Empire Builder Cancellations Continue

[jmbgeg]

Was on EB 28 from PDX yesterday. Cancelled east of SPK before departure. They did take Whitefish passengers by bus.

 

[IHC]

So what did they do for you then? How far were you scheduled to go?

 

[anir dendroica]

Was on EB 28 from PDX yesterday. Cancelled east of SPK before departure. They did take Whitefish passengers by bus.

Has Amtrak always canceled trains when temps drop below -20 along the route? Or is there some other reason (deferred maintenance? powdery snow?) why these temps are causing brake issues on almost every train this year?

Mark

 

[saxman]

Looks like the departure from Chicago yesterday was annulled somewhere in Wisconsin. This cold sure having some trying times on the long distance route. Two Texas Eagle derailments, CZ has had a few cancellations in the last week if not, its 10 hours late. Same with the Builder. It too is either cancelled or 10 hours late.

 

[IHC]

Yet the Southwest Chief, run on BNSF tracks, is having almost no problems..

 

[amtrakwolverine]

Yet the Southwest Chief, run on BNSF tracks, is having almost no problems..

but the EB runs on BNSF tracks also so.....

 

[saxman]

Yet the Southwest Chief, run on BNSF tracks, is having almost no problems..

The Empire Builder mostly runs on BNSF tracks as well.

Also looks like this whole weekend's departures from Chicago are cancelled as well. I checked for tickets from CHI to MSP for the 8th, 9th, 10th and they are all sold out, which in other words means its cancelled.

Geeze, we really need a first rate rail system thats reliable.

 

[GG-1]

Aloha

I did not track any of the problems from last year But it seems to be similar to last year at this time, witch was followed by some good times, then delays and cancellations from flooding. So I expect to see more problems ahead

 

[jmbgeg]

So what did they do for you then? How far were you scheduled to go?

I was going only to SPK, so it did not affect me.

 

[jmbgeg]

Was on EB 28 from PDX yesterday. Cancelled east of SPK before departure. They did take Whitefish passengers by bus.

Stuck on stupid. I was on 8 out of Seattle. Original connection was 28. Went north. The problem was with 8.

 

[Ispolkom]

This is Amtrak's problem, not BNSF, which continues to push container trains through the Hi Line. I notice that even BNSF is warning about delays, though.

Unfortunately, the last two winters Amtrak's P42s seem to have had great problems functioning in temperatures that happen every winter. Whatever fixes they made after last winter's debacle don't seem to have worked.

Another snowy winter might well mean spring flooding on the Red River again. It all depends on how quick the spring thaw is.

 

[oldtimer]

Aloha
I did not track any of the problems from last year But it seems to be similar to last year at this time, witch was followed by some good times, then delays and cancellations from flooding. So I expect to see more problems ahead

Eric,

Just to compare this years snow so far, it has been very fine and powdery subject to a lot of blowing snow even after the storm ends and drifting. It has a ratio of 1 inch of water equals 25 inches of snow while the meteorologic standard for snow is 1 inch equals 10 inches. Last year the snow was in the 1 to 6 ratio, us shovelers refer to this as "Heart Attack" snow as it causes strenuous effort to shovel and leads to the aforementioned.

The snows so far should not cause any serious flooding when it melts.

The problems that are causing cancellations now seem to be the blowing and drifting of the light snow, as plowing it is of little help. The cuts in the country side will soon fill up again and the plains are not as flat as people think, lots of rolling hills and thus lots of cuts.

The EB is not only seeing snow but temps at -20 to -30 F. This is hard on not just the equipment and workers but the rails are also at danger. The steel becomes more brittle and CWR is pulled extremely taunt. These two factors lead to a LOT of broken rails and rail pull aparts. The pull aparts have very large gaps when they happen causing long delays to get crews to the scene (highway travel under these conditions isn't a day at the beach) to make repairs.

Your frozen friend

Al

 

[anir dendroica]

Temps are supposed to warm dramatically over the next days. Perhaps some of these trains are actually sold out (due to reaccommodation of pax from canceled trains) rather than canceled?

Yet the Southwest Chief, run on BNSF tracks, is having almost no problems..

The Empire Builder mostly runs on BNSF tracks as well.

Also looks like this whole weekend's departures from Chicago are cancelled as well. I checked for tickets from CHI to MSP for the 8th, 9th, 10th and they are all sold out, which in other words means its cancelled.

Geeze, we really need a first rate rail system thats reliable.

 

[the_traveler]

Reason for edit: bad fingers

Whip them back into shape Eric - until they agree to cooperate!

BAD, BAD FINGERS!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[Rafi]

Quick update:

7/27(9) and 7/27(10) are both cancelled between MSP and west coast.

8/28(9) and 8/28(10) are cancelled between west coast and MSP.

Local alternative transportation will be provided between whitefish/seattle/portland.

 

[yarrow]

i tried to find the train status for "the canadian" on via's site (to see if it is running when the eb is not)and apparently they don't track it but i did run across and interesting policy for late trains:

Depending on your final destination, a delay of one, two or four hours or more entitles you to a travel credit representing 50% of the fare price paid for the delayed journey (excluding accommodation price). In Sleeper, Touring or Sleeper Touring class, travel credits granted for a delayed train are equal to 50% of the fare you would have paid in Economy class.

The value of your travel credit is calculated on the basis of the price before taxes that you paid for the journey affected by the delay. If your tickets are for a round-trip, the travel credit is based on the journey (there or back) during which you experienced a delay, and not on the total price of your tickets, unless your train has been delayed in both directions.

This credit is applicable towards the purchase of a new train ticket or any VIA Rail travel pass (e.g. BizPak, VIA 6 pak, Canrailpass, Corridorpass and Commuterpass) in the following 6 to 12 months.

When you arrive at your final destination at the scheduled time, you are not entitled to a travel credit, even if one or more corresponding trains have been delayed along the way.

To claim a travel credit, you MUST surrender the originial receipt or stub from your ticket (the remaining portion of your ticket) to one of our ticket offices when purchasing your next ticket.

Please note: The electronic receipt you receive confirming a credit card purchase for an online booking is NOT valid for claiming a travel credit.

When trains are replaced by alternate transportIn exceptional circumstances (e.g., when track works cause a section of track to be taken out of service), buses may be used to ensure connections between one or more of our stations.

For the portion of the trip made by bus, we will grant you a travel credit equal to 50% of the fare (taxes not included) you would have paid to travel the same distance by train. In Sleeper, Touring or Sleeper Touring class, the travel credit is equal to half the price you would have paid in Economy class. Depending on the situation, you might be eligible for a partial refund of the accommodation price.

Only the segment of your trip travelled by bus will be considered.

As an example, if you are travelling from Montréal to Québec City and must complete the Saint-Hyacinthe/Montréal leg of your trip by bus, you may obtain a credit equal to 50% of the amount you would have paid (taxes not included) for a journey between Saint-Hyacinthe and Montréal.

To claim a travel credit, you MUST surrender the original receipt or stub from your ticket (the remaining portion of your ticket) to one of our ticket offices when purchasing your next ticket.

Please note: The electronic receipt you receive confirming a credit card purchase for an online booking is NOT valid for claiming a travel credit.

Read the full conditions for travel credit.

 

[wayman]

Just to compare this years snow so far, it has been very fine and powdery subject to a lot of blowing snow even after the storm ends and drifting. It has a ratio of 1 inch of water equals 25 inches of snow while the meteorologic standard for snow is 1 inch equals 10 inches. Last year the snow was in the 1 to 6 ratio, us shovelers refer to this as "Heart Attack" snow as it causes strenuous effort to shovel and leads to the aforementioned.

Eric, in case you are confused by these descriptions: snow is sort of like white sand that falls from the sky and is very, very cold. Powdery snow is sort of akin to dry sand dunes in a high wind, and "heart attack snow" is sort of akin to dense wet sand just after the tide has gone out :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[jmbgeg]

Service Disrupted on Two Routes between Chicago and the West Coast

California Zephyr & Empire Builder

January 8, 2010

4:00 pm CT

Severe winter weather conditions, including high winds, heavily drifting snow and bitter cold temperatures have caused lengthy delays on the routes of the California Zephyr and the Empire Builder. As a precaution, Amtrak has partially suspended service for those trains originating eastbound and westbound on Friday, January 8, with other service changes through and including train origin dates of January 9 and 10.

The service interruptions are between Chicago and Denver and between St. Paul and Seattle/Portland.

Two other routes between Chicago and the West Coast continue to operate via Albuquerque and San Antonio.

California Zephyr

The California Zephyr (Trains 5 & 6) ordinarily operates daily between Chicago and the San Francisco Bay area, via Omaha, Denver and Reno. Service is temporarily suspended between Chicago and Denver due to severe weather conditions for westbound trains originating through and including January 10 and eastbound trains originating through and including January 9.

Limited alternate transportation is available between Denver and a connection in southeast Colorado to the Chicago-Los Angeles Southwest Chief (Trains 3 & 4).

Empire Builder

The Empire Builder (Trains 7/27 & 8/28), which ordinarily operates daily between Chicago and Seattle/Portland, via St. Paul, Whitefish, Mont., and Spokane, Wash., is suspended between St. Paul and Seattle/Portland due to severe weather conditions, through and including the trains originating on January 10.

Alternate transportation will be provided between Whitefish and Seattle/Portland.

Amtrak regrets any inconvenience. This information is correct as of the above time and date. Information is subject to change as conditions warrant. Passengers are encouraged to call 800-USA-RAIL or visit Amtrak.com for schedule information and train status updates.

 

[DET63]

How do severe winters affect Russian trains, especially those that serve Siberia?

 

[JoanieBlon]

How do severe winters affect Russian trains, especially those that serve Siberia?

Not sure about Russian trains, but the Eurostar seems to be having some of the same issues that affected the Empire Builder ~ and the temperatures there aren't anywhere close to being as severe as those here in the USA......

From BBC News
Eurostar still affected by snow

A Eurostar train broke down inside the Channel Tunnel on Thursday

Eurostar services between London and Paris have continued to be affected by fresh snowfall and freezing temperatures.

Passengers are being urged to cancel or postpone their trips if possible because of the weather conditions.

The firm said it was restricting the number of trains it was running through the Channel Tunnel because of the low temperatures.

Early morning and late night services at the weekend have been cancelled.

'Sorry for inconvenience'

In a statement, Eurostar said: "If you do not need to travel we strongly recommend you cancel or postpone your trip.

"For Saturday 9 January and Sunday 10 January, there is a reduced timetable with a number of cancellations, including our very early morning and late evening services.

"Also, there may be additional delays or last minute cancellations. We are very sorry for any inconvenience this may cause."

The Brussels service has been restricted but Disneyland Paris and ski trains have been running as normal.

 

[Ispolkom]

How do severe winters affect Russian trains, especially those that serve Siberia?

In the usual ways: delays, equipment failures. I can remember late trains, malfunctioning toilets and very cold sleeper compartments (one morning, after sleeping with our winter coats on, I woke to find that Misha, in the upper bunk, was covered by snow that had blown through a cracked window). There's more electrified railroad there (the Trans-Siberian, the Baikal-Amur Mainline, the Norilsk mainline and I think the Murmansk railroad are all electrified). Mostly though, they have the advantage of having lots of equipment to easily replace broken-down units. As Lenin (or Stalin) is supposed to have said, "Quantity has a quality all its own."

 

[yarrow]

How do severe winters affect Russian trains, especially those that serve Siberia?

In the usual ways: delays, equipment failures. I can remember late trains, malfunctioning toilets and very cold sleeper compartments (one morning, after sleeping with our winter coats on, I woke to find that Misha, in the upper bunk, was covered by snow that had blown through a cracked window). There's more electrified railroad there (the Trans-Siberian, the Baikal-Amur Mainline, the Norilsk mainline and I think the Murmansk railroad are all electrified). Mostly though, they have the advantage of having lots of equipment to easily replace broken-down units. As Lenin (or Stalin) is supposed to have said, "Quantity has a quality all its own."

great. our system is almost as good as siberian passenger rail

 

[Elidh]

In celebration of our 35th anniversary, my husband and I have reservations for our first Amtrak trip: On the Empire Builder from Chicago to Havre, MT, on 7 February, and returning on the 16th. Reading this forum topic has me seriously worried about cancellations!! Any advice from you veterans out there?

 

[Bob Dylan]

In celebration of our 35th anniversary, my husband and I have reservations for our first Amtrak trip: On the Empire Builder from Chicago to Havre, MT, on 7 February, and returning on the 16th. Reading this forum topic has me seriously worried about cancellations!! Any advice from you veterans out there?

That's nearly a month away. While it wont be beach weather up in the NW and across the Northern plains, it should be warmer, and if so a beautiful winter ride looking out @ the snowy landscape from an LD train , the EB, one of the better ones for sure! Congrats on the anniversary, some people have more spouses than years married! :lol: I really wouldnt worry a whole lot, we're having problems with the Texas Eagles down south and I'm supposed to leave Monday on a trip east and south so will keep up with the news and weather, I'm packed and ready to go!

If you do have to reschedule due to weather your voucher should cover a nice trip when it's warmer and you get to have a second 35th on the train!

 

[Elidh]

In celebration of our 35th anniversary, my husband and I have reservations for our first Amtrak trip: On the Empire Builder from Chicago to Havre, MT, on 7 February, and returning on the 16th. Reading this forum topic has me seriously worried about cancellations!! Any advice from you veterans out there?

That's nearly a month away. While it wont be beach weather up in the NW and across the Northern plains, it should be warmer, and if so a beautiful winter ride looking out @ the snowy landscape from an LD train , the EB, one of the better ones for sure! Congrats on the anniversary, some people have more spouses than years married! :lol: I really wouldnt worry a whole lot, we're having problems with the Texas Eagles down south and I'm supposed to leave Monday on a trip east and south so will keep up with the news and weather, I'm packed and ready to go!

If you do have to reschedule due to weather your voucher should cover a nice trip when it's warmer and you get to have a second 35th on the train!

Thanks for the encouragement...Have a good trip yourself!!