# 4 European countries in 7 days ~ 11 trains & 2 ferries



## v v (Sep 12, 2021)

Here is a basic photo record of this journey, not a 'real' trip report. Names have been changed to protect the innocent... 

_Correction... 12 trains_

*First stage ~ Moulins sur Allier, France **->** Geneve, Switzerland - Sunday 5 September 2021*


Departed from here, although photo taken at the end of the journey



Modern regional TER train, horribly uncomfortable



Seats look good though



Country town Paray le Monial. Station a little neglected due to lack of traffic or Covid?



Lyon major French city where we make our first train transfer. Also a little neglected which was a surprise as it's a very busy station - same day






Older TER Inter City from Lyon Part Dieu to Geneve main station



Only seatback in front is in focus (sorry), but it gives a picture of the older style interior. Pretty comfortable too.



Amberieu, France near the Swiss border. Pretty small town station which looked well cared for.



Geneve, Switzerland. Next we transfer to an ICE train - same day


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## v v (Sep 12, 2021)

*Second stage ~ Geneve, Switzerland **->** Kusnacht ZH, Switzerland - Sunday 5 September 2021*


Lac Leman (Geneve) close to the train station



Geneve, elegant lake Ferry



In the distance the massive Jet d'Eau
*.*





Beautiful Italian style lake launch



Geneve main station, busy for a Sunday afternoon



Our 3rd train of the day, Swiss ICE from Geneve to Zurich. Seating ok but no air circulation working. Warm day and this double decker left Geneve about 80% full. Warm and humid until we reached Bern when about half the passengers got off, followed by the train filling completely for the remainder of the journey to Zurich. The heat and humidity making things very unpleasant on the upper deck, on top of which with no air circulation the Covid situation springs to mind. Relieved to reach Zurich and leave the train. Of course it may only have affected the car we were in, or the whole train?



Lac Leman, was far more beautiful than this photo shows



Arriving at the enormous Zurich HBF probably on level 2, thought we had arrived in a Mall



Should be on level 3 now, watching our local train (#4 for the day) weave it's way down the slope to take us a short way down the Zurichsee to Kusnacht ZH. We stay here for 2 nights, and 1 day before heading into Austria.


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## Willbridge (Sep 12, 2021)

And a Lufthansa ad popped up next to your photos! To Europe from Denver for less than roomettes to Portland.


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## v v (Sep 13, 2021)

Willbridge said:


> And a Lufthansa ad popped up next to your photos! To Europe from Denver for less than roomettes to Portland.



Pretty scary


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## jiml (Sep 13, 2021)

v v said:


> Geneve, Switzerland. Next we transfer to an ICE train - same day


You didn't stay overnight in Geneva?


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## v v (Sep 13, 2021)

jiml said:


> You didn't stay overnight in Geneva?



No we didn't although it's an attractive bustling and cosmopolitan city. We were headed to Zurich to meet up with friends we hadn't seen for 18 years, people are a bigger draw for us these days.

Why do you ask?


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## jiml (Sep 13, 2021)

v v said:


> No we didn't although it's an attractive bustling and cosmopolitan city. We were headed to Zurich to meet up with friends we hadn't seen for 18 years, people are a bigger draw for us these days.
> 
> Why do you ask?


I'm planning an early 2022 Europe trip, since it's looking a little more practical than the US right now, and was looking for a hotel option near the HBF. (I'd love to do the Schweizerhof, but the budget disagrees.) We're hoping to cash in some airline points that have been stagnant during the pandemic and do trains between Frankfurt and Milan. 

Enjoying your report and tagging along vicariously.


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## v v (Sep 13, 2021)

Yes Geneve is known to be tres expensive, so why not a hotel outside the city along the lake rail line and train in for the day? For such a large lake it is very very beautiful.

Later in this trip we visit Munich, our 3rd or 4th visit. That is a hidden gem of a place to wander or even to live. Not so many traditional sights but has just about everything in else bucket loads, one of the places in the world we could live, and a great rail station too.

Sounds like a good plan that you have there, all the 4 countries we visited came across as handling Covid in a grown up manner, we felt comfortable almost everywhere.


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## v v (Sep 14, 2021)

*Third section ~ **Zürichsee, Switzerland... a day on and by the lake - Monday 6 September 2021*


Kusnacht ferry pier, looking towards Zurich



Ferry arriving



Beautiful day, beautiful lake



Switzerland has a very integrated transport system. Western lake rail line for international and intercity trains. Eastern rail line for local trains. Stations on both sides connected either by the passenger ferry or the vehicle ferry.



Another pier, another rail station west side



In lively discussion with our friends, the ballerina and the professor. What a way to spend a day, in great company, cruising a lovely lake in beautiful weather. And to top it all mountains rising in the distance.



Rail station at the bottom of the lake, Rapperswil. Photo taken after stepping off the ferry pier. From here we returned to Kusnacht by train.



From the train at Uetikon station (east side) looking across the lake



Local train, east side



This ordinary looking platform has a downwards ramp at the far end, a little like Alice's rabbit hole. Down the ramp, 30 yards and up another ramp will bring you out into a street of elegant houses. Our friends live just along from the rabbit hole. We used this station 3 times and each time we thought it felt as though they have their own personal railway station, it was that close. 50 yards to the left of the platforms is the ferry pier, the lake shore is accessed by another tunnel. If you enjoy using public transport this is an amazing place to live. 





*To be continued...*


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## Palmland (Sep 15, 2021)

v v said:


> Switzerland has a very integrated transport system. Western lake rail line for international and intercity trains. Eastern rail line for local trains. Stations on both sides connected either by the passenger ferry or the vehicle ferry.


If ever there was a place where a car is unnecessary, it’s Switzerland. We stayed in Lucerne several years ago as a mid trip rest and recover spot. Absolutely loved that it was so easy to take day trips combining rail, bus, ferry. Enjoyed the transport museum there while my wife had a lazy day. Thanks for your excellent trip report.


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## Deni (Sep 15, 2021)

v v said:


> Later in this trip we visit Munich, our 3rd or 4th visit. That is a hidden gem of a place to wander or even to live. Not so many traditional sights but has just about everything in else bucket loads, one of the places in the world we could live, and a great rail station too.


It's my dream to live in Munich eventually, my favorite city.


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## v v (Sep 15, 2021)

*Fourth section ~ Kusnacht ZH, Switzerland -> Jenbach, Austria on 6th & 7th trains of the trip, then up to Achensee, Austria - Tuesday 7 September 2021*


Local train from Kusnacht ZH to Zurich HBF brought us to a lower level of Zurich HBF. Our first sight of the upper level was the large departure board, quite impressive.
*
*

A pair of regional trains



There is obviously a full renovation of the original section of the station being undertaken, modern facilities do their best to hide most of what must be a classical exterior.



The original train hall? empty and awaiting renovation. Current upper level platforms at the far end of the hall.



Zurich HBF main concourse from the east side entrance. Note: 44 platforms.



Train backing in, not many waiting to board. Destination is Graz, Austria.



Swiss SBB sight-seeing car as part of the consist



Near the Swiss - Austrian border



In the Austrian Tyrol



We were collected at Jenbach, Austria station by friends from Germany and brought to this chalet at Achensee at the upper end of the lake, our home for the next 3 days. (Jenbach is near the lower end of the lake).
We are here only because Klaus and Annette had written early in the year they were taking a week's holiday at Achensee and would we like to pop over to see them, seemed like a nice idea.
Klaus and I worked together in the German Ruhr for a year when we were 21 years old, he then moved to Berlin for 12 years and we lost sight of each other for 35 years. We now meet up as often as is practical, and Achensee is certainly a great place to have a reunion.






*To be continued...*


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## Bob Dylan (Sep 16, 2021)

v v said:


> *Fourth section ~ Kusnacht ZH, Switzerland -> Jenbach, Austria on 6th & 7th trains of the trip, then up to Achensee, Austria - Tuesday 7 September 2021*
> 
> 
> Local train from Kusnacht ZH to Zurich HBF brought us to a lower level of Zurich HBF. Our first sight of the upper level was the large departure board, quite impressive.
> ...


Wonderful trip Jamie, we're envious!


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## v v (Sep 16, 2021)

Bob Dylan said:


> Wonderful trip Jamie, we're envious!



It was, and we are very lucky to have the friends and opportunity to follow our dreams. I bet you can guess how much we would give to be able to visit the US again, life isn't always perfect but still pretty good all the same.

Is there a chance you will go to the Gathering? Good to hear from you Jim.


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## v v (Sep 16, 2021)

*Fifth section ~ Achensee, Austria for 3 days - Tuesday 7 to Friday 10 September 2021*

Wednesday 8 September, a lot of catching up with our friends, walking, eating and a little drinking.


View from our balcony before the sun rose over the mountains.



An hour later looking towards the top of the lake. Achensee appears more fjord like than the Zurichsee, the colour of the water is almost turquoise in places too.



The top of the lake where the river enters Achensee. The lake ferry in the distance is just leaving to head south



While Rosie was having a nap, I am starting to research a future travel project with a view and a cup of tea.







*To be continued...*


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## Bob Dylan (Sep 16, 2021)

v v said:


> It was, and we are very lucky to have the friends and opportunity to follow our dreams. I bet you can guess how much we would give to be able to visit the US again, life isn't always perfect but still pretty good all the same.
> 
> Is there a chance you will go to the Gathering? Good to hear from you Jim.


Thanks, you surely are correct about friends and following your dreams.

I'm sorry yall can't be here this year, but as Scarlett O'HARA would say, 2022 is a New Year!

For several reasons, I will NOT be going to Chicago including Work,Family,Medical and COVID, as Chicago won't be much fun with its Restrictions and so many places closed and lots of friends like yall not being there the Sad State of the Texas Eaglet @ insane prices for what's on offer.

I was lucky to make the trips I made earlier in the year before COVID once again as in reared its ugly head!

I have received my Booster Shot of Pzifer and also the Senior Flu Shot as they're predicting a Big Flu Season here.

I have a good friend ( a young woman) who I worked with, that just moved to London to marry a Frenchman and start her new life.

Lovely pictures, best to Rosie, I really like the Pic with your feet up while you drink a cup of tea!


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## oregon pioneer (Sep 17, 2021)

Oh, my, so beautiful. I recognized your photo of Lac Leman from the slope above, over the vineyards. When I was in college, I stayed some time with a family at Yverdon. I saw that view as the train climbed up the slope above Lausanne (on a different rail line). That was the year I really learned to speak French, after eight years of studying it. There is a big difference between mental translation, and thinking in a language. I knew I had arrived when I began to *dream* in French! Your photos are taking me back to Europe, and making me want to travel again (in my dreams...).


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## v v (Sep 17, 2021)

oregon pioneer said:


> Your photos are taking me back to Europe, and making me want to travel again (in my dreams...).



Come on Jennifer, sometimes dreams do come true...


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## v v (Sep 17, 2021)

*Fifth section ~ Achensee, Austria for 3 days - Tuesday 7 to Friday 10 September 2021*

Thursday 9 September, a lake day. Achensee in beautiful weather.


If you have to wait for a ferry, why not here?






*To be continued...*


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## caravanman (Sep 18, 2021)

A nice varied travel report, it looks like you had some very good weather too. Any tips on which websites to book travel tickets? I can't quite read the title of your "feet up" next trip planning book, where are you thinking of next?


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## v v (Sep 18, 2021)

caravanman said:


> A nice varied travel report, it looks like you had some very good weather too. Any tips on which websites to book travel tickets? I can't quite read the title of your "feet up" next trip planning book, where are you thinking of next?



Thanks Ed, we did get lucky with the weather.

Not really any tips only that I use Trainline to gain an idea of what is possible within the UK and Europe but usually their charges make them less than competitive.

The other almost pan Europe company is Rail Europe which has also taken over French SNCF ticketing (I think they are owned by SNCF). The site is ok but not the best and their ticketing outside France is clunky to be polite, useless on some occassion would also fit. They also load base fares with fees too like Trainline, and like Trainline do not always show all available departures and routes. Through some of Europe DB works very well, and are well priced too. Excellent website and the finished tickets are good too with proper information.
OBB (Austrian Railways) are excellent for sleeper trains, they are the current European leader in them. Their website takes a little getting used to but works when you get the hang of it.
Swiss Rail SBB website is ok, not as good as the trains they run though, but not bad.

At the start of a search I look at one or all of the companies who cover more than one country first, then go into the national rail company website to compare the overview I have. Usually best price, information and good ticketing is supplied by the national company, although where available I use DB increasingly as a combination of price coupled with info and good ticketing.

'Around the world in 80 days' by Michael Palin is the book, I now have 3 versions of the Jules Verne book plus 3 films too.

Last year we had a fully planned and part booked round the world on public transport journey, mainly through central Asia, China and eastwards. It was due to start in autumn 2020, obviously Covid stopped that.
Not ones to give up we started to think of a route that was less off the beaten track, then re-watch the Palin 80 days travelogue. Bought the book of the documentary and realised there was much more about the journey in the book than the tv version, and then that each of the tv/film versions went to different places to the other and different to the original route as written by Verne.
So... we have a crazy idea of creating a different RTWIED but combining elements of the 4 different routes with our 2020 route but visiting mainly less remote countries or ones that haven't suffered so badly from Covid.

The plan could easily be 3 years before we start it mostly due to Covid, but will we want to try such an arduous journey in 3 years time, who knows? But we can dream, that's still allowed.

Next major trip is still shipping our camper to the US, maybe this time next year?

Bit of a long answer but hope it gives you an idea or two. I'll be contacting you for info too as India is high on the list of 80 days adventures. Trying to think of a simple name for such a journey and take some pressure off that the title creates. How about "Around the world in about 80 days, give or take, +/-"?


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## caravanman (Sep 18, 2021)

What about calling it "360 Degrees in under 2000 hours" ? 

Many thanks for the comprehensive tips Jamie!


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## v v (Sep 18, 2021)

caravanman said:


> What about calling it "360 Degrees in under 2000 hours" ?
> 
> Many thanks for the comprehensive tips Jamie!



Well, your idea has some merit... '2000 hours'? No, that sounds like a disaster movie


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## v v (Sep 18, 2021)

*Fifth section ~ Achensee, Austria for 3 days - Tuesday 7 to Friday 10 September 2021*

Thursday 9 September, a lake day. Achensee in beautiful weather ~ Part II


Still waiting for the ferry



Nice looking ship



Quite spacious inside



View along the lake.



Ferry continues without us as we disembark at Pertisau at the southern end of the lake, This has been a resort for many many years and is now moved a long way upmarket. Beautiful setting with rugged mountains as a backdrop, just not our style.



Rosie came here 50 years ago when it was a couple of hotels and a few farms, she was accompaning her maiden aunt. It was her first trip abroad and kick-started her love for travel and all things that were not like home. Rosie didn't remember that Pertisau was on lake Achensee (she was a teenager with other things on her mind) until a few weeks after we had booked our hotel. This photo is taken at the same spot her aunty took one of her, this is for aunty.



Dramatic mountains behind Pertidsau



Fabulous setting for a hotel



We continue on another ferry later in the afternoon



End to a very happy journey around the lake





Tomorrow Friday 10 September we leave Klaus, Annette and Achensee, Austria for Munich, Germany. Only about 1hour 30 minutes by express train.
The Pension Seeblick was all we could wish for and friendly too. While we were getting ready to go out to dinner on Thursday evening Klaus was invited by the Czech couple in the next room to share some home made schnapps on the shared balcony. It was so nice he suggested Annette should try some too.
We were gone only 55 minutes and couldn't believe the transformation in such a short time, giggling was their main explanation as to what had happened. I had to drive their car as I'm not sure they would have been able to find it that alone drive it. Fun evening was had by all, and somehow lederhosen came into the conversation too...



*To be continued...*


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## v v (Sep 20, 2021)

The remainder of the trip to Munich -> Paris -> Moulins will be completed in about 10 days as we must at short notice return to the UK to finalise documentation for our move to France.


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## Bob Dylan (Sep 20, 2021)

v v said:


> The remainder of the trip to Munich -> Paris -> Moulins will be completed in about 10 days as we must at short notice return to the UK to finalise documentation for our move to France.


So it's Goodbye to the Old Sod!


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## JontyMort (Sep 21, 2021)

jiml said:


> I'm planning an early 2022 Europe trip, since it's looking a little more practical than the US right now, and was looking for a hotel option near the HBF. (I'd love to do the Schweizerhof, but the budget disagrees.)



I did do the Schweitzerhof a few years ago. It was certainly expensive, but I thought it was worth it, and you get this view (the original train shed in vv’s photo runs left to right within the building I have photographed). I wanted to do London to Florence via the original St Gotthard route (the base tunnel opened later that year).


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## jiml (Sep 21, 2021)

JontyMort said:


> I did do the Schweitzerhof a few years ago. It was certainly expensive, but I thought it was worth it, and you get this view (the original train shed in vv’s photo runs left to right within the building I have photographed). I wanted to do London to Florence via the original St Gotthard route (the base tunnel opened later that year).View attachment 24500
> 
> View attachment 24500


Thanks so much! My two options are either the direct day train between Frankfurt and Milan or build in a stopover in Zurich. (We plan to fly into FRA and back from MXP.) It's been years since we've been to Zurich and didn't have nearly enough time there. Other than the S'hof, the hotels close to Zurich Main don't review too well. I have Marriott points to burn, but it's a bit of a walk with luggage in February-March.


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## JontyMort (Sep 21, 2021)

jiml said:


> Thanks so much! My two options are either the direct day train between Frankfurt and Milan or build in a stopover in Zurich. (We plan to fly into FRA and back from MXP.) It's been years since we've been to Zurich and didn't have nearly enough time there. Other than the S'hof, the hotels close to Zurich Main don't review too well. I have Marriott points to burn, but it's a bit of a walk with luggage in February-March.


Well, at the risk of influencing you one way or the other, the breakfast was sufficiently good for me to photograph it…


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## v v (Sep 24, 2021)

Bob Dylan said:


> So it's Goodbye to the Old Sod!



Which one?


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## v v (Sep 28, 2021)

*Sixth section ~ Achensee/Jenbach, Austria **->** Munich, Germany - Friday 10 September 2021*


Jenbach station with a mountain backdrop. Change of plan as Express trains are currently not calling at Jenbach due to trackwork. We arrived early which allowed us to catch a local train up the line to Worgl HBF, Austria where we board the Innsbruck - Munich Express, 8th and 9th train on this trip so far.



Worgl HBF



Munich Express arriving



Munich HBF terminus. Lots of walkers were onboard.



Looking across the platforms saw these three



Is it possible the US will have trains like these one day?



Interesting arrivals and departure board



We booked a hotel close to the station, didn't really expect it to be so Bayern. Interesting hotel as it was comprised of a 3 star front section, and a 4 star rear section. Staff were superb, the desk wouldn't accept a tip for something they did for us and instead put the note in a charity box. Room was more than adequat and only a 2 minute walk from the HBF.






*To be continued...*


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## v v (Oct 8, 2021)

*Sixth section continued ~ München, Germany - Friday 10 September 2021*

Friday afternoon we planned to visit the river Isar which runs through the city. It lies on the opposite SE side of the city from the HBF and hotel, a tram journey was planned to take us to one of the river bridges.
Something had happened to the tram system that afternoon as there were only a few trams running, the stations were filling to overflowing with waiting people.
We decided to walk across the city, after all we had time. We were so pleased we did as walking in an arc around the old town (we had visited the center on previous visits) we walked through areas where real people lived, and very vibrant it was too, most enjoyable.

Here are a few photos for *Deni *but they are not very relevant to the journey.


A tram roundabout or traffic circle. Inside this pretty large area was a beautiful park with a natural water feature, very thoughtful



There were quite a number of these small bier gartens/cafes on the west side of the river. Not busy mid-afternoon as most people were at work.



Through the whole city there was a friendly and relaxed atmosphere



Nicely laid out. River, walking path, grassed with shade area, cycle path and behind the camera another walking path through a treee lined avenue.



The reason for our Munich pilgrimage, the island which has our family name but no other connection is known.




I thought I had given up being interested in exotic cars, does anyone know how crowd funding works?





*To be continued... the following day a high speed return to our cottage in France via Paris*


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## v v (Oct 11, 2021)

*Seventh section ~ Munich, Germany -> Paris, France -> Moulins sue Allier, France... heading home - 11 September 2021*


Early start for the short walk round to the Munich HBF, our French Duplex TGV is there waiting for us. We are booked through to Moulins in First Class, never used it before so quite interested in the difference. The tickets for this section were booked through DB, the _extra_ for first class including the 2 1/2 hour French TER express south from Paris was Euros 28, a real bargain.



This is what upper level first class looks like, cozy.



The largest marshalling yard I have ever seen



It was here



The journey from Munich to the French border was at high express train speeds, once into France the speed increased dramatically. Maximum I saw was 326 kph (203 mph) about 1 1/2 hours out from Paris.
I am not a big fan of high speed trains for pure leisure travel purposes, too fast to just stare at something outside that catches your eye. I see them as a better more human alternative to flying if the objective is just to get somehwere in a hurry, but there is an element of excitement too at the acceleration and the speed these trains glide past the fastest traffic on interstate type roads.

All that said this 6 hours from Munich HBF to Paris Est was the most comfortable we have ever travelled by train, maybe a combination of first class and a superb train?

Last on this. The French regional TER express trains are very comfortable in 2nd class, the first class seating on this TER journey was little if at all any better. Also there was not a lot more space either, so we'll stick with 2nd class from now on... unless a 1st class TGV ticket at bargain prices pops up maybe.

Paris Est / Gare de l'Est, our first time here



It's a beautiful station, busy too



West side exit for the short walk to Gare du Nord...



... but first you have to climb this beautifully ornate double flight of stone steps. Do this with 2 good sized bags on a warm day and you'll never forget them.



You arrive first at the new Gare du Nord



Attached to the old Gare du Nord





*Continued below, out of photo space here...*


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## v v (Oct 11, 2021)

*Continuation of seventh section ~ Munich, Germany -> Paris, France -> Moulins sue Allier, France... heading home - 11 September 2021*


Gare du Nord main entrance
*
*

It's a magnificent facade



Inside the main entrance. Stairs on the far left to an upper level for Eurostar to the UK. Passport control, ticket inspection and lounge are on that level. To board a London bound train you have to return to this ground floor via a controlled exit on the other side of the station.




To the right of the above photo are the RER platforms, these are express suburban trains that run through and outside Paris. We travel 2 stops south to Gare de Lyon, then walk through to Gare de Bercy for our south bound TER train.

Back to where we started, this is the original arriving back photo



It was a pretty special week. Met up and spent time with 2 sets of long time friends, travelled through beautiful scenery, had hours on two lake ferries, visited one of our favourite cities, and travelled everywhere by train, fabulous.

Up next is a visit to Ireland to visit various family who have settled there. Then a 'Sail and Rail' journey from Dublin to London for a big family 'event'. Followed by back to France either by camper or Eurostar, yet to be decided.

Next February, Amtrak around much of the USA.

Personal view. Travel during Covid times is a risk, but it has been heavily reduced due to vaccination. Most things in life are a risk, the level is the only difference. Most of our recent journeys which were mainly France-UK-France would have been very difficult without a vaccine passport, the journey above would have been close to impossible as just getting into shops and restaurants would not have been allowed to start with.

We live most of the time in rural isolation and took months on deciding whether to travel, in fact applying to become resident in France meant we had to travel at least 3 times between countries, no options. In hindsight we are pleased we have made the choices we have, we are always fully aware there are situations where we are/would be uncomfortable, but also while taking all sensible precautions possible accept the risk to get some of our old life back.

As said, this is a personal opinion, no politics involved.


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## Willbridge (Oct 12, 2021)

v v said:


> *Continuation of seventh section ~ Munich, Germany -> Paris, France -> Moulins sue Allier, France... heading home - 11 September 2021*
> 
> 
> Gare du Nord main entrance
> ...


Thank you for taking us along! Sometimes it's easy to be depressed when well-intended projects go awry but so many rail services that you enjoyed were only a dream when I first went to Paris.

I rode the last steam-powered rush hour and then on Sunday the new electric suburban line took over from 'Nation' to Boissy-St. Leger. That was it, under the name "Metro-Express" - the RER network was only a dream.









*Metro-Express: It's rolling * [idiomatic for "it's all okay" or in railroading "highball"]
*Open to the public tomorrow*


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## v v (Oct 12, 2021)

Willbridge said:


> Thank you for taking us along! Sometimes it's easy to be depressed when well-intended projects go awry but so many rail services that you enjoyed were only a dream when I first went to Paris.
> 
> I rode the last steam-powered rush hour and then on Sunday the new electric suburban line took over from 'Nation' to Boissy-St. Leger. That was it, under the name "Metro-Express" - the RER network was only a dream.
> 
> ...



The RER will never be the same again, thank you Willbridge


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## oregon pioneer (Oct 12, 2021)

Loved your stories and photos, thank you! I know that TGV stands for "train à grande vitesse," but what does TER stand for?

I did that walk between Gare du Nord and Gare de 'Est in 2015, when I went to France with my sister. Here are a few photos (we took an older, slower train about 4 hours ESE of Paris):





Can't wait to share train adventures with you in February!


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## v v (Oct 12, 2021)

oregon pioneer said:


> Loved your stories and photos, thank you! I know that TGV stands for "train à grande vitesse," but what does TER stand for?
> 
> I did that walk between Gare du Nord and Gare de 'Est in 2015, when I went to France with my sister. Here are a few photos (we took an older, slower train about 4 hours ESE of Paris):
> View attachment 24901
> ...



Transport Express Regional. I think there are 3 types of TER denoted by the number of digits in the particular service number. 4 digits appear to mean least number of stops, faster trains. A 6 digit service gives many more stops with a different style of train, usually very modern. I think there are a 5 digit services too.
Anyway, train knowledge is not my thing, but I bet there are people on this forum that would know all about this, where is Willbridge when you need him?
You managed to get yourselves infront of the station in the first photo, we haven't seen that as yet.



oregon pioneer said:


> Can't wait to share train adventures with you in February!



Thought we would get away without anyone knowing we would all be travelling together, now we'll just have to make up agreed stories to describe how wonderful each of us are.

We're looking forward to it too Jennifer, can't wait to hear all about your adventures.


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## Willbridge (Oct 13, 2021)

TER Grand Est - Wikipedia as a sample.

TER networks were set up to regionalize the planning, marketing and service for rail and connecting bus lines focused on commuters and suburban travel. They're integrated with the national tariffs and on-line ticket sales unlike many North American commuter rail lines.

Some regions took a while to get going and/or were pretty tacky in their marketing (see photo in Basel) but overall I think they're better than what was reluctantly provided before.

I admit to not knowing their numbering system although I am certain that it is very rational!


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## slasher-fun (Oct 13, 2021)

v v said:


> To the right of the above photo are the RER platforms, these are express suburban trains that run through and outside Paris. We travel 2 stops south to Gare de Lyon, then walk through to Gare de Bercy for our south bound TER train.


Any reason not to use the metro? Line 4 from Gare de l'Est to Chatelet, line 14 from Chatelet to Bercy, and voilà.


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## slasher-fun (Oct 13, 2021)

v v said:


> Transport Express Regional.


Used to be Train Express Régional, but since the Régions took over regional transport, regional bus lines are also included, therefore Transport instead of Train now.


v v said:


> I think there are 3 types of TER denoted by the number of digits in the particular service number. 4 digits appear to mean least number of stops, faster trains. A 6 digit service gives many more stops with a different style of train, usually very modern. I think there are a 5 digit services too.


4 digits are former Intercités lines, that have been transferred from national to regional in mid 2010s
5 and 6 digits are the same, sometimes a "8" is added before the other 5 digits.
Some régions use the Krono+ / Krono / Citi / Proxi to differentiate the different patterns of service, but that's far from common.


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## jiml (Oct 13, 2021)

v v said:


> Up next is a visit to Ireland to visit various family who have settled there. Then a 'Sail and Rail' journey from Dublin to London


Look forward to your report on this. We've penciled-in Ireland as our destination for next vacation, with extensive train travel involved. The "Sail and Rail" via Holyhead has been on my bucket list ever since seeing Mark Smith's (Seat61) report on it some years ago.


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## v v (Oct 13, 2021)

Willbridge said:


> TER Grand Est - Wikipedia as a sample.
> 
> TER networks were set up to regionalize the planning, marketing and service for rail and connecting bus lines focused on commuters and suburban travel. They're integrated with the national tariffs and on-line ticket sales unlike many North American commuter rail lines.
> 
> ...



Constantly amazed at your breadth of knowledge of transport, in so many countries too, thanks for that background.


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## v v (Oct 13, 2021)

slasher-fun said:


> Any reason not to use the metro? Line 4 from Gare de l'Est to Chatelet, line 14 from Chatelet to Bercy, and voilà.



The Paris metro is a favourite and feels exotic after having grown up with the London tube system. Used to ride the tube with my brother at weekends and school holidays as children, we'd have passes that gave us the freedom of London.

That said during Covid times we are trying to spend as little time as possible underground, therefore using the faster RER. Plus we have just sat for 6 hours and the short walk round to Nord for a little excercise felt like a good idea. Also walking from Lyon to Bercy was built in for excercise.

I think in better times we would use your route, it is beauitifully simple and didn't occurr to me, thanks. 

Another factor is our most used route is Eurostar London to Paris Gare du Nord where the RER is located anyway so a simple change in the same station. We gave up using the metro from Lyon to Bercy as soon as Covid appeared.


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## v v (Oct 13, 2021)

slasher-fun said:


> Used to be Train Express Régional, but since the Régions took over regional transport, regional bus lines are also included, therefore Transport instead of Train now.
> 
> 4 digits are former Intercités lines, that have been transferred from national to regional in mid 2010s
> 5 and 6 digits are the same, sometimes a "8" is added before the other 5 digits.
> Some régions use the Krono+ / Krono / Citi / Proxi to differentiate the different patterns of service, but that's far from common.



Thanks for that, you have a great deal of detail on French rail, do you work in that area?


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## v v (Oct 13, 2021)

jiml said:


> Look forward to your report on this. We've penciled-in Ireland as our destination for next vacation, with extensive train travel involved. The "Sail and Rail" via Holyhead has been on my bucket list ever since seeing Mark Smith's (Seat61) report on it some years ago.



I'll certainly try to document the Sail and Rail for you but leaving all the arrangements to cousin Bernie. We may travel from Longford to Dublin by train or car, then Dublin to Holyhead ferry. He has mentioned there is a direct train I think to Euston station in London but the majority of these journeys require a change somewhere, I'll write it up in Travelogues when we know.

Just a thought for you and your vacation, take a look at Thurles, medium sized Irish town that Rosie and I fell in love with. Nothing special there except a national stadium for Gaelic football and hurling, but to us it has all that is good about non tourist Ireland... except climate (rain).


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## jiml (Oct 13, 2021)

v v said:


> I'll certainly try to document the Sail and Rail for you but leaving all the arrangements to cousin Bernie. We may travel from Longford to Dublin by train or car, then Dublin to Holyhead ferry. He has mentioned there is a direct train I think to Euston station in London but the majority of these journeys require a change somewhere, I'll write it up in Travelogues when we know.
> 
> Just a thought for you and your vacation, take a look at Thurles, medium sized Irish town that Rosie and I fell in love with. Nothing special there except a national stadium for Gaelic football and hurling, but to us it has all that is good about non tourist Ireland... except climate (rain).


Thanks! I was just telling another friend on AU that we've narrowed down to Ireland or Germany as the ideal spots for fully-vaccinated Canadians to travel in the reasonable future without extra tests or quarantine. It will come down to final cost and right now Ireland is winning.


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## v v (Oct 13, 2021)

It depends what you want from your vacation as to which to head for, both countries have lots to offer. That both are in the EU that means the paperwork is minimised as are border crossing formailities.

As you are into trains you could overnight ferry from Rosslare to Cherbourg, train to Paris, and from Paris train into anywhere in Germany you want to go. That would allow you to have it all and ride very varied train types.


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## caravanman (Oct 13, 2021)

"The Paris metro is a favourite and feels exotic after having grown up with the London tube system. Used to ride the tube with my brother at weekends and school holidays as children, we'd have passes that gave us the freedom of London. "

I well remember the "Red Rover" go anywhere London Bus passes, but I can't remember what the Tube pass "Rover" was called?
I agree that the Paris metro is often more interesting, with more upmarket buskers, etc...


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## v v (Oct 13, 2021)

caravanman said:


> "The Paris metro is a favourite and feels exotic after having grown up with the London tube system. Used to ride the tube with my brother at weekends and school holidays as children, we'd have passes that gave us the freedom of London. "
> 
> I well remember the "Red Rover" go anywhere London Bus passes, but I can't remember what the Tube pass "Rover" was called?
> I agree that the Paris metro is often more interesting, with more upmarket buskers, etc...



Yes, the Paris metro is where I heard quite a lot of classical music live for the first time.

Can't remember one either Ed, maybe just bought one or two stop tickets and just kept riding until we got bored. Do know we saw a lot of the London underground as kids, pretty exciting to have that freedom at 8 or 9 years old. 

Where did you live in the London area, somewhere posh?


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## caravanman (Oct 13, 2021)

I lived in Romford, I seem to recall you were in Brentwood?
We used to buy a return to Gidea Park, but instead would travel up to Stratford, cross the platform to the Central line tube, and ride around all over. Reverse when going home, and use the return ticket to exit at Romford. Happy days, but I think I was probably 11 or 12 rather than any younger.


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## v v (Oct 13, 2021)

Brentwood is posh, or if not posh then well to do. We have never lived there but we often stay with Roise's cousin who does live there. That is only the last 7 or 8 years though since she lost her husband.

Romford was one of our home towns too, from the age of 5 to 10 years old for me. Really liked Romford but parents decided to move on... again.

At the same time we spent a lot of time in Dagenham, went over there to stay with our Grandma some weekends and during school holidays. Some of my uncles still lived at Dagenham family home or called in on a regular basis and they funded our trips into central London, or bought us an ice cream. Typical East End family who didn't worry about what you did providing you didn't get into trouble and got home before it was dark.
You must have experieced similar too.

Playing football (soccer) took over as we got older so fewer and fewer day trips after 10 years old.

Did you have a favourite place in London to go to?


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## caravanman (Oct 13, 2021)

Maybe you started one of your train trips from Brentwood? Very familiar with Dagenham, had an uncle worked in Fords, a major employer at that time.
Good to read that you are visiting America in 2022, I hope to be able to do that next year also, fingers crossed.
We often visited South Kensington, for all the museums there. Makes me sound a bit of a "swot" but I think maybe we just liked pressing the buttons on the cabinets to activate the displays!


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## MARC Rider (Oct 13, 2021)

caravanman said:


> "The Paris metro is a favourite and feels exotic after having grown up with the London tube system. Used to ride the tube with my brother at weekends and school holidays as children, we'd have passes that gave us the freedom of London. "
> 
> I well remember the "Red Rover" go anywhere London Bus passes, but I can't remember what the Tube pass "Rover" was called?
> I agree that the Paris metro is often more interesting, with more upmarket buskers, etc...


In 1985, I bought something called a "Capitalcard" that was good for the underground, city buses and British Rail trains in the London metro area.


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## Willbridge (Oct 14, 2021)

v v said:


> Constantly amazed at your breadth of knowledge of transport, in so many countries too, thanks for that background.


Like our South Platte River it's broad but not very deep.


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## JontyMort (Oct 14, 2021)

v v said:


> I'll certainly try to document the Sail and Rail for you but leaving all the arrangements to cousin Bernie. We may travel from Longford to Dublin by train or car, then Dublin to Holyhead ferry. He has mentioned there is a direct train I think to Euston station in London but the majority of these journeys require a change somewhere, I'll write it up in Travelogues when we know.


It will be Euston. There used to be several through trains, but it seems to be down to one a day at present - possibly the pre-Covid schedule hasn’t been restored. If you have to change - at Crewe - the connections are usually OK. Whether the connection between ferry and train is as good is a different matter. The days when the Irish Mail was a key express have long since gone.


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## caravanman (Oct 14, 2021)

The rail sail ticket is one I have used previously. It allows train travel from any train station to Dublin, via Holyhead. Depending on the Dublin destination selected, it can include a bus from the Ferry Port to the centre. 
There is a similar ticket available to travel from Harwich to Holland, called the Dutch Flyer. (No flying involved)! 
For someone like me who likes to go "the long way round", it is a fun way to travel.
And if any of the North American chums are having sleepless nights fretting about the name of the Underground Rover ticket I mentioned above, it was called a Twin Rover...


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## slasher-fun (Oct 14, 2021)

v v said:


> Thanks for that, you have a great deal of detail on French rail, do you work in that area?


Thanks, but no I don't


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## jis (Oct 14, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> In 1985, I bought something called a "Capitalcard" that was good for the underground, city buses and British Rail trains in the London metro area.


Question for those who are familiar with today's London.... I know that Oyster works on everything TfL, and quite a bit of what used to be British Rail local service around London is now London Overground. But one can of course still travel on non Overground trains like say from Paddington to Southall (within the TfL territory. Is Oyster usable on these journeys?

I do have an Oyster Card, but the last time I was in London my iPhone was my Oyster Card, just like it is becoming the primary fare paying instrument on New York MTA too. Incidentally the system is New York is technically the same one used for Oyster in London.


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## JontyMort (Oct 14, 2021)

jis said:


> Question for those who are familiar with today's London.... I know that Oyster works on everything TfL, and quite a bit of what used to be British Rail local service around London is now London Overground. But one can of course still travel on non Overground trains like say from Paddington to Southall (within the TfL territory. Is Oyster usable on these journeys?
> 
> I do have an Oyster Card, but the last time I was in London my iPhone was my Oyster Card, just like it is becoming the primary fare paying instrument on New York MTA too. Incidentally the system is New York is technically the same one used for Oyster in London.


You should be fine with Oyster on those type of journeys. As you say, you don’t actually need to get an Oyster card. Smartphones will work and the same applies to a credit or debit card with a chip in it also.

There must be thousands of Oyster cards sitting around the world with a few pounds on them. At Vancouver airport I noticed an excellent system where they invite you to put your Compass card in a box so that the unused balance goes to charity.


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## v v (Oct 15, 2021)

caravanman said:


> We used to buy a return to Gidea Park, but instead would travel up to Stratford, cross the platform to the Central line tube, and ride around all over. Reverse when going home, and use the return ticket to exit at Romford. Happy days, but I think I was probably 11 or 12 rather than any younger.


Now that was a smart idea. Is it Gidea Park with a large station car park?




caravanman said:


> Good to read that you are visiting America in 2022, I hope to be able to do that next year also, fingers crossed.


It's all a gamble isn't it, but unless we try we won't know.




caravanman said:


> We often visited South Kensington, for all the museums there. Makes me sound a bit of a "swot" but I think maybe we just liked pressing the buttons on the cabinets to activate the displays!


Yes, us too and for the same reasons. Bet you're not a swot either.




JontyMort said:


> It will be Euston. There used to be several through trains, but it seems to be down to one a day at present - possibly the pre-Covid schedule hasn’t been restored. If you have to change - at Crewe - the connections are usually OK. Whether the connection between ferry and train is as good is a different matter. The days when the Irish Mail was a key express have long since gone.



Thanks for that, but having rellies that use this service several times a year I expect or hope they are up to date. Although maybe not as since they all moved to Ireland this fairly relaxed section of our family are so laid back now they are almost horizontal, so who knows how the day will go. But should be fun...


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## PaulM (Oct 25, 2021)

v v said:


> We were collected at Jenbach, Austria station by friends from Germany and brought to this chalet at Achensee at the upper end of the lake, our home for the next 3 days.


Too bad you missed this:


Achenseebahn Dampzahnradbahn (steam cog wheel railway) in Jenbach. Climbs about 5 miles from Jenbach on the main rail line in the Inn River valley in the Tyrol to Maurach am Achensee that lies on Achensee (a high Alpine lake).


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## v v (Oct 25, 2021)

PaulM said:


> Too bad you missed this:
> View attachment 25126
> 
> Achenseebahn Dampzahnradbahn (steam cog wheel railway) in Jenbach. Climbs about 5 miles from Jenbach on the main rail line in the Inn River valley in the Tyrol to Maurach am Achensee that lies on Achensee (a high Alpine lake).



I knew of it as it came up in research, but we spent our time with friends who had little interest in trains. We don't get to see these people so often now so we all compromised on what to do and see in that short time. One of their compromises was travelling on the lake ferry which we were very keen to do, maybe next time it will be the train.
Here's a photo I managed almost by accident, it pulled out of Jenbach just as our train arrived and had to scrabble for Rosie's camera while keeping an eye on our incoming train.




At first with so much rail equipment in front of it I thought not to bother, although I knew even though we are not extra interested in steam that some on this forum were. So took this blurred obscured photo anyway, then jumped on our train in a hurry. It is such a poor photo that I didn't think it should be included.

Have you ridden this train?


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## Mystic River Dragon (Oct 26, 2021)

v v said:


> It is such a poor photo that I didn't think it should be included.



I have no art training, but “I know what I like,” and I think this is a wonderful photo. 

Its composition is attractive parallel rows—the tracks, the train equipment, and whatever those tall things are sticking up.

And it’s almost like a metaphor for the barricades we’ve all faced this year—a simple ride on a steam train is, in this picture, a hazy dream in the background and almost impossible to reach through the barriers.


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## PeeweeTM (Oct 27, 2021)

v v said:


> Have you ridden this train?



Just as a small correction, but it seems you took a picture of the 'other' steam train in Jenbach, the Zillertalbahn.
Different type of gauge (760mm Zillertalbahn, 1.000mm Achenseebahn and 1435mm ÖBB gauges available in Jenbach) and some other steam locomotive details.


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## v v (Oct 27, 2021)

Mystic River Dragon said:


> I have no art training, but “I know what I like,” and I think this is a wonderful photo.
> 
> Its composition is attractive parallel rows—the tracks, the train equipment, and whatever those tall things are sticking up.
> 
> And it’s almost like a metaphor for the barricades we’ve all faced this year—a simple ride on a steam train is, in this picture, a hazy dream in the background and almost impossible to reach through the barriers.



That is a beautiful description, thanks for the encouragement.


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## v v (Oct 27, 2021)

PeeweeTM said:


> Just as a small correction, but it seems you took a picture of the 'other' steam train in Jenbach, the Zillertalbahn.
> Different type of gauge (760mm Zillertalbahn, 1.000mm Achenseebahn and 1435mm ÖBB gauges available in Jenbach) and some other steam locomotive details.



I don't have experise on any rail equipment so happy to accept your conclusions, they are obviously big on 'steam' in Jenbach. 

Having written that I will also add that Jenback was the most industrialised town that we passed through in the entire Tyrol, maybe there is a connection?


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## PeeweeTM (Oct 27, 2021)

v v said:


> I don't have experise on any rail equipment so happy to accept your conclusions, they are obviously big on 'steam' in Jenbach.



Well, on the picture PaulM shows, you can see the boilers are mounted 'funny' on the frame to keep tubes ducting the hot fumes under water while riding the rather steep slope. If the water doesn't cover and cool the pipes (making steam as a bi-product, or the other way around...), those tubes would melt, releasing the steam via the smook stack bypassing the steam engine.

And for being able to move at the wanted speed on that steep sloop between Jenbach and the Achensee, you can see parts of the 'cog-drive'(?) at elbow height of the man facing the fotographer.

I never drove steam locomotives that little and under those demanding circumstances, but the logic behind the components I can recognize and hopefully explain.


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