# Discount code V851?



## Grill Master (Sep 3, 2008)

After looking at different routes I have decided on taking the Southwest Chief from CHI-LAX. I found the promotion code V851 20% off, sponsored by the red hat society. It says you have to be a member of the society. I just wondering If you by the ticket online and pick it up at the station, are they going to ask to see your membership card?


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## the_traveler (Sep 3, 2008)

They may - or they may not.

I'm not saying to use it, but it's up to your conscience. If your conscience says it OK with using it, you can. Just be prepared that *IF* they ask for proof, and you do not have it, they may make you buy a new ticket at the current bucket! (I personally would rather use something like AAA, NARP or senior - that I'm entitled to use - for a lesser % off.)

But if your conscience says go ahead and take a chance, you may want to.


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## Tony (Sep 3, 2008)

Grill Master said:


> It says you have to be a member of the society.


Remember, Amtrak knows who you are. They can easily provide the Red Hat Society a list of their members who have taken advantage of the discount. The Red Hat Society could always reply back, that you aren't a member.

Fraud is fraud, and fraud is criminal. It all depends on the mood of some specific person at Amtrak to pursue it, or skip over it.


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## Rafi (Sep 3, 2008)

If I'm not mistaken, Red Hat Society members must be women, and when gathering, generally wear purple blouses and red hats. So you'd better dress the part.

Rafi


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## AKA (Sep 3, 2008)

I might pay money to see that. Let me know if you come thru CLE.


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## Grill Master (Sep 3, 2008)

Yeah, I dont look anything like the Red Hat Society. I was just wondering cause it was so easy to put the code in, I thought maybe this was something thats commonly done.


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## RailFanLNK (Sep 3, 2008)

I was at a Red Hat Society get together just last Saturday, there was 84,000 of us. It was for the Huskers game at Memorial Stadium!!!!! :lol:


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## BlueJeanGirl (Sep 3, 2008)

Grill Master sez....I just wondering If you by the ticket online and pick it up at the station, are they going to ask to see your membership card?

What they said, but adding a different perspective...

Perhaps as you purchase the ticket, perhaps not, depending on the ticket agent. If you purchase your ticket through the machine, then no, no-one will ask for proof of discount eligibility at time of purchase.

However, even so, you may be asked to provide said proof at the time of the ticket lift. I routinely ask AAA members, Student Advantage members, and International Students for proof of discount eligibility (as in, "Oh, I see you purchased this on your AAA discount, and it says right on the face of the ticket I need to see your AAA card. Do you have that handy so I can verify this?"), in addition to asking for ID from our randomly-selected passengers (and those who purchased their tickets through the mail, or at the machine.)

In other words, be prepared to provide proof. If you haven't the proof, be prepared to purchase a new ticket (at the on-board fare and current bucket) and you will likely have to surrender the fraudulently-purchased ticket.

Travel light!

~BJG


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## sky12065 (Sep 3, 2008)

BlueJeanGirl said:


> Grill Master sez....I just wondering If you by the ticket online and pick it up at the station, are they going to ask to see your membership card?
> What they said, but adding a different perspective...
> 
> Perhaps as you purchase the ticket, perhaps not, depending on the ticket agent. If you purchase your ticket through the machine, then no, no-one will ask for proof of discount eligibility at time of purchase.
> ...


I presume from your answer that you may be an Amtrak employee and in what you say is in that capacity.

I am a member of both AAA and AARP and have use it on most trips. I never buy tickets at the station or at a kiosk as I use an H rooms. I also usually purge all but necessary items from my wallet before leaving on my trips. Had I accidentally removed one of those membership cards then were made to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars for another ticket because didn't have my membership card, I would have been livid, :angry2: absolutely livid over such action, and all for the relatively small amount saved using one of the membership cards? If anything it should be the equivilent of the discount and not the purchase of another ticket! And what if I couldn't cover the cost of a new ticket? Would you have put a handicapped passenger off the train when you obviouly already had the lions share of the fees?

BTW, If I remember right, the discount is 10% on the coach fare (not sure if it included room) for both AAA and AARP where as its 15% for 62+ senior. Someone please correct me if I'm off on the discount information.


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## AlanB (Sep 3, 2008)

sky12065 said:


> I am a member of both AAA and AARP and have use it on most trips. I never buy tickets at the station or at a kiosk as I use an H rooms. I also usually purge all but necessary items from my wallet before leaving on my trips. Had I accidentally removed one of those membership cards then were made to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars for another ticket because didn't have my membership card, I would have been livid, :angry2: absolutely livid over such action, and all for the relatively small amount saved using one of the membership cards? If anything it should be the equivilent of the discount and not the purchase of another ticket! And what if I couldn't cover the cost of a new ticket? Would you have put a handicapped passenger off the train when you obviouly already had the lions share of the fees?


You might be livid, but you would still be wrong. I quote from the Amtrak website:



> Please note that you must show your AAA membership ID card when you pick up your ticket, and you must carry your card with you onboard the train.


While I think it unlikely that they'd leave you standing at a station, it would be within their rights to do so, since you had failed to follow the rules.



sky12065 said:


> BTW, If I remember right, the discount is 10% on the coach fare (not sure if it included room) for both AAA and AARP where as its 15% for 62+ senior. Someone please correct me if I'm off on the discount information.


The discount is 10% off of coach seating only, it does not include the accomodations. And AARP doesn't get you anything, only AAA or NARP get's you 10%. Being a senior, with some way of proving it like a drivers license, is good for 15% off coach/railfare only.


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## the_traveler (Sep 3, 2008)

AlanB said:


> You might be livid, but you would still be wrong. I quote from the Amtrak website:
> 
> 
> > Please note that you must show your AAA membership ID card when you pick up your ticket, and you must carry your card with you onboard the train.
> ...


Maybe it is in the rules, but I have never been asked to show my AAA card on the train. (Even when I picked up my tickets at the QT.) I have been asked to see the card at the ticket window, but never on the train.


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## AlanB (Sep 3, 2008)

the_traveler said:


> AlanB said:
> 
> 
> > You might be livid, but you would still be wrong. I quote from the Amtrak website:
> ...


I've never been asked for my card either on the train. But that doesn't mean that I leave it at home, as there is always a first time for everything. And since it is required to have the card, I sure wouldn't recommend leaving home without it.


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## OlympianHiawatha (Sep 3, 2008)

I too have never been asked to display my AAA Card (but you do have to give your # when making your res) but I always have it anyways because of all the other discounts you can get with it.


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## sechs (Sep 3, 2008)

I think that we've discussed before using a discount to which one is not entitled. Even if theft sits well on your conscience, on the off chance that you are caught, even the lightest of consequences is not to be desired.


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## BlueJeanGirl (Sep 3, 2008)

sky12065sez.....I presume from your answer that you may be an Amtrak employee and in what you say is in that capacity.

I am a member of both AAA and AARP and have use it on most trips. I never buy tickets at the station or at a kiosk as I use an H rooms. I also usually purge all but necessary items from my wallet before leaving on my trips. Had I accidentally removed one of those membership cards then were made to spend hundreds or thousands of dollars for another ticket because didn't have my membership card, I would have been livid, :angry2: absolutely livid over such action, and all for the relatively small amount saved using one of the membership cards? If anything it should be the equivilent of the discount and not the purchase of another ticket! And what if I couldn't cover the cost of a new ticket? Would you have put a handicapped passenger off the train when you obviouly already had the lions share of the fees?

BTW, If I remember right, the discount is 10% on the coach fare (not sure if it included room) for both AAA and AARP where as its 15% for 62+ senior. Someone please correct me if I'm off on the discount information.

***** ***** *****

Yes, Sky, I am an Amtrak conductor. And while you may be livid, angry, disappointed, or upset when I point out to you that right on the face of the ticket is the statement that your membership card is required (and few discounts are granted on board; most discounts are honored only when your reservation is made 3 or more days in advance of travel), being removed from the train is at the conductor's discretion, for whatever reason. Your attitude plays a huge part in whether I pursue an issue, let it go, or something in between.

If you purchase a discounted ticket, please be prepared to show you are eligible for that discount. If you are unable to show you are eligible for a discount, please be prepared to purchase a new ticket and surrender the ticket you may have purchased inappropriately.

(In reality, I'm most likely to ask you to pay the difference between the discounted fare and whatever fare is standard. I do this with passengers whose grandmother, for example, purchased the ticket, on a senior discount, and the passenger appears to be under the age of 62...again, however, the demeanor, attitude, responses, and general cooperation of the passenger determines how I handle a situation.)

I would humbly suggest that you ensure your paperwork is in order before you travel, including proof of eligibility for discounted fares, to help prevent the potential for an unpleasant traveling experience.

I choose not to pursue or argue this topic any more.

Travel light!

~BJG


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## AlanB (Sep 3, 2008)

BJG,

Just as an FYI, if you click the "reply" button in the bottom right corner of the post you want to reply to, then you won't need to retype whatever the person you are replying to typed. Clicking reply will automatically copy the text for you, and insert some special coding to make it show up as a quote.

Then all you need to do is to roll down to the bottom of the typing box, and start typing your reply after the text that was quoted for you. This should be easier for you than retyping everything, and it makes it a bit more readable for everyone else.


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## sky12065 (Sep 4, 2008)

BlueJeanGirl said:


> Yes, Sky, I am an Amtrak conductor. And while you may be livid, angry, disappointed, or upset when I point out to you that right on the face of the ticket is the statement that your membership card is required (and few discounts are granted on board; most discounts are honored only when your reservation is made 3 or more days in advance of travel), being removed from the train is at the conductor's discretion, for whatever reason. Your attitude plays a huge part in whether I pursue an issue, let it go, or something in between.
> If you purchase a discounted ticket, please be prepared to show you are eligible for that discount. If you are unable to show you are eligible for a discount, please be prepared to purchase a new ticket and surrender the ticket you may have purchased inappropriately.
> 
> (In reality, I'm most likely to ask you to pay the difference between the discounted fare and whatever fare is standard. I do this with passengers whose grandmother, for example, purchased the ticket, on a senior discount, and the passenger appears to be under the age of 62...again, however, the demeanor, attitude, responses, and general cooperation of the passenger determines how I handle a situation.)
> ...


BJG,

Thank you for your response! Perhaps if I realized some of the things you explained to me with your response, (like just charging price "difference") there wouldn't have been my post in the first place.

Putting what I just said aside, there is no argument to be made and truthfully, I have to eat humble pie over this! -_- Yes, I was wrong in what I stated and apologize! But don't ask me exactly why I stated what I did! Although there are a couple of personal reasons that come to mind, I'm still really trying to figure it out for myself and I know that that's not how I would have reacted in reality.

Matter of fact I had a more serious problem than this issue facing me several years ago on an Amtrak trip where I didn't even come close to reacting with a "livid" attitude and Amtrak employees went well above and beyond in resolution of my problem.


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## Walt (Sep 4, 2008)

the_traveler said:


> Maybe it is in the rules, but I have never been asked to show my AAA card on the train. (Even when I picked up my tickets at the QT.) I have been asked to see the card at the ticket window, but never on the train.


I would be more concerned that with a larger, 20%, discount, it might become more likely Amtrak will ask for proof. Plus, being a member of the Red Hat Society is more unusual than AAA, and again, might make it more likely Amtrak will ask for proof.


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## frj1983 (Sep 4, 2008)

On a previous post I had mentioned that I was never asked for my NARP card and I always carry that with me, along with my AARP card, along with my AAA card...hey we could start a whole new acronym thing here at the Amtrak Forum! :lol:

But I always refer back to my Boy Scout training and it's motto: "Be Prepared!"


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## Walt (Sep 4, 2008)

From their website...



> Amtrak invites Red Hat Society members to save 20% off the best available rail fare. Reservations are required at least 3 days in advance of travel. For a complete list of destinations, routes and schedules visit www.amtrak.com or call 1-800-USA-RAIL. Show your Purple Perks Membership card when picking up your tickets.


 (So it is not just any membership, but a Purple Perks membership)


> Not valid for local travel in any Northeast Corridor services, including for Acela Express and Metroliners. Not valid on Auto Train, Joint Amtrak/VIA Rail service and the 7000-8999 series Thruways.





> Blackouts apply November 22-29, 2006; December 16, 2006-January 2, 2007; January 13-16, 2007; February 17-20, 2007; April 13-17, 2007; May 26-29, 2007; September 1-4, 2007.


 (not sure why 2008 blackout's aren't listed. Is the discount still valid?)


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## p&sr (Sep 4, 2008)

BlueJeanGirl said:


> Yes, Sky, I am an Amtrak conductor.


Dear BlueJeanGirl, Welcome to the Group! Great to have you on board.


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## cohusker (Sep 7, 2008)

Hello - My wife used V851 from DEN to LNK and back this summer. (I got the code from flyertalk.com). No one ever asked her to show ID to use the code.


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## Guest (Sep 7, 2008)

cohusker said:


> Hello - My wife used V851 from DEN to LNK and back this summer. (I got the code from flyertalk.com). No one ever asked her to show ID to use the code.


There is still *LOTS* of time left for an audit to catch it, and some uniformed dudes to show up to take your wife away. h34r:


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## sky12065 (Sep 7, 2008)

Guest said:


> cohusker said:
> 
> 
> > Hello - My wife used V851 from DEN to LNK and back this summer. (I got the code from flyertalk.com). No one ever asked her to show ID to use the code.
> ...


Don't worry cohusker, your wife is probably safe from Amtrak; but from Guest, that may be a different story! :lol:


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## Tony (Sep 7, 2008)

sky12065 said:


> Don't worry cohusker, your wife is probably safe from Amtrak; but from Guest, that may be a different story! :lol:


I would be more concerned about the Red Hat Society. They charge for their higher level of membership that gives the discounts like the one with Amtrak. I am sure they will, eventually, check to make sure that a member who isn't paying the extra membership upgrade fee, isn't using (abusing) their discounts.

Of course, the Red Hat Society will quickly find out that your wife isn't even a member at all. 

I would worry! :unsure:


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## Eric (Sep 9, 2008)

I just did a trip from EMY - OMA and I decided to take a chance and use the code. Not only did they not ask for any ID, it does not state on the ticket that it is for Red Hat members only. I also did a onboard upgrade to a Bedroom, no questions asked. Of course, I could of been the lucky one.


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## Walt (Sep 9, 2008)

I think the point is that just because you got onto the train, doesn't mean you are home free. One can still be charged with fraud at any time for the next 4 to 7 years.

The Red Hat Society charges is own members extra, to use the discounts like the one for Amtrak. I can't believe that the Red Hat Society doesn't make any attempt to verify that all users of their discount program, are indeed paying them that extra fee.

I would think that any such verification, will not only highlight a member who hasn't paid the extra fee, but that the person isn't even a basic member of the Red Hat Society either.

*If you really, really want to use their Amtrak discount, then why don't you just join the Red Hat Society, and pay the fee to use their discount program.*


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## frj1983 (Sep 9, 2008)

Eric said:


> I just did a trip from EMY - OMA and I decided to take a chance and use the code. Not only did they not ask for any ID, it does not state on the ticket that it is for Red Hat members only. I also did a onboard upgrade to a Bedroom, no questions asked. Of course, I could of been the lucky one.


Yeah Eric,

But cheating is still cheating and I could see this one day leading to Amtrak stating there is too much abuse of these codes/discounts and getting rid of all of them. So you're helping yourself save some cash but hurting the rest of us! Think about it! :angry:


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## haolerider (Sep 9, 2008)

frj1983 said:


> Eric said:
> 
> 
> > I just did a trip from EMY - OMA and I decided to take a chance and use the code. Not only did they not ask for any ID, it does not state on the ticket that it is for Red Hat members only. I also did a onboard upgrade to a Bedroom, no questions asked. Of course, I could of been the lucky one.
> ...


From what I understand, that is exactly the reason you don't see as many discount codes out there today. there has been a great amount of illegal use of the codes and that leads to revenue dilution for Amtrak. Most of the people mis-using the codes are people who would ride anyway and that simply decreases the amount of money flowing to the bottom line. If you are a railfan and want to see Amtrak succeed, stop thinking of yourself and purchase an honest ticket at an honest price!


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## had8ley (Sep 12, 2008)

sky12065 said:


> BlueJeanGirl said:
> 
> 
> > Grill Master sez....I just wondering If you by the ticket online and pick it up at the station, are they going to ask to see your membership card?
> ...


Even if the poster is an imposter I would rather have the RIGHT ticket than be LEFT at the station


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## The Metropolitan (Sep 12, 2008)

Eric said:


> I just did a trip from EMY - OMA and I decided to take a chance and use the code. Not only did they not ask for any ID, it does not state on the ticket that it is for Red Hat members only. I also did a onboard upgrade to a Bedroom, no questions asked. Of course, I could of been the lucky one.


Matter of fact, I think I saw you boarding at the Emeryville platform.

You're the one on the right, correct?!?

http://l.yimg.com/img.movies.yahoo.com/ymv...ack_lemmon1.jpg


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## PleaseAdviseMe (Oct 6, 2008)

(I'm not blue jean girl , but I am a female!)

I saw this re the Red Hat Society Club and was thinking of joining it, rather than trying to just scam the discount code, but I wanted to be clear about what the discount terms are about- It looks like the % off is based on the regular seat price, not on the upgrades, or am I wrong about that? That's a huge difference. Not sure if it is worth joining the RHS but it was the highest % discount I could find out there- I'm talking a trip that will prob cost me with upgrades close to 1K.

Also I tried to sign up under the registration here as a forum member , but am not getting confirmation emails back,also I have a hard time reading the alpha/numeric codes to sign up though I'm not disabled . I've been on BART once or twice, and on CalTrain once, but never on Amtrak. Thanks for any advice.

Here's what is aw on the Red Hat ladies site:

http://redhatsociety.com/membership/perks/...27828jTXw31F965

*Amtrak Terms and Conditions:

This offer is valid for sale between 12oct07-07dec08 and VALID FOR TRAVEL 15oct07-10dec08. Reservations are required a minimum of three (3) days prior to departure. SEATING IS limited, SEATS MAY NOT BE AVAILABLE ON ALL TRAINS AT ALL TIMES. BLACKOUT DATES APPLY: 09NOV07-12NOV07, 20NOV07-27NOV07, 14DEC07-02JAN08, 15FEB08, 18FEB08, 21MAR08, 24MAR08, 29AUG08, 01SEP08, 25-26NOV08, 29-30NOV08, 01DEC08. THIS OFFER IS VALID FOR RED HAT SOCIETY MEMBERS ONLY. A VALID RED HAT SOCIETY MEMBERSHIP (Purple Perks) CARD IS REQUIRED UPON TICKET PURCHASE. THIS OFFER IS VALID ON THE FOLLOWING TRAINS ONLY: PACIFIC SURFLINER, ANN RUTLEDGE, BLUE WATER, CALIFORNIA ZEPHYR, CAPITOLS, CASCADES, CITY OF NEW ORLEANS, ILLINOIS ZEPHYR, KANSAS CITY MULE, PERE MARQUETTE, SAN JOAQUINS, COAST STARLIGHT, EMPIRE BUILDER, HEARTLAND FLYER, HIAWATHA, HOOSIER STATE, ILLINI, SOUTHWEST CHIEF, ST. LOUIS MULE, WOLVERINE, LINCOLN SERVICE, SALUKI, CARL SANDBURG. OFFER IS NOT VALID FOR ANY NEC/EASTERN U.S TRAVEL. UPGRADE TO BUSINESS CLASS OR SLEEPING ACCOMMODATIONS ARE AVAILABLE UPON PAYMENT OF FULL ACCOMMODATION CHARGES. OFFER IS subject to any restrictions, blackouts, and refund rules that apply to the type of fare purchased and upon which the discount is based. THIS OFFER IS NOT COMBINABLE WITH ANY OTHER DISCOUNT.


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## ALC Rail Writer (Oct 6, 2008)

When I travel I carry a faux black leather passport that has my student advantage card, my student ID, and my state ID all wrapped up in one, plus ticket stubs from the last leg(s). That way if a conductor asks- I just hand them the whole mess. (And only once have I been asked to present this stuff- and I'm wondering if BJG is a certain conductor who tried to ask me for my ID and I just handed her the packet before she finished.)

But I don't think so- it was a random check on the NEC and some conductor on the LIRR had done me wrong the previous day.

I should say that I've never disliked an attendant or conductor based on how I was treated during a trip- however... there is one conductor whom I will hold in the 'Hall of Hatred' for the rest of my life. Stuck up portly wanker... "I run an strict train" (my rear end) it was one of the least organized trips of my life...)


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## TrainVirgin (Oct 6, 2008)

ALC_Rail_Writer said:


> When I travel I carry a faux black leather passport that has my student advantage card, my student ID, and my state ID all wrapped up in one, plus ticket stubs from the last leg(s). That way if a conductor asks- I just hand them the whole mess. (And only once have I been asked to present this stuff- and I'm wondering if BJG is a certain conductor who tried to ask me for my ID and I just handed her the packet before she finished.)
> But I don't think so- it was a random check on the NEC and some conductor on the LIRR had done me wrong the previous day.
> 
> I should say that I've never disliked an attendant or conductor based on how I was treated during a trip- however... there is one conductor whom I will hold in the 'Hall of Hatred' for the rest of my life. Stuck up portly wanker... "I run an strict train" (my rear end) it was one of the least organized trips of my life...)




It was the faux black leather that did it. Next time have it in a _real_ leather passport holder. ;-)

OK, enough with my sick humor. It was me who posted as a guest a few minutes ago asking about the Red Hat Society discount (though at 41 I don't even know if I am old enough for them to let me join!) , the email validation thing might have been slow, I don't know- Anyway, i am thinking about a long distance trip, and was researching trying to get a deal , but it almost seems like some of the various posts I have seen from people looking to get a better rate are kind of met with a little bit of hostility ,as if we are trying to hurt Amtrak or the employees when actually you guys have the monopoly, it isn't like plane fares, there isn't any competition, and I don't see any plans in the works on any huge scale to increase routes or build tracks, never hear about it in the news etc. I certainly don't have anything against Amtrak, I've never even been on a train besides BART and Cal-Train which I hear are nothing like the Superliner/Viewliners. I'm looking forward to it,prob going to get a sleepette as I would have the creeps alone for almost 2 or more days on a train, but of course like almost everyone else, I'm going to look for a deal since it will cost me a fair amount almost 1K at what looks like higher bucket going one way, lower going back - that doesn't make me some kind of shylock coupon criminal. Oh and one more thing, why is it you cant lock the door if you upgrade to a room , I know you can lock it while you are in it from reading stuff, is it just about if it locks and people steal your stuff, there is liability, if it doesn't lock, you take your stuff with you that might be worth anything? Just seems not very private even if you don't have any valuable stuff except maybe a laptop which of course you would keep with you.


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## kashed (Oct 6, 2008)

I've had to show my AAA card once, on the train--the Texas Eagle.

I would never leave home without any card that gets me a possible discount, or, pays for road service since I am usually driving at some point in my trips, and not all my relatives have emergency road service.


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## PetalumaLoco (Oct 6, 2008)

TrainVirgin said:


> .... Anyway, i am thinking about a long distance trip, and was researching trying to get a deal , but it almost seems like some of the various posts I have seen from people looking to get a better rate are kind of met with a little bit of hostility ,as if we are trying to hurt Amtrak or the employees _*when actually you guys have the monopol*_y, it isn't like plane fares, there isn't any competition, and I don't see any plans in the works on any huge scale to increase routes or build tracks, never hear about it in the news etc. ...



Are you thinking this forum is an Amtrak sponsored organization? It isn't. We're just passengers like you.


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## had8ley (Oct 6, 2008)

Just one man's point of view~ if you have to stoop to use a woman's discount and can't (or don't want to) pay the appropriate fare, stay home or start walking.


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## BlueJeanGirl (Oct 7, 2008)

ALC_Rail_Writer said:


> When I travel I carry a faux black leather passport that has my student advantage card, my student ID, and my state ID all wrapped up in one, plus ticket stubs from the last leg(s). That way if a conductor asks- I just hand them the whole mess. (And only once have I been asked to present this stuff- and I'm wondering if BJG is a certain conductor who tried to ask me for my ID and I just handed her the packet before she finished.)
> But I don't think so- it was a random check on the NEC and some conductor on the LIRR had done me wrong the previous day.
> 
> I should say that I've never disliked an attendant or conductor based on how I was treated during a trip- however... there is one conductor whom I will hold in the 'Hall of Hatred' for the rest of my life. Stuck up portly wanker... "I run an strict train" (my rear end) it was one of the least organized trips of my life...)



Alas, 'twas not I who asked for your ID. I've yet to work on the other side of the Mississippi River.

Travel light!

~BJG


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## Green Maned Lion (Oct 7, 2008)

Amtrak's prices, Train Virgin, are such that they lose money on every non-NEC and Auto-Train passenger they carry. If, based on that, you think their prices are unfair, I think you have another think coming. I don't like how high they are, trust me, but I support Amtrak as an organization, and their prices are quite fair.

Second, I have ridden the train many times and have not, in my 15+ years of riding Amtrak trains, and my 20 years of riding trains in general (out of my 24 year life, btw) had something stolen from me. I go sleeper most of the time. They are safe as heck. The reason for no keys? Couldn't tell you. But not having them lock from the outside predates Amtrak as a practice.

I haven't had stuff stole sitting in coach, haven't had it stolen in sleepers, period. Trains are a very safe way to travel. Now, don't tempt fate. If you have a laptop, for instance, keep it in your briefcase. And there is no reason why you can't close the door and curtains to your room. Nobody is entering a room with the door and curtains closed.

Trains are the most civilized form of long distance transportation available in this country. If you have to pay extra for it, trust me, you get what you pay for. No, not just most civilized form- ONLY civilized form.


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## AlanB (Oct 7, 2008)

Green Maned Lion said:


> Amtrak's prices, Train Virgin, are such that they lose money on every non-NEC and Auto-Train passenger they carry. If, based on that, you think their prices are unfair, I think you have another think coming. I don't like how high they are, trust me, but I support Amtrak as an organization, and their prices are quite fair.


Amtrak looses money on every passenger they carry, be it NEC or otherwise, except for state subsidized trains and even then techically someone is still loosing money, just not Amtrak.


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## ALC Rail Writer (Oct 7, 2008)

AlanB said:


> Green Maned Lion said:
> 
> 
> > Amtrak's prices, Train Virgin, are such that they lose money on every non-NEC and Auto-Train passenger they carry. If, based on that, you think their prices are unfair, I think you have another think coming. I don't like how high they are, trust me, but I support Amtrak as an organization, and their prices are quite fair.
> ...


Alas I feel sorry for Amtrak- I can't afford anything but what I pay, and a lot of times I feel guilty that a ticket is in the low bucket- but what's a guy supposed to do?

I guess that just by traveling at all with Amtrak, I am supporting them.


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## Green Maned Lion (Oct 7, 2008)

Naturally, you support them, and they need all the support they can get. I just have an issue with people stealing. Including myself, if anyone remembers that. :unsure:


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## ralfp (Oct 7, 2008)

had8ley said:


> Just one man's point of view~ if you have to stoop to use a woman's discount and can't (or don't want to) pay the appropriate fare, stay home or start walking.


I probably wouldn't stoop to using the discount code, but the fact that it's intended for women only has nothing to do with it. If this club is for women only and the discount is better than any available to men (which seems to be the case), I'd say it's Amtrak that's in the wrong; the appropriate fare should not vary based on sex (or race, religion, etc.) Charging the wealthiest age group less for the same product is one thing; that practice seems to be legal and at least everyone has a chance of qualifying. Giving members of a club that discriminates against sex, race, etc. is going too far; it would seem to violate Amtrak's Code of Ethics (page 4).

How does a group get a discount code? Could group that discriminates in membership on the basis of race, religion, etc. get a deal for a discount code?

Red Hat Society sounds like a club that would be made up of mostly nerdy men (fans of the Linux distro).


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## haolerider (Oct 7, 2008)

ralfp said:


> had8ley said:
> 
> 
> > Just one man's point of view~ if you have to stoop to use a woman's discount and can't (or don't want to) pay the appropriate fare, stay home or start walking.
> ...


I think you are being rather silly, but why not go ahead and apply for membership in the Red Hat Society - they may let you in - I can't wait to see you in your purple dress and red hat.


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## ralfp (Oct 7, 2008)

haolerider said:


> I think you are being rather silly, but why not go ahead and apply for membership in the Red Hat Society - they may let you in - I can't wait to see you in your purple dress and red hat.


As much as I'm thrilled about the prospect of wearing a purple dress and red hat, I cannot join their club, and I don't think I'm being silly. I don't think this is a huge deal either.

Perhaps I'm mistaken, but, as I read it, discounts available only to women are against Amtrak's own rules:



_"Similarly, _
_*business relationships with *_
_competitors, suppliers and _
_*customers of Amtrak*_



_*must always be conducted free of discrimination based on*_
_ race, color, religion, _
_*sex*_



_(including pregnancy, childbirth, or related medical conditions), age, national origin or_



_ancestry, physical or mental disability, veteran status, sexual orientation, marital status or_



_any status protected by law not listed here. All Amtrak employees are responsible for_



_implementing Amtrak’s policy of nondiscrimination._



_..._



_Our values, honesty and standards of conduct do not stop with our actions or at our doors._



_We expect the same from our suppliers, customers and others with whom we do business._

Even if it's the Red Hats that discriminate (and not Amtrak), it would still appear to violate the rules. OTOH it seems that several other discounts (eg senior) also violate their code.


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## Tony (Oct 7, 2008)

haolerider said:


> I think you are being rather silly, but why not go ahead and apply for membership in the Red Hat Society - they may let you in - I can't wait to see you in your purple dress and red hat.


Sorry for being redundant, but I thought at this time it might be the appropriate place to point it out again, that this discount code isn't even intented for all members of the Red Hat Society. It is only for those members who pay extra to be a part of their "*Purple Perks*" program, that get to use this discount (and other "Purple Perks" discounts too).

I guess it would be kind of like using a Sams Club discount, and not having paid for a Sams Club membership.


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## PetalumaLoco (Oct 7, 2008)

I think the Red Had Society deal is a negotiated discount. Any organization is probably welcome to negotiate a deal I would expect. No matter what race, creed, or sex. What's wrong with that?


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## ralfp (Oct 8, 2008)

PetalumaLoco said:


> I think the Red Had Society deal is a negotiated discount. Any organization is probably welcome to negotiate a deal I would expect. No matter what race, creed, or sex. What's wrong with that?


It clearly violates Amtrak's own rules (unless I am misreading them). Whether it's morally, ethically, etc. right or wrong doesn't matter. Amtrak should either change their code of ethics or end the discount.

Would Amtrak negotiate discounts for members of a whites-only club? Does a willingness to negotiate with any other racially-selective club (regardless of race) it acceptable? No and no. (Not that I'm comparing the organization in question to a racist club; I know basically nothing about the group.)

People are free to associate with whomever they please. Amtrak is not and should not be free to do so.


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## Tony (Oct 8, 2008)

ralfp said:


> It clearly violates Amtrak's own rules (unless I am misreading them). Whether it's morally, ethically, etc. right or wrong doesn't matter. Amtrak should either change their code of ethics or end the discount.


Just about every single discount Amtrak offers, discriminates against all those who are not eligible.

The senior and child discount discriminates by age.

The military/veterans discount discriminates by sexual orientation.

The railpass discount discriminates by national origin.


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## PetalumaLoco (Oct 8, 2008)

ralfp said:


> PetalumaLoco said:
> 
> 
> > I think the Red Had Society deal is a negotiated discount. Any organization is probably welcome to negotiate a deal I would expect. No matter what race, creed, or sex. What's wrong with that?
> ...


Write your congressman then.


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## ralfp (Oct 8, 2008)

PetalumaLoco said:


> Write your congressman then.


If this were flyertalk I'd point out that "The captain has turned off the I care sign."


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## Walt (Oct 8, 2008)

Tony said:


> Sorry for being redundant, but I thought at this time it might be the appropriate place to point it out again, that this discount code isn't even intented for all members of the Red Hat Society. It is only for those members who pay extra to be a part of their "*Purple Perks*" program, that get to use this discount (and other "Purple Perks" discounts too).
> I guess it would be kind of like using a Sams Club discount, and not having paid for a Sams Club membership.


I wonder just how many people here, have a counterfeit Sams Club membership card too? Unfortunately, I think several. 

I am disheartened that so many people feel that they have some basic right to a discount. The same discount that other people pay good money to join a discount club or group, to use truthfully.

To me, there is no difference between someone who didn't pay to join the Purple Perk discount program but use their V851 Amtrak discount, from those who have a counterfeit Sams Club membership card and buy merchandise. It is still stealing (or theft of services). Plus, I wonder if one takes Amtrak across state lines by using that ill gotten ticket, if it then becomes a felony. h34r:

I am all for using a discount that is meant for me to use. But this is going way too far.


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## cohusker (Oct 8, 2008)

This past weekend, I took the CZ for a quick weekend trip. I used the V851 code to purchase tickets a couple of weeks ago. I bought the tickets on-line and went to the station to pick up the tickets. I showed my ID to the Amtrak agent and after he printed my tickets, the agent said something like, "Cool, you got a discount." I was NEVER asked to show proof that I could use the code.

So, if Amtrak doesn't care why should I?

By using these codes, I get less AGR points so it takes me a LOT longer to get free trips. Doesn't it even out?

Anyway, I'm prepaired to be bashed, but if I would have gotten caught, I wouldn't have had a problem paying the full fair rate.


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## ralfp (Oct 9, 2008)

cohusker said:


> So, if Amtrak doesn't care why should I?


[if you're male] You're not cheating Amtrak, you're fighting for equal rights. :lol: (Kidding: it doesn't work very well if nobody knows about it).



cohusker said:


> By using these codes, I get less AGR points so it takes me a LOT longer to get free trips. Doesn't it even out?


No. Only if AGR points were worth $0.50 each. Even the best redemption paths get far less than that ($0.10 is really good, $0.03 is normal).


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## p&sr (Oct 9, 2008)

cohusker said:


> but if I would have gotten caught, I wouldn't have had a problem paying the full fair rate.


So you're willing to "play fair"... but only AFTER you get caught?


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## Tony (Oct 9, 2008)

cohusker said:


> So, if Amtrak doesn't care why should I?


Because it is the Purple Perks discount program, and its paying members, who are you really cheating.

And the real point is, why don't you care?


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## haolerider (Oct 9, 2008)

Tony said:


> cohusker said:
> 
> 
> > So, if Amtrak doesn't care why should I?
> ...


I guess the real question is: "Why do you seem to care so much?" This has been beaten to death and if, in fact, you feel Amtrak is violating their internal ethical rules, contact the IG or some other entity and file a formal complaint. The topic is becoming boring on this forum.


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## Tony (Oct 9, 2008)

haolerider said:


> I guess the real question is: "Why do you seem to care so much?" This has been beaten to death and if, in fact, you feel Amtrak is violating their internal ethical rules, contact the IG or some other entity and file a formal complaint. The topic is becoming boring on this forum.


I care because I have a good sense of right and wrong. When I see someone not only sealing, but actually bragging about doing it, I feel I have duty to speak up.

It isn't Amtrak who is violating ethics, but some people here.

And, sorry for being reduant, they are stealing from the paying members of the Purple Perks discount program.

Do I want to file an offical complaint with my local AG office, involving AmtrakTrains.com? No. At this point, I would rather attempt to deal with it amongst ourselves, even if my attempt to do just that, bores you.


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## cohusker (Oct 9, 2008)

Tony said:


> cohusker said:
> 
> 
> > So, if Amtrak doesn't care why should I?
> ...


I have no problem using the V851 code. I highly doubt the Purple Perks is actually losing money from using the code. Do you think AAA has to pay hotels for each time someone uses an AAA code?

When friends/family come into town and I’m too busy to entertain them, I’ll give them AAA card and tell them where to go to get discounts (certain restaurants, etc.) AAA doesn’t lose money and those businesses actually get people in the door. However, I will NOT give my AAA card so they can get towing service, etc. as that actually hits AAA’s bottom line.

I also post coupon codes I get for different products on the web for others to use and I then use codes I find (like V851) so it is a give and take.

A year ago, I had never ridden Amtrak and thought all Amtrak funding by the government was a waste. I thought Bush was correct in attempting to cut all funding for Amtrak.

Then, in an AAA publication, I saw I could get a discount on riding Amtrak. I starting looking into Amtrak, found this site (which is awesome) and the forum on Flyertalk. Someone posted the V851 code and I thought it would be worth 20% off to try Amtrak for a short trip (Feb 2008). I did and fell in love with the train. Since then, I have taken 10+ trips and used the V851 code about 4 times; I have probably saved a total of $50-$75 by using V851. Amtrak has a rider for life and now I want the government to keep funding Amtrak to make it better. I tell all my friends about Amtrak and I have probably gotten 5 people to become riders. So, by using that code, Amtrak has gained thousands of dollars in extra business from me alone.

I also work for a company that gives certain organizations discounts and I, personally, don’t mind if they give them out to everyone. As a business, would I want 0% of a $100 item (as a customer would go to the competition) or 80% of $100 and possibly gain a customer for many years?


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## ralfp (Oct 9, 2008)

Tony said:


> It isn't Amtrak who is violating ethics, but some people here.
> And, sorry for being reduant, they are stealing from the paying members of the Purple Perks discount program.


Are they? Does the club pay Amtrak for each ticket? If not, using the code may be stealing from Amtrak, but not the club or "Purple Perks". They lose nothing, neither actual nor potential revenue, as long as a guy uses the code (women using the code are depriving the club of dues for the Perks program).

The discount may or may not be ethical/legal/worth caring about, but it clearly does violate Amtrak's own ethics policy (unless someone can read it and correct me on that).


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## sky12065 (Oct 9, 2008)

cohusker said:


> When friends/family come into town and I'm too busy to entertain them, I'll give them AAA card and tell them where to go to get discounts (certain restaurants, etc.) AAA doesn't lose money and those businesses actually get people in the door.
> However, I will NOT give my AAA card so they can get towing service, etc. as that actually hits AAA's bottom line.
> 
> Amtrak has a rider for life and now I want the government to keep funding Amtrak to make it better. I tell all my friends about Amtrak and I have probably gotten 5 people to become riders.


I won't address the first part of the above quote. Your conscience should tell you the right and wrong of it!

As for the AAA towing service, I don't know if your indication pertains to when you are with the vehicle or not, but I will quote the following from the AAA site simply for clearification:



*"Who can Receive Service?*


_EMERGENCY ROAD SERVICE IS PROVIDED ONLY FOR THE MEMBER WHOSE NAME APPEARS ON_
_THE MEMBERSHIP CARD. You, as a member, are covered in any vehicle you are driving or are_
_a passenger in, the member is expected to be in the vehicle. Clubs will accommodate members in extenuating circumstances. Service does not cover a particular car nor is service available to any nonmember driving the member's car – even though the non-member may reside in the same household. Associate memberships are available at special reduced rates for qualified persons residing in the member's household."_
 
And on the last item... welcome aboard. All Amtrak converts welcome!


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## Mark (Oct 9, 2008)

This topic comes up time and time again. Somebody finds a magic 'discount code' and asks if they should use it even though they aren't a member of this or that. Then everybody jumps in and we have a great long debate about whether its right, (legally and morally), to use the code or not.

In the end just join NARP, Veterans Advantage or one of the several other associations and use that discount every time you travel. Veterans Advantage costs around $75 per year for my wife and I. One or two trips cover that association cost easily. Doing the quick math, VA saved me about $300.00 last year so the $75 membership fee was plenty worth it.

I feel that Amtrak offers enough discounts to accommodate just about everybody if one take the time to look.


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## Green Maned Lion (Oct 9, 2008)

I'm not getting into this, but people's ability to justify their dishonesty has always amazed me.


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## Joel N. Weber II (Oct 9, 2008)

TrainVirgin said:


> I don't see any plans in the works on any huge scale to increase routes or build tracks, never hear about it in the news etc.


Have you written to your Senators and your Congressional Representative with your thoughts on whether they should fund such expansion?


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## TrainVirgin (Oct 12, 2008)

Joel N. Weber II said:


> TrainVirgin said:
> 
> 
> > I don't see any plans in the works on any huge scale to increase routes or build tracks, never hear about it in the news etc.
> ...



I've written to them about other stuff, but nothing seems to get done about those things! But yeah, never thought things like trains they cared or maybe even could do anything about. Never thought of trains or transportation as political, but I suppose they are/it is!

Kicking myself now for not bookmarking the thread (anyone remember where that is? probably on a stickied thread I missed-duh)that had the layout of the Zephyr so I could see where I will be on the train room wise, upper or lower, etc. I didn't use any coupon codes, I just tried to get dates that had the best deal, even though it meant I had to stay a day or so longer than anticipated where I'm going.


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## AlanB (Oct 12, 2008)

TrainVirgin said:


> Kicking myself now for not bookmarking the thread (anyone remember where that is? probably on a stickied thread I missed-duh)that had the layout of the Zephyr so I could see where I will be on the train room wise, upper or lower, etc.


Here you go, just click here.


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## TrainVirgin (Oct 12, 2008)

AlanB said:


> TrainVirgin said:
> 
> 
> > Kicking myself now for not bookmarking the thread (anyone remember where that is? probably on a stickied thread I missed-duh)that had the layout of the Zephyr so I could see where I will be on the train room wise, upper or lower, etc.
> ...



Thanks A. ! Now I know where I will be, though I'm not sure if it is advantageous or not to be on the top or bottom floor (still wishing I could lock the door to my room so I could go take a shower or something seeing as I will be on the train for what amounts to almost 48 hours , more if running behind). Or at least have lockers. I mean, how does one watch a laptop in the shower? Ahh well, I guess I'll go grungy or improvise in my roomette, ha.

Next thing to try and find is the the internet situation on trains. From what I have searched on already, it appears not to be too reliable, one reason was obvious- you keep moving from one place to another, 2 was the metal of the train itself- #2 sounded like it might be BS because I know you can get internet on planes- some other site said planes can get the signal via satellite (umm, trains could too!) and didn't address the metal blocking signals situations. From what I looked at, it appears to entail getting some gadget- a wireless card and subscription to a service, which would probably be contractual like cell phones or expensive pay as you go, like cell phones- (even though my laptop is this years model and has some wireless junk built-in to detect networks). Is this pretty much right? I mean, I CAN live for 2 days without it, but it would be pretty cool to be able to skypecast while traveling or communicate with people, let them know all is well, etc. Yeah I know it is mixing the modern-coffeeshop-tech-involved-world with the maybe older world of being 'forced' to sit and meet people through accident of fate- but in general I think people would be happy about having the option if Amtrak got some kind of satellite wireless deal going. I'm sure people would pay for it. I would , that's why I'm looking around to see what is out there. I just don't know if I need a 2-yr contract if I'm not a huge traveler (yet!).

Sorry if I am asking too much stuff- I can tell by reading the forum there are Smart People here- my son having the 'engineer's mentality' I can usually recognize when I'm around similar or even possible 'Mensas'. I know my limitations, why torture myself looking for info when someone else already has the answer?


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## ALC Rail Writer (Oct 12, 2008)

All those legit. discounts (Veterans, NARP, Student, ect.) are good all the way around. I use my Student Advantage card for a lot of things beyond Amtrak.

Amtrak's fares a dirt low as it is- we don't need to cheat them out of it.


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## AlanB (Oct 13, 2008)

TrainVirgin said:


> Thanks A. ! Now I know where I will be, though I'm not sure if it is advantageous or not to be on the top or bottom floor (still wishing I could lock the door to my room so I could go take a shower or something seeing as I will be on the train for what amounts to almost 48 hours , more if running behind). Or at least have lockers. I mean, how does one watch a laptop in the shower? Ahh well, I guess I'll go grungy or improvise in my roomette, ha.
> 
> Next thing to try and find is the the internet situation on trains. From what I have searched on already, it appears not to be too reliable, one reason was obvious- you keep moving from one place to another, 2 was the metal of the train itself- #2 sounded like it might be BS because I know you can get internet on planes- some other site said planes can get the signal via satellite (umm, trains could too!) and didn't address the metal blocking signals situations. From what I looked at, it appears to entail getting some gadget- a wireless card and subscription to a service, which would probably be contractual like cell phones or expensive pay as you go, like cell phones- (even though my laptop is this years model and has some wireless junk built-in to detect networks). Is this pretty much right? I mean, I CAN live for 2 days without it, but it would be pretty cool to be able to skypecast while traveling or communicate with people, let them know all is well, etc. Yeah I know it is mixing the modern-coffeeshop-tech-involved-world with the maybe older world of being 'forced' to sit and meet people through accident of fate- but in general I think people would be happy about having the option if Amtrak got some kind of satellite wireless deal going. I'm sure people would pay for it. I would , that's why I'm looking around to see what is out there. I just don't know if I need a 2-yr contract if I'm not a huge traveler (yet!).
> 
> Sorry if I am asking too much stuff- I can tell by reading the forum there are Smart People here- my son having the 'engineer's mentality' I can usually recognize when I'm around similar or even possible 'Mensas'. I know my limitations, why torture myself looking for info when someone else already has the answer?


TV,

I just went west on the Capitol Limited and the SW Chief. I went to meals in the dining car, took showers, and spent hours in the Sightseer Lounge, all with my laptop sitting in my roomette. On the Chief, my laptop wasn't even in my bag, I just left it on the seat covered with a pillow. The key is to 1) not leave things in plain sight, 2) close the curtain on your room as you leave so that no one can see if you are in the room.

And remember that coach passengers aren't allowed into the sleeping cars. So this vastly limits the number of people who actually have access to your room. Just don't leave things out in plain sight and you should be just fine.

As for getting online, that will be tougher without some form of cell connection. You may find Wi-Fi access for a few minutes at stations, but I wouldn't want to count on that. And yes, a cell phone company will want you to join a plan, otherwise you'll pay some hefty connection fees.


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## Joel N. Weber II (Oct 13, 2008)

TrainVirgin said:


> I've written to them about other stuff, but nothing seems to get done about those things! But yeah, never thought things like trains they cared or maybe even could do anything about. Never thought of trains or transportation as political, but I suppose they are/it is!


The United States Congress decides how much taxpayer money to give to Amtrak (along with how many tax dollars to spend on highways and airports), and thus is very much involved in determining just how extensive Amtrak's services are. (A few Amtrak trains have their operating losses covered instead by individual states.)

I've certainly tended to get better responses from my state legislators than my federal legislators when writing to them, but I suspect the number of people contacting each federal legislator about Amtrak has some impact on the total amount of funding Amtrak gets.


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## Green Maned Lion (Oct 13, 2008)

TrainVirgin said:


> Next thing to try and find is the the internet situation on trains. From what I have searched on already, it appears not to be too reliable, one reason was obvious- you keep moving from one place to another, 2 was the metal of the train itself- #2 sounded like it might be BS because I know you can get internet on planes- some other site said planes can get the signal via satellite (umm, trains could too!) and didn't address the metal blocking signals situations. From what I looked at, it appears to entail getting some gadget- a wireless card and subscription to a service, which would probably be contractual like cell phones or expensive pay as you go, like cell phones- (even though my laptop is this years model and has some wireless junk built-in to detect networks). Is this pretty much right? I mean, I CAN live for 2 days without it, but it would be pretty cool to be able to skypecast while traveling or communicate with people, let them know all is well, etc. Yeah I know it is mixing the modern-coffeeshop-tech-involved-world with the maybe older world of being 'forced' to sit and meet people through accident of fate- but in general I think people would be happy about having the option if Amtrak got some kind of satellite wireless deal going. I'm sure people would pay for it. I would , that's why I'm looking around to see what is out there. I just don't know if I need a 2-yr contract if I'm not a huge traveler (yet!).


My father keeps telling me I'm a computer genius and it angers me to all heck. I am somewhat computer literate. I know more about how they work than most, but my programing knowledge ends at C++. I haven't written a program in 7 years. But I will admit I am computer literate and tend to be logical enough to troubleshoot most computer problems. I'm of that younger generation, I suppose you could say.

But boy, I must be a weird one from this generation, because having the internet out there 24/7 bugs me to hell. I keep trying to explain that cellphones have off buttons. I keep trying to explain that when I am not in the mood to chat with people (which is often!) my cell phone is off, and its not somehow evil to turn them off. People are slaves to technology.

I have an old pocket watch in my collection, a key wind Breguet hunter circa 1815. Solid silver. Beautiful piece- its made with attention to detail and care of workmanship people just don't have anymore. It is close to two hundred years old, yet it keeps near perfect time. It fits in my pocket. It has a cover on it, so as not to disturb me with the time should I not be interested in seeing it. This watch, when I use it, serves me. It lets me know what time it is when I happen to care to know.

I have another watch, which I also love. (I used to run a business selling vintage watches) It is a Rolex Oyster Precision (more or less the lowest end model in the lineup- manual wind, no date, not chronometer certified) from circa 1960. Together with my much more modern Omega Seamaster, it makes up what I wear most of the time. I serve the watch. Why? Whenever I see my wrist, I am reminded time passes. Whenever I look at the dial, I am reminded of how much has passed.

When I ride the train, I often take my Texas Instruments LED digital or Soviet Elektronika 2 LED digital. Due to the fact that I have to press a button to display the time, I am not reminded of it so much. (I ain't taking $5k worth of 200 year old horological art on the train!) You should ride the train to experience the world where time and communication doesn't matter so much.

Don't just tolerate not having the internet my friend. Relish in it. I pray Amtrak never implements internet on the long distance trains.


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## Guest (Oct 17, 2008)

I used the code V851 and some 50 year old lady who checked me in saw that I used the code and she made me pay the extra 20%. I had no idea that the code was for Red Hat ladys. I am 19 and male so she didn't even ask for ID.


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