# BIG NEWS: WAS now in both Central & Eastern Zones!



## KrazyKoala (Feb 12, 2013)

The woman on the phone wouldn't tell me exactly when this happened. Maybe she doesn't know, but now, taking a trip to Washington, DC is now considered central zone as well as eastern.












My current trip, SAC>CHI>WAS is only 2-zones. Apparently, with all of the WAS detours people have to take to catch another train back into central zone has caught the attention of AGR. As well as the lost revenue for all those connecting trains the people seem to not be boarding just to get a cheaper rate to WAS. (i.e. booking SAC to ATL rather than SAC to WAS to make it 2-zone instead of 3-zone. AGR said that because of all the connecting trains to and from WAS, it will only be 3-zone if your connecting train ends in the eastern zone.


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 12, 2013)

Goodbye geographical zones?


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## Tumbleweed (Feb 12, 2013)

Hmmmm....so that should make a FAR-WAS-ATL trip a one zone?


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## Ispolkom (Feb 12, 2013)

KrazyKoala said:


> The woman on the phone wouldn't tell me exactly when this happened. Maybe she doesn't know, but now, taking a trip to Washington, DC is now considered central zone as well as eastern.


This was true for as long as you were on the phone with the agent. If you call back again, the next agent will most probably tell you that Sacramento-Washington is a three-zone trip. Last week, for instance, St. Paul-Chicago-Chicago was a two-zone trip. Until I see further evidence or (perish the thought) an actual statement from AGR, I'm going to chalk this one up to AGR's indeterminacy principle.



Devil's Advocate said:


> Goodbye geographical zones?


Perhaps goodbye geographical knowledge.


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## amamba (Feb 12, 2013)

How ridiculous is it that someone is charged two zones for SAC-CHI-WAS and it is the same amount of points for NYP - CHI.


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## Blackwolf (Feb 13, 2013)

And here, I just went WAS-CHI-SAC in December and was "charged" for three zones. I think this is typical AGR nonsense. Book it again at two zones and then I'll pay it credence as anything other than a fluke in your favor. That said, good score if it does not get audited and your account proactively charged for a three-zone reward in the future! :hi:


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## KrazyKoala (Feb 13, 2013)

Ispolkom said:


> KrazyKoala said:
> 
> 
> > The woman on the phone wouldn't tell me exactly when this happened. Maybe she doesn't know, but now, taking a trip to Washington, DC is now considered central zone as well as eastern.
> ...


I originally booked this online. And when it comes to talking to Amtrak, I avoid it at all costs. I honestly think they should be paying my phone bill from all my overages sitting on the phone with them for one reason or another.


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## Trogdor (Feb 13, 2013)

I thought you couldn't book connection redemptions online.


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 13, 2013)

Trogdor said:


> I thought you couldn't book connection redemptions online.


You can't. Unless it involves the Wonderful Wizard of _WAS_. Because because because, all the wonderful things he does.


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## the_traveler (Feb 13, 2013)

You're right, you can't. Perhaps KK first booked it online as a paid reservation and then changed it to an AGR award? I don't know.


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## KrazyKoala (Feb 13, 2013)

the_traveler said:


> You're right, you can't. Perhaps KK first booked it online as a paid reservation and then changed it to an AGR award? I don't know.


Correct.


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## Shortline (Feb 13, 2013)

So is this anything close to official? We would love to go to WAS sometime and do the museum thing, if it is a 1 Zone that would be a great deal for us. I thought that if you crossed a zone, even to get to a city in the departure zone, that it was still a 2 zone award. (Example FTW-ATL via CHI-WAS-ATL....that's a 2 zone, isn't it, even though ATL an FTW are (or can be) in the central zone?


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 14, 2013)

Shortline said:


> So is this anything close to official? We would love to go to WAS sometime and do the museum thing, if it is a 1 Zone that would be a great deal for us. I thought that if you crossed a zone, even to get to a city in the departure zone, that it was still a 2 zone award. (Example FTW-ATL via CHI-WAS-ATL....that's a 2 zone, isn't it, even though ATL an FTW are (or can be) in the central zone?


If it had become "official" how would we even know? The rules aren't written down anywhere so there's no way to know. Apparently if you have already purchased this specific route and get this specific employee to swap it with an AGR award you can cross the country for two zones. Otherwise I would not expect to duplicate this experience unless and until several other people come back with similar examples. So far we only have one person who has accomplished this recently in the manner described.


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## yarrow (Feb 14, 2013)

Devil's Advocate said:


> Shortline said:
> 
> 
> > So is this anything close to official? We would love to go to WAS sometime and do the museum thing, if it is a 1 Zone that would be a great deal for us. I thought that if you crossed a zone, even to get to a city in the departure zone, that it was still a 2 zone award. (Example FTW-ATL via CHI-WAS-ATL....that's a 2 zone, isn't it, even though ATL an FTW are (or can be) in the central zone?
> ...


we did a 2 zone spk-atl redemption in september and were routed spk-chi-was-atl for both halves of our round trip


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## crescent2 (Feb 14, 2013)

I'm totally confused! 

How could spk-chi-was-atl possibly be just two zones? I understand that ATL can be counted as in the central zone, but what about WAS? Curious about how AGR works...


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## the_traveler (Feb 14, 2013)

Does this mean the Slidell Loophole is back? :blush:


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## KrazyKoala (Feb 14, 2013)

crescent2 said:


> I'm totally confused!  How could spk-chi-was-atl possibly be just two zones? I understand that ATL can be counted as in the central zone, but what about WAS? Curious about how AGR works...


That is the WHOLE point of this thread...WAS is dual zone.


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## Ryan (Feb 14, 2013)

crescent2 said:


> I'm totally confused!  How could spk-chi-was-atl possibly be just two zones? I understand that ATL can be counted as in the central zone, but what about WAS? Curious about how AGR works...


Under the "old" "rules", It would be a 2 zone trip because you start in the West zone (SPK) and end in the Central zone (ATL). The fact that you went through the Eastern zone to get there didn't matter.


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## Anthony (Feb 14, 2013)

Like all things on the internet, take this thread with a grain of salt. One person's purported experience does not mean anything has changed.


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## Ryan (Feb 14, 2013)

That's the awesome thing about a single data point - you can create an infinite number of pictures.


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## the_traveler (Feb 14, 2013)

Anthony said:


> Like all things on the internet, take this thread with a grain of salt


I'd rather take it with a fifth of whiskey!  It will look better after! :giggle:


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## crescent2 (Feb 14, 2013)

KK: Yes, I know it's the point of the thread. That's why I'm confused--it doesn't make sense. I'm trying to learn the ins and outs of AGR.

What was the "Slidell loophole"?


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## Ryan (Feb 14, 2013)

A popular trip that utilized what I called the "old" "rules" in my last post. It used to be that the only thing that determined how many zones you were charged for was the start and end point of your trip. You could go from Slidell to the West coast as a 2 zone trip, but since there isn't a same day connection in NOL, you would get routed through WAS and get 4 nights in a room for a cheap 2 zone redemption.

Too many people took advantage of it, and AGR started charging for the number of zones that you travel through, not just the start and end points. Most of the time. Sort of. None of this is written down in any rulebook that anyone has managed to get their hands on, so it's still a little bit of wild west.


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## musikdude (Feb 14, 2013)

Earlier tonight, I tried to book a roomette from Los Angeles to Chicago (using the longer routing on CS & EB) and the agent insisted it would be 35k points (a 15k + a 20 k/ 2 separate transactions). So frustrating that the agents AND supervisors don't know the correct rules of AGR!!!!! I just hung up and will try again tomorrow.


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## crescent2 (Feb 15, 2013)

Thanks, Ryan.

So, say if one were to book ATL-EMY, the amtrak site gives ATL-WAS-Chicago-EMY (or Charlottesville instead of WAS on some days) without using "Multicity." So, I'm assuming that would be only one AGR redemption. But would it be a 3-zone redemption because it routes you through WAS or Charlottesville? (ATL can be eastern or central, so that would be 2 zones using only the departure and destination cities.) It doesn't give you any other routes other than the Crescent/CL or Cardinal/CZ.

I cannot get the Sunset Limited/CS route to show as an option on any day, even departing from as far west as Slidell.


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## Ispolkom (Feb 15, 2013)

crescent2 said:


> Thanks, Ryan.
> So, say if one were to book ATL-EMY, the amtrak site gives ATL-WAS-Chicago-EMY (or Charlottesville instead of WAS on some days) without using "Multicity." So, I'm assuming that would be only one AGR redemption. But would it be a 3-zone redemption because it routes you through WAS or Charlottesville? (ATL can be eastern or central, so that would be 2 zones using only the departure and destination cities.) It doesn't give you any other routes other than the Crescent/CL or Cardinal/CZ.
> 
> I cannot get the Sunset Limited/CS route to show as an option on any day, even departing from as far west as Slidell.


You have a 85% chance of it being charged as three zones, and a 15% chance of getting it for 2 zones. Maybe closer to 90-10. We know that agents give different answers, and we guess that that is because of the agent not knowing the rules, the rules changing, the phase of the moon, or the agent rolling percentile dice to choose an answer. No one can give you a better answer. It's just the way AGR is.



musikdude said:


> So frustrating that the agents AND supervisors don't know the correct rules of AGR!!!!!


Well, it isn't as though we know the correct rules, either.

[Edited to decrease repetitiveness]


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## Ryan (Feb 15, 2013)

That said, if you live in Atlanta you've got a slightly better chance at getting it booked as a two zone, I think. You can make a compelling argument to the agent that you live in ATL and shouldn't be penalized for Amtrak's poor connectivity that forces you to go east before you can go west.

If you really want the Coast Starlight between LAX and EMY, you can do a 2 zone from NOL-EMY via the CONO, SWC and CS. That's a pretty good 2 zone redemption and you can get from ATL to NOL pretty cheap (have to overnight on your own dime, though).


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## yarrow (Feb 15, 2013)

Anthony said:


> Like all things on the internet, take this thread with a grain of salt. One person's purported experience does not mean anything has changed.


our trip spk-chi-was-atl as a 2 zone redemption in september was not a purported trip. dc is obviously not in the central zone as the title of the thread states it to be. that being said i have noticed a loosening of the rigid policy of "no travel through a zone without paying for it" in our last few redemptions. the main agr rule of "if you don't like the answer from the first agent, call back" continues to apply


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## crescent2 (Feb 15, 2013)

Thanks, Ryan.

Last night I asked about "best train combos" on the regular forum. I was fooling around with entering different trips on the website and was rather amazed at all the choices offered on some days for EMY-NOL!

I don't recall the option you mentioned being a choice, though, for NOL-EMY. I will check again, but I think only the SL/CS was shown last night. Maybe the other option is shown for days the SL isn't running? Perhaps I didn't check for those days. Thanks!


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## Ryan (Feb 15, 2013)

It's waaaay down at the bottom:


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## Ispolkom (Feb 15, 2013)

You can actually push that trip past Emeryville to at least Eugene, Oregon.


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## crescent2 (Feb 15, 2013)

Wow, thanks guys!


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## roadman3313 (Feb 16, 2013)

Not to change the subject... but do regular E-Tickets actually say Select Plus on them? Didn't realize they ever mentioned "status" per say on the ticket itself. I use Passbook so I haven't actually ever seen/used a paper/printed/Quik Trak/Agent E-Ticket.

As for this... I chalk it up to a lot of luck on your side!


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## KrazyKoala (Feb 16, 2013)

roadman3313 said:


> Not to change the subject... but do regular E-Tickets actually say Select Plus on them? Didn't realize they ever mentioned "status" per say on the ticket itself. I use Passbook so I haven't actually ever seen/used a paper/printed/Quik Trak/Agent E-Ticket.
> As for this... I chalk it up to a lot of luck on your side!


Yes they do, it shows right on this ticket, this is the same for an AGR trip or a standard paid ticket. It helps get into Metro Lounge and Club Acela without needing my card on me.


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## roadman3313 (Feb 16, 2013)

Good to know! Thanks! I'm on the West Coast so I don't really think it makes a difference and most station agents don't know a difference between AGR tiers anyway besides for the Sarcastic "Aren't you special." Not like airlines where "elites" have universal benefits throughout their travel experience... (extra points are always nice though!)

But that makes sense in terms of lounge access


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## jis (Feb 17, 2013)

The Passbook E-ticket for Amtrak does not mention Select status, nor does it mention accommodation details for sleepers, the latter of which definitely needs fixing.

United Airline's Passbook boarding pass has both the seat information as well as "Premier Access" information, together with boarding group info and checkin sequence info. It has every piece of info that a paper boarding pass has, unlike Amtrak.


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## AlanB (Feb 17, 2013)

KrazyKoala said:


> roadman3313 said:
> 
> 
> > Not to change the subject... but do regular E-Tickets actually say Select Plus on them? Didn't realize they ever mentioned "status" per say on the ticket itself. I use Passbook so I haven't actually ever seen/used a paper/printed/Quik Trak/Agent E-Ticket.
> ...


I just pulled up my paid eTicket PDF from a trip this past Thursday and it most certainly does not show my status! Perhaps a reservation paid with points shows the status, I don't know as I don't have such a reservation handy.

I'll have to check later today when I get back home to see if the eTicket printed on Amtrak ticket stock shows my status. But again, the PDF only shows my AGR number, it makes no mention of my status.


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## amamba (Feb 17, 2013)

I have never had a ticket that showed my AGR status on it. I just looked through some e-ticket .pdfs, some paper tickets stubs, and checked the app and the passbook. There is no mention of AGR status anywhere on any of them.


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## Anthony (Feb 17, 2013)

The status usually only shows on the travel document if a human agent on the AGR phone line books your trip for you.


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## KrazyKoala (Feb 17, 2013)

They are for sure working on something though. Pulling up all the tickets still in my email, each one is different in one way or the other. It looks kinda silly once I have them all in one place like this.


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## Matt (Feb 21, 2013)

I just tried this and had no luck.

I'm soon taking a cross country trip from PHL to SEA. What I wanted to do was take the Cardinal PHL-CHI, Zephyr CHI-SAC(or EMY), and the Starlight SAC-SEA, and then possibly the Builder SEA-Essex and spend a couple days in glacier.

I know the zone boundry on Cardinal is CIN, so I was resigned to paying for a ticket PHL-CIN and then starting the award in CIN to save the points. I jumped when I saw this thread! I called AGR and requested WAS-SEA, but the agent said it would be 3 zones. I had to bump my dept back to CIN and buy a ticket PHL-CIN.

The other issue was that the agent said you can only take the most direct routing, even if others show on the amtrak.com regular one way booking screen. She refuesed to allow Card/Zeph/Star and said the only option is Card/Builder straight into SEA. I said thanks but no thanks and ended the call.

I called back and got a different agent. I just requested CIN-Tacoma, WA as the builder doesn't serve TAC. He was very kind and extremely helpful and booked me the routing I wanted. I had to pay for a ticket TAC-SEA, but I guess that's the best I could hope for, so I ate that cost.


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## amamba (Feb 21, 2013)

Matt said:


> I just tried this and had no luck.
> I'm soon taking a cross country trip from PHL to SEA. What I wanted to do was take the Cardinal PHL-CHI, Zephyr CHI-SAC(or EMY), and the Starlight SAC-SEA, and then possibly the Builder SEA-Essex and spend a couple days in glacier.
> 
> I know the zone boundry on Cardinal is CIN, so I was resigned to paying for a ticket PHL-CIN and then starting the award in CIN to save the points. I jumped when I saw this thread! I called AGR and requested WAS-SEA, but the agent said it would be 3 zones. I had to bump my dept back to CIN and buy a ticket PHL-CIN.
> ...


You should try calling back and editing your trip to go to SEA. I bet you won't have to buy that TAC -SEA ticket.


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## Matt (Feb 23, 2013)

amamba said:


> Matt said:
> 
> 
> > I just tried this and had no luck.
> ...


I just called back and got it extended to SEA, so I should be all set now. First LD train trip since the Autotrain 17 years ago!


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## amamba (Feb 23, 2013)

YAY!!!!!


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