The great discussion of seat orientation in trains and planes

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PVD

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I would imagine a good bit of the bias is cultural, since most of us are in tune with riding forward as a norm. Not such a big deal in most of the rest of the world. As it becomes more common, less and less young people will be acculturated to the ride forward good, ride backward bad concept. But it certainly is a big change for many of us.
 
PVD said:
I would imagine a good bit of the bias is cultural, since most of us are in tune with riding forward as a norm. Not such a big deal in most of the rest of the world. As it becomes more common, less and less young people will be acculturated to the ride forward good, ride backward bad concept. But it certainly is a big change for many of us.
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At least in India no one seems to care much as half the seats are facing backwards in all varieties of Sleepers and also in General Second Class and Suburban EMUs which covers almost every rider in the system.

But as far as the US goes it does not matter what the rest of the world does. We will obsess about whatever catches out fancy and this is one of our favorite obsessions for a while.
 
jis said:
At least in India no one seems to care much as half the seats are facing backwards in all varieties of Sleepers and also in General Second Class and Suburban EMUs which covers almost every rider in the system.

But as far as the US goes it does not matter what the rest of the world does. We will obsess about whatever catches out fancy and this is one of our favorite obsessions for a while.
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Yes, and since much of the rest of the world accepts it and doesn't have a major problem, that suggests that it is mostly psychological, not physiological.
 
PVD said:
Yes, and since much of the rest of the world accepts it and doesn't have a major problem, that suggests that it is mostly psychological, not physiological.
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I would put it a bit differently. There is a group of people for whom there is a genuine physiological problem. The other parts of the world have figured out a way of accommodating them to general satisfaction following the norms of compromise prevalent in those societies.

Afterall almost everywhere half the seats face forward, so it should not be all that difficult to find a way to accommodate all those that have a genuine physiological problem (a cohort much smaller than 50% of the travelers) to face the way they need to. Heck they are able to accommodate the elderly on lower berths and ladies in special accommodation set side for them for those that desire so, This is no different in principle.
 
lordsigma said:
The vast majority of people don't care about riding backwards
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I do not think that is a correct statement. I think the vast majority of people would prefer to ride forwards in the direction of travel.

As far as brightline is concerned... they should be flipping seats as well but we finally got them to take off those terrible wraps so one victory at a time! haha.
 
I have a very high level of liking to look at what is passing any window whether local or a new vista. That is why rail is my preferred method of travel. By auto I always share driving if others can share. RRs means a regular speed train is preferred not HSR in Europe or Acela in the USA.. I prefer riding forward as the zoom in when watching outside is much more pleasing than a zoom out! Backwards riding does have an upside when traveling along other main tracks as a visual of CTC clear signals can indicate a train meet is about to happen. ABS not so much.

Backwards riding especially when viewing out the railfan rear window causes a false visual of continuing zoom out even when stopped! 3 - 10 minutes depending on how long rearward viewing was done.
 
PVD said:
Yes, and since much of the rest of the world accepts it and doesn't have a major problem, that suggests that it is mostly psychological, not physiological.
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On airliners seats (typically/mostly) face forwards, and in cars they do as well. So that is what people are accustomed to. And in the US those are the two dominant modes of transportation.
 
cirdan said:
On airliners seats (typically/mostly) face forwards, and in cars they do as well. So that is what people are accustomed to. And in the US those are the two dominant modes of transportation.
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There are zero reasons to have backward facing seats in an aircraft. It's not like they can fly backwards for operational efficiency.
 
nferr said:
There are zero reasons to have backward facing seats in an aircraft. It's not like they can fly backwards for operational efficiency.
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There are certain safety advantages in any crash involving rapid deceleration if you are sitting in rear facing seats. Being forced backward with the seat as a brace for your back is less likely to result in injury than being thrown forwards with only a narrow seatbelt concentrating that force, not to mention that with seat pitches what they are, the possibility of hard contact with the seat in front of you is also an issue.. That said, airlines know that passengers prefer forward facing seats, and rapid deceleration incidents that are otherwise survivable are not common enough to warrant flying in the face of passenger preference. Heck, four point harness belts are vastly better than lap belts, safety-wise, but only flight attendants in jump-seats get them, not passengers.
 
Pilots all have 4 pointers now. Was not required until late 1970s? Didn't some military transport airplanes have backward facing seats at one time. Now what about air force one??
 
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nferr said:
There are zero reasons to have backward facing seats in an aircraft. It's not like they can fly backwards for operational efficiency.
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On some larger airliners you get some of the seats facing backwards in business class. I guess because they can use the space more efficiently by alternating their direction. Also sometimes the jumper seats used by cabin crew face backwards. I don't know what the rationale for this is, but it may again have to do with efficient use of space.
 
I think the other reason why they want people to get used to the half-facing-backwards seats is so that when new equipment arrive, such as the Airos, they can install non-flipping seats closer together, to fit more seats onto the cars, and at that point, passsengers would all be used to the layout by then.

The current distances between the seats (and the associated legroom) is spaced as such to account for the space needed to rotate the seats.
 
railiner said:
The C-141 Starlifter’s and C-5 Galaxy’s did, back when I was in the USAF…
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The one time I was on Air Force One( during Jimmy Carters Presidency,he wasn't aboard so technically it wasnt AF1) I didn't notice any backwards facing seats.(but I was in the very back by the Luggage!😄)
 
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cirdan said:
On some larger airliners you get some of the seats facing backwards in business class. I guess because they can use the space more efficiently by alternating their direction.
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I remember when BA first introduced these. The rationale seemed to be a combination of space utilization while still providing aisle access. A rear-facing window seat could feel very "enclosed" and meal service can't have been easy for staff.
 
Metra Electric Rider said:
I seem to remember (but this could be a false memory) of backwards facing Southwest seats. I also remember a LOT flight in the 80's with a Soviet made plane with backwards facing seats (a pair of four if memory serves) on each side of the plane.
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SWA had Lounge type Seats around a Table in front on some Planes.

They were popular, especially with Drinkers!😄
 
Metra Electric Rider said:
That it would explain it/that... Back when flying was fun (the 90's)....
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You think flying in the 90s was fun? You should have tried flying in the 1960s, up to the late 70s when the deregulated the airlines. In retrospect, it was a golden age, even though we complained a lot about stuff at the time.
 
Recent travels on the Borealis Business Class -
came time to board all the seats were facing the wrong direction to travel -
Crew took about 2 minutes to remedy -
A little lever under the seat near the aisle -
step on it and the seats slide out to allow rotation of the seats to the new direction of travel
One note with this action if you had a full window view before now you have a bulkhead pillar blocking view

Don't know the status of the coach seating configuration

Riding backwards would not bother me but for some folk could encounter a degree of vertigo ***
*** westpoint comment #7 in this thread

In the 60's I have rode 707 720B DC6 and Electra aircraft rear facing seating in the forward cabin
Neat people watching exercise some expressions priceless !
 
cirdan said:
On some larger airliners you get some of the seats facing backwards in business class. I guess because they can use the space more efficiently by alternating their direction. Also sometimes the jumper seats used by cabin crew face backwards. I don't know what the rationale for this is, but it may again have to do with efficient use of space.
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Even on some mid-size turboprops like the ATR-42/72 the first row is often backward facing. On the small business-sized turboprop, the Pilatus PC-12, which is operated by Boutique Air in scheduled service, the two seats in the first row also face backward.
 
EchoSierra said:
Even on some mid-size turboprops like the ATR-42/72 the first row is often backward facing. On the small business-sized turboprop, the Pilatus PC-12, which is operated by Boutique Air in scheduled service, the two seats in the first row also face backward.
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So you've got intertwined legs with the folks in the 2nd row?
 
joelkfla said:
So you've got intertwined legs with the folks in the 2nd row?
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Actually there is more space with this arrangement - permitting the full stretching
of the legs and crossing one over the other.
A good arrangement for families and on some aircraft a small table was
installed or folded out from the bulkhead wall for business or entertainment

And of course the negative con lacking underseat storage space and limited
overhead bin - - -
 

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