# How reliable is Air Conditioning in Bedroom cars



## Bob

We are taking AMTRAk from Seattle to Chicago and then on to NYC. We have a bedroom on both trains. Here is the question? I have a health issue with heat. Above about 78F I can feel unwell and above 85F I can get really sick. How reliable are the AC units on these cars. Forecasts show in the highs in the high 80's for most of the trip. Thanks.


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## TinCan782

For the trips I have been on, AC in my bedroom has not been a problem. In my experience, reliable.

That said, all it takes is that one occurrence.


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## norfolkwesternhenry

Usually it's fine, it just takes a little while, as well as if the train loses power, the air con goes out, but that is unlikely. I don't like hot weather, my preference is about 62 farenheiht, and if you get too hot, sleep in the lounge car, it should be plenty cool during the night


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## Seaboard92

Which trains are you on. One recommendation I can say is to sleep on the bottom bunk. On Viewliners I tend to not have good air circulation in the top bunk.


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## pennyk

I have traveled in bedrooms on Viewliners and have been warm, when the roomettes were cold. I am in a Viewliner roomette right now and am very comfortable temperature wise. I would rather be too cold than too warm. I believe that inconsistent may be a good term to describe the temperature in the rooms.


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## MikefromCrete

You can only tolerate a seven degree difference in temperatures? Might be best to fly and get the trip over in a couple of hours, rather than spend a day or two on a long distance train where just about anything can happen.


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## KmH

Bob said:


> We are taking AMTRAk from Seattle to Chicago and then on to NYC. We have a bedroom on both trains. Here is the question? I have a health issue with heat. Above about 78F I can feel unwell and above 85F I can get really sick. How reliable are the AC units on these cars. Forecasts show in the highs in the high 80's for most of the trip. Thanks.


When? This summer, fall, some time next year?


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## Ana

Be warned that the temperature for the car is set by the SCA; on a recent trip a cabal of older gentlemen traveling separately but united in purpose convinced the SCA to turn the heat on, despite it being late August and already hot. My traveling alarm clock/thermometer put the temperature at 81F, and I don't think I could have survived without a 10" portable fan. The thermostats in the bedrooms/roomettes are decorative only.


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## Bob Dylan

Sounds like everyone over 75 should only be allowed to ride LD Trains in the Winter when heat is required!

( brings to mind the Pullman Scene from the Movie "Some Like it Hot!)


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## Seaboard92

I've never had the issue of too warm or too cold. I didn't know the sca had access to the master thermostat.


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## Ryan

Ana said:


> The thermostats in the bedrooms/roomettes are decorative only.


No they're not. They work the electric heaters in the vent near the window.

You can make your room as arbitrarily hot as you would like (as long as the heaters are enabled). You cannot cool it any more than the air coming from the vent allows.

Anybody not wanting extra heat in their rooms could have spun the "nonfunctioning" thermostat to the fully cool setting and not gotten any.


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## Hal

Ana said:


> Be warned that the temperature for the car is set by the SCA; on a recent trip a cabal of older gentlemen traveling separately but united in purpose convinced the SCA to turn the heat on, despite it being late August and already hot. My traveling alarm clock/thermometer put the temperature at 81F, and I don't think I could have survived without a 10" portable fan. The thermostats in the bedrooms/roomettes are decorative only.


The SCA didn't turn the heat on in August. The only reason it would get to 81 is if the AC was not working or off. I suspect it was not working, not turned off because I don't believe anyone including older gentlemen would want it to be 81.

If you have any temperature comfort issues that are not resolved by the SCA talk to the conductor.

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


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## dlagrua

We have not had much luck getting efficient A/C in the bedrooms in the past couple of years. At best the room temperature was tolerable but certainly not cool. The equipment is getting old and worn and Amtrak needs to step up the maintenance effort.


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## Tennessee Traveler

I've not had problem with AC, in fact "if the lever to close AC vents" is broken I often have to make some type of "cover" over the vents to stopped the cold air flow. Yes, I am cold natured and have found AC to be too cold on most of my trips in Spring and Summer.


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## zephyr17

My worst problem was with a wall heater that was stuck on full blast and the roomette was like being in the inside of a toaster. It was unbearable. It also turned out that the wall heat in the H room did not work at all. The person in the H room had moved to another car because of that and the SCA gave me the choice of moving to the H room with extra blankets (it was on the Empire Builder in December), or staying inside the toaster. I went with the extra blankets in the H room.

The problem with wall heater heating uncontrollably was only affecting rooms 1 & 2, the rest of the car was apparently okay (except for the H room, of course).

The wall control works in some rooms, doesn't work in others and, as has been pointed out, only controls the wall, floor heater and does nothing to control cooling. I always turn it completely down as a matter of course.

I've ridden many cars with HVAC issues, usually insufficient/non-existent cooling, but probably about 80% of the time things are fine, and it was completely unbearable only the one time. I don't mind too cold, but I do mind too hot.


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## amamba

I've had problems with sweltering sleepers.


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## bretton88

More often than not, I've had hot sleepers, especially in superliners.


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## Lonestar648

Generally, I have had few issues with the room temperature, On the Superliner I Sleepers, I have had issues with the louvers staying open so I carry a screw driver long enough to pry them open so I can get the maximum air flow. I recently traveled on 5 different sleepers, all Superliners, none had any issues with the room temperature. Last year, we had a SCA that messed with the AC controls only to blow a breaker that could only be accessed when the train was stopped for a while. We had to wait until the train reached a service stop, so the temperature got uncomfortable. most hung out in the SSL.


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## Tennessee Traveler

Lonestar648 said:


> Generally, I have had few issues with the room temperature, On the Superliner I Sleepers, I have had issues with the louvers staying open so I carry a screw driver long enough to pry them open so I can get the maximum air flow. I recently traveled on 5 different sleepers, all Superliners, none had any issues with the room temperature. Last year, we had a SCA that messed with the AC controls only to blow a breaker that could only be accessed when the train was stopped for a while. We had to wait until the train reached a service stop, so the temperature got uncomfortable. most hung out in the SSL.


So you are the one who damages the vent louvers so that they cannot be closed by those of us "cold natured" folks who want to close and block the air from circulating or blowing on me.


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## Sauve850

Viewliner bedrooms for me anyway have been shaky at best on staying cool. Last couple years have been ok though. Superliner bedrooms seem to freeze me. I carry duct tape and try to slow down the a/c. Makes it nice for sleeping but I ask for an extra blanket.


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## unitedstatesfan

Northbound in August 2016 on train 14 ("Coast Starlight') I was in roomette number three and did not have any problems at all.

The bedding was nice and warm: the car temperature was about 22 degrees Celsius which is comfortable for me and hopefully most.


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## PVD

71.6 degrees F over here


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## Ferroequinologist

Any updates? I would like to travel in a Superliner bedroom but I need it much cooler than the original poster. My ideal is 69-70F. More than 72F is too hot for me.


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## Qapla

I take it you don't live in Florida


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## Siegmund

My experience is that while the Superliner heating control dial works, it works very slowly: it is often 75+ when I board in winter (it seems to always be very hot in the hallways, and the room doors are open if they are empty) and sometime perhaps 4 hours later my room is cool enough that I move the temperature dial back toward the middle instead of pointing it to Cold. 

It certainly ISN'T like turning down the thermostat causes cold air to blast out of an air conditioner specific to your room.


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## Dakota 400

Siegmund said:


> My experience is that while the Superliner heating control dial works, it works very slowly



I have sometimes have wondered if the dial works at all. This January on the Auto Train in my Roomette, the dial worked quite well. I like to sleep in a cool environment, so I tried to adjust the temperature to a lower setting. After a couple of hours, I was so cool that I had to use the thin blue blanket. Then, I re-adjusted the temperature and then the roomette became too warm.


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## Cho Cho Charlie

Qapla said:


> I take it you don't live in Florida



My family in Florida, will bundle up in their parkas when the outside temp is in the 60's.


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## SarahZ

Ferroequinologist said:


> Any updates? I would like to travel in a Superliner bedroom but I need it much cooler than the original poster. My ideal is 69-70F. More than 72F is too hot for me.


I'm like you. I have my apartment set to 68-70 during the day and 64-66 at night. 

When are you traveling? The sleepers are often much too warm for me during the winter, even with the ceiling vent closed and the dial in the room turned all the way down. It's not too bad during the day since I can leave my door open and let the air circulate, but it turns into an oven at night. There have been times I've left the door open and closed the curtain while sleeping, just so I don't roast.

I haven't had any bad experiences during the summer. Once, I was on the CZ, and the sun turned my side of the train into a greenhouse. Our sleeper attendant couldn't adjust the A/C since those on the left side of the train were comfortable. As a compromise, he offered to let us sit in the empty rooms on the left side, provided we kept them clean.


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## Palmland

We were in a bedroom on Auto Train at the end of last September. The room was cool for the first few hours. Then it got warmer and warmer. By bedtime it was roasting. Our excellent attendant, Ernest, moved all the roomette passengers to another car. A couple bedrooms at the end were ok and he moved us there. he earned his money that night as he insisted on moving all the passengers luggage for them. He had formerly worked for Marriott in Washington. I think he said their were two cooling units? and one died. In any event a good attendant can usually take care of his passengers regardless of the problems.


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## Qapla

Palmland said:


> a good attendant can usually take care of his passengers regardless of the problems



And the available room ... had that train been fully booked there would not have been any empty rooms to move you to


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## Ferroequinologist

SarahZ said:


> I'm like you. I have my apartment set to 68-70 during the day and 64-66 at night.
> 
> When are you traveling? The sleepers are often much too warm for me during the winter, even with the ceiling vent closed and the dial in the room turned all the way down. It's not too bad during the day since I can leave my door open and let the air circulate, but it turns into an oven at night. There have been times I've left the door open and closed the curtain while sleeping, just so I don't roast.
> 
> I haven't had any bad experiences during the summer. Once, I was on the CZ, and the sun turned my side of the train into a greenhouse. Our sleeper attendant couldn't adjust the A/C since those on the left side of the train were comfortable. As a compromise, he offered to let us sit in the empty rooms on the left side, provided we kept them clean.



You are absolutely right. In winter it can be TERRIBLE, not just in sleepers but in coach. On a NE Corridor train, in business class, a couple of years ago the temperature was close to 90F. No kidding! I had difficulty breathing and had to get up and stand in the vestibule. It was bad in the coach next to us as well. Conductors invariably say that the temperature is set in the yards and they can't do a thing about it. About the Superliners, a couple of people on this site, one a former Amtrak on board employee, have said that the Superliner AC systems are shot whereas the Viewliners are OK. 

When do you think is the best time to travel to avoid these problems?


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## me_little_me

Ever since traveling on Amtrak, even back to the early '80s, A/C and heating were always a problem. In fact on the first two LD trips with my wife and small children, we had A/C failure for the whole of the one-way trip (ABQ-CHI then second train with no A/C to Milwaukee followed by a year later ELP-Los Angeles. Return trips were fine.

Since then, whether Superliners or VL, there have been intermittent HVAC problems. One never knows. Not often but enough that we worry about it before each ride because there is little one can do if it happens and the discomfort is for so long a time.

But we took the train anyway because it was fun. However, the fun is not as good any more, the prices are so high, the services worse, the equipment worn out, the delays longer. So we sometimes fly, sometimes drive when in the past, we'd always take the train if at all possible.


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## Michigan Mom

Never had a bad night's sleep in either the Superliner or the Viewliner roomettes due to temps, summer or winter. It's not like a hotel room where you have more control over the AC or heat, I just either pull up the blanket, or not. I get cold easy so eventually always use the blanket.


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## Tom in PA

Never had an HVAC problem on the AutoTrain after Amtrak too over. Prior to that, the heritage sleepers were not dependable; always too hot or too cold.


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## jiml

Tom in PA said:


> Never had an HVAC problem on the AutoTrain after Amtrak too over. Prior to that, the heritage sleepers were not dependable; always too hot or too cold.


This was certainly the experience in Amtrak's inherited 10-6's as well.


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## RichieRich

Tom in PA said:


> Never had an HVAC problem on the AutoTrain after Amtrak too over. Prior to that, the heritage sleepers were not dependable; always too hot or too cold.


With the regularity I take the AT (literally 10 r/t's last year) I find the ceiling vent on/off to work maybe 1-out-of-10 times. It blows hard & cold. I have always taken pizza box tops & duct tape to seal it shut!


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## railiner

Tom in PA said:


> Never had an HVAC problem on the AutoTrain after Amtrak too over. Prior to that, the heritage sleepers were not dependable; always too hot or too cold.





jiml said:


> This was certainly the experience in Amtrak's inherited 10-6's as well.


As bad as it is now, it is still much better than it was in the late '70's, just prior to the HEP conversion and introduction of the then new, Superliner's...
I recall 14 car SFZ's arriving in Denver from Oakland, with half the car's having A/C malfunction's. The BN mechanical forces descended on the train, and made a heroic effort to get them working, but some of them were beyond help. Our harried station supervisor, Art Weber at the time, had his hands full, trying to reaccommodate as many passenger's into good cars as possible. For the times it wasn't....he chartered buses to carry the shorter distance traveler's, or bought them airline tickets for the longer distance traveler's. For those who wanted to try the next day's train, he put them in hotel's. Amtrak spent a fortune on this during that era. In the winter, it wasn't nearly as bad, but sometimes there were several frozen cars, hence more reaccommodating.

When the Superliner's came, it was a blessing, for sure.


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## SarahZ

RichieRich said:


> I have always taken pizza box tops & duct tape to seal it shut!


Please use gaffers tape instead of duct tape. Duct tape leaves sticky residue that collects lint and dust.

Frequent rail travelers tend to mention duct tape and then complain about rooms looking "grimy" near the vents.


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## RichieRich

SarahZ said:


> Please use gaffers tape instead of duct tape. Duct tape leaves sticky residue that collects lint and dust.


Not my first train ride. I also take rubber door stops and WD-40 which is excellent for that residue if needed. I wish they'd clean like I do. Try wearing white socks in the room...look at them later!!! I wouldn't step on the carpet without shoes on. The tight confines on trains make for a great human petre dish. I think the HVAC just circulates your next door infections into your room. Haven't been back on the AT since the COVID hit!


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## joelkfla

SarahZ said:


> Please use gaffers tape instead of duct tape. Duct tape leaves sticky residue that collects lint and dust.
> 
> Frequent rail travelers tend to mention duct tape and then complain about rooms looking "grimy" near the vents.


Thanks for the tip. Never heard of it before.


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## Sauve850

RichieRich said:


> Not my first train ride. I also take rubber door stops and WD-40 which is excellent for that residue if needed. I wish they'd clean like I do. Try wearing white socks in the room...look at them later!!! I wouldn't step on the carpet without shoes on. The tight confines on trains make for a great human petre dish. I think the HVAC just circulates your next door infections into your room. Haven't been back on the AT since the COVID hit!



I have carried a pizza box and other recommendations of yours for a long time. I feel like a hardware store when i board but it has served me well. Thanks for tips over the years.


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## SarahZ

RichieRich said:


> Not my first train ride.


We're all aware of that.

My tip was more for those who don't realize the duct tape will leave residue, but you, too, could switch to gaffers tape and avoid the need for packing more stuff and having to clean up at the end of the trip.


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## jiml

joelkfla said:


> Thanks for the tip. Never heard of it before.


Really good advice from @SarahZ. As a "tech" person I've used it all my life - you can even stick cables to carpet with it and pull it up without residue. The problem is that it costs 4x more than duct tape and you really need to go to a specialty store to buy it. A large quantity of what's sold as gaff tape on Amazon and others is often a cheap knock-off or just duct tape.


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## Barb Stout

SarahZ said:


> Please use gaffers tape instead of duct tape. Duct tape leaves sticky residue that collects lint and dust.
> 
> Frequent rail travelers tend to mention duct tape and then complain about rooms looking "grimy" near the vents.


I haven't heard of gaffers tape until this forum. How would painter's tape or electrical tape do in this regard? I have painter's, electrical, and duct tape, but no gaffer tape.


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## Qapla

Painters tape is not designed to stick to things like carpet and cloth or non-smooth surfaces
Electric tape is not designed to hold weight not does it stick to cardboard very well
Duct tape, while it will stick to most surfaces and hold weight - it leaves a sticky residue behind

Gaffer Tape is designed to stick to most surfaces and has a release glue so it does not leave a residue behind


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## Charles785

Can what's called Gaffer tape be found at typical hardware stores. Or are there some specialty online sources? And to prevent buying cheap knock-offs are there some recommended brands?


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## PVD

Any store that sells industrial packaging hdw (u-line or grainger type) amazon, large photo/video store (BH photo, Adorama) Home Depot... I used to get it at BH because I worked a few blocks away and walked over lunchtime. Last few times, I asked crew members working TV or movie shoots in my neighborhood if they had any "short rolls" they could spare.


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## PaulM

I sometimes think that the problem with the heater dial is the lack of feedback. You turn it and don't hear anything and don't notice an immediate change. But it seems to eventually change the temperature.

If I wake up and it's too hot and lower the temperature. nothing seems to happen. So I turn it even colder. Later on I wake up and it's too cold.


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## 41bridge

SarahZ said:


> We're all aware of that.
> 
> My tip was more for those who don't realize the duct tape will leave residue, but you, too, could switch to gaffers tape and avoid the need for packing more stuff and having to clean up at the end of the trip.


Gaffer’s tape is hard to find and much more expensive. The point is that if Amtrak did it’s job, no tape would be necessary and HVAC would provide a consistent and temperate atmosphere, especially considering the prices they charge for a room with glorified TV dinners.


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## PVD

It is more expensive, but I would disagree that it is hard to find. Aside from camera and video specialty places, Home Depot and Ace Hardware carry it.


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## SarahZ

41bridge said:


> Gaffer’s tape is hard to find and much more expensive.


I can easily find it on Amazon, not to mention in many home improvement stores.

Also, I can get a roll for $4-6. It's hardly more expensive than duct tape.


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## 20th Century Rider

Bob said:


> We are taking AMTRAk from Seattle to Chicago and then on to NYC. We have a bedroom on both trains. Here is the question? I have a health issue with heat. Above about 78F I can feel unwell and above 85F I can get really sick. How reliable are the AC units on these cars. Forecasts show in the highs in the high 80's for most of the trip. Thanks.


Overheating can be a real problem... I've taken the H room on the lower level several times and have recorded temperatures as high as 86 F. Sometimes you can get the conductor or the attendant to have the system do a reset.

Regardless, heating and cooling on the superliners is extremely problematic and can not be controlled from inside the room. Important to note that heating and cooling can be controlled from your room in the single level trains in the east.


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## Devil's Advocate

RichieRich said:


> I also take rubber door stops and WD-40 which is excellent for that residue if needed.


Unfortunately WD-40 replaces a sticky residue with an oily residue.



Barb Stout said:


> How would painter's tape or electrical tape do in this regard? I have painter's, electrical, and duct tape, but no gaffer tape.


Painter's tape works similarly to gaffer's tape in my experience. Electrical tape is probably the worst formulation for leaving residue.



41bridge said:


> Gaffer’s tape is hard to find and much more expensive.


If you can find an Amtrak station and afford a sleeper ticket you should be able to find and afford a role of gaffer's tape. One roll should be enough to last _several years_ of train rides.


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## RichieRich

Devil's Advocate said:


> Unfortunately WD-40 replaces a sticky residue with an oily residue


I discovered this new thing called "paper towels" that seems to clean that up just fine!


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## SarahZ

So duct tape, paper towels, a rubber stopper, and WD-40, but one small roll of gaffers tape would take up too much extra space.

Got it.


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## RichieRich

It's reliably too cold and you can't turn it off.


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## pennyk

MODERATOR NOTE: Please try to keep comments on the topic of air conditioning in bedroom cars. Thank you.


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## jimmrl

Here is the REAL answer to the original question.

1. The thermostat, if working, does not do much either way USUALLY. Once in a while you will get a room that works better than normal.
2. The BIG ONE, if you are normally hot, you will roast on Amtrak, if you are normally cold, you will freeze. They try to keep the temperature somewhere in the middle.

Any other questions?

Jim


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## Georgie

My question is, why are they allowing ill-functioning HVAC carriages to be in service? Do they really need a legal case related to illness from heat exhaustion.


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## MilwaukeeRoadLover

We took the EB Sep 15 CHI to WFH, fmreturn Sep 21. We tried playing with the Cool-Normal-Warm control and the ceiling vent slider control. Although it was uncomfortable at times, I just noticed it on occassion: sleeping was one.

Just for comparison, I'd say the same challenge exists as a passenger for 30 hrs straight in a car where you can't open the window.


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## MARC Rider

I've never had problems with the A/C in the sleeper rooms. Once I had problems with heat in a roomette until I figured out where the control was.


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## Siegmund

Georgie said:


> My question is, why are they allowing ill-functioning HVAC carriages to be in service? Do they really need a legal case related to illness from heat exhaustion.



The Superliner HVAC works about as well today as it did 40 years ago when the cars were new. Unless it fails completely in midsummer, no danger of heat exhaustion, just discomfort.

But people's expectations for climate control have risen considerably in that same 40 years. (My family bought its first air-conditioned car in 1985, for instance. Neither the school I went to nor the house I grew up in had AC.)


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## Georgie

Siegmund said:


> But people's expectations for climate control have risen considerably in that same 40 years. (My family bought its first air-conditioned car in 1985, for instance. Neither the school I went to nor the house I grew up in had AC.)



That's a fair reply, and you are correct. However, we must acknowledge that we are progressing through 2020 now; and your family did upgrade your vehicle in 1985, and not to mention that most vehicles today comes with ever evolving climate-control. The issue is, we are not piling onto a rickety Amtrak bus with chickens on our heads to get to the next village; we are paying a substantial amount for a rewarding travel experience. If the growing consumers are wanting quality climate control, wouldn't that be in your company's best interest to provide it?


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## Dakota 400

Traveling in a Roomette on the Auto Train during January, I found my temperature control knob to be more effective than on other Superliner Sleepers that I have had. Trying to change the temperature of the room took a "bit of time"--did not happen instantly. I remember lowering the temperature when I retired for the night and woke up 2-3 hours later and I needed to unpack the blue blanket from its plastic bag.


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## Sauve850

Georgie said:


> That's a fair reply, and you are correct. However, we must acknowledge that we are progressing through 2020 now; and your family did upgrade your vehicle in 1985, and not to mention that most vehicles today comes with ever evolving climate-control. The issue is, we are not piling onto a rickety Amtrak bus with chickens on our heads to get to the next village; we are paying a substantial amount for a rewarding travel experience. If the growing consumers are wanting quality climate control, wouldn't that be in your company's best interest to provide it?


Ive had a few issues over many years as have most travelers, mostly too cold for me and have never had great luck with thermostat. I think we all would like the climate control and other things to be improved. Without money how does Amtrak accomplish this task? No help from Congress.


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## Siegmund

I think we'd find widespread agreement on this forum that Amfleet and Superliners are both old enough to be nearing replacement. (Funny how the 40-year rule that forced the Heritage sleepers out of service in the mid 90s has been repealed now.) Or, failing that, a complete interior redo.

My point was just that the problem was a bit more fundamental than Amtrak allowing poorly maintained cars to remain in service.


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## nferr

Georgie said:


> That's a fair reply, and you are correct. However, we must acknowledge that we are progressing through 2020 now; and your family did upgrade your vehicle in 1985, and not to mention that most vehicles today comes with ever evolving climate-control. The issue is, we are not piling onto a rickety Amtrak bus with chickens on our heads to get to the next village; we are paying a substantial amount for a rewarding travel experience. If the growing consumers are wanting quality climate control, wouldn't that be in your company's best interest to provide it?



The company's flat broke so there is a choice between putting all new air conditioning systems in almost 50 year old cars and maybe cutting a bunch of service to somehow pay for it.


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## Georgie

Well....  if they ran a better show; improved management and marketing; if they were savvy in their relationships with airline partnerships and non-partisan inter-city governances; avoided nepotism & cheap graduates into overall management; avoided the destructive technique of “we need more money, let’s cut staff/customer experience first”; and invested in real-estate... America might have a rail system that rivals Europe, the Pacific, the East & well, pretty much every where else in the world.


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## BoulderCO

Can't recall ever being too warm on Amtrak. Too cold sometimes, however. Especially at this time of the year, getting too hot shouldn't be a concern.


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