# Lake Shore no Sleeping cars Sep 2016



## Thomas Morgan (Jun 11, 2016)

Have tickets for LSL BOS to CHI on Sept 7. Notified that there are no sleeping cars BOS to ALB - track work. Does this really mean that we will be bused?


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## daybeers (Jun 11, 2016)

Thomas Morgan said:


> Have tickets for LSL BOS to CHI on Sept 7. Notified that there are no sleeping cars BOS to ALB - track work. Does this really mean that we will be bused?


No, that means you will change trains to the train right across the platform with only coach cars and a cafe car. That train runs from ALB to BOS.


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## Guest (Jun 11, 2016)

By bused, I meant from BOS to ALB. Seems strange that there would be no sleeping cars because of track work. I have been bused from SPG to ALB before because of track work.


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## daybeers (Jun 11, 2016)

Guest said:


> By bused, I meant from BOS to ALB. Seems strange that there would be no sleeping cars because of track work. I have been bused from SPG to ALB before because of track work.


There are no sleeping cars BOS to ALB because of track work happening at the ALB station. They are working on multiple tracks and switches. Usually, the crew switches the cars around so that one sleeper car, a few coaches, a cafe car, and an engine go to BOS, while the rest of the consist goes to NYP. However, due to the track work, it is too difficult to switch cars around. Therefore, they just have a different train with its own consist from BOS to ALB. This happens going both directions: west to CHI and east to BOS.


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## Guest (Jun 11, 2016)

Now I get it, Thanks


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## daybeers (Jun 11, 2016)

Guest said:


> Now I get it, Thanks


No problem!


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## AG1 (Jun 11, 2016)

You might be bussed if there is *track work* *other than at ALB*. That is the usual situation on that line . The sleeper has been removed BOS to ALB for many months, now. That is a separate event. Contact Amtrak and they will be able too give you the exact dates for service disruption for track work and bustitution. Ask for a supervisor if the first agent can't answer your question. Amtrak sells the sleeper space then emails the next day that there is no sleeper. It happened to me and others a month a go. Make sure you are not charged for the sleeper. I was and had to request a voucher.

*edit for clarity


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## Thomas (Jun 11, 2016)

I booked awhile ago using points (old system). They offered to rebook under the new system for an additional 16K points.


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## Mjo (Jun 11, 2016)

We booked roomettes from Chicago to Boston in July and were notified of the same thing. They refunded some money, though frankly I doubt it would have prorated to what we paid for our roomettes minus the Albany-Boston leg. It's a disappointment, especially if we are late coming into Boston, which apparently is common (kids could be sleeping). Nothing we can do about it though, and it's not the longest stretch in the world, so trying to accept and be positive. Hopefully we don't have too many other rearrangements. I'm more worried about missing a connection in Chicago.


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## Palmetto (Jun 12, 2016)

There used to be a move that involved 449 [in this example] getting to Renssalaer by coming in from the south on the CSX Hudson Division. It involved travelling further west on the Berkshire Division, past the Post Road Branch, and then down a connecting track to the CSX Hudson Division. This was prior to Amtrak's restoring the current trackage on the Post Road Branch. It required a back-up move, IIRC, and there was a trainman at the rear of the train to keep in contact with the engineer.

If Amtrak wished to do so, I believe it would still be possible to make that move.


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## jis (Jun 12, 2016)

To get the train then to face the right way they'll also have to Wye it at LAB. I don't see this happening, even if they could work around the issue of regularly backing a fully loaded train many miles on a higher speed track. Stuyvesant where the Berkshire Connection meets the Water Level Route is smack dab in the middle of the 110mph section.


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## norfolkwesternhenry (Jun 12, 2016)

Thomas Morgan said:


> Have tickets for LSL BOS to CHI on Sept 7. Notified that there are no sleeping cars BOS to ALB - track work. Does this really mean that we will be bused?


 I have already done this, you get off in Albany and walk 20 feet, into an Amfleet cafe/buisness car, buisness seats for Sleeper, Coach seats for Coach, number is same, 448/449


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## oregon pioneer (Jun 12, 2016)

I have not heard of a timeline to finish the project. I sure hope it is done by November 2017 (the earliest I could possibly travel that way), and the sleeper restored to the Boston section.


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## RSG (Jun 12, 2016)

norfolkwesternhenry said:


> Thomas Morgan said:
> 
> 
> > Have tickets for LSL BOS to CHI on Sept 7. Notified that there are no sleeping cars BOS to ALB - track work. Does this really mean that we will be bused?
> ...


When I did it in January, it was slightly more than 20 feet and it involved going down an escalator or elevator to the lower track for the continuing train to BOS. My TA-S was the nicest in helping me with one of my bags to the platform, which helped make up for the surly Boston-based conductor on the continuing train who berated a passenger because she turned the wrong way into the coach car.


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## Palmetto (Jun 13, 2016)

jis said:


> To get the train then to face the right way they'll also have to Wye it at LAB. I don't see this happening, even if they could work around the issue of regularly backing a fully loaded train many miles on a higher speed track. Stuyvesant where the Berkshire Connection meets the Water Level Route is smack dab in the middle of the 110mph section.


I believe the back up move was on the connection down to the Hudson Division, so we were already facing in the correct direction. We then ran north at track speed into Renssalaer. It wasn't a bad move, considering.

Edit: I just checked it on Google Maps and the connection is still there. And yes, the back up move is on the connection, not in the high speed running area down on the Hudson Division. There are also three tracks on the Hudson Division at that point to stay out of the way of the Empire Service trains. Again, not an impossible move if Amtrak wanted to do it.


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## jis (Jun 13, 2016)

Palmetto said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > To get the train then to face the right way they'll also have to Wye it at LAB. I don't see this happening, even if they could work around the issue of regularly backing a fully loaded train many miles on a higher speed track. Stuyvesant where the Berkshire Connection meets the Water Level Route is smack dab in the middle of the 110mph section.
> ...


I don't know what you are looking at, but there are no three main line tracks between Stuyvesant and Albany. Only two tracks.

You are correct about the backup move. I had forgotten what the track alignment is. Should have remembered since we used that for the Hudson River Excursion which ran up the east shore and back down the west shore crossing the river using that connection.

As for Amtrak, they have shown quite clearly that for whatever reason they don't want it. It is likely that the state of the interlocking is such at present in Ren that even if they got the twot rains there they would not be able to do the necessary shunting reliably, specially if the southbound Adirondack is running little late. Afterall, it is not like they cannot get the two trains on the same track at Ren even now. The tracks are not completely disconnected. They are just awkward.


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## Palmetto (Jun 13, 2016)

Jis, I said "three tracks", not "three main tracks". The connection drops down along side the Hudson Division and becomes a third track for a while, before joining the Main1 a bit further south.


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## jis (Jun 13, 2016)

Yes but there is no third track to Albany from where it joins. That was my point. But I can see how I misunderstood what you were trying to say and responded based on the misunderstanding. Sorry about that.


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## mycalpal (Jun 14, 2016)

I am taking this trip later this week when I get off the Empire Builder in Chicago and get on the Lake Shore Limited. I take this trip every year, sometimes twice a year or more. I usually book the sleeper to Albany, spend Father's Day there and get back on the Lake Shore Limited to Boston and go on the Maine and double back. Even for the trip from Albany to Boston and back I book the Roomette which gives me a private restroom, a light dinner to Boston and a lunch from Boston to Albany as well as access to Club Acela in Boston while I wait for the Lake Shore Limited to leave Boston. The track work has been going on for well over a year and I was contacted only a couple of weeks before my departure last year to let me know that my sleeper from Albany to Boston and back was cancelled and I would be traveling coach class on the "stub train" they have going back and forth from Boston to Albany. I have talked to some of my friends at Amtrak and they said the Boston Sleeper car should return when the track work is finished.

I was surprised by the consist when I boarded in Chicago last year as I had learned from my trips over the years to book one of the New York sleepers if I was getting off in Albany anyway and to book the Boston Sleeper only if I was taking it straight to Boston or booking it for just the Alb to Bos portions as is the last car of the train. When you board in Boston the diner was just past the two NY sleeper cars, so a short walk. From the Boston Sleeper you had to walk through the two Boston coaches and the cafe car and another 4-5 coaches going to NY before you get to the diner.

Last year the sleepers were in a different place on the current consist, I am assuming they are the same now and I will see this Friday, June 17th when I board. Last year, they were actually seating the Sleeping car passengers connecting in Albany to Boston in a small Business class section in the lounge car. I don't know if they are still doing that, but it if you paid for a sleeper from Boston to Albany and are continuing to Boston you might as well ask. Good Luck and enjoy your trip!


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## Palmetto (Jun 14, 2016)

jis said:


> Yes but there is no third track to Albany from where it joins. That was my point. But I can see how I misunderstood what you were trying to say and responded based on the misunderstanding. Sorry about that.


No problem. I've done this move many years ago, on Amtrak. The crew had it down to a tee. And since you arrive on the Hudson Division in 110 MPH territory, as you stated, it would be a zippy trip up to Ren. They're detouring the Sunset. Why not this DAILY train. I'm willing to bet that current leadership ar Amtrak doesn't even know about this option or that they used it when the LSL first started running.


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## Kami (Jun 14, 2016)

I made this trip recently and yes, they had a business class section for us sleepers. If you showed your sleeper boarding pass at the cafe you go a free sandwich, chips, and drink.... Do that as soon as the cafe opens, even if you aren't hungry right then. They ran out of sandwiches after maybe twenty minutes, and it wasn't busy in the cafe at all. I think they only brought 3-4 of each kind.


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## Palmetto (Jun 14, 2016)

There seems to be no valid reason to run out of stuff, especially on a short trip like this. After all, the train is all-reserved, and Amtrak should have a pretty good idea of how many people are going to be on board. I realize it's not quite as simple as that, but don't they have any metrics in place per train about food consumption. Maybe I'm dreaming, and there's not even such a thing.

So what is the bottom line reason for this situation to obtain? Fear of waste? Anyone?


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## the_traveler (Jun 14, 2016)

Not trying to make excuses for them, but there is no commissary in ALB, so all the food has to be loaded in BOS before 449 departs. Who knows the amount of meals consumed by passengers on 449. What is available to be sold to passengers on 448 is the food not sold to 449 passengers.


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## Palmetto (Jun 15, 2016)

It is certainly true that trains are not planes regarding food consumption. However, airlines have a similar problem: how many snack boxes should be put aboard for purchase by economy passengers. And their snack boxes, from what I can tell, contain items that are not susceptible to short-term spoilage.


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## jis (Jun 15, 2016)

Palmetto said:


> It is certainly true that trains are not planes regarding food consumption. However, airlines have a similar problem: how many snack boxes should be put aboard for purchase by economy passengers. And their snack boxes, from what I can tell, contain items that are not susceptible to short-term spoilage.


This is true of only US and certain other domestic and cheapo flights. Most airlines in the world actually still serve way more than just snack boxes, and go all the way to full five course meals on board which are exactly as spoilable as food served on Amtrak, and in addition they have much more severe weight issues than does Amtrak. Even on domestic flights of several US airlines there is full food service in First Class on flights longer than usually two hours or so and which span a meal hour.


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## Palmetto (Jun 15, 2016)

Airlines do, though, run out of entrees in first class. It's happened to me more than once, which is why I like a seat in Row 2!


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## jis (Jun 15, 2016)

Depends on the airline. The US3 yes. The EU3 slightly less often, The ME3 less often so. Singapore Airlines, hardly ever.

Of course slowly that is becoming a thing of the past as now many airlines allow you to pre-reserve what food you'd like, and naturally that is what you are served, and the menu is much richer than the three or four items that are available on a generic menu flight.. AA has just started it and looks like DL and UA will follow soon.

I experienced this first in the mid 90s on Singapore Airlines on a short 4 hour flight between Singapore and Kolkata. It was really nice.


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## Triley (Jun 16, 2016)

RSG said:


> norfolkwesternhenry said:
> 
> 
> > Thomas Morgan said:
> ...


Just a small nit pick... It was not a surly Boston based conductor. Not sure if it's Albany or Springfield that they're based out of, but I can tell you that Boston only crews trains on the Northeast Corridor.


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## OBS (Jun 16, 2016)

It would be Albany based...


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## RSG (Jun 16, 2016)

Triley said:


> RSG said:
> 
> 
> > norfolkwesternhenry said:
> ...





OBS said:


> It would be Albany based...


Interesting. Well, he had a Boston accent and departed the train at South Station (does the LSL overnight the crews in Boston?). But, thinking back on it, he could have been a transplant.


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## Palmetto (Jun 17, 2016)

I've got a strong Boston accent. Some people from Florida used to ask me if I'm from New York. Maybe it was a New York accent? :unsure:


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## AmtrakBlue (Jun 17, 2016)

I'm from GA but have lived in DE most of my life. People are always asking if I'm from Boston or England.


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## jis (Jun 17, 2016)

In my case, people just start off with the assumption that they will not understand whatever accent I might have, and then after exchanging two or three sentences they relax and stop squinting at me, and just carry on a conversation.  And occasionally they even say something like "You speak English very well", indicating that I far exceeded their expectation and then some  I guess the expectations are set by whatver they hear from the call centers or something like that.


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## AmtrakBlue (Jun 17, 2016)

jis said:


> In my case, people just start off with the assumption that they will not understand whatever accent I might have, and then after exchanging two or three sentences they relax and stop squinting at me, and just carry on a conversation.  And occasionally they even say something like "You speak English very well", indicating that I far exceeded their expectation and then some  I guess the expectations are set by whatver they hear from the call centers or something like that.


Unfortunately, for the hard of hearing, like myself, any accent can be difficult to understand. 

I'm glad we're friends on line because I can understand you so much better...until you start talking about technical stuff.


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## RSG (Jun 17, 2016)

Palmetto said:


> I've got a strong Boston accent. Some people from Florida used to ask me if I'm from New York. Maybe it was a New York accent? :unsure:


Could be; but I went to college with a girl from Yonkers so I know that general accent (recognizing there are differences between that part of the city and other boroughs, even) and the “pahk the cahr in Hahvahd Yahd” stereotype and his was more the latter than the former. But as AmtrakBlue has said, if one has changed residences in life it can seem muddled to others. This conductor also had the look as if he would be right at home in any neighborhood bar in Southie.


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## Bob Dylan (Jun 17, 2016)

I'm from Texas, spent 25 years in the NE, traveled and lived all over the world but still can't speak English, even Texans can't understand me! 

The New Yorker I know that doesn't sound like a New Yorker is Alan B, but Boston Mike is definitely from Boston.

As for jis,I'm with Betty,I understand you perfectly till you start the technical stuff!


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## the_traveler (Jun 17, 2016)

I have a speech impediment of sorts, so many think I have an accent. When talking, I've been asked, "You have an accent I can not place, where are you from?"

My answer throws them off. "The US!"


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