Ethan Allen schedule change

[John Bobinyec]

Vermonter does not go through Burlington at all. It goes through Essex Jct.

So to do a loop trip to Vermont via the future Ethan Allen Express and the current Vermonter, you'd have to transfer somehow from one station to the other?
jb

 

[jis]

So to do a loop trip to Vermont via the future Ethan Allen Express and the current Vermonter, you'd have to transfer somehow from one station to the other?
jb

Uber/Lyft or possibly local transit. In any case you have to overnight in the Burlington/Essex Jct. area, so there really is not direct transfer from one train to the other.

 

[Amtrak25]

There are no hotels in Essex Jct. The hotels in downtown Burlington cost $200 - 400 a night. Halfway afforable hotels are in South Burlington and a Days inn in Colchester. Wyndham currently has all hotels blocked from the reservation system due to Covid, so you would have to reserve them directly. I will likely take a VT Transline bus from Albany, which gets there around 6pm. Ethan Allen won't get there until 10pm, too late for the local transit system.

 

[Exvalley]

There are cheaper hotel options outside of downtown, but everything is fairly expensive in the summer.

 

[John Bobinyec]

Does anybody have any insight as to why the Ethan Allen extension plan didn't connect the train lines after coming all the way up from Rutland?
jb

 

[jis]

Does anybody have any insight as to why the Ethan Allen extension plan didn't connect the train lines after coming all the way up from Rutland?
jb

I suspect it is an ROI and operating cost issue perhaps.

First of all, the track from Burlington to Essex Jct. is not in exactly usable state and would need considerable work.

Secondly Essex Jct. is not exactly a place where you can turn a train. It would have to go all the way to St. Albans, which itself is not a huge ridership generator, nor is Essex Jct. unless it is serving Burlington.

Third, they would require additional work in St. Albans to extend facilities to service the train there, which of course may be a wash with what had to be done in Burlington anyway. But basically they'd have to incur the cost of running the train an hour or two more each way with minimal additional revenue.

And finally VTDOT, whose baby it is, did not think they wished to pay for it. Which of course completely trumps everything else I suppose.

 

[Amtrak25]

Which other train lines ? Burlington - Essex Jct is only connected by a branchline in very poor condition.

 

[joelkfla]

Uber/Lyft or possibly local transit. In any case you have to overnight in the Burlington/Essex Jct. area, so there really is not direct transfer from one train to the other.

There is a local bus that runs between downtown Burlington & Essex Jct., except for the Sunday northbound train. Strangely, I can't find any fare info on the website.
https://ridegmt.com/2-essex-2/

 

[Amtrak25]

GMT website says fares are still suspended. "Effective immediately until further notice, GMT will operate all bus service fare free. " The regular fare would be $1.25.

 

[Amtrak25]

The #6 bus can take you to South Burlington for cheaper digs:

https://ridegmt.com/6-shelburne/
Last southbound bus is 10:30pm, too close a call. Amtrak is not Swiss Federal Railway.

 

[fdaley]

If you're willing to go in the off-season (i.e., November-April), the Lake Champlain Hilton and the Hilton Garden Inn on Main Street, both walking distance from Burlington Union Station, have rates in the $130-to-$150-a-night range.

 

[Exvalley]

If you can afford it, you really want to stay in downtown Burlington. There is quite a bit of charm downtown with the lakefront, the University of Vermont, and Church Street (a pedestrian-only street). The suburbs are your typical generic suburbs, with chain restaurants, stores, etc.

Another option that requires a rental car or an Uber ride is Stowe, which is about 45 minutes from Burlington. Stowe is your classic New England town nestled in the mountains. There isn't as much to do there, but it's a tremendously popular town with tourists. The Green Mountain Inn is located right in the middle of town and is a nice choice if you don't plan on having a car.

 

[Seaboard92]

There is a hotel in Essex Junction because the airline I work for puts us up in it for Burlington. The Essex it's also a culinary college

 

[oregon pioneer]

There are cheaper hotel options outside of downtown, but everything is fairly expensive in the summer.

I grew up in Burlington, and I faced that choice when I went back for my 50th high school reunion four years ago. I looked at the hotels on/near Williston Ave (South Burlington), but ended up with a very reasonably priced Air BnB two blocks north of Battery Park, close to the corner of North St and North Ave. Easy walking distance to downtown, the waterfront (steep!), and my old neighborhood. I think it cost me around $65-70/night (fees included) for a small private room with shared bath, breakfast on the sun porch included. That might not be everyone's cup of tea, but it suited me perfectly!

 

[Amtrak25]

There is a hotel in Essex Junction because the airline I work for puts us up in it for Burlington. The Essex it's also a culinary college

If you mean this Luxury Vermont Resort & Spa | Essex Resort & Spa, it is 2.2 miles from Amtrak. The cost of cab fare there and back (if there are taxis in Essex Jct), would defeat the purpose of staying out of Burlington.

 

[MARC Rider]

I did a loop trip once using the Adirondack and Burlington ferry. We combined it with a week in the Maine cabin. We had to ride a taxi from the Burlington Ferry dock to the airport where we picked up our rental car. We then stayed in a suburban motel. On our return from Maine, we stayed in the same suburban motel, then dropped the rental car at the airport and took a cab to Essex Jct. to catch the Vermonter. I don't recall either cab ride being particularly expensive, and there is probably now competition from Uber and Lyft. Essex Jct. is actually part of the Burlington metro area; they could just as easily call it "North Burlington."

 

[neroden]

They'll probably fix up the Essex Jct - Burlington track (it's only a couple of miles, so it's a triviality to repair) after they get the Vermonter running to Montreal, because then it'll make sense to extend the Ethan Allen to Montreal too.

Without that connection, the ridership benefit of Burlington to Essex Jct is... low, because it mostly benefits people going from or to points north of Burlington and there just aren't that many until you get to Montreal. Frankly I think they only keep running the Vermonter to St Albans because they're trying to get it back to Montreal.

 

[Maverickstation]

Here is an article from Wednesday (3/16) on the Burlington extension.

https://vtdigger.org/2022/03/16/all...vTmvyN7WUMx92Wfdu6C36E9OIVhn0D-O9wof_SpmuPh-U

 

[Barb Stout]

From the article, "The train’s overnight location was a sore subject in the city three years ago. While a state-commissioned study called for the five-car train to sit at Union Station in between runs, some residents pushed back against that idea."

Why would the train sitting there overnight be a problem?

 

[Amtrak25]

Locomotive idling, spoiling their view, usual NIMBY stuff.

Since I no longer believe the Vermonter will be extended to Montreal, Essex Jct - Burlington operation is off the table. Even if were to happen, how would Montreal Central's Track 23, where the Customs Taj Mahal would be built, be able to handle both a Vermonter and Ethan Allen within an hour or so of each other each way?

 

[jis]

It is certainly true that if CN insists on remote control of the Drawbridge across the Richelieu the cost will probably be more than what Vermont would be willing to bear. Compared to that the cost of remote control of one switch at Cantic is next to nothing.

Since I no longer believe the Vermonter will be extended to Montreal, Essex Jct - Burlington operation is off the table. Even if were to happen, how would Montreal Central's Track 23, where the Customs Taj Mahal would be built, be able to handle both a Vermonter and Ethan Allen within an hour or so of each other each way?

I don't necessarily see that as a problem. Airports routinely handle multiple flights through a single C&I facility without necessarily separating the passengers from each flight. I don't see how a train station would be any different. Just like there is the C&I cleared Airside at airports, there will be a Railside at a station. Eurostars operate that way for example at London St. Pancras for passengers headed to Europe or arriving from there.

 

[Amtrak25]

If the train's "jail" is Track 23 and only Track 23, like at Vancouver, fenced in with barbed wire, can both trains occupy Track 23 simultaneously ? I would think not. It is not like you would get off Track 15 as now and walk over to Track 23's facility.

 

[jis]

If the train's "jail" is Track 23 and only Track 23, like at Vancouver, fenced in with barbed wire, can both trains occupy Track 23 simultaneously ? I would think not. It is not like you would get off Track 15 as now and walk over to Track 23's facility.

No but the arrivals and departures can be schedule an appropriate amount of time apart while passengers for both service can be processed simultaneously through C&I, that was my point. Afterall two flights can arrive at the same gate, one followed by the other, after the first aircraft is moved away from the gate, and the disembarkation of the passengers of the second flight need not be held up waiting for the passengers of the first flight to clear C&I. Similarly on the departure side.

 

[jpakala]

The Ethan Allen will stay overnight in the Vermont Rail System yard south of Maple Street in Burlington, as preparatory cost was less than expected and all parties now are pleased. https://vtrans.vermont.gov/sites/ao... Amtrak Burlington train parking location.pdf

 

[Amtrak25]

Not surprsing to me they came to that conclusion on where to stash the train. That is also where during Summer 1976 that Steamtown's Bicentennial steam train was stored overnight during the 2nd half of the season when it was based in Burlington for Bennington round trips. But I doubt there is much of any institutional memeory of that in Vermont Railway or VTrans