New dining options (flex dining) effective October 1, 2019

[Manny T]

Not sure the Western trains will be forever exempt. The premise seems to be, "these are long 2-night trips, there has to be good (acceptable) dining."

But isn't it true that most folks don't ride end to end? Aren't most trips on the western trains taken by folks who ride between intermediate stops, often just overnight?

If that is a fact, then I don't see why Amtrak would not switch to "flexible dining" at some point in the not too distant future, esp. if it saves money.

 

[striker64]

I'm currently on 97 and had the chicken fettuccini and it's really not great. It doesn't taste awful, but it's just very bland. It's also a small serving portion compared to what the dining used to be (although that's probably a good thing).

I sat at the table and was served, so apparently that's still being done on some trains. I know the old menu wasn't the greatest food but there was some genuinely good stuff on there. This, not so much.

 

[tonys96]

I’m not convinced yet it’s coming to the western trains from reading the five year service plans. Otherwise what is the point in keeping the traditional dining on there now and why didn’t they just do it everywhere now? I think they do realize there is a difference in the longer distance trips and probably want to approach those more carefully. There may be some changes to those to try to reduce costs (or boost revenue) on those but I’m not convinced they’re going to do the exact same thing as the eastern trains. It may not be necessary to breakeven on F&B on every single train so long as they breakeven nationally. I think one way they may approach the western trains is hinted at in the five year plans. I think they may try to bring in some more premium offerings (like what is offered on VIA’s routes) to try to boost revenue.

This sounds a lot like some of the posts made back when the cuts first started. N
The ones that said no worries, we don't need tablecloths, real silverware, amenity kits, and those darned flowers. Don't worry, that is all that is getting cut, they can't mess with food service, etc

Only time will tell.

 

[Ryan]

Don't worry, that is all that is getting cut, they can't mess with food service, etc

Can you point to a quote from someone actually saying that?

 

[yarrow]

Can you point to a quote from someone actually saying that?

I didn't post it but you can sure quote me on it

 

[user 14106]

Not sure the Western trains will be forever exempt. The premise seems to be, "these are long 2-night trips, there has to be good (acceptable) dining."

But isn't it true that most folks don't ride end to end? Aren't most trips on the western trains taken by folks who ride between intermediate stops, often just overnight?

If that is a fact, then I don't see why Amtrak would not switch to "flexible dining" at some point in the not too distant future, esp. if it saves money.

I think there are enough long distance riders on these trains where it would be a concern in my opinion. You also don't need to be an end to end rider to have a trip with several meals depending on start/end points. In my opinion if changes do come, I don't think it will be a simple copy and paste of the eastern trains, otherwise they probably would have done it already.

 

[user 14106]

This sounds a lot like some of the posts made back when the cuts first started. N
The ones that said no worries, we don't need tablecloths, real silverware, amenity kits, and those darned flowers. Don't worry, that is all that is getting cut, they can't mess with food service, etc

Only time will tell.

Not saying it's impossible and will never occur or that no changes will occur at all. I'm just saying I don't think it's the current plan to take the flex dining on the eastern trains and stick it on the western. I think whatever they do may look different. And maybe it will be a similarly negative change. I think you may see them keep the traditional dining setting but making some different changes to reduce costs. Maybe I'm totally off base, just sharing my view based on what I saw in the five year plans which indicate the intentions of the current management. I'm not even saying don't worry or that I agree with the present changes: I personally think what the current management would really like to see out west is changes to the network with a premium service class on whatever routes remained. So it may be end up being great for someone taking the Zephyr, but for those taking the Chief or Sunset Limited they may not even have a train.

 

[chrsjrcj]

If the Western trains are broken up with a bus ride in the middle, then a 2 consecutive night on the train becomes 1 and contemporary dining becomes practical.

https://www.allaboardmn.org/about/news/current-press-releases/amtraks-empire-builder-threatened/

 

[Amtrakfflyer]

Wow. Twin Cities to Spokane on a bus. Wow. 1341 miles if anyone was wondering.

 

[Mystic River Dragon]

And that includes going through (up, up, then down, down) those Rocky Mountains? Yikes.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

If the Western trains are broken up with a bus ride in the middle, then a 2 consecutive night on the train becomes 1 and contemporary dining becomes practical. https://www.allaboardmn.org/about/news/current-press-releases/amtraks-empire-builder-threatened/

What a mess...this should probably get its own thread.

 

[IndyLions]

Giving a quick review tonight. This will probably be a little disjointed.

On the Cardinal (50) - running nearly 3 hours late out of CHI - after arriving 6 hours late the other direction this morning - so I’m stressed and starving - now it’s time for New Flexible Dining choices.

I’ll wait and see how the food tastes - I’m not expecting much but almost anything will work.

I’m one of the first here in the diner (9:30 “seating”) and it is pretty much chaos. Bags sitting everywhere - most without any food in them yet - some orders placed and most are not - just a mess. Kitchen is loud and disorganized.

My first impression is that the bags are stupid. For those taking out to their room - sure. For people eating in the quasi-diner car - silly.

My order is the first one ready - and the food isn’t terrible. I got the “kids” meatball pasta, red wine & small salad with packaged brownie dessert.

Portions small but not unreasonable. Salad is fresh. Food reheated but tasty. Brownie for dessert not bad. I would put it on par or slightly better than Airline Coach food on International flights back in the 90’s. Not up to par at sleeper prices.

Food - Decent to OK
Presentation - messy.
Experience - chaos.

I’d give it a D+, mainly because of the presentation & experience. At Coach prices it would rate a C+.

Another note - the guy who “prepares” the food was out of here after an hour. That left the Lounge guy, the Sleeper Car attendant and a trainee. So (outside of prep) they got a whole hour of work out of him and he’s off to his room.

I’ve had other crews for “contemporary” dining that were far superior and they made the experience better. The SCA is pretty solid - but I’m not impressed otherwise.

 

[Larry H.]

That was a similar experience to what I had on the City of New Orleans last year. A whole diner full of people and one person trying to serve them while shouting at coach passengers that they couldn't come in the diner. The food was awful an what was ordered they didn't even have so they just make it up. Two choices and both bad. This was going south. For people who say that a train leaving at 8pm does't get much business there was no where to sit and you had to wait if you were in sleeper class. Coach people had no choice but to go to the end of the car that had a snack type bar. Frankly I told one disgruntled lady from coach as she passed us while leaving that her burger and chips from the cafe end was probably a lot better than what we ended up with. That trip pretty much ended my wish to pay for sleeper class and be soundly disappointed by the food service. I would guess that is how many felt because on a trip on the Chief a few years ago people then in what was left of a diner were telling us it was their first train ride and last!

This whole scheme to save money while destroying the most pleasant part of rail travel, a decent diner, is a sad day and a terrible idea.

P.S. I do recall a lot of people saying it was a slippery slope when the flowers, and table cloths went. And some here always take the other point of view no matter how crazy things get. Not helpful in my mind to saving what is left of rail travel.

 

[Amtrakfflyer]

Another RPA Friday update today and not a word on the dining. Not ONE word since the flex dining was implemented a month ago. Sounds like they are working on it just like Anderson is working on convection oven refits in the V2 diners.

 

[scrollmaster]

Wife and I have bedroom on Crescent #19 tonite and it was Fast Food Self Serve. He had rolled a cabinet at the entrance to his station and never left his hole the hour plus we were there eating and visiting. There was also a box with a few dollar bills placed on top and I was informed his gratuity was not included with our free meals. I was then instructed to wait while he prepared our drinks and salads tray and also had to come back to pick up the "stuff" he heated and bring to our table. When finished I am expected to bus my own table. This routine was extended to everyone eating while we were there. I did all the leg work Aland he expects me to tip him? I might as well been at McDonalds!!

 

[crescent-zephyr]

I didn’t tip the LSA on the meteor 1 cent. I gave all of my dining car tips to my sleeper attendant who gave me my menu, took my orders, brought me coffee, and brought me a refill after my dinner.

That was in addition to her tip as a great SCA as well.

 

[pennyk]

I didn’t tip the LSA on the meteor 1 cent. I gave all of my dining car tips to my sleeper attendant who gave me my menu, took my orders, brought me coffee, and brought me a refill after my dinner.

That was in addition to her tip as a great SCA as well.

I have traveled on the Silver Meteor 3 times since October 1st and have tipped the LSA each time. Although I am unable to not eat the flex dining meals, the LSA gets me beverages, brownies, hot water, breakfast items, etc. I am guessing I have had much better experience with LSAs than you have. My SCAs pretty much did nothing related to flex dining, so I did not provide tips in addition to what I normally would tip.

 

[Twinkletoes]

I first rode the trains right at the end of the NY Central and Illinois Central era. I traveled mostly in coach. My pattern was this: for afternoon departures eat a good meal before boarding and carry snacks for later. I was always able to get a good diner hot breakfast supplemented by a snack bar sandwich of some sort with my carried on snacks. I got by. When I started traveling mainly by sleeper, the privacy, bed, and “en suite” toilet were the attractions. It was good to have the hot meals, but I always had my snacks (and favorite condiments such as my own diet salad dressing and genuine maple syrup for the French Toast for meals which I always had served in my compartment).

From the discussion it sounds like the new service will be similar to the meal service l experienced on the Lake Shore Limited in Summer 2018 and Summer 2018. I do not look forward to this and have concluded that prudent planning is back in my life: e.g, (1) eating a good meal in Chicago before boarding east or southbound trains (Lake Shore Limited or City of New Orleans); (2) revert to the traditional carry on box of chicken; (3) buy something from the snack bar. The one thing Amtrak seems not to have considered is that most people do not want 2 dinners/day. A hot and cold sandwich option should be available at both lunch and dinner times. To avoid this issue, the preferred option for me will be to buy or bring a sandwich when boarding the Crescent and trying one of the hot meals for dinner. I do not have great expectations for their quality. If inedible at the first bite, I will just get something from the snack car. I loved not having to plan meals, but I prefer that to eating unpalatable food just because it came with the ticket. It’s analogous to my accepting that the NYP Acela Lounge is not for the snacks, but frequently cleaned toilets, early boarding and quietness. The service barely deserves the name First Class. The crux for me to avoid seething the entire trip about enhanced dining (the term is absurdly Orwellian) will be remembering my motivation for spending extra money on a ticket is not food-related.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

I have traveled on the Silver Meteor 3 times since October 1st and have tipped the LSA each time. Although I am unable to not eat the flex dining meals, the LSA gets me beverages, brownies, hot water, breakfast items, etc. I am guessing I have had much better experience with LSAs than you have. My SCAs pretty much did nothing related to flex dining, so I did not provide tips in addition to what I normally would tip.

Your SCA's didn't present you the menu or offer to take your order? Or you're saying they didn't help you because you couldn't eat the meals so there was no order to take, etc?

I feel like the LSA I had was right in the middle... she wasn't rude, but she also wasn't friendly. If you aren't even going to try to be friendly, I'm not leaving a tip for handing me a yogurt.

 

[user 14106]

What a mess...this should probably get its own thread.

I’m a little confused by the article in the way it mentions summer. Was this essentially a plan to permanently cancel the builder and replace with bus service or was this a temporary summer thing they were thinking of pitching due to some type of track work or whatever somewhere? While obviously the article is concerning, it is lacking in details.

 

[pennyk]

Your SCA's didn't present you the menu or offer to take your order? Or you're saying they didn't help you because you couldn't eat the meals so there was no order to take, etc?

My SCAs did not take my order because I told them I could not eat the meals, thus, there was no order to take. I placed my own beverage orders directly with the LSA.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I might as well been at McDonalds!!

In my experience even a lowly McDonald's is faster, fresher, and friendlier than Amtrak dining. I've never once been barked at or belittled in a McDonald's and if they happen to screw up they even act apologetic and try to make it right in some small way. Can't say I've ever seen anything like that when dining with Amtrak. At best they just shrug and suggest you contact someone at corporate.

I’m a little confused by the article in the way it mentions summer. Was this essentially a plan to permanently cancel the builder and replace with bus service or was this a temporary summer thing they were thinking of pitching due to some type of track work or whatever somewhere? While obviously the article is concerning, it is lacking in details.

I agree it would be very helpful to have more information and details. Bus bridges for maintenance and irregular operations already happen as needed so that wouldn't normally be seen as a threat in and of itself. Summer is prime time for the Western long distance routes and it makes little sense to target high season from a revenue perspective.

 

[Anderson]

Also bear in mind that if there's extensive track work being done somewhere, there's a good chance that it won't be up to Amtrak when it happens. Amtrak might not even have "boo" to say about it.

Right now, all we have is a vague rumor and some previous bad behavior to go on.

 

[drfonta]

My SCAs did not take my order because I told them I could not eat the meals, thus, there was no order to take. I placed my own beverage orders directly with the LSA.

Hi Penny,

Is there hot water available on the Silvers? Or would I run the risk of blowing a circuit breaker with a water boiler in my room? Thinking ahead potentially for some Korean cup ramen...

 

[Anderson]

Hi Penny,

Is there hot water available on the Silvers? Or would I run the risk of blowing a circuit breaker with a water boiler in my room? Thinking ahead potentially for some Korean cup ramen...

I know you can get hot water for tea in the cafe (since they do sell hot tea). I would presume you could get it in the ex-diner.