# December Black-out Dates



## Trainmans daughter (Sep 1, 2013)

I had been mulling over taking a trip (my first AGR redemption) right after Christmas to see my kids in Virginia. However, Dec. 28-29 are black-out dates. I had been planning on leaving from here on the 26th and it's a 3 day trip. So I could get as far as somewhere in the middle of a cornfield and then be SOL, right? Or do they go by the start date and let you complete the trip using points?


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## the_traveler (Sep 1, 2013)

Ant blackout dates just mean you can not start OR CONNECT on that/those date(s). But if you are traveling but started before the blackout date, you can continue.

Example: The blackout date is the 13th. You're going from CHI to SLO. If you leave CHI on the 13th, you can't because it's a blackout date. If you leave CHI on the 12th and will be in NM on the SWC on the 13th, that's OK. If you left CHI on the 11th, but had to connect in LAX on the 13th, it's a no because the 13th is a blackout date and you can't board a new train on a blackout date.

I hope this makes sense.


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## Trainmans daughter (Sep 1, 2013)

Thanks for the reply. So I could start out in SAC on the 26th and arrive in CHI on the 28th using points, but I couldn't connect to the CL for the remainder of the trip. I'd have to pay for that segment, right?


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## the_traveler (Sep 1, 2013)

Correct. And your award would end in Chicago. 

But if you could start on Dec 25 (I didn't look to see if that's a blackout date) and arrive in CHI on Dec 27, you could connect to the CL (since Dec 27 is not a blackout date per your original post)! However since you arrive in WAS on the 28th (a blackout date), you could not board another Amtrak train using that award. (I don't know where in VA you're going.) If a train is necessary, you would have to pay for that segment.


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## benjibear (Sep 1, 2013)

However, it would only be a two zone trip into Chicago vs. a three zone trip all the way to VA.


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## Trainmans daughter (Sep 1, 2013)

Leaving on Christmas Day is a good idea, but I'll have to convince my granddaughter (and her mom and dad) of it. Lots and lots of special traditions in their home! I'll have to work on that one because it makes a lot of sense.


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## amamba (Sep 1, 2013)

I did this around thanksgiving. I left the day before a black out date on the silver meteor. I then paid cash for a regional ticket from NYP up to New England.


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## Trainmans daughter (Sep 7, 2013)

Well, I did it. I have the tix for my first AGR redemption trip. I had enough points for 4 zones (2 out and 2 back) and my MIL had enough for 1 zone. But it's a real messy trip, partly due to ignorance and - OK, ENTIRELY due to ignorance!

The trip is from SAC to FBG and returning FBG to CIC with a couple of days touring WAS. The first segment is a 2-zone reward from SAC to CHI. Since I don't know the rules regarding a guaranteed connection on 2 different reservations, we are going to stay overnight in CHI and catch the next day's CL (paid ticket, not AGR award). That way, we can relax and not worry about connecting from the CZ to the CL if there are delays. I couldn't connect through to TOL since that day is a blackout date.

Returning, we will leave from WAS to TOL on my MIL's points. Now here's the "ignorance" part. When I made the reservation for the final 2-zones home, I should have started it in TOL. I totally forgot about the zone line and instead started it in CHI (ending point Chico). So I had to purchase a ticket from TOL to CHI. At 5:22 am, my granddaughter and I will have to switch from our cozy roomette to coach for the final 3-hours into CHI.

In all, we have 6 tickets for this trip:

1. AGR reward from SAC to CHI on the CZ

2. Paid ticket from CHI to FBG

3. Paid ticket from FBG to WAS (spending a couple of days with my ex-daughter-in-law)

4. AGR ticket from WAS to TOL

5. Paid ticket from TOL to CHI

6 AGR ticket from CHI to CIC (via the SWC and the CS, breakfast at Phillipe's during the layover)

Told you it was messy! Now you can all jump on me and tell me how dumb I am and how it should have been done. But remember, this is my first time redeeming AGR points, it's a long trip, I'm 68 years old, and I get my feelings hurt pretty easily so have mercy. I'm just happy to be able to see my Virginia Grands who I haven't seen in over 2 years!


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## AlanB (Sep 7, 2013)

Trainmans daughter said:


> Returning, we will leave from WAS to TOL on my MIL's points. Now here's the "ignorance" part. When I made the reservation for the final 2-zones home, I should have started it in TOL. I totally forgot about the zone line and instead started it in CHI (ending point Chico). So I had to purchase a ticket from TOL to CHI. At 5:22 am, my granddaughter and I will have to switch from our cozy roomette to coach for the final 3-hours into CHI.
> In all, we have 6 tickets for this trip:
> 
> 1. AGR reward from SAC to CHI on the CZ
> ...


I would urge you to call up AGR and speak with an agent. They should be able to modify your segment 6 reservation to start in TOL and in a sleeper. And assuming that your room remains unsold, keep you in the same room. And then they can issue a refund for that paid segment.


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## Trainmans daughter (Sep 7, 2013)

Thanks Alan! I was able to modify the reservation and get a refund for the unnecessary segment. Things are a lot simpler now.


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## the_traveler (Sep 7, 2013)

I second Alan's suggestion. Call AGR ASAP and change your CHI-CIC award to TOL-CIC!

EDIT: You posted as I typed while watching TV.


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## AlanB (Sep 7, 2013)

Trainmans daughter said:


> Thanks Alan! I was able to modify the reservation and get a refund for the unnecessary segment. Things are a lot simpler now.


Good!  I'm happy to hear that. Aside from the inconvenience of moving in the middle of the night, there really is no reason for you to be paying for something that you can get for free. I'm glad you got a good agent who was able to deal with things properly!


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## amamba (Sep 8, 2013)

Great news! Have a wonderful trip.


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## Trainmans daughter (Sep 8, 2013)

Thanks! I will. I can hardly wait!


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## PeterKsfo (Feb 25, 2014)

I was reading this to research more about blackout dates, particularly for connections to thruway busses where you must connect to/from a train. Doesn't make sense to me that they would be blacked out as a connection:

Example I booked the following for last week:

Sat/15FEB - BOS-CHI - non-blackout day - arrive Sun/16FEB

Sun/16FEB - CHI-WMJ - Non-blackout departure - arrive Mon/17FEB

Mon/17FEB - WMJ-WMA - Blackout day - could not book

I mentioned to the Amtrak representative that the only reason that the bus exists from WMJ-WMA is for connecting passengers who are getting off the Southwest Chief at WIlliams Jct. But she advised that because the bus departs on the blackout date, that she could only book me to arrive at Williams Jct.

While a few of the busses sell local seats, most only sell for connections to/from the train, so does not really make sense that the black out departure dates would apply to them, but should be considered an extension of the train - assuming that you had a train departure date on a non-black out date.

Anyone have any thoughts? Think this should be an exception that Amtrak should consider?

Thanks


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## Anderson (Feb 26, 2014)

My advice? Book to ABQ points and then pay ABQ-WMJ/WMJ-WMA. It'll drop the award from a three-zone to a two-zone.


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## fairviewroad (Feb 26, 2014)

PeterKsfo said:


> Anyone have any thoughts? Think this should be an exception that Amtrak should consider?


I agree that WMJ-WMA should be an exception. This is a "Thruway" connection like no other. In your case, you could either take up *Anderson'*s suggestion

about booking to ABQ or simply book your AGR ticket to WMJ. (Others on here can probably better speak to the advisability of booking to WMJ instead of

WMA.)

As for Thruway bus connections generally, I'd hesitate to advocate for a system-wide exemption to blackout dates for reasons of fairness. Why should some

people get to dodge the blackout dates simply because their connection is on a bus rather than a train?


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## Anderson (Feb 26, 2014)

If they were going to do an exemption, it should be "this Thruway can be booked separately if it is being blocked by a blackout date and you have a matching reservation"...basically a special exception to allow an "orphan" bus leg to be booked along with an AGR ticket.

The second option you could use would be to book a "dummy" res FLG-WMA and pull your AGR number off the reward leg. This should yield a two-leg trip (FLG-WMJ-WMA) for <$25, making it one heck of a points run.


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## the_traveler (Feb 27, 2014)

It may be a Thruway, but I don't agree that it should be blacked out. There is no other way to get the 1 mile (or whatever it is) from WMJ to WMA! Even locals in Williams must take this Thruway.

While the pedestrian bridge at KIN was being built, you has to take a shuttle bus (on the roads) to get across the tracks to catch the southbound train. Should that be blacked out too? :huh:


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## Ispolkom (Mar 2, 2014)

PeterKsfo said:


> Anyone have any thoughts? Think this should be an exception that Amtrak should consider?


In my experience AGR agents often have great difficulty enforcing the Rules as Written, without any odd-ball exceptions. Asking them to remember that this particular bus connection is allowed in a blackout date when all others aren't is probably excessive.


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