Chicago to West or East Coast and back, looking for advice

[eldomtom2]

I'm planning on doing a full transcontinental trip of the US by rail both ways. I've decided that the Chicago-West Coast leg will be made using the California Zephyr one way and the Southwest Chief the other way, but I need advice on which one should be the westbound trip and which one should be the eastbound trip. This would probably be around September.
On a related note, I see that the westbound Southwest Chief is scheduled to arrive in LA at 8AM, with the northbound Coast Starlight departing LA at 9:51AM. Is this a plausible connection to make, as we'd be booking everything in advance? What would our options be if we missed the connection? Avoiding the cost of a night in LA could sway my decision.

 

[zephyr17]

I do think that the California Zephyr westbound and the Southwest Chief eastbound is the better option. The reason is the climb up the Front Range leaving Denver is in the morning, so even if the train is late it will be in daylight. Eastbound, if the train is late, it'll be dark descending into Denver.

The connection between the westbound Starlight and the northbound Starlight is guaranteed if booked on a single reservation. Note that a "guaranteed connection" does not necessarily mean the outbound train is going to be held. It means Amtrak guarantees it will get you to your destination. In the case of the Southwest Chief to the Starlight that most often takes the form of Amtrak putting you on the Amtrak Thruway bus connection to Bakersfield and connecting with a San Joaquin train there to take you to northern California.

Finally, you mention you'd be "booking everything in advance" as if there is really an option. Most Amtrak services are "reserved" (which, on Amtrak, doesn't generally mean a seat assignment, just a seat somewhere on the train) and require a reservation. Sure, you can walk up and buy a ticket at a staffed station at the last minute or, more likely these days, buy one using a smartphone, but chances are prices could be higher and there's a risk of the train being sold out. There have been cases of sleeper fares dropping at the last minute, which I won't go into here, it's been covered extensively in other threads

 

[Steve4031]

The California Zephyr westbound is best, but EB in the summer is usually okay. If you have a room on the left side eastbound going into D,nver you can turn off the lights even if the train is late and still have a spectacular view.

,IMHO the problem with taking the Zephyr first is that the Chief's scenery is not as dramatic and some may not enjoy it so much after seeing the CZ's scenery. Thus I suggest taking the Southwest Chief west, spending one night in LA, and then taking the Coast Starlight north. Then spend as many nights as you want in the bay area. You could stay multiple nigh,ts in,LA too iwishu want.

The Coast Starlight route is spectacular as it runs along the coast. I do not recommend a same-day connection from the Chief because if you r,un late you would end up on the bus/train combination to Bakersfield.

 

[allanorn]

Regarding the Chief to the Starlight, you can see how many connections are missed using this site:

https://juckins.net/amtrak_status/archive/html/connections.php
I did a check from 1/1/23 to 5/1/23 allowing for a 15-minute connection, which is probably the bare minimum I'd be comfortable with assuming you're fit and aren't terribly encumbered with luggage. With those parameters about one in four connections would have been missed, and I'd probably say three or four of those they would probably hold the Starlight or you'd make it with less of a connection time. That's still a 20% miss rate, though the weather this winter was pretty rough; how do you like those odds?

Depending on how late you are and how many people are making the connection, Amtrak might send you on a connecting bus to Santa Barbara or somewhere closer (rare), or send you to Sacramento via the San Joaquins route with a couple of bus connections (more likely). If the Chief is massively late they may put you up at a hotel in LA, but you're probably riding coach the next day.

I agree with @zephyr17 on a westbound Zephyr and an eastbound Chief itinerary. You'll want to see the scenery on the Zephyr during the day, and you'll likely get daytime views of Arizona and New Mexico going eastbound. I would also suggest this itinerary because even if the Starlight is massively late (12+ hours) you're going to connect. That means a night in LA, which is some money - but will be less stressful and you'll have plenty of time to do some sightseeing.

 

[Brian Battuello]

On a related note, I see that the westbound Southwest Chief is scheduled to arrive in LA at 8AM, with the northbound Coast Starlight departing LA at 9:51AM. Is this a plausible connection to make, as we'd be booking everything in advance? What would our options be if we missed the connection? Avoiding the cost of a night in LA could sway my decision.

Good information from the connect-o-matic. On the other hand, having done a lot of cross country circle trips, you kinda get tired of being on a train after a while. You didn't say if you were planning on coach or a room, but in either case after two or three days/nights on a train, I'm ready for a break. Nice to sleep in a real hotel room and get some food other than the diner/cafe for 24 hours. Plus you can always find something touristy to do. Well worth the extra day and the price of a mid-range hotel. As mentioned above, if you did miss a connection, they might very well throw you on a Bakersfield central valley run, which is amazingly non-scenic, especially on a bus/coach train combination with no lounge car. It would be a real shame to miss the Coast Starlight in either direction.

 

[zephyr17]

I did a check from 1/1/23 to 5/1/23 allowing for a 15-minute connection, which is probably the bare minimum I'd be comfortable with assuming you're fit and aren't terribly encumbered with luggage.

Actually, I'd be comfortable with 10 or even 5 minutes at LAUS between 3 and 14. They'll be on tracks close to each other, so at most it is just a matter of going down into to tunnel, walking a few feet to the other platform, then going back up. There's a reasonable chance they'll even be spotted across the platform from each other. They don't close the platforms early at LA like they do at some other statioms (Chicago and Portland come to mind). There's no need at all to go into the station itself, which is an admittedly long walk.

 

[allanorn]

Actually, I'd be comfortable with 10 or even 5 minutes at LAUS between 3 and 14. They'll be on tracks close to each other, so at most it is just a matter of going down into to tunnel, walking a few feet to the other platform, then going back up. There's a reasonable chance they'll even be spotted across the platform from each other. They don't close the platforms early at LA like they do at some other statioms (Chicago and Portland come to mind). There's no need at all to go into the station itself, which is an admittedly long walk.

The 15 minutes is my personal risk tolerance, only because in that situation you have hundreds of passengers leaving one train and hundreds more are heading to others. Even though I've been through Union Station plenty of times, I've become crossed up in the tunnel and walked out at the bus depot end once or twice. I can transfer in five minutes, but my anxiety is probably through the roof the entire time if it's to a once-daily train. I also imagine in those situations they'll hold the Starlight for a few minutes.

I'm also assuming that the original poster is of sound body and can move freely about airports at an average walking speed with luggage. If they have mobility issues that might be more of a concern, though in those cases I imagine the Red Caps will let the Starlight crew know so they won't power up and go without them.

 

[eldomtom2]

That's still a 20% miss rate, though the weather this winter was pretty rough; how do you like those odds?

1 in 5 is a bit too much for a once-in-a-lifetime trip like this. So assuming I spend a night in LA, is the consensus Zephyr westbound/Starlight soundbound/Chief eastbound?

This is also part of a broader there-and-back trip of the US using the Lake Shore Limited and the Capitol Limited. Is there any consensus on which should be westbound and which should be eastbound? From searching this forum there seems to be a general feeling in favour of Lake Shore westbound/Capitol eastbound.

 

[zephyr17]

I agree with that, with the sole proviso that personally I do the LSL both ways since the Capitol lost its Sightseer Lounge. I like the Viewliner Diner as a "sleeper lounge" better than the Superliner diner/lounge on the Cap. Note the LSL is usually quite a bit more expensive than the Cap, though.

 

[joelkfla]

I agree with that, with the sole proviso that personally I do the LSL both ways since the Capitol lost its Sightseer Lounge. I like the Viewliner Diner as a "sleeper lounge" better than the Superliner diner/lounge on the Cap. Note the LSL is usually quite a bit more expensive than the Cap, though.

I would go with the Cardinal in one direction for the scenery, even though still no diner or SSL. It's often cheaper than the CL if reserved well in advance. I'm not sure, but I think the eastbound has more daylight in the scenic portions.

 

[niemi24s]

Here's what I do when trying to decide:

• See where the route goes using this: https://fragis.fra.dot.gov/GISFRASafety/ It also shows all the stations.
• See what local time of day the train is scheduled to be at any point of interest using the timetables available here: Amtrak + VIA Rail Timetables | Rail Passengers Association | Washington, DC

What someone classifies as scenic is quite personal. An urbanite might view anything as scenic. Somebody from our great plains might call mountains and cities scenic. Somebody from the mountains might rave about the wide expanses of our great plains and the hodge-podge of the big cities. In short, what make you ooh and ahh might make somebody else yawn.

 

[joelkfla]

This is a personal Google Map that I created, similar to the one referenced above, which shows only Amtrak LD routes and stations, without the pesky milepost and freight data. It's fully zoomable, and you can click on a route or station to see the name. There's also a little box at the bottom of the legend that lets you switch to satellite view. It's based on the same data as the FRA Safety Map, but the data was last updated in 2018, so a few of the routes are slightly off in some spots. (I don't know whether it can be viewed in other countries.)
Map of Amtrak LD Routes & Stations

 

[niemi24s]

Nice work, Joelkfla!!

FWIW, the FRA safety map can be customized to display just the passenger rail routes by eliminating freight railroads, grade crossing numbers and mileposts. In addition, this can be displayed on thirty different base maps. It doesn't, however, contain the names of all the stations.

 

[Mr.Technician]

I am doing exactly this on Thursday, actually!

GBB > LA on the Chief, then LA > SLO on the Starlight. That last part is important as the Surfliner runs LA > SLO later in the day and is my backup if the Chief is late and I miss the connection with the Starlight. As I am renting a car anyway and seeing national parks, going further north would be pointless anyway.

 

[TinCan782]

I would go with the Cardinal in one direction for the scenery, even though still no diner or SSL. It's often cheaper than the CL if reserved well in advance. I'm not sure, but I think the eastbound has more daylight in the scenic portions.

Yes on the eastbound Cardinal. I've done both directions and westbound you run out of daylight when you get to the New River Gorge which is the most scenic part of the route. Eastbound you travel through the gorge late AM to afternoon.

 

[tomfuller]

Actually, I'd be comfortable with 10 or even 5 minutes at LAUS between 3 and 14. They'll be on tracks close to each other, so at most it is just a matter of going down into to tunnel, walking a few feet to the other platform, then going back up. There's a reasonable chance they'll even be spotted across the platform from each other. They don't close the platforms early at LA like they do at some other statioms (Chicago and Portland come to mind). There's no need at all to go into the station itself, which is an admittedly long walk.

I do remember making a cross platform transfer from either the SWC or the Sunset Limited to the Coast Starlight. Another time I arrived on the Sunset Limited an hour after the Starlight left. They directed us to busses to Bakersfield where we got on the San Joaquin train all the way to Martinez. We missed the great coast scenery but we were in MTZ more than 2 hours before the northbound Starlight that we had missed arrived.

 

[tomfuller]

If you take the Zephyr westbound you will end up spending a night in Sacramento, Davis or Martinez and getting on the southbound Coast Starlight to Los Angeles the next morning. If you take the Southwest Chief westbound to Los Angeles and make the connection to the Coast Starlight you will connect to the eastbound Zephyr between Emeryville and Sacramento in the morning.

 

[MARC Rider]

Yes on the eastbound Cardinal. I've done both directions and westbound you run out of daylight when you get to the New River Gorge which is the most scenic part of the route. Eastbound you travel through the gorge late AM to afternoon.

During the summer, if the train isn't too delayed, the Cardinal runs through most of the New River Gorge while it's still light out.

 

[amy1277]

This is a personal Google Map that I created, similar to the one referenced above, which shows only Amtrak LD routes and stations, without the pesky milepost and freight data. It's fully zoomable, and you can click on a route or station to see the name. There's also a little box at the bottom of the legend that lets you switch to satellite view. It's based on the same data as the FRA Safety Map, but the data was last updated in 2018, so a few of the routes are slightly off in some spots. (I don't know whether it can be viewed in other countries.)
Map of Amtrak LD Routes & Stations

This is amazing! Thanks for sharing.

 

[Brian Battuello]

This is a personal Google Map that I created, similar to the one referenced above, which shows only Amtrak LD routes and stations, without the pesky milepost and freight data. It's fully zoomable, and you can click on a route or station to see the name. There's also a little box at the bottom of the legend that lets you switch to satellite view. It's based on the same data as the FRA Safety Map, but the data was last updated in 2018, so a few of the routes are slightly off in some spots. (I don't know whether it can be viewed in other countries.)
Map of Amtrak LD Routes & Stations

Very nicely done! Will bookmark and use.

FWIW, Amtrak also has a surprisingly useful version that includes the current position of trains, but their map isn't as good as yours.

https://www.amtrak.com/services/maps.trainlocation.html

 

[jis]

Very nicely done! Will bookmark and use.

FWIW, Amtrak also has a surprisingly useful version that includes the current position of trains, but their map isn't as good as yours.

https://www.amtrak.com/services/maps.trainlocation.html

Pointers to these and many more can be found at :

https://www.amtraktrains.com/threads/amtrak-timetables-and-train-information.80742/

 

[joelkfla]

Very nicely done! Will bookmark and use.

FWIW, Amtrak also has a surprisingly useful version that includes the current position of trains, but their map isn't as good as yours.

https://www.amtrak.com/services/maps.trainlocation.html

Yes, I have that bookmarked and use it to see where my train is when I'm waiting for it to arrive (although it's not quite real-time), and to see how late we are and how long until the next station when on board. It looks like streets and roads are on there, but they're too faint to be useful.

I put the data into Google Maps so that I could see an individual route at a glance, see where they intersect, and zoom in to see the tracks' location in relation to streets and waterways. Also to see the route thru cities like JAX and CHI where there are a lot of tracks and it's not immediately obvious which ones are used by Amtrak. I haven't had the chance to use my map on a trip yet; I'll find out whether it's useful on the train in 2 weeks.

 

[Mr.Technician]

My preference is Intercity Rail Map over the official Amtrak tracker.