Washington DC Union Station redevelpment plans

[ToniCounter]

that looks great for $7 billion budget.

but why does it seem like other Amtrak stations are only given a $7 budget for improvements? just went through one yesterday and all they had were two vending machines and two driking water fountains. according to the Amtrak guy at the ticket window, one of the water fountains has not worked for 2 years because they didn't have the budget to replace it.(beyond repair)

 

[jis]

that looks great for $7 billion budget.

but why does it seem like other Amtrak stations are only given a $7 budget for improvements? just went through one yesterday and all they had were two vending machines and two driking water fountains. according to the Amtrak guy at the ticket window, one of the water fountains has not worked for 2 years because they didn't have the budget to replace it.(beyond repair)

Is that station building owned by Amtrak or someone else?

 

[ToniCounter]

that looks great for $7 billion budget.

but why does it seem like other Amtrak stations are only given a $7 budget for improvements? just went through one yesterday and all they had were two vending machines and two driking water fountains. according to the Amtrak guy at the ticket window, one of the water fountains has not worked for 2 years because they didn't have the budget to replace it.(beyond repair)

Is that station building owned by Amtrak or someone else?

pretty sure it was Amtrak... said Amtrak on the outside.. .only Amtrak used it for it's 3 daily trains... of course I forgot to ask the station manager to see the deed to the station... should have strolled down to the city hall on the next block and ask the clerk to look up who actually owned the station?

 

[Eric S]

It's often not that simple. Stations, even if only or mostly used by Amtrak, are often owned by the freight railroad, the municipality, the local/regional transit system, or other non-Amtrak entities.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

When you shop at a shopping center and see a Sears or Penny's on the outside of a building, do you assume Sears or Penny's owns the building? Most likely they're tenants, just like all the other stores in the shopping center.

 

[jis]

that looks great for $7 billion budget.

but why does it seem like other Amtrak stations are only given a $7 budget for improvements? just went through one yesterday and all they had were two vending machines and two driking water fountains. according to the Amtrak guy at the ticket window, one of the water fountains has not worked for 2 years because they didn't have the budget to replace it.(beyond repair)

Is that station building owned by Amtrak or someone else?

pretty sure it was Amtrak... said Amtrak on the outside.. .only Amtrak used it for it's 3 daily trains... of course I forgot to ask the station manager to see the deed to the station... should have strolled down to the city hall on the next block and ask the clerk to look up who actually owned the station?

I did not realize that the charges you were leveling at Amtrak and its budgeting policies were born out of utter ignorance of how things work. Oh well ... In fact many stations with big Amtrak sign on them are not owned or maintained by Amtrak. Without knowing who is responsible for maintenance it is hard to say who should be held responsible for replacing the water fountain. So yeah, you did need to investigate a bit further. The information you seek is actually available on the web and does not necessarily require a trip to the city hall.

 

[MikefromCrete]

Amtrak actually owns very few stations. Chicago Union Station, New York Penn, Philadelphia 30th Street, Baltimore Penn are Amtrak owned. But everywhere else is owed by some other entity: a municipality, a transit district, a freight railroad, a private developer. In some instances a station building may be owned by a municipality, but the platforms are owned by the freight railroad.

Washington Union Station is actually owned by the U.S. Department of Transportation

 

[afigg]

pretty sure it was Amtrak... said Amtrak on the outside.. .only Amtrak used it for it's 3 daily trains... of course I forgot to ask the station manager to see the deed to the station... should have strolled down to the city hall on the next block and ask the clerk to look up who actually owned the station?

You don't have to do that, the basic information on ownership of each station, the platforms, parking lot, and tracks is provided on the Great American Stations website. Just enter the city or station code for the station with the broken drinking fountain and look it up. Many stations are owned by the local government or sometimes for "legacy" stations, the freight railroad.

The ownership of stations and related facilities can be quite complex for large stations. Here is the GAS entry for WAS which shows the station itself is owned by the federal government, US DOT as the agency, and (portions of it) Washington Terminal Corporation, which is a holding company that goes back to the days of Penn Railroad. US DOT owns the parking garage, Washington Terminal Corporation owns the platforms and tracks.

 

[jis]

And Washington Terminal Company is now substantially owned by Amtrak IIRC. There was a recent flap about the whole thing and I am not sure which way it was resolved.

 

[afigg]

Resurrecting an old topic, there was a public presentation scheduled for today (March 22, 2018) on the revised plan for the expansion for Washington Union Station.

The Greater Greater Washington blog posted a preview and one person's take on the now scaled back Master plan for WAS: See details for Union Station’s future expansion. In short, a smaller concourse than proposed in the earlier Master Plan, a major reduction in the number of spaces for the parking garage and parking space, but space is to preserved for up to a 4 track Metro line (or perhaps 2 new Metro line side by side) running under the station.

Not sure when the material being shown at the March 22 public presentation will be posted on the net. Although GGW and other blogs are likely to post stuff.

Phase 1, the expansion of the Clayton Concourse, appears to have started as I noticed what appeared to be at least some pre-construction or utility relocation work underway when I was at WAS a few weeks ago.

 

[sitzplatz17]

I was at the public presentation today. Nothing too exciting or new to report except that there are a whole bunch of new renderings of what the 4 to 5 alternatives are now.

Really it comes down to the question of a perpendicular over the tracks extended concourse, or a parallel over the tracks extended concourse and where to put the parking garages and the buses.

There should be a bunch of those renderings up on the website in the next few days, I'll try and post a couple tomorrow if they're not up yet.

 

[frequentflyer]

https://docs.google.com/viewerng/viewer?url=https://www.fra.dot.gov/eLib/Document/17180

 

[sitzplatz17]

So they’ve narrowed it down to 5 options:



(As mentioned previously, there will be more detailed renderings available on the site within a few days, but for discussion purposes here I’m providing a little bit of an overview)

Key items to note here are that alternatives B-E all would build a parking garage under the stub end tracks. The only difference being that some of the options would be one level of parking others will have two levels.

Additionally, it should be noted that alternate C splits the bus terminal up. For intercity, local, and commuter buses there would be a garage north of H street, either west or east. The small line of purple between Claytor hall and the new train hall would be for the tourist buses only.

Note that in all cases the actual platform and track layout stays the same. It seems that Amtrak is pretty firm in the design happening there.

Unfortunately when I went the representatives of DC DOT had already left so I couldn’t ask about the H street bridge replacement project.

But there was this handout:



If I think of anything else or have time to upload more detailed photos of the alternatives I’ll be sure to add them.

Sent from my iPhone using Amtrak Forum

 

[Ryan]

4 years later....

Some new renders of what is to come.... maybe.... someday....

https://www.cfa.gov/system/files/me...2-1_FRA-WUS_Expansion-priv-dev(pres-6-15).pdf
https://www.cfa.gov/system/files/me...JUN22-1_FRA-WUS_Expansion-publ-prop(pres).pdf

 

[joelkfla]

I'm skeptical of underground concourses. Sure, they look all nice and shiny in the renderings. Current Penn Station probably did, too.

 

[Tlcooper44]

I'm skeptical of underground concourses. Sure, they look all nice and shiny in the renderings. Current Penn Station probably did, too.

Doesn't WAS have a little too much diesel traffic to have an underground concourse?
I suppose this is not completely underground, but it seems like it might be a problem.

 

[jis]

Doesn't WAS have a little too much diesel traffic to have an underground concourse?
I suppose this is not completely underground, but it seems like it might be a problem.

Tier IV diesels with big enough exhaust fans over the tracks hosting them should be able to adequately address that problem. One should refrain from getting a classic Alco belching black smoke in there though.

 

[jis]

Here is the WaPo article on it. If you have read too many WaPo articles already, might require subscription...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/06/16/union-station-dc-redevelopment-photos

 

[A.H. Rudd]

Whatever will become of my beloved K-Tower?

 

[west point]

Skimming this report had many surprizes. At the end was one had not heard aboutat all. Washington US has a sub basement. The platform tracks that lead to 1st street tunnel pass over the sub basemet. The sub basement roof is in such poor condition that it has temporary shoring to prevent the collaspe of the tracks above. To fix this problem the track 22 restoration is needed to do whatever is neeeded to the sub basement ceiling rebuild.. Timeline is June 2023 to start construction.

https://nec-commission.com/app/uplo...nvestment-Plan-02-Appendix-Amended-Mar-22.pdf

Page A3-298

Also 1st street tunnel will receive high density signaling.

 

[Jack Davis]

I have reviewed the 6 pages of pictures of the planned Washingon Union Station. As a preservationist what scares me is that nowhere in the architects drawings do I see anything of the original station. It must be saved as it is a historic gem that could never be built again. Does anyone know of the plans for the old station?

I recall arriving into the D.C. Station a couple of decades ago and I was told by friends that it had just undergone a renovation that kept its historical status. The ceiling was beautiful as I recall. So, now the yahoos of industry are out there doing their best to 'upgrade' everything they can, no matter the significance.

 

[Ryan]

There are no "yahoos of industry" trying to "upgrade" anything. This project is all about the expansion of the station and air rights over the track. The historical portion will remain in its current glory. Every post immediately after this 10-year old post that you've quoted points this out. @dlagrua was wrong 10 years ago, and he remains wrong today.

 

[Ryan]

View attachment 28639

Whatever will become of my beloved K-Tower?

My understanding is that it will be relocated and reconstructed as a restaurant. This piece of historic railroad infrastructure will continue to be celebrated.

 

[tricia]

Here is the WaPo article on it. If you have read too many WaPo articles already, might require subscription...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/06/16/union-station-dc-redevelopment-photos

Beat me to posting this.

FWIW, the comments on this article lean heavily toward complaint that this is mainly an expensive boondoggle to benefit private developers.

 

[Metra Electric Rider]

Skimming this report had many surprizes. At the end was one had not heard aboutat all. Washington US has a sub basement. The platform tracks that lead to 1st street tunnel pass over the sub basemet. The sub basement roof is in such poor condition that it has temporary shoring to prevent the collaspe of the tracks above. To fix this problem the track 22 restoration is needed to do whatever is neeeded to the sub basement ceiling rebuild.. Timeline is June 2023 to start construction.

https://nec-commission.com/app/uplo...nvestment-Plan-02-Appendix-Amended-Mar-22.pdf

Page A3-298

Also 1st street tunnel will receive high density signaling.

I'm going to withhold comment on what might be lurking there in that basement.... But very interesting find. That's quite an expensive repair (I don't know how large it is, what the structure is and/or how bad it is (plus I don't know the labor rates in DC plus the recent inflation on construction has clouded estimates).

I also loved how they described NY Penn as "two basements" in the report!