# Fall Double Points Promotion



## pennyk (Aug 29, 2012)

I just received an email from AGR announcing their Fall double points promotion.


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 29, 2012)

pennyk said:


> I just received an email from AGR announcing their Fall double points promotion.


:hi: Thanks Penny!  I forsee lots of Point Run Reservations being made by AU Members! Book it, Danno!


----------



## Afsheen (Aug 29, 2012)

pennyk said:


> I just received an email from AGR announcing their Fall double points promotion.


And for monthly pass riders, note that the promo starts Wednesday, September 5th, which is only the second normal business day of the month (assuming you have Labor Day off). If you have an alternate means of getting where you need to go on Tuesday the 4th and can wait to buy your pass on the 5th, then you can squeeze three monthly passes during the promo period, since it runs through November 16th.


----------



## Acela150 (Aug 29, 2012)

September 5th... Great day.. My birthday.. Thanks for the Birthday Present Amtrak!  Came just in the knick of time! I'm doing a Bday trip on the 6th.


----------



## amamba (Aug 29, 2012)

Afsheen said:


> pennyk said:
> 
> 
> > I just received an email from AGR announcing their Fall double points promotion.
> ...


Afsheen, it has been my experience with the monthly passes that the date always posts as the first of the month, no matter when the pass was bought.

Are you suggesting the if the pass is bought on the 5th that it will qualify for double points?


----------



## Railroad Bill (Aug 29, 2012)

Thanks Penny

We are leaving on the 5th on the Cap Ltd & CZ for our Yellowstone trip.

Great Timing on Amtrak's part...smile


----------



## Afsheen (Aug 29, 2012)

amamba said:


> Afsheen said:
> 
> 
> > pennyk said:
> ...


Oh, you know what, I hadn't ever checked, but you're right - all my monthly pass points post dated on 1st of the month. I'll try buying mine on the 5th this time around and see if it gets double points.


----------



## winterskigirl (Aug 29, 2012)

Excellent ! Joined AGR in May & love the points I'm already adding up over my summer travel. I got the email too


----------



## Railroad Bill (Aug 29, 2012)

Just as a clarification of the rules for this promotion. You may take only two 1-way trips each day to gain the double points.

Therefore; if we ride from CLE to CHI for one trip and ride the Hiawatha up to Glenview for another trip, we could not count the return trip from Glenview to Chicago for double points. :unsure:

I know the group has discussed this issue several times before when it comes up, but would like to hear it again-- I am old and my mind is not as sharp as it was yesterday :giggle: :giggle:


----------



## fairviewroad (Aug 29, 2012)

Railroad Bill said:


> Just as a clarification of the rules for this promotion. You may take only two 1-way trips each day to gain the double points.
> 
> Therefore; if we ride from CLE to CHI for one trip and ride the Hiawatha up to Glenview for another trip, we could not count the return trip from Glenview to Chicago for double points. :unsure:
> 
> I know the group has discussed this issue several times before when it comes up, but would like to hear it again-- I am old and my mind is not as sharp as it was yesterday :giggle: :giggle:


You are correct, and it's important to point this out since the Email I received from Amtrak has this subject line:

*Double points on all Amtrak travel this autumn*

Granted, you can't expect them to cram all the fine print into the subject line of the email, but it's simply incorrect to say "All Amtrak Travel."

Edit to add: Actually, I see that it's not just the subject line of the email. The promotional material is full of references to "All Amtrak Travel."

Kind of misleading.


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Aug 29, 2012)

I agree it is misleading.

I can hear the lawyers now... "Well it is on all Amtrak travel... as long as you only take two one-way trips a day..." :wacko:

It reminds me of when I was growing up, and my parents who would say: "Do what you want." *But,* the unspoken part was: "As long as we would approve." :huh:


----------



## Anthony (Aug 29, 2012)

It says that terms and conditions may apply.


----------



## Acela150 (Aug 29, 2012)

Kinda ruins the deal though. I always would do four one ways. To max out that Double Points. I guess they figured out a lot of people do that.


----------



## Bob Dylan (Aug 29, 2012)

As they say in the NFL, "Upon further review", looking @ the Fine Print that limits Double Points to Two One Way or One Roundtrip a day sort of puts a damper on the old Promos that allowed up to Four trips a day! In the case of the Gathering, if we ride Amtrak from PHL-WIL, and upon returning to PHL via Septa want to take a turn on the Keystone only one of the Legs will count for Double Points! Same thing on the Return Home on the Penn and Cap Ltd. from PHL on Monday,, a morning Point Run on the Keystone Wouldn't Work because of the Two Legs getting Double Points later in the day! Bummer!


----------



## Devil's Advocate (Aug 29, 2012)

Add me to the list of folks who don't think this promotion is worth the effort at this point.


----------



## Anthony (Aug 29, 2012)

The promo is well worth signing up for if you are traveling like a normal person, and not a railfan...


----------



## the_traveler (Aug 29, 2012)

I didn't get the email (for some reason), so thanks for letting me know about it!



And if someone did not notice, you need to *register* for the double points!





And yes, I wish it were like prior years that allowed 4 one way trips per day. If I make a day trip to (say) ALB, I have to take 2 trains each way. However, on the return, I'd only earn 1x points?



I don't like that!


----------



## Railroad Bill (Aug 29, 2012)

But as my old daddy used to say. "Don't look a gift horse in the mouth" :giggle:


----------



## pennyk (Aug 29, 2012)

the_traveler said:


> I didn't get the email (for some reason), so thanks for letting me know about it!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Dave, I guess you are not "normal" according to Anthony's definition - and I am. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

and.... if you believe that I am normal, I have a bridge to sell you. :giggle:


----------



## the_traveler (Aug 29, 2012)

Sorry already bought it - 37 times! I'm a slow learner.



But I did sell it 26 times - and made a profit!


----------



## AmtrakBlue (Aug 30, 2012)

I didn't get an email either, but did register after seeing Penny's post. Thanks Penny for alerting us un-normal people. 

Hmm, maybe we're paranormal. h34r:


----------



## Devil's Advocate (Aug 30, 2012)

Anthony said:


> The promo is well worth signing up for if you are traveling like a normal person, and not a railfan...


Is it worth signing up for? Sure, we're talking maybe five minutes of work at most. Is it worth scheduling a brand new trip just to take advantage of the promotion? Not even close.


----------



## the_traveler (Aug 30, 2012)

Texas Sunset said:


> 1346352468[/url]' post='390688']
> 
> 
> Anthony said:
> ...


Five minutes?

















Pull up your AGR account, and click to register! That takes five minutes?





Are you going to the Gathering?



There may be some train riding there, and it's in the time period!


----------



## Devil's Advocate (Aug 31, 2012)

the_traveler said:


> Five minutes?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


If my computer is off then yes it can take up to five minutes for it to start up and reach the website. I don't generally leave everything running all the time so it's not uncommon for me to turn my computer on before making use of it. Oddly enough my Windows 7 computers tend to get going a lot quicker than my Macbook Pro. Not sure why that is.



the_traveler said:


> Are you going to the Gathering?
> 
> 
> 
> There may be some train riding there, and it's in the time period!


I'm currently scheduled to be in Asia during those dates so I won't be able to attend the Gathering this year. -_-


----------



## Afsheen (Aug 31, 2012)

Texas Sunset said:


> Anthony said:
> 
> 
> > The promo is well worth signing up for if you are traveling like a normal person, and not a railfan...
> ...


Doesn't that apply to EVERY points promotion, though? Any "typical" trip where you're earning 2 points/dollar, plus a double points promo, plus buying with an AGR credit card, plus getting an S+ 50% bonus (so having the stars align to earn a total of 7 points / dollar), is still 14 cents/point, which is nearly 7x the price of just buying points outright.

Even in _most_ extreme edge cases, travelling solely for the points doesn't really make economic sense. Looking at an extreme (and very cushy) example that comes in with a very, very low CPM: a low-bucket Acela ticket from BOS to WAS (which is $163, I believe) booked as a two-segment through fare to yield two select city pair trips (BOS-NYP, NYP-WAS) and upgraded to first for free the whole way through with one coupon still yields around 3.99 cents/point for 4076 points (1500 + 1500 2x bonus + 750 S+ bonus + 326 if bought with an AGR card), which is still more expensive than sitting at home and buying points for 2.75 cents/point, although you still get a lot of bang for your buck and it's a nice trip all the way in first.

I can, however, think of one example where taking the train yields better CPM than an outright points purchase: a $8 $6.5 PHL-PAO trip, booked as a two-segment through fare (PHL-ARD, ARD-PAO) yields 266 points 513 points (200 points at 100 minimum per segment, plus 200 bonus, plus 100 S+ bonus, plus 13 for buying on an AGR card) for a $8 $6.50 outlay, which is a great deal, coming in at a low, low 1.26 cents/point. It's not nearly as nice as the Acela ride in first, but it's a substantial savings over buying points.

My previous conclusion, when my math was off on the PHL-ARD-PAO journey, was that it's never economically justifiable to ride purely for points, but in this case, as long as you're not assigning any monetary value to your time, then sure, this ride is worth it purely for the points. There are probably some other trips like that out there, too, but I still think my earlier point makes sense: ride the train if you love riding the train or if it's your most economical option to get from one place to another or if it's the easiest way to get from one place to another or whatever other reason you have, and if you're already going to be on the train, though, these bonuses are exactly that - a nice bonus for doing something you were already planning to do. I just don't value the points highly enough, though, to go seek out train travel purely for more points.


----------



## Acela150 (Aug 31, 2012)

Afsheen said:


> Texas Sunset said:
> 
> 
> > Anthony said:
> ...


For the record unless your booking last minute Keystone Tickets are usually $6.50 between PHL-ARD/PAO. I've paid $8 for a Keystone Ticket between PHL-PAO twice that I can remember. Once because I booked 30 minutes before departure. The other time I have no idea. It was two days before departure..


----------



## PRR 60 (Aug 31, 2012)

Acela150 said:


> For the record unless your booking last minute Keystone Tickets are usually $6.50 between PHL-ARD/PAO. I've paid $8 for a Keystone Ticket between PHL-PAO twice that I can remember. Once because I booked 30 minutes before departure. The other time I have no idea. It was two days before departure..


The fare difference on the Keystone Service is not based on time of booking. It is based on day of travel. Keystone fares are higher for Friday and Sunday travel (most of the day). Your $8 fare was for Friday or Sunday travel. $6.50 is the fare the rest of the week, and it can be purchased right up to train time.


----------



## fairviewroad (Aug 31, 2012)

Afsheen said:


> Doesn't that apply to EVERY points promotion, though? Any "typical" trip where you're earning 2 points/dollar, plus a double points promo, plus buying with an AGR credit card, plus getting an S+ 50% bonus (so having the stars align to earn a total of 7 points / dollar), is still 14 cents/point, which is nearly 7x the price of just buying points outright.
> 
> Even in extreme edge cases, travelling solely for the points doesn't really make economic sense. Looking at a couple of extreme examples that come in with a very, very low CPM:
> 
> ...


Your analysis is good, but keep in mind there is a cap to the number of points you can buy in a calendar year.


----------



## fairviewroad (Aug 31, 2012)

Anthony said:


> The promo is well worth signing up for if you are traveling like a normal person, and not a railfan...


True, I'd guess that the majority of "normal" Amtrak travelers won't exceed two trips per day. But it's not unheard of. If someone is making a

same-day round trip from a station on the NEC to a station on the Empire Service line, they'd have 4 individual tickets but only two of them

would qualify for double points.

Likewise a "normal" traveler could easily take two round-trips in a day on high-frequency, low fare corridors like the Keystones or the Capitol

corridor. For this promotion only the first round-trip would qualify. Not the end of the world, of course. But if someone casually reads the

promotional material which repeatedly refers to "ALL Amtrak travel" you would certainly be in for a surprise (assuming "normal" people even

pay attention to their AGR statements).


----------



## Afsheen (Aug 31, 2012)

PRR 60 said:


> Acela150 said:
> 
> 
> > For the record unless your booking last minute Keystone Tickets are usually $6.50 between PHL-ARD/PAO. I've paid $8 for a Keystone Ticket between PHL-PAO twice that I can remember. Once because I booked 30 minutes before departure. The other time I have no idea. It was two days before departure..
> ...


Thanks for the correction, gents - I went back and edited my post.


----------



## PRR 60 (Aug 31, 2012)

fairviewroad said:


> Anthony said:
> 
> 
> > The promo is well worth signing up for if you are traveling like a normal person, and not a railfan...
> ...


One situation where four segments a day is not unusual is travel to and from San Francisco. A simple round trip includes two train trips and two bus rides.


----------



## Acela150 (Aug 31, 2012)

PRR 60 said:


> Acela150 said:
> 
> 
> > For the record unless your booking last minute Keystone Tickets are usually $6.50 between PHL-ARD/PAO. I've paid $8 for a Keystone Ticket between PHL-PAO twice that I can remember. Once because I booked 30 minutes before departure. The other time I have no idea. It was two days before departure..
> ...


I know and that's what I fully don't understand.. It charged me $8 two days before travel.. It was a Tuesday or Thursday. I'll have to go back and look at my ticket stubs to be sure.


----------



## winterskigirl (Sep 15, 2012)

Will I qualify for double points for a one day round trip ticket?

Double point promotion says :

Limit of two qualifying one-way trips per day. Amtrak Guest Rewards points will not be awarded for canceled or refunded reservations or tickets. Other terms and conditions may apply.


----------



## PRR 60 (Sep 15, 2012)

winterskigirl said:


> Will I qualify for double points for a one day round trip ticket?
> 
> Double point promotion says :
> 
> Limit of two qualifying one-way trips per day. Amtrak Guest Rewards points will not be awarded for canceled or refunded reservations or tickets. Other terms and conditions may apply.


Yes, you will get double points for both segments of your round trip. A round trip counts as two one-ways and meets the promotion criteria.


----------



## Railroad Bill (Sep 24, 2012)

Just checked my AGR account and there is a credit for the trip we took two weeks ago CLE-TOL for 100 points but no double points bonus award. We left on September 5 at 3am so it should fall within the rules of the double points offer. 

I guess it is time to call AGR again and see if I can get them to pay up


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Sep 24, 2012)

Railroad Bill said:


> Just checked my AGR account and there is a credit for the trip we took two weeks ago CLE-TOL for 100 points but no double points bonus award. We left on September 5 at 3am so it should fall within the rules of the double points offer.
> 
> I guess it is time to call AGR again and see if I can get them to pay up


You did register for the promo? If not, my understanding is that if you register now, it will be retroactive.


----------



## Railroad Bill (Sep 24, 2012)

The Davy Crockett said:


> Railroad Bill said:
> 
> 
> > Just checked my AGR account and there is a credit for the trip we took two weeks ago CLE-TOL for 100 points but no double points bonus award. We left on September 5 at 3am so it should fall within the rules of the double points offer.
> ...


Yes, both wife and I registered. We both received the 100 base points but neither have received the double points.


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Sep 24, 2012)

Railroad Bill said:


> The Davy Crockett said:
> 
> 
> > Railroad Bill said:
> ...


Hmmm... Gotta keep an eye :blink: on those AGR folks!

And may Amtrak never borrow the insurance industry's belief that every day you can delay is money in the bank. hboy:


----------



## pennyk (Sep 24, 2012)

Railroad Bill said:


> Just checked my AGR account and there is a credit for the trip we took two weeks ago CLE-TOL for 100 points but no double points bonus award. We left on September 5 at 3am so it should fall within the rules of the double points offer.
> 
> I guess it is time to call AGR again and see if I can get them to pay up


Bill, if the train originated on 9/4, before the promo started, the system might treat it as a trip prior to the promotion. My guess is that you need to contact an agent. That has happened to me when riding the Silver Meteor southbound (since it originated the previous day in NYP).


----------



## AlanB (Sep 24, 2012)

pennyk said:


> Railroad Bill said:
> 
> 
> > Just checked my AGR account and there is a credit for the trip we took two weeks ago CLE-TOL for 100 points but no double points bonus award. We left on September 5 at 3am so it should fall within the rules of the double points offer.
> ...


I agree with Penny, Bill, your problem is that any train that you would have caught going CLE-TOL originated in NY on the 4th. The system would have seen your trip as taking place on the 4th, even though you didn't board until the 5th. All tickets for that train are processed in one batch, or at least they used to be pre-eTicketing. I'm not sure, but I don't believe that has changed. I think it's still batched together.

So you will almost certainly have to call to get the double points.


----------



## Railroad Bill (Sep 24, 2012)

AlanB said:


> pennyk said:
> 
> 
> > Railroad Bill said:
> ...


Yes, I remember reading about this happening on other double points trips now that you mention it 

Oh, well it was still a nice ride, even at 3am in the morning 

Since the rest of our trip was on AGR to SLC and back, I guess we received a free ride on Amtrak's dime anyway. :giggle:

Thanks for the information. See you all in 11 days.


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Oct 31, 2012)

Now that we are nearing the end of Fall Double Points, I have a question that is the inverse of Bill's. The promotion ends on November 16th. What if one were to start travel on the 16th, but finished on the 17th? Would they get double points?


----------



## Exiled in Express (Oct 31, 2012)

The Davy Crockett said:


> Now that we are nearing the end of Fall Double Points, I have a question that is the inverse of Bill's. The promotion ends on November 16th. What if one were to start travel on the 16th, but finished on the 17th? Would they get double points?


Tickets are lifted at time of boarding so any train scheduled to be boarded on the 16th will not be a problem. If you are questioning boarding an eastbound long distance train that originated on 10/16 the following day I think you would still get double points per the batching rule but I would not fight for them if they do not post.


----------



## The Davy Crockett (Oct 31, 2012)

Exiled in Express said:


> The Davy Crockett said:
> 
> 
> > Now that we are nearing the end of Fall Double Points, I have a question that is the inverse of Bill's. The promotion ends on November 16th. What if one were to start travel on the 16th, but finished on the 17th? Would they get double points?
> ...


Explained THAT way... :unsure:

makes complete sense! ^_^

Thanks! :hi:


----------



## Anthony (Oct 31, 2012)

It should all be based on the departure date printed on your ticket.


----------



## Acela150 (Nov 2, 2012)

I don't know if I got lucky or if AGR messed up and it's the kinda thing I'll take. I did a double points run on the 25th of October. AGR posted double points on all four segments between PHL-PAO. IIRC it was only going to be one round trip or two one ways would earn the Double. I guess it was my lucky day.


----------



## Anderson (Nov 2, 2012)

This is one of the few times I get the feeling I've done well with a promotion (a lot of them just end up with unintentionally lousy timing or offer me low-class tickets I can't upgrade, such as NER Coach...granted, I'll take a free ride on a train, but I'm almost always inclined to spring for BC at least). Right now, I'm at 2534 points off of the promotion, and I'm waiting on 582 more that ought to be coming in (total: 3116). Ideally, I'll jam an Acela run in before the end of the period as well, which should put me up another 1500 or so (as well as cleaning up any "loose change" needed for S+ for next year once I factor in my Christmas trip out to Iowa).


----------



## the_traveler (Nov 2, 2012)

Remember that the double point bonus does not count towards status. Only the base points do! :excl:


----------



## Anderson (Nov 2, 2012)

Oh, I know. The points I'm waiting on are for a NB sleeper trip from FL (I'm just under 7000 TQPs for the year at the moment). The trip was $291, so it should give me 582 TQPs, 582 Double Days bonus points, 291 points for S+, 291 points for being an Amtrak purchase on the card, 291 points for being a generic purchase on the card, and about 145 points into my AGR for Business account. All in all, somewhere around 30% of the cost of the trip _should_ be coming back in the door to me.


----------

