# Phase IIIb



## TylerP42 (Nov 23, 2015)

Looks like they may be rebranding to Phase IIIb. Just saw #10001 Beech Grove today in Phase IIIb paint.


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## AC4400 (Nov 23, 2015)

It's an observation car. Notice that there is a private car at the rear.


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## CCC1007 (Nov 23, 2015)

technically yes, its the only one in Amtrak's inventory. 10001 is a former coach and was converted after a wreck damaged it. it was converted to a company service car.


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## Agent (Nov 23, 2015)

_Beech Grove_ as well as AMTK 10021 _Pacific Cape_ have been in Phase III since at least early October and presumably at least a bit earlier than that whenever exactly it was they came out of the shop.


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## lo2e (Nov 23, 2015)

I seem to recall seeing still pictures of 10001 and 10021 in Phase III on the Facebook Northeast Corridor fan page in mid/late September, but I can't seem to find them now. I know that I was at least about a week or two late finding out about the new paint job after it was first spotted.


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## Ryan (Nov 23, 2015)

Discussed here on 9/20:



Amtrak172 said:


> Can someone just bring me up to speed just incase you guys had already talked about this. I was in Philly yesterday and was railfanning the parking garage over Race Street Yard and noticed that the 10021 "Pacific Cape" is now painted in Phase III. It used to be Phase IVb, and from what I've been hearing, the Cape came in to the yard yesterday for its first time back from Beach Grove. The 10001 "Beach Grove" is also now in Phase III. Does anyone know what Amtrak's plans are with the Phase III paint scheme and what cars will get it? Besides the Viewliners and some of the Amfleet II's. Thanks guys


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## jis (Feb 5, 2016)

According to some reports the first Viewliner I in Phase IIIb livery has been spotted in Chicago. It is 62043, also sporting the name plate "New River". So the conversion of Viewliner Is to Phase IIIb livery has begun.


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## CSXfoamer1997 (Feb 5, 2016)

jis said:


> According to some reports the first Viewliner I in Phase IIIb livery has been spotted in Chicago. It is 62043, also sporting the name plate "New River". So the conversion of Viewliner Is to Phase IIIb livery has begun.


Nice! Only question is, why would they make it with the wave logo beside the lettering rather than the logo below the lettering like you see on the Phase V locos?

AND why is it now being named Amtrak America instead of just Amtrak?


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## cirdan (Feb 5, 2016)

CSXfoamer1997 said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > According to some reports the first Viewliner I in Phase IIIb livery has been spotted in Chicago. It is 62043, also sporting the name plate "New River". So the conversion of Viewliner Is to Phase IIIb livery has begun.
> ...


I think there was a thread here some time ago where it was said that "Amtrak America" is the new brand of Amtrak's LD services, I guess setting them apart from the NEC and other corridor services-


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## Ryan (Feb 5, 2016)

Yes, I'm on my phone and can't dig it up, but it was about a year or so ago.


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## TylerP42 (Feb 5, 2016)

Here it is.


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## TylerP42 (Feb 5, 2016)

Better photo.


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## CCC1007 (Feb 5, 2016)

Is that the cardinal?


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## sitzplatz17 (Feb 5, 2016)

Interesting. I assume this was just an outside paint job and the interior mods to match the VIIs haven't been done yet?


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## TylerP42 (Feb 5, 2016)

CCC1007 said:


> Is that the cardinal?


No, just an equipment move.


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## OlympianHiawatha (Feb 5, 2016)

The IIIb looks nice on the Viewliner and matches up with that on the Great Dome.


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## lo2e (Feb 5, 2016)

Haha, that would be an amazing revenue train - a newly-painted V1, dome car, heritage diner, and I think a surfliner coach and a superliner down on the end.


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## me_little_me (Feb 5, 2016)

CSXfoamer1997 said:


> AND why is it now being named Amtrak America instead of just Amtrak?


Because the jealous European rails want to look like their better run American counterparts? :giggle:


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## Ryan (Feb 5, 2016)

CSXfoamer1997 said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > According to some reports the first Viewliner I in Phase IIIb livery has been spotted in Chicago. It is 62043, also sporting the name plate "New River". So the conversion of Viewliner Is to Phase IIIb livery has begun.
> ...





Ryan said:


> Yes, I'm on my phone and can't dig it up, but it was about a year or so ago.


OK, you've got to go all the way back to October 2013 for this one - just a bit more than a year. 

http://discuss.amtraktrains.com/index.php?/topic/57231-amtrak-america-new-ld-train-branding/


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## KnightRail (Feb 5, 2016)

CCC1007 said:


> Is that the cardinal?


That was the Cardnial. Everything ahead of 160 was added at IND.


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## MattW (Feb 5, 2016)

And by the time almost the whole fleet is in Phase IIIb, it'll be time to pointlessly change color schemes again just to keep Amtrak from ever having a uniform fleet.


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## Thirdrail7 (Feb 5, 2016)

TylerP42 said:


> CCC1007 said:
> 
> 
> > Is that the cardinal?
> ...


It was the Cardinal's equipment, CCC1007. They added all of the stuff you see in the picture on top of 51(3) at IND.


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## LDKarr (Feb 5, 2016)

The fleet may have been uniform, but it was also extremely bland. If I were going to rebrand as Amtrak America, I would want to emphasize the red, white, and blue. Granted, the previous scheme used the same basic colors, but it also had a tendency to get lost in the background.


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## Big Iron (Feb 6, 2016)

The Amtrak phase I miss the most.

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=563525&nseq=103


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## Thirdrail7 (Feb 6, 2016)

I have a theory but I'll need a few days to test it. Keep your eyes towards Beech Grove and/or Chicago next week because we may have the wrong idea.


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## Bob Dylan (Feb 6, 2016)

Big Iron said:


> The Amtrak phase I miss the most.
> 
> http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=563525&nseq=103


Rainbow Trains!!!


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## neroden (Feb 6, 2016)

Thirdrail7 said:


> I have a theory but I'll need a few days to test it. Keep your eyes towards Beech Grove and/or Chicago next week because we may have the wrong idea.


Okey-dokey. I like Phase IIIb, however. I'd like to see it everywhere. So I hope I have the right idea.


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## mfastx (Feb 7, 2016)

MattW said:


> And by the time almost the whole fleet is in Phase IIIb, it'll be time to pointlessly change color schemes again just to keep Amtrak from ever having a uniform fleet.


This.


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 7, 2016)

Amtrak's progressive Phase V scheme arrived with the crisp and clean Acela Express and was associated with major capitol improvements and long term recurring increases in passengers and awareness. Now that Amtrak's dining services, sleeper amenities, and loyalty benefits all appear to be on a path of perpetual decline I wonder what Amtrak's 1970's magic marker style Phase IIIb scheme will remind us of in the future.


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## neroden (Feb 7, 2016)

Phase V was, however, hideous-looking and said "corporate drone". Maybe that image worked for Acela.


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## TommyBNSF (Feb 18, 2016)

Might be unrelated, but I noticed a Phase IVb Viewliner on the Lake Shore Limited this morning with what looked to be a name plate. Anyone know which car this is? And on that note, does anyone know where 62043 is at because I've been trying to find it and haven't had any luck.


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## CCC1007 (Feb 18, 2016)

Look south for 62043.


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## Dutchrailnut (Feb 18, 2016)

one of lsl cars is Croton river.a V1 sleeper. all V1 sleepers's are getting river names.

http://www.on-track-on-line.com/amtkrinf-viewname.shtml


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 18, 2016)

Dutchrailnut said:


> one of lsl cars is Croton river.a V1 sleeper. all V1 sleepers's are getting river names.
> 
> http://www.on-track-on-line.com/amtkrinf-viewname.shtml


That's hilarious.

If Amtrak had been in charge of the Titanic the first step on the evacuation checklist would involve renaming and repainting all the lifeboats.


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## PVD (Feb 18, 2016)

Didn't they all have names when they were new (before they wore off or were removed)? I sort of remember seeing them on the end doors when passing between cars. Are they getting their original names back or new ones?


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## Ryan (Feb 18, 2016)

New ones. The old ones were in the series "$FOO View".

Both names are at the above link.


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## jis (Feb 18, 2016)

What is the excitement about? The eastern river names for all Viewliner Sleepers have been known for over a year now.


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## Ryan (Feb 18, 2016)

Apparently some are late to the party.


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## TommyBNSF (Feb 18, 2016)

Ryan said:


> Apparently some are late to the party.


I was only asking because I thought they were waiting until they were repainted into Phase III to get their new name. I guess not for some.


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## Seaboard92 (Feb 20, 2016)

62043 is in Miami or enroute there today from Jacksonville.


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## neroden (Feb 20, 2016)

It's just to keep the guys in the paint shop entertained. Don't want them bored, who knows what they might start painting!


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## Thirdrail7 (Feb 21, 2016)

Thirdrail7 said:


> I have a theory but I'll need a few days to test it. Keep your eyes towards Beech Grove and/or Chicago next week because we may have the wrong idea.



Ok...here is my theory. Mr. Boardman keeps putting out memos about cutting expenses. He is also retiring soon. I knew the 8400 was going to be part of the GCIT, so I was interested in seeing what phase it would have.

My theory is there are numerous inspection/vip/tour trains traversing the nation. It is possible that they are getting a group of cars to make an entire special out of Phase 3? This way, you wouldn't have a mismatched train touring the country. most of the VIP trains have a sleeper or two plus coaches.

I could be wrong. I'm just throwing it out there for comment.


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 21, 2016)

I wonder how much they'd save by _not_ running all these specials, _not_ screwing with the livery, and simply sending Boardman on his merry way.


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## Thirdrail7 (Feb 21, 2016)

Devil's Advocate said:


> I wonder how much they'd save by simply not running all these specials, not changing the livery, and simply sending Boardman on his way.


Mr. Boardman and the livery aside, the specials are likely to operate. Most railroads operate them to inspect their territory or drum up business and/or support for their operation.


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 21, 2016)

Thirdrail7 said:


> Devil's Advocate said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder how much they'd save by simply not running all these specials, not changing the livery, and simply sending Boardman on his way.
> ...


How many railroads routinely operate their own inspection specials on class one foreign territory? What is the point of trying to drum up additional financial losses when you're supposedly trying to balance the budget? If Boardman wants to run a premature victory lap on his way out then maybe he should ride what he's actually selling instead of selling something no actual customer will ever ride.


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## Thirdrail7 (Feb 21, 2016)

Devil's Advocate said:


> Thirdrail7 said:
> 
> 
> > Devil's Advocate said:
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Umm. BNSF, CSX ,Conrail (Shared Assets), UP, and NS to my direct knowledge. Not only have they run them on their own territories, they've run them on other territories. Additionally, it is about showing people the product and seeing if their is support. The GCIT carried a lot of people that can drum up support and hopefully financing for the route, and last I looked, the everything in that consist except for the 10001,10021 and 10004 which bracketed the train, is equipment that the general public has access to.

This is the exact same tactic that Mr. Gunn used when he had inspection trains ply the Harrisburg Line with PA officials. Those trips inspired PA to contribute a boatload of money to funding the operation of the Keystone Corridor.


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## jis (Feb 21, 2016)

Besides, this particular operation of the NOL - JAX inspection train was requested among others by a Republican Senator, a Republican and at least one Democrat Congressperson (one who was on the train with the Senator) and a whole host of Mayors and a few County officials along the route. It would be somewhat foolish IMHO to turn them down.


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 21, 2016)

Thirdrail7 said:


> Devil's Advocate said:
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> 
> > Thirdrail7 said:
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So BNSF, CSX, UP, and NS are *routinely* operating their own hardware inspection specials on *foreign* class one trackage hundreds or even thousands of miles away from their nearest home territory? Because it almost sounds like you're trying to sell a "has it ever happened anywhere at anytime" type of answer to a "does it happen regularly in a similar manner" type of question. There are third party commercial maintenance services and regulatory inspection cars that operate on most if not all class one mainlines, but I am not referring to those.



jis said:


> Besides, this particular operation of the NOL - JAX inspection train was requested among others by a Republican Senator, a Republican and at least one Democrat Congressperson (one who was on the train with the Senator) and a whole host of Mayors and a few County officials along the route. It would be somewhat foolish IMHO to turn them down.


Does anyone really believe that a new or revived NOL-JAX train is going to be funded to anywhere near a net neutral level? If not then Mr Boardman is simply drumming up even more debt that the rest of the staff will be tasked with erasing after he's gone. If Mr. Boardman had gone to bat and won some substantial operating concessions from congress then by all means take your newly invigorated show on the road and enjoy it. Instead Mr. Boardman ended up making unrealistic promises that are virtually guaranteed to fail and set the stage for even harsher attacks in the future.


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## CCC1007 (Feb 21, 2016)

Devil's Advocate said:


> Thirdrail7 said:
> 
> 
> > Devil said:
> ...


Yep, every year they send officer specials to events like the super bowl, and when there is an election year, they also show up for the party conventions.


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## jis (Feb 21, 2016)

It seems to me that you live in an alternate reality where Mr. Boardman has made any promises to anyone. The only thing that he has said repeatedly is that unless there is full funding from the Feds, the state's involved or someone else there will be no train, much to the chagrin of some starry eyed train enthusiasts. Could you identify which promise he has made to whom exactly? I talked to the people involved day before from the cities and counties, at Jacksonville. I did not get the sense that anyone thought any promise had been made. All seem to be quite aware that it is upto them to find the funding or there will be no train. Could you share your sources that suggest someone thinks they will get a train for free? Even those that think the Feds should fund the train understand that Amtrak is not the Feds.


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 21, 2016)

CCC1007 said:


> Devil's Advocate said:
> 
> 
> > Thirdrail7 said:
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Good point. I had not considered Superbowl™ trains and political glad handing. Still wondering how they how they would manage to survive if all they ever brought back was more debt, but I probably should have anticipated that response before asking.



jis said:


> It seems to me that you live in an alternate reality where Mr. Boardman has made any promises to anyone. The only thing that he has said repeatedly is that unless there is full funding from the Feds, the state's involved or someone else there will be no train, much to the chagrin of some starry eyed train enthusiasts. Could you identify which promise he has made to whom exactly? I talked to the people involved day before from the cities and counties, at Jacksonville. I did not get the sense that anyone thought any promise had been made. All seem to be quite aware that it is upto them to find the funding or there will be no train. Could you share your sources that suggest someone thinks they will get a train for free? Even those that think the Feds should fund the train understand that Amtrak is not the Feds.


Boardman promised the food and beverage losses would come to an end in five years with much of that time already spent and only a couple years left to work with. According to _your_ reality this was an simple and easy ploy that has no bearing on anything because Amtrak's growing number of detractors will simply "forget" about any promises made the moment Boardman is gone. His successor will simply disavow any knowledge of such a promise and will be free to start another round of lies that won't reach fruition until just after retirement. Which honestly makes this whole thing sound more like a getaway than a victory lap, but once AU's hive mind has decided what is real there is little if any chance to counter it.


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## Thirdrail7 (Feb 21, 2016)

CCC1007 said:


> Devil's Advocate said:
> 
> 
> > Thirdrail7 said:
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Yes, DA. This is routine. BNSF has their OCS on the east coast multiple times a year. This has been occurring for at least a decade and they have little east coast presence. I can almost mark my calendar that UP will traverse eastern routes even though they have little east coast presence. NS has little action in New England, yet their OCS shows up in Boston. Shared Assets takes some sort of state of the operation joyride over their territory and for the heck of it, operate on NS as well.

As for net neutral, do we have five net neutral passenger operations that own their own territory and receive no subsidy in the United States? Perhaps, but support has to be drummed up and if the people that may want you to provide a service want a trip to see if it is worthwhile to pursue, then there is nothing wrong with making a presentation.

Again, these types of trip have led to funding for Amtrak and has also allowed freight operators to lobby support for their operations.


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## jis (Feb 21, 2016)

Devil's Advocate said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > It seems to me that you live in an alternate reality where Mr. Boardman has made any promises to anyone. The only thing that he has said repeatedly is that unless there is full funding from the Feds, the state's involved or someone else there will be no train, much to the chagrin of some starry eyed train enthusiasts. Could you identify which promise he has made to whom exactly? I talked to the people involved day before from the cities and counties, at Jacksonville. I did not get the sense that anyone thought any promise had been made. All seem to be quite aware that it is upto them to find the funding or there will be no train. Could you share your sources that suggest someone thinks they will get a train for free? Even those that think the Feds should fund the train understand that Amtrak is not the Feds.
> ...


I was talking of the justification for running the special which has precious little to do with F&B subsidies. Apparently that is no longer a point of contention since the subject seems to have changed.

As far as F&B subsidy goes, the fact that it is currently the law of the land was not exactly preventable by whatever Boardman said or not. The reality is Amtrak will fail to meet that goal and the law will be adjusted to align with reality. That is closer to reality than your bloviation. This has happened in the past with Amtrak, with oodles of defense budget line items, with attempt to legislate the value of pi to be exactly equal to three etc. The fact that you don't like it does not make it unreal.


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 21, 2016)

My more detailed point to point reply was apparently eaten by the forum software.

In any case I do not see the Sunset East coming back. Which means I do not see these types of specials as beneficial to Amtrak's budget or to Boardman's future image. It feels more like a money wasting tease to me. Boardman gets to play the role of adamant supporter while strangling the budget elsewhere and various politicians get to take credit for helping to support a train that's never coming back. The fans along the way get to play the role of future passengers who will use the service regularly, even though it's doubtful most of them would keep buying tickets beyond the first few few joyrides.

The current mandate is never going to be practical enough for Amtrak to thrive at the national level. Adding more long distance trains only adds to the debt burden that Amtrak must carry on its back. If Amtrak wants to run support generating specials then I believe they should be focused on areas that have the will and the money to build up a budget neutral service. It makes no sense to see Amtrak spending time and money trying to revive one of the slowest and poorest performing routes.

I would like to believe that if we just generated enough new support the rules for Amtrak would change, but I sincerely doubt that's ever going to happen. Even the most pro-Amtrak administration since Amtrak's creation wasn't able to change the fundamentally flawed rules Amtrak must operate under now and forever. Until these rules change any expansion has to be cost neutral or it risks hastening Amtrak's demise.

That's my view anyway. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Amtrak is stronger today than ever before, and running specials anywhere and everywhere they're welcome is just good business sense. However, in a election year where even the pretense of compromise is equated with tyranny, and partisan ideology trumps any semblance of reason, I sincerely doubt that the worst is behind us. If anything the the worst threat to Amtrak's existence seems to be just around the corner. Perhaps Amtrak will be ready for it, but it sure doesn't seem like it at the moment.


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## jis (Feb 21, 2016)

OK. Good to know your opinion. Thanks for sharing.


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## neroden (Feb 21, 2016)

Devil's Advocate said:


> That's my view anyway. Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe Amtrak is stronger today than ever before, and running specials anywhere and everywhere they're welcome is just good business sense. However, in a election year where even the pretense of compromise is equated with tyranny, and partisan ideology trumps any semblance of reason, I sincerely doubt that the worst is behind us. If anything the the worst threat to Amtrak's existence seems to be just around the corner. Perhaps Amtrak will be ready for it, but it sure doesn't seem like it at the moment.


We're in a political realignment period, which is confusing a lot of people. Support for passenger rail in general and Amtrak in particular is on the rise permanently, and Amtrak actually is stronger than it has been in its entire history, both by ridership and financially. (The upward trend in ridership started in 1995 after being flat for at least 15 years. This was amidst the Downs administration, so it's an underlying secular trend, certainly not management competence!)

I'm no optimist. The United States government is probably in the most dangerous unstable position it's ever been in, with structural deadlock problems quite possibly leading to the collapse of the system (every other US-style President / Congress system in the world has collapsed -- parliamentary systems do better). The threat of world war is probably higher than it's been in 30 years. The general economic situation of high inequality threatens to return the world to the Dark Ages of aristocracy. The world environmental situation is nothing short of catastrophic. But passenger rail is a bright spot.

Actually, passenger rail seems to do better in periods of high economic inequality, much to my chagrin. Also worth noting: individual departments have a tendency to survive governmental collapse (just ask Russian Railways, which has survived essentially intact from the Tsars through today).


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## Acela150 (Feb 21, 2016)

For DA.

http://www.railpictures.net/viewphoto.php?id=510724&nseq=308

Photo by Matt Donnelly.


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## KnightRail (Feb 25, 2016)

Any sightings of 172's repaint? Should have pulled into the Windy City today.


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## CCC1007 (Feb 25, 2016)

172?


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## KnightRail (Feb 25, 2016)

CCC1007 said:


> 172?


Yup, P-42


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## lo2e (Feb 26, 2016)

KnightRail said:


> Any sightings of 172's repaint? Should have pulled into the Windy City today.



Apparently I missed the news that it was getting a repaint. Do you have a link on where you saw that?


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## Thirdrail7 (Feb 26, 2016)

lo2e said:


> KnightRail said:
> 
> 
> > Any sightings of 172's repaint? Should have pulled into the Windy City today.
> ...


It wasn't on the news but it was supposedly repainted while in the shops. It is currently in MKE service. If someone can eyeball and post a picture, we'll know if this is true.


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## KnightRail (Feb 26, 2016)

Thirdrail7 said:


> lo2e said:
> 
> 
> > KnightRail said:
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If it stayed in Phase V or is now III should help paint the picture if III is going fleet wide or not. Could even be the new Operation Lifesaver paint scheme P42 mentioned on the inside cover of the official 2016 callander?


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## TommyBNSF (Feb 27, 2016)

It was on the Cardinal on Thursday and can confirm it's in fresh Phase V. Also, Superliners are still coming out of BG with Phase IVb. However, I wouldn't say Phase III is out of the possibility for the whole fleet yet. It might just be a slow transition. Remember when Phase IV came out in 1993, they were still repainting engines into Phase III for a while afterwards and new Genesis engines were delivered in Phase III in 1996. Also, Viewliners took forever to be repainted into full Phase IVb after it was introduced in 2002.


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## KnightRail (Feb 27, 2016)

TommyBNSF said:


> It was on the Cardinal on Thursday and can confirm it's in fresh Phase V. Also, Superliners are still coming out of BG with Phase IVb. However, I wouldn't say Phase III is out of the possibility for the whole fleet yet. It might just be a slow transition. Remember when Phase IV came out in 1993, they were still repainting engines into Phase III for a while afterwards and new Genesis engines were delivered in Phase III in 1996. Also, Viewliners took forever to be repainted into full Phase IVb after it was introduced in 2002.


Interesting seeing that 704 came out in III, 172 in V, and 710 went west and should be there now strongly believed to be getting III. Sounds like we will have to wait and see what the next few show up with. Thanks for posting and sharing the image.


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## TommyBNSF (Feb 27, 2016)

For anyone wondering where 62043 is at, it's on 48(26).


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## Thirdrail7 (Feb 27, 2016)

KnightRail said:


> TommyBNSF said:
> 
> 
> > It was on the Cardinal on Thursday and can confirm it's in fresh Phase V. Also, Superliners are still coming out of BG with Phase IVb. However, I wouldn't say Phase III is out of the possibility for the whole fleet yet. It might just be a slow transition. Remember when Phase IV came out in 1993, they were still repainting engines into Phase III for a while afterwards and new Genesis engines were delivered in Phase III in 1996. Also, Viewliners took forever to be repainted into full Phase IVb after it was introduced in 2002.
> ...



710 isn't really indicative to what happens to the general fleet, since NY state is paying for Phase III. As you indicated, we'll just have to see what rolls out of the facility.


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## TylerP42 (Mar 3, 2016)

8400 in Chicago Yard today.


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## KnightRail (Mar 3, 2016)

TylerP42 said:


> 8400 in Chicago Yard today.


Any sightings of Appomattox River? Should have rolled in today on the inbound Cardnial.


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## neroden (Mar 3, 2016)

IIIb is gorgeous. I really hope they replace all the Phase IV and Phase V stuff with it. (Except the Acelas; they can just retire those in their current paint scheme.)


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## Thirdrail7 (Mar 3, 2016)

Wait until you see it on the P32-BWH. :giggle:


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## TylerP42 (Mar 3, 2016)

KnightRail said:


> TylerP42 said:
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> 
> > 8400 in Chicago Yard today.
> ...


Nope. Sorry.


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## Devil's Advocate (Mar 3, 2016)

neroden said:


> IIIb is gorgeous. I really hope they replace all the Phase IV and Phase V stuff with it.


It might look great if we were coming up on the 1970's again. It's 2016 and 3B looks like Amtrak is confused as to which century we're in.


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## neroden (Mar 3, 2016)

Tastes vary. IV and V are horrible color schemes by any measure.


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## Acela150 (Mar 3, 2016)

Thirdrail7 said:


> Wait until you see it on the P32-BWH. :giggle:


Bring back that Pepsi can!! :lol:


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## jis (Mar 4, 2016)

neroden said:


> Tastes vary. IV and V are horrible color schemes by any measure.


I agree. Phase IV and V are basically relatively dull colors which do not stand out. In any case it was reiterated to me in a conversation that at least for the single level LD fleet, Phase IIIb will be the fleet livery.

Just noticed that the red, blue and white in the new AA livery are closer to the Phase IIIb shades than the original red, blue and white. OTOH, the Phase IV blue shade is closer to the original AA blue shade.



Acela150 said:


> Thirdrail7 said:
> 
> 
> > Wait until you see it on the P32-BWH. :giggle:
> ...


Now the P32-BWH color scheme was more like the new AA livery in the sense of the variety of angles and lengths of each color stripe


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## TommyBNSF (Mar 4, 2016)

KnightRail said:


> TylerP42 said:
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> > 8400 in Chicago Yard today.
> ...


There was an extra Viewliner on #51 and it looked like 62002, but it was still in Phase IVb and still said "Viewliner 62002" written where it should say Appomattox River. Again, I couldn't tell the number for sure, but it did look to be 62002. And it didn't come back south on #50 that night. Also, it had Surfliner Coach 6407, a Superliner 2 Coach (34135?), a Superliner 1 Lounge (33009?), and a Superliner 2 Transition Sleeper (39041?), plus Surfliner engine 464.


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## KnightRail (Mar 4, 2016)

TommyBNSF said:


> KnightRail said:
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> > TylerP42 said:
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So there's 62014 in IVb with the name "Croton River" applied, 62043 in III with "New River", and the latest overhaul no changes. Either the phase III decals are on back order or it's an identity crisis.


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## frequentflyer (Mar 4, 2016)

TylerP42 said:


> 8400 in Chicago Yard today.


Brings back memories of July 1984 Amtrak ride. In the Amtrak magazine they had a drawing of the new single level LD car called Viewliner in Phase 3 livery.


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## TylerP42 (Mar 10, 2016)

.


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## Acela150 (Mar 10, 2016)

TommyBNSF said:


> KnightRail said:
> 
> 
> > TylerP42 said:
> ...


Probably for extra rooms. It's also probably the only train that is selling out all of its rooms and seats now.


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## TommyBNSF (Mar 11, 2016)

Acela150 said:


> TommyBNSF said:
> 
> 
> > KnightRail said:
> ...


It was in front of the normal Cardinal set though, so it definitely came out of Beech Grove.


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## MikefromCrete (Mar 11, 2016)

Griddle issues? Has it been in service?


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## MikefromCrete (Mar 11, 2016)

I'm sorry, I was under the impression that the 8400 has been in Beech Grove for several months. The latest report has it deadheading on the Cardinal from the Grove to Chicago and then deadheading on the Lake Shore to New York City. So, I doubt if they were serving meals. Are these "griddle issues" from its previous operation before the stay in Beech Grove?


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## jis (Mar 11, 2016)

Tyler, do you actually have permission from the Amtrak employees that shared these internal documents with you, to post such information in an open public forum? Would they be willing to be named as the source of such information without getting in trouble? If the answer is no to either of those two questions you should probably reconsider making such specific claims of "having access to and seen with your own eyes" what are possibly Amtrak internal documents.

I know you are trying hard to establish you railfan insider credentials. but to do so you should not endanger the jobs of your friends in the railroad. Just a friendly cautionary note. I personally don't have a horse in this horse race. But IPR rules are harsh and punishments are severe.


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## Ryan (Mar 11, 2016)

Were someone in management inclined to get a burr under their saddle, it'd be pretty easy to figure out which train you were on and who you spoke to.

If you want to have continued access to such information, you should be a little smarter about how you share it.


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## neroden (Mar 11, 2016)

Every time I've seen an Amtrak employee on a single-level train write up a defect report or seen a conductor write a delay report, they do it in public, at one of the public tables, because where else are they going to do it? Honestly it wouldn't be hard for an eavesdropper to read the topline of the report. Can't blame the employees for being overheard.

I tend to consider this stuff to be minutiae of little importance. It's not state secrets, and I'd share it if it helped quiet down *much worse* rumors (you know how rumors can work..."the wheels fell off the train!!!!"...) but normally I can't see why anyone would care.


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## jis (Mar 11, 2016)

Yeah, eavesdropped is fine, within limits. But the impression conveyed is that he has some inside track to inside information through someone. That is the part that can lead to trouble, even if nothing bad was intended. A little bit of considered discretion goes a long way in keeping everyone out of trouble.


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## neroden (Mar 11, 2016)

Agreed, jis.


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## jis (Mar 11, 2016)

TylerP42 said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > Tyler, do you actually have permission from the Amtrak employees that shared these internal documents with you, to post such information in an open public forum? Would they be willing to be named as the source of such information without getting in trouble? If the answer is no to either of those two questions you should probably reconsider making such specific claims of "having access to and seen with your own eyes" what are possibly Amtrak internal documents.
> ...


That is good. Having personally gotten into trouble in the past I just wanted to caution that be careful what you share and make sure to share in such a way that the source is protected. I am glad that apparently that is the case in this instance. Your claim that you saw some document with your own eyes, which apparently you actually didn't is what caught my attention. Sometimes claiming access that one actually did not have can still cause trouble for someone.


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## Acela150 (Mar 11, 2016)

TylerP42 said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > Tyler, do you actually have permission from the Amtrak employees that shared these internal documents with you, to post such information in an open public forum? Would they be willing to be named as the source of such information without getting in trouble? If the answer is no to either of those two questions you should probably reconsider making such specific claims of "having access to and seen with your own eyes" what are possibly Amtrak internal documents.
> ...


On the train or not. If it's information that the public shouldn't have. Such as write ups don't share it here or anywhere. Those employees can be brought up on charges of divulging company information. And trust me being out of service, going on trial, and being able to go back to work on the bad side of things is not a good thing and it can take some time to get back in service. Be extremely mindful of your postings. Cause if I got brought up on charges like this and knew who I told. That person would be all of dead to me.


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## TylerP42 (Mar 11, 2016)

Just to put this out there - the conductors and engineers and other employees I know in real life or on facebook as their real names give me info thst can be found by anyone else who has eyes (as in what is in a yard, or on a train). Any other info is either me seeing something myself (not them giving me anything or letting me see it) that I shouldn't see (which I will make a point not to do anymore, and by that I mean a report that I happen to walk past in public or overhearing a conversation at a station or on a train), or someone who I don't even know who their name is, so I share it with a grain of salt. So all of my Amtrak contacts don't give me super secret info. Even if they did, I wouldn't share it because I know it can hurt them.

My friendship with the Director of Operations is just a friendship where he gives me info that is publicly available. Anyone with an email address can email and ask questions and get the same info I have and am given. He has NEVER given me ANY secrets.


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## TommyBNSF (Dec 30, 2016)

Apologies for bringing up an old topic, but I'm curious if Amtrak is still planning to convert their long distance single level trains to the "Amtrak America" branding with Phase III colors or if that's being scrapped because so far, only 2 regular passenger cars have been repainted into Phase IIIb, 8400 and 62043, with no Amfleets having been repainted. I noticed in the video down below that the 2nd sleeper is in fresh Phase IVb with the 8400 right behind it looking kind of ratty in IIIb. Perhaps Amtrak is waiting for the new diners to come onilne or have they axed the Amtrak America branding and just going to stick with the normal Phase IVb on cars.


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## jis (Dec 30, 2016)

The Viewliner Is were not scheduled to be restriped before they are converted to the same configuration as VL IIs, or at least so I was told once upon a time. Notwithstanding that one VL I Sleeper has be restriped in Phase III and got a new name plate - the "New River".


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## TommyBNSF (Dec 30, 2016)

Perhaps 62043 was a "test" car for the Phase IIIb scheme. Then again, if that's the case, we should've seen an Amfleet test car too, and so far nothing on that front.


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## Ryan (Dec 30, 2016)

They're not going to drag a car into the ship and restripe it just for the heck of it, nor do they need to test how to restripe a car. That'd be a complete waste of time and money.

More likely, New River needed to be redone, and they just did it with the new stuff and not the old.


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## Devil's Advocate (Dec 30, 2016)

_New_ stuff? I guess that's one way to put it. Hopefully this hideous retro rebranding scheme follows Boardman right out the door.


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## jis (Dec 30, 2016)

Devil's Advocate said:


> _New_ stuff? I guess that's one way to put it. Hopefully this hideous retro rebranding scheme follows Boardman right out the door.


My understanding is that the Phase III rebranding was not something that Boardman came up with. It came from within Amtrak, and Boardman just went with the flow. So unless the significant people involved in that decision are all gotten rid of probably Boardman's departure will make no difference. So far none of them have left Amtrak AFAICT.

Interestingly Boardman seems to be credited with a lot of decisions that he was only peripherally involved in, if at all, and certainly had little ownership of.


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## neroden (Dec 30, 2016)

I like IIIb.


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