# Starwood Preferred Guest American Express Card



## jmbgeg (Jun 18, 2010)

Without doing a line by line comparison of the AGR MasterCard and the Starwood Preferred Guest Amex Card, are any of you using the Starwood Amex Card to earn SPG points that you transfer to AGR? I am going to give it a try.


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## frugalist (Jun 18, 2010)

jmbgeg said:


> Without doing a line by line comparison of the AGR MasterCard and the Starwood Preferred Guest Amex Card, are any of you using the Starwood Amex Card to earn SPG points that you transfer to AGR? I am going to give it a try.


Other than the signup bonuses, what are the advantages to using the SPG card vs. the AGR card? Does the SPG card have an annual fee? Just wondering if I'm missing out on anything by not carrying the SPG card.


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## the_traveler (Jun 18, 2010)

I don't know, but I agree. :blink: I got rid of all my cards that had annual fees - and just use the AGR MC to get AGR points for free! So what's the advantage? (Unless they transfer at something like 1 Starwood point transfers as 10 AGR points, why pay a fee - if there is one?) :huh:


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## jmbgeg (Jun 18, 2010)

frugalist said:


> jmbgeg said:
> 
> 
> > Without doing a line by line comparison of the AGR MasterCard and the Starwood Preferred Guest Amex Card, are any of you using the Starwood Amex Card to earn SPG points that you transfer to AGR? I am going to give it a try.
> ...


https://www143.americanexpress.com/apisites...;landingCode=76


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## jmbgeg (Jun 18, 2010)

the_traveler said:


> I don't know, but I agree. :blink: I got rid of all my cards that had annual fees - and just use the AGR MC to get AGR points for free! So what's the advantage? (Unless they transfer at something like 1 Starwood point transfers as 10 AGR points, why pay a fee - if there is one?) :huh:


No fee first year. Nominal $45 year thereafter.


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## frugalist (Jun 18, 2010)

jmbgeg said:


> the_traveler said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know, but I agree. :blink: I got rid of all my cards that had annual fees - and just use the AGR MC to get AGR points for free! So what's the advantage? (Unless they transfer at something like 1 Starwood point transfers as 10 AGR points, why pay a fee - if there is one?) :huh:
> ...


What I'm particularly interested in knowing is why would I want to continue using the SPG after the first year, after I've gotten my signup bonuses and transferred my points to AGR?

I'm really averse to paying anything for my AGR points if I don't have to.  For example, my wife and I both got the Continental OnePass MasterCard for the 30,000 OnePass miles after the first spend and adding each other as authorized users. The $65 annual fee was waived for the first year, which made it a really sweet deal. Now that we've moved all those miles over to our AGR accounts, we'll be closing these cards out before the first anniversary.

Don't misunderstand me, jmbgeg, I'm not criticizing your decision to carry and use the SPG card. You may have a different reason for carrying the card than I would. I would just like to know what advantage it has over the AGR MC for someone like me whose main objective is to accumulate as many AGR points as possible for as little cost as possible.


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## yarrow (Jun 18, 2010)

we got the starwood card a couple years ago and kept it for the free year but at times i wish i still had it. the sign up bonus was nice and they had great point promotions at starwood properties (some of which actually had reasonable rates). i remember one time we got 17 points for each dollar spent at an aloft hotel. no problem transferring to agr in, i believe, blocks of 5000


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## sechs (Jun 18, 2010)

jmbgeg said:


> are any of you using the Starwood Amex Card to earn SPG points that you transfer to AGR?


Yes.
The main reason that I have the SPG card is that I prefer to use American Express cards over all others. In my opinion, they have the best consumer protection and have the best "bells and whistles" (extended warranty, travel insurance, etc.) of any similar card. While you don't have to get one of their fee cards to get these features, I always more than manage to make that back in extended warranty claims every year. On top of that are the hotel benefits, which may or may not be useful to you, depending on your travel habits.

Unfortunately, it's not possible to use AmEx everywhere. So, I also have the AGR card from Chase for that purpose.

I know that there is at least one person here who plays this coin from the Hilton HHonors side. That's something else into which to look.


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## sechs (Jun 18, 2010)

frugalist said:


> For example, my wife and I both got the Continental OnePass MasterCard for the 30,000 OnePass miles after the first spend and adding each other as authorized users. The $65 annual fee was waived for the first year, which made it a really sweet deal. Now that we've moved all those miles over to our AGR accounts, we'll be closing these cards out before the first anniversary.


Honestly, I wouldn't suggest this kind of churning just for the sign-up miles. Unlike Chase's checking account promotions, it's a one-time hit -- and it's not helpful to your credit.
There's no such thing as a free lunch. What are you trading for these "free" points?


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## trainrider1976 (Jun 19, 2010)

By reading this thread, I see that the Amex SPG can convert points to Amtrak's Guest Rewards. Is the opposite also true? For example, if someone had the AGR Chase card, could they convert that to Starwood points?


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## trainrider1976 (Jun 19, 2010)

trainrider1976 said:


> By reading this thread, I see that the Amex SPG can convert points to Amtrak's Guest Rewards. Is the opposite also true? For example, if someone had the AGR Chase card, could they convert that to Starwood points?



Just found my answer; however, it would appear the point to point transfer is not equal in the programs. *IF* I am reading this correctly, Amtrak would require 27,500 points for a Level 4 one night stay. If using the Amex card, it would appear that only 10,000 points is needed for the same room.

Amtrak: https://www.amtrakguestrewards.com/index.cf...ards=HotelCerts

Starwood: https://www.starwoodhotels.com/preferredgue...comparison.html


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## Devil's Advocate (Jun 19, 2010)

sechs said:


> Honestly, I wouldn't suggest this kind of churning just for the sign-up miles. Unlike Chase's checking account promotions, it's a one-time hit -- and it's not helpful to your credit. There's no such thing as a free lunch. What are you trading for these "free" points?


Excellent point, but if this is really a serious concern wouldn't all these folks who _do_ open and close numerous credit accounts each year just for the bonuses be suffering at some point? I have heard some horror stories but it seems so long as you keep opening new accounts in roughly the same or larger numbers than the accounts you closed you'll at least break even on your credit scores. Weird, illogical, and risky. But it seems to be working for a lot of folks. Now, as for those who close more accounts than they open, they certainly get burned and those who close _all_ of their accounts seem to get burned the worst. I honestly have no idea how you rebuild and recover after closing all of your accounts. It's like the credit scoring system was never designed to handle that possibility. Kind of like telling the post office you no longer want any mail. ;-)


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## RailFanLNK (Jun 19, 2010)

A couple of years ago I became a churning "monkey" and after reading posts about what it was going to do to my credit rating I got nervous. I made for sure I paid off the balances etc and then was in my bank one day and asked them to "check my credit" and the bank employee gasped, I about died thinking my credit was muck, and then she replied, "I've never seen a credit rating this high in my 20 years of banking", it was in the lower 900's. I think so much of all this depends on the human behind the plastic.


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## Ispolkom (Jun 19, 2010)

Lots of people seem to really like the SPG card. I'm not one of them. I got the card, got the sign-up bonus, and eventually canceled the card before my free year was up.

*Pluses:*

1) Earning SPG points, which can be very valuable if you stay at those kinds of properties. I don't -- I'm more a Choice or Wyndham kind of guy, or Hilton if we're staying in a big city. Starwood just doesn't have the breadth of coverage I need.

2) Flexibility. SPG points can be transfered at 1:1 or even 1.25:1 to many different frequent flyer programs.

*Minuses*

1) Annual fee. Perhaps $45 is nominal, but I won't pay annual fees for credit cards. It's my idiosyncrasy.

2) Separate program. What if one day Starwood stops transfers to AGR? It doesn't seem likely, but people with United miles probably thought the same thing, and that went away

3) Points earning. You can earn bonus points (I think) for staying at Starwood properties, but I don't. AGR Mastercard earns 2 points per dollar on Amtrak purchases. I do business there. And they still have my good will for a targeted 3-month-long triple points promo last Christmas.

4) American Express isn't as widely accepted as Visa or Mastercard.

I don't think there's a perfect card. I mostly use the AGR Mastercard and the Costco American Express, which gives cash back.

I also try not to stockpile points because frequent-traveler programs all devalue their points (again, AGR hasn't done this yet, but who says they won't?).

As for how churning credit cards affects your credit score, I'm baffled. We applied and received half a dozen credit cards at the beginning of last year. Six months later we refinanced our mortgage with no problem. I've heard horror stories the other way too. I really don't know what's up.


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## frugalist (Jun 20, 2010)

sechs said:


> frugalist said:
> 
> 
> > For example, my wife and I both got the Continental OnePass MasterCard for the 30,000 OnePass miles after the first spend and adding each other as authorized users. The $65 annual fee was waived for the first year, which made it a really sweet deal. Now that we've moved all those miles over to our AGR accounts, we'll be closing these cards out before the first anniversary.
> ...


sechs, you certainly have a valid point. For some people, accumulating credit cards, for whatever reason, could lead to disaster. If they are not disciplined with their credit and take their new credit cards and treat them as found money to ring up large balances they can't pay off right away, thus incurring larger and larger interest and penalty charges, they can destroy their credit and their entire financial lives.

We consistently run up about $2000 a month in every-day charges and pay our balances off in full every month. We haven't paid interest on credit cards in years. And we've had no problem getting three new credit cards in the past 6 months, with applications 3 months apart to avoid the "Too many recent applications" situation.

I realize a credit card application results in a hard credit pull, which results in a small ding to your credit score. But, it's only a short-term ding. Nothing like a delinquency or bankruptcy. And it seems like the effect on your credit score of a lower utilization ratio is more positive than the effect of the credit pull is negative. So maybe it balances out. 

Good conversation here.


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## sechs (Jun 21, 2010)

I think that a general lack of knowledge of how credit information is recorded and used leads to these blase attitudes. The apparent voodoo confuses and baffles people; others feel feel that they can act without knowing what they *don't* know.

Many still act like credit is still being handed out like candy.


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