Help! How soon after departure does Amtrak cancel ticket?

[Texan Eagle]

I want to ride the California Zephyr from Sacramento to Emeryville, but SAC is a "discharge only" station so I can't buy a ticket from there. If I purchase a ticket from one station prior- Roseville to Emeryville, will I be able to board in Sacramento? Or will my ticket be cancelled as a "no-show" as soon as the train departs Roseville? The schedule gives 1 hour between Roseville departure and Sacramento arrival, but it is only 17 miles, so I am guessing a lot of it is padding.

 

[tomfuller]

Take #541 Capitol Corridor from SAC to EMY It leaves SAC at 2:10PM. If the CZ is late, it will be ahead. If the CZ is early they discharge and go onward without worry.

 

[Texan Eagle]

Take #541 Capitol Corridor from SAC to EMY It leaves SAC at 2:10PM. If the CZ is late, it will be ahead. If the CZ is early they discharge and go onward without worry.

Thank you but I already know this.

Capitol Corridor does not have a Sightseer Lounge though I want to specifically ride CZ because I have not been on an LD train in a long time and am feeling that train-travel-deprivation

 

[TiBike]

The bigger problem might be staff letting you get on the train in Sacramento in the first place. You could ride the eastbound CZ up to Roseville and catch the westbound there. There's also local transit options to get from Sacramento to Roseville.

 

[ehbowen]

The bigger problem might be staff letting you get on the train in Sacramento in the first place. You could ride the eastbound CZ up to Roseville and catch the westbound there. There's also local transit options to get from Sacramento to Roseville.

^^^ What he said.

Edit To Add: My understanding is that Amtrak allows a one-stop tolerance, but that if your tickets are not lifted after the next stop down the line you are officially a no-show. When I took my 2012 Regional joyride to New York so that I could cover new mileage and ride the Crescent bumper-to-bumper, I only had an hour and 35 minutes between trains. My emergency escape plan in the event the Regional fell way behind time was to bail at Newark and attempt to board the southbound Crescent there. Fortunately I did not have to put this plan to the test; we were right on time into NYP.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

My understanding is that Amtrak allows a one-stop tolerance, but that if your tickets are not lifted after the next stop down the line you are officially a no-show.

If I remember correctly two meters start ticking as soon as the conductor finishes processing tickets. One of the meters is based on stops reached and the other is based on time elapsed. If the train completes another scheduled stop or runs out the clock without stopping your ticket becomes invalid and useless. I've never seen anyone attempt to board at a discharge only stop but I'd imagine the staff would be confused/annoyed with an unusual request and choose to error on the side of caution.

 

[caravanman]

If you can reasonably get to the station in advance of SAC and board there, that seems the safest bet. I imagine that you might be able to sneak on board at SAC, pretending that you just got off to stretch your legs, and just go to the sightseer lounge and not worry about a "coach seat". Just say you were in the bathroom or some such at ticket inspection.

Sadly, that run from Sac to Emy is not the most interesting, even viewed from the lounge.

If you end up in jail, don't mention my "advice"

Ed.

 

[Bob Dylan]

I think Eddie was being satirical, but fare jumping is a serious offense and some conductors come down really hard on this.

I like the idea of riding #6 East to Roseville, or even Reno!, and then catching #5 back to EMY..Twice through the Sierras in a Sightseer Lounge if you do Reno!

 

[sechs]

My understanding is that Amtrak allows a one-stop tolerance, but that if your tickets are not lifted after the next stop down the line you are officially a no-show.

If I remember correctly two meters start ticking as soon as the conductor finishes processing tickets. One of the meters is based on stops reached and the other is based on time elapsed. If the train completes another scheduled stop or runs out the clock without stopping your ticket becomes invalid and useless. I've never seen anyone attempt to board at a discharge only stop but I'd imagine the staff would be confused/annoyed with an unusual request and choose to error on the side of caution.

How does the conductor note that he's finished processing tickets?

Last year, I took a trip LAX-SLO on the Pacific Surfliner. I had used points for a friend to come with me, and, then, return on the CS same day. Unfortunately, she missed the train and had to scrap the trip. I didn't call reservations to cancel until after I got to SLO, and they had no problems. That's about four hours after the train left.

 

[sechs]

Take #541 Capitol Corridor from SAC to EMY It leaves SAC at 2:10PM. If the CZ is late, it will be ahead. If the CZ is early they discharge and go onward without worry.

Thank you but I already know this.

Capitol Corridor does not have a Sightseer Lounge though I want to specifically ride CZ because I have not been on an LD train in a long time and am feeling that train-travel-deprivation

Might be a safer bet to take the CS in the morning and ride a Capitol Corridor back. You can take the bus into the City and have lunch.

 

[Hal]

I think Eddie was being satirical, but fare jumping is a serious offense and some conductors come down really hard on this.

I like the idea of riding #6 East to Roseville, or even Reno!, and then catching #5 back to EMY..Twice through the Sierras in a Sightseer Lounge if you do Reno!

I don't have a clue about out west but at discharge only stations I know about the crew, if it is not a lazy crew, does not let anyone board without questioning them if they see them. With an observant crew only in some cases might they be allowed to board. For example a carry by from another train. Or someone who got off a stop early by mistake on the previous train. Would look at their documents to confirm. If someone said they missed the train at the last stop and drove to catch up, that would might work, probably not think they were lying even if they were, but there is no guarantee that would work with every "observant" crew.
As for when the ticket is cancelled as a no show. Can't say for out west. But it is not only time. After each crew member completes their ticket sweep they indicate it on their EMD. They tell the conductor. The conductor does that on their EMD when they are confident that the ticket sweep had been done. So when the whole crew has done that it would designate any tickets not lifted as no shows. On the NEC it may be a few stops because all the doors get opened and a bunch gets on so they might wait a few stops to both complete the lift and put that the sweep is completed into the EMD. Also don't want to say someone who was in the bathroom is a no show. And then find them and then oops their ticket was canceled as a no show. But I have seen on long haul trains with a few passengers getting on they might lift the ticket on the platform. So I can imagine it is possible if they know they collected all the tickets on the platform they might complete the sweep on the EMD leaving the stop. The EMD is supposed to indicate a real time manifest and to allow no show space to be sold. The time meter that has been mentioned is really there in case the crew takes to long to indicate on the EMD that the sweep has been completed. Or forgot.

In other words trying to game having their ticket cancelled might work like the OP proposes might work, but it might not.

 

[BCL]

Maybe it's the time, but if you really want to ride in a lounge, wouldn't the Coast Starlight make more sense?

 

[Texan Eagle]

Maybe it's the time, but if you really want to ride in a lounge, wouldn't the Coast Starlight make more sense?

If I had the time I would do Starlight, but that route has only one train so going out and connecting to the returning Starlight is a risky venture with little bailout options. At least between Bay Area and Sac, if I miss one of the trains there are other trains and buses to get me back home without breaking bank.

 

[Texan Eagle]

I think Eddie was being satirical, but fare jumping is a serious offense and some conductors come down really hard on this.

Curious, how does what I proposed count as fare jumping? I am paying complete fare for Roseville to Emeryville, which is an official valid ticket, just getting on the train one station later at Sacramento just 17 miles later.

 

[Texan Eagle]

Sadly, that run from Sac to Emy is not the most interesting, even viewed from the lounge.

I will respectfully disagree on this part. Sac to Emy is beautiful this time of the year since everything is green after abundant rainfall, spring flowers are in bloom everywhere you see, you cross the longest railway bridge west of Mississippi at Martinez, run hugging the coast of the Bay before reaching EMY... that is interesting enough for a 2 hour ride.

 

[RSG]

But I have seen on long haul trains with a few passengers getting on they might lift the ticket on the platform.

In my experience in riding the California Zephyr most of the conductors tend to scan tickets on the platform at intermediate stations which are not service stops. I think this would tend to be more the case as the train approached the terminus so as to keep current with ‘paperwork’ and not lag behind.

 

[KmH]

In Denver, the main service stop on the CZ route, I've seen conductors lifting tickets at the end of the 2 lines (sleeper/coach) they form between the end of the backed-into-the-station train and the station itself.

In Ottumwa, where I board the CZ, conductors have always scanned my ticket on the platform.

In Sacramento I've experienced conductors lifting tickets in the station (for the CS northbound,) and for getting on the CZ eastbound lifting my ticket on the platform & after I have boarded.

 

[MARC Rider]

I board at Washington, and sometimes my ticket doesn't get scanned until right before we get to Baltimore (where I'm getting off). This is after two intermediate stops (New Carrolton and BWI). Once, before the e-ticket days, I once had to actually find the conductor on the platform in Baltimore to give him my ticket. I've never had any trouble with being considered a "no-show."

 

[Hal]

I board at Washington, and sometimes my ticket doesn't get scanned until right before we get to Baltimore (where I'm getting off). This is after two intermediate stops (New Carrolton and BWI). Once, before the e-ticket days, I once had to actually find the conductor on the platform in Baltimore to give him my ticket. I've never had any trouble with being considered a "no-show."

Where it becomes a problem is if you have a connecting or return ticket. Then the connecting leg or return ticket gets cancelled if you are a no show. For a one way ticket it does not matter.

 

[Seaboard92]

I've had a case where in the sleeper I've gone from PHL to CAM without getting a ticket lifted in a little over twelve hours. The conductor as we were arriving in Camden was surprised that no one lifted our ticket. Back in the paper ticket days

 

[willem]

I went from Chicago to western Colorado without having my ticket lifted, although I had understood the TA-SC to say that it had been. A conductor walking by the room stopped and asked who I was.

That was almost a mess because I did have follow-on travel (that had been canceled), but the conductor was able to get everything reinstated. It was a nerve-racking few minutes, though.

 

[RSG]

In Denver, the main service stop on the CZ route, I've seen conductors lifting tickets at the end of the 2 lines (sleeper/coach) they form between the end of the backed-into-the-station train and the station itself.

When the Temporary Station was still in use in Denver, the conductor would have people line up at a large table in a corner of the station near the crew access door and assign seating and collect tickets about 20 minutes prior to the expected arrival. I'm sure that's impossible inside the refurbished Union Station since it's primarily an entertainment complex with annoying intra- and innercity travelers wandering around.

 

[caravanman]

There was no intention to imply fare jumping, if one has booked and paid from the station in advance.

No matter how vigilant a train crew, and let's face it, we are talking Amtrak here , if you have a ticket and say you got off the train to grab a photo, from a different coach car... It's not like you were chatting to THE RUSSIANS!

I was brought up by the criminal underworld, so have a fund of masterly plans to get on a train with my ticket...

Ed.

 

[jis]

No matter how vigilant a train crew, and let's face it, we are talking Amtrak here , if you have a ticket and say you got off the train to grab a photo, from a different coach car... It's not like you were chatting to THE RUSSIANS!

THE RUSSIANS are out BFFs these days!