OlympianHiawatha
Engineer
On a couple of occasions I have been seated for Lunch with the Trails and Rails Guide and that usually results in very interesting conversation about the program and what is going on outside the window.
Dining Car experience
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Well to be clear, there are times at breakfast especially where it could happen that you find a table with only 2 people at it. They are supposed to try to avoid seating people at the same table where someone already has their entree. And they also can't leave someone standing there because they don't have a party of 4. And if the train is fairly empty, then you could see half empty tables at lunch & dinner too.
But the LSA is required to try their best to maximize the table usage whenever possible.
trainman74
Conductor
There are restaurants out there with community seating. It's usually a different situation than Amtrak dining car booths, though -- at the ones where I've eaten, it's in the form of, say, long tables with 8 or more seats apiece, and it's easy enough to slide or angle your chairs a bit and ignore any unrelated people who are seated at the same long table with you.
We met online, through mutual friends. He didn't talk much at first, just bits here and there. Eventually, we started emailing. We clicked really well and talked on Yahoo Messenger every so often. We never spoke on the phone because we were both too shy for that. When I met him in person, it was a bit easier because we already knew so much about each other (we'd been friends for a year). If it's someone we know, it isn't as hard, but we still get worn out after anything social.
I am very introverted, at times almost pathologically so. I've been told by people who are trying to be funny that I'm stuck for an answer when someone says hello to me and that I'd get lost in a crowd of two. Not to mention being asked where I learned to do such a great imitation of a cigar store Indian. 
As uncomplimentary as that is, it's oftentimes true. Nonetheless, I enjoy the dining car experience. It helps that, on long distance trips, I've always traveled with my uncle, who is the type that never met a stranger. Obviously, I didn't inherit any part of that gene pool. He carries the conversation and I don't have to join in. But when I've traveled solo, I can hold my own. It helps there, too, that when I've been on my own, it seems I get seated with three other strangers, so there's no feeling of being a third wheel. On my last solo trip, from Spokane to Glacier Park, I was seated at breakfast with a mother-daughter team and a young woman, and it was hilarious. The tag team were traveling to Minot, I believe it was, to see the daughter's first grandchild. (And, of course, the mother's great-grandchild). The two were ragging on each other throughout the whole meal. And our server, Chris, joined right in. The young woman, was also headed to Glacier Park, and I were in hysterics throughout. That's what makes it so fun. And this past summer, when my uncle crossed the country, Ft. Lauderdale-Spokane, we met so many interesting people: A young woman who was from the States but was working and living in Ecuador, a couple from Australia, another from Great Britain, and another from Norway. Those are the kinds of experiences you just don't get growing up in St. John, WA (pop. 537) nor living in Colfax, WA (CFX in your Amtrak timetable), pop. 2880. I've encountered some folks who didn't want to talk, and I certainly understand that. I've really only encountered one unpleasant person at a meal while on Amtrak, a man who joined my uncle and I for breakfast on the Crescent. This man loudly and angrily began berating the entire Amtrak experience and especially bitched, whined, pissed, and moaned about how rotten the food on Amtrak always is. He made sure the entire dining car knew that if he got another cold, hard biscuit, he was going to make sure "Amtrak heard about it" Sure enough, the biscuit wasn't to his liking, and he practically threw it back in the server's face, loudly demanding in a voice that the engineer probably heard, another one. The server only looked at him with a look of pity; had it been me, I would have looked at him with a look of complete disgust. :angry2: His display was absolutely uncalled for. Perhaps that one experience soured me, but I wish people would, if they have a complaint, be more civil about it. No need to show your a$$ without pulling your pants down. :angry2:
As uncomplimentary as that is, it's oftentimes true. Nonetheless, I enjoy the dining car experience. It helps that, on long distance trips, I've always traveled with my uncle, who is the type that never met a stranger. Obviously, I didn't inherit any part of that gene pool. He carries the conversation and I don't have to join in. But when I've traveled solo, I can hold my own. It helps there, too, that when I've been on my own, it seems I get seated with three other strangers, so there's no feeling of being a third wheel. On my last solo trip, from Spokane to Glacier Park, I was seated at breakfast with a mother-daughter team and a young woman, and it was hilarious. The tag team were traveling to Minot, I believe it was, to see the daughter's first grandchild. (And, of course, the mother's great-grandchild). The two were ragging on each other throughout the whole meal. And our server, Chris, joined right in. The young woman, was also headed to Glacier Park, and I were in hysterics throughout. That's what makes it so fun. And this past summer, when my uncle crossed the country, Ft. Lauderdale-Spokane, we met so many interesting people: A young woman who was from the States but was working and living in Ecuador, a couple from Australia, another from Great Britain, and another from Norway. Those are the kinds of experiences you just don't get growing up in St. John, WA (pop. 537) nor living in Colfax, WA (CFX in your Amtrak timetable), pop. 2880. I've encountered some folks who didn't want to talk, and I certainly understand that. I've really only encountered one unpleasant person at a meal while on Amtrak, a man who joined my uncle and I for breakfast on the Crescent. This man loudly and angrily began berating the entire Amtrak experience and especially bitched, whined, pissed, and moaned about how rotten the food on Amtrak always is. He made sure the entire dining car knew that if he got another cold, hard biscuit, he was going to make sure "Amtrak heard about it" Sure enough, the biscuit wasn't to his liking, and he practically threw it back in the server's face, loudly demanding in a voice that the engineer probably heard, another one. The server only looked at him with a look of pity; had it been me, I would have looked at him with a look of complete disgust. :angry2: His display was absolutely uncalled for. Perhaps that one experience soured me, but I wish people would, if they have a complaint, be more civil about it. No need to show your a$$ without pulling your pants down. :angry2:
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OlympianHiawatha
Engineer
A good outgoing Dining Car Crew can contribute to a Happy Diner atmosphere where folks are encouraged to kick back and interact with one another. I've had numerous experiences "cutting up" with Servers and LSAs and watching them make sure everyone else was having a good time as well. When the bounds of conversation begin to cross onto other tables, it's a Happy Diner.
Perhaps the most comical was a couple years ago on the Empire Builder with an older Server who at first came across as having a very dry deadpan sense of humor; she was already giving me a hard time about not leaving any scraps on my plate for the Kitchen Cat. For one Dinner I was seated with a family of 3, Mom, Dad and Teenage Son and Dad dropped his napkin and managed to kick it under his seat out of reach. When he asked that Server for a replacement, she came back with a whole linen tablecoth, tucked it around him and loudly declared he better not lose that. Of course he turns red as can be as the whole car explodes into laughter; he quickly joined in and the rest of Dinner went great.
Perhaps the most comical was a couple years ago on the Empire Builder with an older Server who at first came across as having a very dry deadpan sense of humor; she was already giving me a hard time about not leaving any scraps on my plate for the Kitchen Cat. For one Dinner I was seated with a family of 3, Mom, Dad and Teenage Son and Dad dropped his napkin and managed to kick it under his seat out of reach. When he asked that Server for a replacement, she came back with a whole linen tablecoth, tucked it around him and loudly declared he better not lose that. Of course he turns red as can be as the whole car explodes into laughter; he quickly joined in and the rest of Dinner went great.
cirdan
Engineer
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Not too long ago while travelling on the Texas Eagle with a friend, we were seated at the same table as two ladies several times during that trip. There was an elderly lady and a somewhat younger one. We always assumed they were mother and daughter or otherwise closely related as they talked as if they knew one another well and seemed to agree about almost everything and even had a similar hairstyle and body language. But later they told me that no, they had only met on the train. So just because people act as if they are a clique, don't assume they are.
Henry Kisor
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A very good way to clear everyone else away from your table is to hunch over your food with one arm around the plate and mutter, "I just got out of prison last week and . . . "
It also helps if you have some stick-on jailhouse tats on your forearms.
It also helps if you have some stick-on jailhouse tats on your forearms.
Henry Kisor
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Seriously, I truly enjoy meeting people in the diner. The most recent was a Canadian theatrical actor from Toronto who was on his way to L.A. for a screen test. His whole conversation, spurred by some remarks about Amish families in the lounge car, was about growing up Amish on the plains of Saskatchewan. It was absolutely engrossing.
Another memorable fellow diner was an artist from Taos, N.M., who specialized in creating outdoor clock sculptures. He was on his way to New Jersey to install a new sculpture outside a city hall. He spoke a little about his art but was far more interested in learning about his tablemates.
Curious and intelligent folks who'd rather learn about you than talk about themselves are the best kind to sit with.
Another memorable fellow diner was an artist from Taos, N.M., who specialized in creating outdoor clock sculptures. He was on his way to New Jersey to install a new sculpture outside a city hall. He spoke a little about his art but was far more interested in learning about his tablemates.
Curious and intelligent folks who'd rather learn about you than talk about themselves are the best kind to sit with.
I've found that a lot of "regulars" have stories like yours, Henry. I've got a few, which I'll recount when I'm not about to run off and catch a train myself.
As to restaurants with community seating, it's usually called the bar. A lot of sushi restaurants will have a bar where lots of food is served, and I've been seated at the bar in many other places and gotten my full meal there at peak hours. So from that standpoint, the number of places where community seating exists is probably somewhere on the order of at least 20% of all restaurants. It's not universal in most, and at some fancier ones the bar is solely for serving/consuming drinks, but it still exists in a very large number of cases.
As to restaurants with community seating, it's usually called the bar. A lot of sushi restaurants will have a bar where lots of food is served, and I've been seated at the bar in many other places and gotten my full meal there at peak hours. So from that standpoint, the number of places where community seating exists is probably somewhere on the order of at least 20% of all restaurants. It's not universal in most, and at some fancier ones the bar is solely for serving/consuming drinks, but it still exists in a very large number of cases.
You can always try Ned Beatty's line, from Silver Streak..........."Do you go All The Way........................To Chicago I mean....."
Just be ready for the SAME consequences.
There is a fair number of restaurants that offer community seating cropping up, I'm in the biz, so I see it happening more and more, but the biggest differences with that, and what Amtrak HAS to offer is:
- Community seating on Amtrak is REQUIRED, in the few restaurants that offer it, it's almost always a "choice"
- If you don't like community seating, on "land" you can walk next door, or down the block to another restaurant, on Amtrak your choice of eating establishments are well, "limited" to say the least.
If you truly don't like community seating a tip to the steward or coming in late will offer a better chance at getting to dine "solo". I've certainly tipped for that, and never, ever, had someone else be seated with us. (the waiter, if they are good, will offer anyone who asks all kinds of good excuses, "They are almost done", "They are expecting their kids any moment".
Shawn Ryu
Conductor
If you don't like community dining just take the food and go back to coach, I think they can do that. Obviously for sleepers order through SCA
TimePeace
Disillusioned.
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My sense is, the majority of us do like to eat with other people. In addition to the example of a bar, there are also diners, lunch counters, school cafeterias, dining halls, military messes, etc, etc, so I expect we have all experienced community dining at one time or another. The posts here indicate that a majority of Amtrak riders like that aspect of the train experience.
And for those that don't, the previous couple of posts offer pretty good strategies for avoiding being forced to sit with others. It would have never occurred to me to do that... but we are all different.
And for those that don't, the previous couple of posts offer pretty good strategies for avoiding being forced to sit with others. It would have never occurred to me to do that... but we are all different.
fillyjonk
OBS Chief
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I don't mind being seated with people I don't know. That's just the way traveling alone works. I'm a fairly shy person and may not have a lot to say if someone doesn't ask me anything or start a conversation - I'm not always so good at it.
One thing I find that helps a lot is introducing yourself and shaking hands with the other diners; that always seems to break the ice. (Unless you get someone who is uncomfortable with shaking hands). Usually "Where are you headed" seems to break the ice also.
I enjoy asking people about their careers if they work....I've had some interesting conversations with people who had different careers (one man I remember was something like an "industrial archeaologist" or so he said....he researched old factories and production lines, that kind of thing). Or places they've traveled to. Or where they're from....I've met people from New Zealand and Australia and Britain on the train.
I've had a few stinkers in community seating with me - the guy who could NOT put down "The Da Vinci Code" to talk to anyone, the person who texts and ignores everyone at the table (I'm sorry, but I see that as rude). Or the guy who felt everyone at the table was entitled to his loud and rather pointed opinion on politics and religion. (I'm not THAT old, but I was raised to believe those were two of the three things you didn't discuss with relative strangers....)
Occasionally I've wound up alone at a table if it's a not very full train and I get called for dinner at an odd hour (or am late getting on, and they've already started the service I was assigned). That's okay, too.
One thing I find that helps a lot is introducing yourself and shaking hands with the other diners; that always seems to break the ice. (Unless you get someone who is uncomfortable with shaking hands). Usually "Where are you headed" seems to break the ice also.
I enjoy asking people about their careers if they work....I've had some interesting conversations with people who had different careers (one man I remember was something like an "industrial archeaologist" or so he said....he researched old factories and production lines, that kind of thing). Or places they've traveled to. Or where they're from....I've met people from New Zealand and Australia and Britain on the train.
I've had a few stinkers in community seating with me - the guy who could NOT put down "The Da Vinci Code" to talk to anyone, the person who texts and ignores everyone at the table (I'm sorry, but I see that as rude). Or the guy who felt everyone at the table was entitled to his loud and rather pointed opinion on politics and religion. (I'm not THAT old, but I was raised to believe those were two of the three things you didn't discuss with relative strangers....)
Occasionally I've wound up alone at a table if it's a not very full train and I get called for dinner at an odd hour (or am late getting on, and they've already started the service I was assigned). That's okay, too.
cirdan
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I very much agree with this.
I^ve met with all sorts, from the absolutely fascinating to the somewhat embarassing. But for me its all part of people watching. If I agree with what they say I say so, and if i don't I stay polite but don't start an argument over it (but still consider it broadening to see what other people think). I once sat with a guy who was speaking on the phone throughout the meal very loudly and in a foreign language (probably Arabic) and pretending I didn't exist. That I found very rude. But apart from that one time I've always managed to stick up some level of conversation and took something home from it.
Henry Kisor
Service Attendant
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The absolute worst dinner companions are the ones who attempt to convert you to their religion before dessert is served and the ones who try to get you to agree to vote their way. Occasionally they are one and the same, and it is very difficult not to get up from the table and stomp out without a word. Fortunately they are comparatively rare.
Carry brochures from different religious groups and political groups. When dinner is over, hand them one from an opposing group and leave.
When the J.W. would come to my mom's house, she would be respectful and then hand them a copy of a magazine that she got from an organization in her relgious affilitation. Hmm, wonder if she ever converted any of them w/o knowing it.
Devil's Advocate
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That sounds like a lot of work just to contribute to the problem. Better to be honest and just admit that you have differing views that are no less valid than their own. No need to go into any detail if you don't want to, but probably best to avoid greeting unwanted evangelizing with a passive aggressive response.
Converted to a whole new religion by being handed a magazine? I don't think that's how it works.
trainman74
Conductor
I'd actually be a little iffy on shaking hands with a stranger right before eating -- I'm sure you just washed your hands, fillyjonk, but I'm not sure I could vouch for everyone in the dining car.
Yes, I will second this.
D.P. Roberts
Conductor
On my last trip (the SWC), our SCA took meals to almost half the car. She was running herself ragged trying to get meals to everybody, especially with boxing/ arranging things to make it through several cars on a moving train, multiple trips to get different condiments or wrong items, etc. I'd love to have my meals delivered to my sleeper on my next trip, but I'd feel guilty about making the SCA do so much extra work - aside from the fact that by the time it arrived, it would probably be cold.
Several previous posters mentioned that many restaurants have a bar that also serves food. That's definitely "community seating" for dinner. All restaurants are different, but if you look at the nationwide chains that have both a restaurant and a bar where you can eat (Friday's, Applebees, Outback Steakhouse, etc.), the bar area is certainly a lot smaller than the table-service areas. In most of those cases, I'd say the bar is maybe 10-25% of the whole restaurant. If you used that as an average, would it be fair to say that 3 out of every 4 Americans would prefer NOT to have community seating?
I know that community seating is traditional aboard trains, and that there's a large group of traditional train buffs on Amtrak. However, Amtrak can't survive by just catering (literally) to that group. If most of its passengers want something else, and that alternative could be done more cheaply and efficiently, it seems like Amtrak ought to pursue it.
As a counter-example, look at air travel. True, you're not seated across from your fellow passengers. On the other hand, you're often seated next to them for 6-8 hours or more. I've only eaten a few dozen meals aboard Amtrak trains, but I've been on many more flights, so I believe I'm correct in stating that there is NO "plane etiquette" that requires you to chat with your fellow passengers. Instead, I think leaving your seatmates alone is the proper thing to do. Sure, I've had conversations with seatmates, and I don't doubt that random plane conversations have led to business deals and marriage proposals, but these are the exception rather than the rule.
So, if MOST travelers, when shoved into a metal tube (whether wheeled or winged) with strangers, prefer silence to be the rule, you'd think Amtrak would try to adjust to that and not force people into a dining arrangement that basically requires conversation.
Amen Brother Kisor!
That sounds like my friend Jim Hudson!! I even had breakfast with him on the Texas Eagle between SAS & AUS!!Amen Brother Kisor!
:hi: I resemble that remark! We Liberals are always trying to "convert" the Conservatives but as the resident Agnostic on this site I have to plead Not Guilty to the Second part ****! :giggle:That sounds like my friend Jim Hudson!! I even had breakfast with him on the Texas Eagle between SAS & AUS!!Amen Brother Kisor!
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