# Compressed Natural Gas Train



## Guest

I was wondering, has anyone ever proposed or built a train or light rail to run on clean natural gas like many city buses do?


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## Ross

BN (prior to merger with ATSF) had several diesel sets modified to operate on CNG. Two units operated with a modified CNG tank car used as a fuel tender coupled between them.

Ross


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## Swede

A swedish Y1 (italian diesel train, not sure what they're called in english - in swedish they are literally called "engine wagon", ie basically a passenger wagon with it's own engine and "cockpit") has been converted to run on biogas.

There is a picture of it here:

http://www.jarnvag.net/bild/vagnguide/extY...inehamn2005.jpg

And some more info on the Y1 (in swedish, but the basic data should be understandable)

http://www.jarnvag.net/vagnguide/Y1.asp


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## Guest

Swede said:


> A swedish Y1 (italian diesel train, not sure what they're called in english - in swedish they are literally called "engine wagon", ie basically a passenger wagon with it's own engine and "cockpit") has been converted to run on biogas.
> There is a picture of it here:
> 
> http://www.jarnvag.net/bild/vagnguide/extY...inehamn2005.jpg
> 
> And some more info on the Y1 (in swedish, but the basic data should be understandable)
> 
> http://www.jarnvag.net/vagnguide/Y1.asp


Probably the closest thing would be a DMU, which often run in single or double unites (even if it is a contradiction of terms) or a "railbus". It's interesting to know some research and application has been done though.


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## George Harris

This has been discussed before. The BN experiment had to have a waiver from the normal hazardous materials handling rules to even happen. That is you are not allowed, as was required to make this system work, to have a tank car of compressed flamable gas adjacent to an engine. I don't think the crews were overly thrilled about riding all day every day next to a propane tank, either. I would not consider this the best use of a finite resource, in any case.

If we wnat to get serious about weaning ourselves from fossil fuels, then it has got to be hydro power, geothermal, nuclear, and string wires over the tracks. Everything else is primarily a way to look like we are doing something when we really are not.

This 3% and such ethanol? Give me a break! We could reduce petroleum consumption by more than that by just better planning in driving around. In fact you can save more than that just by changing your driving habits to slower rates of acceleration and better anticipation of needing to stop and slow down so your foot spends less time on the brakes without changing the distances you drive at all.

George


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## Swede

George Harris said:


> If we wnat to get serious about weaning ourselves from fossil fuels, then it has got to be hydro power, geothermal, nuclear, and string wires over the tracks. Everything else is primarily a way to look like we are doing something when we really are not.


This is exactly what I think also. The US should electrify more track. It is not cheap, but it is doable, just look at other countries!


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## Guest

Trust me, I understand that a fully electric train system is the way to go. But what are the odds of that any time soon? I hadn't really thought about the risk of explosion, that is a good point.

I would personally advocate an electric high speed direct line being built between NYP and Chicago. Using Japanese or TGV technology it could compete with airlines at 5 hours.


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