# Metrolink EMD F125 "Spirit" Locomotive



## Fan Railer

More info: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_F125


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## CCC1007

Wow, that looks cool!


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## willem

Since the wikipedia article says the first one is scheduled to be delivered this quarter, I assume that's the first one. And yes, that is a fine looking machine.

Was the picture taken at the assembly plant in Muncie, IN?


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## CSXfoamer1997

Finally!!! What will they be numbered?


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## PerRock

idk, not a fan.

peter


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## Fan Railer

willem said:


> Since the wikipedia article says the first one is scheduled to be delivered this quarter, I assume that's the first one. And yes, that is a fine looking machine.
> 
> Was the picture taken at the assembly plant in Muncie, IN?


Presumably yes.


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## CSXfoamer1997

I've seen that the first of this model is now being shipped. Someone saw it on the Chesterton Webcam covered with a tarp.


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## CSXfoamer1997

Besides #903, has anyone else seen any others that have been complete so far? And whether they're still in La Grange or heading for Pueblo?


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## CSXfoamer1997

Any heads-ups as of now?


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## Ryan

You know, I'm sure that the hypothetical person that does know was just sitting on that info until Simone asked about it. I'm sure your well thought out question will bring them out of the woodwork posthaste.


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## Eric S

Simone doesn't share her secrets


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## CSXfoamer1997

Where is #903 currently at as of now? A couple months ago, it passed the Chesterton Webcam. Also, have any others been complete yet?


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## Acela150

If someone knew.. Someone would have said something.. Until then.. This is my feelings on these units..


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## Fan Railer

To be blunt: if the information hasn't already been volunteered, it is not public yet, and therefore there is no point in asking. So as I tell everyone who asks questions like this. Sit back, have some patience, and play the waiting game like the rest of us.


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## Acela150

I will give Foamer some credit.. I'm glad to see someone excited to see new equipment come out. I remember how excited I was for the Acela sets to come out. Granted I was 8 or 9. But I am glad to see that such excitement still exists.. 

At NS we get excited over new locomotives coming out.. Yes that includes the second hand stuff... On top of that us conductors will get excited when a brand spankin' new car comes by that is easy to ride.


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## CSXfoamer1997

Acela150 said:


> I will give Foamer some credit.. I'm glad to see someone excited to see new equipment come out. I remember how excited I was for the Acela sets to come out. Granted I was 8 or 9. But I am glad to see that such excitement still exists..
> 
> At NS we get excited over new locomotives coming out.. Yes that includes the second hand stuff... On top of that us conductors will get excited when a brand spankin' new car comes by that is easy to ride.


Nice!


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## CSXfoamer1997

What's the official order now? 20 locos, 29 locos, or 40 locos?


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## jis

10+7+3 = 20. See http://www.metrolinktrains.com/news/news_item/news_id/899.html, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_F125


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## CSXfoamer1997

Looks like the official order is now 40.

http://www.metrolinktrains.com/pdfs/MetrolinkMatters/metrolink_matters_2016_AprMay.pdf


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## CSXfoamer1997

Also, a second note: how come on the rear of the loco, there's a window on one side instead of on the door?


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## CCC1007

Potentially for the same reason that the P40's had that originally, a hostler control stand?


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## CSXfoamer1997

CCC1007 said:


> Potentially for the same reason that the P40's had that originally, a hostler control stand?


I see. And what did they do on the P40's to remove the rear window?


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## CCC1007

Just removed the controls and plated over the window frame.


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## jis

CSXfoamer1997 said:


> Looks like the official order is now 40.
> 
> http://www.metrolinktrains.com/pdfs/MetrolinkMatters/metrolink_matters_2016_AprMay.pdf


Interesting. I can't find this new number anywhere else. But I suppose Metrolink must know what they have ordered! Good find! I wonder where they found the money for the other 20.

Ah OK. The actual number of engines ordered so far is 20+9 = 29. They eventually want to order the remaining 11 to make up 40, but so far do not have the funds to do so. They have3 recently gotten another grant that will allow them to order another 4 or so, and another future grant is in the offing that will enable them to order the balance 7 to make up 40, but these orders are yet to be placed and finalized.

See: http://www.railway-technology.com/news/newsmetrolink-unveils-first-emd-f125-spirit-diesel-locomotive-4791592

Interestingly, the monococque car body of these locomotives comes from Vossloh, and is European technology.


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## Acela150

First Metrolink unit out of Muncie as of 6/8.


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## TheMalahat

Lots of pictures: http://www.metrolinktrains.com/agency/page/title/Tier_4_Locomotives


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## TinCan782

Apparently just arrived per their Facebook page...

https://www.facebook.com/Metrolink/photos/?tab=album&album_id=10153701023252934


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## MisterUptempo

Located a video of the F125's arrival-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7Hr1yjLSw4


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## CSXfoamer1997

If the rear windows are for hostler controls, what exactly IS hostler controls? Is it the control stand at the rear of the loco?


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## CCC1007

CSXfoamer1997 said:


> If the rear windows are for hostler controls, what exactly IS hostler controls? Is it the control stand at the rear of the loco?


yep, and the maximum speed was limited to 15 mph on the p40 locomotives while that control stand was in use.


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## CSXfoamer1997

Cody, why would they need a hostler control stand if they already have a control stand at the front of the loco?

When backing up, the engineer could just simply stick his head out the window and look back, or look in the rearview mirrors.


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## CCC1007

CSXfoamer1997 said:


> Cody, why would they need a hostler control stand if they already have a control stand at the front of the loco?
> 
> When backing up, the engineer could just simply stick his head out the window and look back, or look in the rearview mirrors.


They have ~60 feet of locomotive between the rear coupler and the main controls. The hostler controls allow for easier sight lines when coupling to their cars. This is the same reason that freight trains when coupling have someone on the ground near the coupler giving instructions to the engineer.


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## TinCan782

Spotted SCAX 905 at CMF (Central Maintenance Facility) this morning as I was coming into town on Metrolink 100 from Chatsworth.


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## jis

According to a posting in trainorders, the F125 project is currently in deep doo doo. It has not been certified by FRA yet, so deliveries are all held up by the bunch of issues that need to be resolved first. meanwhile Vossloh which is a supplier of design and parts to EMD for the F125 has been acquired by Stadler, which competes with EMD in the US. So things are not exactly going peachy between EMD and Vossloh anymore. Considering that Vossloh manufactures the body of the F125, that is - shall we say - a bit of a problem, over and above the problems with FRA certification, or lack thereof.

Meanwhile EMD is apparently so late that they have already reached the maximum liquidated damages, so they are unlikely to deliver anything further until all issues are resolved. So everyone is sitting around the one hangar queen in possession of Metrolink (905) and apparently another one sitting in Pueblo, which is yet to complete the testing for certification, for issues to resolve first.

Seems like shades of CAF repeating itself here.


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## Acela150

CSXfoamer1997 said:


> Cody, why would they need a hostler control stand if they already have a control stand at the front of the loco?
> 
> When backing up, the engineer could just simply stick his head out the window and look back, or look in the rearview mirrors.


It's not as simple as sticking your head out a window or looking in the side mirrors.

Run an engine long hood forward and you will quickly understand.


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## Devil's Advocate

jis said:


> According to a posting in trainorders, the F125 project is currently in deep doo doo. It has not been certified by FRA yet, so deliveries are all held up by the bunch of issues that need to be resolved first. meanwhile Vossloh which is a supplier of design and parts to EMD for the F125 has been acquired by Stadler, which competes with EMD in the US. So things are not exactly going peachy between EMD and Vossloh anymore. Considering that Vossloh manufactures the body of the F125, that is - shall we say - a bit of a problem, over and above the problems with FRA certification, or lack thereof. Meanwhile EMD is apparently so late that they have already reached the maximum liquidated damages, so they are unlikely to deliver anything further until all issues are resolved. So everyone is sitting around the one hangar queen in possession of Metrolink (905) and apparently another one sitting in Pueblo, which is yet to complete the testing for certification, for issues to resolve first. Seems like shades of CAF repeating itself here.


God Bless America.


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## bretton88

I do wonder how long EMD will continue. This is not their first major mis-step in the last several years and Cat has shown signs that they might be willing to pull the plug on it. At the very least, the competition for passenger locomotives is very strong in the usa and this could kill that department for EMD.


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## CCC1007

bretton88 said:


> I do wonder how long EMD will continue. This is not their first major mis-step in the last several years and Cat has shown signs that they might be willing to pull the plug on it. At the very least, the competition for passenger locomotives is very strong in the usa and this could kill that department for EMD.


EMD has already been withdrawn from use as a brand, though they do still make many freight locomotives.


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## bretton88

CCC1007 said:


> bretton88 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I do wonder how long EMD will continue. This is not their first major mis-step in the last several years and Cat has shown signs that they might be willing to pull the plug on it. At the very least, the competition for passenger locomotives is very strong in the usa and this could kill that department for EMD.
> 
> 
> 
> EMD has already been withdrawn from use as a brand, though they do still make many freight locomotives.
Click to expand...

Yes, though the whole tier 4 transition has been a disaster for EMD too. Progress Rail is a better brand, so it might help reboot EMD even if it's no longer called EMD.


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## cirdan

jis said:


> According to a posting in trainorders, the F125 project is currently in deep doo doo. It has not been certified by FRA yet, so deliveries are all held up by the bunch of issues that need to be resolved first. meanwhile Vossloh which is a supplier of design and parts to EMD for the F125 has been acquired by Stadler, which competes with EMD in the US. So things are not exactly going peachy between EMD and Vossloh anymore. Considering that Vossloh manufactures the body of the F125, that is - shall we say - a bit of a problem, over and above the problems with FRA certification, or lack thereof.


With everybody owning everybody else these days, isn't it already quite common that parts are sourced from competitors in the industry? I don't think this situation is totally unprecedented nor unresolvable.

And whereas Stadler may now be building locomotives for the European market, they are not supplying any in the US market nor planning to, so I don't see an immediate conflict of interest.


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## jis

I suppose we can all agree that the observed fact is that nothing is forthcoming from EMD in the near future. To what extent that is due to the Vossloh issue falls most likely in the speculation category AFAICT. The known potential conflict of interest is in Stadler's desire to sell DMU's rather than push passenger diesel locomotives in the US. But whether that is the cause of reduced enthusiasm on part of Vossloh to engage with EMD, or just their desire to milk EMD for all that they are worth or something else, who knows? Again, what people involved with EMD's Muncie Plant have observed is that Muncie is struggling with the F-125 and is not getting the support at present from Vossloh that they desire.


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## PerRock

cirdan said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> 
> According to a posting in trainorders, the F125 project is currently in deep doo doo. It has not been certified by FRA yet, so deliveries are all held up by the bunch of issues that need to be resolved first. meanwhile Vossloh which is a supplier of design and parts to EMD for the F125 has been acquired by Stadler, which competes with EMD in the US. So things are not exactly going peachy between EMD and Vossloh anymore. Considering that Vossloh manufactures the body of the F125, that is - shall we say - a bit of a problem, over and above the problems with FRA certification, or lack thereof.
> 
> 
> 
> With everybody owning everybody else these days, isn't it already quite common that parts are sourced from competitors in the industry? I don't think this situation is totally unprecedented nor unresolvable.
> 
> And whereas Stadler may now be building locomotives for the European market, they are not supplying any in the US market nor planning to, so I don't see an immediate conflict of interest.
Click to expand...

However EMD does make locomotives for the European market, so there is a conflict there.

peter


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## OlympianHiawatha

Is this a rugged and meaty enough unit to stand up to Amtrak use?


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## cirdan

OlympianHiawatha said:


> Is this a rugged and meaty enough unit to stand up to Amtrak use?


You might need to add larger fuel tanks and beef up the HEP. But apart from that i don't see why it wouldn't work.


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## CCC1007

cirdan said:


> OlympianHiawatha said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is this a rugged and meaty enough unit to stand up to Amtrak use?
> 
> 
> 
> You might need to add larger fuel tanks and beef up the HEP. But apart from that i don't see why it wouldn't work.
Click to expand...

It would help to have a unit or two for testing...


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## CSXfoamer1997

I've read that lately, the F125's have some kind of problems that need modifications. What were the problems?


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## leemell

Saw one today at the Van Nuys Amtrak station.


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## CSXfoamer1997

Welp, the EMD F125's are already being tested. It probably won't be long until they're in service!


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## CSXfoamer1997

http://thesource.metro.net/2017/10/06/metrolinks-first-tier-4-clean-locomotive-debuts/


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## The Iron Horse

Just saw it pass by my work. I heard its somewhat distinctive horn in the distance so I knew what was coming. It has been passing by late at night the past couple nights; heading out around 10-ish or so & coming back after 2am (last night it called it quits early and headed back before 1).

Today when I saw it a couple minutes ago, I thought it was just gonna be doing more testing, but no, it stopped at the station in the San Gabriel Valley and accepted passengers. It had a proper Metrolink locomotive behind it (sorry, I dont know any of the technical terms lol).

I took a pic of it through the fence but it's a bad pic so I wont bother posting.

Imo this locomotive is ugly, but not as bad as some of the current Metrolink ones that look like theyve been smashed in the head with a shovel LOL!!

The horn is odd sounding...when i first heard it I thought it was broken. Not a very good horn imo but again, better than some of Metrolink's other ones.


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