# VIA 'Atlantic' Nostalgia



## NS VIA Fan (Nov 14, 2021)

'First' Last Run – 40 years ago today: November 14-15 1981

Most would say the last scheduled passenger trains in Maine until the launch of Amtrak's _Downeaster_ in 2001 were Boston and Maine's RDC runs between Boston and Portland in 1965 or the Grand Trunk Portland-Montreal summer only 'passenger specials' that lasted 'till 1967......but it was actually VIA Rail Canada's _Atlantic_ that made their last runs....40 years ago today and overnight: November 14-15, 1981.

The _Atlantic Limited_ was originally a CPR train between Montreal and Saint John, New Brunswick running on 200 miles of Canadian Pacific across the State of Maine.......then extended to Halifax by VIA in 1979

The _Atlantic_ did come back again in June 1985 and lasted another 9 1/2 years until it made a second and final Last Run on December 16, 1994. Maine was again Freight Only until the launch of Amtrak _Downeaster_ 6 years later almost to the day on December 15, 2001.

Below is that 'First' Last Run of westbound VIA #11 the _Atlantic_ at Truro, Nova Scotia on November 14, 1981. The train crossed the US/CAN Border twice (think of those logistics today) First at Vanceboro, ME at 8:40pm then reentered Canada between Jackman ME and Megantic QC around 1:45am with an arrival in Montreal at 7am on the 15th.

6773 FPA-4
6860 FPB-4
9645 Baggage
5519 Coach
5594 Coach
750 Café Lounge
5738 DayNiter Coach
1350 Diner
1087 Cape Breton 2bdr 2comp Sleeper Lounge
1163 Greenmount 6-6-4 Sleeper
1179 Green Ridge 6-6-4 Sleeper
1181 Greenwich 6-6-4 Sleeper










And to put another New England twist on it: although not in the consist for the last run......ex Boston and Maine and Bangor and Aroostook 6-6-4 Pullman Standard (Worcester) sleepers were regulars on the _Atlantic_

Here they are just a couple of weeks earlier at Saint John. Back in the '50s.....they would have been in Saint John as the through sleeper from Boston on the jointly operated B&M-MEC-CP _Gull_

And at Moncton on November 2, 1981. Six hours earlier their west-east route across Maine on the _Atlantic_ would have crossed the Bangor and Aroostook Railroad route they once took as the through sleepers between Boston and Van Buren ME on the _Potatoland Special_


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## jiml (Nov 14, 2021)

Ah, memories.


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## joelkfla (Nov 14, 2021)

Was the train sealed while crossing Maine, or did it accept passengers?


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## fdaley (Nov 14, 2021)

joelkfla said:


> Was the train sealed while crossing Maine, or did it accept passengers?



In the Atlantic's last incarnation, from 1985-94, most of the cars were sealed, but there was one coach door where Maine passengers could board or detrain at Jackman, Greenville, Brownville Junction, Mattawamkeag, Danforth and Vanceboro. There were two pairs of U.S. customs officers who rode the trains, one based in Jackman and the other in Vanceboro. They traded places when the eastbound and westbound trains passed outside Greenville so they could return to their home bases. They interviewed anyone detraining in Maine. If you boarded in Maine, you were interviewed by Canadian customs officers at Megantic or McAdam.


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## NS VIA Fan (Nov 14, 2021)

Here's the Atlantic Timetable from June 1981. Passengers could also ride between two stations within Maine.


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## jiml (Nov 14, 2021)

It was not unusual for officers from either side to "roust" sleeper passengers - particularly eastbound in the '90's. Our last trip before discontinuation it seemed we had just gotten back to sleep after the US inspection only to have Canadian authorities banging on the door. After that experience we used the northern (all-Canadian) trains for subsequent trips. I didn't get a vote.


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## fdaley (Nov 14, 2021)

jiml said:


> It was not unusual for officers from either side to "roust" sleeper passengers - particularly eastbound in the '90's. Our last trip before discontinuation it seemed we had just gotten back to sleep after the US inspection only to have Canadian authorities banging on the door. After that experience we used the northern (all-Canadian) trains for subsequent trips. I didn't get a vote.



As I recall, there was a period after the train was revived in 1985 when U.S. customs was waking everyone up at Vanceboro and Jackman, which was obviously really unpopular, and this resulted in the deal to have the U.S. agents ride the train so they could verify the doors were secure and only interview the comparatively small number of people detraining in Maine. The whole point of this was to not disturb people who were traveling through between Canadian points, which was the vast majority of passengers. So it's just beyond dumb that you would been subjected to this. 

In my own experiences traveling to and from the stations in central and western Maine in the late '80s and early '90s, I remember the U.S. agents being pretty respectful of the through passengers' sleep. But heading west from Maine, I did always dread the 3 a.m. knock at the door from Canadian customs at Megantic. Most of those inspections were pretty low-key, but there was one trip when they insisted that everyone who'd boarded in Maine had to come inside the Megantic station and empty our luggage onto a counter there. I think there were eight or ten of us on that trip. There were also a couple of trips when I got up at Megantic, expecting to be interviewed, and no agent ever came to my room.


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## NS VIA Fan (Nov 14, 2021)

As a Canadian riding through the US...we'd be inspected by US agents but when we reentered Canada at Magantic or McAdam seldom did we ever see Canadian Customs. I know I had been 'Officially' admitted to the US but I've always wondered.....was I ever 'Officially' back in Canada??


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## fdaley (Nov 14, 2021)

NS VIA Fan said:


> Here's the Atlantic Timetable from June 1981. Passengers could also ride between two stations within Maine.
> 
> View attachment 25499



The eastbound schedule was very similar to this on all of my trips in the late '80s and '90s. The westbound ran about 90 minutes later than this, arriving at Montreal about 8:30 a.m. The stops at Cookshire, Scotstown, Harvey and Westfield Beach weren't revived when the train resumed in 1985. 

For a brief period after the service resumed in '85, the eastbound ran quite a bit later -- enough so that the portion east of Brownville Junction would have been in daylight in the summer months. Alas, I never got to ride it during that time; the entire state of Maine was always covered in darkness on every one of my trips. It's too bad, as there was some great scenery going through the western half of the state -- the Boundary Mountains along the Quebec border, hugging the shore of Moosehead Lake, and crossing the high Onawa trestle. If I was awake and had a berth or a room, I would try to look out and see as much as I could by moonlight.


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## AmtrakMaineiac (Nov 20, 2021)

Rode the Atlantic back in 1981 from Montreal to Truro where we changed for the RDC to Sydney NS. We were originally planning to fly home but enjoyed the trip so much we canceled our flight and got reservations to go back by train. I remember trying to get sleepers on the Ocean but they were sold out so we went back on the Atlantic. I recall we had a bedroom in one of the Manor sleepers both ways.


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## jiml (Nov 20, 2021)

AmtrakMaineiac said:


> I recall we had a bedroom in one of the Manor sleepers both ways.


Getting a Manor sleeper on either of the Eastern trains in 1981 would be a real treat! Both trains were usually relegated ex-CN E-series or "Green" sleepers then, as shown in the initial photos by @NS VIA Fan, with the CP cars usually found on Western routes.


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## fdaley (Nov 20, 2021)

I remember the E-series and Green cars, and I recall having a lower berth in one of the E cars a couple of times in the late '80s. But I think all of those cars vanished after the 1990 cuts. Anytime I had a sleeper on the Atlantic in the early '90s, it was one of the Chateau cars, which VIA did a great job of restoring around that time. 

Until the conversion to HEP in late '92, VIA also still offered the extra-fare Dayniter coaches, which came with pillow and blanket. These were a good alternative eastbound if I was getting off at Brownville Junction at 2:30 a.m.


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## NS VIA Fan (Nov 20, 2021)

AmtrakMaineiac said:


> I recall we had a bedroom in one of the Manor sleepers both ways.





jiml said:


> Getting a Manor sleeper on either of the Eastern trains in 1981 would be a real treat! Both trains were usually relegated ex-CN E-series or "Green" sleepers then, as shown in the initial photos by @NS VIA Fan, with the CP cars usually found on Western routes.



Checking through some consist notes.....I caught a couple of 'Manors' on the Atlantics at Truro NS on August 2, 1981: 'Cornwall Manor' eastbound and 'Cameron Manor' (below) heading west.




As the early '80s progressed.....more exCP equipment appeared in the east and on the Ocean after the Atlantic was discontinued. The first dome car was a 'Skyline' in March 1984 and then a 'Park' on the Ocean in May 1984.

After the Atlantic was reinstated in June 1985....it got the 'Park Car' when the Ocean was cutback to a Moncton-Montreal only train. 

Atlantic at McAdam in June 1985.......


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## jiml (Nov 20, 2021)

fdaley said:


> I remember the E-series and Green cars, and I recall having a lower berth in one of the E cars a couple of times in the late '80s. But I think all of those cars vanished after the 1990 cuts. Anytime I had a sleeper on the Atlantic in the early '90s, it was one of the Chateau cars, which VIA did a great job of restoring around that time.
> 
> Until the conversion to HEP in late '92, VIA also still offered the extra-fare Dayniter coaches, which came with pillow and blanket. These were a good alternative eastbound if I was getting off at Brownville Junction at 2:30 a.m.


Agreed, but seeing a Manor sleeper east of Montreal in 1981 as posted was unusual. Even the Toronto section of the Canadian/Super Continental seldom saw them at that time. I remember our trip west in 1980 featuring an almost all-CN consist until Sudbury, where it merged with the gorgeous primary section out of Montreal.


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## NS VIA Fan (Nov 20, 2021)

fdaley said:


> Until the conversion to HEP in late '92, VIA also still offered the extra-fare Dayniter coaches, which came with pillow and blanket. These were a good alternative eastbound if I was getting off at Brownville Junction at 2:30 a.m.



The original Dayniters were converted coaches with good window spacing. Later on some sleepers went through the conversion and you might find yourself next to a wall....No View!


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## fdaley (Nov 20, 2021)

jiml said:


> Agreed, but seeing a Manor sleeper east of Montreal in 1981 as posted was unusual. Even the Toronto section of the Canadian/Super Continental seldom saw them at that time. I remember our trip west in 1980 featuring an almost all-CN consist until Sudbury, where it merged with the gorgeous primary section out of Montreal.



Oh, I don't ever recall seeing a Manor car east of Montreal in the late '80s or early '90s, even after the Ocean and Atlantic converted to HEP. VIA seemed to prioritize them for the Canadian. But I guess it did happen occasionally, as the photos above show.


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## jiml (Nov 20, 2021)

There's a lot of memories in this thread, having had many great trips on both routes since the start of VIA. That said, I still have yet to travel in a Renaissance car (other than walking through or using the shower), being spoiled with a room in the Park car every time on the modern Ocean.


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## fdaley (Nov 20, 2021)

I also have yet to ride one of the Renaissance sleepers. Our last trip to the Maritimes was in 2003, when those cars were just making their debut, but we had stainless steel consists both ways on the Ocean. We actually had a drawing room in one of the Chateau cars on the way back from Halifax to St. Lambert.

And of course, since 2001, all of our trips to Maine have been on the Downeaster.


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## joelkfla (Nov 20, 2021)

I already posted this on another thread, but here's a Simply Railway video of a trip in an Ocean Renaissance sleeper last month. Everything looks pretty normal, except for the absence of the Park car. Diner selections are good and look well prepared and nicely served.


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