# AGR Points vs Rail points



## boxcar479 (Jan 31, 2010)

When I check My AGR acount balance it shows, Point Balance:5010

Rail Points: 0

What is the difference between Points vs Rail Points? I thought once I gained 5000 Points I would gain Select status.Can someone tell me the deifference?


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## BeckysBarn (Jan 31, 2010)

Rail points are for actual train travel. Your total AGR points may or may not include rail points. In your case, the total does not include rail points. Looks like you haven't traveled on a train using your AGR number since January 1, 2010.


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## Ryan (Jan 31, 2010)

Rail points are only earned by actually riding trains at a rate of 2 points per dollars spent.

Rail points are the only points that count towards status - points earned by other means (AGR card, points for shopping, bought points, bonus points (from promotions, status, etc)) aren't good towards select status but can be redeemed for trips.

Edit: Becky also correctly pointed out that your rail points "reset" every January 1st - you only earn status by earning 5,000 rail points in a calendar year.


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## Guest (Jan 31, 2010)

Rail Points = Base points earned by traveling Amtrak. 2pts/$ or 100 pts minimum or 500/750 for Acela city pairs. No S/S+ bonus, no promos.

Points = everything else.


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## DivMiler (Jan 31, 2010)

"Rail Points" are the points you have earned in the current calendar year by actual Amtrak travel (and not including bonus points from promotions). This number is less than or equal to your total point balance. The amount of the "Rail Points" is useful *only* for determining if you have earned Select or Select Plus during the current calendar year.

The Point Balance includes points earned from Amtrak travel, bonus points from promotions, the Amtrak Guest Rewards Shopping Mall, the Amtrak Guest Rewards MasterCard from Chase, and elsewhere.


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## the_traveler (Jan 31, 2010)

As stated, rail points help determine Select or Select+ status by actual rail travel during the calendar year. (That is from January 1 to December 31 only!)

If for instance the only travel you did was on Dec 23, 2009 (when you earned 3,520 rail points) and January 4, 2010 (where you earned 3,293 rail points), you still would not have earned Select status. That is because 3,520 count for 2009 and the other 3,293 count for 2010! So neither 2009 or 2010 would have earned over 5,000 rail points during that calendar year!


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## boxcar479 (Jan 31, 2010)

the_traveler said:


> As stated, rail points help determine Select or Select+ status by actual rail travel during the calendar year. (That is from January 1 to December 31 only!)
> If for instance the only travel you did was on Dec 23, 2009 (when you earned 3,520 rail points) and January 4, 2010 (where you earned 3,293 rail points), you still would not have earned Select status. That is because 3,520 count for 2009 and the other 3,293 count for 2010! So neither 2009 or 2010 would have earned over 5,000 rail points during that calendar year!


So Since I earned 5010 points all in Dec. 2009 I achieved select status  if only just for a short time <_< . I will be getting an earlier start this year and take advantage loopholes  . THANKS GUYS


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## the_traveler (Jan 31, 2010)

boxcar817 said:


> So Since I earned 5010 points all in Dec. 2009 I achieved select status  if only just for a short time <_< . I will be getting an earlier start this year and take advantage loopholes  . THANKS GUYS


Unless *ALL* of your 5,010 points were from *TRAIN TRAVEL ONLY* during 2009, you would not be Select! (*NOT* from signing up for AGR, *NOT* for shopping, *NOT* for bonuses like double points, etc... - only train travel!)


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## AlanB (Jan 31, 2010)

the_traveler said:


> boxcar817 said:
> 
> 
> > So Since I earned 5010 points all in Dec. 2009 I achieved select status  if only just for a short time <_< . I will be getting an earlier start this year and take advantage loopholes  . THANKS GUYS
> ...


If you actually did earn 5010 rail points in Dec, then your Select Status will be valid until February 28, 2011.

But again the key is, were all those points just from riding Amtrak? If any part of that 5010 was a bonus, even the sign up bonus of 500 points, then you did not achieve Select status.


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## Ryan (Jan 31, 2010)

AlanB said:


> the_traveler said:
> 
> 
> > boxcar817 said:
> ...


Er, 28 Feb 2010, right?


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## DivMiler (Jan 31, 2010)

AlanB said:


> If you actually did earn 5010 rail points in Dec, then your Select Status will be valid until February 28, 2011.
> But again the key is, were all those points just from riding Amtrak? If any part of that 5010 was a bonus, even the sign up bonus of 500 points, then you did not achieve Select status.





Ryan said:


> Er, 28 Feb 2010, right?


No, *AlanB* is correct. (Of course!)


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## Guest (Jan 31, 2010)

If I am reading this correctly, rail points expire after a year. So, does that mean this is true?

You buy 10k points in May

You earn 2.5k points from travel in July

You have 12.5k points until Dec 31, after that you only have 10k???????


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## boxcar479 (Jan 31, 2010)

DivMiler said:


> AlanB said:
> 
> 
> > If you actually did earn 5010 rail points in Dec, then your Select Status will be valid until February 28, 2011.
> ...


BUBBLE BURSTERS 

Just means i gotta try harder!!!! But you guys were right about how i earned the points some were sign on bonus some were from the fall promotion.. Now I understand. Once again many thanks


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## Ryan (Jan 31, 2010)

DivMiler said:


> AlanB said:
> 
> 
> > If you actually did earn 5010 rail points in Dec, then your Select Status will be valid until February 28, 2011.
> ...


It would help if I remembered that it was 2010 already! Right theory, wrong application!

Guest, the points don't expire - you'll still have 12.5k, but none of them will count towards status.


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## Rail Freak (Jan 31, 2010)

Guest said:


> If I am reading this correctly, rail points expire after a year. So, does that mean this is true?
> You buy 10k points in May
> 
> You earn 2.5k points from travel in July
> ...


Here I go again, talking before double checking but, I thought you had 3 years to travel????

RF


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## KayBee (Jan 31, 2010)

Rail Freak said:


> Guest said:
> 
> 
> > If I am reading this correctly, rail points expire after a year. So, does that mean this is true?
> ...


No, points dont ever expire if you take a train trip at least once every three years 

At least until you use them! :lol:


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## DivMiler (Jan 31, 2010)

The only reason to be concerned about Rail Points is if you are trying to reach Select or Select Plus. Otherwise, just look at your Point Balance. I'll likely never reach Select or Select Plus, so I don't really look at the amount of Rail Points I have. However, I have over 80,000 points from travel and other sources -- I keep an eye on the Point Balance!

(And make sure you have an Amtrak points-earning trip at least once every three years!)


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## Trogdor (Jan 31, 2010)

The term "rail points" is just a confusing label within AGR that really should be renamed.

Instead (and I did submit this suggestion to them, but they simply responded by explaining to _me_ what I already knew), they should be called "Select Qualification Points." Because that's exactly what they are. They have no bearing on your total point balance, they have no relation to when your points expire, and they do not in any way impact your ability to redeem points for free travel (or any other award).

It is merely a counter for the number of points you've accumulated in the calendar year which can qualify you for Select (or Select-Plus). Hence my suggestion of "Select Qualification Points" (and, to make it even less ambiguous, they should put the year in there as well, so it might be "2010 Select Qualification Points" in the header). If you're familiar with major airline frequent flyer programs, they tend to show a mileage balance, and another row for "elite qualification miles." This would be a similar concept. But, alas, we'll continue to have confusion as they choose to use the ambiguous term "rail points."


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## frugalist (Jan 31, 2010)

DivMiler said:


> (And make sure you have an Amtrak points-earning trip at least once every three years!)


If I last earned rail points on October 13, 2009, does this mean I would need to take another rail points-earning trip by October 13, 2012 to avoid having all my AGR points expire? Or is it based on a full calendar year, giving me until December 31, 2012?

Of course, as we all know, the world will end on the Winter Solstice 2012 when the Mayan calendar ends.  :lol: :lol:


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## the_traveler (Jan 31, 2010)

frugalist said:


> DivMiler said:
> 
> 
> > (And make sure you have an Amtrak points-earning trip at least once every three years!)
> ...


It's 3 years from the date of your last Amtrak travel.

If you took a trip on October 13, 2009 and had 50,247 points at that time, you would have until October 2012 to extent the points. If on June 24, 2012 you have 86,372 points (all the additional from your credit card, shopping, etc...) and tae a train, it would extend *ALL* 86,372 until June 24, 2015! 

And that trip does not have to be a big trip  If there is a $3 one way trip near you, and you can earn AGR points for it, that will reset the clock!


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## DowneasterPassenger (Jan 31, 2010)

Ryan said:


> Rail points are only earned by actually riding trains...


...and Amtrak Thruway buses?


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## the_traveler (Jan 31, 2010)

SanJoaquinRider said:


> Ryan said:
> 
> 
> > Rail points are only earned by actually riding trains...
> ...


I believe so!


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## AlanB (Feb 1, 2010)

the_traveler said:


> SanJoaquinRider said:
> 
> 
> > Ryan said:
> ...


Thruway buses and Thruway trains count towards rail points.


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## transit54 (Feb 1, 2010)

AlanB said:


> Thruway buses and Thruway trains count towards rail points.


What's an example of a Thruway train right now? Something like ACES because Amtrak handles the ticketing?


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## DowneasterPassenger (Feb 1, 2010)

transit54 said:


> AlanB said:
> 
> 
> > Thruway buses and Thruway trains count towards rail points.
> ...


I believe the NJT Atlantic City line is one,


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## AlanB (Feb 1, 2010)

SanJoaquinRider said:


> transit54 said:
> 
> 
> > AlanB said:
> ...


SanJoaquinRider is correct, the NJT Atlantic City line between AC and Philly is indeed an Amtrak Thruway connection. That connection grew largely out of the fact that it was Amtrak that first restored the line to AC for passenger service. When Amtrak gave it up and NJT took it over, it became a Thruway connection.

On the other hand ACES is not a thruway connection. In fact, even though Amtrak handles the ticketing because NJT has no ability to sell first class tickets, it is not a thruway connection. Those tickets don't earn AGR points. There has been some lobbying to get AGR to do that, but so far no luck.

I think that I recall a recent story stating that the train which provided the thruway connection was dropped from the schedule, but at one time there was an Amtrak Thruway rail connection using ACE (Altamonte Commuter Express) in California between San Jose and Stockton. Again, I'm not sure if that connection is gone or if it is still in effect.


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## Long Train Runnin' (Feb 1, 2010)

Isn't the grand canyon railway a thruway connection?


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## AlanB (Feb 2, 2010)

Long Train Runnin said:


> Isn't the grand canyon railway a thruway connection?


Not that I'm aware of.

The shuttle bus to the GC railway is, but again I don't believe that the GC railway is.


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## DowneasterPassenger (Feb 2, 2010)

AlanB said:


> SanJoaquinRider is correct, the NJT Atlantic City line between AC and Philly is indeed an Amtrak Thruway connection. That connection grew largely out of the fact that it was Amtrak that first restored the line to AC for passenger service. When Amtrak gave it up and NJT took it over, it became a Thruway connection.
> On the other hand ACES is not a thruway connection. In fact, even though Amtrak handles the ticketing because NJT has no ability to sell first class tickets, it is not a thruway connection. Those tickets don't earn AGR points. There has been some lobbying to get AGR to do that, but so far no luck.
> 
> I think that I recall a recent story stating that the train which provided the thruway connection was dropped from the schedule, but at one time there was an Amtrak Thruway rail connection using ACE (Altamonte Commuter Express) in California between San Jose and Stockton. Again, I'm not sure if that connection is gone or if it is still in effect.


I am pretty sure ACE (as opposed to ACES) is not currently a Thruway connection, nor is Caltrain. Booking a hypothetical trip from Modesto to San Jose for tomorrow, doesn't turn up any ACE connections. I remember the story about ACE being added as a Thruway a few years ago, but I missed the story about it being dropped.

One problem with ACE is that it only operates M-F, and all our Amtrak service in California is daily, although its early AM train has a decent connection to the SB CS in SJC. I'm not sure whether the lack of daily service had anything to do with it being dropped.

Interestingly, the online Interactive Route Atlas shows Caltrain as a RED line, indicating an actual Amtrak train, and the ACE train is still on there as a GREEN line, indicating Thruway Service.


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## AlanB (Feb 2, 2010)

I believe that the one ACE train that was a Thruway connection was one of the mid-day runs that got dropped when they cut back on service to reduce costs.


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## alanh (Feb 3, 2010)

AlanB said:


> Long Train Runnin said:
> 
> 
> > Isn't the grand canyon railway a thruway connection?
> ...


If you try to book LAX-GCN, it comes up
4 Southwest Chief

LAX-WMJ

6904 Bus

WMJ-WMA

7904 Thruway Train

WMA-GCN

However, the AGR terms say



> Members will not earn or redeem Points for (i) the Canadian portion of joint Amtrak/VIA services, (ii) Amtrak 7000 series Thruway bus services.


Since it's 7904, I assume it doesn't earn points.


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