Rude Employees

[Dovecote]

I have been riding Amtrak for about 10 years mostly on the Crescent and every single trip I run into at least one rude employee. Most of the time I can count on poor service in the dining car among other things. For some reason the dining car doesn't understand the concept of checking on people to see if they need anything without having to be flagged down.

I certainly agree with you on your evaluation of poor and rude service being the norm in the dining car. The exception to this is the staff working the Auto Train. The quality of the meals however have not been very good on our last two trips (we travel on the average of three round trips a year). Personally, I think the worst of the lot in the dining car, when it comes to customer service, are the folks on the Capitol Limited. In regard to the dining car staff on the Crescent, Tyree and his staff provided friendly and stellar service on our last trip in March. We are keeping our fingers crossed that we get him on our next trip in mid September.

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

What are some of the typical starting and few years down the road wages at Amtrak?

 

[jis]

For most US Domestic airlines, on board service is mostly an oxymoron, since there is not really that much service of any sort to be had. it is sort of like asking, what kind of on board service did you have on a Northeast Regional. Well, uh... there was not much.

Comparing what service one should have in a Dining Car with the meager service provided on board an aircraft on a US domestic flight is kind of apples and oranges to start with IMHO. OTOH, on international flights most US airlines service is borderline tolerable in Economy, and between good and excellent in Business or First. I would not term any as spectacular, the standard bearer being Singapore Airlines in that department.

Service in Amtrak Diner rarely rises to the basic Business Class international service on most US airlines, though I believe it is at par on many occasions with domestic First Class or slightly better.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

For most US Domestic airlines, on board service is mostly an oxymoron, since there is not really that much service of any sort to be had. it is sort of like asking, what kind of on board service did you have on a Northeast Regional. Well, uh... there was not much.

Airlines of today are far below what airlines of yesterday offered, that is true. And yet on even the shortest coach flight I still receive at-seat drink service. Refills and even alcoholic drinks if I want. On longer flights I can receive at-seat snacks and sandwiches if I should desire to purchase one. On much longer flights that are still much shorter than most Amtrak routes you will receive multiple at-seat meals included in the cost of the ticket. On Amtrak coach trips of any length you can't expect at-seat anything. In fact I'm not even sure what the coach car attendants actually do besides ask you where you're going and remind you to get off if you forget.

Service in Amtrak Diner rarely rises to the basic Business Class international service on most US airlines, though I believe it is at par on many occasions with domestic First Class or slightly better.

If anyone in international business class ever spoke to me with the dismissive "take it or leave it" attitude that Amtrak diner staff routinely display I'd demand a refund of the business class premium. No ifs, ands, or buts about it.

 

[amamba]

As for Kevin Smith it might surprise you to discover he's a comedian and that any confrontations he can conjure up may be nothing more than an attempt to cultivate more content and increase his relevance in the eyes of the press. While I do enjoy his humor I cannot defend his remarks against Southwest. Kevin Smith is a humongous gelatinous blob by his own doing. His personal space ends where mine begins. If that means he has to charter his own plane in order to keep his enormous blubbery folds to himself then that's his problem and not mine or anyone else's. Keep in mind that Southwest was the one and only US airline willing to participate in a reality show that was all about airline customer service. Maybe you never watched it, but I believe it showed some real guts and pride on the part of Southwest. Of course I would never claim that decades of flying Southwest has never once resulted in a bad experience at the hands of a rude employee. That sort of blatant pandering requires a level of blind infatuation I've never had the misfortune of catching.

Considering that I saw first saw Clerks well over 15 years ago and can pretty much quote the entire movie on command - and the rest of his original "trilogy" -, I am quite familiar with his comedic antics. Clearly we are going to have to agree to disagree here, but at the end of the day, Kevin Smith was sitting in his seat with the arm rest down and with the seatbelt buckled without an extender. Since SWA publishes a firm policy on buying two seats for a "person of size", and since Kevin Smith clearly fell within the policy of having to only buy one seat, I would consider that poor customer service and rude behavior on their behalf. Just like how we get frustrated with amtrak when the customer experience deviates from the rules in the manual, that is my take on the Kevin Smith incident.

And I actually caught quite a few episodes of that show and thought sometimes the staff was pretty rude. But hey, we are all allowed our own opinions and perceptions. Personally I really don't like the SWA experience because I don't like the idea of not having assigned seats - I would LOVE for amtrak to have seat selection, for example - but clearly I am in the minority as the airline has been profitable while others have not.

Although I do have to say that some of my friends and I popped in the DVD of clerks II to watch again on Saturday night after returning home from the phillies/nats game, and it was so bad we had to turn it off after 20 minutes.

Edited to Add: I would put Jet Blue at the top of the customer service pile based on my own personal experiences. The staff has always been friendly, they have been great about putting me on an earlier flight when seats are available without charging a fee, and even when there are delays we have been treated like humans instead of cattle.

 

[Tumbleweed]

Folks....a lot of your experiences depends so heavily on your own attitude.....if you try and greet each Amtrak employee with a smile and a philosophy of "there are no strangers, only friends i have not met", you will find it substantially improves your chances of a good experience.....no guarantees, but it is worth a try......

 

[tonys96]

I have never ridden in a sleeping car, unfortunately.but I plan to do so on my rail pass trip next year, upgrading a time or two to help with layovers and/or long segments. I have ridden quite a bit in coach, both on the Eagle and the Heartland Flyer.

As in any part of life, I have found both good and bad employees on Amtrak. Wrote about some above. Just a fact of life, people are people. I do agree 110% that if one is confronted with unacceptable customer service, it should be escalated to a higher level, and to that end, I am asking the forum....exactly what is that higher level??

Say, as a coach passenger who may be upset with an attendant, is there someone on the train at that time that is in a supervisory position? Can a coach passenger ask for a supervisor, or must they just sit and fester until the segment is done and call Amtrak? It would seem that there should be a "crew chief" or somesuch. Same question about sleeper car pax....

And as a corollary, when a passenger sees/recieves exceptional service, is there someone in a supervisory position on the train that could be made aware of that exemplary service?

I suppose I am asking, what is the on board chain of command?

Thanks!

 

[Henry Kisor]

Tumbleweed is right. Cheeriness begets cheeriness.

 

[Railroad Bill]

Just returned from our trip to Boston and Maine and must add to the conversations that our SCAs and dining car crews were excellent in both efficiency and manner.

We had Robert on the eastbound LSL and Walt on the westbound LSL and both were great. Personable, kept things in order, informative about things going on, both had to serve a meal in the lounge car for our Boston sections' sleeper and did it with a smile. (now Boston cab drivers, that is another story!!

Debra on the LSL coaches was a riot and she and I even pulled off a little play for an obnoxious coach passenger who was getting on her nerves a lot. What a fun ride it was! :lol:

And the crews on the Downeaster were also very friendly. Even had a hospitality agent on the southbound Downeastern who passed out literature about Boston, maps and stickers for the kids.

Yes, we have had a few losers on all of our trips, but I have found that if you start out being nice to them, most of the crew members will lighten up and we all have a good time. The ones that dont get reported to Amtrak!!

 

[Dan O]

Not a lot of Amtrak experience to consider but one trip from LA to CHI and back. I found the staff on the train (coach both ways) to be friendly and helpful. No complaints at all. The service was exceptional on the way back to LA. I wrote to Amtrak to tell them about it. My only complaint was buying the ticket in LA. Was the person rude? Nope. She was a bit slow and gave off the feeling that she didn't care at all about her job or how quickly she did it. She may do a wonderful job (we did get the right tickets after all) but it seemed like we were a bit of a bother. Not a big complaint and overall, as in on the train, great service.

Dan

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Clearly we are going to have to agree to disagree here, but at the end of the day, Kevin Smith was sitting in his seat with the arm rest down and with the seatbelt buckled without an extender. Since SWA publishes a firm policy on buying two seats for a "person of size", and since Kevin Smith clearly fell within the policy of having to only buy one seat, I would consider that poor customer service and rude behavior on their behalf.

At the end of the day all I have is Kevin Smith's claim of what happened, but let's presume he's telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth. Even if we give him the benefit of the doubt there is no way Kevin's enormous body wasn't spilling over into another seat. Kevin knows what a typical airplane seat looks like. He knows what a whale looks like. He knows a whale can't fit into a typical airline seat. And he knows how to turn a small issue into a much bigger one in a matter of seconds. He also knows he can afford to charter a private plane of sufficient volume from anywhere to anywhere. But erring on the side of practicality isn't going to give Kevin the new content and attention he needs to stay relevant. So Kevin apparently decided to simply keep forcing the issue until someone eventually slipped up so he could feign surprise and outrage when the official policy isn't able to predict his childish antics. It's great fun when Kevin's on stage talking about it, but when it comes to actually judging the customer service level of Southwest Airlines I wouldn't consider Kevin to be an objective source. I used to fly a lot and although Southwest is not always smiles and cheer they tend to do a pretty good job of making wrong things right and letting little things slide. That's not the sort of experience I had with America West, American, Continental, Delta, Northwest, Republic, United, US Airways, and the like. Jet Blue doesn't fly to the seventh largest city in the nation so I can't comment on them. Maybe some day they'll fly here and I can give them a try.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Since I dont fly like I used to (million miler back in the day), can only say that my best experiences in the past few years, while limited, have come on Southwest, Jet Blue and Air Canada! (maybe those Canadians are on to something!) The absolute worst was US Air and Delta!

Of course the worst part of flying usually comes @ the airport now thanks to TSA, Airport Police and the Indifferent clerks manning the desks! In comparison with Amtrak, only the CHI Brown Shirts @ CUS come close to those Inquisition wanna-bes!! :help:

 

[RailFanLNK]

I'm a member of the Teamsters Union and I drive for a large Union Package delivery company....and for 3 years the non-union employee of my competition nickname was "Mean Dean" cuz the non-union guy was the most grumpy, mad and rude delivery guy anybody on my delivery route had ever seen. He was very easy to sell our services against his cuz he was such a jerk. So, please throw out the union thing because I get compliments called in on me for the service and attitude I bring to my customers. "Mean Dean" is now somewhere else (he quit, he didn't get fired) making life miserable for whomever he's working for and he's probably not carrying a union card. :giggle:

 

[Bob Dylan]

I'm a member of the Teamsters Union and I drive for a large Union Package delivery company....and for 3 years the non-union employee of my competition nickname was "Mean Dean" cuz the non-union guy was the most grumpy, mad and rude delivery guy anybody on my delivery route had ever seen. He was very easy to sell our services against his cuz he was such a jerk. So, please throw out the union thing because I get compliments called in on me for the service and attitude I bring to my customers. "Mean Dean" is now somewhere else (he quit, he didn't get fired) making life miserable for whomever he's working for and he's probably not carrying a union card. :giggle:

Lets hope he's not working for Amtrak Al! :excl: :excl: :excl: When is the CZ going to be able to go through Omaha again?? The CZ OTP is looking like the old Sunset East!!

 

[EB_OBS]

Now, turning to one of the underlying themes currently running through this topic, let me once again repeat something that I have said many, many times before.

Amtrak Management Does Ride the Trains!

We currently have one now retired member who did that for a good portion of his career at Amtrak and we have one member who currently does it. Is there a manager on every train every day? No. But they are out riding the trains.

The problem isn't that management isn't riding the trains! The problem is that the employees know who the managers are. So when there is a manager around, the bad employees do their jobs. When there is no manager around, they don't. It's that simple.

So management has to rely, at least in part, on reports from the passengers. If you get bad service, report it! Take names and call Amtrak's Customer Service to be sure that it gets documented. The more times an employee gets reported, the more likely it is that they'll be sent for retraining, given greater scrutiny, and eventually terminated if they don't improve.

It's important that whenever you contact Amtrak to either compliment or complain about a specific employee that you are able to provide the following; your reservation #, date you boarded the train and the train #, the employee's name.

Simply saying the employee was the conductor or the train attendant won't suffice. I can attest to the fact that many many employee complaints refer to the employee as the conductor when in fact it was a train attendant. I can also attest to the fact that specific complaints about an employee can and do pile up and are addressed if there is a pattern of poor performance.

As to the Union issue, I'll say that I worked for 20 years in non-union jobs, 16 of those years in management. In most states you cannot just terminate someone based upon one or even two complaints. Not if you also don't want to pay their unemployment. You have to have cause and usually well documented performance failures and a documented effort to retrain and/or coach to improvement before you can terminate an employee. If you don't, you'll be paying their unemployment for at least six months.

In a Union shop, yes your union representative defends you but if Amtrak has done their due diligence to coach and retrain and performance failures still exist then that union rep is gonna have a hard time keeping that employee employed. It's important to know though, that even non-union workers can get representation in employment / unemployment disputes. Every time I went before the magistrate, the employee had an appointed attorney to represent them. Every time. Also BTW, in the 11 cases over six years that I represented my company in unemployment claims I never lost one.

 

[Everydaymatters]

It's important that whenever you contact Amtrak to either compliment or complain about a specific employee that you are able to provide the following; your reservation #, date you boarded the train and the train #, the employee's name.

In the past when reading negative consumer experiences about Amtrak employees, I have wondered if the pax could call and complain while they are still in the train in which it occurred???

Others in this thread have suggested that immediately being pleasant helps to soften the grumpy TA. The TA I referred to came up unexpectedly and started yelling and carrying on. There was no opportunity to be pleasant to her as others have suggested as a solution. She never stopped ranting and raving before, during and after the time I was trying to put my things on the overhead rack. I didn't have a chance to say anything other than "please give me a minute". She was a nightmare of a person.

So, back to my question, is there any reason not to call and complain while the pax is in the train?

 

[had8ley]

It's important that whenever you contact Amtrak to either compliment or complain about a specific employee that you are able to provide the following; your reservation #, date you boarded the train and the train #, the employee's name.

In the past when reading negative consumer experiences about Amtrak employees, I have wondered if the pax could call and complain while they are still in the train in which it occurred???

Others in this thread have suggested that immediately being pleasant helps to soften the grumpy TA. The TA I referred to came up unexpectedly and started yelling and carrying on. There was no opportunity to be pleasant to her as others have suggested as a solution. She never stopped ranting and raving before, during and after the time I was trying to put my things on the overhead rack. I didn't have a chance to say anything other than "please give me a minute". She was a nightmare of a person.

So, back to my question, is there any reason not to call and complain while the pax is in the train?

Very good point Betty. The On Board Service Manager gets an e-mail copy of the complaint and they seldom, if ever, immeditely react. I did call the Supt. in NOL about the bad order CCC (sodium bomb sandwiches for dinner, greasy donuts for breakfast)on the way back from St. Louis AU Gathering and he had the Road Foreman board in Jackson, MS. He bad ordered the sleeper I was in so you might want to wait until you get where you're going !!! :lol:

 

[rrdude]

Calling Amtrak's Customer Relations FROM the train, makes great sense. Make sure to tell them you are on Train #____,. and the offending employee's name is ______ and the offense was ___________________ (assuming they are open).

If you can, seeking out the conductor, or the LSA-Diner, and informing them calmly and politely is also suggested.

Now, if you are like me, and ENJOY a confrontation, CONFRONTING the abusive employee is also an option. (and very fun, if done correctly..... and publicly.........Except for the Conductor, NEVER confront a Conductor, unless you are ready to "walk)

 

[amamba]

Texas Sunset, did you actually listen to any of Kevin Smith's podcasts about the SWA situation? I don't think they were funny and/or comedic AT ALL. They were sad and he was angry. I followed the story pretty closely, and while I agree that he could have been using the situation to draw attention to him right when a new movie of his was coming out, it didn't seem like he was infusing humor into his description of the situation. I wasn't laughing as I listened to his podcast, and as I listened to him interview other folks that had similar things happen to them.

He interviewed a couple of people that were brought to tears over the way they were treated by SWA. I agree that there are always going to be good apples and bad apples - and every company everywhere has some bad apples - but I'm still boycotting SWA as a result of their inconsiderate and uneven treatment of overweight folks. I fully agree that a person of size who is encroaching on another's space should buy two seats - but SWA has a track record of unevenly applying their policy and humiliating pax in the process.

 

[had8ley]

Calling Amtrak's Customer Relations FROM the train, makes great sense. Make sure to tell them you are on Train #____,. and the offending employee's name is ______ and the offense was ___________________ (assuming they are open).

If you can, seeking out the conductor, or the LSA-Diner, and informing them calmly and politely is also suggested.

Now, if you are like me, and ENJOY a confrontation, CONFRONTING the abusive employee is also an option. (and very fun, if done correctly..... and publicly.........Except for the Conductor, NEVER confront a Conductor, unless you are ready to "walk)

Jerry~ if every on board manager acted on pax complaints cell phoned in I'm afraid a lot of OBS would be collecting RRB unemployment. There's two sides to every story and I'm sure the employee and the unions would be fuming if a TA was pulled out of service on the word of a pax. I'll be the first one to admit that some OBS act like "Your in my territory and you'll do as I say until you get off" but in fairness I think the "fire 'em" mentality needs to seek its own course. Enough complaints come to the OBS manager's computer and he/she is going to have to start answering some questions about the individual.

 

[jdcnosse]

Folks....a lot of your experiences depends so heavily on your own attitude.....if you try and greet each Amtrak employee with a smile and a philosophy of "there are no strangers, only friends i have not met", you will find it substantially improves your chances of a good experience.....no guarantees, but it is worth a try......

^^ This. I've even noticed myself, when I drive upset, or do anything upset...just little tiny things people do piss me off. but if I try and stay positive and calm, I don't really care.

The problem isn't that management isn't riding the trains! The problem is that the employees know who the managers are. So when there is a manager around, the bad employees do their jobs. When there is no manager around, they don't. It's that simple.

sounds like a perfect reason to be on that show undercover boss. haha

Texas Sunset, did you actually listen to any of Kevin Smith's podcasts about the SWA situation? I don't think they were funny and/or comedic AT ALL. They were sad and he was angry. I followed the story pretty closely, and while I agree that he could have been using the situation to draw attention to him right when a new movie of his was coming out, it didn't seem like he was infusing humor into his description of the situation. I wasn't laughing as I listened to his podcast, and as I listened to him interview other folks that had similar things happen to them.

 

He interviewed a couple of people that were brought to tears over the way they were treated by SWA. I agree that there are always going to be good apples and bad apples - and every company everywhere has some bad apples - but I'm still boycotting SWA as a result of their inconsiderate and uneven treatment of overweight folks. I fully agree that a person of size who is encroaching on another's space should buy two seats - but SWA has a track record of unevenly applying their policy and humiliating pax in the process.

I just wanted to agree with you, in the fact that yes he does have loads of money, but that doesn't give him any less of a right to wanting to save that money by flying coach. Like was said many times before, he was within SWA's guidlines and they still kicked him off.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Texas Sunset, did you actually listen to any of Kevin Smith's podcasts about the SWA situation? I don't think they were funny and/or comedic AT ALL. They were sad and he was angry. I followed the story pretty closely, and while I agree that he could have been using the situation to draw attention to him right when a new movie of his was coming out, it didn't seem like he was infusing humor into his description of the situation. I wasn't laughing as I listened to his podcast, and as I listened to him interview other folks that had similar things happen to them.

I didn't hear any of his podcasts. I heard him talking about his various incidents with Southwest on stage. It was pretty clear that his weight and the problems it gets him into is most certainly part of his schtick. It was also pretty clear that he has no need of Southwest for anything but press and material.

He interviewed a couple of people that were brought to tears over the way they were treated by SWA. I agree that there are always going to be good apples and bad apples - and every company everywhere has some bad apples - but I'm still boycotting SWA as a result of their inconsiderate and uneven treatment of overweight folks. I fully agree that a person of size who is encroaching on another's space should buy two seats - but SWA has a track record of unevenly applying their policy and humiliating pax in the process.

I fully support political correctness when it deals with unalterable traits, but not when it comes to something that we can and should control. You can only get Kevin Smith huge if you live a highly caloric and sedentary lifestyle. No organ or gene or enzyme or neurotransmitter can conjure calories out of thin air and I'm tired of being expected to pretend that's not true. I'm not trying to say you or anyone else should fly Southwest; that decision is yours alone to make and I honestly respect people who take a stand on who they will or will not do business with. I just wanted to point out that all we have to go on is Kevin Smith's side of the story and it's pretty clear he has an inherent conflict-of-interest when it comes to issues like this. That's all. ^_^

 

[PRR 60]

I prefer to make decisions based on my experiences and my family's experiences, not someone else's. A company that has treated me well, my wife well, and my kids well, is not going to lose my business because someone else had a problem (allegedly). Everyone has an agenda. The only agenda that matters to me is my agenda.

 

[George B]

I didn't hear any of his podcasts. I heard him talking about his various incidents with Southwest on stage. It was pretty clear that his weight and the problems it gets him into is most certainly part of his schtick. It was also pretty clear that he has no need of Southwest for anything but press and material.

I fully support political correctness when it deals with unalterable traits, but not when it comes to something that we can and should control. You can only get Kevin Smith huge if you live a highly caloric and sedentary lifestyle. No organ or gene or enzyme or neurotransmitter can conjure calories out of thin air and I'm tired of being expected to pretend that's not true. I'm not trying to say you or anyone else should fly Southwest; that decision is yours alone to make and I honestly respect people who take a stand on who they will or will not do business with. I just wanted to point out that all we have to go on is Kevin Smith's side of the story and it's pretty clear he has an inherent conflict-of-interest when it comes to issues like this. That's all. ^_^

I think it is pretty humorous to see people come to a public forum like this to gripe about people complaining in a larger public forum. People have no problem going on and on about grievances here on this site (even when they have no facts to back them up) because they know they have an audience, and certainly would continue to do it if they had the power to go on stage or on TV and continue complaining.

 

[JayPea]

I've generally received pretty good service over the years traveling Amtrak. I've had, especially in coach, attendants that were non-existant, but for the most part, even then, I've gotten good service from Amtrak employees that were happy to be of service. I've been wondering if perhaps I've given poor employees a pass, because I've certainly heard a lot of stories of bad to worse to totally rotten service, and I guess I've begun to pay more close attention to the service. And I still think for the most part I've had it pretty good. One time on the CZ the kid waiting tables in the diner about bit my head off, because I was new to the Amtrak experience and sat down at a table without him showing me a specific place to sit. I thought his reaction was a bit over the top on that one. And the absolute worsst I've had was this past June, while on a Spokane-Seattle trip. I was in coach, and went to get a diet Pepsi, as the last couple of tables in the diner also serve as a lounge. It took forever to get waited on, even though the woman knew full well I was waiting. She finally sauntered over, told me there was no bottled water and no Diet Pepsi. When I said I'd then settle for apple juice, she basically told me that if I didn't like it, go drink out of the tap. I didn't exactly care for that. I didn't exactly appreciate it, either, when it took forever for to get change from the LSA. (The LSA wasn't the one who reluctantly waited on me). And the waitperson acted as if it was a grand imposition for her to have to even ask the LSA to come up with change. The whole transaction must have taken nearly 10 minutes. And I REALLY didn't like it when a woman came in behind me, and in about 30 seconds, went back to her seat--WITH A DIET PEPSI they were supposedly out of. I was irate at this point, and I blew it by not saying anything then. I should have. I did contact Customer Service after this and did get a voucher. When I go to the gathering, I hope I get this person again. And if she's rude again, I won't keep my mouth shut the next time around.