# Boeing unveils the 777X in Dubai



## jis

Boeing unveiled its latest new aircraft, the 777X at the Dubai Airshow with over 250 firm orders and additional options in what is being termed as the largest new aircraft introduction. This together with other orders that Boeing received for the 737Max are said to be worth over $100 billion, yes with a "b"! Did someone on AU say recently that Boeing isn't doing well? I am sure many companies are wishing they were doing as poorly as Boeing today!







It has a new composite wing and fins similar to the one on the 787s, and all with front edge laminar flow just like on the 787. It also has a unique folding wingtip which allows it to fit into current standard airport gates.

See http://www.newairplane.com/email/wdt-launch/


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## Trogdor

I'm wishing I had held onto by Boeing stock a bit longer (sold it a little while ago when rebalancing my portfolio).

I was looking at their stock price today, and it has doubled in the past year (November 16, 2012, closing price was a little over $70, today it's at $136).


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## Swadian Hardcore

Is there anything out there about the 777-10X? Why the heck did Emirates order 150 planes?!


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## leemell

Boeing's order is worth more than $130B USD, the largest commercial launch in history.


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## chakk

Swadian Hardcore said:


> Is there anything out there about the 777-10X? Why the heck did Emirates order 150 planes?!


Emirates is making a name for itself by offer service between the USA and the Middle East (and even Asia?) via connections in Dubai. The 777-10x will allow them to do that at very economical operating costs--even on "thin" routes with not so many daily passengers.


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## railiner

I wonder how the development of the new super twins, both the 777X and the A350 will impact the future of the A380? It seems like there are few markets where the A380 would be the aircraft of choice for any airline...... :unsure:


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## Swadian Hardcore

How big is the 777-10X going to be? The proposed A380-900 is pretty much the only way to save the quads if the 777-10X can carry 80% the load of the A380-800 at much lower costs. AF already squeezed 472 pax into one version of their 777-300ER.


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## Fan Railer

there is no information on the -10x for the new 777 yet. anything you hear or read at this point is pure speculation.


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## Swadian Hardcore

I guess there's a reason why Boeing unveiled it at Dubai, considering Emirates.


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## Trogdor

Boeing has not unveiled the 777-10X, at Dubai or anywhere else, AFAIK.

There is the 787-10, of which there is plenty of information. The planes launched this week were the 777-8 and 777-9.


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## Trogdor

As for the A380, while Emirates was busy signing for 150 777s, they also decided to pick up a side-order of 50 A380s. This on top of the several dozen they already have in service or on order.


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## Texan Eagle

Swadian Hardcore said:


> I guess there's a reason why Boeing unveiled it at Dubai, considering Emirates.


Umm they unveiled it at the Dubai Air Show, one of the biggest aviation events of the year. It is only incidental that Emirates has a huge inaugural order for the 777-9X.


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## Texan Eagle

chakk said:


> Swadian Hardcore said:
> 
> 
> 
> Is there anything out there about the 777-10X? Why the heck did Emirates order 150 planes?!
> 
> 
> 
> Emirates is making a name for itself by offer service between the USA and the Middle East (and even Asia?) via connections in Dubai. The 777-10x will allow them to do that at very economical operating costs--even on "thin" routes with not so many daily passengers.
Click to expand...

It's not just Emirates that is doing the anywhere-to-anywhere-via-Middle East thing. There are other huge players out there too- Qatar Airways via Doha, Etihad via Abu Dhabi, Turkish Airlines via Istanbul (ok not technically Middle East but same concept), and on a smaller scale, Gulf Air via Bahrain, Kuwait Airways via Kuwait, Royal Jordanian via Amman... all of these airlines have created a niche for themselves using the same strategy- have just one HUGE hub airport and fly short, medium, long, ultralong routes in "banks" or "waves" that all hit the hub around the same time to passengers can conveniently transit from anywhere to anywhere.


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## Devil's Advocate

chakk said:


> Emirates is making a name for itself by offer service between the USA and the Middle East (and even Asia?) via connections in Dubai.


North America actually represents one of the few major markets that does not generally benefit from new connections through Dubai. Asia and Europe are providing lots of new traffic for Dubai, but Emirates has yet to make much of a dent in the North American market. They also pack in ten seats across widebody jets, which would seem to be a poor choice for transporting passengers from the fattest continent on Earth.



chakk said:


> The 777-10x will allow them to do that at very economical operating costs--even on "thin" routes with not so many daily passengers.


777's don't normally fly thin routes in scheduled service. At least not unless there is a considerable amount of high margin freight to be carried below the passenger cabin. In most cases if a route is able to support routine 777 services then it would cease to be a thin route.



railiner said:


> I wonder how the development of the new super twins, both the 777X and the A350 will impact the future of the A380? It seems like there are few markets where the A380 would be the aircraft of choice for any airline...... :unsure:


There are still plenty of poorly designed and/or poorly managed airports where flying the A380 is the only practical method to substantially increase passenger loads. Not to mention that the A380 generally offers the best passenger experience currently available in terms of noise, space, and comfort. Trust me when I say the A380 is here to stay.


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## Swadian Hardcore

Texan Eagle said:


> Swadian Hardcore said:
> 
> 
> 
> I guess there's a reason why Boeing unveiled it at Dubai, considering Emirates.
> 
> 
> 
> Umm they unveiled it at the Dubai Air Show, one of the biggest aviation events of the year. It is only incidental that Emirates has a huge inaugural order for the 777-9X.
Click to expand...

They could have lauched it at the Farnborough Air Show or the Paris Air Show. Just saying.


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## Trogdor

Swadian Hardcore said:


> Texan Eagle said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Swadian Hardcore said:
> 
> 
> 
> I guess there's a reason why Boeing unveiled it at Dubai, considering Emirates.
> 
> 
> 
> Umm they unveiled it at the Dubai Air Show, one of the biggest aviation events of the year. It is only incidental that Emirates has a huge inaugural order for the 777-9X.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> They could have lauched it at the Farnborough Air Show or the Paris Air Show. Just saying.
Click to expand...

Or they could have launched it in 1927.


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## xyzzy

Let's get the nomenclature straight. There hasn't been a 777-100 since the concept days of the program. It was dropped back then and has never been resurrected.

The 777-8X and 777-9X are collectively called the 777X. They use some technology from the 787 program. The 777X has the same fuselage width as the 777-200 and 777-300, but the 777X will have four inches more of cabin width (the interior sidewalls will be thinner).

The 787-10 is a very different aircraft.

I'm waiting to see which airline will go 11-abreast in the 777W...


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## Devil's Advocate

xyzzy said:


> The 777-8X and 777-9X are collectively called the 777X. They use some technology from the 787 program. The 777X has the same fuselage width as the 777-200 and 777-300, but the 777X will have four inches more of cabin width (the interior sidewalls will be thinner). The 787-10 is a very different aircraft. I'm waiting to see which airline will go 11-abreast in the 777W...


I'm guessing that Boeing is not confident they can make a fuselage as large as a 777 using carbon fiber in a timely fashion. Otherwise you'd think that would be their focus as most airlines have shown a strong and continuing preference for fuel savings. If 11 across gives us better legroom the so be it.


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## jis

I guess you could get to 11 abreast in the 777X by taking 1 inch from each seat and 1 inch from each aisle and add in the 4" of added inside cabin width to get another 16inch wide seat in. I don't see exactly how you can got to 11 abreast in a 7W. Emirates has talked about going to 11 abreast on A 380, not on the 7W.


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## xyzzy

Sorry that was a typo and should have read "which airline will go 11-abreast in the 777X" not the 77W, which refers to the 777-300. My bad. That said, it wouldn't surprise me if a charter operator eventually tries 4-3-4 in a 777-200 or 777-300.


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## Texan Eagle

xyzzy said:


> That said, it wouldn't surprise me if a charter operator eventually tries 4-3-4 in a 777-200 or 777-300.


No airline can go 4-3-4 because safety regulations dictate that every passenger on the plane should be no more than 2 seats away from an aisle for evacuation. 4-3-4 would put the window seat passengers 3 seats away. The only way you can do 11 across is 3-5-3. You could technically do 2-6-3 but I don't see why anyone would want to do that.


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## Devil's Advocate

Texan Eagle said:


> xyzzy said:
> 
> 
> 
> That said, it wouldn't surprise me if a charter operator eventually tries 4-3-4 in a 777-200 or 777-300.
> 
> 
> 
> No airline can go 4-3-4 because safety regulations dictate that every passenger on the plane should be no more than 2 seats away from an aisle for evacuation. 4-3-4 would put the window seat passengers 3 seats away. The only way you can do 11 across is 3-5-3. You could technically do 2-6-3 but I don't see why anyone would want to do that.
Click to expand...

No airline anywhere?

In some countries you can still smoke, leave your seat belt undone, and even enter the flight deck while in flight.

Not on flights to or from the US or Europe, or on aircraft registered there, but there are exceptions here and there.


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## xyzzy

Having flown domestically in China and seen what is accepted there, I do not assume that 4-3-4 is impossible everywhere. But 3-5-3 would be just as tight from the passenger perspective.


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## Swadian Hardcore

I think if airlines start going 11-abreast on any plane, it's going to be 3-5-3 because that elimilates the windows seats from being separated 3 seats away from the aisle. It's just a better config, many airlines did fine with 3-4-3 and 2-5-2, so if you mix those two together, you get a practical 3-5-3. Poosibly with 16.5"seat width.


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## Texan Eagle

xyzzy said:


> Having flown domestically in China and seen what is accepted there, I do not assume that 4-3-4 is impossible everywhere. But 3-5-3 would be just as tight from the passenger perspective.


Well if you want to throw rules to the wind, then why stop at 11-across? If you can do 11-across with two aisles, what is stopping you from doing 12-across with a single aisle in a 6-6 configuration?


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## Devil's Advocate

Texan Eagle said:


> xyzzy said:
> 
> 
> 
> Having flown domestically in China and seen what is accepted there, I do not assume that 4-3-4 is impossible everywhere. But 3-5-3 would be just as tight from the passenger perspective.
> 
> 
> 
> Well if you want to throw rules to the wind, then why stop at 11-across? If you can do 11-across with two aisles, what is stopping you from doing 12-across with a single aisle in a 6-6 configuration?
Click to expand...

Hmm. I've never seen a single block of six seats before, so I'm guessing you'd need to pay a special order design and manufacturing fee for that. Considering the cost of conventional aircraft seats that's likely to be quite an outlay. I'm also wondering how you'd get the seats to fasten to the floor properly since every widebody jet I've ever flown appeared to be specifically designed and equipped for two aisles. Interesting idea, but my guess is that there's more than just a few rules preventing airlines from installing seats in a 6x6 layout. Would be quite a sight to behold though. Personally I don't think we'll see anything like that until the scientifically superior but perceptively inferior "flying wing" design finally makes its debut.


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## xyzzy

First I'd want to hear from a B-2 pilot about the stability of that aircraft in turbulence and convection. No passenger wants to fly in a "vomit comet". But that's getting off topic...


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## Swadian Hardcore

I think Turkish Airlines will be wanting to buy a lot of these new 777's. They're expanding at a fast rate and Istanbul is the world's second-largest city, plus their location offers good connections to the Middle East, Northeast Africa, and Southeast Europe, expecially with the demise of Olympic and the troubles of Egyptair.

Now if only they could remedy their safety problems and labour issues.


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