Ohio finally starts the process for new Amtrak service
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The pre-pandemic Willamette Valley rail/bus service was the third try, two decades after the first proposal. The first intermodal package was funded but was killed by a new governor after agreements in principle had been achieved with Amtrak, SP and Greyhound. Five years later an all-rail package with prize-winning ads and poor connections was tried and failed. Nineteen years later the current intermodal approach was gradually put into operation.
Bon voyage, Ohio!
Dakota 400
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I was able to read the story and it's news to me, but, very encouraging news. There are some possible reasons for the Governor's interest in this. There's Federal money to be obtained and not left on the table by not using it. The previous GOP Governor took the money when it was available for Medicaid expansion. Many of his Party's members in the General Assembly screamed "bloody murder" about the decision, but, Governor Kaisch did it anyway and it has worked to the benefit of Ohio's citizens. Perhaps Governor DeWine learned a lesson from his predecessor.
The amount of traffic on some of our major highways exceeds the amount for which they were designed. In spite of adding lanes and trying to make changes to accommodate the traffic loads, in the future, it is only going to become an increasing problem. A new passenger rail corridor ought to help this situation.
It's an election year and Governor DeWine's opponent has been a supporter of Amtrak's proposal from the day it was announced. As the former Mayor of Dayton, Mayor Whaley knows what positive potential impact it could have for both the State as well as the region in which I live.
The irony is that Ohio’s rail development commission has the acronym ORDC. The state prison system is called the Ohio Department of Rehabilitation and Correction, or ODRC. I can imagine that some judge made a mistake and sentenced someone to “5 years in ORDC”, or “5 years in the Ohio Rail Development Commission”, when they meant to sentence the defendant to 5 years in prison. Riding trains for 5 years sounds better than spending time in prison.
George Harris
Engineer
Forgot the occasion, but a number of years ago there was something that Baltimore did that led to someone in the media saying, "If it was raining soup, Baltimore would be out there with a fork and a plate." Sometimes it appears that something similar could be said about Ohio. The map fairly screams, "We are the place for multi-train per day medium distance trains," but yet there seems to be no enthusiasm for it. When whining about the cost of operating trains, compare it to the cost of adding lanes to existing highways or adding new roads. While gas taxes may cover the cost of building and maintaining roads in rural area, they are far under the cost of doing so in urban/suburban areas. When people in rural areas complain about subsidizing trains that serve urban areas, they already are subsidizing the costs of roads in urban areas, so they should be the strongest of proponents of rail service between closely spaced cities.
jis
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An interesting take on the situation in Ohio...
https://neo-trans.blog/2022/12/16/amtrak-expansion-may-bypass-state-of-ohio/
https://neo-trans.blog/2022/12/16/amtrak-expansion-may-bypass-state-of-ohio/
God, I hope so. Most of the state doesn't even realize there's a passenger train that runs in the country, let alone through the state. When there's more than myself and some Amish getting on in Cleveland I'm always shocked! Waiting for enough people to be loud enough to convince the state this is necessary would take until the end of time. My hope would be that we get the 3C+D or at least a few routes that aren't in the wee hours and that would help raise awareness of train travel in general! Hopefully, at that point, enough to make even bigger moves.
Metra Electric Rider
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Considering the times Cleveland is served, ridership is pretty good.
22 passengers boarding a train on average in FY 21 doesn't sound terrible, but it's a city with a metropolitan area of about 2 million people. It's not great. And again, it's mostly Amish who have no choice but to take the train. The main Amish area is an hour and a half from Cleveland. They would benefit too from an expanded train service.
Metra Electric Rider
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As I said, if it was at a reasonable hour (and arrival/destination times were as well) ridership would be drastically more.
(I've been jokingly told - by a Mennonite - that the Amish are able to exist because the Mennonites are there to drive them)
TransitTyrant
Lead Service Attendant
Latest news is a bit positive Is Ohio finally on board for Amtrak expansion? State ‘strongly considering’ seeking federal money for new train service
I would love them to add service between Detroit and Toledo, because it would really open up eastward train travel from Detroit.
There's a thruway bus, which does that now. Not ideal, but you can book a ticket going east without going through Chicago
toddinde
OBS Chief
You hit the nail on the head. These corridors will raise awareness and feed a lot of traffic to the national system.
The Thruway bus also serves Dearborn, Ann Arbor, and East Lansing.
But the calling times are all O-Dark-Thirty with long waits for your Train @ the Station, especially in Toledo!
Yeah exactly. The searches I’ve done are like, get to Toledo at 11 pm. Wait for your train at 3 a.m., if it is on time. With expanded Ohio service, hopefully there will be more options.
I'm hoping for the 3C+D to make fruition as well. Not only with me being an Amtrak railfanner in central Ohio, but I agree with the above that it would open up the corridor and allow a good flow of traffic through Ohio from places in NKY as well.
It would be cool to see Cincinnati Union Terminal serve another train rather than just the Cardinal, a midpoint here in Columbus for passenger rail and a point southward from Cleveland. Plus, Dayton could also benefit from a station being there as well.
I know that the 3C+D is still a long ways away from possibly happening, but it's good to dream (and yes, I have dreamed of the different rolling stock it would have too, hehe).
It would be cool to see Cincinnati Union Terminal serve another train rather than just the Cardinal, a midpoint here in Columbus for passenger rail and a point southward from Cleveland. Plus, Dayton could also benefit from a station being there as well.
I know that the 3C+D is still a long ways away from possibly happening, but it's good to dream (and yes, I have dreamed of the different rolling stock it would have too, hehe).
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That would be nice! My in-laws live in Detroit. When we visited them last summer, they drove us from Detroit to Toledo to avoid the Thruway Bus, and not have to spend hours waiting for the train. We timed our travel based on Amtrak train status updates, and arrived at the Toledo station just 10 minutes before the train arrived. It worked out great!
I am wondering why there is no train service to Columbus, the capitol of Ohio, for goodness sake! To visit my relatives in Columbus from Northern California,
the closest I can get is Cincinnati. Is a corridor train between Cinci and Columbus feasible?
the closest I can get is Cincinnati. Is a corridor train between Cinci and Columbus feasible?
There was a plan for a Cincinnati-Dayton-Columbus-Cleveland or "3C" service back in 2008. Three round-trips a day, I think. The federal government was going to pay most of the capital, but Ohio would have to pay the operating subsidy. Though that was only a few millions annually -- less than what Ohio DOT pays to landscape highways, if I recall correctly -- Gov. Kasich rejected the federal funds.
Now, there's a program to add corridor routes where the feds pay the capital and a starter operating subsidy -- everything the first year or two, diminishing after that. But someone -- not necessarily the state, could be the relevant counties, cities, tourism boards, or chambers of commerce -- has to apply for the program and be willing to pay the operating subsidy as the federal contribution diminishes. As I recall, some organizations along the 3C have expressed interest, but the state of Ohio hasn't yet.
To summarize: it could happen, but it's "up in the air" right now.
Now, there's a program to add corridor routes where the feds pay the capital and a starter operating subsidy -- everything the first year or two, diminishing after that. But someone -- not necessarily the state, could be the relevant counties, cities, tourism boards, or chambers of commerce -- has to apply for the program and be willing to pay the operating subsidy as the federal contribution diminishes. As I recall, some organizations along the 3C have expressed interest, but the state of Ohio hasn't yet.
To summarize: it could happen, but it's "up in the air" right now.
Thanks for the information John. I know that if States chip in some money and cooperate with the Feds things go well. I understand AMTRAK is getting a boost this year money wise. Hopefully they can repair infrastructure and get some new train sets. Even so, freight is a big problem for on time performance.
Columbus did have Amtrak service until 1979 and the train station here was demolished (only the columns remain--now moved to another location). A convention center now stands where the previous train station was.
There are talks that if the 3C+D comes to fruition, there would be a station inside of the convention center as a possible location.
The Quaking Widow
Train Attendant
Ohio definitely needs a 3C plan, but I think there needs to be a plan for more direct routes to Toledo and Detroit, hopefully with service to DTW as well. Toledo has lost airline service, necessitating a long drive to Detroit. An inter-urban type service there would probably attractive. Everyone I know in Toledo who flies has a list of friends to call upon for rides to DTW, which means 2 round trips for the generous friend. Also, it would be a shame if the 3C plan meant that folks in NW Ohio had to take the train to Cleveland to get to Columbus. BTW, the 80/90 toll toad through Northern Ohio subsidizes surface transportation for the whole state. Back when the turnpike was built, the region was promised that eventually the tolls would go away. Alas. So we help pay for the “free-ways” all through the state.
Agreed @The Quaking Widow. There definitely needs to be a route from Toledo to Detroit (or even to Ann Arbor) even in a shuttle-based aspect. This way, this would open up travel in the eastern part of Michigan to points south and not just a Chicago-bound route.
I know that both the 3C+D and a Toledo-Detroit route are a long shot, but the throughput of these cities would be a great idea to keep travel flow pushing through.
I know that both the 3C+D and a Toledo-Detroit route are a long shot, but the throughput of these cities would be a great idea to keep travel flow pushing through.
