Washington DC Union Station redevelpment plans

[west point]

Hope some one can come up with a track diagram for the lower level of WAS. Especially how track 22 is going to avoid the sub basement problem at the throat of the 1st stree tunnel.

 

[AmtrakBlue]

Hope some one can come up with a track diagram for the lower level of WASH US. Especially how track 22 is going to avoid the sub basement problem at the throat of the 1st stree tunnel.

Wasn't too hard to find. Starts on page 292.
https://railroads.dot.gov/sites/fra...rminal Infrastructure Report_WUSDEIS_pdfa.pdf

 

[user 29398]

How much of the congestion there would be relieved if Amtrak used the same boarding procedure as every other railroad, i.e. tell people which track their train is on and leave it to them to be on the platform when it comes? The airline-style gate check is a huge bottleneck IMO, and rebuilding the station (expensive) to relieve congestion before even trying operational changes (cheap) seems foolish.

I'm also a bit perplexed by the lack of any obvious mention of the subway in the documents I've seen about this.

I love the planned renovation but can't help but wonder if it's really the best use of $10 billion in scarce transportation funding. That's enough money to electrify every passenger route in Virginia and the Carolinas with enough left over to do some serious curve straightening on the NEC.

 

[west point]

Skimmed the Washington Union Station EIS on redoing the tracks and platforms. Option 14 is the choice. The station will have to run on a very tight on time schedule. The overhaul will rotate shut downs of many of the tracks and platforms. It appears that all the operators will need to arrive on time and depart on time during the years of construction. As well quicker turn times. The higher NEC speeds may mean no reductions in schedules. Instead keep WAS from getting out of sync.

Consideration of changing the thru trains to Diesel power at PHL was also mentioned. That happening when several of the lower level tracks will be out of service especially for the sub basement overhaul. It seems that the sub baement overhaul is key to much of the other works. However it appears work cannot start until Amtrak gets control of the station lease. Part of the station above the sub basement is not part of Amtrak's lease.

The thru put of the 1st street tunnel is limited to one train at a time due to diesel emissions. Ventilation cannot really be improved as new ventilation shafts would exit on the capitol grounds.

https://railroads.dot.gov/sites/fra...rminal Infrastructure Report_WUSDEIS_pdfa.pdf

 

[jis]

This document lists projects involving Washington Union Station that are of relevance to this thread

https://nec-commission.com/app/uplo...nvestment-Plan-02-Appendix-Amended-Mar-22.pdf

 

[NES28]

The thru put of the 1st street tunnel is limited to one train at a time due to diesel emissions. Ventilation cannot really be improved as new ventilation shafts would exit on the capitol grounds.

https://railroads.dot.gov/sites/fra...rminal Infrastructure Report_WUSDEIS_pdfa.pdf

Seems as if electrifying the 1st Street tunnel is critical. With the the next generation of NEC trains on order being dual-mode this would seem to be doable. Does anyone know its vertical clearance?

 

[west point]

Seems as if electrifying the 1st Street tunnel is critical. With the the next generation of NEC trains on order being dual-mode this would seem to be doable. Does anyone know its vertical clearance?

Agree about electrifying both bores. We do know that both bores will clear Superliners but not double stacks. How close it would be from top of rail to catenary have no idea. Might have to use a power rail system. It may depend on if the ceiling is mostly flat or curved. Too curved a ceiling the pan might short out on the ceiling? Maybe someone can find a clearance diagram. Maybe 1st street bores will need notching.

But none of this can be done until Amtrak gets full control of the sub basement area as part of the whole station. Have no idea if track 22 work can connect to the tunnel bores tracks until Amtrak gets control.

Electrifying to ALX is important but dealing with catenary on CSX tracks ??? IMO this is one more reason that the second Long Bridge is completed as soon as possible along with 4 tracking from 1st street to ALX.

 

[jis]

Agree about eletrifying both bores. We do know that both bores will clear Superliners but not double stacks. How close it would be from top of rail to catenary have no idea. Might have to use a power rail system. It may depend on if the ceiling is mostly flat or curved. Too curved a ceiling the pan might short out on the ceiling? Maybe soeone can find a clearance diagram. Maybe 1st street bores will need notching.

For what it is worth, here you go. The original drawings for your perusal.

https://archive.org/details/transactionsofam71amer/page/134/mode/2up
Nominally the limiting clearance is 17' from ToR to crown, though most of it would appear to be 18' from ToR to the crown. It seems feasible to lower the ToR by a foot or two, so with some effort it would appear that electrification is feasible with even adequate clearance for 25kV.. Due to the structure of the tunnel, notching may be difficult.

 

[west point]

jis : agree. If the rest of the tunnel bores are the same as those above the sub basement. Have often wondered why catenary only went 400 feet into the bores.

 

[Ryan]

What good would extending it further into the tunnel have done in the past?

 

[user 1215]

Wow. This thread started 10 years ago and literally nothing has been moved forward on at WAS.

 

[MARC Rider]

Wow. This thread started 10 years ago and literally nothing has been moved forward on at WAS.

Better take a trip and see the work being done on Track 22.


This was from a year ago. It was a lot further along the last time I passed through, which was in March 2022 or thereabouts.

 

[west point]

Descriptions and better still photos would be info on track 22 approaches to the 1st street tunnel.

Theere is another surprize when thumbing through the 2035 service tables. There are no additional LD services south of WAS Union Station planned.. That seems to exclude a third train to Florida and any day train to / from ATL.

 

[jis]

Theere is another surprize when thumbing through the 2035 service tables. There are no additional LD services south of WASH Union Station planned.. That seems to iexclude a third train to Florida and any day train to / from ATL.

As long as the total train count remains the same, which trains are designated Intercity and which LD is a detail that is a matter that usually gets resolved on an ongoing basis way after the thing is built, if it is that is. So beyond the total train count, the operating patterns and division of the count among different types is not something that at least I worry about at this stage.

But yeah, I had noticed that when I read the document the first time many weeks back.

 

[NES28]

Theere is another surprize when thumbing through the 2035 service tables. There are no additional LD services south of WAS Union Station planned.. That seems to exclude a third train to Florida and any day train to / from ATL.

The law was changed in about 2008 to make clear that Amtrak has to fund operations of long distance trains itself while regional trains (less than 750 miles) are now "state-supported" service. I don't think that there has been a new long distance train established for years; it would, essentially, take an act of Congress. The real problem with this construct is that it doesn't accommodate long regional day trains serving multiple city pairs: NYC-Atlanta, NYC-Chicago, or Chicago-Florida.

 

[west point]

Speculation: It may be that the primary leasee holder is requiring Amtrak to stay into the limits of Amtrak's sub leasee. Sort of a payback on Amtrak's Eminent Domain filing for complete control of Union Station?. If someone has access to a diagram of Amtrak's actual lease limits that would probably counter this speculation.

 

[jis]

Another WaPo article on Washington Union Station

https://www.washingtonpost.com/transportation/2022/11/13/union-station-dc-rail-renovation/

 

[jis]

MODERATOR'S NOTE: A large number of posts about current facilities, convenience and experiences of Washington Union Station have been moved out of this thread into the following dedicated thread on those subjects:

https://www.amtraktrains.com/thread...facilities-convenience-and-experiences.83700/
Please use this new thread to discuss current facilities, experiences and whether the station is convenient for accessing Washington DC or not at the present time and reserve the original thread for discussing the redevelopment project.

Thank you for your understanding, cooperation and participation.

 

[MARC Rider]

Here's a nice little "high level" video that shows what the refurbished Union Station will look like (You'll have to click through to You Tube to view it.).



Looks like they'll have 3 concourses and multiple vehicle drop-off locations, so they can spread out the commuter crowd from all having to congregate at the south end concourse. You'll be able to access the platforms from the middle of the trains. I'm hoping that will reduce or even eliminate the cattle lines for the Amtrak trains. The only thing they need to worry about is getting people away from accessing the station from Columbus Circle. The additional drop-off locations will help, and they can reroute Metrobuses to stop at different places, but the Metro station will still be feeding passengers into the south end. Maybe they could build a passageway with a moving sidewalk to get people up towards H St. That would also allow a more obvious connection to the trolley.

No real information about what the waiting areas will look like, or whether there's going to be a new Club Acela/Metropolitan Lounge. Of course, most MARC/VRE riders don't wait around too long, if at all. Also, it wasn't clear about how many of the lower-level platforms will be high-level platforms. They're going to need to retain a few low level-platforms for the VRE trains, and the Capitol, too, as long as it keeps using Superliners, but with more and more Northeast Regionals continuing on to Virginia, it would speed up loading and unloading if they could open all the train doors and passengers didn't have to climbdown steps. They won't have the time cushion of the engine change after the new dual-modes come into service, although I guess Washington will still be a crew change, so they won't be unloading, loading and on their way in 2 minutes or whatever.

 

[joelkfla]

Here's a nice little "high level" video that shows what the refurbished Union Station will look like (You'll have to click through to You Tube to view it.).



Looks like they'll have 3 concourses and multiple vehicle drop-off locations, so they can spread out the commuter crowd from all having to congregate at the south end concourse. You'll be able to access the platforms from the middle of the trains. I'm hoping that will reduce or even eliminate the cattle lines for the Amtrak trains. The only thing they need to worry about is getting people away from accessing the station from Columbus Circle. The additional drop-off locations will help, and they can reroute Metrobuses to stop at different places, but the Metro station will still be feeding passengers into the south end. Maybe they could build a passageway with a moving sidewalk to get people up towards H St. That would also allow a more obvious connection to the trolley.

No real information about what the waiting areas will look like, or whether there's going to be a new Club Acela/Metropolitan Lounge. Of course, most MARC/VRE riders don't wait around too long, if at all. Also, it wasn't clear about how many of the lower-level platforms will be high-level platforms. They're going to need to retain a few low level-platforms for the VRE trains, and the Capitol, too, as long as it keeps using Superliners, but with more and more Northeast Regionals continuing on to Virginia, it would speed up loading and unloading if they could open all the train doors and passengers didn't have to climbdown steps. They won't have the time cushion of the engine change after the new dual-modes come into service, although I guess Washington will still be a crew change, so they won't be unloading, loading and on their way in 2 minutes or whatever.

Was there any space shown for dining and retail, other than a coffee stand? If there was, I missed it.

I'm not a fan of stepping from the classical architecture of the Great Hall directly into an oversized airport terminal. Seems like culture clash.

 

[dwebarts]

I used the "Gift Article" link for this one, so most should be able to read it.

Feds release updated $8.8 billion redevelopment plan for Union Station