# Scanners, Radio and other such tech inquiries



## Irelandvegas65 (May 6, 2021)

I have been watching videos for my October 2021 Empire to Coast Starlight to Zephyr journey. One piece of tech I have seen are Scanners, tuned to Amtrak frequencies. It looks like a fun, and useful item, but a few minutes on Amazon show a great cost for a none regular Amtrak passenger. Can these be rented and programmed without buying one? 

I also have an older stand along Garmin and wondered it it might be something to bring along, or will the iPhone do enough for tracking progress? I realize Data will be mostly none existent for big distances on the routes. 

Thanks, I appreciate your responses and collected wisdom!


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## mcropod (May 6, 2021)

I brought along a scanner for my trips and had a bit of fun with it. I likely didn't get the value from it that a true Amtrakphile would have because I wasn't up with all the details of the various tracks I was on. However, I did still enjoy hearing the axle-count at all the monitoring places I passed, and knowing that none had dropped off since the last report.

My scanner was bought before I left Oz and I had no probs loading the frequency-ranges I found out would apply.

I did bring along a suitably-USA/Canada maploaded Garmin GPS which was very useful throughout. I got great value from that helping me work out exactly where I was, and at what speed I was travelling, which perfectly suited my fact-based personality  It also let me operate in kilometres and kph rather than having to try to make sense of the bushels, or farenheit, or ounces, or whatever it is that you lot use to measure distance and speed.

I'll be taking that GPS with me as I take to the trains on Far North Queensland in a couple of days. I'll ditch the foreign maps chip and have it on home territory. I'll likely not take the scanner, at least in part because I'll be hearing the exchanges of the driver and crew direct in the rail-car.


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## PVD (May 6, 2021)

Obviously, the lack of a signal makes the internet radio option less than perfect, although in some areas of the country (like the NE) it isn't bad. If you aren't using it outside of an occasional trip, I guess it could be more than some would spend, but some folks use them for other scanning/listening in their "home areas" If the services in your area haven't gone digital, a decent handheld scanner is not terribly expensive, and many people like to listen on a train an earpiece/headset is proper behavior, unless in a private room. There are great online listings of the frequencies for specific routes, and a usb cable to a pc is all you need to program in whatever suits your trips


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## Eric in East County (May 7, 2021)

Like most North American railroads, *AMTRAK* still uses *VHF* for its radio communications. To be able to listen in on these transmissions, all that is needed is a handheld *VHF *scanner small enough to pack along in a carry-on bag. Assuming you don’t already have a suitable handheld scanner, acquiring one shouldn’t be too difficult or expensive. Models that sold for hundreds of dollars a few years ago can now be picked up quite reasonably on the used equipment market. (I use a little *Uniden SC230* scanner that I bought on *eBay* for only a few dollars.) 

Here are a few features to look for when shopping for a radio that will scan railroad frequencies:

The capacity to receive frequencies of from 160.215 to 161.565 MHz. (This is where most railroads operate their main voice communications networks.)

The _optional_ capacity to receive the 450 to 470 MHz UHF band. (*AMTRAK*’s On-Board Service personnel sometimes use these frequencies to facilitate family and group activities.)

A sufficient number of programmable channels for storing all of the frequencies you plan to listen to. (Believe it or not, 20 channels will usually be sufficient!)

The capacity to lock out certain channels so that they won’t be scanned.

A “close call” feature that allows searching for nearby active frequencies.

A “hold” feature that stops the radio from scanning and pauses it on a particular frequency.

An external earphone jack. (Wearing earphones is a “must” if you plan use your scanner in an open coach or other public spaces.)

Some might also want to add battery-charging capabilities to this list. I use disposable batteries but make it a point to pack along my scanner’s AC adapter. Most *AMTRAK* passenger cars now offer conveniently located AC power outlets for those passengers who want to use their laptop computers and other electronic devices at their seats. Taking advantage of this amenity can greatly prolong battery life. 

The* AMTRAK* *Radio Frequencies* page of the *On Track On Line* website: On Track On Line - Amtrak Radio Frequencies has most of the frequencies used by various *AMTRAK* trains such as the “Southwest Chief,” the “Capitol Limited,” and the “Texas Eagle.” These frequencies should be reasonably current since they are updated on a regular basis using information provided by rail fans.


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## Devil's Advocate (May 7, 2021)

Irelandvegas65 said:


> I have been watching videos for my October 2021 Empire to Coast Starlight to Zephyr journey. One piece of tech I have seen are Scanners, tuned to Amtrak frequencies. It looks like a fun, and useful item, but a few minutes on Amazon show a great cost for a none regular Amtrak passenger. Can these be rented and programmed without buying one? I also have an older stand along Garmin and wondered it it might be something to bring along, or will the iPhone do enough for tracking progress? I realize Data will be mostly none existent for big distances on the routes. Thanks, I appreciate your responses and collected wisdom!


These days handheld radio scanners are a niche product for a shrinking audience. A scanner tuned to rail broadcasts mainly receives automated readouts and some brief industry jargon around longer stops. The only time it gets really interesting is when something important goes wrong or there is a major disruption on the line. Scanners are great for spotting from a car but one or two rides on Amtrak is unlikely to feel like a good value for the money and effort spent. Most of the time scanners resemble a noisy electronic brick that needs to be carried with you in the hope that something interesting happens. A set of travel size binoculars is likely to be cheaper and more interesting.


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## zephyr17 (May 7, 2021)

I love my scanner and take it on every trip. You hear chatter between the engineer and conductor, the crew and dispatcher (relatively little in CTC territory, though). The trackside detectors sounding off.

You often get to find out what the crew isn't telling anyone (the reason the train went into emergency braking was because the duct tape fell off the brake line. True story).

With that said, it is probably a lot more interesting to a dedicated railfan. Choose whether you want one based on your knowledge of, and interest in, railroad operations.


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## Eric in East County (May 7, 2021)

Some of the most commonly encountered railroad transmissions are those from *Radio* *Alarm Detectors* or *RAD*s. Sometimes referred to as “talking detectors” or “draggers,” these trackside devices check for broken wheels, broken axes, overheated wheel bearings and journal boxes (referred to as “hotboxes” by railroad personnel), and oversized loads that could strike bridges, tunnels, or trackside structures. After a train passes it, a *RAD* uses an electronically synthesized “voice” to transmit a radio report to the train crew. A typical *RAD* announcement will give its location (usually expressed as a mile post number), the train’s speed, the ambient temperature, and the total axle count. If no problems are found, the report will conclude with, “no defects.” Located about every 20 miles or so along the main lines, *RAD*s typically transmit on the primary road frequency. (Listening for these reports is a good way to verify that you are tuned to the frequency your train is currently using.)

While most railroad transmissions are routine, there will be exceptions that are usually related to mechanical problems, the weather and other natural phenomena, or the “human element.” Being able to listen in on a train’s radio communications will help you to keep appraised of these situations while they are taking place. Here are few examples of out-of-the-ordinary events that we monitored on our rail trips:

- While traveling from San Diego to San Juan Capistrano, our “Pacific Surfliner” suddenly came to a complete and unexpected halt. Turning on the scanner, we heard the main line dispatcher tell our engineer that a slight earthquake had just occurred and that he should proceed at 25 miles per hour until the tracks ahead had been inspected for possible damage.

- We had just departed Galesburg, Illinois onboard an eastbound “Zephyr” when an announcement was made to stop the train because of a medical emergency in one of the coaches. This was followed by a request for assistance from any trained medical personnel who might be on board. From our scanner, we learned that a coach passenger had suffered a seizure. 

- On one trip to California onboard the “Southwest Chief,” we heard the main line dispatcher contact our train with a weather warning that 60 mile an hour winds had been reported to the west of us. We heard our engineer ask the dispatcher if *AMTRAK* #6 (the east-bound “Zephyr”) had had to stop. Shortly afterwards, the “Chief” came to a stop. There were dark storm clouds overhead, with strong wind and lightning. An announcement was eventually made to the passengers as to why we had stopped. A short time later, we monitored a second high wind warning. About 30 minutes later, the eastbound “Zephyr” went by and the “Chief” finally got underway in a light rain. Later, in the wee hours of the morning, we awoke to find everything quiet and the “Chief” standing still. Turning on the scanner, we heard our engineer ask the dispatcher if he could proceed and was told to wait until after the tracks ahead had been inspected for flooding. 

- During another trip west on board the “Chief” we were able to follow an incident occurring in one of the coaches: a woman who was either intoxicated or on drugs had aroused the suspicions of the on-board staff, who were trying to determine if she had a weapon and/or was being disruptive to the other passengers. Authorities at the next station were notified and she was taken off the train when we arrived there.

BY ALL MEANS TAKE A SCANNER ALONG WITH YOU. YOU'LL BE GLAD YOU DID!

Eric & Pat


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## Eric in East County (May 7, 2021)

Among railroad scanner enthusiasts, the general consensus is that the little “rubber ducky” antennas that come with most scanners should be replaced, since they are not optimized for railroad frequencies. Based on what I’ve read, the preferred antenna for monitoring railroad radio communications appears to be an adjustable whip that can be “tuned” to a specific frequency by altering its length according to the following formula:

*Correct length (in inches) = 2,800 divided by the frequencies in MHz*

Using this formula, optimum reception of 160.800 MHz (which is at about the middle of the railroad band) is attained by using an antenna 17.5 inches in length. Since re-tuning the antenna for each new frequency is impractical for my purposes, I compromise by using a 12-inch all-band antenna. The output power of the portable radios used by the train crews is in the range of from 5 to 10 watts, providing coverage of no more than a mile or so. Since most onboard communications are only intended for other nearby radios, my all-band antenna is more than adequate for receiving them.


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## Irelandvegas65 (May 7, 2021)

Based on the feedback here, some say bring it some say no worries if you dont, I reached out to a family member who I recalled has one and I think that might be the best idea, no need to buy, but some fun along the way. Ill confirm what type and frequencies it works on as I get closer to October and ill borrow far enough I advance so I can program and play with it here, maybe even a test run to the viewing platform in Rochelle il just for fun!


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## zephyr17 (May 7, 2021)

I am okay with the stock rubber ducky antenna onboard. It picks up the crew on the train I am on, the detectors, and communications with very nearby trains ("Looking good on the north side, Amtrak") just fine. Getting the dispatcher clearly can be off and on, but the engineer has to repeat back most things, so I get it on that end, if my reception of the dispatcher is bad.

In the US on Amtrak, I generally keep my scanner locked on the road channel, I don't care about yard stuff or MOW usually. That minimizes, though doesn't eliminate, random squawks and bursts of static. I also turn the squelch up fairly high, as I am interested in things I don't have to try to decode out of static-y bursts.

Bonus on VIA is that the onboard service crew uses radio, not an intercom, to communicate. So on VIA I set up to scan the road, RTC (Canadian for dispatcher), and VIA channels. That VIA OBS channel, also used for communication with the head end, can be really interesting.

If I am out railfanning I use a big magnetic mount antenna that gives me a whole lot more range.


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## Devil's Advocate (May 7, 2021)

Irelandvegas65 said:


> Based on the feedback here, some say bring it some say no worries if you dont, I reached out to a family member who I recalled has one and I think that might be the best idea, no need to buy, but some fun along the way. Ill confirm what type and frequencies it works on as I get closer to October and ill borrow far enough I advance so I can program and play with it here, maybe even a test run to the viewing platform in Rochelle il just for fun!


This sounds like a good middle ground approach. You'll get a chance to try it out and see if you like it before buying your own. In my case the scanner I bought for trains (Uniden Bearcat BC125AT) did not do much for me on Amtrak. It was a lot more interesting on aircraft but most airlines have banned scanners and now it mainly sits in a drawer unless I'm spotting from the car.


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## zephyr17 (May 7, 2021)

If you do borrow it, use earphones while using it onboard. Having it just blast out on its speaker is against Amtrak policy, and the nature of it can be quite annoying to fellow passengers, random squawks and tones, burst of static, static-y, garbled speech. By all means enjoy it, but respect others.

I usually stick an earphone in one ear and not in both, so I can hear what is going around me and carry on a conversation.


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## PaTrainFan (May 7, 2021)

Obviously this is dependent on the type of scanner and quality of the antenna, but what is the typical maximum range? I have considered buying one with the intent of picking up communications from Amtrak where I live, but I am roughly 9 miles away from downtown Pittsburgh. I suspect that's well outside the range.


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## TinCan782 (May 7, 2021)

You can get a scanner for something around $100 that is more than adequate for receiving the railroad frequencies. The so-called "NASCAR" scanners will do the job. Even with the stock "rubber ducky" antenna, you are close enough to receive the engineer and conductor and most dispatchers use various mountain-top "repeaters" or remote bases to communicate with the trains. Most of the time, you will be able to copy the dispatcher as well. I use a suction-cup mount antenna mounted in the window; my handheld Garmin GPS is also connected to an external antenna hanging on a suction cup in the window.

A lot of "silence" will be heard but over time, you will hear the trackside defect detectors (heard one "catch" us a couple of times); conversation when the air line parts and the train comes to a sudden stop. On the SWC several years ago, the dispatcher relayed a flash flood warning to the engineer while we were in SE Colorado/NE New Mexico. The rain was pounding down on us! Last October on the Coast Starlight near Ventura as we came to a sudden stop (you could hear the air being dumped) the engineer radioed the standard "Emergency, emergency, emergency" to alert the dispatcher and possible nearby trains (we struck a trespasser).

My typical setup in the bedroom. The scanner is a Uniden BCD396XT (no longer made). The GPS a Garmin GPSMAP 62s (also no longer made) handheld GPS (intended for backpacking).


Showing sleeper bedroom window. To the right end you can see the telescoping VHF suction-mount antenna and to its right the external GPS antennas. I normally keep the curtain pulled just enough to cover the hardware in the window! This is way more than what may be needed. For the novice, a handheld scanner with the stock antenna will work fine in most cases.


There are slightly less 200 VHF frequencies designated for railroad use each numbered and referred to by train crews as "channels" - channel 30, channel 96, etc. If you program you frequencies and tag them with the AAR Number, it becomes pretty easy to change to the channel currently in use. Use the Amtrak frequency resource mentioned above or, you might hear the crew mention changing to channel # something. You can also scan those channels to try and find the active frequency. By the way, the dispatchers are with the host railroad, not Amtrak (there are places where Amtrak does the dispatching). In any case, all trains communicate on the appropriate "road channel".

Start simple, sit back and enjoy (and be patient). Don't forget an earbud or earphones if you are in coach.
73, John


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## BoulderCO (May 8, 2021)

zephyr17 said:


> If you do borrow it, use earphones while using it onboard. Having it just blast out on its speaker is against Amtrak policy, and the nature of it can be quite annoying to fellow passengers, random squawks and tones, burst of static, static-y, garbled speech. By all means enjoy it, but respect others.
> 
> I usually stick an earphone in one ear and not in both, so I can hear what is going around me and carry on a conversation.



Excellent advice!


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## Nick Farr (Aug 9, 2021)

FrensicPic said:


> You can get a scanner for something around $100 that is more than adequate for receiving the railroad frequencies.



A Baofeng UV-5R, a programming cable and a decent antenna can all be had for $50 these days, and probably less if you crawl Facebook marketplace.

You can program that Baofeng to "Dual Watch" the Amtrak "home" frequency and scan only the channels used on your trip.


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## Irelandvegas65 (Aug 23, 2021)

I did buy theUV-5R. now to program in and learn the thing between now and the end of September when my journey starts.........


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## Nick Farr (Aug 23, 2021)

Irelandvegas65 said:


> I did buy theUV-5R. now to program in and learn the thing between now and the end of September when my journey starts.........



If you have the cable, you can just use CHIRP. The US Railroad Frequencies are already built in, it's just a matter of picking the ones that matter for your trip.



PaTrainFan said:


> Obviously this is dependent on the type of scanner and quality of the antenna, but what is the typical maximum range?



Depends mostly on your antenna and line of sight. A well-tuned VHF antenna on your roof that can be had for $80 will pick up almost anything within line of sight in your valley. You won't have much luck getting traffic on the other side of the mountain unless that subdivision is using repeaters.


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## Irelandvegas65 (Aug 23, 2021)

Great help getting me started Nick Farr! apple care was able to show/help me get the editor connected and show me how to download and upload to the editor. The download of the file from CHIRP was a bit more than we could figure out together, so I will just edit the list manually. Now figuring out what ones I want ( your suggested list is highly welcomed! ) so I can put together the most useful channels for Empire Builder/Coast Starlight/California Zephyr. my understanding , looking at the link to the track on road list link, the Road frequency is ch 13 , freq 160.305 that would be the main one during the entire CHI to SEA route? is that how that works? or is "road" specific to CHI area?


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## Devil's Advocate (Aug 23, 2021)

The channel frequencies are specific to certain regions and change over time. 

It would have to be a short ride to use the same channel the whole way. CHI to SEA will change several times.






On Track On Line - Amtrak Freqs Empire Builder


Trains Community - On Track On Line provides information about Rail Travel and all facets of the hobbies of railroading and trains.



www.on-track-on-line.com




​
SegmentHostAAR
ChanFrequencyEMPIRE BUILDERChicago Union Station areaAmtrak Road
Yard
Mechanical13
42
77160.305
160.740
161.265Chicago-MilwaukeeMETRA & CP/Soo Line44160.770Milwaukee-PortageCP/Soo Line84161.370Portage-La Crosse (East of Miss. River)CP/Soo Line94161.520Mississippi River at La Crosse-Mississippi River at HastingsCP/Soo Line44160.770_Mississippi River at La Crosse-Mississippi River at Hastings (Alternate)__BNSF__39__160.690_Mississippi River at Hastings-North of St. Croix JunctionBNSF76161.250North of St. Croix Junction-St. Paul Union DepotBNSF76161.250St. Paul Union Depot-Merriam ParkCP44160.770Merriam Park-St. AnthonyMNNR30160.560_Between Merriam Park/St. Anthony(switching)__MNNR__30__160.560_St. Anthony-Coon RapidsBNSF70161.160Coon Rapids-StaplesBNSF85161.385Staples-Fargo NDBNSF87161.415Fargo-MinotBNSF66161.100Minot-Berthold NDBNSF46160.800Berthold-Bainville MTBNSF54160.920Bainville-Just east of HavreBNSF66161.100Just east of Havre-WhitefishBNSF76161.250Whitefish-SandpointBNSF54160.920Sandpoint-*Spokane WA2*BNSF76161.250_Switching in Spokane__BNSF
Amtrak__54
62__160.920
161.040_*Spokane2*-Latah Jct*3*BNSF76161.250Latah Jct*3*-EverettBNSF66161.100Everett-Edmonds (MP 18)BNSF76161.250Edmonds-*Seattle*BNSF70161.160_Seattle
Station Services/Yard
Mechanical__Amtrak__
23
45__
160.455
160.785_*Spokane2*-Latah Jct*3*BNSF76161.250Latah Jct*3*-PascoBNSF70161.160Pasco TerminalBNSF89161.445Pasco-WashougalBNSF87161.415Washougal-*Portland OR*BNSF76161.250_Station Services
Larger stations__Amtrak__23__160.455__Station Services in Portland_*4*_Amtrak__15__160.350__Switching in Portland__Amtrak__62__161.040_Notes:
*1* - Merriam Park is just south of the St. Paul Union Depot.
*2* - Spokane station services may use Channel 23 listed above.
*3* - Latah Jct is a few miles west of Spokane.
*4* - Channel 16/160.785 in Portland is used by handheld (low power) radios only.​​
3/11/2018: Seattle Station services updated courtesy of Martin Caestecker
6/10/2016: Chicago to Hastings updated with data from Curt Fettinger
2/6/2015: Minot ND to Bainville MT updated with data from Curt Fettinger
2/6/2015: Chicago-Milwaukee updated with data from Michael Johnson
1/18/2014: Whitefish to St. Paul updated with data from Tom Rawson
9/22/2014: New segment Coon Rapids-Staples added with data supplied by Larry Milsow
9/14/2014: Newly restored St Paul Union Depot and switching at old Amtrak depot between Merriam Park and St Anthony updated courtesy of Nick Modders​


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## Alice (Aug 23, 2021)

I also have the police/fire band programmed for scanning on one button I can turn on or off easily in addition to rail frequencies. When things go south, often they have more info.

For learning to use the scanner, turn it on every time you get in the car on whatever channels (not necessarily rail) are active in your neck of the woods.


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## WWW (Aug 24, 2021)

Other things to consider:

Using scanners on railroads is not security critical - no big deal 
However going through TSA security at airports may raise eyebrows 
Use of scanners in flight is really an issue - use with extreme care here (ear piece headphones absolutely necessary)
Scanners are receivers and not transmitting devices - can't mess with transmissions - but then there are the uneducated - - -

On cruise ships some will not pass muster - especially Carnival Cruise Lines at San Juan PR - they were not very pleasant about it.

As with all scanners - privileged communications is open to monitoring by the public be careful of what you hear and passing it on

Transceivers and Satellite phones are another thing - check to see if the use if OK - verboten - void - don't even think about it !

Most of the police and government frequencies are on a trunking circuit where the signal is on multiple frequencies so you only receive part of
it before changing channels - really hard to follow all the juicy stuff in progress.

In some local areas using a scanner to monitor police activity is illegal - the bad guys out-witting the keystone cops !

But it really is fun to hear the chatter as to why the hell the damn train is late - other than no defects at mile post xxx
Amtrak is really deficient in dispensing information about delays - Ok 20 minutes no big deal but an hour come on give me a break !
YES some trains do pick up time and station stops are often brief - just enough time to keep the delays on the minus side.

And the usual Mission Impossible discloser:
The Secretary will disallow any use of communication devices by the parties


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## Nick Farr (Aug 24, 2021)

More specifically, along your entire route:



SegmentChannelFrequencyRoadChicago-Milwaukee44160.770METRAMilwaukee-Portage84161.370CP/SooPortage-La Crosse (East of Miss. River)94161.520CP/SooMississippi River at La Crosse-Mississippi River at Hastings44160.770CP/SooMississippi River at La Crosse-Mississippi River at Hastings (Alternate)39160.695BNSFMississippi River at Hastings-North of St. Croix Junction76161.250BNSFNorth of St. Croix Junction-St. Paul Union Depot76161.250BNSFSt. Paul Union Depot-Merriam Park44160.770CPMerriam Park-St. Anthony30160.560MNNRBetween Merriam Park/St. Anthony(switching)30160.560MNNRSt. Anthony-Coon Rapids70161.160BNSFCoon Rapids-Staples85161.385BNSFStaples-Fargo ND87161.415BNSFFargo-Minot66161.100BNSFMinot-Berthold ND46160.800BNSFBerthold-Bainville MT54160.920BNSFBainville-Just east of Havre66161.100BNSFJust east of Havre-Whitefish76161.250BNSFWhitefish-Sandpoint54160.920BNSFSandpoint-Spokane WA76161.250BNSFSwitching in Spokane (Amtrak)62161.040BNSFSwitching in Spokane (BNSF)54160.920BNSFSpokane-Latah Jct76161.250BNSFLatah Jct-Everett66161.100BNSFEverett-Edmonds (MP 18)76161.250BNSFEdmonds-Seattle70161.160BNSF(EB to Portland) Latah Jct-Pasco70161.160BNSF(EB to Portland) Pasco Terminal89161.445BNSF(EB to Portland) Pasco-Washougal87161.415BNSF(EB to Portland) Washougal-Portland OR76161.250BNSFSeattle-Tukwilla70161.160BNSFTukwilla-Tenino87161.415BNSFTenino-North Vancouver66161.100BNSFNorth Vancouver-Portland76161.250BNSFPortland-Coalca27160.515UPCoalca-Swain96161.550UPSwain-Calimus30160.560UPCalimus-Dunsmuir45160.785UPDunsmuir-West Haggin80161.310UPWest Haggin-Oakland Coliseum46160.800UPEmeryville-West Haggin46160.800UPWest Haggin-Rocklin51160.875UPRocklin-Vista14160.320UPVista-Ocala78161.280UPOcala-Weso96161.550UPWeso-Alazon (Track 1)96161.550UPWeso-Alazon (Track 2)24160.470UPAlazon-Smelter24160.470UPSmelter-Salt Lake City57160.965UPSalt Lake City-Midvale57160.965UPMidvale-Provo42160.740UPProvo-Helper23160.455UPHelper-Grand Junction54160.920UPGrand Junction-Bond23160.455UPBond-Winter Park54160.920UPWinter Park-Moffat Tunnel97161.565UPMoffat Tunnel-MP 17.423160.455UPMP 17.4-Prospect14160.320UPProspect-Denver39160.695UPDenver-West Pinneo66161.100BNSFWest Pinneo-E. Heartwell70161.160BNSFE. Heartwell-Lincoln54160.920BNSFLincoln-MP 466.487161.415BNSFMP 466.4-Halpin53160.905BNSFHalpin-CP 175039160.695BNSFCP 1750-Galesburg51160.875BNSFGalesburg-Aurora85161.385BNSFAurora-Chicago66161.100BNSF


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## Nick Farr (Aug 24, 2021)

StationChannelFrequencyChicago Amtrak Road13160.305Chicago Amtrak Yard42160.740Chicago Amtrak Mechanical77161.265Amtrak Pacific NW Switching Channel62161.040Seattle Amtrak Station Services23160.455Seattle Amtrak Mechanical45160.785Portland Amtrak Station Services15160.335Larger Station Amtrak Services23160.455Oakland UP Yardmaster66161.100Oakland Mechanical22160.440Oakland Yard51160.875Salt Lake City66161.100Amtrak OBS ChannelN/A452.900Amtrak OBS ChannelN/A457.900


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## Nick Farr (Aug 24, 2021)

If you wanted to just program the ones that will be in use on your route and hit the "scan" button every so often this is the table to use and scan against:


ChannelFrequencyTimes used on EB>CS>CZ route13160.305114160.320215160.335122160.440123160.455524160.470227160.515130160.560339160.695342160.740244160.770345160.785246160.800351160.875353160.905154160.920657160.965262161.040266161.100870161.160576161.250877161.265178161.280180161.310184161.370185161.385287161.415489161.445194161.520196161.550397161.5651


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## Irelandvegas65 (Aug 24, 2021)

That’s just brilliant! I’ll work on this my next day off! Thank you


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## PVD (Aug 24, 2021)

WWW said:


> Other things to consider:
> 
> Using scanners on railroads is not security critical - no big deal
> However going through TSA security at airports may raise eyebrows
> ...


Some airlines expressly forbid scanners, and any PED is generally subject to the 10,000 foot rule even if allowed. While there is no transmission, there are fears (perhaps unfounded, but they make the rules) that reception can be an issue. Unless things have changed, Delta and Southwest were definitely no, not sure of the others.


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## Devil's Advocate (Aug 24, 2021)

PVD said:


> Some airlines expressly forbid scanners, and any PED is generally subject to the 10,000 foot rule even if allowed. While there is no transmission, there are fears (perhaps unfounded, but they make the rules) that reception can be an issue. Unless things have changed, Delta and Southwest were definitely no, not sure of the others.


I'm unaware of any US airline that allows _operating_ radio scanners while in flight but I'm also unaware of anything dangerous happening as a result. Mobile phones in transmit mode are likely a bigger issue but they only seem to affect the smallest of regional aircraft. If you were caught in the act it would probably just get a warning to turn it off and put it away but ignoring these instructions could be cause for civil penalties. Always avoid taking a scanner on international flights without proper research as the rules and regulations vary widely from country to country and simple possession can be a major offense in some areas.


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## PVD (Aug 24, 2021)

I had heard Air Canada (not a US carrier, but do fly a fair number of flights here) was ok, of course that may not have been in US airspace, and certainly may have changed.


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## caravanman (Aug 24, 2021)

Just as a mater of interest, folk with scanners might like to know that radio amateurs (hams) can be heard on scanners, they operate FM between 144 Mhz and 148 Mhz in USA. There is another band between 420 and 450 Mhz. also. Some channels carry "repeaters" which boost the signals over larger distances, so one can sometimes hear folk using handheld walki talki type sets from over 50 miles away on your scanner.


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## Bob Dylan (Aug 24, 2021)

caravanman said:


> Just as a mater of interest, folk with scanners might like to know that radio amateurs (hams) can be heard on scanners, they operate FM between 144 Mhz and 148 Mhz in USA. There is another band between 420 and 450 Mhz. also. Some channels carry "repeaters" which boost the signals over larger distances, so one can sometimes hear folk using handheld walki talki type sets from over 50 miles away on your scanner.


As a kid I remember talking with a guy in Australia and Barry Goldwater in Arizonia on the Ham Radio of our neighbor.


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## caravanman (Aug 24, 2021)

Bob Dylan said:


> As a kid I remember talking with a guy in Australia and Barry Goldwater in Arizonia on the Ham Radio of our neighbor.


Depending on the short wave frequency band, some hams do achieve world wide communication. Scanners tend to mostly be vhf / uhf coverage, which is much shorter range.
One can monitor ham traffic worldwide over the internet now, you can "control" a distant reciever free of charge with your computer!


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## CTANut (Aug 27, 2021)

Nick Farr said:


> A Baofeng UV-5R, a programming cable and a decent antenna can all be had for $50 these days, and probably less if you crawl Facebook marketplace.
> 
> You can program that Baofeng to "Dual Watch" the Amtrak "home" frequency and scan only the channels used on your trip.


Is that not illegal because it can transmit on Amtrak frequencies.


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## CTANut (Aug 27, 2021)

Also, I am looking at getting a scanner like this one. Do you know of any one that would cost under $50?


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## Nick Farr (Aug 27, 2021)

CTANut said:


> Is that not illegal because it can transmit on Amtrak frequencies.



Owning the device is not illegal. You can program it to not transmit at all, which would make it a scanner. 

Transmitting on frequencies you're not licensed to transmit on is illegal.


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## Nick Farr (Aug 27, 2021)

CTANut said:


> Also, I am looking at getting a scanner like this one. Do you know of any one that would cost under $50?



The current comes-with-everything kit for the UV-5R is under $50.


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## WWW (Aug 27, 2021)

Consider having the scanner pre-programmed with all the radio chatter that you will likely have an affinity to monitor.
OR investing in a software program to self install the frequencies.
Trying to program each individual frequency on a teeny tiny keyboard half the size of a flip cell phone is madness !


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## TinCan782 (Aug 28, 2021)

Bob Dylan said:


> As a kid I remember talking with a guy in Australia and Barry Goldwater in Arizonia on the Ham Radio of our neighbor.


Barry Goldwater, K7UGA was an active Ham and quite supportive of the hobby.


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## TinCan782 (Aug 28, 2021)

WWW said:


> Consider having the scanner pre-programmed with all the radio chatter that you will likely have an affinity to monitor.
> OR investing in a software program to self install the frequencies.
> Trying to program each individual frequency on a teeny tiny keyboard half the size of a flip cell phone is madness !


Radioreference.com is a good source of more technical information including frequencies. For Amtrak frequencies by route, on-track-online is great.
I use Freescan which, as the name implies, is free. It is no longer supported but the last version is stable and widely used. I use it often with my handheld scanner, especially getting ready for train trips! It will also work with many mobile scanners. Freescan does not support newer modes such as NXDN.
I also use Proscan which is free for 30 days, $50 for a lifetime license. Proscan also works with a wide variety of scanners. I use it for my home scanner and also allows me to remotely control my scanner from my computer. Besides control, it also displays a facsimile scanner on the screen which looks like that actual scanner including the scanners display screen.


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## Oreius (Sep 6, 2021)

I brought along my scanner to “listen” in on freight traffic and crew reports should the Starlight get delayed. What are the frequencies for UP? I believe Amtrak must broadcast on the frequency of their host railroad(s).


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## zephyr17 (Sep 6, 2021)

Amtrak is on the host railroad's road channels. Road channels change at various points.

Your best asset is On Track On Line. They collect radio frequencies on all Amtrak routes:





On Track On Line - Amtrak Radio Frequencies


Trains Community - On Track On Line provides information about Rail Travel and the hobbies of railroading and trains.



www.on-track-on-line.com





Note that their frequency lists are entirely dependent on field reporting. The railroads shift their channels for a given area with some frequency, so everything may not be up to date, they need someone to detect and report the change. It would be a good idea to have one bank programmed with all the AAR channels so if you lose the road channel you can scan all AAR channels until you pick something up in the event a channel change happened that OTOL hasn't had reported yet. Your best bet for finding an unknown channel is to scan just before, during, and just after station stops, the conductor and engineer are almost guaranteed to be conversing then ("Two more" "That'll do. Stop." "HIghball Salinas on signal indication")



If you intend to railfan with a scanner on Amtrak with some regularity, programming your scanner channels to correspond with AAR channel numbers is a good idea. So if you hear the crew say "rolling to 36", you can just punch up channel 36. Also, the crews generally have no idea of the actual frequencies, they do know the AAR channel, though. That's how their radios are set up.

You are likely only to be hearing your train, detectors, the dispatcher, and very nearby freights with a regular, short rubber ducky antenna. Sometimes you won't be able to hear the dispatcher well. That's okay, any orders must be repeated back by the engineer and you will hear him.

There is not a lot of chatter, so don't worry if there is silence for long periods. One of the nice things about the Starlight is a lot of the Coast Line is not CTC. CTC ends somewhere north of Santa Barbara (CTC installation keeps creeping northward, so not sure of exactly where currently) plus there is CTC over Cuesta between San Luis Obispo and San Miguel. So you will get the dispatcher and engineer issuing, repeating back, and releasing track warrants to authorize movement. Traffic is light enough on the coast line that the dispatcher will often issue a track warrant all the way from San Miguel to Salinas, though, so there is not a lot of back and forth all the time on track warrants.


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## TinCan782 (Sep 6, 2021)

zephyr17 said:


> Amtrak is on the host railroad's road channels. Road channels change at various points.
> 
> Your best asset is On Track On Line. They collect radio frequencies on all Amtrak routes:
> 
> ...


Some good pointers there. I also "tag" all the frequencies with the associated AAR Channel number. Having a group of just the entire range of frequencies in addition to each route as listed in On Track On Line is also a good idea. 
I never get on a train without my scanner (and handheld GPS).


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## Kbyrdleroydogg (Sep 10, 2021)

Are scanner radios a good thing to get into? Does anyone use them in their sleeper car or try and use one in coach? Can you use them on Amtrak trains? Are they discouraged?


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## Sauve850 (Sep 10, 2021)

I always bring a scanner along on my train travels. Use headset or earphones so as not to disturb others.


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## zephyr17 (Sep 10, 2021)

They are not discouraged, but remember to use earphones. Scanners can be particularly annoying to other passengers with static, squawks, beeps and tones.

I always carry mine. Plus, my sleeper attendants often ask me what is going on when something happens unexpectedly, such as a long unexplained stop. They know I can overhear the operating crew while they are not usually told anything more than the passengers.


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## empirebuilderdude1929 (Sep 14, 2021)

If travelling via sleeper I recommend getting a mobile scanner that plugs into the wall. That way you don't go through batteries and the reception on those is generally better than the handheld scanners.


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## zephyr17 (Sep 14, 2021)

I have a handheld with rechargeable batteries. I leave it plugged in in my room, but then take it with me on fresh air stops and waiting in the station, where i can listen to station services and maintenance frequencies as well as the road channels. I find that a handheld I can plug in to be optimal. I don't need great reception for what I am interested in onboard, as I can hear my own train's crew and if the dispatcher reception is bad, the engineer repeats things back and I can always her the engineer. Getting a tuned antenna would improve reception dramatically over the stock rubber ducky on a handheld (the electronics are basically the same in either), but the rubber ducky has proven sufficient for my limited purposes while onboard.

If I am out railfanning, I have a big magnetic mount antenna for my truck. That improves reception and range on my handheld no end. I want range when I am out railfanning, I find I do not particularly need it onboard for what I want.


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## Irelandvegas65 (Sep 14, 2021)

This has been so helpful! Thanks! I bought a hand held and the kit has two batteries, on radio sized one extended longer It also has the short and long antenna. I guess I’ll just bring both antennas (?) and both batteries and the charge base. Two days on empire, one on Coast and two on zephyr with two nights in Sea, San and Aspen. Lots of tech in my pack for this journey


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## Eric in East County (Sep 14, 2021)

You didn't mention which hand held model you bought. My little Uniden SC230 hand held Racing Scanner can run off of AC power which helps to save on batteries. Check your scanner's manual to see if yours can run off of AC power.


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## Irelandvegas65 (Sep 14, 2021)

I bought the Beofang UV-5R. Kit with two batteries and two antennas , charger and earpiece! heck of a deal.


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## CTANut (Sep 15, 2021)

Check out this site as well.


TrainMon5


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## joelkfla (Oct 20, 2021)

I just ordered a Bearcat BC125AT scanner. It costs $110, but it includes the computer cable, and software that says it allows loading frequencies from a spreadsheet. I'm fluent in Excel, so that should be easy for me.

I looked at the current Baofeng kit, which is now $70, but the computer cable is an extra $22. I looked at both user manuals, and it seemed to me that the Baofeng is much more complicated, as I would expect since it's really a 2-way radio that also scans. There are only a few pages in the Baofeng manual covering scanning, but I did notice that it scans at only 3 steps/second, compared with 100/sec for the Bearcat. The Bearcat seems to have a lot of features which were not mentioned in the Baofeng manual. The Bearcat just seemed like it would be more straightforward to use for scanning, since that's it's only purpose in life.

The Bearcat uses rather obsolete NiMH batteries which are recharged thru the USB cable, which can be plugged into a phone charger. But it can also use regular alkaline AA's. It's not clear to me whether it can run directly off USB power.

I also ordered a Diamond RH77CA antenna, because Danny Hartman (Distant Signal vlog) said it works much better than the included "rubber ducky". (He also recommended the scanner.)

So, I'll see how it goes on my upcoming NYC trip.


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## AmtrakMaineiac (Oct 20, 2021)

mcropod said:


> It also let me operate in kilometres and kph rather than having to try to make sense of the bushels, or farenheit, or ounces, or whatever it is that you lot use to measure distance and speed.


My preferred speed measurement is furlongs per fortnight  Haven't been able to program the speed app to use this though.


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## MerchantSeaman (Oct 20, 2021)

Why I really like listen to My Scanner while traveling by train . The following ( Train Story / Sea Story ) this past Summer Coast Starlight Portland to Sacramento .. My Scanner lite up with Chatter about a Train Trestle in Southern Oregon that was on Fire. Followed by the Conductor informing the Train Crew of the Changing Situation. About what was going to happen next. It was funny to me how heavily edited was the messaging ( talking to the Passengers as if they were 3rd graders ) I had enough information to phone ahead for food delivery to the station we were standing by., knowing that we would be at a siding overnight, the pain of some passengers that were on a schedule, when and how the delay would be handled by Amtrak ( they did a great job considering the massive issues ) I was put up for two days in a great hotel given food vouchers and had a great time exploring Portland. Although I had planned on returning to Chicago via the Zephyr I returned on the Empire Builder. I was upgraded to the Handicap Compartment. Which was great because I had view on both sides of the train. I will never travel by train with out my Scanner.


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## Eric in East County (Oct 20, 2021)

MerchantSeaman said:


> Why I really like listen to My Scanner while traveling by train . The following ( Train Story / Sea Story ) this past Summer Coast Starlight Portland to Sacramento .. My Scanner lite up with Chatter about a Train Trestle in Southern Oregon that was on Fire. Followed by the Conductor informing the Train Crew of the Changing Situation. About what was going to happen next. It was funny to me how heavily edited was the messaging ( talking to the Passengers as if they were 3rd graders ) I had enough information to phone ahead for food delivery to the station we were standing by., knowing that we would be at a siding overnight, the pain of some passengers that were on a schedule, when and how the delay would be handled by Amtrak ( they did a great job considering the massive issues ) I was put up for two days in a great hotel given food vouchers and had a great time exploring Portland. Although I had planned on returning to Chicago via the Zephyr I returned on the Empire Builder. I was upgraded to the Handicap Compartment. Which was great because I had view on both sides of the train. I will never travel by train with out my Scanner.


This is one of the best endorsements yet for why train travelers should consider having a scanner with them. While we’ve never monitored AMTRAK radio traffic as dramatic as this example, we have been able to listen in on other conversations between crew members and messages from dispatchers that alerted us to events out of the ordinary, some of which did affected our trains’ operations. We would never consider traveling by train without our scanner.

Eric & Pat


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## Devil's Advocate (Oct 20, 2021)

joelkfla said:


> I just ordered a Bearcat BC125AT scanner.


I purchased that same model six or seven years ago. There was a newer model back then but there was something it was missing (self-charging?) that pushed me to buy the older model instead. The digital trunking models made no difference for rail or air and could not decode metro PD so I left them alone.



joelkfla said:


> The Bearcat uses rather obsolete NiMH batteries which are recharged thru the USB cable, which can be plugged into a phone charger.


Make sure you buy a quality brand like Panasonic eneloop from a legitimate distributor (plus a charger and backup pack) and you'll be good to go.






joelkfla said:


> I also ordered a Diamond RH77CA antenna, because Danny Hartman (Distant Signal vlog) said it works much better than the included "rubber ducky". (He also recommended the scanner.)


Let me know how Danny Harmon's advice works out. I'm pretty sure it will be better than the coiled version but not as good as his in-vehicle setup.


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## PVD (Oct 20, 2021)

I wouldn't call NiMh obsolete in the context of a rechargeable AA or AAA since their cell voltage of around 1.2v is easier to deal with in that particular application than a Lithium ion cell which typically has a much higher cell voltage...


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## joelkfla (Oct 20, 2021)

Devil's Advocate said:


> Let me know how Danny Harmon's advice works out. I'm pretty sure it will be better than the coiled version but not as good as his in-vehicle setup.


Oops! I see I mangled his name. It was late.

I think I'll bring both antennas (or antennae) and try them out, but if there is a difference I might not be able to tell, since this is my 1st scanner and it's only 1 day on the train in each direction.

I'll admit, I might have gotten carried away in the excitement of buying a new toy.


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## west point (Oct 20, 2021)

About antennas. Are any available that are fractal antennas ? Fractal antennas are the reason your cell phone does not need the extendable antenna that older cells and the shoe box phones.


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## TinCan782 (Oct 20, 2021)

I use this suction cup mount antenna (originally from Radio Shack; Scannermaster carries the same) with a telescoping antenna that is about 19-20" long extended (original use was the Ham 2 meter band). I shorten it a couple of sections for 160 MHz. 
The second and third images show it mounted in my sleeper window along with my GPS antenns. 
The fourth shot shows it mounted in my cabin window on our Mississippi River cruise in August. Used for monitoring the maritime frequencies, especially when "locking through" the two dozen locks we passed.
The scanner and GPS both are powered by AA NiMH batteries and are chargeable via the USB port from a standard USB charger.


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## mcropod (Oct 20, 2021)

AmtrakMaineiac said:


> My preferred speed measurement is furlongs per fortnight  Haven't been able to program the speed app to use this though.



You are lightening quick then - most of my friends seem to use chains per Tuesday, so you'd be well ahead!


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## WWW (Oct 20, 2021)

mcropod said:


> You are lightening quick then - most of my friends seem to use chains per Tuesday, so you'd be well ahead!


When Prince Charles becomes KING there will be a whole nother method of measuring things i.e. foot size and all that malarkey ! LOL !


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## mcropod (Oct 21, 2021)

WWW said:


> When Prince Charles becomes KING there will be a whole nother method of measuring things i.e. foot size and all that malarkey ! LOL !



Not even with the poms/sassenachs (Oz/Scottish references) out of the EU is this a chance


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## CTANut (Dec 16, 2021)

joelkfla said:


> I just ordered a Bearcat BC125AT scanner. It costs $110, but it includes the computer cable, and software that says it allows loading frequencies from a spreadsheet. I'm fluent in Excel, so that should be easy for me.
> 
> I looked at the current Baofeng kit, which is now $70, but the computer cable is an extra $22. I looked at both user manuals, and it seemed to me that the Baofeng is much more complicated, as I would expect since it's really a 2-way radio that also scans. There are only a few pages in the Baofeng manual covering scanning, but I did notice that it scans at only 3 steps/second, compared with 100/sec for the Bearcat. The Bearcat seems to have a lot of features which were not mentioned in the Baofeng manual. The Bearcat just seemed like it would be more straightforward to use for scanning, since that's it's only purpose in life.
> 
> ...


Watch out. Certain states restrict the possession of scanners if you are not a licensed ham radio operator. As a result, I got my ham radio license.








Are Police Scanners Legal?


Are police scanners legal? Yes, police scanners are legal in the US. View details including regional restrictions while driving, committing other crimes + more. State by State guide of police scanner laws and statues affecting police scanning in America.




www.zipscanners.com




This includes railfan scanners. Indiana seems to restrict handheld scanners.


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## Eric in East County (Dec 16, 2021)

CTANut said:


> Watch out. Certain states restrict the possession of scanners if you are not a licensed ham radio operator. As a result, I got my ham radio license.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Not all scanners can pick up police frequencies, particularly now that many police departments have switched over to digital transmission. A basic racing scanner will probably not be able to receive police calls, but will work fine for listening to AMTRAK transmissions.


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## PVD (Dec 16, 2021)

joelkfla said:


> I just ordered a Bearcat BC125AT scanner. It costs $110, but it includes the computer cable, and software that says it allows loading frequencies from a spreadsheet. I'm fluent in Excel, so that should be easy for me.
> 
> I looked at the current Baofeng kit, which is now $70, but the computer cable is an extra $22. I looked at both user manuals, and it seemed to me that the Baofeng is much more complicated, as I would expect since it's really a 2-way radio that also scans. There are only a few pages in the Baofeng manual covering scanning, but I did notice that it scans at only 3 steps/second, compared with 100/sec for the Bearcat. The Bearcat seems to have a lot of features which were not mentioned in the Baofeng manual. The Bearcat just seemed like it would be more straightforward to use for scanning, since that's it's only purpose in life.
> 
> ...


I would disagree that in this type of application nimh is "rather obsolete." Since they are easy to produce in the sizes like AA or AAA, and are pretty close in voltage to alkaline (1.2v vs 1.5v) they are useable in most AA or AAA applications without much additional work. They are still widely used in these type of applications.


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## WWW (Dec 16, 2021)

Eric in East County said:


> Not all scanners can pick up police frequencies, particularly now that many police departments have switched over to digital transmission. A basic racing scanner will probably not be able to receive police calls, but will work fine for listening to AMTRAK transmissions.


Police activity is not the only restricted area of monitoring - Cruise Ships and Airlines may have an interest in monitoring their activity - airlines 
especially in flight on board similar to operating using a cell phone.
Use them discretely - wear an ear device to listen rather then the units speaker - avoid trouble and legal complications.
Oh and don't be too obvious with that "whip antenna" sticking out your pocket ! LOL !


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## Eric in East County (Dec 17, 2021)

I checked with my friends at *Radio Reference.com* and they clarified that state restrictions on the use of scanners (handheld or otherwise) apply to using a scanner while driving (for example to avoid a speed trap) or using a scanner in the commission of a crime. Some handheld *digital* scanners used by hobbyists have the capability to *transmit* as well as receive, so I can see where a ham license might be required to operate them. Many government agencies and private businesses that use radios to conduct business are now using *encryption* to limit who can receive their transmissions. I can see where having a scanner with the capability to listen in on encrypted radio transmissions might raise some concerns. Until Amtrak comes out with a specific ruling that bans passengers from using scanners, I will continue to use mine during rail trips. As was pointed out, when listening to a scanner in an open coach, sightseer lounge car, or other public area, always use earphones or earbuds.


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## Devil's Advocate (Dec 17, 2021)

Eric in East County said:


> Not all scanners can pick up police frequencies, particularly now that many police departments have switched over to digital transmission. A basic racing scanner will probably not be able to receive police calls, but will work fine for listening to AMTRAK transmissions.


Any scanner with the right frequency range will still receive police broadcasts. What a very basic scanner cannot do is follow a transmission across a shared frequency pool or translate what is being said due to digital encoding (legally reversible) or encryption (legally protected).



PVD said:


> I would disagree that in this type of application nimh is "rather obsolete." Since they are easy to produce in the sizes like AA or AAA, and are pretty close in voltage to alkaline (1.2v vs 1.5v) they are useable in most AA or AAA applications without much additional work. They are still widely used in these type of applications.


The original problem with NiMH cells was that they were often rated just shy of the cutoff voltage for equipment expecting conventional batteries. This often resulted in unexpected and undesirable operation but modern electronics are much more efficient and can usually work fine at NiMH voltages. You might see a low battery warning if the designer did not plan around rechargeable batteries but with a quality brand you can simply ignore it.



WWW said:


> Police activity is not the only restricted area of monitoring - Cruise Ships and Airlines may have an interest in monitoring their activity - airlines
> especially in flight on board similar to operating using a cell phone.


Here in the US police activity is generally unrestricted unless encrypted or received while operating a vehicle without a radio operator license and modern aircraft broadcast a near constant stream of data over open channels all over the world. I have no idea about cruise ships or maritime law.


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## joelkfla (Dec 17, 2021)

joelkfla said:


> I just ordered a Bearcat BC125AT scanner. It costs $110, but it includes the computer cable, and software that says it allows loading frequencies from a spreadsheet. I'm fluent in Excel, so that should be easy for me.
> 
> I looked at the current Baofeng kit, which is now $70, but the computer cable is an extra $22. I looked at both user manuals, and it seemed to me that the Baofeng is much more complicated, as I would expect since it's really a 2-way radio that also scans. There are only a few pages in the Baofeng manual covering scanning, but I did notice that it scans at only 3 steps/second, compared with 100/sec for the Bearcat. The Bearcat seems to have a lot of features which were not mentioned in the Baofeng manual. The Bearcat just seemed like it would be more straightforward to use for scanning, since that's it's only purpose in life.
> 
> ...


It's been a few months, but there have been a few recent reactions and replies to my post, so I just wanted to update a couple of things.

My understanding that frequency banks could be maintained in Excel using the supplied software was incorrect. The software is easy to use, though.

However, there is a freeware package that duplicates and extends the Uniden software, including more extensive real-time control of the scanner from a Windows PC. That package also includes a utility to export and import frequency banks to/from Excel-compatible .csv files. That package is called Scan125, and is at this website.

I did enjoy using the scanner on the trips up and down between Orlando & NYP. I was preboarded by Redcap from the Metro Lounge at NYP before the OBS were in position. When my SCA came into the room and started his spiel, he saw the scanner and said, "I see you've done this before, but I'm gonna continue anyway 'cause I'm supposed to."  

I kept the Diamond antenna attached most of the time, so I can't really say whether or not it improved reception over the stock antenna. Although I did preprogram the frequencies for the trip into a bank, it seemed like just using the Bearcat's built-in search of all railroad frequencies worked about as well.


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## west point (Dec 17, 2021)

The new fractal antennas are much better. example your cell phone today can receive many frequencies vs. the old shoe phones with extendable antennas.


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## basketmaker (Dec 18, 2021)

CTANut said:


> Watch out. Certain states restrict the possession of scanners if you are not a licensed ham radio operator. As a result, I got my ham radio license.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Scanners in vehicles are illegal in Florida where I was born and raised. I carried or had mounted a scanner in every car/truck I owned. And still do carry a handheld scanner regularly (including Amtrak trips). Never had an issue with LEO in Florida, Tennessee or now Colorado. There are a few cellphone apps that provide scanner broadcasts from locations around the world mainly law enforcement, aviation but sadly minimal rail at least in the US.


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## Charles785 (Dec 19, 2021)

One of the comments above mentioned that - in some areas at least - it may not be legal to have a scanner programmed to police frequencies in a motor vehicle.

I can remember that back in the 1960s the radio station I worked for had a station-owned car utilized by a news reporter that had a mobile scanner for the obvious purpose of covering police news.

Is that sort of thing illegal in this day and age?


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## PVD (Dec 19, 2021)

It depends on your state...


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## amtrakpass (Dec 19, 2021)

I would recommend programming the scanner to the same existing 99 AAR channel numbers, so that when the crew says going over to 56 or 72 etc.... you could just switch your scanner to that channel and not be trying to think about frequencies. 
In general I think most trips the communication you will hear is rather mundane but it is nice to know what you are waiting for if you do get stopped, especially if you are already used to the railroad lingo. It is not perfect but the on track online site still has a helpful list of different Amtrak trains radio channels/frequencies if someone has not mentioned it.
As far as batteries I just got a separate charger that comes with Energizer rechargable batteries at Walgreens so one pair could charge while using another. Don't know if they are all the same, but mine you have to remember to flip a small switch under the battery cover if you are using rechargeable or regular batteries.


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## AmtrakMaineiac (Dec 21, 2021)

west point said:


> the old shoe phones with extendable antennas.


You mean like the one Maxwell Smart used?


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## PVD (Dec 21, 2021)

amtrakpass said:


> I would recommend programming the scanner to the same existing 99 AAR channel numbers, so that when the crew says going over to 56 or 72 etc.... you could just switch your scanner to that channel and not be trying to think about frequencies.
> In general I think most trips the communication you will hear is rather mundane but it is nice to know what you are waiting for if you do get stopped, especially if you are already used to the railroad lingo. It is not perfect but the on track online site still has a helpful list of different Amtrak trains radio channels/frequencies if someone has not mentioned it.
> As far as batteries I just got a separate charger that comes with Energizer rechargeable batteries at Walgreens so one pair could charge while using another. Don't know if they are all the same, but mine you have to remember to flip a small switch under the battery cover if you are using rechargeable or regular batteries.


since an NiMh cell is 1.2V vs 1.5V in the alkaline, throwing the switch probably accounts for that *or* allows current flow towards the batteries to recharge if a usb cord was connected. Never really looked to see which.


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## joelkfla (Dec 21, 2021)

PVD said:


> since an NiMh cell is 1.2V vs 1.5V in the alkaline, throwing the switch probably accounts for that *or* allows current flow towards the batteries to recharge if a usb cord was connected. Never really looked to see which.


It generally has to do with disabling the charging circuitry. There are all kinds of warnings about not trying to charge a non-rechargeable alkaline battery.


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## Devil's Advocate (Dec 21, 2021)

Disabling internal charging and adjusting the low battery alert are two of the most common reasons for a battery type switch.


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## PVD (Dec 21, 2021)

Makes sense, that's what I've generally seen, but never bothered to verify on my radio.


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## Eric in East County (Dec 21, 2021)

Our little _Uniden SC230_ racing scanner has the capability to operate on AC power and we always use this feature to save on batteries.

We have our scanner programmed so that one bank has all of the AAR channels while another bank just has the channels for the trains we’ll be riding on. (These are readily available from the *On Track On Line* site’s radio frequencies lists for each _Amtrak_ train.) While en route, the bank with our trains’ frequencies is the only one that is active. 

The *On Track On Line* frequency lists also indicate when the road frequencies change. We have this information notated on our route map and usually change channels manually. (Sometimes the engineer will radio everyone when he is about to change channels.) If we don’t hear the periodic reports for the automated *Radio Alarm Detectors* (RADs) we’ll check to make sure that we’re on the correct channel and that it has not be inadvertently “locked out.”


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## 5280 Guy (Dec 24, 2021)

I have installed the (for Android) Scanner Radio app for my phone. Does that work as well?


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## TinCan782 (Dec 24, 2021)

5280 Guy said:


> I have installed the (for Android) Scanner Radio app for my phone. Does that work as well?


With a scanner app on a phone, you are limited to what is provided by other individuals. Private individuals set up a scanner tuned to some frequency of interest and provide the "feed" to app providers such as Broadcastify or Scanner Radio. Railroad radio is even more limited in scope as compared to public safety listening. You may also notice various amounts of delay (many seconds) between what may be heard on an actual scanner vs an app. It's not really a good substitute for having an actual scanner available.

While an app may not provide the listening you want during train travel, it will allow you to listen in on distant areas. For example, I used an app to listen in on Tucson PD during the shooting on the Sunset Limited recently. I use scanners all the time on my trips and at home. and also use a phone app from time to time as I just mentioned.
Edit to add: With a phone scanner app you need cellular service or wifi.


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## piedpiper (Apr 27, 2022)

I recently upgraded from a Radio Shack PRO-60 to a RS PRO-94. 10 banks to now 20. This is how I programmed it for almost all Amtrak routes, using OTOL site. A PRO-94 can be found on ebay for under $75 usually.


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## Eric in East County (Apr 27, 2022)

piedpiper said:


> I recently upgraded from a Radio Shack PRO-60 to a RS PRO-94. 10 banks to now 20. This is how I programmed it for almost all Amtrak routes, using OTOL site. A PRO-94 can be found on ebay for under $75 usually.View attachment 28207


You seemed to have organized your *Amtrak* frequencies in a most efficient manner. (Do you actually ride on all of these trains?) We use three trains: the *Pacific Surfliner*, the *Southwest Chief*, and the *Capitol Limited* when we travel from San Diego to Ohio and back. Between the three of them, they only use 30 different frequencies, and I’ve combined them all into a single bank on my scanner. (When we're traveling, I keep all of the other banks locked out.) I do have ALL of the AAR Channels programmed into another bank just in case.

Your post also helps to emphasize a very good point, mainly that one doesn’t need to spend a lot of money to obtain a perfectly adequate scanner for taking along on train trips. Being able to listen in on conversations between our train’s crew members, conversations between dispatchers and the engineer, and the periodic reports from radio alarm detectors always makes our trips more interesting. We consider a scanner to be one of the essentials to have along whenever we travel by train. With all the bargain priced scanners to be had on eBay, there is no reason why anyone who wants one can’t have one.


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## TinCan782 (Apr 27, 2022)

I only program in the routes I am actually taking on a trip...two or three trains Those frequencies are tagged with AAR number for quick access - I just enter the AAR number and the scanner jumps there.
In addition, I always have another group with ALL AAR frequencies tagged with AAR number for quick access, especially if I need a channel not included in the route groups.
Since I follow along the route pretty well and stay parked on the active channel. I do NOT scan any of these groups unless I'm unsure of the channel in use and wish to identify it.

In my System and Groups (think bank*) for trains the Pacific Surfliner and Metrolink is always programmed as well as other local UP, BNSF frequencies of interest. My scanner at home is usually scanning the local RR frequencies, especially the Coast Starlight/Pacific Surfliner/Metrolink line that passes near here.
* my scanners use "DMA" (Dynamic Memory Access) - systems and groups rather than banks.


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## zephyr17 (Apr 27, 2022)

Likewise, I tend to organize my scanner with common trips, like banks set up for the Empire Builder and the Starlight.

All banks use AAR channel numbers, with the addition of non-AAR station services and mechanical frequencies appropriate to the route when available, except for the banks set up for Canada trips.

I tend to lock off all channels except the current road channel and don't scan unless I am in the immediate vicinity of a channel rollover or in a station, like LA, where I want to get station services, mechanical as well as road.

Finally, I have one bank (0) that has all AAR frequencies with none locked out that I use if I feel I have lost the road channel and don't feel confident of my reference material. That way i can scan everything until I pick something up. Best used at station stops, as I can usually catch the highball ("Highball, Hicktown, DIB", "Highball") and know I have caught my train on the current road channel.


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## Northwestern (Apr 28, 2022)

Irelandvegas65 said:


> I have been watching videos for my October 2021 Empire to Coast Starlight to Zephyr journey. One piece of tech I have seen are Scanners, tuned to Amtrak frequencies. It looks like a fun, and useful item, but a few minutes on Amazon show a great cost for a none regular Amtrak passenger. Can these be rented and programmed without buying one?
> 
> I also have an older stand along Garmin and wondered it it might be something to bring along, or will the iPhone do enough for tracking progress? I realize Data will be mostly none existent for big distances on the routes.
> 
> Thanks, I appreciate your responses and collected wisdom!


*********************************
Going to Amazon, Uniden has some scanners for around $100. E-Bay has some used scanners for much less.

If interested, you might want to consider getting an amateur radio technician license. The cost, I think, is $15 and many amateur radio clubs, across the country, will have volunteers to give you a 35 question exam. You can also take the exam online. The exam isn't hard to pass, with sample questions available on line.

2 meter hand held amateur transceiver will pick up ham frequencies as well as the radio frequencies used by trains and Amtrak. They are a few not much more than $100 (Ham Radio Outlet). I like to take along a 2 meter hand-held when I book an Amtrak sleeper. You can get a booklet listing 2 meter repeaters in your state. A lot of fun to talk to hams from your sleeping compartment.


TinCan782 said:


> You can get a scanner for something around $100 that is more than adequate for receiving the railroad frequencies. The so-called "NASCAR" scanners will do the job. Even with the stock "rubber ducky" antenna, you are close enough to receive the engineer and conductor and most dispatchers use various mountain-top "repeaters" or remote bases to communicate with the trains. Most of the time, you will be able to copy the dispatcher as well. I use a suction-cup mount antenna mounted in the window; my handheld Garmin GPS is also connected to an external antenna hanging on a suction cup in the window.
> 
> A lot of "silence" will be heard but over time, you will hear the trackside defect detectors (heard one "catch" us a couple of times); conversation when the air line parts and the train comes to a sudden stop. On the SWC several years ago, the dispatcher relayed a flash flood warning to the engineer while we were in SE Colorado/NE New Mexico. The rain was pounding down on us! Last October on the Coast Starlight near Ventura as we came to a sudden stop (you could hear the air being dumped) the engineer radioed the standard "Emergency, emergency, emergency" to alert the dispatcher and possible nearby trains (we struck a trespasser).
> 
> ...




*****************************
I like the photo of your scanner setup in your sleeper, John. I have found just a "rubber duck" antenna, attached to my 2 meter hand-held, can work well for repeater access or train communication reception much of the time. Depending, of course, on the distance of the repeater from your train.

Here is a list of frequencies used by specific Amtrak trains:





__





Railroad Radio Frequencies


A list of radio channels and frequencies used by railroads, including those used by Amtrak.



is.gd





73's,

Richard


TinCan782 said:


> You can get a scanner for something around $100 that is more than adequate for receiving the railroad frequencies. The so-called "NASCAR" scanners will do the job. Even with the stock "rubber ducky" antenna, you are close enough to receive the engineer and conductor and most dispatchers use various mountain-top "repeaters" or remote bases to communicate with the trains. Most of the time, you will be able to copy the dispatcher as well. I use a suction-cup mount antenna mounted in the window; my handheld Garmin GPS is also connected to an external antenna hanging on a suction cup in the window.
> 
> A lot of "silence" will be heard but over time, you will hear the trackside defect detectors (heard one "catch" us a couple of times); conversation when the air line parts and the train comes to a sudden stop. On the SWC several years ago, the dispatcher relayed a flash flood warning to the engineer while we were in SE Colorado/NE New Mexico. The rain was pounding down on us! Last October on the Coast Starlight near Ventura as we came to a sudden stop (you could hear the air being dumped) the engineer radioed the standard "Emergency, emergency, emergency" to alert the dispatcher and possible nearby trains (we struck a trespasser).
> 
> ...




***********************************************************
I like those pictures of your scanner set-up in your sleeper! Yes, bring along an earbud or earphone as to not disturb your neighbor in the sleeper next door. The walls are thin.

I have had pretty good luck accessing and hearing repeaters with just a rubber duck antenna attached to the 2 meter hand-held. Of course, it depends on the distance of the repeater from the train.

Here is a list of communication frequencies for specific Amtrak trains:





__





Railroad Radio Frequencies


A list of radio channels and frequencies used by railroads, including those used by Amtrak.



is.gd
 




73's,
Richard


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## piedpiper (Apr 28, 2022)

Eric in East County said:


> You seemed to have organized your *Amtrak* frequencies in a most efficient manner. (Do you actually ride on all of these trains?) We use three trains: the *Pacific Surfliner*, the *Southwest Chief*, and the *Capitol Limited* when we travel from San Diego to Ohio and back. Between the three of them, they only use 30 different frequencies, and I’ve combined them all into a single bank on my scanner. (When we're traveling, I keep all of the other banks locked out.) I do have ALL of the AAR Channels programmed into another bank just in case.
> 
> Your post also helps to emphasize a very good point, mainly that one doesn’t need to spend a lot of money to obtain a perfectly adequate scanner for taking along on train trips. Being able to listen in on conversations between our train’s crew members, conversations between dispatchers and the engineer, and the periodic reports from radio alarm detectors always makes our trips more interesting. We consider a scanner to be one of the essentials to have along whenever we travel by train. With all the bargain priced scanners to be had on eBay, there is no reason why anyone who wants one can’t have one.


I have riden on more than 2/3's of the routes as shown in my signature.


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## Devil's Advocate (Apr 28, 2022)

My main use of a scanner is on road trips where I leave it scanning the AAR bank and when it starts making noise I know I'm somewhere near a train. If I see something interesting (bridge, tunnel, yard) maybe I'll park in the area for a bit and listen for anything heading my way. Although I have taken my scanner on Amtrak trips I rarely hear anything interesting that is not communicated over the PA. Usually it's one defect detector after another. Another issue is that I often only hear one side of the conversation or get stuck trying to decipher industry jargon through a southern drawl. Now that topics like where to get a scanner and what to program are pretty well covered I'm wondering if we can get a primer on buying a better antenna and understanding the terminology?


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## NorthShore (Apr 28, 2022)

Northwestern said:


> *********************************
> Going to Amazon, Uniden has some scanners for around $100. E-Bay has some used scanners for much less.
> 
> If interested, you might want to consider getting an amateur radio technician license. The cost, I think, is $15 and many amateur radio clubs, across the country, will have volunteers to give you a 35 question exam. You can also take the exam online. The exam isn't hard to pass, with sample questions available on line.
> ...



The FCC recently imposed a 35 dollar fee (on top of any testing fees for initial licensure) to every application for license or 10 year renewal.


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## zephyr17 (Apr 28, 2022)

Personally I do fine with the factory rubber ducky antenna, because I am mostly interested in the train I am on. Sometimes the dispatcher conversations are one sided (can't hear the dispatcher), but most anything important from the dispatcher side must be repeated back by the engineer, so I know I will catch it then.

I think I finally understand your antipathy to scanners if you just scan all AAR frequencies. You would get a LOT of extraneous stuff doing that if you are only interested in the operation of your train. Things like the yardmaster talking to someone kicking cars on a yard frequency, freight trains on another railroad entirely, tones and squeals on PBX channels (if there are are any PBX channels still in use). That is why I keep my scanner locked on the current road channel 95% of the time.

There actually isn't that much industry jargon (or I am so immersed in it that I don't notice it as jargon).

The main ones are calling signals, calling slow orders, calling work gangs. On non-CTC lines, such as much of the former SP Coast Line, they will do track warrents over the radio for permission to occupy main track.

Almost all railroads require calling less than clear signal indications, some require calling ALL signal indications (LA's Metrolink comes to mind). The call includes the location which can either be a milepost number or a station name (the proper definition of "station" being a named point on the railroad), such as:
"Advance approach at Ridgefield"

There are a LOT of signal indications, and they vary a little by railroad, I won't list them here. One general rule is any indication with the word "approach" in it means you are approaching a restricted or stop indication somewhere ahead. If they are calling anything less than "clear" you are either following something, about to meet something, or taking a diverging route (diverging routes include sidings or crossing over on multiple main track, as well as taking a different line, such as the Point Defiance Bypass). There are few places where there are permanent than clear indications just to control speed, though.

When talking signals, there are "aspects" which is what the signal is displaying, "red over yellow" and the indication, its meaning, "diverging approach". Sometimes crews call aspects, the majority of the time they call indication.

Calling slow orders is simple, speed and milepost number. "We have a 10 between 352.2 and 352.6" 10 mph slow order between milepost 352.2 and 352.6.

Work gangs, "Amtrak train 11, Calling foreman Smith at Ridgefield." "Foreman Smith, Amtrak train 11, we are in the clear, permission to pass work zone at Ridgefield, track speed, bells and horn".

Trains are officially identified by lead engine number and direction. Amtrak can be somewhat of an exception because they can be informally identified by train number (which had no standing for the host railroad). Official track warrents from the dispatcher will always use the lead engine and direction, "Antrak 42 South". Less formal communication may use the Amtrak train number, or the unit and direction or both. "Amtrak train 11, AMTK 42 South". One UP dispatcher on the Coast Line had the cute habit of calling Amtrak units "Am-tiki", a play on Amtrak's AMTK.

In the clear means no person or equipment is fouling the track. Track speed is maximum authorized speed for that section of track.

The conductor often will acknowledge a signal call by clicking his transmit button a couple times without saying anything. For detectors, sometimes both the engineer and conductor both just click.

Other various things that come to mind, on a station highball, they will usually say "Highball Hicktown on signal indication" or "Highball Hicktown DIB". DIB means Delayed in Block, which means that a signal is not visible from where they are, and they cannot proceed based on the last signal indication because they stopped and things might have changed in the interim. So they have to proceed at restricted speed (able to stop with half the range of vision) until another signal becomes visible.

Another thing that comes to mind is blue flag, which means someone is working on the train and the train cannot be moved at all. Only the worker that placed a blue flag can remove it. Most of the time they aren't fabric flags, but small blue metal sheets on a pole. More durable.


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## Alice (Apr 28, 2022)

DA, I use a gps for road trips. I have an elderly Garmin that allows me to input my own POIs. I downloaded a list of all grade crossings in California into a spreadsheet, manipulated it to the format Garmin requires, and uploaded it into the gps. I set it to sound whenever I am near one of the crossings. Every time I update the Garmin it erases what I've done so I have to re-upload, a nuisance. This is the CA list, other states should have something similar. It is particularly useful when UP steam comes through here.


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## zephyr17 (Apr 28, 2022)

One thing to remember is much of what you hear has been written in blood, a legacy of injury and death over 180 years of railroading, some of it recent.

The Delayed in Block rule is recent and adopted as a result of a commuter train coming out of a station stop that it had entered on a clear and ramming a freight train. LA's Metrolink (SCRRA) requires calling ALL signal indications as a direct result of the Chatsworth wreck.


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## AmtrakWPK (Apr 28, 2022)

mcropod said:


> It also let me operate in kilometres and kph rather than having to try to make sense of the bushels, or farenheit, or ounces, or whatever it is that you lot use to measure distance and speed.


I calibrate mine in furlongs per fortnight. <grin>


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## AmtrakWPK (Apr 28, 2022)

" Scanners are receivers and not transmitting devices - can't mess with transmissions "

That's not strictly true. Any superheterodyne receiver contains at least one RF oscillator to convert down to an IF. That oscillator WILL leak RF, and that DOES qualify as a transmitter as it would be detectable beyond the radio itself. If it is poorly designed and/or built, and a lot of the Chinese radios ARE, that leakage COULD be sufficiently strong to interfere with nearby equipment. I'm a ham (55 years) and a pilot (47 years). Many of the really cheap Chinese-built ham handheld radios have incredibly dirty transmitters - as few <5% of one manufacturer's radios that were tested met FCC spectrum purity regulations. You're talking about just receivers, of course, but the quality of their engineering design and production is still relevant. 
So if an aircraft cabin attendant says turn off ALL electronic devices, IT INCLUDES THAT SCANNER.


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## MIrailfan (Apr 28, 2022)

Is ebay a good place to buy one?


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## WWW (Apr 28, 2022)

Do a Google Search - Railroad Scanners
Research the market - eBay ain't the only game out there
Check out buying one direct with all the goody channels already installed - CD download etc.

Check on POWER requirements - battery (rechargeable internal/battery pack) - AC transformer - USB operable

Consider if your travel is on other than trains - airplanes - cruise ships - marine traffic - police/fire/ambulance
Beware some of these modes have restrictions about use - obviously police for one 

I have purchased a Radio Shack Pro 2051 on eBay - everything was perfect just as described and price was in the ball park.
BID - and won - everything about it almost new in box - looked the seller found it complicated to program - - -
The Pro 2051 is a base unit (not a portable) therefore has a limited range of reception from my house - works great for aviation -
police/fire calls are now encrypted so not so good in that respect.
I also bought a Radio Shack Pro 164 for travel trips entertainment - this too from eBay awhile back 
The Pro 164 is a handy talkie multi trunking channel unit - a devil to program - but once that is done - it has interchangeable antennas -
rubber ducky for travel and fixed based coaxil cable for the house mounted unit - really improves reception.

ABOUT EBAY - check the sellers business ratings - careful if he has a lot of complaints - inquire about return if something isn't right

Retired an old Radio Shack Realistic brand Pro-30 - missed the easier to program key board - but it is a BIG log to haul around.

Both of these portables are quite loud in volume so agree definitely plan on ear phones when used in a public place.
Sadly there is not as much chatter these days unless something dramatic is happening or one is a high transit travel area - railroad junction
railroad yard etc. - on the rails - clickety clack - mile post no defects - Alaska RR wildlife alert - great when leaving i.e. Chicago or big city.
Crews are not so talkative except for strictly business.


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## TinCan782 (May 2, 2022)

Here are a couple of links that specifically discuss the use of scanners and monitoring railroads. Commonly shared here is On Track On Line's listing of frequencies for each Amtrak route (On Track On Line - Amtrak Radio Frequencies) but, they also have more general info regarding scanners here: On Track On Line - Scanner Radio

Scannermaster (an online retailer) also provides some general information on the subject here... Scanning the Railroads By Richard Carlson | Scanner Master

Radio Reference has a discussion forum specifically for discussing the monitoring of railroad communications. Railroad/Railfan Monitoring Forum


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## TinCan782 (May 2, 2022)

Another common question and resulting discussion is the use of scanner "apps" vs an actual radio scanner.




__





Radio Scanner versus Online Police Scanner | Scanner Master Blog






www.scannermasterblog.com





The website Radio Reference has these (and more) discussions as well...








phone app vs hand held scanner


What are the pro's and con's of having a handheld vs using a phone app to listen.




forums.radioreference.com












Real Scanner vs Phone App Scanner


I’m new to the scanner scene and know very little, so I apologize in advance for what is going to seem like a stupid question. I’m so new I do not even have a scanner yet. I’ve done a little research on scanners and, right or wrong, I believe either the Whistler TRX-1 or the Uniden BCD436HP...




forums.radioreference.com





Hope this helps some better understand the difference between and app and an actual scanner.


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## dan (May 21, 2022)

is this the best scanner:





Uniden Bearcat BC125AT Handheld Scanner, 500-Alpha-Tagged... ​​


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## TinCan782 (May 21, 2022)

dan said:


> is this the best scanner:
> 
> 
> ​
> ...


That particular scanner is more than adequate for RR scanning.


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## UserNameRequired (Aug 18, 2022)

Halpin-CP 175039160.695BNSFCP 1750-Galesburg51160.875BNSF

So, between Halpin (Albia, IA) and Galesburg IL we have "CP 1750". How does one figure out where/what CP 1750 is?


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## TinCan782 (Aug 18, 2022)

UserNameRequired said:


> Halpin-CP 175039160.695BNSFCP 1750-Galesburg51160.875BNSF
> 
> So, between Halpin (Albia, IA) and Galesburg IL we have "CP 1750". How does one figure out where/what CP 1750 is?


What route is this?
The "1750" is likely the mile post (location). CP is "control point", typically a switch at a siding, junction, etc.
First, as you travel keep an eye out for mile post (MP) markers and signal placards (the signal number is actually the MP). The fourth digit is the decimal mile so, a MP of 175.0 would be displayed as 1750 (no decimal)
Second, listening to the scanner to catch the engineer radioing the conductor to change channels. In your example above that would be either 39 or 51 depending on direction of travel. It is easy to miss those transmissions!


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## zephyr17 (Aug 18, 2022)

UserNameRequired said:


> Halpin-CP 175039160.695BNSFCP 1750-Galesburg51160.875BNSF
> 
> So, between Halpin (Albia, IA) and Galesburg IL we have "CP 1750". How does one figure out where/what CP 1750 is?


General Answer :CP 1750 means Control Point 1750. The 1750 almost certain refers to a milepost location, which is probably at or near MP 1750 or MP 175.0. Get your hands on an employee timetable and/or scout the subdivision.

Specific answer:
You got that off OTOL for the CZ. In this case, CP 1750 translates to MP 175.0. The road channel goes from channel 51 for the Galesburg terminal area, which is quite busy, and the distance on that channel is quite short. MP 175.0 is not far west of Galesburg, probably just past Cameron where the Junction with the former AT&SF mainline is and where the SW Chief peels off the former Burlington.

Scan both channels after leaving Galesburg westbound, and about 20 minutes or so before Galesburg eastbound. Or listen for "Roll to 39/roll to 51" from the crew.

Remember the OTOL frequencies are crowdsourced from scanner enthusiasts and are not always up to date based on who is riding and reporting. It is a good reference but not a perfect one, so be prepared to do a broad AAR channel scan to relocate the road channel if you lose it.


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## UserNameRequired (Aug 19, 2022)

Thanks! That helps, yes CZ. 

Is there a phraseology standard manual for engineer/conductor? (like in the air we have the manuals Pilot/Controller Glossary, AIM Chap 4 Sec 2, JO 7110.65Z ATC)


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## TinCan782 (Aug 19, 2022)

UserNameRequired said:


> Thanks! That helps, yes CZ.
> 
> Is there a phraseology standard manual for engineer/conductor? (like in the air we have the manuals Pilot/Controller Glossary, AIM Chap 4 Sec 2, JO 7110.65Z ATC)


Not specifically communications but, the closest might be the General Code of Operating Rules (GCOR). It covers pretty much everthing related to operating trains including a section on "Railroad Radio and Communications Rules".




__





General Code of Operating Rules - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org





You pretty much just have to become familiar with the lingo!


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## zephyr17 (Aug 19, 2022)

UserNameRequired said:


> Thanks! That helps, yes CZ.
> 
> Is there a phraseology standard manual for engineer/conductor? (like in the air we have the manuals Pilot/Controller Glossary, AIM Chap 4 Sec 2, JO 7110.65Z ATC)


Not generally. There are a few, like I understand use of the word "Stop" is now mandated, the traditional "That'll do" is now insufficient by itself and a rules violation. "That'll do. Stop" is more commonly heard than a simple "Stop" in my experience, though.

"Roll to" the new channel is fairly common. "Go to" is, too. Just "Roll channel" without mentioning channel number is not unknown. They know what it ought to be. On the other end just the channel number is heard, too.

Shortest exchange:
Engineer: "22"
Conductor: (click)

Colorful exchange:
Engineer: "Roll Deuces"
Conductor: "Rolling Deuces"

I don't know if use of the traditional "Highball" is mandated, but it is certainly used almost universally.

On leaving Salem:
Conductor: "Highball Salem on signal indication!"
Engineer: "Highball!"


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## TinCan782 (Aug 19, 2022)

zephyr17 said:


> Not generally. There are a few, like I understand use of the word "Stop" is now mandated, the traditional "That'll do" is now insufficient by itself and a rules violation. "That'll do. Stop" is more commonly heard than a simple "Stop" in my experience, though.
> 
> "Roll to" the new channel is fairly common. "Go to" is, too. Just "Roll channel" without mentioning channel number is not unknown. They know what it ought to be. On the other end just the channel number is heard, too.
> 
> ...


Even simpler, "Lets roll"!


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## railiner (Aug 20, 2022)

I always liked: "Highball the dragger, Number Six"...conductor acknowledging to engineer that there were no defects reported by trackside automatic dragging equipment detector.


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## TinCan782 (Aug 20, 2022)

When in a "restricting" (flashing red) situation, the train must remain at restricted speed until the next favorable signal - the train's leading wheels must reach the signal so, you will hear the term "leading wheels" over the air.
The more casual comment when calling the next signal while at restricted speed is, "Signal 2345, clear - when we get there!".


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## zephyr17 (Aug 20, 2022)

TinCan782 said:


> When in a "restricting" (flashing red) situation


A hard red is also a "restricting" indication on an intermediate/non absolute signal (one with a number plate on the mast) or an absolute with a "G" (for grade) plate. A hard red aspect is only a "stop" indication on an absolute signal without a "G" plate.

The differences between the meaning of what a seems to be simple, a hard red signal light, is a good illustration of the importance of the difference between signal "aspect" and "indication" .


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