# Amtrak Seat Check Question



## seat38a (May 23, 2014)

On the Surfliner, 99% of the time, the conductors use positioning, fold, or tear with color combination to designate your destination city. For example, my city is a yellow seat check with a tear in the center. On rare occasions, a conductor will write the city code on the seat check. Which method is the more common method used throughout the system?


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## Bob Dylan (May 23, 2014)

Mostly in LD Trains the Attendant writes on a tag with a Sharpie! The colored tags seem to be used on the shorter routes such as commuter and Regionals!


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## SarahZ (May 23, 2014)

I believe it varies.

On the EB Wolverine, they use a numerical system, which I imagine matches the order of the stops. KAL is usually 2-3, and the Detroit suburbs are 10-12, etc, if I remember correctly.

On the WB Wolverine I always use (#351), KAL is the last stop before Chicago, so they just fold my seat check. I have no idea what they do with the other cities because anyone who isn't going to Chicago would have gotten off at or before KAL and, therefore, had their seat check removed.

I've never seen different colors used, but I've seen all different colors. What I mean is, all of the seat checks will be pink, or green, or yellow, or blue, but I've never seen them use a combination of colors on the same run. They always match.

On the SWC, they've always written the station code, which I love because it allows me to see where everyone's going. Brent's on that train right now, heading to ABQ, and he said they're using station codes. Most of the people in his car are going to LAX.


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## seat38a (May 23, 2014)

Yes, on the Surfliner, the conductors all have multiple color seat checks. For example, San Diego is always light blue put in sideways into the slot. Some cities get a red folded in half and my city gets a yellow with a tear in the middle. Also some cities its its say a red standing straight up in the holder. The conductors must need a really good memory to remember all of the combinations!


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## BCL (May 23, 2014)

Right now on Capitol Corridor they're mostly carrying portable printers that generate a printed seat check. It's complete with date of travel, the origin station, destination station, train number, and reservation number. Roadman took a photo of two of them printed back to back for two passengers:







Eventually this is going to be rolled out completely on Amtrak, or so I've been told. At that point I guess the codes that conductors use will go away. I would think they would also have the ability to print the car number and seat number for those on long distance trains with assigned seating.


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## SarahZ (May 23, 2014)

seat38a said:


> Yes, on the Surfliner, the conductors all have multiple color seat checks. For example, San Diego is always light blue put in sideways into the slot. Some cities get a red folded in half and my city gets a yellow with a tear in the middle. Also some cities its its say a red standing straight up in the holder. The conductors must need a really good memory to remember all of the combinations!


That sounds pretty.


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## AmtrakBlue (May 23, 2014)

I forget the color, but I think it was orange, that I had on the Cardinal. It may have been a specific color because I'm HoH/deaf which would make it easier to find me if they needed to make sure I heard any critical announcements. It certainly made it easier for me to find my seat.


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## Ryan (May 23, 2014)

Seat checks can also have marks on them that help the conductors prevent people from making their own seat checks and riding for free:

https://web.archive.org/web/20140124092246/http://railroaddave.com/zoo/

(Sadly, Dave Smock passed away, and his domain finally expired. Sad.  Thank god for the Wayback Machine!)


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## benjibear (May 23, 2014)

I always wondered what the colors, folds, and tears mean.


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## Blackwolf (May 23, 2014)

BCL said:


> Right now on Capitol Corridor they're mostly carrying portable printers that generate a printed seat check. It's complete with date of travel, the origin station, destination station, train number, and reservation number. Roadman took a photo of two of them printed back to back for two passengers:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Yeah, I too have heard that the plan is for this being rolled out system-wide. The system is pretty darn proven, and not just used with Amtrak. A full-service carwash here in Sacramento uses what looks to be the same exact system. An iPhone is used to take the order, or call up an account, and a belt-mounted printer identical to Amtrak's produces a barcode receipt you take up to the cashier.

In the case of Amtrak, you'll note that it contains a lot more data than just the station 3-letter code. It has the res number, and a barcode. As such, a conductor can (and I've witnessed them do it) walk down the isle and scan a suspicious tag to see if its valid. And in the case of the person involved, it wasn't (they'd kept their seat tag from an earlier ride and tried to reuse it.) That person had to either pay the fare to the conductor right there, or be seen off the train at the next stop and into law enforcement's hands. They paid up.


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## Barciur (May 23, 2014)

On the Keystones, they use colors codes and tears etc too - although just for Harrisburg, Lancaster, Philadelphia and New York. If you are going to any of the intermediate, they will write a 3 letter code with a sharpie on the back of one of the seat checks.


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## Acela150 (May 23, 2014)

AmtrakBlue said:


> I forget the color, but I think it was orange, that I had on the Cardinal. It may have been a specific color because I'm HoH/deaf which would make it easier to find me if they needed to make sure I heard any critical announcements. It certainly made it easier for me to find my seat.


Well aren't you "special"!! :lol: I should be talking... My nickname is "Special Steve"! :lol:



Barciur said:


> On the Keystones, they use colors codes and tears etc too - although just for Harrisburg, Lancaster, Philadelphia and New York. If you are going to any of the intermediate, they will write a 3 letter code with a sharpie on the back of one of the seat checks.


When I ride PHL-PAO or PHL-DOW I never get a seat check. Most likely because the conductor doesn't want to waste one. I can recall once or twice getting a SC.

When I've been on 66 conductors checking tickets before NYP write station codes on seat checks with sharpies or pen and the NYP and NHV crews issue new checks.

When I ride regionals between PHL and RTE I get a check after PHL collection and NHV re-checks. WAS, PHL, NYP, RTE, BBY, and BOS usually get a solid color check or one is placed with no punches that pre-determined by the crew. Which makes it easier to find the seat I was in.


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## SarahZ (May 23, 2014)

I want a purple seat check with glitter and unicorns to reflect how fabulous I am.


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## AmtrakBlue (May 23, 2014)

Acela150 said:


> AmtrakBlue said:
> 
> 
> > I forget the color, but I think it was orange, that I had on the Cardinal. It may have been a specific color because I'm HoH/deaf which would make it easier to find me if they needed to make sure I heard any critical announcements. It certainly made it easier for me to find my seat.
> ...


Why, yes I am. And don't you forget it, young man!


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## Acela150 (May 23, 2014)

AmtrakBlue said:


> Acela150 said:
> 
> 
> > AmtrakBlue said:
> ...


I'm sorry you're what??


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## BCL (May 23, 2014)

Blackwolf said:


> BCL said:
> 
> 
> > Right now on Capitol Corridor they're mostly carrying portable printers that generate a printed seat check. It's complete with date of travel, the origin station, destination station, train number, and reservation number. Roadman took a photo of two of them printed back to back for two passengers:
> ...


I've scanned the code on the new seat checks before. It's a PDF417 matrix code format and pretty easy to read with the right software on a smartphone. For seat checks generated from standard tickets, it's a reservation number and the reservation date. A seat check from a 10-ride (and I'm assuming the monthlies) contains the reservation number and the initial valid date. It's not the same as the eTickets printed at Quik-Trak, which now sport a PDF417 code with the ticket number (a long decimal number).

Now what they're going to do with that who knows. When I use my 10-ride, every time they generate one of these things from the same multi-use ticket, it will have the same PDF417 code. If a conductor scans it, they'll probably just check it against reservations that have already been pulled for that train. If it doesn't match a ticket that's been pulled for that particular train, they know someone is trying to pull a fast one. Theoretically it could be considered fraud or "fare evasion". Now I suppose they could just read the smaller print - the stuff including the train number and the date. That should be pretty obvious if it's dated a couple of days earlier.

Others have been mentioning that sometimes the conductors don't even both writing up a seat check. When this system is in place they probably have no other choice. It's automatically printed. However, I have seen some cases where a ticket was pulled almost at the destination, and the conductor just pocketed the printed seat check.


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## FreeskierInVT (May 23, 2014)

When I take the Vermonter, those of us going north of SPG get a colored seat check, and our station code later written out after the new crew boards at SPG.


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## seat38a (May 24, 2014)

RyanS said:


> Seat checks can also have marks on them that help the conductors prevent people from making their own seat checks and riding for free:
> 
> https://web.archive.org/web/20140124092246/http://railroaddave.com/zoo/
> 
> (Sadly, Dave Smock passed away, and his domain finally expired. Sad.  Thank god for the Wayback Machine!)


That link was so informative! Did not know about the little tic marks


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## SarahZ (May 24, 2014)

seat38a said:


> RyanS said:
> 
> 
> > Seat checks can also have marks on them that help the conductors prevent people from making their own seat checks and riding for free:
> ...


That's the Wolverine! How funny that they still use the numbers.  I like knowing what the tic mark means too.

I grumbled a bit when they talked about The International heading to Canada. I wish...


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## Barciur (May 24, 2014)

Acela150 said:


> AmtrakBlue said:
> 
> 
> > I forget the color, but I think it was orange, that I had on the Cardinal. It may have been a specific color because I'm HoH/deaf which would make it easier to find me if they needed to make sure I heard any critical announcements. It certainly made it easier for me to find my seat.
> ...


I find that quite fascinating. I never went on that route, but whenever I'd go PHL-PAR I'd get a seat check. Now I only go from LNC so it's longer and there are seat checks as one would expect. Paoli might sometimes be the first/last stop to Philly so it might not matter too much. Not sure about Downingtown, though.


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## railiner (May 24, 2014)

RyanS said:


> Seat checks can also have marks on them that help the conductors prevent people from making their own seat checks and riding for free:
> 
> https://web.archive.org/web/20140124092246/http://railroaddave.com/zoo/
> 
> (Sadly, Dave Smock passed away, and his domain finally expired. Sad.  Thank god for the Wayback Machine!)


Great link.....thanks so much for posting it!

I read with great amusement of the college kids trying to get free rides....some things never change...we contend with similar scheme's to get free rides on our buses...


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## rickycourtney (May 24, 2014)

BCL said:


> Others have been mentioning that sometimes the conductors don't even both writing up a seat check. When this system is in place they probably have no other choice. It's automatically printed. However, I have seen some cases where a ticket was pulled almost at the destination, and the conductor just pocketed the printed seat check.


The conductors on the San Joaquin don't bother writing up a seat check if your getting off at the next stop. That's because as they lift tickets they also pull the seat check for the people getting off at the next stop.


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## Alice (May 24, 2014)

RyanS said:


> Seat checks can also have marks on them that help the conductors prevent people from making their own seat checks and riding for free:
> 
> https://web.archive.org/web/20140124092246/http://railroaddave.com/zoo/
> 
> (Sadly, Dave Smock passed away, and his domain finally expired. Sad.  Thank god for the Wayback Machine!)


It has been a long time since I read this site, and this time I went through the whole thing. Great stories (most of them hilarious) and photos ("Stuffing the books" has the ruins of Michigan Central Depot in Detroit). A few gruesome tales would benefit certain people before they are inclined to trespass on the tracks, but of course they wouldn't believe them anyway.


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## Ryan (May 24, 2014)

I do the same thing ever once in a while. I'd love to find a better way to preserve his stories.


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## BCL (May 24, 2014)

rickycourtney said:


> BCL said:
> 
> 
> > Others have been mentioning that sometimes the conductors don't even both writing up a seat check. When this system is in place they probably have no other choice. It's automatically printed. However, I have seen some cases where a ticket was pulled almost at the destination, and the conductor just pocketed the printed seat check.
> ...


That's what I was getting at. Usually the conductors are going around looking for seat checks indicating the next stop and pocketing them. When they come across someone with a ticket for the next stop (and I've literally had mine pulled after 50 minutes waiting for it) they don't have an option to avoid having the printer print out the seat check. I've seen it ripped off the printer and placed right in the pocket with all the expiring seat checks.

I've also never had a conductor who refused to let me keep one of these new seat checks. I think with these newer ones, it's kind of hard to fake it since there's a date on the check.


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## OlympianHiawatha (May 24, 2014)

On one trip on a Midwest Corridor train the Conductor simply placed full blank seat checks above the occupied seats and left them when the folks detrained. A few of those "fell" into my grip and are part of my displayed collection. I also have some where the Conductor flipped over to the blank side, wrote the city code and below that 2 for the number of pax in that bank of seats. And on the _*Heartland Flyer*_, at least 1 Conductor tears the check in half and writes the city code on it, picking it up just before destination; depending on load they generally put through pax in one Coach, locals in the other and use the third as needed.


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## seat38a (May 24, 2014)

RyanS said:


> I do the same thing ever once in a while. I'd love to find a better way to preserve his stories.


Well, if you can get the source files, I can put it up on my hosting space. As a web app developer, I got plenty of space and bandwidth to spare.


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## Ryan (May 24, 2014)

That's not the problem, that part is easy. Getting in touch with someone for permission is the tough part.


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## neroden (May 25, 2014)

It's better to ask for forgiveness than permission. Put it up.


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## NorthShore (May 25, 2014)

I'm wondering whether some conductors and car attendants wouldn't mind keeping some of the color coded tags around, even after conversion to the new system, as the established ways still offer a ready way for fast vidual identification that the printouts might not, since all tags look the same at initial glance, before reading the station code.


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## Slasharoo (May 25, 2014)

neroden said:


> It's better to ask for forgiveness than permission. Put it up.


I hate the expansion that this phrase has taken on the last few years. It's one thing to take the last cookie out of the jar without asking, but infringing on someone's privacy, quite another...maybe not a "One rule for all cases" phrase.


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## Ryan (May 25, 2014)

neroden said:


> It's better to ask for forgiveness than permission. Put it up.


Not when it comes to other people's IP.
Does the site work for anyone else now? I reloaded it and now it says that the site's robots.txr says "NO YUO!!!!". Hopefully it isn't gone forever. Google's cache still has the site, but without pictures.


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## PerRock (May 26, 2014)

Blackwolf said:


> BCL said:
> 
> 
> > Right now on Capitol Corridor they're mostly carrying portable printers that generate a printed seat check. It's complete with date of travel, the origin station, destination station, train number, and reservation number. Roadman took a photo of two of them printed back to back for two passengers:
> ...


Over in England the conductors carry a device on them that can scan your ticket (they don't use E-Tickets, but all their tix have magnetic stripes), they can swipe a credit card to buy tickets, and they can print tickets.

I too cannot access that site anymore, So I don't know what was said on it (so I might just be repeating things). But in my experience a conductor will put two ticks on a seat check to indicate that both seats are going to the same location, basically saves paper & the need for them to write out another check.

Somewhere I have a handful of blank seat check slips I acquired on one of my journeys.

peter


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## Alice (May 26, 2014)

I'm getting a different error message now. It was intermittent before, so maybe it'll go away when not so many people are trying to read it.

Page cannot be crawled or displayed due to robots.txt.
See railroaddave.com robots.txt page. Learn more about robots.txt.


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## neroden (May 26, 2014)

RyanS said:


> neroden said:
> 
> 
> > It's better to ask for forgiveness than permission. Put it up.
> ...


Actually, that's *exactly* when it's better to ask for forgiveness than permission. IP laws have gotten completely insane lately. It's much more important to preserve knowledge and make it available than to respect "IP".

The Internet Archive and the Wayback Machine quite explicitly decided not to ask permission.


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## neroden (May 26, 2014)

Alice said:


> I'm getting a different error message now. It was intermittent before, so maybe it'll go away when not so many people are trying to read it.
> 
> Page cannot be crawled or displayed due to robots.txt.
> 
> See railroaddave.com robots.txt page. Learn more about robots.txt.


I've been seeing this with other things. Someone should figure out who "spi.domainsponsor.com" is because they appear to be deliberately sabotaging the Wayback Machine, by buying old domains and putting a new robots.txt up.


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