Maple Leaf Business Class discussion

[evanderm]

Hello Everyone,
As promised in my new member introduction, I would be coming here with some questions. I'm booked to travel from Toronto, Union Station to NYC (TWO-NYP) on the Maple Leaf, and it'll be my first ever trip on Amtrak (flying back). In fact, I think it's my longest daytime single-train journey to date. Some info about my trip: I'll be traveling on my own, on a Friday, in Business class - I've read here that VIA doesn't really do business class on this route when they operate the train (case in point, I could only book EconPlus on the VIA Rail site - so I booked on Amtrak.com). Wondering what I can expect. I have some specific questions though:

1. Will there be any kind of priority boarding for this train in Toronto?
2. What about at the border - will Business Class be invited to clear customs and immigration first?
3. Is there separate or front-of-the-line processing for Nexus/Global Entry?
4. Will there be priority boarding in Niagara Falls NY after clearing with CBP?
5. Will I have to 'reclaim' my seat after clearing the border or are the seats reserved/held?
6. I would like to sit on the right-hand side for better views. from what I can tell that is most likely the 2-seater side. Will I (travelling on my own) be able to take one of these seats or will I be asked to move?
7. I've read here that the café does sometimes run out of food - any suggestions on what to pack?
8. Business class seems to come with one drink, is that it, or can I get more than one? (reports vary on here but I might also be looking at old information).

I'm probably obsessing over detail too much, but that just means I'm excited about the trip. Thanks in advance for all your insights.

 

[zephyr17]

Reports vary, but I have ridden the Maple Leaf, Toronto-New York, several times and my experience is:
1. No priority boarding in Toronto. No use of the Business/Panorama Lounge there. VIA does not recognize it as its Business Class and does not extend BC privileges to BC passengers on VIA train 97. It charges just a additional dollar on the fare as a placeholder to sync BC reservations with Amtrak.
2. I have always been seated in the BC car TWO-NFL by VIA with the BC ticket, although some here have reported other experiences. Also, the only open coach Toronto-Niagara Falls was the one immediately forward of the half BC/half cafe and we were detrained from that vestibule. Note the Amtrak operating crew boards at Niagara Falls, ON station to take the train over the bridge.
3. I am a NEXUS cardholder. Like other pedestrian crossings (I have been across on a bus at Pacific Highway and Whirlpool Bridge as well as at NFL station), there is no separate NEXUS line or head of line privileges. You can use your NEXUS as ID, though.
4. When they reopen the train up at NFL for reboarding there isn't priority boarding. You will probably be waiting in the NFL station for an hour or so before they do. You don't go through Customs & Immigration inspection and reboard the train. You go through Customs and Immigration and wait in the station for the boarding call, which is typically around 30 minutes before departure. Most local NFL passengers haven't arrived yet when they reopen and most initial boarding is from those who came in from Canada, though.
5. The seats are not saved officially. My experience is people respect where they had been sitting in BC and reclaim the same seats. In coach, more of the train is open and the crew will direct you to a different car based on destination.
6. The 2 seat side is on the right. You can take one if you want, but expect a seat mate at some point, BC fills up down the line. Most of the time as it fills up, it seems there are more single riders than single seats.
7. They do run out of some food items, but usually have enough for a lunch out of NFL (more like BUX). Dinner may be a different matter. If packing food, bear in mind you will cross an international border. Don't pack fresh fruits and veggies. Don't bring meats. Hard cheeses are okay, and all non-meat packaged/processed foods (crackers, potato chips, breads, etc). There are exceptions to the meat and fresh fruit and vegetable rules, but you have to know the exceptions and it is safer to just avoid them entirely. Bear in mind that as a NEXUS/GE trusted traveller program member you are expected to know and strictly adhere to all customs and immigration rules as a condition of membership. They'll revoke your membership for an apple. I am fiercely protective of my own NEXUS membership, it is just too damned handy, and I will not risk it. I stick to things like Babybel cheeses and crackers when crossing, which I know are okay.
8. All my experiences on the Leaf were pre-COVID. Then the practice was one free non-alcoholic drink.

My experience is not a whole lot of people cross the border on the Leaf. It is a much calmer and less crowded experience than a busy bus crossing like Pacific Highway or Whirlpool Bridge. Especially since they moved into the new station which has a much larger Port of Entry facility than the one in the old station in an old Lehigh Valley freighthouse.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Hello Everyone,
As promised in my new member introduction, I would be coming here with some questions. I'm booked to travel from Toronto, Union Station to NYC (TWO-NYP) on the Maple Leaf, and it'll be my first ever trip on Amtrak (flying back). In fact, I think it's my longest daytime single-train journey to date. Some info about my trip: I'll be traveling on my own, on a Friday, in Business class - I've read here that VIA doesn't really do business class on this route when they operate the train (case in point, I could only book EconPlus on the VIA Rail site - so I booked on Amtrak.com). Wondering what I can expect. I have some specific questions though:

1. Will there be any kind of priority boarding for this train in Toronto?
2. What about at the border - will Business Class be invited to clear customs and immigration first?
3. Is there separate or front-of-the-line processing for Nexus/Global Entry?
4. Will there be priority boarding in Niagara Falls NY after clearing with CBP?
5. Will I have to 'reclaim' my seat after clearing the border or are the seats reserved/held?
6. I would like to sit on the right-hand side for better views. from what I can tell that is most likely the 2-seater side. Will I (travelling on my own) be able to take one of these seats or will I be asked to move?
7. I've read here that the café does sometimes run out of food - any suggestions on what to pack?
8. Business class seems to come with one drink, is that it, or can I get more than one? (reports vary on here but I might also be looking at old information).

I'm probably obsessing over detail too much, but that just means I'm excited about the trip. Thanks in advance for all your insights.

I've taken this Train numerous times between Toronto ( and Oakville).and New York in Biz Class.

I see Zeyphr17 beat me to this but I'll still post my experiences on this route, it's similar to his.

I haven't been on this Route since 2019 Pre-COVID so not sure about priority boarding @ Union Station now, but it used to be first come,first served.

The Train is Amtrak equipment run by a VIA Crew as far as the VIA Station on the Ontario side in Niagara Falls.( the Attendant in the Cafe/Biz Class Car will have Canadian items for Sale ( Snacks and Drinks) until the Stop, then will remove everything as the VIA crew departs the Train( they will take the evening Train to Toronto)and the Amtrak Crew takes over the Train including putting American items into the Cafe.

You are correct that VIA doesn't sell Biz Class in the Cafe/Biz Car to Niagara Falls but Amtrak only charges $1 to ride in that car to/from Toronto from Niagsra Falls,ON.

This Train is Reserved only but Seats are not assigned, so I suggest that when you board in Totonto @ Union Station that you try to be on the Platform early AZ possible to snag your choice of seats.

Every time I've ridden the Single seats have been on the Right hand side( towards the Falls).

Once you cross the River and stop @ the New Niagara Falls Station you will have to take all your stuff anx go inside the Station to clear Immigration and Customs.( the Agents here are known for their Less than Friendly Customer Service!)

Since you already have a Seat you don't have to worry about getting it back once everybody has cleared CBPand are allowed to reboard.Just be patient,it takes awhile.

You'll stop @ the New downtown Buffalo Station, the Suburban Buffalo Depew Station,and then head to Rochester, Utica etc till you ger to Albany where you'll then head down the Hudson River ( Right Hand Side)to New York City!

The Train usually runs Late,so just go with the flow till you get to Penn Station.( be sure and Chdck out the Shiney New Moyihan Train Hall!).

 

[jiml]

With well over a dozen Maple Leaf trips I can confirm most everything stated above. Point #7 by Zephyr17 cannot be over-emphasized. Don't stop at Subway in Canada with the intention of enjoying your sandwich on the US side.

His Point #8 is also correct. For some reason they're much stingier with drinks on the Maple Leaf business class than other Empire Service trains. I've never had a problem getting more on other trains between NYP and BUF.

Also, add that sometimes VIA does not open the cafe car at all on the Canadian side - particularly Toronto-bound. With current staffing situations everywhere this may be more likely.

 

[evanderm]

Thank you, everyone, for your helpful responses.

It's a shame VIA won't treat this as a business class product, but I suppose they don't want to have to deal with catering and are taking the all-or-nothing approach - landing on nothing - to this train rather than developing a hybrid business class service with in-station perks but limited on-board service.

I'm definitely looking forward to the trip, and experiencing this method of crossing the border between Canada and the US. Can add it to my list which already includes air, personal car, bus, pedestrian, seaport, and marine. I think that only leaves rail and ferry. Thanks for the reminders on what foodstuffs not to bring. I, indeed, do not want to risk my Nexus card so already prepared to pack accordingly. I like the babybel and crackers idea. Will probably buy a salad or something together with lunch out of Niagara Falls or Buffalo to keep on hand come dinner time.

Really looking forward to this trip and whatever happens on it. Thanks again for all the detailed posts.

 

[zephyr17]

Probably at least part of the reason VIA does not treat it as business class is that over the majority of the route it is Amtrak business class and is nowhere near the same product as VIA's business class. On the Maple Leaf it is pretty much a somewhat larger seat in the back half of the cafe car and a free coke from a usually surly attendant. Who won't open for service until around Buffalo Exchange Street, if you're lucky. You won't get a crack at that salad until then.

VIA's Business Class is similar to Amtrak's Acela First Class in terms of service level. It is a different animal than Amtrak "Business Class". If I were running VIA, I would not want to risk it being conflated with my fine product.

As for dinner, there is a long dwell in Albany where they change engines and some decent food options in the station there. Running in and picking something up is a viable option.

 

[NYP2NFL01]

Hello! This thread could not have appeared at a better time! I am booked on the Maple Leaf in September from NYP to NFS in Business Class.
It's been 21 years since last riding this train. Back then, you did not have to get off the train for Customs and immigration. We visited Niagara Falls, ON two more times after the 2001 trip. To circumvent the lengthy border crossing on the train, we took the Maple Leaf from NYP to NFL. Then, a taxi across the border to our hotel. On the return trip, we would take a taxi back across the border to NFL and an Empire Service train from NFL. But, it appears the taxi border crossing is no longer an option. Someone correct me if I'm wrong.

 

[evanderm]

A quick browse of taxi company websites would imply that they do cross the border but you could always call a few companies and ask.
If Niagara Falls ON is your final destination I'm sure you could just leave the station once you are cleared by CBSA.

If travelling light and if there are no mobility issues, you could also walk across the Rainbow Bridge and then hail a taxi on the US side for your return.

 

[zephyr17]

Before they restarted the Maple Leaf, I was looking at taking GO Transit from Toronto to Niagara Falls, ON and getting over the border to Niagara Falls, NY station to catch the truncated Leaf for my November New York trip. I looked at taxis and found there are cab companies in Niagara Falls, ON that advertise service to the Buffalo airport, so there are cabs that will cross, least from Canadian side. However, I decided if I were to take GO, I'd take an Uber/Lyft or a cab down to the Rainbow Bridge and walk across, then grab another on the NY side to take me to the Amtrak station. Either that or take Megabus from Toronto to Buffalo and catch the train at Exchange Street.

Happily, the Maple Leaf is going through now, so I am now booked TWO-NYP in November and don't have to fool around.

Honestly, with your destination being Niagara Falls, ON, with the loads I've experienced on the Maple Leaf, customs is likely going to be faster taking the train across. There probably won't be nearly as many people as at the Rainbow Bridge. As soon as you clear customs, you'll be able to leave. You won't have to wait for the train's extended dwell since you'll be at your destination.

 

[NYP2NFL01]

Thank you zephyr17 for that information!

 

[daybeers]

Probably at least part of the reason VIA does not treat it as business class is that over the majority of the route it is Amtrak business class and is nowhere near the same product as VIA's business class. On the Maple Leaf it is pretty much a somewhat larger seat in the back half of the cafe car and a free coke from a usually surly attendant. Who won't open for service until around Buffalo Exchange Street, if you're lucky. You won't get a crack at that salad until then.

VIA's Business Class is similar to Amtrak's Acela First Class in terms of service level. It is a different animal than Amtrak "Business Class". If I were running VIA, I would not want to risk it being conflated with my fine product.

This is hilarious, thank you for the laughs.

 

[user 5784]

Hello all, Ive just booked a business class seat on Maple Leaf in February--Albany to Toronto. I dont see a specific seat number on my reservation or ticket. Are specific seats not reserved on this train? On other business class trips ive booked on Amtrak (ie the vermonter) i get assigned a specific seat, and if i dont like it, i can switch online. Any info from anyone with the knowledge is appreciated. I tried looking thru previous messages and online and couldnt find the answer to my question, thus ive asked here. Thanks

 

[tomfuller]

If you are traveling solo, try to get on early so you have your choice of the single seats instead of 2 seat pair.

 

[user 5784]

If you are traveling solo, try to get on early so you have your choice of the single seats instead of 2 seat pair.

thanks, ill be riding to toronto out of albany so i imagine the prime seats will have been taken by then. but ill try. I wonder why the seats arent assigned when booking like on many/most other trains?

 

[trimetbusfan]

thanks, ill be riding to toronto out of albany so i imagine the prime seats will have been taken by then. but ill try. I wonder why the seats arent assigned when booking like on many/most other trains?

Buisness class are only really assigned on NEC trains

 

[user 5784]

Buisness class are only really assigned on NEC trains

guess im spoiled here in vermont--business class is assigned on the vermonter. again--im wondering why cant be assigned on other trains as well.

 

[Amtrak25]

The Vermonter is really an NEC train. The Ethan Allen is an Empire Service train. Do they assign specific seats on the Ethan Allen business class ?

 

[user 5784]

The Vermonter is really an NEC train. The Ethan Allen is an Empire Service train. Do they assign specific seats on the Ethan Allen business class ?

not sure if they do or not on EA. ive only ridden coach on that train.

 

[Acela150]

I believe that part of the reason that the Maple Leaf is that VIA Rail runs the train from the Canadian border to TWO. Although I'm not sure on that.

 

[MccfamschoolMom]

To compare with Business Class in another region, the hubby and I recently rode Business Class on the Lincoln Service/Missouri River Runner, and there were no assigned seats there. There weren't even 2 seats together for us initially, until a passenger who had boarded in Chicago got off.

 

[BlackDiamond]

Consistency is not one of Amtrak's strong points

 

[MARC Rider]

I will be taking Maple Leaf Business class from Albany to Toronto next month. What are the chances that I'll be able to get a seat to myself? And what is VIA's food service like north of Niagara Falls? I think we cross the border about dinner time. I might have to settle for a late dinner in Toronto, I guess.

 

[Bob Dylan]

I will be taking Maple Leaf Business class from Albany to Toronto next month. What are the chances that I'll be able to get a seat to myself? And what is VIA's food service like north of Niagara Falls? I think we cross the border about dinner time. I might have to settle for a late dinner in Toronto, I guess.

As you know between the Border and Totonto, the Cafe is run by a VIA LSA,with Limited Canadian Snack Items available for purchase once underway.( they're loaded during the Station dwell while passengers go through border procedures inside the Ststion)

You'll want to wait to eat Dinner upon arrival into Union Station which is very easy since Totonto is Canada's New York.( with High Prices)

 

[BrianR]

To compare with Business Class in another region, the hubby and I recently rode Business Class on the Lincoln Service/Missouri River Runner, and there were no assigned seats there. There weren't even 2 seats together for us initially, until a passenger who had boarded in Chicago got off.

No assigned Business Class seats on the Wolverine Services trains I take from ARB->CHI. Strictly first come, first served.

 

[OBS]

I will be taking Maple Leaf Business class from Albany to Toronto next month. What are the chances that I'll be able to get a seat to myself? And what is VIA's food service like north of Niagara Falls? I think we cross the border about dinner time. I might have to settle for a late dinner in Toronto, I guess.

For a single seat, if all else fails it should thin out around SYR/ROC...