# EB and Glacier fire?



## pianocat (Jul 23, 2015)

My source for national news right now is less than great since I'm traveling, bit I caught something briefly this morning about a very large wildfire in Glacier. Unclear to me at the moment if it's near the rail lines. Anyone with updated news re possible affect to EB would be much appreciated.


----------



## CCC1007 (Jul 23, 2015)

It is well away from the track, but went from 2 acres to over 4000 acres in a day!


----------



## OlympianHiawatha (Jul 23, 2015)

If I recall the Great Northern runs along the southern border of the Park and if the fire is inside the Park, you should be alright. Of course that is just one more problem being thrown the_* Builder's*_ way.


----------



## montana mike (Jul 23, 2015)

The fire is more than 20 miles north of the BNSF main line. Centered around St. Mary's area and moving east and north. Not a lot of danger to the tracks now, BUT, winds are always fickle around here and just a few hours of NE winds could turn the fire southward into very heavily wooded terrain, which is bone dry (no decent rainfall in over 3 months now).

We are forecasted to have cooler weather with a slight chance of a few light showers this weekend, but also those NE winds. So everyone will be watching carefully.

As of today the East Glacier Train Station is open, but just a few miles to the north just about all of the Park's access is closed to tourists as there are now hundreds of firefighters on the scene. With almost half of the Going to the Sun Road closed now this is really making a mess of enjoying the Park.


----------



## oregon pioneer (Jul 23, 2015)

It's a pity that it sometimes takes days for them to post a perimeter on the fires, but you should soon be able to see it mapped out here: http://www.geomac.gov/viewer/viewer.shtml.

Use the "Jump to Wildfire" drop-down in the upper right, and scroll down to select "Reynolds." Once they put a perimeter on the fire, they update it regularly, sometimes several times a day. You can select other fires, to see what the perimeter mapping looks like.

Ah! Found much more detailed info on Inciweb. Still no map, but there are good details and they will update this whenever there are any changes. They'll post a good map of the fire here as soon as it's available.

Just FYI, I live in a fire-adapted ecosystem. We have fires in the area every summer, and when I used to be an event planner, I used to regularly receive calls asking me if all the roads were closed, and the event cancelled, because of the fires. Only once in the more than twenty years I've been here was a major road into our valley actually closed because of a fire, and that was last year. You can check this out for a little entertainment: http://www.kval.com/news/local/Wildfire-closes-Hwy-26-east-of-Redmond-267218571.html. I was actually glad that my event had ended the year before, so I did not have to answer questions about open roads two weeks later (when the roads were back open and the fire well-contained).


----------



## montana mike (Jul 23, 2015)

21 miles (of a total of 52 miles) of the GTTS Road are closed now as are some of the lodges and several major campgrounds in the Park and dozens and dozens of trails are now off limits to visitors. The Park service's policy is to let these fires burn-as they are a part of the natural process of the forest-while just protecting structures and other infrastructure. A fire like this could easily grow to 50,000 acres or larger if the dry and windy conditions persist. Less than 10 years ago we watched as over 250,000 acres of the Park and adjacent wilderness burned. An amazing sight and it was smoky in the Flathead valley for weeks. We have close friends who have a cabin inside the Park (their family were legacy inholders) and those fires came within 100 yards of their cabin! As I mentioned before, the onset of winter may be the key factor that finally puts this fire out. If the perimeter of the fire goes outside the Park the firefighting teams fight the fire very differently and do everything they can to stop it. While the Park itself is heavily forested, just outside the eastern boundary in the Blackfoot Reservation, it is mostly rolling prairie with almost no trees at all, so that may help them stop this fire as it pushes eastward.


----------



## pianocat (Jul 24, 2015)

Thanks everybody for the information! I have a much better understanding now of what's going on realizing of course that things can change on a dime. We are headed to Walla Walla tomorrow and there's a fire just east of there so I imagine will see the smoke. OP, appreciate the links! And MM, thanks for educating a midwesterner who didn't understand there are different ways to fight fires, or not as the case may be .


----------



## montana mike (Jul 24, 2015)

Enjoy your travels!


----------



## oregon pioneer (Jul 24, 2015)

pianocat said:


> Thanks everybody for the information! I have a much better understanding now of what's going on realizing of course that things can change on a dime. We are headed to Walla Walla tomorrow and there's a fire just east of there so I imagine will see the smoke. OP, appreciate the links! And MM, thanks for educating a midwesterner who didn't understand there are different ways to fight fires, or not as the case may be .


Oh, you will definitely be able to see the smoke from Walla Walla. Just look on geomac.gov for the Blue Creek fire, perimeters are posted for that one. Looks like it is headed away from town, but it's closer than the Glacier one to where you will be passing. You will get a good feel for how life goes on, as long as the wind is blowing away from you, and you are not on the road with all the fire traffic!


----------



## CHamilton (Jul 25, 2015)

> Glacier National Park officials shepherded visitors who had planned to visit the popular sights on the closed portions of the park's main Going-to-the-Sun Road to other areas of the park. They encouraged people with upcoming trips not to cancel their plans.
> 
> "The rest of the park is spectacular, it's beautiful and there is no impact whatsoever," park spokeswoman Denise Germann said.


Cold front headed toward Glacier park fire zone


----------



## montana mike (Jul 25, 2015)

While it is indeed true that most of the Park remains unaffected by the fire, the fact that the GTTS Road is closed from Logan Pass to the east entrance is a big negative, since this road is the primary way people move from one side of the Park to another. Yes, you can drive on US 2 around the southern perimeter to get to the West side of the Park, but it is not the same experience. Anyone who has been to Logan Pass will agree!

Another day of fairly strong westerly winds and just a few isolated showers. Nothing to help the fire fighters. The "cool" front will drop temps--always a plus--but not much rain is forecasted for our area (Trace amounts in the Valley and less than 1/4" in the adjacent mountains). The one mitigating factor which should keep the spread of this fire down, is that the primary growth direction of the fire is east, which takes it eventually away from the heavily forested lands and onto the rolling grasslands, which should be somewhat easier to fight, IF the wind doesn't stay strong. At 10% contained as of midday today that's progress.

After a few cooler days, the latter part of next week and the weekend are forecasted to be around 90 degrees in the Valley and around 80 in the Mountains with more windy, dry conditions. August is typically the month our fire season starts, since it is usually sunny, very warm and mostly dry. One positive note about our drought in NW Montana, we haven't had very many fires started due to lightening strikes. Just NO T-storms almost the entire summer.


----------



## CHamilton (Aug 4, 2015)

On a related topic: a wildfire has closed Washington Hwy 14 near Wishram, which may affect train 28(4).


----------



## montana mike (Aug 4, 2015)

The latest on the Reynolds Fire in GNP: 67% contained, BUT the GTTS Road is still closed from Logan Pass all the way to St. Mary's at the East entrance. It is so dry here in NW MT that only the hoped for late Fall rains and snows are going to finally put out any fires that have started this summer. Related to this, our stream flows on many of our major tributaries in NW MT are the lowest ever recorded. We have lived in MT for 13 years and have been coming here for double that time and have never seen anything quite like this. The combination of very hot temperatures (three records over 100 and two others at 99) and bone dry weather has been a deadly combination. The smoke has been very dense at times, making any views of the Park difficult for many travelers on the train. The good news is most of the rest of the state has had a "normal" summer and much lower fire danger.


----------



## CHamilton (Aug 4, 2015)

CHamilton said:


> On a related topic: a wildfire has closed Washington Hwy 14 near Wishram, which may affect train 28(4).


It looks like train 28 got through the fire area in Roosevelt, WA, successfully. They lost an hour, but Amtrak's status maps are showing them proceeding well.


----------



## CHamilton (Aug 4, 2015)

montana mike said:


> The latest on the Reynolds Fire in GNP: 67% contained, BUT the GTTS Road is still closed from Logan Pass all the way to St. Mary's at the East entrance. It is so dry here in NW MT that only the hoped for late Fall rains and snows are going to finally put out any fires that have started this summer.


Mike, are you suggesting that the GTTS may not reopen this summer at all? I was planning to take a friend to the park in September, but maybe we should postpone until next season.


----------



## andersone (Aug 5, 2015)

Sad to hear of this destruction,, but Mother Nature always wins.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 5, 2015)

CHamilton said:


> montana mike said:
> 
> 
> > The latest on the Reynolds Fire in GNP: 67% contained, BUT the GTTS Road is still closed from Logan Pass all the way to St. Mary's at the East entrance. It is so dry here in NW MT that only the hoped for late Fall rains and snows are going to finally put out any fires that have started this summer.
> ...


The local Park people would love to re-open the GTTS road, BUT until that fire is put out it is too close to parts of the road (plus there are still almost 400 firefighters and dozens of pieces of equipment using the road to move equipment and people in and out of the fire zone. We need a couple days of soaking rains-which are not in the forecast-in order for the fire to be called out. Right now, while the fire has not expanded much since last week, it continues to burn all of the available timber that was not consumed in the initial runs (likely several thousand more acres). IF no other fires are started in the area (this one was most likely "man-caused" btw), the firefighters may be able to get the fire under sufficient control to allow the Park to re-open the road at some point. I would hope this would be the case. If I hear anything from the local Park folks about a reopen date I will post it. We are planning a trip to Waterton in Sept and normally would use the GTTS Road as the quickest and shortest route, but I may have to detour around the Park on US 2. The Western half of the Park plus the Two Medicine area is mostly unaffected by the fire and one can now access Logan Pass, just not anything to the East of that point.


----------



## CHamilton (Aug 5, 2015)

Thanks very much, Mike.


----------



## andersone (Aug 5, 2015)

The good part (if there is one) of the drive on 2 is a stop for dinner at Isaac Walton Inn - great food and gratuitous train spotting.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 5, 2015)

I agree. We usually find an excuse to stop by Izaak Walton for their Huckleberry Cobbler and to watch the many BNSF freights go by at very close proximity and perhaps an Empire Builder too!


----------



## andersone (Aug 5, 2015)

I found the Walton to be one of the most enjoyable meals in all of my travels. Have always wondered what it would be like to stay there,,,, alas it is only 1,940 miles from here,,,,


----------



## Paul CHI (Aug 5, 2015)

andersone said:


> The good part (if there is one) of the drive on 2 is a stop for dinner at Isaac Walton Inn - great food and gratuitous train spotting.


Buffalo burgers, mmmm

One of the world's best dining spots for train watching.

The Inn has been under new management since the last time we visited - higher prices now. No elevators in the main lodge btw.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 5, 2015)

andersone said:


> I found the Walton to be one of the most enjoyable meals in all of my travels. Have always wondered what it would be like to stay there,,,, alas it is only 1,940 miles from here,,,,


We have stayed at the Inn several times-both winter and summer. As you know it's a railroad buffs haven and the rooms, while refurbished to modern standards, reflect what it was like when the GN crews stayed there many years ago. If you really want to splurge you can stay in a completely outfitted BNSF locomotive close to the main Inn. It's actually very, very nice inside. And of course they have a number of cabooses across the tracks for the adventurous folks who wish to relive the days when there was a caboose on every freight train!

Basically, they have accommodations to suit just about any fancy.

As mentioned separately there is no elevator, but the main floor is handicapped accessible from the parking lot.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 8, 2015)

Update on the Reynolds Fire in Glacier National park:

1. The GTTS road was re-opened on a limited basis (9 AM to 7 PM daily) on the east side. But it is still subject to periodic closures due to fire fighting equipment and fire activity.

2. The fire itself is unfortunately growing again. About a 10% increase in the size today. The forecast for most of next week is not helpful--very warm, windy with perhaps a few dry and perhaps slightly damp T-storms (less than 1/4 inch total rainfall forecast for the Park for the next two weeks at best).

3. Many trails on the east side remain closed, but the boat trips out of St. Mary will be operating again.

For people planning to travel to GNP this summer/fall be prepared to see quite a different aspect of Nature's natural processes in full view. The fire has blackened and burned a huge area along and across the GTTS road on the east side and it looks very stark and sad, but still most interesting.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 10, 2015)

Glacier Fires Update as of 8-10:

1. Reynolds Creek Fire is still only 67% contained, but as stated earlier the GTTS road is open now--Day use only.

2. A new fire erupted Sunday-Thompson Creek Fire, now grown to over 500 acres and no control. This is 8 miles north of US 2 at the South end of the Park. The Empire Builders should not be interrupted due to this fire, but some hiking activities in the Park will likely be suspended in the area of this new fire, which could grow rapidly given the conditions.

The weather forecast for the week is very hot and continued mostly dry. Just a few T-storms, with little or no rain. This summer of heat and miserable drought continues in NW Montana.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 12, 2015)

8-12 Update: The Thompson fire has now grown to over 11,000 acres (in just two days). While it is North of US 2 and the BNSF tracks by about 8 miles, we know the railroad is watching this closely because of the possibility that the fire could eventually effect BNSF operations. We could see the massive smoke plume in Whitefish yesterday afternoon, and we are 30 miles away from the fire! Currently the fire is totally uncontrolled and because of the rugged and steep terrain there is not a lot the fire fighters can do to put it out. In off the record comments one firefighter shared he said that the winter snows will be the main factor that puts this fire out as they do not have the manpower or the ability to stop this fire from spreading. Anyone who has visited the southern part of GNP will understand his comments. It is mountainous terrain (8-10 thousand foot peaks, no roads, few trails and very heavily forested).

More dry T-storms are forecasted over the next several days with little relief expected from the heat (90-100) and very low humidity.


----------



## CHamilton (Aug 12, 2015)

Thanks for the continued updates, mike. I'll be on the Builder in a couple of weeks, and will be watching carefully.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 12, 2015)

Safe travels-You may get quite a show, especially if you go thru the Park during darkness.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 13, 2015)

8-13 Update: Sadly two NEW fires have now started just outside Libby. One on Plum Creek land, the other on Forest Service land. Both apparently lightning caused (we have several dry T-storms Tuesday evening in that area). Both are fairly small now (around 100 acres), but expected to grow. Since they are east of Libby not sure how they will effect BNSF and Amtrak, but they bear watching, since they are not that far away from the BNSF tracks.

The Thompson fire continues to grow to the NE and is not effecting anything but additional trails in the Park at this time. The main effect now is a lot of smoke and a huge plume that has become a media attraction. It rose up to 40,000 feet at times yesterday!

The bottom line is more smoke and more fires expected over the next 30 days as our fire season continues to ramp up, with no relief in sight (unfortunately high winds and hot temps forecasted for today and Friday with only a slight chance of rain Friday (more wind than rain) with more sunshine for next week.


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 13, 2015)

Our trip on the Builder to GPK is 6 days away... We are watching this nervously.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 14, 2015)

So far the fires have not closed most of the Park attractions, BUT it is smoky some of the time-depending on the wind direction. The locals are referring to this "bonus" as added "ambiance". We had more, mostly dry, T-storms this afternoon. Not a lot of lightning, but almost no rain either. Should be cooler temperatures but still mostly dry when you are in the Park.

My BNSF folks say that even though the number of fires are increasing almost daily in the Pacific NW, so far almost all of their tracks have not been effected.


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 15, 2015)

Thanks for keeping us updated! Looks like the Thompson fire was slightly downsized in acreage, but a new one up at Goat Haunt sparked. Firefighters sure have their hands full!


----------



## montana mike (Aug 15, 2015)

Yes, the initial estimate was a SWAG, the latest sizing was done by GPS. I did put up an impressive plume for a while yesterday before the strong winds and clouds moved in. The T-storms yesterday and last night in our area dropped almost no rain, but according to the local news media started another dozen or so fires in NW MT. We now have 55 active fires burning in MT, many in our part of the state. No extreme weather forecast the next 7 days-that's good, but no measurable rainfall forecast either-that's bad. Smoke is definitely a factor now with so many active fires. We woke up to a nice pleasant breeze and temps in the upper 50's and smoky, red skies. My BNSF contact said they are really watching this situation very closely as some of the new fire starts could eventually cross BNSF tracks at several locations in the coming days and weeks. The USFS also announced this AM that their resources are spread so thin that unless a fire is threatening life and property some of these fires are just going to be allowed to burn.

Other than the above we are having a great time here in Western MT!


----------



## JayPea (Aug 15, 2015)

I'm staying here in Bozeman on my way back home from a road trip to the Black Hills and it is extremely smoky here.


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 15, 2015)

JayPea said:


> I'm staying here in Bozeman on my way back home from a road trip to the Black Hills and it is extremely smoky here.


A couple of my friends left Bozeman this afternoon and their flight to Denver was delayed due to the smoke in the area from the Montana Fires.


----------



## TUMBLEWEEDTRANSIT (Aug 16, 2015)

On EB today. Train was held in Minot for approximately 40 minutes due to brush fires by the tracks to west of Minot. Fires were put out but we were warned that train brakes could reignite them. Goslow rules may be in effect depending on conditions


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 17, 2015)

Any word on the Sheep/Granite fires that have formed the "Thompson-Divide Complex?" The Sheep fire seems to be moving NE "towards the highway" (Hwy 2), which can't be good...


----------



## montana mike (Aug 18, 2015)

There are now several smaller fires that are indeed close to US 2, and thus the BNSF main line. I just looked at the USFS update. These fires are going to be very difficult to contain because they are in extremely rugged and steep terrain, and of course all of the timber is bone dry, plus the added kicker that there are many beetle killed trees in the area of these new fires. They are holding a meeting later today at Izaak Walton Inn to discuss the situation. Hopefully more information to follow.

The USFS announced late yesterday that there were at least seven fires in MT that they were letting burn because they now have NO resources available to deal with them and as of now, none of these fires are endangering people or major property assets. The forecast continues to be warm and dry, with frequent windy periods all week, and once again a slight chance of mostly dry T-storms around Friday, then back to windy and slightly cooler temps for all of next week. We just can't catch a break here.


----------



## andersone (Aug 19, 2015)

I am sure glad I went to GNP last summer,,,, so far no trouble for YNP which I am headed to next week,,, my prayers for those in the area,,, may they all come away safe


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 19, 2015)

We catch 7/27 this afternoon to GPK... Hope all remains as is/improves. The Sheep fire seems to have gone from 3 miles NW of Essex to 3 miles S, which is very concerning.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 19, 2015)

More windy conditions, with a limited chance of light rainfall forecasted for the end of this week. The USFS just moved to Stage II fire conditions, which further restricts access to forest lands and essentially stops all campfires and some other outdoors activities like construction and certain off road vehicle use. Many locals are surprised we are not already into Stage III, which shuts down access to all forest lands. It is THAT dry here. Perhaps after Labor Day, and many of the tourists have gone home the final Stage will be imposed. We can begin to appreciate what some of the folks in CA have gone thru now. NW MT is on track for the driest year since they started keeping records back in the 1880's!

We are fortunate that a big fire to our NW is just north of the BNSF main line tracks. The prevailing winds are causing it to expand to the NE and not toward the BNSF tracks--at this time. A shift in the winds could change all of that, but for now the trains are still moving thru without too much difficulty.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 19, 2015)

PM Update 8-19: The two new fires just a couple miles either side of US 2-and very close to Essex and the Izaak Walton Inn are being watched closely. They are currently small (both less than 100 acres), BUT a fire weather warning is in effect for Friday, with strong winds and additional dry T-storms expected, which could dramatically increase the size of the fires. Currently the USFS is not able to do any fighting of these two fires due to the very steep terrain (I have hiked in this area-very dense forest land, lots of downed trees, beetle killed trees and snags) and no roads. Local residents have been informed they should be prepared to leave on little notice in the coming days. BOTH of these fires may pose a serious threat to the BNSF main line by Friday if the weather predicted materializes.

Grim.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 19, 2015)

Late Update 9 PM August 19th: The local USFS firefighters are mobilizing to try to protect the structures in and around Essex (including the Amtrak stop, the Izaak Walton Inn and a number of private residences) from the growing Thompson Fire Complex (which now stretch from just south of the Essex area into the southern part of the Park). BNSF has stated that they are concerned about the Avalanche Sheds and one major wooden trestle on their main line thru the south end of GNP. There is heightened concern that both the Essex area and a portion of US 2 and the BNSF line will be effected at some point by these fires, which are still uncontrolled and growing each day. A significant wind event is forecast for Friday, which could cause the fires to rapidly increase in size and this could shut down both parts of US 2 and the BNSF main line. My local BNSF guy said there really is not a lot they can do to protect the avalanche sheds and the trestle. They are in heavily forested areas and would like burn along with the forest around them. If these are torched and destroyed (which is still hopefully not likely) this could cause a major disruption in BNSF freight movement and cancellation of Amtrak Empire Builder service for an indefinite period of time. This is still a worst cause scenario, but until yesterday was not even on the radar. It is so smokey in the Flathead Valley right now in many places that it is like driving thru dense fog. Some parts of the Park are fine, while others are filled with dense smoke. It all depends on winds. As the fires grow though more areas will become smokey.


----------



## East Minneapolis NP (Aug 20, 2015)

I'm supposed to pass through that area on the Friday evening 7, traveling MSP-SEA. What will happen if the track gets closed? Will my train detour, or will they put us on buses at Shelby, or what? I pretty much need to be in Seattle by 3 PM on Saturday. 7 has been arriving in SEA mostly on time recently but this fire might really ruin my weekend as I am booked to be in Seattle for just Saturday afternoon until Sunday afternoon and taking the 8 back east on Sunday.

Surprisingly, last-minute airfare is pretty reasonable and I could just do that, but that is just from MSP. I'd hate to get on the 7 tonight and get into Montana only to have it cancel there, or get horribly delayed making my entire trip worthless. Unfortunately these are saver tickets so I would only get a refund if the train cancels, as far as I know.

Also, if the 7 that is supposed to arrive SEA on Saturday cancels, is this the same equipment that operates the Sunday 8? Would I be affected in both directions? Any tips are appreciated. I've never dealt with any Amtrak cancellations or diversions before.

Edit: I guess I can cancel a Saver fare and get a travel voucher, so at least I wouldn't lose everything. Do you think I should just do that?


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 20, 2015)

Well nuts. We are on 7/27(19) right now, leaving GPK on Sun morning via 8/28. I really hope these fires stay put- I don't know what options we'd have if the tracks close.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 20, 2015)

As of this AM the Governor has declared a state of emergency throughout the State, which allows the MT National Guard to be mobilized. The area around Essex was told last night that residents must be prepared to leave on a moment's notice due to the expanding fires (now three very close) in their area. Firefighters were pulled off one of the fires yesterday due to active burning and torching that was threatening the men. BNSF has hired additional private firefighters to try to protect the wooden trestle and snow sheds that are in the path of the expanding fires.

As far as what will happen, it is anyone's guess and things can change very rapidly. You may be perfectly fine, or Amtrak and BNSF may have to stop train ops with no notice. If Friday's forecast of strong winds and little rain bears out it could be very bad for the folks in the above areas. We are all hoping that somehow we get measurable rainfall and no lightning--but this may be wishful thinking. We are currently under a Red Flag fire warning for today and Friday btw.

Meanwhile to our west-and also a possible effect on BNSF tracks-- the numerous other fires continued to increase in size last night. While they may not immediately threaten BNSF/Amtrak operations, if the fires continue to burn and expand, these blazes could also shut things down from the west next week.

The smoke was so thick in the Flathead valley this AM that visibilities were down to around a mile in many locations. It smelled like you were inside your backyard BBQ grill!!


----------



## montana mike (Aug 20, 2015)

stageman12 said:


> Well nuts. We are on 7/27(19) right now, leaving GPK on Sun morning via 8/28. I really hope these fires stay put- I don't know what options we'd have if the tracks close.


If you are only going as far as East Glacier you may be fine--except for the smoke issues I mentioned. People with travel plans to Essex are the ones "on the bubble" today, as the Inn may have to evacuate and shut down at any time. Friday could be a big day--good or bad. So please everyone hope for some measurable rainfall and no lightning!!


----------



## JayPea (Aug 20, 2015)

I just read that the special firefighting train BNSF has stationed in Spokane was dispatched to the Essex area.


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 20, 2015)

Yep, we're staying at East Glacier Lodge tonight through Sun morning. Will be keeping a wary eye on the west and hoping for rain!


----------



## neroden (Aug 20, 2015)

It's times like this I wish the North Coast Hiawatha route was still running.


----------



## East Minneapolis NP (Aug 20, 2015)

I decided it was too risky to take the 7(20) considering the time-sensitive nature of my trip. I'm sure glad I stumbled onto this forum and thread as I would have had no idea of the fires. Took the eVoucher and booked a non-stop itinerary on Delta instead for only $303, not bad for short notice. It's a bummer I'll be missing the train journey but I'll use my eVoucher in the spring or so. At least I get a 767 on my way back to MSP (now if only I can get a window seat).

Thanks again for the heads up.


----------



## Ispolkom (Aug 20, 2015)

Goodness. We're on 28(31) from Portland to Minot the week after next. This is on the home stretch of a Halifax-Quebec City-Montreal-Schenectady-Chicago-Kansas City-LA-Portland-Minot-St. Paul odyssey. I'd hate to get stranded in Portland, but of course my possible inconvenience nothing compared to what the people in Montana are suffering. I'll just live in hope.


----------



## andersone (Aug 20, 2015)

i hope they can rescue the treasure of the Walton if need be,,,,, that place is just COOL,,,,,,,


----------



## montana mike (Aug 20, 2015)

Now over 100 active fires in Montana. I am sure the IWI people and the firefighters will do everything they can to save the place. The nearest fire is less than 2 miles away now. When this is all over I am afraid that area may look different than it did before the fires. The cabins and cabooses across from the tracks may not be as fortunate, as they are all located in heavy timber. My BNSF contacts say BNSF is mobilizing a lot of people and equipment to try to keep the line from being significantly damaged. Aside from the snow sheds and the wooden trestle there is a fairly high potential of having literally hundreds of large trees topple down onto the track beds as the fire passes thru.

Keep the rain dances going and let's hope for some relief--soon!



andersone said:


> i hope they can rescue the treasure of the Walton if need be,,,,, that place is just COOL,,,,,,,


----------



## Karl1459 (Aug 20, 2015)

As I recall the Inn and the BNSF yard office are pretty defensible. With lots of water available from the fire train they should be able to make a stand and those buildings should be OK. The metal cabooses might do OK if they can safely get water on them when the flame front hits. Hopefully they are prepping them by cutting all brush near them. The wood caboose is iffy as are the cabins, and the rest of the village has a LOT of trees so they will have major problems if this turns into a crown fire. The other good things are that the village is steeply down hill from the forest side, and any fire front should move slower from that direction as fires tend to try to spread uphill.


----------



## East Minneapolis NP (Aug 20, 2015)

KPAX out of Missoula says the BNSF mainline at Essex has been closed.


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 20, 2015)

7/27(19) will not be allowed past Shelby,MT. Our first trip to Glacier in 18 years and we may never make it.


----------



## East Minneapolis NP (Aug 20, 2015)

Is the train holding at Shelby indefinitely or is it cancelled with buses coming in? I'm wondering what happened to anyone heading to Seattle. I really dodged a bullet here. I wonder how far 7(20) will operate.


----------



## Ispolkom (Aug 20, 2015)

US 2 is closed as well in Marias Pass, so no bus bridge.


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 20, 2015)

They've found some busses but not enough for everyone. Those of us going to E Glacier are ok, as are the Seattle/Spokane crowd. They need 1 more bus for the other people heading between those two spots. This is turning into quite the adventure/roller coaster of a day...


----------



## East Minneapolis NP (Aug 20, 2015)

At least Shelby is on I-15 so the longer-distance buses can just take 15 and 90. I imagine people headed to West Glacier, Whitefish, and Libby (not to mention Essex) have it the hardest.


----------



## eblkheart (Aug 20, 2015)

This might be repeatitive, but I just saw this posted in a FB group. This is from BNSF directly:


----------



## Lonestar648 (Aug 21, 2015)

Looks like the EB will be disrupted for a while. Bad summer for the western LD trains.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 21, 2015)

If the trestle burns (which we hope BNSF is successful in defending) it will be more than just a long summer. While there is some rain in the forecast, lightning is also part of the equation, then back to hot and dry weather for at least 4-5 days thereafter. We just cannot catch a break this summer.


----------



## Ispolkom (Aug 21, 2015)

I'm looking at Amtrak Status Maps, and am confused by what I see.

Train 7(19), which was stopped at Shelby last night, now picks up at Ephrata, Washington at 6:26 a.m. Did the poor passengers on that train get bussed between Shelby and Spokane, and then put on the consist for 8(20)? That train is shown as a disruption after Ephrata.

Ouch! I'd be pretty unhappy about an overnight, 400+ mile bustitution, even though it certainly isn't Amtrak's fault.

I notice that Amtrak will still selling me a ticket to travel tonight between St. Paul and Seattle, and 7(20) is still heading west.


----------



## jis (Aug 21, 2015)

Train Tracker shows that 7 is at Edmonds about 2 hours late and train 8 is sitting in Shelby. Looks suspiciously like a bus bridge may be in place between Shelby and Spokane or some such.


----------



## Lonestar648 (Aug 21, 2015)

It is a bus bridge between Spokane and Shelby (400+ miles, about 8 hours). Since the bus is about 80 minutes faster than the EB, they can try to keep the EB close to being on-time.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 21, 2015)

I am wondering how they are getting across the Continental divide, since US 2 is now closed due to the numerous fires, leaving the only route to travel I-15 South to I-90 West-that is a long way out of the way! There are other smaller fires which may cause issues as well close to I-90. The smoke is so thick in the Flathead Valley the air is now unhealthy and it is difficult to breathe at times. We have lived here a long time and have never seen it this bad. During midday yesterday even though there were no clouds the smoke obscured the sun to the point that all we saw was a very dark red "spot" in the sky. At noon it looked like early evening.

BNSF has definitely shut normal operations down along the entire stretch from about Shelby to Spokane. They have positioned a large contingent of fire fighters and water tankers in Essex. Evacuation notices have been given, since the first fire threatening Essex was 1/4 of a mile from the Izaak Walton Inn as of about 9 AM this morning. With winds expected to reach almost 40 mph this PM, with little rainfall expected (the local weather guessers said we might see up to a tenth of an inch of rain) things are looking grim. Over 70 fires just in Flathead County now!


----------



## CHamilton (Aug 21, 2015)

Mike, I am so sorry for you and your neighbors. I'm on my phone, so I don't have a way to post this, but maybe someone can grab it from Facebook. https://m.facebook.com/friends/center/suggestions/?mff_nav=1&ref=bookmarks#!/photo.php?fbid=10206448788211802&id=1632044064&set=a.1480591828070.66442.1632044064&source=48&ref=bookmarks


----------



## oregon pioneer (Aug 21, 2015)

Mike, many of us here in Oregon are in the same situation, and I can sympathize mightily. I have never seen it like this, nor in every northwest state from northern CA to Montana at the very same time! And the worst part of it is, I see no end to years like this.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 21, 2015)

According to some of our native American historians and the Forest Service people in Western MT there have indeed been times when our area suffered droughts for up to 10 years at a time. The 500 year old Cedar Trees in the park have clearly shown that fact (with relatively minor dry spell in the 1930's and several big ones in the 1700 and 1800's), so perhaps we are indeed on the cusp of another dry period. Bummer.

I was communicating with USFS people locally today and they say "containment" of these many, many fires really will not happen until we get a major shot of precipitation, which may not occur until mid to late October at the earliest. They are so overwhelmed with the number of fires that there is no chance that they can be all addressed without Mother Nature's help. My BNSF contact told me this AM that they were told the service interruption on this portion of their route structure could be a long one and that BNSF has already shifted freight travel to reflect this. He said it could be a while before we see freight trains going thru Whitefish again. He would not give me any thoughts as to whether they meant days or weeks. My guess is BNSF is not going to take any chances with multi-million dollar trains and cargo as long as active fires are all over western MT and so close to their tracks. I counted well over a dozen active fires that either are currently or could soon effect their tracks just in NW MT.


----------



## Lonestar648 (Aug 21, 2015)

Route is I-90 from Spokane to MT 200 to I-15 to Shelby, MT - 6 1/2 hours 420 miles without any stops.


----------



## Ispolkom (Aug 21, 2015)

Looking at the published pictures, I can't imagine how you would establish a fire line in that kind of terrain. I'm so sorry for you, Mike, and everyone else in the fiery West. For once winter can't come fast enough.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 21, 2015)

Yes, that is indeed an alternative, especially in good weather. But the smoke is so thick in parts of this route it is like driving in dense fog (Roger's Pass can be really slow when this happens). MT 200 is also close to several fires and while it is open now may be subject to closure or at least slowdowns due to fire fighting efforts in the coming weeks. We just drove the stretch between US 93 and I-90 days ago and several fires can be seen fairly close to the highway and the smoke is very thick. It may not be long before the only alternative is I-15 to I-90, and even that route may be in jeopardy around Lookout Pass at some point--there are THAT many fires around here. And to just make our day today the vigorous cold front making its way thru here has a broken line of mostly dry T-storms that are showing dozens of lightning strikes but no measurable rainfall as the front moves into far northern MT this PM.

PS: US 2 is now closed at West Glacier and East Glacier, except for fire emergency personnel and a few residents. In addition to the fire that is now burning very close to Essex, two other fires are now threatening the Marias Pass area and are expected to reach US 2 (and thus the BNSF tracks) within the coming week, especially given the forecast.


----------



## Rail Freak (Aug 21, 2015)

My thoughts & prayers are with all you folks affected by this!!!!


----------



## rusty spike (Aug 21, 2015)

We were fortunate enough to have visited Whitefish (arriving on Amtk from PDX) and Glacier National Park last summer, then renting a car and driving the GTTS road and U.S. 2 back to Whitefish, including a stop at Essex.

It is just an exceptionally beautiful area and I am dismayed and extremely saddened by reading this thread and other reports on these fires. Unfortunately Mother Nature has to do what she has to do.

My heartfelt sympathies and prayers are with MontanaMike and neighbors in NW Montana and especially to the courageous men and women who are out there on the front lines of these fires. May they return home safely.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 21, 2015)

So glad you enjoyed our area. I guess the important thing to take away is that hopefully all residents and firefighters will remain safe during this crisis. The trees will eventually (50 years) grow back.


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 21, 2015)

Absolutely pouring in E Glacier right now. Am praying some of this is making it's way to Essex!


----------



## Lonestar648 (Aug 21, 2015)

Prayers for all those affected by the fires and the fire fighters risking their lives to battle the fires.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 21, 2015)

The showers were most welcome tonight, but sadly very spotty and brief. The Flathead Valley got almost no rain (we live close to Whitefish and had perhaps 30 minutes of light, but steady showers-enough to wet the ground. The airport received 3 hundredths of and inch of rain). But hopefully the mountains in and around GNP received at least measurable amounts! No relief for places to our west though, still very dry there. Every drop counts. Now we can look forward to frost Sunday morning followed by more 90 degree heat much of the week next week--crazy weather to be sure.

Note: BNSF is letting some of their trains (no oil trains btw) thru the route that goes thru Marias Pass this evening, BUT they may close it again on a moment's notice. As of this evening I do not believe any Builders were going to be allowed thru and parts of US 2 are still closed. Three fires are within a couple miles or so of their tracks now and while no fire has engulfed any tracks yet they are so close caution is the word. With light NE winds the next 24 hours this should slow any northward progress of the fires towards the tracks and give firefighters a chance to build some lines of containment. We shift back to critical fire danger again likely Monday thru the rest of next week, so no rest for the weary.


----------



## NDJollyMon (Aug 21, 2015)

Thanks for the updates. Many of us are watching this topic closely. I spent 32 years as a career Firefighter...I know the devastation it can cause. Stay safe and good luck! Keep those updates coming if you can!


----------



## montana mike (Aug 22, 2015)

Saturday AM Update: The rain last night did help slow the fires down. Yea! US 2 is open this morning with a pilot car guiding people thru the effected areas-no stopping is allowed. BNSF has given the go ahead for Amtrak to run the Builders thru Marias Pass for now, with the caveat that this could change with little notice. BNSF has done a lot of prep work on the trestle and snow sheds (wrapping, sprinklers, water tanks, et. al.) to mitigate any fire that comes thru. With temps scheduled to go back into the 90 degree range by Monday and a mostly dry southwest wind flow beginning Sunday and continuing all week, critical fire danger elements will be back in play shortly. The USFS still expects there is a good chance that at least one of the two of the fires just south of US 2 may reach and cross the highway at some point this week given the forecast.

Personal Note: This is the first day we have seen "blue" sky in perhaps 5 days. A wonderful sight to see.


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 22, 2015)

Glad to hear about the break Mike! Hope it continues for ya'll!

Maybe Montana should consider changing it's Motto from "The Big Sky Country" to "The Smokey Sky Country!".


----------



## montana mike (Aug 22, 2015)

jimhudson said:


> Glad to hear about the break Mike! Hope it continues for ya'll!
> 
> Maybe Montana should consider changing it's Motto from "The Big Sky Country" to "The Smokey Sky Country!".


LOL

While wildfires are a way of life in the Rockies this summer has been one for the record books. The media has been interviewing people who have been here all of their lives, going back to the 1920's and no one can recall a summer that had so many record high temperatures, coupled with almost no rain and now the record number of fires. I guess we hit the trifecta this summer!!


----------



## crosshair428 (Aug 23, 2015)

I've got a trip scheduled on the EB from Wisconsin to Whitefish in the middle of October. Any thoughts on whether this will still be an issue?


----------



## west point (Aug 23, 2015)

Hey now we already have the "Smokies" here in NC & TN.


----------



## AmtrakBlue (Aug 23, 2015)

crosshair428 said:


> I've got a trip scheduled on the EB from Wisconsin to Whitefish in the middle of October. Any thoughts on whether this will still be an issue?


It's Mother Nature. No one can accurately predict Mother Nature that far in advance.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 23, 2015)

crosshair428 said:


> I've got a trip scheduled on the EB from Wisconsin to Whitefish in the middle of October. Any thoughts on whether this will still be an issue?


Normally October is one of the best times to travel thru our area. On one hand we would hope that the wildfire situation would have largely settled down by then, but on the other hand with the forecasted "El Nino" this Fall and winter, that usually means dry and mild conditions for our area, which could mean the fires still continuing. I would just watch the news closely and hope that we at least get some rainfall between now and then. If someone had told me we would get less than 1/2 inch of rain over the entire summer I would have said they were crazy, but that appears to be the case and why we are in such a predicament now.


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 23, 2015)

8/28 picked up at E Glacier no problems this morning. Sad to be leaving the area , and we hope the situation improves quickly!


----------



## Rail Freak (Aug 23, 2015)

stageman12 said:


> 8/28 picked up at E Glacier no problems this morning. Sad to be leaving the area , and we hope the situation improves quickly!


How was your stay?


----------



## stageman12 (Aug 23, 2015)

Rail Freak said:


> How was your stay?


It was great! Fri was very smoky, but after the rain/snow came through, Sat was extremely clear. Can't wait to come back for longer! Currently sitting on 8/28 waiting on freight traffic. Running 90 min late right now.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 23, 2015)

We had about a 24 hour reprieve from the smoke here in the Flathead valley. The smoke started coming back in last night and most of the day smelled of smoke, but not yet as bad as last week. Some BNSF trains are being run thru Marias Pass and the EBs are being allowed thru as well.

9 PM Update: The Sheep fire is now within 1/4 mile of the BNSF tracks just outside Essex. It apparently grew by several hundred acres today and more active growth is expected tomorrow. With several days of hot dry weather forecast along with increasing SW winds things do not look good.


----------



## andersone (Aug 24, 2015)

If the fire is within 1/4 mile of the tracks at Essex, it has to literally be that close to the Inn .. I can only assume it is closed, I worry more that is safe


----------



## Karl1459 (Aug 24, 2015)

If the fire is creeping down hill in low brush it is likely the railroad tracks will be a fire break. My guess is the Inn is being used as a crew base and conmmand post for Forest Service/BNSF firefighting efforts.


----------



## west point (Aug 24, 2015)

Have often wondered why buildings in fire prone areas do not have a rood sprinkler system. Water in the roof could suppress embers but not a full blown fire. Of course a standby power source for water pump would be needed since fire might destroy power lines..


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Aug 24, 2015)

Izaak, you are in my thoughts, prayers, wishes and whatever else might be of some assistance.

Montana Mike: Thanks for keeping us updated. :hi: You too are in my thoughts, prayers, wishes and whatever else may be of some assistance. Stay safe from the trifecta!


----------



## montana mike (Aug 24, 2015)

Monday PM Update: BNSF has used a special train to bring in more firefighters and equipment to the Essex area. It is clear both the railroad and the Forest Service people are going all out to try to protect assets in that area. Several large containment lines are being constructed immediately to the South of Essex and a lot of fire retardant has been laid down in front of the approaching Sheep Fire. It's really up to the weather now. The forecast for this entire week is warm and dry with increasing southwesterly winds. Just what we didn't need. But there are now hundreds of firefighters in Essex area to make a stand. Let's hope their efforts are successful.

Meanwhile just a few miles down the road the Granite Fire is within a few miles of US 2 (and thus the BNSF tracks). There as well the BNSF and Forest Service crew are constructing substantial fire lines and may even consider back burning if the winds are favorable.

The air quality in the Valley is now in the very unhealthy range. We are literally surrounded by dozens and dozens of small and large fires over all of NW Montana. Like being inside our Weber grill all of the time, so outside activities are limited now. Bummer.


----------



## andersone (Aug 25, 2015)

Thanks again Mike for the update. Sounds like it is all hands on deck to save the Walton. Is there any danger for the Belton on the west?


----------



## montana mike (Aug 25, 2015)

andersone said:


> Thanks again Mike for the update. Sounds like it is all hands on deck to save the Walton. Is there any danger for the Belton on the west?


No danger for Belton-yet. The fire threatening Essex is to the East of West Glacier by enough miles that the likelihood of this fire spreading West is very small. If there are no more new fire starts, the West Glacier area should be OK, but that is a big if, since everything is so dry and all it will take is one lightning strike or a careless cigarette to start another fire anywhere now. The Glacier Rim fire, which was less than 10 miles from West Glacier happened early enough in the season that the firefighters were able to contain that fire at around 300 acres. Thursday and Friday are likely to be very challenging days, as the winds are forecasted to increase.


----------



## andersone (Aug 25, 2015)

Thanks those places are dear to my heart


----------



## NDJollyMon (Aug 26, 2015)

9 more days to EB #27, GFK to VAN. Fingers crossed the fires don't disrupt my river cruise plans! (Columbia River)


----------



## montana mike (Aug 26, 2015)

The amount of manpower and equipment both the USFS and BNSF are putting into this fight is something to behold. Hundreds of firefighters, dozens of bulldozers and other heavy pieces of equipment and several helicopters are up at Essex. They are wrapping buildings, clearing literally thousands of trees away from just south of the BNSF main line tracks and hauling the timber away daily. The wooden trestle has been fitted with sprinklers and hoses have been laid all over the Essex area. The main fire remains just south of Essex and has been moving slowly to the North.

A few very small spot fires have been reported in the immediate Essex area; all successfully put out, but the smoke and ash are a constant issue. BNSF is ferrying men and equipment and water tanks daily mostly from the Whitefish area on a special train. A good amount of BNSF's normal traffic flow has been diverted to other routes during this crisis, so this has helped.

Thursday and Friday appear to be very critical for this area. Temperatures today got into the mid 90's in the Valley and even around 90 in the Essex area (about 15 degrees above normal). Thursday and Friday should be even warmer and very dry (RH around 10-15%) with more winds out of the SW. The smoke was not quite as bad in the Valley today, or perhaps we are just getting used to it, not sure now........


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 26, 2015)

Thanks for the reports Mike! Hope the Good luck continues and Fall gets there soin!

Wonder if BNSF might consider keeping the trees cut down close to the track on an ongoing basis like Cities do with trees and power lines?

Is this private land or RR ROW they are working on? I'm not familiar with Montana Law concerning property and Public Safety Hazards, that's why I ask!


----------



## montana mike (Aug 27, 2015)

They are cutting large swaths of trees down on the South side of the tracks. The land is both privately owned (even some IWI land) and part of the Bob Marshall Wilderness. I was trying to get a copy of the image in our local paper showing how close the fire is to the IWI. Very close. The official USFS web site stated "less than a mile away". The local news media stated this AM that it was just across the tracks in some spots-yikes. My gut feeling is that they should be able to save the Inn and the BNSF buildings and trestle, given the huge amount of effort being exerted, but we are all worried about Friday, as yet another dry cold front passes by with more lightning and strong winds.

BNSF does have a tree trimming program in place along this stretch of track, but not to the extent that they and the USFS are doing now in the Essex area. It is a double edged sword. The trees help anchor the soil and ground along the tracks to minimize rock falls and mud slides. As you are likely well aware it is pretty steep along much of that route through the south edge of the park and any vegetation that can gain a foothold is a plus to lower the chances of mud slides in the summer and avalanches in the winter.

Meanwhile the fire complex that is South of Libby has tripled in size recently and could, in a week or so threaten roads and tracks in that area, although the terrain there is less forbidding than around Essex. Never a dull moment here. We will all be so glad when we finally do get some rain and cooler temperatures and winter comes to put an end to what has been a nightmare of a summer.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 27, 2015)

Here is an image, taken from the Izaak Walton Inn yesterday. As you can see the fire is indeed very close. My wife and I go snowshoeing each winter in the very areas that are currently ablaze!

:-(


----------



## oregon pioneer (Aug 27, 2015)

Yikes!

Is the wilderness boundary right by the tracks? And are they actually cutting trees within the wilderness? I know they have a special dispensation here where I live, right now, on the Canyon Creek Complex, Fire, to use chainsaws in the Strawberry Mountain Wilderness (so it can be done in case of emergency).


----------



## montana mike (Aug 27, 2015)

The RR has a certain amount of Right-of-way, the Inn owns a portion of the land, plus some of the other land is privately owned, but yes some of the land to the south of the tracks is part of the National Forest and the BMW and they are indeed logging that as well. I believe when people's lives and property are threatened the government does indeed waiver the normal firefighting procedures. US 2 also cuts right between the Park and the BMW as well.

PS: The County Sheriff just ordered the evacuation of Essex. The fire is getting too close now and so far efforts to stop the fire have not been entirely successful. Bummer......


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Aug 27, 2015)

Yes, the rules on what can and can't be done in a wilderness area can be waved in an emergency.

Whatever happens, the area is going to look pretty different after this.


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 27, 2015)

Wow, evacuation of Essex sounds ominous! As we've said, best of luck to everyone in the NW, hopefully it will rain and cool off soon!

Thanks for keeping us posted, be Safe!!


----------



## yarrow (Aug 27, 2015)

as of an hour or so ago, essex is under mandatory evacuation. the residents were given 1 hour to leave. we have lived in the woods in e. washington since 1976. worst fire season anyone around here has seen


----------



## montana mike (Aug 27, 2015)

montana mike said:


> The RR has a certain amount of Right-of-way, the Inn owns a portion of the land, plus some of the other land is privately owned, but yes some of the land to the south of the tracks is part of the National Forest and the BMW and they are indeed logging that as well. I believe when people's lives and property are threatened the government does indeed waiver the normal firefighting procedures. US 2 also cuts right between the Park and the BMW as well.
> 
> PS: The County Sheriff just ordered the evacuation of Essex. The fire is getting too close now and so far efforts to stop the fire have not been entirely successful. Bummer......


The main line of the fire is now less than 1/4 mile from the BNSF tracks according to the USFS spotters. Some firefighters have been pulled back from logging activities to try to protect the buildings. As I said in my 3:15 PM message the Sheriff ordered mandatory evacuations. None to soon given the imminent threat to all in this area. Once this is all done (and who knows when that will be given the grim Fall and winter forecasts for our area) the once pristine and spectacular Marias Pass area will indeed look a lot different for many decades. We often drive guests thru the Moose Fire (71,000 acres) area, on the west side of the Park, which burned 14 years ago and while there are many signs of life and small (6 foot high) trees covering at least some of the burn area, it still looks like a war zone 14 years later.


----------



## oregon pioneer (Aug 27, 2015)

yarrow said:


> as of an hour or so ago, essex is under mandatory evacuation. the residents were given 1 hour to leave. we have lived in the woods in e. washington since 1976. worst fire season anyone around here has seen


Yes indeed, and the first time in my memory that it has hit all the NW states (Montana, Idaho, Washington, Oregon and northern California) badly, at the same time.


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 27, 2015)

What Climate Change?

I'm no scientist as the "snake oil" salesmen politicians and their moronic supporters say, but even Alfred E. Neuman would be worried!!!


----------



## JulietEcho (Aug 27, 2015)

Looks like the rail line has been shut down until further notice. I just called Amtrak because I'm scheduled to be leaving MSP on the EB tomorrow night, but they haven't made any changes to itineraries beyond today, yet. Will have to hope for the best and see what happens in the next few hours...


----------



## montana mike (Aug 27, 2015)

jimhudson said:


> What Climate Change?
> 
> I'm no scientist as the "snake oil" salesmen politicians and their moronic supporters say, but even Alfred E. Neuman would be worried!!!


We had a very bad Fire Season about eleven years ago and another bad one in 2012 and both years actually burned more acreage than we have so far this year (we were here then as well), but 1910 was by far the worst fire year. Historians refer to that summer as The Summer Montana Burned. Well over 1 million acres torched just in MT. Similar weather patterns occurred during those years, which we unfortunately do have every once in a while, especially during El Nino years. Our issue this year though was three fold, which we did not experience during the past two higher than normal fire seasons: (1) below normal snowpack in NW MT because of the El Nino developing last winter, (2) the driest spring and summer (so far) in NW MT in 100 years, (3) hot, hot, hot (7 record high temps in Kalispell this summer thanks to the "Super El Nino" developing). During 2004 and 2012, even though there were many fires (a lot of T-storm activity), NW MT had close to normal rainfall and we experienced normal summer temperatures and the fires that did occur, while huge, were not near most population bases. This year all we have to do is look at a tree and it explodes!!!


----------



## going to the sun sue (Aug 28, 2015)

Mike..Any more updates on the fire? Hoping for good news..Thanks


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Aug 28, 2015)

I've been wondering too.


----------



## HenryK (Aug 28, 2015)

Latest (4 pm EST Friday) from the Great Falls Tribune:

http://www.greatfallstribune.com/story/news/local/2015/08/28/fire-closes-essex/71317490/


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Aug 28, 2015)

Thanks HenryK! :hi:

Looks like Essex hasn't burned YET... :help:

Maybe Montana Mike has volunteered on the fire lines? :huh:


----------



## going to the sun sue (Aug 28, 2015)

Thanks Henry for the update


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 28, 2015)

Maybe Mike is getting evacuated too!


----------



## montana mike (Aug 28, 2015)

I appreciate your concern. Just a busy day to take care of other important things here. So far no fires threatening Whitefish. The smoke is worse here in the Flathead Valley today than in the past. Visibility is often down to a mile or less and almost everyone notices their throats getting raw from breathing the smoke filled air-which remains in the Very Unhealthy category. Some of our Whitefish fire department people have been in Essex helping to fight the fire today. The feedback from them is there has been minor spotting of small fires in and around Essex, but the main fire line is not quite there-yet, but it is within a few hundred yards of the tracks in several areas! BNSF and USFS crews have removed thousands of trees and built several fire breaks, but against strong winds they would be of little or no use. Winds of over 40 mph from the SW (the worst possible direction) are forecasted for tomorrow with no measurable rainfall on the horizon for yet again at least another week. This is getting really old. It's like we are living in a desert here (record low stream flows for all rivers in NW MT--the lowest ever recorded). So low that many rafters and kayakers can't even use some parts of the Flathead river, which we have not seen before. Other than one 6 hour period of rain on June 2nd there has been essentially no measurable rainfall in almost all of NW MT since mid April. More small fires have popped up in the Bob Marshall Wilderness over the past couple days as well. The other news is the Fire complex now only 8 miles from Libby (read BNSF main line and Amtrak station) grew a lot today and is marching towards that town.

US 2 remains closed and BNSF trains are only being allowed thru sporadically and most freight service has been diverted. Interesting to see all of the freight cars backed up in the Whitefish yard right now.


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Aug 28, 2015)

Thanks Mike! :hi:

Wish it was better news. As you said earlier, once it finally starts raining again, that will bring its own set of problems.

I've wanted to hike in the Bob Marshall Wilderness since I was a teenager. Hopefully there will be something left once all this craziness ends.

People with breathing disorders must be really hurting.

Good luck and stay safe.


----------



## going to the sun sue (Aug 28, 2015)

Thanks Mike for the update..coming to east glacier in 3 weeks..hope it will be better by then..Stayed in that engine in Essex.Hope the Inn and other homes will be spared..such a beautiful area..take care


----------



## montana mike (Aug 29, 2015)

Update on Fires in NW MT: (1) The fairly good news is that the high winds forecast for this area have not materialized, yet. The Sheep Fire knocking on the door at Essex has so far been held just south of the BNSF tracks thru incredible efforts by over 500 fire fighters and equipment. (2) The not so good news is that the complex of fires just SW of Libby has grown rapidly today and they are now evacuating some homes just to the SW of Libby. This fire has the potential to threaten Libby and of course the BNSF main line at some point this week.

The cool front will apparently come thru here this PM dry, as has been the case all summer. No measurable rainfall forecast for our area, just wind.


----------



## going to the sun sue (Aug 29, 2015)

Thanks again for the updates""what else can go wrong..now Libby..it seems like Essex is not out of harms way yet..hope things change for the best


----------



## montana mike (Aug 29, 2015)

The winds were strong for only about 2 hours this evening. Whew. Also no rainfall (bad) or T-storms (good) when the front passed. but in that 2 hours they did stir up some of the fires-especially the one SW of Libby and a new large fire on the east side of the Park (requiring an immediate evacuation order for the town of Heart Butte, about 600 people). More than 500 total fire fighters (USFS and BNSF), 4 Helos, dozens of pieces of heavy equipment are doing all they can to keep the Sheep Fire from burning down the BNSF facilities, the IWI and the town of Essex. What may happen is a successful defense of the IWI and most of the homes in Essex and the fire could literally "burn around" the heavily defended town and continue on North into the Park. Once it spots across US 2 and the Flathead River the terrain is very steep and it would be difficult to stop.

The Empire Builder's schedule is going to be disrupted periodically for quite some time as the spokesperson for the USFS said today that these fires will likely take several months to extinguish, and only then with great help from Mother Nature.


----------



## west point (Aug 30, 2015)

Any one know if the fires are taking out commercial power?. Can imagine that BNSF could loose signals if signal maintainers cannot bring in portable generators. Dispatchers might be hard pressed to run sections of a dark RR.


----------



## NW cannonball (Aug 30, 2015)

west point said:


> Any one know if the fires are taking out commercial power?. Can imagine that BNSF could loose signals if signal maintainers cannot bring in portable generators. Dispatchers might be hard pressed to run sections of a dark RR.


Good question. AFAIK the power lines run near US 2. Anybody know more?

Also, has there been a national emergency declaration to allow funding for this disaster zone?

PS - thanks Montana Mike for the ongoing updates - hope the smoke don't take too much off your lifetime, and thank you for your reporting.

Also, I've seen the remains of human habitations after a crown fire. The garage is obvious - a slab of heat-expanded chalky-looking what was concrete with a puddle of metal that was the riding mower. Also the kitchen is easy to spot, the melted remains of appliances. And a few piles of dirty glass where the windows were. Zero remains of above-ground structure. Zero.

Hoping Essex and IWI are saved -- but -- how it is for the people on the the ground - residents, firefighters -- I'm an atheist, but I'm praying.


----------



## JulietEcho (Aug 30, 2015)

I just went through Essex on the EB last night. No schedule disruption because of the fire. Was on the north side of the train, so I didn't see the fire, but I did see that Essex is still standing! Empty, but there.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 30, 2015)

They shut the power off in the Essex area as a precaution. I was somewhat surprised they are letting the EBs thru at the moment, given the proximity of the fire, but that's BNSF's call. My local BNSF guy says they have rerouted the "majority" of freight traffic away from Marias Pass and of course are not allowing any oil trains thru this area. Images today show the fire line literally a couple hundred yards from the tracks at several locations in the Essex area! The power supplying the signals thru the pass is mostly underground (that may be due to avalanche concerns mainly).

There is a huge power line complex from the Hungry Horse Dam (one of the largest hydro plants in the US), which is perhaps 20 miles to the west of Essex). This dam supplies power to not only NW MT, parts of ID, but to Washington state as well. It is not currently threatened, but if that failed a lot of people, including NW MT would be without power.

The governor declared the entire state a disaster area about a week ago with a special emphasis here in NW MT.

We were so very fortunate that we did not get the strong winds that were forecasted last evening. I just wish we had received some rain!! We might get a little rain today as another front passes by-every drop counts. The area fire incident commander said yesterday that he could use a thousand more firefighters in NW MT, but resources are spread so thin that they are just not available.


----------



## going to the sun sue (Aug 30, 2015)

Thanks Juliet for that post..Essex and Glacier are so dear to my heart...I really hope it doesn't cross hwy 2 into the park..I will be on the EB in 2 weeks...but just to East Glacier..take care


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Aug 30, 2015)

JulietEcho and montana mike,

Thanks for the updates! :hi:

I'm glad to hear things are not worse than they are.

Anyone know a non-lightening rain dance, how to seed clouds, both, or _something - *anything*_ - to make it rain?


----------



## NW cannonball (Aug 30, 2015)

Thinking many people homeless would gladly scrape the ground for firebreaks. Not qualified firefighters, but qualified firefighters are all sweating and have busted their gutz already.


----------



## JulietEcho (Aug 30, 2015)

You're welcome for the updates.  I have my fingers crossed that the rain we're rolling through this morning makes its way east, and soon.


----------



## Ispolkom (Aug 30, 2015)

I also appreciate the updates. I've been following this thread as we've been crossing the continent. We're waiting inLA for the Coast Starlight, and I'm still wondering if we'll be able to take #28 on Tuesday.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 30, 2015)

We will hope your EB on Tuesday makes it thru the fire areas. The resources they have brought to bear on Essex may very well save that enclave, but many locals are concerned today about the fire complex just a few miles from Libby. That terrain is heavily wooded and just as bone dry.


----------



## Karl1459 (Aug 30, 2015)

NW cannonball said:


> Thinking many people homeless would gladly scrape the ground for firebreaks. Not qualified firefighters, but qualified firefighters are all sweating and have busted their gutz already.


I disagree. Most, if not all "homeless" people are afflicted with some combination of mental issues, physical issues, and chemical dependency issues. Anywhere near a fire line is not the place do deal with those issues, especially if becomes an emergency which could easily consume more resources than the "homeless" would provide. Those "homeless" who were anywhere near able likely got the word and have been hired, trained, and are on the fire lines anyway.


----------



## CHamilton (Aug 30, 2015)

I am getting ready to leave Chicago on my way west back to Seattle. But as much as I would like to be on the Builder, I decided to go via the Zephyr and the Starlight instead. I will be thinking about everyone who is traveling and living in the fire area. Best wishes to all of you.


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 30, 2015)

Is Montana using the National Guard? Lots of States activate them to help in Emergencies?

The Gov is CIC of the States Guard, maybe he could call them upto help the worn out Firefighters and RR workers???

I'm sure the Feds will help with funding and Emergency help too, is FEMA involved yet???


----------



## Ryan (Aug 30, 2015)

Yes.

http://www.krtv.com/story/29827168/montana-national-guard-deploys-for-fire-fighting-mission


----------



## JayPea (Aug 30, 2015)

Here in Eastern Washington we have had rain, glorious rain, most of the day along with much cooler temperatures. Hope this heads to NW Montana too!


----------



## montana mike (Aug 30, 2015)

The front went thru dry last evening (just gusty winds for a couple hours), but today we are having a few scattered showers and Thunderstorms in the area (so far just a Trace of rain) along with breezy winds. Some moderate showers appear to be with the T-storms, but also quite a few lightning strikes in the Mountains again. We just can't seem to get any solid period of rainfall here. Normally in the summer time we will get some showers and T-storms with measurable rainfall about every 4th or 5th day (not this year for sure!!). After August, which ends tomorrow, we dry out (Sept and Oct are our driest months of the year in MT) and have to wait until Pacific storms start coming in to Washington and Oregon in early November. As the fire incident commander stated in his AM media statement today-this fire season will be a very long one for us in MT.

Forecast is for sunshine and warming temps with more occasional smoke Monday thru Wednesday.


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 30, 2015)

Ryan said:


> Yes.
> 
> http://www.krtv.com/story/29827168/montana-national-guard-deploys-for-fire-fighting-mission


Thanks Ryan! Sounds like Montana has a Governor that's staying home and doing his job!


----------



## montana mike (Aug 30, 2015)

Ryan said:


> Yes.
> 
> http://www.krtv.com/story/29827168/montana-national-guard-deploys-for-fire-fighting-mission


Every resource helps for sure! The issue with the helicopters is much of the time the visibility is so low in these mountain fires that they cannot use them, as had been the case the last couple days with the Sheep fire at Essex. Perhaps they will have better luck around Libby, where the terrain is not quite as steep.

;-)


----------



## andersone (Aug 30, 2015)

We had a fatality on the CZ this morning (more on my thread) but we are back to only 40 minutes late. Appreciate the updatesupport regarding one of the most special places in my life.


----------



## montana mike (Aug 30, 2015)

Just looked at the rain totals for the last 24 hours in NW MT. The airport here in the Valley had .04 inches of rain. Not much more than a Trace. The NOAA radar estimates for the Park show a few spots may have picked up close to .25 inches, better, but still nothing that would put out a huge fire. We did have a number of lightning strikes in the Mountains today from the T-storms that rumbled thru this afternoon. Too early to tell if there will be any new fire starts. I hope not. The northern part of the Park apparently received little or no rain.

Sorry to hear about a fatality on the CZ.

9 PM (MDT) Update: The Incident Fire Commander has agreed to lift the Evacuation notice for Essex (Yea) as of 6 AM Monday morning. US 2 will reopen ( with escorted vehicle only and no stopping in the fire area) at that time as well.

They were able to do this because they have completed the massive fire breaks and logging operations and now have a large zone that should withstand a northward push by the fire into Essex. I may not be pretty, but the firefighters believe that even if the fire moves north it would have to go around Essex, not thru it. If this were to happen it would still effect US 2 and the BNSF tracks, but at least the area close to and in Essex is now very well defended. At first light assuming weather conditions permit (forecast is for sunny and mild with little wind) a direct attack on the north flank of the fire will commence with all of the helicopter resources they have (at least three more MT National Guard helicopters are expected to join in this effort) to try to put out as much of the north flank of the Sheep Fire as possible.


----------



## NDJollyMon (Aug 31, 2015)

Good to hear people are getting back to their homes. Thanks for the updates, Mike. I'm crossing my fingers things stay open for my EB ride through the area to PDX this Friday-Saturday. I spent 32 years chasing flames before I retired last year. Maybe I should come out of retirement and lend a hand!


----------



## montana mike (Aug 31, 2015)

It is certainly looking at lot better for you at this point. I hope all goes as planned for you!!


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Aug 31, 2015)

PHEW!!! I hope things continue to improve in Essex and that things are no worse than this elsewhere. Clear cuts around the IWI are better than no IWI!

Thanks again! :hi:


----------



## montana mike (Aug 31, 2015)

Looking at some of the images not all clear cuts. They did try to leave some trees in spots, not for esthetics but because the firefighters said they didn't need to take them all down. It does look different and of course the fire is still burning (just not expanding to the north and east as had been the case last week) and a couple thousand acres of the wilderness just south of the IWI are now blackened. But you are right--that is much better than the alternative to be sure. 50 years from now (assuming no more fires in that area), no one will really know what happened there. And 50 years is a blink in the eye of the forest cycle.

The forecast for the latter part of this week is for our first "rainy" day in several months--yea!! We are all hoping that the forecast does indeed come true! We just finished August with .07 inches of rainfall. We have had 5 months in a row with less than 1/2 inch of rainfall, with 4 of the last 5 months with less than 1/4 inch!!! We could have given Phoenix a good run for the money this year.


----------



## JayPea (Aug 31, 2015)

Glad you are finally getting rain, Mike. Spokane will end up with both their hottest AND driest summer ever, counting June, July, and August. But the first week of September looks to be wet and cool. Sure hope you get that kind of weather too.


----------



## Ispolkom (Sep 4, 2015)

I went through Maria's Pass on September 2, and it was surprisingly uneventful. The smoke had mostly cleared. a lot of trees near the track had been cut, but no more than a railroad might do anyway, just to avoid the possibility of trees falling on the track. Plus, because of the steep and rugged topography, you couldn't see much burnt area from the train.

What really struck me was how shockingly low the streams are.

Bottom line, from trackside, Marias Pass is still beautiful.

The train wasn't even very late, only an hour late into Minot.


----------



## TraneMan (Sep 8, 2015)

Been pretty quiet, and I am taking the fire is out or pretty much all in control now?


----------



## montana mike (Sep 8, 2015)

While the fires are not out, the weekend rain (and even little snow above 6500 feet), did knock down the activity to the point that most are just smoldering and not actively burning. This may change somewhat if the forecast for the next two weeks is accurate, as we are supposed to go back to a warm and dry pattern. We do not believe we will see conditions like we did in August, but several of the larger fires could once again become active. Normally, once we get into September and October the cooler temps help reduce the fire danger, but it was so dry this summer-as stated earlier, the driest summer ever recorded in NW MT, that no one is writing the fire season's obituary just yet.


----------



## oregon pioneer (Sep 8, 2015)

Glad to hear you got some of the same rain and high-elevation snow that we did. We are in the same situation, where the big fire is by no means "out", but the hot spots are all in the interior of the blackened area now. The perimeter is almost fully secured or at least blackened and out.

Tough it was a little unnerving last week to drive through the fire to town and see still-smoking logs and stumps, within about 100 yards of US highway 395, in an area that had burned over two weeks previously. When the fires are that large and numerous, firefighting resources are concentrated on perimeters where there is danger to homes and infrastructure. Mopping-up of the interior hot spots can wait a long, long time (sometimes till winter puts them out).


----------



## Chaz (Sep 27, 2015)

Interesting archived C-Span book discussion from a Cascades Smoke jumper. A retired jumper from the Missoula base was there.





SEPTEMBER 26, 2015	Book Discussion on_Smokejumper_Jason Ramos talked about his book, Smokejumper: A Memoir by One of America’s Most Select Airborne Firefighters, about his life as a smokejumper and the changes in fighting wildfires…


----------



## Chaz (Oct 4, 2015)

Gene Poon at T.O. Has posted an article from the Great Falls paper re "the miracle of the Izaak-Walton inn's survival"--the fire having gotten 1 mile away. Pictures too. Oct 3

http://www.greatfallstribune.com/story/life/my-montana/2015/09/24/izaak-walton-inn-fire/72781152/

TO link Oct4

http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,3858415

Chaz


----------



## oregon pioneer (Oct 4, 2015)

Really good article, thanks.

Having lived through it right here at home, I can see it all as I read the article. It's good to see that the Izaak Walton (where Hubby and I stayed on our first train trip from Oregon to Boston) survived.


----------



## andersone (Oct 5, 2015)

Thanks for the link. What a well written piece about a place I love. I am not sure I will ever get there but I am glad it survived unscathed. Such a pleasant piece of new in a world full of gloom and doom.


----------



## Ziv (Oct 5, 2015)

I hope that this means that the IWI is pretty much safe from fires for the next 20 or 30 years, given the reduction in the fuel/dry wood around it. I have never gotten the opportunity to stay there but I have seen it in the early morning light a time or two as the EB rolls by. I usually save money by staying at the Glacier Highland in W Glacier. It is not in the same class, at all, but nice people run it and I love walking to the lake from there.



Chaz said:


> Gene Poon at T.O. Has posted an article from the Great Falls paper re "the miracle of the Izaak-Walton inn's survival"--the fire having gotten 1 mile away. Pictures too. Oct 3
> http://www.greatfallstribune.com/story/life/my-montana/2015/09/24/izaak-walton-inn-fire/72781152/
> 
> TO link Oct4
> ...


----------



## montana mike (Oct 5, 2015)

No I would NOT assume that at all. While the fire crews did a great job clearing literally tens of thousands of trees from around Essex, the Inn is still in a heavily forested area. I was just there a couple weeks ago (we enjoyed our favorite dessert there--Huckleberry cobbler with a scoop of Huckleberry ice cream) after the Sheep Fire had settled down and the number of trees removed represent a tiny fraction of the forest land. Most of the trees removed were to the east of the IWI along and just to the south of the BNSF main line.

Having lived in the Pacific NW now for a number of years I can vouch for the fact that burning coals can travel very long distances during intense fires, so while the chances of being overrun by a modest fire event like the Sheep Fire are lessened, a major conflagration as we have seen in this area in the past would, in all likelihood, take the IWI out, along with dozens of other structures. We need to keep in mind the Sheep Fire was small as fires go, perhaps 5000 acres at its height. I remember standing on the top of Big Mtn just north of Whitefish a few years ago watching the 71,000 acre Moose Fire (with a 40,000 foot smoke plume) wipe out several entire mountains worth of timber in a matter of a few days.


----------



## Karl1459 (Oct 5, 2015)

Trees and brush grow pretty quick especially when the ground is fertilized and prepped by fire. Remember to plants in this area wild fires are a "normal" thing, and they are very able to regrow. Keeping human habitation fire resistive is not easy and is a ongoing maintenance task. While the Izaac Walton is in reasonably good shape the rest of Essex has problems.

Those beautiful pine trees in Essex should be at least 30 feet from structures, 150 feet away if its a steep uphill to the structure. https://gallery.mailchimp.com/d4b34ba20c75e8b5e74ad703d/files/30_Days_30_Ways_Wildfire_Day_8.pdf.

When there is a fire the priorities for firefighters are life hazard - significant cultural/historical artifacts - significant environmental features - significant economic generators (industry-stores-timberland) - private homes - other "no cash value" land, more or less in that order. Most of the time wildland firefighters will not commit to going down road with no second exit, too much risk of being cut off (It can happen quickly, in Washington one firefighter lost his life and several others were burned when the wind shifted unexpectedly and they were trapped). A lot of the residential area of Essex and the cabin area south/west of the the tracks will be written off as too risky to commit firefighters when the flames come.

BNSF and the Forest Service spent a lot of money on the Essex area this season, lets hope they will recognize (and the general public will support the idea) that there needs to be ongoing maintenance to minimize hazards.


----------

