# Which stations are smoking breaks?



## Sbaitso

I'm not a smoker, but I've always wondered how to tell which stops along a route are smoking breaks. There has been a time or two that I would like to get off the train and stretch my legs in the fresh air for a few minutes but I never know how to tell. Hopefully the answer isn't "listen for the announcement" because I have to say that I may hold the record for never having understood a single announcement on an Amtrak train. Too bad there isn't an award for that, I could use a few thousand AGR points. :giggle:


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## Bill Haithcoat

Sbaitso said:


> I'm not a smoker, but I've always wondered how to tell which stops along a route are smoking breaks. There has been a time or two that I would like to get off the train and stretch my legs in the fresh air for a few minutes but I never know how to tell. Hopefully the answer isn't "listen for the announcement" because I have to say that I may hold the record for never having understood a single announcement on an Amtrak train. Too bad there isn't an award for that, I could use a few thousand AGR points. :giggle:


A suggestion would be those stops which have a separate arrival and departure time. And if you do go out check with your car attendant how far you can stray.


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## PerRock

The ones with seperate arrival & departure are the 'official' smoking stops however if the train isn't running to badly late the crew usually will allow someone to step off at just about any station, provided they stay near the door.

peter


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## saxman

Well aside from announcements, there is no way to tell really. Sure there are stops that list both and arrival and departure times, but there are others as well. Do you have a particular route you normally ride? I'm sure I could come up with most of the smoke stops along many of the routes.

For the Texas Eagle it's:

St. Louis

Little Rock

Longview

Dallas

Fort Worth

Temple

Austin

For the Sunset Ltd.:

Lafayette?

Beaumont

Houston

San Antonio

Del Rio

Alpine

El Paso

Tuscon

Palm Springs

Most of these are places I've at least been able to step off. If the train is late, I'm sure some smaller stops might be eliminated, especially if there's no crew change or checked bags to handle.


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## the_traveler

As mentioned, once I was on the Sunset Limited/Texas Eagle that arrived into Alpine, TX 1 hour *EARLY*




. Because trains can not depart until their scheduled departure time, we had an unscheduled smoke stop of 1 hour!


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## saxman

the_traveler said:


> As mentioned, once I was on the Sunset Limited/Texas Eagle that arrived into Alpine, TX 1 hour *EARLY*
> 
> 
> 
> . Because trains can not depart until their scheduled departure time, we had an unscheduled smoke stop of 1 hour!


I believe Alpine is a smoke stop no matter what because that is a crew change point.


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## the_traveler

saxman said:


> the_traveler said:
> 
> 
> 
> As mentioned, once I was on the Sunset Limited/Texas Eagle that arrived into Alpine, TX 1 hour *EARLY*
> 
> 
> 
> . Because trains can not depart until their scheduled departure time, we had an unscheduled smoke stop of 1 hour!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I believe Alpine is a smoke stop no matter what because that is a crew change point.
Click to expand...

That may be true, but not for an hour. We were specifically told about the hour stop, and also the train blocked 2 grade crossings! Thus I doubt 1 hour is normal!


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## Trogdor

There are no "official" smoking stops in the schedule. Also, a separate arrival and departure time doesn't mean a heck of a lot. There are plenty of stations with extended dwells that only list one time in the timetable, and a few that are fairly short, but still show both of them.


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## guest

There are no guaranteed smokestops. If the train is late, the smokestop can be cancelled. I've seen this happen on the Capitol Limited. On that train, the smokestops are Toledo, Cleveland, Pittsburgh, and Cumberland, MD.

On trains south of Washington, Richmond Staples Mill is a smokestop.


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## Sbaitso

Thanks to everyone for the information. I think the safest thing to do to make sure I make it to my destination is to just keep my butt on the train.  I've just always wondered about how it worked and never could figure it out from the schedule.


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## PerRock

if you want off the easiest thing to do is to ask the conductor or car attendant. Usually they'll tell you when you can get off. When you do take your ticket stub with you. That way you can prove you belong on that train.

peter


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## daveyb99

Just look for the pile of butts on the platform -- littered and left behind rather than properly disposed of......


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## zephyr17

Sbaitso said:


> Thanks to everyone for the information. I think the safest thing to do to make sure I make it to my destination is to just keep my butt on the train.  I've just always wondered about how it worked and never could figure it out from the schedule.


You really can't from the schedule, because most stops, even long ones, don't have both arrive and depart times. Also smoking/fresh air stops are subject to operational conditions, so if a train is late, you might not have one that you ordinarily would.

With that said, there are places where you are going to have a relatively long stop no matter how late the train is. Those are service stops and crew change stops. For example, Klamath Falls on the Coast Starlight.

The conductor will typically announce which stops are "fresh air" stops, as they call them now, that you can detrain for a few (or more minutes). The conductor will also usually announce if a stop is NOT a "fresh air" stop and that passengers should not detrain if that is not their stop.

On the Coast Starlight, the "fresh air" stops are Portland, Eugene, Klamath Falls, Sacramento, Emeryville or Oakland (or both), San Luis Obispo and Santa Barbara. Sometimes San Jose. On the Empire Builder, I think they are Spokane, Whitefish, East Glacier, Shelby, Havre, Williston, Minot, Fargo (if you are up), Minneapolis, Red Wing(?), Milwaukee. Not sure of the whole list on the Southwest Chief, but ones that definitely are are Flagstaff, Albuquerque, La Junta, Kansas City. Again, not sure of the whole list on the California Zephyr, but ones that are include Reno, Salt Lake City (again, if you are up), Grand Junction, Denver, Omaha, Ottumwa.

But don't get off at any of them unless the conductor announces you can.


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## Karen

I am trying to convince my parents to take the Train from Newark NJ to Rocky Mount NC. My mother wants tio drive, and I know it is because she smokes. I could convince her to go if I KNEW the smoking stops, or if there were for sure stops she could get off quickly and get her fix. Please let me know!


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## EB_OBS

Empire Builder

Spokane, WA

Whitefish, MT

Havre, MT

Minot, ND

Minneapolis, MN

Winona, MN

If the train is running on-time, then also;

Shelby, MT

Williston, ND

St. Cloud, MN

Milwaukee, WI


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## HeadingNorth

Karen--from Newark to Rocky Mount, there's definitely Washington (a 20-30 minute stop to change engines) and very, very likely Richmond (unless the train is really late). That comes out to about 2-3 hours between smokes.


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## guest

SWC

San Bernardino

Flagstaff

Albuquerque

Raton

La Junta

Kansas City

Fort Madison

CS

Santa Barbara

San Luis Obispo

Salinas

San Jose

Oakland

Sacramento

Klamath Falls

Eugene

Portland

re: the EB, smoking on the platform is AGAINST THE LAW (Washington Clean Air Act) on any station platform in WA...


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## ThayerATM

guest said:


> re: the EB, smoking on the platform is AGAINST THE LAW (Washington Clean Air Act) on any station platform in WA...


When did the part about no smoking on the platform go into effect? We arrived in Seattle on the EB at the King Street Station, and stood outside (on the platform) smoking in 2010, and nobody said anything. Maybe it's loosely enforced? :unsure:


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## guest

If you were ON the platform, you could have been ticketed; I've seen it happen. If, however, you were over by the baggage area, you were not ON the platform...

I believe the law went into effect over 2 years ago. There are signs at nearly all stations indicating this; with the construction at SEA, the signs might be obscured.


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## busboy

I rode the CZ a few months ago. When we stopped at Grand Junction, somebody wandered off to explore and we ended up leaving him. I guess the allure of all those cutesy shops and restaurants was too much for him to resist.

I never wander farther than a 10 second sprint back to the train. The thought of being left, with all my stuff on the train scares me.


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## ThayerATM

guest said:


> If you were ON the platform, you could have been ticketed; I've seen it happen. If, however, you were over by the baggage area, you were not ON the platform...
> 
> I believe the law went into effect over 2 years ago. There are signs at nearly all stations indicating this; with the construction at SEA, the signs might be obscured.


We stepped off the train, and with our carry-on went over to the fence and lit up. Then we walked our carry-on down to the baggage area and stood outside the station finishing; but I figure we were within 10 feet of where the crew was unloading the inventory from the diner. I've always thought of that area as the platform --- outside the station, but just four steps from the train. In any case, there were no signs, nobody said anything, and we didn't get a ticket. :lol:


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## deathcabforchristina

What about on the cardinal?


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## George Harris

The location and length of smoke stops can also depend upon whether or not there are smokers in the crew and what the they can convince the conductor (if it is not teh conductor, himself) to let them do.


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## Big Iron

deathcabforchristina said:


> What about on the cardinal?


On the westbound run, based on my trip of two years ago: Indy, Cincy, Huntington, Charlottesville. I got off in CVS so probably the next and last spoke stop would be DC.

I may be wrong as I didn't need to pay attention to the smoke stops, on this run there was a deadheading coach behind the sleeper and I would go on the rear platform and light up. The on board crew was doing it as well although they were extremely paranoid that the operating crew might catch them.


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## Big Iron

Karen said:


> I am trying to convince my parents to take the Train from Newark NJ to Rocky Mount NC. My mother wants tio drive, and I know it is because she smokes. I could convince her to go if I KNEW the smoking stops, or if there were for sure stops she could get off quickly and get her fix. Please let me know!


DC is definitely a smoke stop. You can almost count on Richmond as well. In Richmond typically 35-40 passengers are boarding and the lines are long. If you get off you can get in a quick smoke then get in line and get back on. Just keep an eagle eye on the Conductor or Car Attendant and make sure you beat them back on the train. Never walk more than 10-15 feet from the door to the car.


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## EB_OBS

EB_OBS said:


> Empire Builder
> 
> Spokane, WA
> 
> Whitefish, MT
> 
> Havre, MT
> 
> Minot, ND
> 
> Minneapolis, MN
> 
> Winona, MN
> 
> If the train is running on-time, then also;
> 
> Wenatchee, WA
> 
> Pasco, WA
> 
> Shelby, MT
> 
> Williston, ND
> 
> St. Cloud, MN
> 
> Milwaukee, WI


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## EB_OBS

PerRock said:


> ... however if the train isn't running to badly late the crew usually will allow someone to step off at just about any station, provided they stay near the door.
> 
> peter


Horrible information this is. Do not attempt or ask to get off at unannounced stops. That's one very quick way to get on just about any conductor's short-list.

Smoke breaks are typically announced prior to the stop. If you don't hear an announcement informing you that you may step off the train then it's not a good idea to go and ask or attempt to get off.


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## Texan Eagle

EB_OBS said:


> If you don't hear an announcement informing you that you may step off the train then *it's not a good idea to go and ask* or attempt to get off.


Yes, do not forget while onboard Amtrak, you are the slaves and the on-board staff are the masters who like to control you with a whip. You should not ask them anything, just do what they tell you to do.

EB_OBS, I know you have been extremely helpful and supportive and not like some of the rude onboard staff we the passengers have to encounter, but this hints of the typical "power trip" attitude that puts off many passengers from Amtrak. Why should the passenger not ask? What's wrong if the passenger wants to know something they don't know? I don't see why the passengers should submit themselves to the often-not-so-great announcements and not question.


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## EB_OBS

Texan Eagle said:


> EB_OBS said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you don't hear an announcement informing you that you may step off the train then *it's not a good idea to go and ask* or attempt to get off.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, do not forget while onboard Amtrak, you are the slaves and the on-board staff are the masters who like to control you with a whip. You should not ask them anything, just do what they tell you to do.
> 
> EB_OBS, I know you have been extremely helpful and supportive and not like some of the rude onboard staff we the passengers have to encounter, but this hints of the typical "power trip" attitude that puts off many passengers from Amtrak. Why should the passenger not ask? What's wrong if the passenger wants to know something they don't know? I don't see why the passengers should submit themselves to the often-not-so-great announcements and not question.
Click to expand...


What I mean is that sometimes, going to "ask" involves the actions of, waiting until the train stops, then getting out of the seat, going downstairs and being in the way while detraining and boarding passengers are attempting to get on and off, grab and stow baggage and the conductors or attendant are busy working the stop, so one can "ask" if it's OK to get off the train for a smoke.

I didn't mean to imply don't ever ask if one can get off at a stop for a smoke break but there is usually plenty of time in between stops to ask an attendant or conductor if the next stop is a smoke break or not. That's all I meant.


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## johnny.menhennet

EB_OBS said:


> Texan Eagle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EB_OBS said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you don't hear an announcement informing you that you may step off the train then *it's not a good idea to go and ask* or attempt to get off.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, do not forget while onboard Amtrak, you are the slaves and the on-board staff are the masters who like to control you with a whip. You should not ask them anything, just do what they tell you to do.
> 
> EB_OBS, I know you have been extremely helpful and supportive and not like some of the rude onboard staff we the passengers have to encounter, but this hints of the typical "power trip" attitude that puts off many passengers from Amtrak. Why should the passenger not ask? What's wrong if the passenger wants to know something they don't know? I don't see why the passengers should submit themselves to the often-not-so-great announcements and not question.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What I mean is that sometimes, going to "ask" involves the actions of, waiting until the train stops, then getting out of the seat, going downstairs and being in the way while detraining and boarding passengers are attempting to get on and off, grab and stow baggage and the conductors or attendant are busy working the stop, so one can "ask" if it's OK to get off the train for a smoke.
> 
> I didn't mean to imply don't ever ask if one can get off at a stop for a smoke break but there is usually plenty of time in between stops to ask an attendant or conductor if the next stop is a smoke break or not. That's all I meant.
Click to expand...

I think that's perfectly fair. Asking well before the stop when the conductor/attendant is obviously not preoccupied with loading passengers should definitely be fine, but getting in the way is not. Sounds fir to me.


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## Texan Eagle

EB_OBS said:


> Texan Eagle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> EB_OBS said:
> 
> 
> 
> If you don't hear an announcement informing you that you may step off the train then *it's not a good idea to go and ask* or attempt to get off.
> 
> 
> 
> Yes, do not forget while onboard Amtrak, you are the slaves and the on-board staff are the masters who like to control you with a whip. You should not ask them anything, just do what they tell you to do.
> 
> EB_OBS, I know you have been extremely helpful and supportive and not like some of the rude onboard staff we the passengers have to encounter, but this hints of the typical "power trip" attitude that puts off many passengers from Amtrak. Why should the passenger not ask? What's wrong if the passenger wants to know something they don't know? I don't see why the passengers should submit themselves to the often-not-so-great announcements and not question.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> What I mean is that sometimes, going to "ask" involves the actions of, waiting until the train stops, then getting out of the seat, going downstairs and being in the way while detraining and boarding passengers are attempting to get on and off, grab and stow baggage and the conductors or attendant are busy working the stop, so one can "ask" if it's OK to get off the train for a smoke.
> 
> I didn't mean to imply don't ever ask if one can get off at a stop for a smoke break but there is usually plenty of time in between stops to ask an attendant or conductor if the next stop is a smoke break or not. That's all I meant.
Click to expand...

Fair enough. As long as the staff is co-operative in answering "next stop is a smoke stop or not" query raised by a passenger *before *the train has stopped without going all "What did I announce? Did you not hear it?" its all good. As you may be aware, the announcements are not always great.. sometimes difficult to hear, sometimes difficult to understand, or both.


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## surfgeek

Now, about the Coast Starlight and San Jose...

SJC used to be a smoke stop. It's an engineer-change for both #14 and #11, and there's a 12-minute dwell at the station, so there was plenty of time for people to clamber off the train and stretch their legs and/or lungs. But as of June 2012, the folks who oversee Caltrain, or is it the JPB (whoever remembers that they own-and-manage the platforms at SJC at any given time) hung big "NO SMOKING" signs on all of the platforms and informed Amtrak that they weren't to announce a smoking stop at San Jose. Smoking's illegal at county bus stops, so you cant walk out to the bus area for a smoke either...so I've heard people take their break at Salinas.

I still see plenty of people smoking when #11 comes through. And since the smoke-stands/ashtrays were taken away, we've got plenty of ciggie butts on the platform now, and no, the JPB/Caltrain don't clean up on track 1, which is used by the Starlights.

One of our Station Hosts at San Jose is a strong anti-smoking advocate, and he'll rant at smokers. I usually find something more useful to do; we're not law enforcement anyway. If tickets are to be written, let the various agencies fight out the jurisdiction on the platform -- that's always a hoot to watch. We have VTA/Sheriffs, San Jose PD, Amtrak PD, and Caltrain/SamTrans/San Mateo PD all tussling over "who's in charge here, and where"...


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## EB_OBS

Texan Eagle said:


> As you may be aware, the announcements are not always great.. sometimes difficult to hear, sometimes difficult to understand, or both.


Believe me, our PA problems frustrate me to no end. Both as a dining car LSA and as a supervisor. It drives me nuts not being able to communicate to the train effectively when it's needed. But not only just when it's needed but routine announcements and conductor's announcements are severely hampered and ineffective when the PA sucks, as it often does.

Crappy PAs is on my top 5 list for things, mechanically, that must be improved.


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## Swadian Hardcore

zephyr17 said:


> Again, not sure of the whole list on the California Zephyr, but ones that are include Reno, Salt Lake City (again, if you are up), Grand Junction, Denver, Omaha, Ottumwa.
> 
> But don't get off at any of them unless the conductor announces you can.


I must add Glenwood Springs, Lincoln, and Galesburg. Maybe also SAC.



Karen said:


> I am trying to convince my parents to take the Train from Newark NJ to Rocky Mount NC. My mother wants tio drive, and I know it is because she smokes. I could convince her to go if I KNEW the smoking stops, or if there were for sure stops she could get off quickly and get her fix. Please let me know!


The easy way around this would be nicotine gum!


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## Ana

Yeah, the PAs are pretty bad. The only announcements I hear super clearly are the breakfast and lunch wait lists which I don't wanna hear. Last trip I taught myself to sleep through 'Larsen, party of two, Peters party of four, Mary, party of one please come to the dining car at this time' etc etc over and over. After two days I felt like I could list by name half the passengers on board. And who was slow at getting on the wait list.

My first big LD trip was on the CS and all the fresh air breaks on day two (sea-lax) were awesome, I missed that on the EB and CZ as we were alway trying to make up time and most were hop on hop off.

To the CZ list I would also add Granby, we had a few moments there. Also the conductor encouraged us to go shopping at the platform store at grand junction. On the cardinal I was allowed off at Ashland KY a few years ago but not sure if coach got to - my car attendant asked me if I wanted to, since I had at all the others and I think he was getting a sleeper passenger there. I find in sleepers the SCA quickly learns who wants off every break and why and they give you a heads up for the necessary not announced (like at night). On the CZ we had a bunch of smokers and me, collecting new states I could claim to have visited




.

It's amusing how different the announcements about them are. That CS southbound trip the conductor reminded us every time that it was a 24 wait til the next train and it would leave us behind.. I pictured the US full of left behind passengers and man did it put a fear of going far from the train, my SCA that trip kept teasing me that with the ten min stops, i could probably risk stepping a few feet away. I spend a lot of the time standing next to the SCA at the door of the car! On the EB one of the conductors them literally spelled it out if we werent to get off. This stop is not, n-o-t, not, a smoke break. Yeah, the EB PA in my sleeper was loud, I remember way too many of those announcements in way too much detail...


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## ehbowen

I was once on a _Sunset Limited_, running ahead of schedule (No! Really!), which made Sanderson, TX into a smoke stop.


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## Swadian Hardcore

Ana said:


> Yeah, the PAs are pretty bad. The only announcements I hear super clearly are the breakfast and lunch wait lists which I don't wanna hear. Last trip I taught myself to sleep through 'Larsen, party of two, Peters party of four, Mary, party of one please come to the dining car at this time' etc etc over and over. After two days I felt like I could list by name half the passengers on board. And who was slow at getting on the wait list.
> 
> My first big LD trip was on the CS and all the fresh air breaks on day two (sea-lax) were awesome, I missed that on the EB and CZ as we were alway trying to make up time and most were hop on hop off.
> 
> To the CZ list I would also add Granby, we had a few moments there. Also the conductor encouraged us to go shopping at the platform store at grand junction. On the cardinal I was allowed off at Ashland KY a few years ago but not sure if coach got to - my car attendant asked me if I wanted to, since I had at all the others and I think he was getting a sleeper passenger there. I find in sleepers the SCA quickly learns who wants off every break and why and they give you a heads up for the necessary not announced (like at night). On the CZ we had a bunch of smokers and me, collecting new states I could claim to have visited
> 
> 
> 
> .
> 
> It's amusing how different the announcements about them are. That CS southbound trip the conductor reminded us every time that it was a 24 wait til the next train and it would leave us behind.. I pictured the US full of left behind passengers and man did it put a fear of going far from the train, my SCA that trip kept teasing me that with the ten min stops, i could probably risk stepping a few feet away. I spend a lot of the time standing next to the SCA at the door of the car! On the EB one of the conductors them literally spelled it out if we werent to get off. This stop is not, n-o-t, not, a smoke break. Yeah, the EB PA in my sleeper was loud, I remember way too many of those announcements in way too much detail...


When was your last trip? What train was it on?



ehbowen said:


> I was once on a _Sunset Limited_, running ahead of schedule (No! Really!), which made Sanderson, TX into a smoke stop.


How was Sanderson? I heard its station is probably the worst Amshack around!


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## Nickrapak

surfgeek said:


> Now, about the Coast Starlight and San Jose...
> 
> SJC used to be a smoke stop. It's an engineer-change for both #14 and #11, and there's a 12-minute dwell at the station, so there was plenty of time for people to clamber off the train and stretch their legs and/or lungs. But as of June 2012, the folks who oversee Caltrain, or is it the JPB (whoever remembers that they own-and-manage the platforms at SJC at any given time) hung big "NO SMOKING" signs on all of the platforms and informed Amtrak that they weren't to announce a smoking stop at San Jose. Smoking's illegal at county bus stops, so you cant walk out to the bus area for a smoke either...so I've heard people take their break at Salinas.
> 
> I still see plenty of people smoking when #11 comes through. And since the smoke-stands/ashtrays were taken away, we've got plenty of ciggie butts on the platform now, and no, the JPB/Caltrain don't clean up on track 1, which is used by the Starlights.
> 
> One of our Station Hosts at San Jose is a strong anti-smoking advocate, and he'll rant at smokers. I usually find something more useful to do; we're not law enforcement anyway. If tickets are to be written, let the various agencies fight out the jurisdiction on the platform -- that's always a hoot to watch. We have VTA/Sheriffs, San Jose PD, Amtrak PD, and Caltrain/SamTrans/San Mateo PD all tussling over "who's in charge here, and where"...



I was on 11 about two weeks ago, and the crew made it very clear that SJC was not to be a smoking stop. I can recall it being announced 3x over the PA, and my SCA mentioned something about it when I was getting off to walk around.


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