Most Unattractive Amtrak Routes...

[caravanman]

Hi Folks,

I am still fine tuning my Jan 2007 Amtrak trip, and am looking for a little more advice.

The main Amtrak routes that I missed out on other trips were Miami to New York, and the Crescent between New York and New Orleans. I could include the Crescent on my next trip, but is it an attractive route? I understand that the Crescent might be curtailed due to track repairs anyway?

Ed B)

 

[Rafi]

Hi Folks,I am still fine tuning my Jan 2007 Amtrak trip, and am looking for a little more advice.

The main Amtrak routes that I missed out on other trips were Miami to New York, and the Crescent between New York and New Orleans. I could include the Crescent on my next trip, but is it an attractive route? I understand that the Crescent might be curtailed due to track repairs anyway?

Ed B)

 

I can tell you that as far as your Silver Service is concerned, you'll probably want to take the Silver Meteor, as opposed to the Silver Star. It hugs the coast, and it's the faster run (unless you prefer more train time, of course). It doesn't have that single "you have to see this" moment, but it does pass through some scenic towns, and I'd say the highlight is most likely the James River crossing in Richmond, VA. It's quite a tall trestle and provides a great view. I've only been as far south as Orlando, though, so there could be sights south of ORL that I'm not aware of.

 

As for the Crescent, your daylight hours are primarily New York to Charlottesville and then from Northern Georgia to New Orleans, if it's on time. I've only gone as far south as ATL, so I can't comment down to NOL, but the rolling blue ridge in Virginia are quite beautiful, although a little stagnant and in the distance. It should be noted that the northbound Crescent provides more blueridge in the daylight than the southbound.

 

As for track work, I believe it's just for a week or two; there's a topic on the forum addressing what the schedule is.

 

-Rafi

 

[George Harris]

Atlanta to Birmingham is wandering through the hills, mostly at 35 to 50 mph. South of Birmingham speed picks up. I regard as a highlight the crossing of the western end oif Lake Pontchartrain. 6 mile trestlle. Look out to the west (right side southbound) and it looks like you are alone out at sea. On the east side are the generally parallel US11 and I10 bridges. South of the lake crossing, you follow the south shore of the Lake for a considerable distance.

George

 

[caravanman]

Ok, thanks for those tips..would anyone care to comment on the choice of the Crescent to New Orleans, against the option of NYC to WAS, Was to Chi, and Chi to Nol?

(with a tourist rail pass, the sleeper portion can work out cheaper via Chi than direct to Nol on the Crescent.)

I am thinking about the fun of a longer train ride, as well as a cheaper sleeper price!

Ed,

 

[haolerider]

Ok, thanks for those tips..would anyone care to comment on the choice of the Crescent to New Orleans, against the option of NYC to WAS, Was to Chi, and Chi to Nol?(with a tourist rail pass, the sleeper portion can work out cheaper via Chi than direct to Nol on the Crescent.)

I am thinking about the fun of a longer train ride, as well as a cheaper sleeper price!

Ed,

I would opt for the route via Chicago, based on the time on the train and the variety of the route.

 

[Rafi]

Ok, thanks for those tips..would anyone care to comment on the choice of the Crescent to New Orleans, against the option of NYC to WAS, Was to Chi, and Chi to Nol?(with a tourist rail pass, the sleeper portion can work out cheaper via Chi than direct to Nol on the Crescent.)

I am thinking about the fun of a longer train ride, as well as a cheaper sleeper price!

Ed,

I'd second the chicago routing, with the caveat that you take the Cardinal instead of the Capitol. There's nothing wrong with the Capitol, per se, but you'll find the Cardinal's routing to have two main advantages:

1). The train originates in New York, providing a one-seat ride to Chicago.

2). The Cardinal travels south of washington to Charlottesville, arriving in the early afternoon. It's almost the same route the Crescent takes, except that the Cardinal diverges at Orange, VA (15 mins south of Culpeper) to Gordonsville, VA over what I'd consider to be excursion trackage (at best). It's a small branch line that's quite scenic, especially as the Cardinal meanders through Gordonsville toward Charlottesville. Once you head west from Charlottesville, you'll be going through some fantastic river rapids/natural gorge scenery (New River Gorge) in the Appalachian mountains. It's just a much more scenic trip, and you'll see most of what you would have seen on the Crescent during daylight hours anyway.

Three caveats you should be aware of with respect to the Cardinal, however:

1). You'll see more New River Gorge scenery when heading TOWARD Washington/New York during the winter months. During the summer, it's pretty much equal.

2). The Cardinal only runs three days a week, departing WAS/NYP on Sun/Wed/Fri and departing CHI on Tue/Thur/Sat.

3). As of right now, there is no dining car on the Cardinal: just a Dinette, which serves a somewhat limited (but acceptable) menu.

-Rafi

 

[racer1735]

The Cardinal also utilizes Viewliner sleeping cars and a mix of Amfleet/Horizon coaches, while the Capital Limited is a Superliner-equipped train. Also, my personal oppinion (FWIW) is that I'll take SDS dining service over a cafe car (dinette) any day.

 

[Guest]

If your starting in NYP, why not take the Lake Shore Limited to chicago so you have one less connection if you don't want to take the cardinal.

 

[Rafi]

If your starting in NYP, why not take the Lake Shore Limited to chicago so you have one less connection if you don't want to take the cardinal.

Agreed, but since the subject is titled, "Most Unattractive Amtrak Routes," and since caravanman's wondering what the scenic alternatives are, I'd say they rank as follows on a New York to Chicago route (most scenic to least scenic):

1). Cardinal

2). Capitol Limited (connection in DC)

3). Lake Shore Limited

And to echo racer, yes, SDS does provide better food than the Cardinal's dinette, but again, I'm assuming you're primarily interested in scenery. The dinette food is not bad. It's just not fantastic. Unfortunately, the Cardinal lost its superliner consist a few years ago (and gained the New York connection, however), so you will be without a curved window superliner car, which is a shame. A viewliner bedroom's high windows provide a nice alternative, however.

-Rafi

 

[caravanman]

Seasons Greetings to all from Robin Hood town!

Thanks again folks for all your thoughts.

The Cardinal sounds a better trip than the Capitol, but it often costs twice as much for a roomette on the Cardinal as it would on the Capitol, with the Lake Shore somewhere in the middle..

I have ridden both the LSL and the Capitol before, and would like to try the Crescent to NOL next trip..but it is more expensive to use (in sleeper) than the Capitol and City of New Orleans route, so I was trying to find out if it was worth the extra to travel on a new route, or whether it was not especialy attractive. One other cost saving option might be to travel to WAS by regular train from New York, and catch the Crescent (roomette class) from there to NOL.

I arrive in NYC on 4th Jan, so I need to start making my rail reservations soon..

Ed B)

 

[racer1735]

Seasons Greetings to all from Robin Hood town!Thanks again folks for all your thoughts.

The Cardinal sounds a better trip than the Capitol, but it often costs twice as much for a roomette on the Cardinal as it would on the Capitol, with the Lake Shore somewhere in the middle..

I have ridden both the LSL and the Capitol before, and would like to try the Crescent to NOL next trip..but it is more expensive to use (in sleeper) than the Capitol and City of New Orleans route, so I was trying to find out if it was worth the extra to travel on a new route, or whether it was not especialy attractive. One other cost saving option might be to travel to WAS by regular train from New York, and catch the Crescent (roomette class) from there to NOL.

I arrive in NYC on 4th Jan, so I need to start making my rail reservations soon..

Ed B)

If you are locked into specific days you have to travel, the Cardinal may cost more as you say. but if you are flexible it may be less expensive as well. Also, if you book a sleeping roomette, your meals are included. And my experience on the Cardinal is that the cafe car is very low on selections in the morning when you may want breakfast (west of Indianapolis). My two trips (not a large sampling, but still two-out-of two) has been that many of the staples....chocolate milk for kids, cinnamon buns, etc....are sold out. You may stand a better chance of enjoying a breakfast and also getting 'your money's worth' on the diner-equipped Capitol Ltd.

 

[AlanB]

One other cost saving option might be to travel to WAS by regular train from New York, and catch the Crescent (roomette class) from there to NOL.

Ordinarily it would never be cheaper to take a regular train from NY to Washington and in fact would be far more expensive. However with a railpass it doesn't matter.

I'm not sure that it would lower the cost of the sleeper all that much, but you can certainly try. Of course you could probably also just book coach on the Crescent NYP - WAS, or even a bit further south, and then book from WAS to NOL in a sleeper. That way you don't even have to change trains, unless of course you want to spend some time in WAS.

 

[AlanB]

You may stand a better chance of enjoying a breakfast and also getting 'your money's worth' on the diner-equipped Capitol Ltd.

Or Diner Lite equiped Capitol Limited.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

One other cost saving option might be to travel to WAS by regular train from New York, and catch the Crescent (roomette class) from there to NOL.

Ordinarily it would never be cheaper to take a regular train from NY to Washington and in fact would be far more expensive. However with a railpass it doesn't matter.

I'm not sure that it would lower the cost of the sleeper all that much, but you can certainly try. Of course you could probably also just book coach on the Crescent NYP - WAS, or even a bit further south, and then book from WAS to NOL in a sleeper. That way you don't even have to change trains, unless of course you want to spend some time in WAS.

But you can't ride the Crescent just from NYC to WAS, as it is a long distance train, stopping only to receive passengers between NYP and WAS. However, the fact that, in this proposed scenario, he would actually be staying on the Crescent might make a difference, not sure.

 

[Rafi]

One other cost saving option might be to travel to WAS by regular train from New York, and catch the Crescent (roomette class) from there to NOL.

Ordinarily it would never be cheaper to take a regular train from NY to Washington and in fact would be far more expensive. However with a railpass it doesn't matter.

I'm not sure that it would lower the cost of the sleeper all that much, but you can certainly try. Of course you could probably also just book coach on the Crescent NYP - WAS, or even a bit further south, and then book from WAS to NOL in a sleeper. That way you don't even have to change trains, unless of course you want to spend some time in WAS.

But you can't ride the Crescent just from NYC to WAS, as it is a long distance train, stopping only to receive passengers between NYP and WAS. However, the fact that, in this proposed scenario, he would actually be staying on the Crescent might make a difference, not sure.

Arrow won't ticket the LD trains out to NY to WAS, no matter what. I ran into this last week, as I needed an itinerary on the Silver Meteor segmented: I wanted coach from BAL-WAS for my wife, at which point I'd meet her in WAS to take a sleeper to Orlando. The agents had to segment her ticket at Alexandria instead, so that may be what caravanman might need to do.

-Rafi

 

[caravanman]

No worries about the NYC to WAS section, I would be happy to even travel a day earlier to WASand pick up the southbound Crescent from there..The saving on roomette price is an incredible $100. Enough to pay for a nights hotel in Washington. Anyone stayed at the Washington Court Hotel, 525 New Jersey Ave Nw

It seems quite close to the station?

Ed B)

 

[LITRAK]

The following hotels are also a quick walk from dc union station.

-Phoenix Park Hotel

-Hoilday Inn on the Hill-New jersey Ave., close to capitol bldg.

-Hyatt (probably a bit more costly.)

I usually stay at the Holiday Inn since I am a priority club member. Good place to stay overnight. About a five minute walk to & from station.

Also, regarding the LSL route westbound, the train runs along the Hudson River up to Albany. Sit on the left side. Thats as scenic as that route gets.

 

[LITRAK]

While some railfans like the Sunset Ltd. route, I personally am not crazy about it. To me, going through Texas is very much boring..seeing the same praries & mountains for the whole day. Only nice part is the departure from New Orleans, climbing the Huey Lewis bridge. Also going over the Pecos River bridge at Del Rio is great. other than those 2 things, not much to see imo.

 

[The Metropolitan]

Only nice part is the departure from New Orleans, climbing the Huey Lewis bridge.

...which you know you're on when you hear the singing,... "If this is It, Please Let me know..." :lol:

I think ya meant the Huey Long Bridge.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huey_Long

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Huey_Lewis_and_the_News

 

[rmgreenesq]

No worries about the NYC to WAS section, I would be happy to even travel a day earlier to WASand pick up the southbound Crescent from there..The saving on roomette price is an incredible $100. Enough to pay for a nights hotel in Washington. Anyone stayed at the Washington Court Hotel, 525 New Jersey Ave Nw It seems quite close to the station?

Ed B)

The Washington Court Hotel is about $250 a night. I've got a meeting scheduled in this hotel for March 15. Most of my colleagues are going to fly down from Boston the night before and spend a night in this hotel.. I'm going to hop Train #67 (the overnight train from Boston to Washington) and skip the night in the hotel. I'll head home on the Acela.

You will be hard pressed to find a bed in Washington DC for $100 a night. You might want to try priceline.com.

Rick

 

[Brian UK]

Rick, an interesting scenario here - I know its 450 miles but what with check in times and transfers, what is it that stops your colleagues considering Acela instead of flying? Is it time, cost, convenience or just ingrained habit? Im not being judgemental, just an observation of the psychology of US travel that I am still trying to understand. Would Boston to New York be more of a certainty?

Brian

 

[rmgreenesq]

Rick, an interesting scenario here - I know its 450 miles but what with check in times and transfers, what is it that stops your colleagues considering Acela instead of flying? Is it time, cost, convenience or just ingrained habit? Im not being judgemental, just an observation of the psychology of US travel that I am still trying to understand. Would Boston to New York be more of a certainty?Brian

I can't speak on behalf of my fellow members of the bar. Boston to Washington DC on the Acela is about six and a half hours. The flight is about an hour and a half. Flying is faster between Boston and Washington, and I think that's what drives the decision. The last Acela south leaves Boston at 3:15 pm and arrives at 9:45 pm. Leaving at 7:00 pm by plane will get you to DCA by 9:30.

If you factor in travel to/from the airport, early check in times, airport screening, and the dead time spent waiting for the plane to load, taxi and take off, travel time between Boston and New York is about the same as flying as the Acela. In my experience on the Acela, most passengers boarding north of NYP disembark at NYP. I imagine the train fills up in NYP with passengers for WAS.

I'm taking Train 67, the overnight train because unlike my collegaues who work for large law firms, I am a solo practitioner and a railfan. They are better funded. Their firms will pick up the bill for the travel and hotel. This trip comes off my bottom line, so I'm willing to sleep (or at least try to sleep) on the train. I'll probably ensure an empty seat next to me by buying a regional business class seat south. I'll want the bonus AGR points, the gate gormet food (yum!), and access to the Acela lounge going north, so I'll probably buy a first class Aclea ticket north. I've now spent $404.

My better heeled colleageus will probably spend that on a plane ticket alone. They will also plunk down $250 a night at the hotel.

Rick

 

[George Harris]

Most US business travel offices think in terms of airplanes only. In a past job, even though working for an engineering company that did rail stuff, I had trouble getting them to give me train tickets.

Note that the night train between Boston and Washington has no sleeper, so if you have a morning meeting the options are either sleeping in coach or going the evening before and getting a hotel room. If the company pays, and time is important, then flying makes more sense. However, if you plan a working trip, you will get more done on the train because there is less time and hassle between leave office and sitting on train, and no all electronics off from door closing to above 10,000 feet.

We are then back to travel habits. There are people that will fly from Washington DC to Philadelphia even though it actually takes longer.

George

 

[gswager]

Maybe you should ask them to time it once you and your friends leave the office (or home) to start a business trip. It'll be interesting to find out how their and your trips compared.

 

[Brian UK]

We are then back to travel habits. There are people that will fly from Washington DC to Philadelphia even though it actually takes longer.
George

thats the bit I cant comprehend! How far is it, 140 miles? Thats not even London to Sheffield. Even if Sheffield had an airport (note the UK's 5th largest city, pop 500k, has no airport), anyone who admitted to flying that distance would be chased out of town by the green lobby as a planet-destroying social lepper.