# Rubber-tired metro



## DET63 (Sep 28, 2009)

A few cities around the world, including Montreal and Mexico City in North America, use rubber-tired subway or metro systems. Although these are trains (in some cases, completely automated and driverless), they run on tires rather than steel wheels. They are thought to have an advantage in certain circumstances, such as creating less noise on aerial structures and being capable of ascending or descending steep grades without a rack. On the other hand, they create more noise in tunnels, and have initial construction cost and maintenance (e.g., tire-replacement) issues that make them less attractive than they might appear to be at first.

Does anyone here have any experience with them, either as passengers, designers or operators?


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## p&sr (Sep 28, 2009)

DET63 said:


> A few cities around the world, including Montreal and Mexico City in North America, use rubber-tired subway or metro systems. Does anyone here have any experience with them, either as passengers, designers or operators?


Sure. They work great in Paris, and they've been there for quite a long time.


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## DowneasterPassenger (Sep 28, 2009)

Isn't the rubber tire dust supposed to be a health hazard in tunnels?

I rode one once in Sapporo, Japan.


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## transit54 (Sep 28, 2009)

I've ridden them in both Montreal and Paris. They are also very popular for use in airport transit systems. I've seen them in a number of airports...Orlando, Pittsburgh and Zurich come to mind right off the top of my head, but that's very far from a comprehensive list.

They seemed to be a bit louder, though at times they offered a slightly smoother than a rail based system. I'd be interested in knowing how much more energy they consume versus steel wheels on rails, which provides much less rolling resistance.


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## Neil_M (Sep 28, 2009)

p&sr said:


> DET63 said:
> 
> 
> > A few cities around the world, including Montreal and Mexico City in North America, use rubber-tired subway or metro systems. Does anyone here have any experience with them, either as passengers, designers or operators?
> ...


The Paris ones have had some problems with tyre wear. I have quite a good book on the Paris Metro at home, when I get back there sometime next week I will have a look and see what it says.

They do ride well though....Feels like you are floating on the rails!


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## Bob Dylan (Sep 28, 2009)

Ive ridden them in Montreal and Mexico City, thought the ride was smooth compared to most subways, but of course I mostly rode in NY and WAS so perhaps that is not a fair comparison? :lol: As others have said, the Paris one is pretty nice too! Ive never been on the LAX ones, do any of them have this feature?


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## AlanB (Sep 28, 2009)

jimhudson said:


> Ive never been on the LAX ones, do any of them have this feature?


No, LAX's subways are steel wheel.


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## jis (Sep 29, 2009)

In Paris while many Metro lines are rubber tired, there are several that are traight steel wheel on steel rail too. Also, even the rubber tired vehicles do have flanged steel wheels and steel wails which are not used under normal circumstances. As I recall, one of the big initial porblems was the heat generated by the friction between rubber tires and the wood rails that they used to run on, leaving a constant smell of burning wood in the tunnel. That was somehow fixed as time went on.


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## George Harris (Sep 29, 2009)

Rubber tire systems are not quieter than properly maintained steel wheel on steel rail using CWR. I emphasize properly maintained because BART for example has a lot of area with rail corrugations that are very noisey.

Rubber tire systems have a greater rolling resistance than steel wheel on steel rail, and as a consequence have a higher energy consumption per unit of weight hauled, and produce more heat. The heat issue has been a problem in Mexico City. It is not in Paris because the lower ground temperature provides a better "heat sink". Also, Mexico City's system has a much higher ridership so there is more heat being produced.

My understanding is that tiire pressure is 100 psi plus, but still 100,000 miles is about it for tire life.

Airport people movers is about as much as these are good for, and I am not even sure they are really the best answer there.


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