Refund for Amtrak train accident involving suicide

[jis]

I think it would be perfectly reasonable under these circumstances to very civilly give Amtrak a call and ask if they would be in a position to compensate for the delay. They may or they may not, that would be their CR decision. I would not view it as an entitlement but as a discrete execution of a well though out Customer Relations policy.

I know for a fact when a suicide involving an Acela smeared the first car's exterior in blood and gore, Amtrak offered to refund everyone's fare on that trip, even though none of it was Amtrak's fault.

OTOH, when it was Amtrak's fault like in the half a dozen times an Acela has died on me, and caused a transfer to a Regional to complete the trip hours behind schedule, Amtrak has always offered to refund the fare, and I have seldom taken them up on it, since I did get there, and I wanted my 500 AGR point. I did pick up a refund when I absolutely did not get there and missed the meeting I was going to.

What is done would vary depending on the circumstances and actual experience that the passengers had to go through.

On Time Performance is one area where most delays are totally and completely beyond Amtrak's control.

Except on the North East Corridor South, where it is more often than not very much in Amtrak's control.

 

[Cho Cho Charlie]

... and only given small bottled waters

Does Amtrak have water bottles in any other size? Where they taunting the passengers, showing them large water bottles, and saying "you can't have THESE"?

 

[the_traveler]

I will tackle this from another angle. I think that saying the OP was trying to "profit" from the incident is off base. Profit is not the right term. The OP suffered a five hour delay in arrival and may have incurred additional costs as a result. If the OP had missed a guaranteed connection, Amtrak would likely have applied the standard policy and provided accomodations, etc.

Since the OP stated in the first post that it was stuck "only 30 minutes from my destination in the AZ desert", I personally do not think there was a guaranteed connection involved!

 

[Green Maned Lion]

Sometimes life is so bad suicide is the only option. I've known a few. In one case I felt terrible because they were a friend with a problem I thought could be solved. In several other cases, I was happy. Twice because they had finally been put out of their terrible misery. Once because it put them out of mine.

Suicide is sometimes the only option someone has to stop their living hell of a life. I don't believe in taking away their only salvation. If you can't see why I have a point, god bless you, you have the fortune of not knowing true hopeless unhappiness.

However, what I can not forgive is some selfish **** having the indecency to take their life in such a way as to screw up the lives of completely innocent people, as in this instance.

 

[Dan O]

However, what I can not forgive is some selfish **** having the indecency to take their life in such a way as to screw up the lives of completely innocent people, as in this instance.

Doesn't it usually work that way? Even if not a train, someone is going to discover the body, be it police, fireman, reuglar old guy or young kid. Most likely someone is going to know the person too and even if they don't find the body they will be upset when they find out what happened.

 

[jmbgeg]

I will tackle this from another angle. I think that saying the OP was trying to "profit" from the incident is off base. Profit is not the right term. The OP suffered a five hour delay in arrival and may have incurred additional costs as a result. If the OP had missed a guaranteed connection, Amtrak would likely have applied the standard policy and provided accomodations, etc.

Since the OP stated in the first post that it was stuck "only 30 minutes from my destination in the AZ desert", I personally do not think there was a guaranteed connection involved!

I did see that. I was speaking hypothetically.

 

[RRUserious]

I'd say anyone who defines time on a train as "lost" probably is using the wrong form of transportation. I take trains specifically because the time on the train is not "lost", any more than my time in an art museum is "lost' or my time walking through a park is "lost". Time is only "lost" when you are forced to do what you don't want (like, say, at WORK). And, wow, if you don't like being on a train, it certainly is far from the only option between points.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

In my view everything has an expiration point, including a train ride. After thirty plus hours I'd be ready to get off any train or plane or boat or bus or car. Even thirty straight hours in a Ferrari would get old for me. Too much of a good thing is a bad thing in my view. Everyone has their own limits, and I've been known to push my own, but in general I prefer to spend no more than a day at a time in continuous transit.

 

[jis]

I'd say anyone who defines time on a train as "lost" probably is using the wrong form of transportation. I take trains specifically because the time on the train is not "lost", any more than my time in an art museum is "lost' or my time walking through a park is "lost". Time is only "lost" when you are forced to do what you don't want (like, say, at WORK). And, wow, if you don't like being on a train, it certainly is far from the only option between points.

Unfortunately railfans such as us are a very very small minority and could not possibly sustain the entire transportation mode. Fortunately there are lots of places where those that ride trains do so mainly because it reduces the amount of "lost time" overall, and not because they particularly care about the journey itself. They mostly care about getting to the destination in a timely fashion spending as little time as possible on the journey and doing so productively if possible. That is what primarily sustains the rail passenger business. The primary purpose of a transportation mode has got to be providing transportation, and not just leisure rides.

 

[Bierboy]

It is just me?

I find it offensive that someone would try to profit off someone else's death. Particularly since the engineer, and anyone else in the train crew that checked the train or walked back to see the condition of the person hit will likely have nightmares about this for the rest of their lives.

Nope, not just you.

I will tackle this from another angle. I think that saying the OP was trying to "profit" from the incident is off base. Profit is not the right term. The OP suffered a five hour delay in arrival and may have incurred additional costs as a result. If the OP had missed a guaranteed connection, Amtrak would likely have applied the standard policy and provided accomodations, etc.

This is a matter for Customer Relations to resolve by a phone call from the OP. This was totally outside Amtrak's control, so it likely does not warrant a refund. Perhaps a small inconvenience voucher is appropriate. That is not a profit for the OP.

I agree here. I don't see "profit" as any part of the original post.

 

[the_traveler]

I'd say anyone who defines time on a train as "lost" probably is using the wrong form of transportation. I take trains specifically because the time on the train is not "lost", any more than my time in an art museum is "lost' or my time walking through a park is "lost". Time is only "lost" when you are forced to do what you don't want (like, say, at WORK). And, wow, if you don't like being on a train, it certainly is far from the only option between points.

Unfortunately railfans such as us are a very very small minority and could not possibly sustain the entire transportation mode. Fortunately there are lots of places where those that ride trains do so mainly because it reduces the amount of "lost time" overall, and not because they particularly care about the journey itself. They mostly care about getting to the destination in a timely fashion spending as little time as possible on the journey and doing so productively if possible. That is what primarily sustains the rail passenger business. The primary purpose of a transportation mode has got to be providing transportation, and not just leisure rides.

And if you consider work time lost, consider this:

On a plane, you must turn off all electrical equipment (like computers) while below 10,000 feet - and even while on the runway if you have a 2 hour delay! On a train, your seat or room most likely has a plug, so you can plug in your computer and work thru the delay - or even before the train starts moving when you board!

So if you look at it that way, you probably have less "lost" time on a train than on a plane!

 

[FriskyFL]

<br />It is just me?<br /><br />I find it offensive that someone would try to profit off someone else's death.  Particularly since the engineer, and anyone else in the train crew that checked the train or walked back to see the condition of the person hit will likely have nightmares about this for the rest of their lives.<br />

<br /><br /><br /><br /><br />No, definitely not just you.  <br /><br />My DW's grandfather is a retired engineer (CB&Q/BN/Amtrak); he once spoke of a terrible incident in which a carload of teenagers crossed in front of his locomotive...and didn't make it across in time.  Nothing he could do except watch it happen right in front of him.  Yes, the memories stick with him, he's 95 years old. I wonder if the passengers on his train sought "compensation"?

 

[Braniff747SP]

This just happened to me; two hour delay over my thirty five hour run- about forty five minutes away from my final destination.

Would I ask for compensation? Of course not. Why should Amtrak pay you for something that they had no control over? Why should they pay if someone just decided to throw themselves infront of a train? It's not their problem. The last thing they want is for someone to kill themselves with one of their trains. It's not like they did it on purpose.

And I feel for the engineers on the OP's train and on mine- they are the ones whose lives will likely never be the same. And you want compensation?

 

[PaulM]

Whether it be poor communication, rude employees, inadequate maintenance and dirty restrooms and/or accommodations, however, On Time Performance is one area where most delays are totally and completely beyond Amtrak's control.

The big exception being delays due to mechanical problems, which is a whole other discussion.

 

[Mary L. Ramos]

My granddaughter and I were on this same train ride where this accident occurred in Benson, Arizona. It was tragic and upsetting knowing someone was dead while we were all waiting for several hours until the coroner arrived. Several people in our car were making obnoxious remarks why they should not be made to wait because the victim decided to commit suicide. Perhaps these were the same people requesting their refunds.

We returned to El Paso this past Saturday on Amtrak. A passenger decided to ether smoke a cigarette or as rumors were said he was trying to cook meth in the restroom. There was smoke damage and electrical wire damage. This happened around Lordsburg, New Mexico. This incident caused a six hour delay which started around 6:30 a.m. Amtrak graciously served complimentary breakfast to all passengers onboard. We never encountered anyone complaining about the " inconvenienced delay". We understand these incidents were unavoidable and unpreventable. Amtrak should not have to refund anyone. Personally, we are looking forward to another trip on Amtrak soon.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I don't want a refund. I just don't want everything to take the standard five or six hours of sitting to resolve. Seems like a pretty reasonable position to me.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

You can't move till coroner releases the train.

Some small towns only have one coroner and sometimes he has other functions as well.

Or the suicide is not only person to die at that hour.

This Coroner is not gone drop everything he is doing, just because Amtrak has a casualty.

Or even if Coroner gets to scene on time , things may not go his way, critical parts of body may be missing or estimated weight or sum of all body parts just don't jive.

they will check that train till parts are found, or no cause of death can be determined.

What if a body was already death and propped up on rail ??, there is very little to seperate a crime vs a suicide.

let the coroner and investigators do his/her job, yelling at crew won't get things going faster .