No more Sunset Ltd trains 19 and 20 will run in it's place

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Save Our Trains Michigan

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Here is an official plan the Sunset LTD will come off and the Crescent train's 19 and 20 would run 3 days a week between New Orleans, LA and San Antonio, TX this should go into affect towards the end of Oct 2007

The train's between New Orleans and San Antonio,TX both ways will run at night.
 
There will be no more Sunset LTD at all from what i have heard is 21 and 22 will run all the way to LA all the freight Railroads have agreed to this except for the UP and the issue is around LA the paper work has been sent out to all freight Railroads.
 
I assume the source for this info is more reliable than the source that said that all the LD trains would be getting 180-day notices two summers ago.
 
Save Our Trains Michigan said:
There will be no more Sunset LTD at all from what i have heard is 21 and 22 will run all the way to LA all the freight Railroads have agreed to this except for the UP and the issue is around LA the paper work has been sent out to all freight Railroads.
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Where did this info come from? The Crescent runs with Viewliner equipment, so ....Doen't make sense..So AMTRAK is killing another LD train! If this does happen, is the Crescent new route LA to NYP??
 
rmadisonwi said:
I assume the source for this info is more reliable than the source that said that all the LD trains would be getting 180-day notices two summers ago.
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Well while it certainly doesn't confirm what Matt is saying here, and what he's stating is definately much bigger than was expected if this info is correct; but a decision on the Sunset east of NOL was expected last week.

I quote from the URPA newsletter posted by MrFSS:

MrFSS said:
This Week at Amtrak; April 30, 2007
4) There was an expectation by many last week an announcement would be

made of a decision by the Amtrak Board of Directors regarding the fate of

the Sunset Limited east of New Orleans. No news has been forthcoming. We

are only a few short months away from a full two years since this service

was discontinued due to track and infrastructure damage wrought by

Hurricane Katrina.
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So it would appear that news is expected on the Sunset Limited, the only question would be, "is this the correct news?"
 
If I read this correctly, it does not change the actual train miles operated.

Other than it should be daily, this is really not that bad. Assuming overnight to Houston, about noon arrival in San Antonio, a few hours for turnaround, then about 4:00 to 5:00 pm departure for an early morning arrival in New Orleans. Would think you would need a later than the current slightly after 7:00 am departure for the Crescent. I would think this would increase the passengers going between Houston and eastern points, and also makes a decent but somewhat long layover connection with the City of New Orleans for points north.

To continue west from San Antonio, you would have a most of the day there with a late night departure to the west, early morning arrival from the west. Really no more cool-your-heels time for the east of New Orleans to west of San Antonio passenger than the current set-up, maybe less, and it would be daytime, not over night. San Antonio is probably a nicer place to do it than New Orleans now is.

For 21/22, I would think it would make more sense to change the schedule west of San Antonio rather than east of it. This should get you back to a early morning arrival / late evening departure on the LA end. Unless there is a fairly hefty load of western traffic to/from San Antonio and Austin, it would make even more sense to simply keep going west out of Ft. Worth to El Paso and run a stub train or a bus to San Antonio. Chicago to San Antonio traffic could get there by the City of New Orleans to Crescent.

Since all this milage is on UP, except New Orleans to Iowa Jct. LA on BNSF, it would seem that UP is the critical component on this thing.

George
 
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AlanB said:
rmadisonwi said:
I assume the source for this info is more reliable than the source that said that all the LD trains would be getting 180-day notices two summers ago.
Click to expand...
Well while it certainly doesn't confirm what Matt is saying here, and what he's stating is definately much bigger than was expected if this info is correct; but a decision on the Sunset east of NOL was expected last week.

I quote from the URPA newsletter posted by MrFSS:

MrFSS said:
This Week at Amtrak; April 30, 2007
4) There was an expectation by many last week an announcement would be

made of a decision by the Amtrak Board of Directors regarding the fate of

the Sunset Limited east of New Orleans. No news has been forthcoming. We

are only a few short months away from a full two years since this service

was discontinued due to track and infrastructure damage wrought by

Hurricane Katrina.
Click to expand...
So it would appear that news is expected on the Sunset Limited, the only question would be, "is this the correct news?"
Click to expand...

I sure hope we're not barking at the moon again. This has too many strings attached (such as Viewliner vs. Superliner) for me to bite into. I'm going to have to sit back and see it to believe it much like the demise of Amtrak's LD trains that never transpired...
 
I do think that is time for some things to be done about the Sunset. I honestly think that train does more harm then good for amtrak with its on-time performance. However, I really dont like the idea of the Crescent being involved. For the most part, the Crescent has an excellent on-time performance, and I feel that this could really hurt the Crescents reputation. I think they should make the City of New Orleans continue to San Antonio, then you have the whole Superliner equipment thing worked out. I dont really know how that would work scheduling wise though.
 
Let me once again say that my comments are in no way confirming or denying the news that was posted at the top of this topic. I have no personal knowledge either way as to the validity of the statements made regarding the Crescent and the Sunset Limited and I caution all reading that this news is at present unconfirmed by any second source.

That said, I'm not sure why people are concerned about the Viewliner / Superliner thing. There is nothing that says that the route between NOL and SAN must use Superliner equipment. Amtrak has no contract with anyone that says Superliner equipment must run on this line. And if this were to happen, it would not be the first time in recent history that Amtrak has converted a train from Superliner equipment to Viewliner equipment. The Cardinal did just that about 4 years ago now, IIRC, might have been 3 years.

And if it does come down to a choice between no trains and Viewliner/Amfleet equipment running the route between NOL and SAN, then I suspect that most people would choose Viewliner/AMF equipment rather than no service. I know that I'd rather see Viewliner's and AMF II's between NOL and SAN, as opposed to no service.
 
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AlanB said:
Let me once again say that my comments are in no way confirming or denying the news that was posted at the top of this topic. I have no personal knowledge either way as to the validity of the statements made regarding the Crescent and the Sunset Limited and I caution all reading that this news is at present unconfirmed by any second source.
That said, I'm not sure why people are concerned about the Viewliner / Superliner thing. There is nothing that says that the route between NOL and SAN must use Superliner equipment. Amtrak has no contract with anyone that says Superliner equipment must run on this line. And if this were to happen, it would not be the first time in recent history that Amtrak has converted a train from Superliner equipment to Viewliner equipment. The Cardinal did just that about 4 years ago now, IIRC, might have been 3 years.

And if it does come down to a choice between no trains and Viewliner/Amfleet equipment running the route between NOL and SAN, then I suspect that most people would choose Viewliner/AMF equipment rather than no service. I know that I'd rather see Viewliner's and AMF II's between NOL and SAN, as opposed to no service.
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Alan;

I totally agree with you that any service is better than no service. My antennae goes up when the posting on this subject says the "official" ruling is this is what is going to happen. Didn't we go through this already? Who, when and where is the "official" word coming from ???
 
if the CNO 's schedule was flexable enuf - making the CNO go thru to San Antonio then connecting to the TXEagle would make the most sense. The stopover in NO would only hv to be 15-30minutes for servicing. B)
 
I guess I had assumed that possiblly one car would be a through car, and changesd over in San Antonio TX to the Sunset Train. I realize that was never mentioned, but that is what I had thought for some reason, and thus my confusion of the single level / superliner.

I am still not sure what this is going to help anyway, if the train was getting delayed between New Orleans and San Antonio, then the Crescent will be delayed as well. And then passengers will have to wait at San Antonio for the delayed Crescent. I dont really understand what they are trying to accomplish here, if in fact they are going to do this.

As for what equipment is running, I am one of the few who actually prefers viewliners and single level eqipment over superliner. So I am all for riding from New Orleans to San Antonio in Amfleet and Viewliners!
 
Does this mean that there will be no service from NOL to LA?

Also, they had better give official notice soon, 180 days from late October is fast approaching.
 
Guest said:
Does this mean that there will be no service from NOL to LA?
Also, they had better give official notice soon, 180 days from late October is fast approaching.
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No, if this is true, it would mean that there would no longer be a Sunset Limited. However there would be no need for 180 day notices, since service will not be discontinued. The Crescent would cover the portion of the route from New Orleans to San Antonio, and the Texas Eagle will cover the route west from San Antonio to LA. So all stations would still be receiving train service and therefore there is no need for 180 day notices. The notices are only required if train service ceases, not if Amtrak changes the trains that serve those stations.

And as long as they continue to play the "damage" game for the route east of New Orleans, they don't have to put up notices there either.
 
What will Amtrak do with the freed up equipment??? New services, such as a Desert wind? Personally I don't think this will work out very well, because, as others have said, the Crecscent will have timekeeping problems. It already has trouble making it to ATL on time, and often doesn't. Running it over mostly UP tracks from SAS-NOL will make it much alter. Amtrak will probably lose passengers who ride onyl say ATL-WAS, probably the section of the route with the heaviest passenger load. It would be interesting to ride 2 nights on a single level train...
 
O.k. I did not at first understand that the Texas Eagle would take over the San Antonio to LA route. I thought the Sunset Limited would still operate from San Antonio. Now I see how some equipment could be freed up.

Well, I guess we will just have to see. It would be pretty cool to take a direct route to San Antonio from Atlanta, but on the other hand, I hope that doesnt make the Crescent one of those "always really late" trains.
 
For what it's worth....

Sam Damon and I attended tonight's Annual NARP reception in Washington, DC and had the opportunity to speak with Emmett Fremaux (VP of Marketing) at length about various these sorts of things, and I asked him point blank if he had heard of this rumor.

He said that he had, in fact, heard of that plan, but it was one of many that are being considered. It was clear to me that at least from Fremaux's point of view, things were still very much unofficial in so far as what he could tell us. In speaking to Sam just now about it, he mentions to me that from where he stood, it sounded to him like this particular plan never got past the "conversation" stage in Amtrak's offices. That could be, or it could be that Fremaux was just biting his tongue, but that's just my own commentary.

Again, I should reiterate that Fremaux said he had only heard of this option in the context of others, so it appears that what Matt has put forth has at least been discussed, but as far as an Amtrak VP is concerned, as of tonight (May 2), it is officially just an option that has been discussed and nothing more.

-Rafi
 
Operationally, I don't know that this would work. New Orleans has servicing facilities for the CNOL and crescent and the Sunset Limited. San Antonio I gues has something for when the Texase Eagle turns around from Chicago. Though I have never heard of a servicing facility in San Antonio. Turning th Crescent there after a two night trip from New York would require some sort of servicing.
 
Steve4031 said:
Operationally, I don't know that this would work. New Orleans has servicing facilities for the CNOL and crescent and the Sunset Limited. San Antonio I gues has something for when the Texase Eagle turns around from Chicago. Though I have never heard of a servicing facility in San Antonio. Turning th Crescent there after a two night trip from New York would require some sort of servicing.
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You never know it might be a coach only train from NOL-SAS and be push pull just have to add an extra engine at NOL run 3-4 coaches and a cafe car.
 
Guest said:
Steve4031 said:
Operationally, I don't know that this would work. New Orleans has servicing facilities for the CNOL and crescent and the Sunset Limited. San Antonio I gues has something for when the Texase Eagle turns around from Chicago. Though I have never heard of a servicing facility in San Antonio. Turning th Crescent there after a two night trip from New York would require some sort of servicing.
Click to expand...
You never know it might be a coach only train from NOL-SAS and be push pull just have to add an extra engine at NOL run 3-4 coaches and a cafe car.
Click to expand...

At the minimum, there is a way to turn trains around in San Antonio. As far as servicing, I am talking about food, cleaning, bathroooms, etc. Remember, that train is coming from nyp.
 
One-seat service between Texas and Washington/New York is not a bad thing. That is what was proposed for the Crescent Star, the Network Growth Strategy train that would have split off the Crescent in Meridian, run through northern Louisiana (Jackson, Shreveport), and ended in the Dallas/Fort Worth area.

But I am skeptical about this news until we hear it from a reputable source. Amtrak owes the world an explanation of their intentions for the NOL-Florida route, and I doubt that they would release this news about west of NOL as a smoke screen.
 
Before we get carried away like the 180-day thread, let's remember that this is simply a rumor and is not specifically endorsed (or otherwise) by the administrators. Everyone is entitled to write what they wish, but I don't want to again go through the whole argument about the fact that our allowing the thread to remain open is a tacit endorsement :lol:
 
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