# Boeing's next plane: a 757 replacement?



## CHamilton (Feb 11, 2014)

The Next Boeing Clean-Sheet Will Probably Be a 757 Replacement

A comment from the former aerospace reporter for the Everett Herald:



> Big opportunity here for Boeing to improve passenger sanity: Make the fuselage wider so we can have 19- or 20-inch-wide seats in coach, but not so wide that the airlines can squeeze in an additional seat per row by shrinking the seat width.
> 
> That's what the airlines did with the 787. Boeing designed it for eight 18.5-inch seats per row, but most airlines choose to configure it at nine 17-inch-wide seats per row because, well, they pretty much hate their customers.
> 
> Airlines especially hate us when we're flying coach on a 737 for six hours. I guess 17 inches of width in coach seems like plenty to an airline exec who sits in first class.


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## PRR 60 (Feb 11, 2014)

CHamilton said:


> The Next Boeing Clean-Sheet Will Probably Be a 757 Replacement
> 
> A comment from the former aerospace reporter for the Everett Herald:
> 
> ...


Maybe it's not that the seats are too narrow. Maybe it's that American's are too wide.


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## jis (Feb 11, 2014)

A stretched 737-900 with a CFR wing and CFR body and taller more capable landing gears. Yeay!


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## Texan Eagle (Feb 11, 2014)

I have never got a chance to be on a 757 operated flight, so someone please fill me in- how does it fare compared to 737 in terms of interior width? I believe it is the same 3-3 configuration as 737s but verrrrrry long fuselage, right? Are there any other differences from a coach passenger perspective between 737 and 757?


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## the_traveler (Feb 11, 2014)

I'm not certain, but I think a 757 fuselage is basically that of a 737. (Now that I think of it, I forget if it's a 757 or 767 - one is a narrow body jet and one is a wide body jet.)

And "the big guys" don't fly First Class - they use private jets!


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## PRR 60 (Feb 11, 2014)

the_traveler said:


> I'm not certain, but I think a 757 fuselage is basically that of a 737. (Now that I think of it, I forget if it's a 757 or 767 - one is a narrow body jet and one is a wide body jet.)
> 
> And "the big guys" don't fly First Class - they use private jets!


While both are narrow-body aircraft, the 757 is not actually a derivative of the 737 line. It was stand alone, and was really a narrow-body version of the 767 with similar avionics and cockpits. For now, the 737-900 has effectively replaced the 757 in the Boeing line-up.


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## railiner (Feb 11, 2014)

I believe the 737 shares its basic fuselage cross section with its narrow-body older brother's, the 727, the 707 and the 720. The 757 is distinctly different....while the former have rounded bottoms, the 757 has a flattened out bottom cross-section, most noticeable in the nose area.....

The 757 seems to have been the aircraft of choice for many years when high performance is required for operating at mountain airports in places like Colorado ski areas.

As for passenger differences.....the main entry I believe is located between first calss and coach sections, so boarding passengers for coach don't have to walk thru the first class section. And there is another entrance, (though seldom used) forward of the first class cabin. Makes the first class cabin truly separate, better than a half partition and flimsly curtain.....

Until recent advanced versions of the 737, the 757 was Boeings only narrow body with transoceanic range and capacity.


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## jis (Feb 11, 2014)

The 757-200 in general is still a more capable aircraft than the 737-900ER, or so I am told. Though its fuel consumption is more. The 757-300 has considerably larger capacity, but not the range of 757-200.


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## saxman (Feb 11, 2014)

The 757 is basically a 767 with the bottom third cut off. That said, it's a very powerful airplane with excellent thrust to weight ratios. It can land and takeoff and very short runways and has quite the range. The 737-900 though just doesn't have the power that the 757 does. I've heard of a lot more weight restrictions on the 737-900 for the long haul flights they do. Same for the Airbus A321. So glad to see Boeing is coming up with a 757 replacement. Something as powerful as it is, but with more modern technology is something that's needed.


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## jis (Feb 11, 2014)

Yeah, 737-900 and A321s can barely make it from London to New York with a full load. The 757s do it pretty easily. Things get tough for 757s when going westbound from Berlin Tegel to Newark. That is on the bleeding edge of its capability.


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## Blackwolf (Feb 11, 2014)

I really enjoyed the 757-200's I flew on with TWA between New York-JFK and Barcelona, Spain in 1998. Fantastic airline, and fantastic aircraft.


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## Texan Eagle (Feb 11, 2014)

jis said:


> Yeah, 737-900 and A321s can barely make it from London to New York with a full load. The 757s do it pretty easily. Things get tough for 757s when going westbound from Berlin Tegel to Newark. That is on the bleeding edge of its capability.


Wait, you're telling there are London-New York flights on 737s and A321s? What the heck! How? Who operates them? I for one would definitely not enjoy traveling international on a 737, I tend to associate "international" travel with big (widebody) planes.


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## railiner (Feb 11, 2014)

And I enjoyed flying the 757's in and out of places like Steamboat Springs (Hayden), Gunnison, Montrose, and Eagle, Colorado; and Jackson, Wyoming.....spectacular!


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## the_traveler (Feb 11, 2014)

Texan Eagle said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah, 737-900 and A321s can barely make it from London to New York with a full load. The 757s do it pretty easily. Things get tough for 757s when going westbound from Berlin Tegel to Newark. That is on the bleeding edge of its capability.
> ...


I'm not positively certain, but some large airline (American maybe) had a transatlantic flight with an A321 - I think JFK to London City Airport - a few years ago.


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## PRR 60 (Feb 11, 2014)

BA operates non-stops JFK-LCY using Airbus A318's. The westbound flights make a stop at SNN for fuel (and in the case of one flight, US CBP pre-clearance).


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## SubwayNut (Feb 11, 2014)

Your thinking of BA's JFK to London City Service, all business class, I've never flown it, just read about it. London City has a tiny runway and BA specifically ordered A318s London to JFK it stops in Shannon to refuel (and where passengers can use the US customs/immigration pre-clearance facility)


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## railiner (Feb 11, 2014)

the_traveler said:


> Texan Eagle said:
> 
> 
> > jis said:
> ...


Definitely not AA.....they only recently received their first A321T's for transcontinental service to replace 767's.....


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## Trogdor (Feb 11, 2014)

The 757 and 737 are different fuselage designs, but they have the same cabin width, and thus use the same seats.

It's been a couple of years since I've been on a 757 now, as it seems that all the stuff I fly that used to be popular 757 flights has now switched to 737s and A320s. It'll be even more difficult in the next few years as more 757s are drawn down and replaced with more advanced 737s and A320s.

As for trans-Atlantic, I don't know of anyone flying A321s or 737-900ERs across the ocean. There are, however, a few airlines flying other 737 or A320 family jets (either current or in relatively recent history). WestJet is planning to start service to Dublin from St. Johns, Newfoundland, using 737-700s. Already noted is British Airways' A318 service from JFK to LCY (the westbound makes a fuel stop in Shannon simply because the runway at London City is far too short to accommodate an A318 with a full fuel load). I think Sun Country is flying, or used to fly, to Europe via eastern Canada on a 737-800. Air Canada has also flown into either the UK or Ireland with A319s or A320s from eastern Canada.

There have also been a handful of flights using business-class-configured 737s and A320s offering scheduled service on behalf of larger airlines. One was a KLM flight from Houston to AMS on a 737 operated by PrivatAir (http://www.klm.com/travel/nl_en/prepare_for_travel/on_board/seating_plans/737-700PrivatAir.htm). I know there are (or were) a couple of other examples of such as well.


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## xyzzy (Feb 12, 2014)

Not sure how practical it is to stretch the 739 further. If Boeing redesigns the wings, the landing gear, and the fuel tanks plus a larger engine they might as well do a clean-sheet -- and then the marketing people would favor calling it a different aircraft instead of the 737-1000.

Is there any regulator in the world that would allow a single-aisle aircraft in a 3-4 configuration? I hope not!

I suspect the 757 replacement, if it does materialize, would be influenced mainly by Asian needs. That said, if the aircraft had been available this year, AA might have taken it for JFK-LAX in lieu of a smaller A321, but that's speculation on my part.

From a passenger's perspective, aside from the rather limited long-haul use of the 757, the only practical difference between it and the 737 is that the 757 tends to take longer to load and unload passengers through a single door. (Welcome to the DC-8-60.) A lightly-fueled 757 does have superb takeoff performance, but the downside of that is relatively low wing loading that makes a lightly-fueled 757 a real pig in rough air. Ask anyone who flies DL frequently in the thunderstorm-prone southeast. The upside: the 757 is probably the only large aircraft in common use that can take off from SNA (5700 feet) on a hot day with full pax load and sufficient fuel for a nonstop flight to the east coast.


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## Trogdor (Feb 12, 2014)

xyzzy said:


> Is there any regulator in the world that would allow a single-aisle aircraft in a 3-4 configuration? I hope not!


In the US and Europe, at least, no seat can be more than two seats from an aisle. So, as long as that is the case, you won't see more than three seats together next to a window/wall, or (theoretically) six seats in a middle section.


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## jis (Feb 12, 2014)

Texan Eagle said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah, 737-900 and A321s can barely make it from London to New York with a full load. The 757s do it pretty easily. Things get tough for 757s when going westbound from Berlin Tegel to Newark. That is on the bleeding edge of its capability.
> ...


Sure. There have been Europe - US fights on 737s or a32x and 318. I have flown many times on Privatair 737 from Stuttgart to Newark when it operated under contract from Lufthansa. It was a really nice all BC flight. I actually enjoyed it way more than any widebody cattle car flight across the pond.


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