# The Canadian: Winter vs. Spring, 2018



## Dakota 400 (Apr 28, 2017)

I would appreciate opinions as to which season would be the most scenic to travel from Vancouver to Toronto on The Canadian. Would late April or early to mid-May be too late to see snow on top of the mountains in the Canadian Rockies?

Opinions are appreciated as well about Sleeper Plus Class vs. Prestige Class on The Canadian.

Thank you for your opinions and experiences!


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## zephyr17 (Apr 29, 2017)

There will ALWAYS be snow on top of the Canadian Rockies (i.e. Mt. Robson). At track level, maybe, maybe not.

Take Sleeper Plus in the off-season, so you have all-day access t the Park car. Late April would do.

I would always take Sleeper Plus, as those are traditional railroad accommodations. Prestige, they tubed out they cars and they bear no resemblance to their original layout. The big thing about Prestige is the bed big enough to sleep two people. If that is important to you, take Prestige if you have the money, otherwise do Sleeper Plus. The meals are the same, and you can buy an awful lot of booze (included for Prestige) for the price differential, pretty much enough to destroy your liver if you are so inclined.

I ride the Canadian about once a year, off season in Sleeper Plus.

I am a big fan of the off-season. The last few years I have taken the Canadian in either November or March, when it is a "normal" train (eight cars, not a 26 car monster), and I have a great time.


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## Montreal Ltd (May 2, 2017)

I rode The Canadian from Vancouver to Toronto about 5 weeks ago. More daylight in the Rockies that direction. First things I did before booking were A-check Daylight Time, started March 12. B-check Easter, April 16. High season began May 1 this year. Rode March 21-25 in a Cabin for One. Fantastic trip. Do not make plans for day of arrival because you WILL be late.


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## Montreal Ltd (May 2, 2017)

Arrived Toronto Sat pm, and from my 11th floor window at the Royal York, got to see the westbound Canadian pull out of Union Station right on time!


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## Dakota 400 (May 3, 2017)

Thank you Montreal Ltd and zephyr17 for your responses.

It is helpful to know that your arrival into Toronto was in the PM and not the scheduled AM. Do you recall the approximate time in the PM that the Canadian arrived?


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## zephyr17 (May 3, 2017)

Second Montreal's recommendation on taking the eastbound trip, for the same reason...more time in the Rockies. That is what I always do now and will continue to do on one-way Canadian trips.

Last two times I took it, we were actually a bit early into Toronto, but you absolutely cannot count on that. Another time we got in about 2 pm. Arrival time with the Canadian is an absolute crapshoot, make no firm plans in advance except to have a room reserved and be happily surprised if you are on time.

BTW-the Strathcona is a good, less expensive alternative to the Royal York in downtown Toronto. Pretty much across the street from Union Station, too, it is a walk of a few more yards to their lobby as opposed to the Royal York. The rooms are quite small, but very nice. Also, those the times the Canadian was on time, they let me check in wayyyyy early.


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## Dakota 400 (May 7, 2017)

When one makes a reservation for a Sleeper Plus accommodation on The Canadian, is one informed as to whether the reservation is for a Manor Car or a Chateau Car Cabin? Does it make a difference as to which Car one is assigned?


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## zephyr17 (May 8, 2017)

They know and will tell you if you ask, but you will have to ask, what they will tell you automatically is the car number and accommodation number. Since I travel in roomettes, I don't like the Chateaus, since they have duplex roomettes and the duplex roomettes are smaller than the standard roomettes in the Manor. Manors are the standard sleepers on the Canadian, while Chateaus are used, they are not that common in the non-summer period when plenty of Manors are available.

If you are picky about accommodation, call for a reservation. The way Via works is a room will automatically be assigned, but the agent can change it. Personally, I like to be in the rear-most Sleeper Plus Manor, and ask for that.


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## Montreal Ltd (May 8, 2017)

My #2 got into Toronto shortly before 2pm.


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## Dakota 400 (May 8, 2017)

Thanks again for the information!

zephyr17, I am picky about accommodations. If I am going to spend what one must to travel, I want the best that I can obtain for the money I am willing to spend.

Your suggestion about requesting the rear-most Sleeper Plus Manor Car raises the question in my mind as to what might the probable consist of The Canadian be? Via Rail's web site page for The Canadian says "3 Classes, 9 Cars". I count 8 car types listed. Is there only one Sleeper Plus Car? Where might the Sleeper Plus Car(s) be located in relation to the Park Car?

From previous visits to the Via Rail's The Canadian page, it is my understanding that the Park Car is available whenever to Sleeper Plus guests during the off-season. Or. has that changed for the Fall, 2017 and Winter/Spring, 2018?


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## NS VIA Fan (May 9, 2017)

I’ve posted this link here before….but this will give you some info on a winter trip on the Canadian a couple of years ago. Consist would be similar except Prestige Class sleepers will now be added ahead of the Park Car:

http://discuss.amtraktrains.com/index.php?/topic/58023-a-winter-ride-on-vias-canadian-with-photos/


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## zephyr17 (May 9, 2017)

Last winter the basic consist was:

Bag/dorm

Coach

Skyline (coach accessible)

2 Manor sleepers (Sleeper Plus)

Diner

2 Manor sleepers (Sleeper Plus)

Prestige Chateau

Park Car

In the summer, the train is 26 cars, with a coach portion (coaches and Skyline), two sleeper portions (Skyline "activity car", diner, Manor sleepers, maybe some unconverted Chateaus in each), Panorama car (car with non-revenue coach style seating and wrap around windows), Prestige Chateau sleepers and the Park car (restricted access for Sleeper Plus).

If you want the rearmost sleeper plus Manor like I do, ask for it. In terms of accommodations, all the Manors are the same, the only difference is the distance to the Park Car and the diner. The Manors run berths forward, roomettes rear. If you get a "Cabin for 2", ask for an "F" room in the Manor. Those are Compartments as opposed to Double Bedrooms and are slightly larger.


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## Dakota 400 (May 10, 2017)

NS VIA Fan said:


> I’ve posted this link here before….but this will give you some info on a winter trip on the Canadian a couple of years ago. Consist would be similar except Prestige Class sleepers will now be added ahead of the Park Car:
> 
> http://discuss.amtraktrains.com/index.php?/topic/58023-a-winter-ride-on-vias-canadian-with-photos/
> 
> Thank you for again posting this link. You are really responsible for my considering a Winter journey on The Canadian as a result of viewing/reading your post. I did an Empire Builder trip during the Winter and it is a favorite memory of mine. That is why I have considered such a trip in Canada.


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## Dakota 400 (May 10, 2017)

So, what to do? Book a late March, 2018 trip this far out? There will be much water "to flow over the dam" before then. I'm hesitant to do so.

Do I risk not being able to book a Cabin for One by booking maybe this late Summer or early Fall for a late Spring Canadian trip?

Given the difference in the price of the Canadian $ and the US $, which is now quite attractive as an American, well, that is another factor to consider.

Opinions would be appreciated. Thank you.


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## Bob Dylan (May 11, 2017)

I suggest you consider booking a Lower Section Berth instead of a Cabin for One.

Much more affordable with the same amenities and the most comfortable bedding I've ever had on a train!

Keep watching via.ca and look for specials, currently the Winter Season Tuesday departures out of Vancouver to Toronto seem to be the best deals as opposed to Toronto to Vancouver.


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## Montreal Ltd (May 11, 2017)

FWIW I booked my trip in August.


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## chakk (May 11, 2017)

Dakota 400 said:


> Thank you Montreal Ltd and zephyr17 for your responses.
> 
> It is helpful to know that your arrival into Toronto was in the PM and not the scheduled AM. Do you recall the approximate time in the PM that the Canadian arrived?


When I took a February trip a couple years ago, my train arrived Toronto at 7 PM. I was just barely able to make the last flight from Pearson Airport back to California on a red-eye. I learned my lesson, and in the future will always plan for a night's stay in Toronto before attempting to return home.


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## Chessie (May 11, 2017)

Sorry to piggyback on this thread but what would be a good price for a one way trip on the great Canadian, Sleeper plus during off season?

I am currently seeing $1062 for a lower berth in late May, is that a good price?


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## zephyr17 (May 11, 2017)

Chessie said:


> Sorry to piggyback on this thread but what would be a good price for a one way trip on the great Canadian, Sleeper plus during off season?
> 
> I am currently seeing $1062 for a lower berth in late May, is that a good price


That is the price on their Sleeper Plus discount page, which is for only for specified departures within a few weeks of departure. The fares offered there are the best you can get, although they vary by time of year. Via's yield management is much simpler than Amtrak's (5 buckets, etc). You basically have full price, a "regular" discount price, and the Sleeper Plus specials (which were sleeper Discount Tuesday prices, but are no longer only offered on Tuesday). So it is quite easy to figure out what is a deal and what isn't.

That special discount price is likely somewhat lower for the off-season (full winter), but you can only book those fares fairly close to the date of travel and may not be available for all departures. The regular "discount" fare for the off-season that is bookable well in advance is $1277 for a lower, inclusive of tax. That is from a "test" booking for 1/23/18.

Bear in mind, those prices are CAD.


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## zephyr17 (May 11, 2017)

Bob Dylan said:


> I suggest you consider booking a Lower Section Berth instead of a Cabin for One.
> 
> Much more affordable with the same amenities and the most comfortable bedding I've ever had on a train!
> 
> Keep watching via.ca and look for specials, currently the Winter Season Tuesday departures out of Vancouver to Toronto seem to be the best deals as opposed to Toronto to Vancouver.


I agree that the bed is the most comfortable on the train, but I will still continue to book roomettes on the Canadian. I like having a door and a power outlets, and the bed isn't that much more comfortable to offset the loss of privacy and availability of power. My personal choice, just pointing out there are trade-offs to be made.


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## Chessie (May 11, 2017)

zephyr17 said:


> Bob Dylan said:
> 
> 
> > I suggest you consider booking a Lower Section Berth instead of a Cabin for One.
> ...


Thanks for the info, @zephyr17 another question, if I book a berth will I have access to power at some other places on the train?


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## zephyr17 (May 11, 2017)

Dakota 400 said:


> So, what to do? Book a late March, 2018 trip this far out? There will be much water "to flow over the dam" before then. I'm hesitant to do so.
> 
> Do I risk not being able to book a Cabin for One by booking maybe this late Summer or early Fall for a late Spring Canadian trip?
> 
> ...


There is no need to book this early for a March 2018 trip. Booking 3 or 4 months out would probably be fine to get a discount fare in a Cabin for One (roomette). If you really wanted to gamble, wait until late March dates start showing up in the Discount Sleeper Plus page (probably early to mid February) and see if there is a Cabin for One on a departure that works for you. However, you'd have to keep your other travel plans on hold until that came through, assuming it did.

On the other side, the exchange really is good right now and there is no telling where it will go. Also, last year I delayed booking (booked about 5 months out) and there was a fare increase between the time I started looking and the time I booked.

I would HIGHLY encourage you to join Via's Preference frequent traveler program. One trip in a roomette or above is over the $999 CAD qualification level for "elite" Privilege status. With Privilege status comes a 50% off coupon for Sleeper Plus on the Canadian that is good at any time. While that "50%" is computed off full high season fare, it is still less than the regular discount fare in the winter and is on about the same level as the special Discount Sleeper Plus prices. And you can book it in advance on pretty much any departure, making planning easy. They've got me hooked now, I ride it every year.


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## zephyr17 (May 11, 2017)

Chessie said:


> zephyr17 said:
> 
> 
> > Bob Dylan said:
> ...


Since I have power in my roomette, I haven't had to look. But I don't recall noticing public or semi public power outlets like the one in the old drink station in the upper level of the Superliner Sightseer Lounges, although that does not mean there weren't any.


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## willem (May 14, 2017)

Bob Dylan said:


> Keep watching via.ca and look for specials, currently the Winter Season Tuesday departures out of Vancouver to Toronto seem to be the best deals as opposed to Toronto to Vancouver.


What is Via's policy regarding exchanging tickets for higher-class accommodations? For example, if I book a Lower Section Berth but a Cabin for One becomes available at a slightly higher (or even lower) price, what penalty do I pay for changing?


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## zephyr17 (May 15, 2017)

Well, according to VIA on the sale page, those Discount Tuesday-ish fares are:


100% non-refundable
Non-exchangeable
Non-transferable
Available for a limited time only.
Valid for online booking only.
Taxes are not included in the prices.
Space at this price is limited
However, that conflicts with the note on the booking page itself, which gives the same conditions that apply to the "normal" discount fare:

Before Departure : Exchangeable and refundable less a *$100.00* plus applicable tax(es) service charge. A fare difference may apply in case of exchange.
After Departure : *Non-exchangeable and non-refundable.*

So I am really not sure. Since the special fares have to be ticketed online and you'd have to have an agent process an upgrade, I think I tend to go with the more restrictive conditions.


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## Lonestar648 (Jun 16, 2017)

The fare you see on the VIA site is in Canadian dollars and Canadian taxes, so what have you found the USD amount to be in comparison?

For Seniors traveling, does VIA honor any senior discounts or would only Canadian citizens qualify for senior discounts?

If I take my daughter with me (i am 70, she 40), what room would be the best for us in your opinion?

Thanks.


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## Bob Dylan (Jun 16, 2017)

The Canadian Dollar "Floats" against the US Dollar and has been "Weak" for the past several years. ( ie $1CDN=65-75 cents US so $1,000 CDN= $650-$750 US).

There is a Goods and Service Tax on almost everything in Canada including VIA Fares. ( a combination of Federal and Provencial Tax that varies from Provence to Provence)

Senior Fares are for Anyone over 60.

If you don't mind Sharing a Section(Upper and LowerBerths) y'all will get the Best Fare and still receive all the Sleeper Benefits that Pricey Cabin and Bedroom pax enjoy.They have the most comfortable Beds and Bedding I've ever had on a Train.


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## Lonestar648 (Jun 17, 2017)

Thanks for the update. I am looking at what my 2018 rail excursion will be, so considering the Canadian. AS long as my heath holds, I plan a yearly long trip, a few short ones. I thought the Canadian dollar price on the site was higher than what would pay in USD. Good suggestion about the upper and lower berths.


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## SCbogey (Jun 17, 2017)

Bob Dylan said:


> If you don't mind Sharing a Section(Upper and LowerBerths) y'all will get the Best Fare and still receive all the Sleeper Benefits that Pricey Cabin and Bedroom pax enjoy.They have the most comfortable Beds and Bedding I've ever had on a Train.


Superliner upper berths are not easy entry nor easy sleeping. How do the upper Section berths on VIA Canadian compare to Amtrak Superliner upper berths?


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## Bob Dylan (Jun 18, 2017)

The Upper Berths on VIA in the Sections(Budd Sleeper)don't have a Window but have plenty of HeadRoom, and the Bed is the most comfortable I've ever expierenced on a Train.

One uses a Ladder, just like in the Superliner Bedrooms, to climb up into the Upper Berth which has a heavy curtain covering the side of the Berth instead of a wall to ensure privacy.

The biggest drawback is the lack of Storage space, passengers must check all large bags, and only small carryons and packs ( also small) are permitted in the Sleepers.

The attendants are very good at finding places to hang jackets,sweaters etc but at night your personal stuff has to placed inside your Berth.


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## SCbogey (Jun 18, 2017)

We will use this information in planning our father son bucket list trip on the Canadian, probably Vancouver-Toronto during the off season. Thanks for the help.


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## NS VIA Fan (Jun 19, 2017)

Bob Dylan said:


> One uses a Ladder, just like in the Superliner Bedrooms, to climb up into the Upper Berth which has a heavy curtain covering the side of the Berth instead of a wall to ensure privacy.


If you scroll down here 5 pictures...you will see how the Sections/Berths are set up in day/night configuration. Unlike a Superliner Roomette....they are open to the aisle during the day and only a closed heavy curtain at night.

http://members.kos.net/sdgagnon/canb.html

This is from a CPR brochure from the 1960s. Other equipment shown are Duplex Roomettes, VIA calls these "Cabin for 1'. Another style of Cabin for 1 in Manor cars have the rooms all on the main floor and no steep-up.

The Bedrooms shown are now called 'Cabin for 2'


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## Paul CHI (Jun 28, 2017)

My wife and I rode the Canadian from Vancouver to Toronto a couple of years ago, in late January, using a 2 person cabin. We found the trip totally enjoyable despite being -12F in Winnipeg when we got there. Nice to have a toilet in the unit, and the shower down the hall was warm and comfortable. We did not find the short days to be a problem, since there was snow everywhere and the nights were not super dark. The Park car is just wonderful and I wouldn't do a trip of that length if I could not get access.

We pulled into Toronto around noon. I had scheduled an evening flight out of Pearson so we had plenty of time.


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## Everydaymatters (Jun 29, 2017)

Bob Dylan said:


> The Upper Berths on VIA in the Sections(Budd Sleeper)don't have a Window but have plenty of HeadRoom, and the Bed is the most comfortable I've ever expierenced on a Train.
> 
> One uses a Ladder, just like in the Superliner Bedrooms, to climb up into the Upper Berth which has a heavy curtain covering the side of the Berth instead of a wall to ensure privacy.
> 
> ...


There is enough room in the berth for personal stuff. I had a jacket, backpack and large purse and didn't feel crowded in.


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## Palmetto (Jun 29, 2017)

I had a lower berth and will agree with the "most comfortable bed on the train" statement. My small suit case fit under the bed at night, and there was space for the small suitcase for my upper berth companion under my bed. The only public electric outlet was in the common bathroom down the hall, as far as I could tell. I had a scanner, and knowing the lack of outlets in a compartment, I brought a supply of batteries to last the trip. Also, custom has it that the person occupying the lower berth rides forward during the day, while the upper berth occupant rides backwards. Not a problem if you're in the dome all day, though!!


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