# Economy class vs VIA 1 on Windsor Toronto corridor



## Steve4031 (Oct 31, 2019)

What is the difference between the classes of service? How ar the meal selections for breakfast and dinner? what equipment is used?

thank you


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## jiml (Oct 31, 2019)

Equipment will either be LRC (VIA's equivalent of Amfleet, but less "round") or heritage Budd coaches. It used to be predictable but recently they've standardized seating and substitute freely. Business class (VIA 1) is seldom discounted, so can be stupidly more expensive than a coach seat, however if low buckets in coach are sold out VIA 1 becomes an excellent value. Domestic First/Business class meals on airlines aren't far from what you'll get, but breakfast won't include alcohol so might be less "worth it" for some. The actual service can vary from okay to exceptional, depending on the crew. Be sure to check timetables for trains that don't have VIA 1 on that route - especially on Saturdays.


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## Steve4031 (Oct 31, 2019)

Thank you for the information about via 1 not being available on Saturday. If I book a train and am able to select it does that mean that via 1 is available?


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## jiml (Oct 31, 2019)

Absolutely. For some reason half the Saturday trains on that route don't offer VIA 1 service. It's always puzzled me since I've never travelled in an empty VIA 1 car. If they have one it gets filled. I'm guessing equipment repositioning or something similar. Bottom line - if you can book it it's there. Personally I would always book VIA 1, but don't know your budget. "Back in the day" I would be hesitant to waste even an entitled upgrade on a breakfast flight or train.


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## NS VIA Fan (Nov 1, 2019)

Here's a link to the Travelogue Forum and a trip in Business (VIA 1) Class last year. (click on the photo to display full size)

https://discuss.amtraktrains.com/threads/a-business-class-trip-with-a-difference.73770/#post-775562


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## jiml (Nov 1, 2019)

The pictures alone should be enough to influence the original question. Budget permitting it's the only way to go.


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## Seaboard92 (Nov 1, 2019)

Go with VIA 1 it’s a superior product.


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## Urban Sky (Nov 1, 2019)

Steve4031 said:


> Thank you for the information about via 1 not being available on Saturday. If I book a train and am able to select it does that mean that via 1 is available?


As far as I’m aware, all Corridor trains (i.e. train numbers 20-98 and 622-669) except trains 84/85/87/88 (Toronto-Kitchener-London[-Sarnia]), 97/98 (Toronto-Niagara Falls, for domestic travel at least) and on Saturdays also trains 71/73 (the two first Toronto-Windsor trains of the day), 76/78 (the last two Windsor-Toronto trains) and 655 (the morning Kingston-Toronto train) offer Business Class service and this is reflected in the reservation system: If it offers you a Business Class ticket, then Business Class service is offered...



jiml said:


> Absolutely. For some reason half the Saturday trains on that route don't offer VIA 1 service. It's always puzzled me since I've never travelled in an empty VIA 1 car. If they have one it gets filled. I'm guessing equipment repositioning or something similar. Bottom line - if you can book it it's there. Personally I would always book VIA 1, but don't know your budget. "Back in the day" I would be hesitant to waste even an entitled upgrade on a breakfast flight or train.


Saturday is the day with the weakest travel demand, therefore no Business Class service is offered on trains 71/73/76/78. However, just as with trains 84/87, the first passenger coach is a Business Class car (i.e. with 2+1 seating, unless it’s an un-refurbished HEP2 Business car) and seats all Economy Class passengers assigned to “Car 03”...


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## Steve4031 (Nov 1, 2019)

I appreciate all the responses. Very helpful. I will probably go bc when I do this. Does anyone know what exactly is offered for breakfast and dinner? I’ve found that I really don’t like the Acela first class meals most of the time for lunch and dinner. But breakfast is ok. Was wondering what via was like.


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## Seaboard92 (Nov 1, 2019)

I want to say VIA swaps out the menus every month. Usually three or four dinner options, and two breakfast options. 

Breakfast hasn’t impressed me on the corridor and I seam to always end up on No. 60/50 the first eastbound out of Toronto. 

There are ways to tell which equipment you are getting. When you go to the reservation screen. Select a fare and hit the info so it’ll pop up. 

Look at the URL and you will see a code for what type of car is being used. 

HP1=HEP 1 these are the long distance coaches. More than likely you won’t see these on the corridor but they do pitch in from time to time. HP1 also will characterize the Manors and Chateau sleepers as well. 

HP2=HP2. These are second hand Ex Amtrak Budd cars. 

LRC=Light Rapid Comfortable. These are the cars from the 70s that are only found on the corridor. These will soon be retired. 

REN=Renaissance. These are the former British Nightstar coaches and sleepers. For the most part these stick on the Ottawa-Quebec City portion of the corridor. As well as the Ocean to Halifax. However these will be retired soon as well. 

MIX=Mixed consist that’s made up of various types. Usually HEP and LRC. 

???= they don’t have an idea. 

RDC=Rail Diesel Car. This is only on the Sudbury-White River Train.


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## jiml (Nov 1, 2019)

I know VIA is anxious to retire the British stuff, but after significant investment in LRC refurbs I wouldn't be surprised if they're around for awhile. I'm thinking secondary routes after the Siemens trainsets arrive. They didn't order enough of them to replace everything.


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## Seaboard92 (Nov 1, 2019)

That would actually be the best because they could use the HP2s and some spare LRCs to launch some new corridors. Maybe Edmonton to Calgary. And Halifax to St Johns. Both are decent air markets.


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## Steve4031 (Nov 1, 2019)

This information was very helpful. Textbook example for why I enjoy AU. I would like to ride the old budd cars so this will help me work that out. 



Seaboard92 said:


> I want to say VIA swaps out the menus every month. Usually three or four dinner options, and two breakfast options.
> 
> Breakfast hasn’t impressed me on the corridor and I seam to always end up on No. 60/50 the first eastbound out of Toronto.
> 
> ...


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## Seaboard92 (Nov 1, 2019)

I enjoy the old Budds so much. By far the best cars out there to work on. Especially if someone’s retrucked them with tread brakes. 

The Budds are almost always on the Sarnia train.


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## Anderson (Nov 2, 2019)

Just on a cost reference, I did Montreal-Ottawa and back yesterday (Friday) to go bungee jumping. For a _full fare round-trip in Business_ it was CAD310 plus tax (I think it came out to about CAD355), or about USD265-270. That got me:
-The ticket, in a 2-1 LRC car
-Lunch, with a whiskey and coke plus a glass of wine
-Dinner, with a rum and coke plus a glass of wine
-Tea after both meals
-Supplemental drink service when the train was delayed on the return to Montreal (due to signals getting blown down by the weather)
--A 50% travel voucher on the return leg as well (per VIA policy).
-4.5 points per CAD of base fare (Premier status/3x points times 150% for the full fare ticket), which I roughly value at about 6-8 cents Canadian each (due to them still being...well, think AGR 6-8 years back).

The most similar Acela tickets would have cracked that for a _one-way_ ticket in First.

Edit: My experience is three lunch/dinner options as a rule. Usually it's two hot, one cold at lunch and three hot at dinner. Vegetarian, fish, and meat is pretty standard. I have yet to have a lousy meal on this front. Breakfast is a little more limited (two, usually, I think; breakfast rarely happens for me*) and there are a few mid-afternoon trains that do a cold plate/light meal either Quebec-Montreal or Montreal-Ottawa.

*My standard combo for a bungee trip is the noon-ish train (presently 35; as long as I can recall there's been a train between about 1200 and 1300 on weekdays; weekends have been more variable and constrained and Saturday has always been a PITA) Montreal-Ottawa and the last train back (presently 38 at 1855; the evening train situation has changed...it used to be a run-through from Toronto that left around 2030 and got in around 2220). Note that I _think_ I have every ticket record I ever had on VIA in my email files. If I don't, I'm dang close.


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## Bob Dylan (Nov 2, 2019)

Good stuff Cliff! 

Brings back great memories of my trips on these routes while visiting relatives in Oakville,Windsor,Ottawa and Montreal!


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## jiml (Nov 3, 2019)

Took VIA 1 to Montreal yesterday - lunch train. Service was almost identical to Anderson description above. Hearty first drink (as in full Solo cup), then lunch as shown below. Entrée choices were vegetarian pasta, grouper with lobster sauce and shrimp over rice or chicken schnitzel cold plate with German potato salad. Both were served with tomato-mozzarella appetizer and warm bread - white, wheat or olive, and dessert bar. Wine with refills was also served.




The only odd thing was an overflowing luggage rack in a half-full car when we boarded at the second stop on the route. We were directed to store our bags in the baggage car (self-serve), which was a little unusual. I haven't been in a baggage car in 20 years, which was sort of cool. Wife was less impressed. Same method of retrieval at Montreal. Apparently our car had an unmodified luggage rack (half-size). Otherwise service was average for this route - neither bad nor great. Although there was significant passenger turnover throughout the trip, the lone attendant (usually two) was never busy and spent a lot of time sitting around.


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## Steve4031 (Nov 4, 2019)

Thank you for the meal pictures and additional information. I’m curious about parking in Windsor. Google satellite maps shows there is a small parking lot by the station. Is it possible to park there for the day?


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## seat38a (Nov 5, 2019)

Definitely take Business Class or whatever they are calling it these days. I took it from Toronto to Quebec City with a change of train in Montreal.














Thats a 16oz Gin and Tonic. Wine and hard liquor flowed freely.


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## Bob Dylan (Nov 5, 2019)

seat38a said:


> Definitely take Business Class or whatever they are calling it these days. I took it from Toronto to Quebec City with a change of train in Montreal.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Canadians give a good pour and like to eat too! LOL


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