Names of 1966-68 trains to Wyoming from Main Line?

[BalmyZephyr]

I've done some research but can't nail it down - does anyone here know the names of the two sleepers I would have taken to get from Main Line Philly to Rock Springs Wyoming in the mid-late Sixties? The first train went through PA to Chicago (possibly Broadway Limited), and the second Chicago to Rock Springs. Thanks. (UPDATE, the years would have been summers 1965-67.)

 

[BlackDiamond]

Away from home so don't have access to my timetable collection but I recall that late sixties PRR still had a number of Philadelphia to Chicago trains, the Broadway the Admiral and the General come to mind. By 1968 it would have been Penn Central but I believe the Admiral was still running along with the Broadway of course. You probably would have boarded at Paoli as I think that was the only LD stop on the Main Line.

 

[Steve4031]

Probably city of San Francisco or City of Los Angeles west of Chicago.

 

[BalmyZephyr]

Away from home so don't have access to my timetable collection but I recall that late sixties PRR still had a number of Philadelphia to Chicago trains, the Broadway the Admiral and the General come to mind. By 1968 it would have been Penn Central but I believe the Admiral was still running along with the Broadway of course. You probably would have boarded at Paoli as I think that was the only LD stop on the Main Line.

That's right, we did board at Paoli. This was a train with some cars reserved for us campers. Pretty sure the New York campers were already on there.

 

[Willbridge]

That's right, we did board at Paoli. This was a train with some cars reserved for us campers. Pretty sure the New York campers were already on there.

Sometimes groups ended up on secondary trains for various reasons. However, effective 12 Nov 68 the best schedule was Train 55, the Pennsylvania Limited. It departed Paoli at 12:01 a.m. Do you recall what period of the day you began your trip? It was due into Chicago at 3:10 p.m., connecting in Union Station with the Streamliner City of Los Angeles / City of San Francisco at 6:00 p.m.

The best train from Paoli, as mentioned above, was the Broadway Limited, which was the last full-service train on that route. It departed Paoli at 7:03 p.m. and arrived Chicago Union Station at 8:40 a.m. For space availability and to reduce the stress on group leaders in Chicago, you may have continued on the Streamliner City of Portland at 3:00 p.m.

In earlier years, the Pennsy had waves of trains from Paoli and I doubt whether they would have booked a youth group on the sacred Broadway,

 

[BalmyZephyr]

Sometimes groups ended up on secondary trains for various reasons. However, effective 12 Nov 68 the best schedule was Train 55, the Pennsylvania Limited. It departed Paoli at 12:01 a.m. Do you recall what period of the day you began your trip? It was due into Chicago at 3:10 p.m., connecting in Union Station with the Streamliner City of Los Angeles / City of San Francisco at 6:00 p.m.

The best train from Paoli, as mentioned above, was the Broadway Limited, which was the last full-service train on that route. It departed Paoli at 7:03 p.m. and arrived Chicago Union Station at 8:40 a.m. For space availability and to reduce the stress on group leaders in Chicago, you may have continued on the Streamliner City of Portland at 3:00 p.m.

In earlier years, the Pennsy had waves of trains from Paoli and I doubt whether they would have booked a youth group on the sacred Broadway,

Thank you! A wealth of information. Streamliner, ooh. Those Broadway Limited times sound appropriate for Chicago. We went to the science museum there, but didn't stay overnight. Fall '68 would have been too late. I did this rail round trip for three summers, 1966-68 I believe. No later than that, possibly a year earlier. As I recall we had three cars to ourselves on the western leg after picking up the Midwestern cohort, probably two sleepers and a coach. Possibly the eastern leg was normal, not reserved, but they had to keep an eye on us somehow (ages 10-14). We had a singalong "campfire" in a coach car, and there were sleepers with bunks. It was daytime when I boarded at Paoli, pretty sure, as there's a picture of me with my floppy hippie hat and guitar with the family seeing me off, and I'm recalling daylight. Would have been still light in July for the 7:03. I should try to find that picture again, we could see what direction the light is falling. It was also daytime when we got to Rock Springs WY because I had not eaten enough and almost passed out from heat stroke while waiting for our bus connection, i.e., the sun was blazing. Now that I mention it, the altitude may have gotten me too. Looking for the photograph now...

 

[toddinde]

I've done some research but can't nail it down - does anyone here know the names of the two sleepers I would have taken to get from Main Line Philly to Rock Springs Wyoming in the mid-late Sixties? The first train went through PA to Chicago (possibly Broadway Limited), and the second Chicago to Rock Springs. Thanks

Any of the Pennsylvania trains, probably the Broadway. I think by that time, most people would have avoided the secondary trains that were starting to lose services. To Wyoming, definitely the City of Everywhere; the Milwaukee Road/Union Pacifica’s combined Western Cities Domeliner. By that time, the Cities trains were combined. The City of Denver and City of Portland ran together, and the City of LA and SF ran together by the mid ‘60s, but by the late ‘60s, they all ran together in one big train.

 

[BalmyZephyr]

OK I searched for the photograph on the train platform in Paoli and was unsuccessful. But I did find snapshots dated 1965 from camp the first summer. So, the period we're researching is Summer 1965 to Summer 1967. I'll go with Broadway Limited and City of Portland, sounds reasonable! Thank you, love nitpicky research, it's the best.

 

[BalmyZephyr]

Any of the Pennsylvania trains, probably the Broadway. I think by that time, most people would have avoided the secondary trains that were starting to lose services. To Wyoming, definitely the City of Everywhere; the Milwaukee Road/Union Pacifica’s combined Western Cities Domeliner. By that time, the Cities trains were combined. The City of Denver and City of Portland ran together, and the City of LA and SF ran together by the mid ‘60s, but by the late ‘60s, they all ran together in one big train.

Haha our posts arrived simultaneously. City of Everywhere, was it called that??? Love it. Thank you.

 

[toddinde]

Any of the Pennsylvania trains, probably the Broadway. I think by that time, most people would have avoided the secondary trains that were starting to lose services. To Wyoming, definitely the City of Everywhere; the Milwaukee Road/Union Pacifica’s combined Western Cities Domeliner. By that time, the Cities trains were combined. The City of Denver and City of Portland ran together, and the City of LA and SF ran together by the mid ‘60s, but by the late ‘60s, they all ran together in one big train.

I read the answer above and your reply, and it doesn’t sound like the Broadway.

 

[BalmyZephyr]

Vague memory of train sitting in Pittsburgh, but 99% sure we did not change trains there.

 

[BalmyZephyr]

The sinaglong in the coach car may have been only on the western leg.

 

[BalmyZephyr]

Haha our posts arrived simultaneously. City of Everywhere, was it called that??? Love it. Thank you.

I googled City of Everywhere and someone on another forum says it didn't start till 1969, but that CoP and CoD would have been combined by 1965. He didn't say what its name was though.
https://cs.trains.com/ctr/f/3/t/228465.aspx

 

[Willbridge]

The City of Everywhere was memorable but actually was not in service very long. I believe it was launched on December 7, 1969 (an inauspicious date). The UP schedule that I referred to was in the January 1969 Official Guide, with an effective date of October 27, 1968. In that configuration, the City of Portland and City of Denver were combined between Chicago and North Platte. At North Platte the trains split. BTW, in this period the Cities of Portland and Denver covered a number of small towns between Omaha and Cheyenne after discontinuance of the mail train that had served them.

For the period that we're focused on the combined City of Portland and City of Denver running with the train numbers of the Portland train was just a deviation through Denver by the Portland train. From what I have on hand, the deviation ended effective October 29, 1967.

Now, for summers 1965, 66 and 67 ---

In all three of those summers the Domeliner City of Portland departed Chicago Union Station at 3:00 p.m. and arrived in Rock Springs at 2:37 p.m. via Denver. In the summer it carried a Buffet-Lounge for cafeteria service in addition to the usual dome cars and flat-top cars.

The deviation accomplished a couple of things. As UP advertisements proclaimed, the City of Denver (which really was the Portland train) now had the ONLY dome diner between Denver and Chicago. The Q was eating their lunch with two daily CHI<>DEN dome trains (California Zephyr and Denver Zephyr). Secondly, traffic between Denver and the Northwest was remaining strong and with the Portland Rose this gave them 2x daily departures on that route.

An interesting side effect of the deviation is that westbound the Portland train was lapped by the California train. When the New York Times circulation experts planning the Western Edition visited Portland they checked into the Multnomah Hotel on a Tuesday afternoon and found the Sunday New York Herald-Tribune on sale. When would the Sunday Times be delivered? Midday Thursday! The H-T left Penn Station on a Saturday night and got to Chicago along with the Times on Sunday afternoon. The H-T bundles were loaded right away onto the California train to Green River. At that Wyoming metropolis they were put onto the lapped Portland streamliner, arriving in the Rose City in time for deliveries before lunch. Meanwhile, the good, gray NYT was plodding along on mail trains and was delivered to sales outlets on Thursday with the regular magazine deliveries.

 

[jphjaxfl]

The combined City of Everywhere was very inconvenient because if one section was running late, the whole train would be delayed. I did some circle trips in the west in 1969 and 1970. Santa Fe was still offering great service on the SuperChief/El Capitain and San Francisco Chief. Even the Grand Canyon was more reliable though a slow schedule. Union Pacific had given up on the passenger business. They knew that Amtrak was coming and preferred not to have Amtrak running on their lines.