# is first class worth it?



## MIrailfan (Mar 5, 2014)

for an Amtrak trip from Jackson Michigan to San Diego?


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## MiRider (Mar 5, 2014)

As long as you don't think of it as 'First Class' - because it is NOT - it's worth it for that long of a trip just for the added comfort of a flat surface to sleep on and the included meals.


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## MIrailfan (Mar 5, 2014)

I assume I'd be in business class to Chicago then a sleeper to Los Angeles then business class again to San Diego?


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## AmtrakBlue (Mar 5, 2014)

Only you can decide if something is worth it. Everyone has different opinions.


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## Ryan (Mar 5, 2014)

MIRAILFAN said:


> I assume I'd be in business class to Chicago then a sleeper to Los Angeles then business class again to San Diego?


That would be correct.
As Betty said, it's really up to you. It's worth it to me, but someone else may have different priorities.


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## MIrailfan (Mar 5, 2014)

just found out its $562 round trip if I go coach and $1562 if I go business/sleeper/business.


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## Guest (Mar 5, 2014)

MiRider said:


> As long as you don't think of it as 'First Class' - because it is NOT


Given that it is the highest class of service offered by Amtrak, the definition is correct.


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## jebr (Mar 5, 2014)

MIRAILFAN said:


> just found out its $562 round trip if I go coach and $1562 if I go business/sleeper/business.


It probably won't be much cheaper, but you could see the price of coach/sleeper/coach, as the business class trips are all during the day (and probably only a few hours long.)


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## MIrailfan (Mar 5, 2014)

plus first class gets me meals and Chicago Los Angeles Lounge access.


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## VentureForth (Mar 5, 2014)

Guest said:


> MiRider said:
> 
> 
> > As long as you don't think of it as 'First Class' - because it is NOT
> ...


 Someone can (and will) correct me if I'm wrong, but I understand that Amtrak has stopped calling sleeper service "First Class". The ONLY defined "First Class" (which is, indeed, a higher level of service than sleepers or business) is on the NEC. To that definition, sleeper service is nothing like Acela First Class. Arguably for the next two weeks, sleeper service on the Auto Train is closer to Acela First Class than any other sleeper service is.



MIRAILFAN said:


> plus first class gets me meals and Chicago Los Angeles Lounge access.


Indeed there are perks. It is up to you if you want to spend the $1000 for those perks.


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## RTE_TrainGuy (Mar 5, 2014)

Personally I would never spend $562 (roughly twice the cost of a RT flight) for about 50 hours each way in a Amtrak couch seat. I say a sleeper is well worth it.

The suggestion for couch on the short legs is a good one.


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## Texan Eagle (Mar 5, 2014)

You could see fare for doing Jackson-Chicago by Coach, Chicago-LA by roomette and LA-SD by coach. This combo might turn out to be cheaper than going "First Class" all the way and you will still get a bed to sleep, all meals between CHI-LA and lounge access in Chicago and LA. For short runs like Jackson-Chicago and LA-SD, Amtrak coach is quite comfortable, about as much space as domestic First Class on flights.


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## Tumbleweed (Mar 5, 2014)

If your dates are somewhat flexible, check the fares on Amsnag at http://biketrain.net/amsnag/amSnag.php There is quite a variation depending on dates of travel.....


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## rrdude (Mar 5, 2014)

Guest said:


> MiRider said:
> 
> 
> > As long as you don't think of it as 'First Class' - because it is NOT
> ...


WRONG! I don't care what they call it, it is definitely NOT first class. As other posters have said, it is simply a flatbed, a private room, and average meals.


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## June the Coach Rider (Mar 5, 2014)

Texan Eagle said:


> Amtrak coach is quite comfortable, about as much space as domestic First Class on flights.


I still think Amtrak coach has more leg room than even first class on planes. I am sure there are some that have more. But you can't compare coach on Amtrak to First Class flights. On Amtrak, would be the observation car and if interested the cafe car and dining cars.

But this is just my opinion, and I am sure others will disagree.


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## Railroad Bill (Mar 5, 2014)

I would agree with some of the previous posts.

1) if flexible in your dates. definitely check Amsnag for possible cheaper fares

2) definitely go coach in Michigan and on the Surfliner LAX-SAN. The extra cost is not worth what few amenities you would receive on those trains.

3) I could only handle the trip from Chicago to LA in a sleeper. Too far to ride in coach for my back and for mental health 

4) if you figure the cost of meals on the train, better restroom facilities, a shower, a bed for two nights, it is certainly worth the extra money for a sleeper. 

5) As mentioned you would get access to Metro Lounge in Chicago and in LA. Better restrooms, snacks, priority boarding, luggage storage in CHI. That is all worth something to me when I figure my cost of sleeper as well.


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## brentrain17 (Mar 5, 2014)

Going cross country, if you can afford it do the sleeper. If you dates are flexible check the site "Amsnag" for possible better pricing. Have a great trip!


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## SarahZ (Mar 5, 2014)

Having traveled long distance from Michigan many times, I agree with the others who say you should travel coach on the shorter runs (Jackson to Chicago, for example). Business class is nice, but it's not worth the price. You get a free beverage and more leg room, plus a comfy chair, but coach on the Wolverine is quite comfortable, and it's not THAT big a difference. If you travel in coach for those runs, you can save around $200. The only time I use business class is when it's included in my Amtrak Guest Rewards redemption trips. I never pay cash for it.

For the actual long-distance trip, I would book a roomette. This is a very personal choice, though. For me, it's worth it to have a private room where I can shut the door and keep noise out. I can't sleep in a chair, so the flat beds are another perk. I also enjoy the meals in the dining car, and they are included in the price of the room. If you travel in coach, you either have to bring food, buy it in the cafe car, or buy meals in the dining car. The cafe car and dining car are not cheap. Also, you'll have access to a shower, which I definitely recommend if you're traveling for more than one night. In addition to the shower, food, bed, and private room, the car itself is generally quieter, and you'll have access to the Metropolitan Lounge in Chicago.

If you love to meet other people and can sleep in a recliner, then coach is a good option. The seats have leg rests and lots of room to stretch your legs to sleep. You won't have access to a shower, though, but you can find lots of tips online for bathing in a bathroom. Again, you would have to bring food and/or buy food on the train.

Check YouTube for some videos of the Superliner roomettes and coach to get an idea of where you'd be sleeping and hanging out most of the time. Keep in mind you can also use the lounge car if you need to get out of your seat/room for a while. I like the roomettes and think they're comfy and cozy, but I know some people start to feel twitchy after sitting in one spot for too long.


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## RalphCT (Mar 5, 2014)

I agree with those who suggest traveling coach for the short sections of your trip and spend your money on the roomette for the overnight section. The privacy, meals in the diner, shower and a bed make it worth it IMHO.

A Montanan who enjoys train travel.


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## andersone (Mar 5, 2014)

Only you can determine value, Personally the above mentioned plans makes senses, coach for the short runs and a sleeper for the overnight. Although I could make it in coach overnight, I choose not to - but the titanium hip and the trachea make for rough sledding over the duration. But then again as a young man I used to enjoy camping, but those days are long gone.

Enjoy the trip,,, kick back and relax,,, and my favorite part - enjoy the people you are traveling with ,,,


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## SarahZ (Mar 5, 2014)

Superliner coach seat, fully reclined:







(Keep in mind you'll have to bring a pillow/blanket, or you can purchase a "Passenger Comfort Kit" in the cafe)

Superliner roomette at night (the table would be folded up; that's just for the train day sign):






(Pillow and blankets are provided, and if you're by yourself, you can sleep in the top bunk and leave the seats in the "daytime" position.)

Superliner roomette during the day:






Business class on the Wolverine (sometimes the seats are cloth):






Coach seats on the Wolverine - not as much leg room as the long-distance trains or business class, but still plenty of leg room, and the seats are wide and comfy:


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## D.P. Roberts (Mar 5, 2014)

Everyone in this thread is correct about everything.

I have just two other questions:
1) How soon are you going?

2) Are you going by yourself, or with others?

I'm just wondering because you might save some money by joining Amtrak's frequent traveler program, Amtrak Guest Rewards.

For example, one leg of your trip (Michigan- San Diego) would cost 20,000 Amtrak points. If you sign up for an AGR credit card, earn points through Amtrak shopping, or even buy some points, you could probably earn at least half of your trip fairly quickly.


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## chakk (Mar 5, 2014)

RTE_TrainGuy said:


> Personally I would never spend $562 (roughly twice the cost of a RT flight) for about 50 hours each way in a Amtrak couch seat. I say a sleeper is well worth it.
> 
> The suggestion for couch on the short legs is a good one.


Do they have a couch to stretch out on in coach?


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## SubwayNut (Mar 5, 2014)

Not really unless you count stretching out over 3 seats at an awkward angle in the Superliner lounge on overnight runs, something I've been known to do when I've gotten stuck in the asile seat.


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## FriskyFL (Mar 5, 2014)

Other than Acela First Class, comparing Amtrak to any airline first class is a fool's errand. Service will be inconsistent, ranging from outstanding to penal.


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## amamba (Mar 5, 2014)

The only official "first class" on amtrak, as other's have said, is on the acela service. Sleepers are called "sleeper class."


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## rrdude (Mar 5, 2014)

chakk said:


> RTE_TrainGuy said:
> 
> 
> > Personally I would never spend $562 (roughly twice the cost of a RT flight) for about 50 hours each way in a Amtrak couch seat. I say a sleeper is well worth it.
> ...


Luggage rack on lower level of Superliner, although it's pretty well lit. If you crawl behind the suitcases, you might be able to deal with the light. I think they have put "slide-barriers" on the luggage racks up in coach, used to be a good place to crash. Lower level of Superliner coach sometimes has flat space on the floor, usually reserved for wheelchairs or such.

Bear in mind, *none of these spaces I mentioned above* are "legal" or recommended. Just places I have found people sleeping over the years of working and traveling on the AmDog.


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## PerRock (Mar 5, 2014)

chakk said:


> RTE_TrainGuy said:
> 
> 
> > Personally I would never spend $562 (roughly twice the cost of a RT flight) for about 50 hours each way in a Amtrak couch seat. I say a sleeper is well worth it.
> ...


"officially" No.

However as people have mentioned it is sometimes possible to find flat areas on the train to stretch out in overnight. When I first traveled long distance on Amtrak in coach we slept in the Sightseer Lounge on some of the benches & floor there. However this practice has since become much more common & different crews have different internal rules on the practice. Some crews will let you some will kick you out of the car. Also because it's more common these days it is harder to find a spot to sleep there as it does fill up quickly. The practice is also frowned down upon by Some sleeping car passengers who are not shy about letting their dislike for it known.

peter


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## AmtrakBlue (Mar 5, 2014)

Am I wrong or have those commenting on the couch missed why s/he asked?


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## RTE_TrainGuy (Mar 5, 2014)

AmtrakBlue said:


> Am I wrong or have those commenting on the couch missed why s/he asked?


Yes, I think so. I think 'chakk' was just making a joke about my misspelling of 'coach'. I said 'couch' (twice) when I meant to say 'coach'. In my defense, I had another window opened to a furniture website, as I buying a new sofa.


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## AmtrakBlue (Mar 5, 2014)

RTE_TrainGuy said:


> AmtrakBlue said:
> 
> 
> > Am I wrong or have those commenting on the couch missed why s/he asked?
> ...


That's what I thought too


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## D.P. Roberts (Mar 5, 2014)

AmtrakBlue said:


> RTE_TrainGuy said:
> 
> 
> > AmtrakBlue said:
> ...


Okay, I was wondering whether everyone had really missed the joke. But when you coach it in those terms, it makes sense.


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## SANSR (Mar 5, 2014)

At the risk of sounding silly (oh hell, I don't care....ask Ryan, he'll confirm it) Einstein WAS right.......relativity is a personal thing. And in much the same context, we all tend to define our own concepts, including 'first class', whatever THAT may be. Train travel is what WE make it. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. If you have the $$$ and you have the time (that is the REAL equalizer, time) then sign up for the Full Monty and meet it head on. Enjoy your trip!


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## seat38a (Mar 5, 2014)

For the portion from Los Angeles Union Station to San Diego, Business Class is well worth it. Remember, on the Pacific Surfliner, Business Class gets more perks than just a free soda.

On the trains before noon, they setup a continental breakfast bar in the car:




IMG_0063 by seat38a, on Flickr

On afternoon trains, they setup the buffet area, with coffee, juice, snack packs and you get a free soda, bottled water, or red or white wine.




IMG_0357 by seat38a, on Flickr

For the small cost to upgrade, it is really a great value when you really itemize up everything they give you and you actually bought them at the cafe or store before boarding.





IMG_0079 by seat38a, on Flickr


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## SarahZ (Mar 5, 2014)

Wow. That's pretty awesome. I wish they'd do that with business class on the Michigan trains. They could (maybe) set up some kind of deal with Leelanau Wine Cellars or St. Julian's.


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## tonys96 (Mar 5, 2014)

What? They are giving away free wine to pax? They should stop that this instant. The money saved could save routes/jobs. And they do not do it onall other routes any more, so they should stop it on these routes.

/sarc


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## seat38a (Mar 5, 2014)

tonys96 said:


> What? They are giving away free wine to pax? They should stop that this instant. The money saved could save routes/jobs. And they do not do it onall other routes any more, so they should stop it on these routes.
> 
> /sarc


LOL, no way!! The Pacific Surfliner, San _San Joaquin and _ Capitol Corridor are state supported routes. It is the State support that allows us to have 11 round trips a day from Los Angeles to San Diego. A big portion of the equipment used are state owned. Plus the state even paid to have the "Federal" Amtrak's damaged equipment fixed in return for a long lease. Examples of these Superliner's:




P1000406 by seat38a, on Flickr

I think the future of rail in California is bright. It is just the rest of the country we don't know. So the decision to remove the wine and snacks will come from Sacramento NOT Washington (Thank God!).


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## seat38a (Mar 5, 2014)

I forgot to add. If you have a business class ticket, you get access to the new Metropolitan Lounge at Los Angeles Union Station.




P1000021 by seat38a, on Flickr


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## PerRock (Mar 5, 2014)

seat38a said:


> I forgot to add. If you have a business class ticket, you get access to the new Metropolitan Lounge at Los Angeles Union Station.


It's not just at LAUS. Business Class Passengers can use any Metropolitan Lounge in which they have a ticket in Biz on that same day.

peter


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## seat38a (Mar 5, 2014)

PerRock said:


> seat38a said:
> 
> 
> > I forgot to add. If you have a business class ticket, you get access to the new Metropolitan Lounge at Los Angeles Union Station.
> ...


Sorry, I should have been more clear. I was trying to make a point that LAUS has a lounge now. It opened late last year.


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## SubwayNut (Mar 5, 2014)

Cascades Buissiness class passengers are now allowed in the Portland Metropolitan Lounge?


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## NorthCoastHiawatha (Mar 6, 2014)

It's interesting, did a test booking out of curiosity on a Pullman Rail Journeys trip on the City of New Orleans a few weeks back. Turns out that booking an open section on PRJ was cheaper than it would be booking an Amtrak roomette (240 vs 359). So not only are you paying less, but you're getting an actual first class experience.

As for the question at hand, I'm not really sure anymore, the price for a roomette has gotten much too expensive for what you get. I had thought about taking sleeper on the starlight on my upcoming trip, but $556 for a roomette is just too much. The lowest I could find was 441. The last time I took sleeper on the starlight in 2008, I paid 197.


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## Bob Dylan (Mar 6, 2014)

I wonder if Amtrak is Filling the Starlight at these High Bucket Rates?? I know they take off a Sleeper and a Coach in Slow times and cut back on the OBS,(not to mention the latest Idiotic Amenities Cuts!) but is the Market really there for these, to me, Astounding Prices for Roomettes???!! :help:

If it wasn't for AGR I couldn't afford to ride in Sleepers on LD Trains either, and to be Honest probably some of the Routes aren't Worth what the Revenue Wizards have set the Buckets at! I know it's a Trade off but there will be a Breaking Point, especially with the Poor OTPs, Cancellations, Bustitutions etc. that the LD Trains have turned in this Winter!


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## PerRock (Mar 6, 2014)

SubwayNut said:


> Cascades Buissiness class passengers are now allowed in the Portland Metropolitan Lounge?


I would presume so; here is what the Amtrak Website says:



> Similar to ClubAcela, Metropolitan Lounges are available to sleeping car passengers, business class passengers with the same day travel ticket (departure or arrival) and Amtrak Guest Rewards Select Plus or Select Executive members, and include:
> 
> 
> Comfortable, quiet lounge seating
> ...


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## NorthCoastHiawatha (Mar 6, 2014)

jimhudson said:


> I wonder if Amtrak is Filling the Starlight at these High Bucket Rates?? I know they take off a Sleeper and a Coach in Slow times and cut back on the OBS,(not to mention the latest Idiotic Amenities Cuts!) but is the Market really there for these, to me, Astounding Prices for Roomettes???!! :help:
> 
> If it wasn't for AGR I couldn't afford to ride in Sleepers on LD Trains either, and to be Honest probably some of the Routes aren't Worth what the Revenue Wizards have set the Buckets at! I know it's a Trade off but there will be a Breaking Point, especially with the Poor OTPs, Cancellations, Bustitutions etc. that the LD Trains have turned in this Winter!


Mind you those prices include railfare, but yes somehow they are selling out at those prices.


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## 7deuceman (Mar 6, 2014)

Is "First Class" on Amtrak worth it? Yes! Here is how I look at the costing for rooms - for what its worth:
I took a month-in-advance fare for a Roomette off of Amtrak.com for the following dates on The Southwest Chief...

Monday, April 7, 2014 Chicago, IL - Union Station (CHI) to Los Angeles, CA - Union Station (LAX) $505.00
Monday, April 14, 2014 Los Angeles, CA - Union Station (LAX) to Chicago, IL - Union Station (CHI) $505.00

For each sector you get quite reasonable comfort, privacy, meals and the option to mingle with other passengers
in the Superliner Lounge Car and Diner, essentially for 2 nights. 

For a similar period, one could easily spend the same money or more, at a hotel and restaurants. Only in this case 

you "board the hotel in Chicago and leave the hotel in LA" so to speak (and the same on the return.) To me this

is a value, because you are also transported nicely as well. So there is some real value in riding in First or Sleeper 

Class if you want extra comfort and privacy that the service delivers. Especially, when you want to hide from the 

world for a while and combine it all with sightseeing and socializing as desired.

The Jackson - Chicago and LA - San Diego would be extra of course. I really like Business Class and it is worth
the cost. Of course on a Chicago - West Coast trip, Coach is nice as well (I only ride in the Roomette when my
better-half joins me on the trip.) I really like the cost-effective Coach pricing and the legroom of the seats. It is
adequate for me when I am on the move to/from New York, Virginia, Florida and Denver/West Coast.

Enjoy your trip!


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## kiwiaz (Mar 6, 2014)

I was looking forward to trying out the new lounge in LA a couple of weeks ago. It was randomly closed with no signage for explanation. :-(

Took my first journeys in sleeper class though and found it worth the money for me. Much more relaxing (oh, and the lamb shank dinner in the parlor car was amazing!)


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## Bob Dylan (Mar 6, 2014)

kiwiaz said:


> I was looking forward to trying out the new lounge in LA a couple of weeks ago. It was randomly closed with no signage for explanation. :-(
> 
> Took my first journeys in sleeper class though and found it worth the money for me. Much more relaxing (oh, and the lamb shank dinner in the parlor car was amazing!)


 This is curious! Did you ask the Amtrak Info or Ticket Desk in Union Station why the Lounge was Closed? I'm glad you enjoyed your Sleeper Experience  , and suggest that you call Amtrak @ 1-800-USA-RAIL/after "Julie" Answers, ask for an Agent and when the Regular Agent comes on the Line ask to be Transfered to Customer Relations, have your Info ready and perhaps they can give you info and perhaps even send you a nice Voucher for Future Travel since you didnt receive the Promised Services that are Part of Sleeping Car Travel on Amtrak!


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## cassie225 (Mar 6, 2014)

For LD trips that I have taken I always find out it is worth the cost. But I always look at Amsnag and my travel dates are very flexible. Ex. my daughter and I traveled back to NO from Newark in H room with discount for her and companion discount for me for 445.I thought that was an awesome price. I always try to book at the cheapest rate.


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## the Other Mike (Mar 6, 2014)

Worth the bed ? YES

Worth the shower? YES

Worth the food ? Depends, "I" say no, but most people here seem to think Applebees is gourmet dining. ^_^

But what the hell, it's included :giggle:


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## cassie225 (Mar 7, 2014)

the Other Mike said:


> Worth the bed ? YES
> 
> Worth the shower? YES
> 
> ...


The food is ok,but at least when I have the sleeper I don't have to lug my fried chicken,pound cake,ritz crackers,cheese,water.capri sun,loaf of bread,potato chips,candy,fruit,lunch meat,mayo,mustard,tuna fish,forks,spoons.plates,etc and thats just for me. lol


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## kiwiaz (Mar 7, 2014)

jimhudson said:


> kiwiaz said:
> 
> 
> > I was looking forward to trying out the new lounge in LA a couple of weeks ago. It was randomly closed with no signage for explanation. :-(
> ...


Thanks for the tip - I may just try that! I did try asking at the information desk (after fruitlessly tugging on locked doors) and just got told it was closed today but they didn't know why. :unsure:

Other than that I got to experience a Pacific Parlor Car (for the first half of my trip - when I rejoined a different train we had an SSL substituted), joined the wine and cheese tasting (before it disappears), and discovered why so many folks on here want train journeys to just keep going... I could have happily stayed on board another day or two at least.


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