# #4 & #18 route out of LAX, prior to 1994



## ParanoidAndroid (Sep 21, 2015)

Prior to 1994, the Southwest Chief, along with the Super Chief when it was run by Santa Fe, stopped at Pasadena and Pomona, on what is now the Metro Gold Line (light rail). I understand that the railbed is mostly the same, and they just changed the rails to accommodate the light rail.

However, just north of LAX, is the "Chinatown" station on the current Gold Line Route, and it is an elevated track. It's quite hard to believe that the SWC ran on that elevated track the whole time.

To see what route it took out of LAX, I looked at the historical images of the LA area on Google Earth for May 1994, and found 2 possible routes:

1. Where the current Gold Line crosses the LA river, it was not elevated prior to 1994. This could mean that the rail broke off from the current Surfliner/Antelope Valley track to go east, and the SWC followed the current Surfliner rails to that point, then went east thru Pasadena and Pomona.

2. I'm seeing rails, like, a BIG railyard just north of the current Chinatown light rail station. The tracks go south a little bit, then it kinda fades away into Alameda Street. I'm a bit confused by this, so I'm not very sure of this alignment.

Does anyone have any answers? I know this is silly, but this is one of the things I'm interested in about trains!

Thanks in advance!


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## crabby_appleton1950 (Sep 21, 2015)

How can I access the "historical images" on Google Earth? Thanks


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## lstone19 (Sep 21, 2015)

IIRC, Santa Fe went up the west side of the river. They did not share track with SP trains once clear of LAUS. Which made for the "strange" arrangement where trains east to Chicago initially were west of trains that went west to San Francisco/Oakland.


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## ParanoidAndroid (Sep 21, 2015)

Then, where did they cross the river?


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## zephyr17 (Sep 21, 2015)

The tracks were significantly rearranged in that area since then. The current West Bank line north of Mission Tower (entrance to LAUPT throat at the river) was the AT&SF 3rd District, the Pasadena Line. It crossed the river where the Gold Line crosses now, but did NOT connect to the SP line coming down from Dayton Tower and heading toward Bullring yard, which is now the continuation of the Metrolink West Bank line. There may have been interchange tracks, but the lines did not connect.

The Super Chief went north on the 3rd District at Mission Tower, and crossed the river where the Gold Line crosses now.

Then: | SP

/ / to Pasadena

/ /

to | ATSF
Bullring

The SP line that went to Bullring yard was the original SP mainline and continued down the middle of Alameda St. The tracks were still in Alameda for the longest time and were in active use until the early 80s. This is route of all SP passenger trains until the opening of Union Station on May 4, 1939. They stayed in Alameda heading toward SP-UP Central Station at 5th & Central. There are pictures of SP passenger trains in the middle of Alameda in front of Union Station just prior to its opening.

After the opening of Union Station, SP trains from the north shifted to the East Bank line, which was primarily used by SP but actually owned by UP south of Dayton, and took the "sowbelly" connection track to the Sunset Route line coming in from the east to cross the river right at Mission Tower. This continued to be the route of the Coast Starlight until Metrolink rearranged the tracks to make the through West Bank line we have today.

None of this is remotely close to LAX. The closest any rails got to LAX was the Santa Fe line to the harbor that ran along Aviation Blvd. LAX is an actual place, not just a code, and it isn't Union Station.


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## railiner (Sep 21, 2015)

Here's a link to a nice description (with photo's) of the various RR depot's in Los Angeles prior to the LAUPT in 1939. I am particularly impressed by the SP-UP Central Station...

http://www.kcet.org/updaily/socal_focus/history/la-as-subject/lost-train-depots-of-los-angeles.html


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## Bob Dylan (Sep 21, 2015)

railiner said:


> Here's a link to a nice description (with photo's) of the various RR depot's in Los Angeles prior to the LAUPT in 1939. I am particularly impressed by the SP-UP Central Station...
> 
> http://www.kcet.org/updaily/socal_focus/history/la-as-subject/lost-train-depots-of-los-angeles.html


Good stuff! Thanks for sharing! I was impressed by the Le Grande Station also,!

Where did all the Orange trees go? LOL


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## ParanoidAndroid (Sep 21, 2015)

I know where Mission tower is, but I'm not sure where Bullring yard and Dayton tower is. I'm assuming that "Bullring Yard" is the "a BIG railyard just north of the current Chinatown light rail station" in the original post. I'm assuming Dayton Tower is somewhere north of LAUS. I'll be sure to check on Google Earth's historical images, and my Official Guide of the Railways book when I get home.

Assuming those above, the Super Chief left LAUS with the other tracks, then broke off the rail lines to go up the West Bank of the LA river. It passed through Main street, Spring St and Broadway (maybe under), and just north of Broadway, it curved east and crossed the LA River, which is the same place where the Gold Line crosses the LA river today.

And then it continues to Pasadena.

I now understand that the tracks I saw "fading" into Alameda previously went down to 5th/Central, and were Southern Pacific tracks, and I also see the line connecting from the Sunset Route bridge to the East Bank Line.

Thanks so much for the detailed reply!


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## trainman74 (Sep 21, 2015)

maxbuskirk said:


> I know where Mission tower is, but I'm not sure where Bullring yard and Dayton tower is. I'm assuming that "Bullring Yard" is the "a BIG railyard just north of the current Chinatown light rail station" in the original post. I'm assuming Dayton Tower is somewhere north of LAUS.


Bullring Yard, more formally known as River Station Yard, is now the site of the Los Angeles State Historic Park, not too far northeast of Union Station -- I think that's what you may have seen in the old photos.

Dayton Tower was at the south end of the SP's Taylor Yard, which was just north of where the 5 freeway crosses the river (there's a Metrolink maintenance facility on the Taylor Yard site, but there was quite a bit more to the yard than what remains today).


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