Quite frankly, I have no idea what to do. Last night, I thought I would pass up on the opportunity. After reading your reply, I am not so sure anymore. I am kind of embarrassed by my own indecision. But it is a big step and I do not want to make the wrong choice. I also wouldn't want the corporation to spend all that time training me, only to flake out if I decided it wasn't for me. Not fair to them. Maybe I should take the strength test anyway and see where this goes. I did not know you were guaranteed eight hours off work after a shift.
There is no need to be embarrassed. You asked for the information and that shows you are thoughtful and taking this seriously. While I think CACharger is correct when he says you should consider it, I would like to paint the true picture of New York so you have the proper information to make an informed decision. I'm not worried about the corporation since they often anticipate people not adjusting or passing. However, I like to remind people that when they are selected for a job, someone else who really may want it did not get selected. There are a large number of applicants for a limit amount of positions and this becomes a lifestyle....and you need to have a long term vision if you want to do this.
Again, I'm not trying to frighten you. I just want you to have as much information that is available so I will add on to a few things.
I would say a lot depends on how fast seniority moves in your crew base; this meaning how often people above you in seniority either bid out to another area, retire, are fired, move to engine service etc. I work on the west coast and they definitely do warn you that you could be on call for years. I got lucky and was only on the extra board for 8 months. Seniority moved fast in my crew base and I got a regular job (not amazing but no longer on call) fairly quickly. In my experience a lot of the negatives about the early years can be eliminated by how quick you are able to get a regular job: you know when you are working, what days you have off, you don't need to worry about someone calling when you're out at dinner.
This is quite true. However, New York is not the place where ACs get immediate work. There may be a few that sign up in the middle of the night that you may hold after a few months if you're extremely lucky. The trouble is once you are able to hold a regular job as an AC, New York is infamous for taking the lowest available ACs and force assigning them to the conductor's extra list. They tend to do it as soon as it is allowed which just around the one year mark. This is where things get dicey since New York has a large yard. While there are roughly 9 assistant conductor positions in the yard and maybe 3 work assignments, there are roughly 55 conductor positions in the yard. That's a lot of work to cover and you have to contend with people from New York Zone 1 NYP-Zone 1 (NYP-BOS) taking these positions. You also have to worry about personnel from Philadelphia blocking you out of regular assignments, particularly during prime assignments.
New York is definitely a bigger and busier crew base than anything we have out west, so I can't speak completely on what your experience would be. I concur with what was said above by expecting calls at all times of the day. You get at minimum 8 hours off after work and if they are extremely short (rare in my experience but can happen like during the holidays) they can and will call you after your 8 is up. Most crew dispatchers are good at warning you if they're gonna need you sooner than later. They will become your best friends.
I did not know you were guaranteed eight hours off work after a shift.
And yes. The 8 hours off is part of the federally mandated Hours of Service law. Any job that has you work up to 11 hrs 59 mins, you get 8 hours off after. If you work 12 hours (the maximum amount of time you are allowed to work in one shift) you get 10 hours off. And then other tidbits like you can't work more than 6 days without a full 24 hours off.
I really want to go over this portion because this is what people tend to mismanage. Yes, you are entitled to 8 hours off if you have completed a shift...providing they need you rested for a full assignment. There is something called a respite in the hours of service of law and it is used in New York, New Haven, and Philadelphia liberally.
Basics federally hours of service law for passenger service:
You can work up to 12 working hours in a 24 hour period.
You can not exceed 12 continuous hours.
8 hours off restarts your time if you haven't worked 12 continuous hours. If you work 12 continuous hours, you must have 10 hours off.
So:
If you work an 8-hour shift, you would be entitled to 8 hours off before you can work your next FULL assignment. However, a break between 4 hours and 7 hours and 59minutes interrupts your hours of service. That means any time between the 4 hours and 8 hours, they CAN call you back to work and utilize.
Example: There is a job in New York that works a round trip to Philadelphia. It is about a 7-hour assignment and the crew callers a very aware of this Once you complete that assignment, you still have almost 5 hours available to work under the hours of service law. They can send you right back out if necessary. However, let's say you make it home. They can still activate you anywhere between the 4th hour and 8th hour and you'll have 5 hours left.
That is enough time to take a one-way trip somewhere.
Another thing I also want to address is "time off" between assignments. While you are guaranteed 8 hours off between shifts, that is counted from sign off, to sign up. It is not an undisturbed rest period. They can call you prior to the end of your 8 hour period of rest.
Example:
You finished a shift that ended at 2 pm. You are now rested for an assignment that starts at 10 pm since that is 8 hours from when you finished. Now, add in your call period of 2 or 3 hours which means you may receive a call around 7pm.
Another thing is your 24 hour relief day. It generally runs from 1201am to 1201am the next day, but you may work into your relief day as you are responsible for any assignment that starts prior to 12:00 prior to relief day.
Example:
Your relief day is Tuesday but there is a job that signs up at 11:59 pm on Monday. You ARE responsible for protecting that job. Now, if you work it, you are entitled to 24 hours off from the completion of that assignment. If this job finished at 7:59 am on Tuesday, you wouldn't go back on the extra board until 7:59 am on Wednesday.
This leads to another situation regarding your relief day: You may be called to cover something right as it ends.
Example:
Continuing from above, your relief day is Tuesday. It is Monday evening and you note that train 67 , which signs up at 1:30 am in the morning is open. You're on call to protect anything that occurs prior to 11:59 pm, so you are NOT responsible for protecting that assignment.
Now, you're enjoying your day off. It starts getting late so you prepare to hit the sack. First, you check the system to see what vacancies exist. You note that 67 is open. Since 67 signs up after your day off finishes at 12:01 am, you ARE responsible for covering this assignment if necessary. This is what
@CACharger262 was talking about when he said a good crew caller will let you know if you are needed sooner rather than later. They can be your best friend or worst enemy.
The natural segue is this next statement:
If you can't make it, you can call out sick, but keep in mind you only get a handful of unexcused absences a year. It depends on your manager how strictly this is enforced. I've never seen anyone terminated due to attendance.
I have seen plenty of people terminated for attendance issues, largely because of things like I listed above. When the NEC is hopping, it is hopping and New York typically has the most manpower. It is easy to miss calls, sleep through calls or things go to hell while you're asleep. You may call the crew dispatcher at night and they will tell you are 11 times out (the 11th person to be called) with 3 showing (3 open jobs) all day. Finally, you can relax. 3 hours later, you're getting a call because the wires came down or some other disruption occurred. However, some of the people you were following were unprepared and called out or dropped the call. Now, it reaches you and you never went to bed since you thought you had time.
What will you do?
If missing calls is not habit and you generally work, I know the bosses in NY will fight off attacks on their workers. It is hard to start discipline proceedings on someone that is working 60+ hours a week (which is probably in NYP.)
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