# North East Corridor (NEC) night train and sleeper journey



## Tlcooper93 (Apr 8, 2021)

Just wanted to share a few thoughts and pictures from my overnight journey from BOS - WAS on the inaugural return of sleeper cars to the NE Regional 65-67.
I would put this in the trip reports, but I thought it might spark additional conversation.
Miles in Transit (who had a roomette next to mine booked only from BOS to BBY) has a video out.

Arriving at South Station and being able to wait in the lounge is a plus. Amtrak lounges are great, and often staffed by wonderful people. This was no exception.
They offered to check my bags, but I did not have any luggage aside from my instrument and backpack.

The sleeper car was the first car at the front of the train, so it was quite a walk, especially since tracks have been shortened at SS due to construction. I must admit, the cars are old, but from the outside, they look great!





I am sorry to report the my roomette was dirty when I arrived. The floor had not been thoroughly vacuumed, and while the seats were clean, the table and all other surfaces had to be wiped down. This was different from my November trip aboard the Cal Zephyr, which was overall a well cleaned room and pleasant trip.
The train departed and arrived on time, and station stops were exactly as planned, with the exception of New Haven, which lasted longer than scheduled. I was genuinely surprised how well patronized the train was, especially at the Providence stop. About 50 people boarded the train there.

In the morning, the "continental breakfast" they offered was abysmal. It was a cracker, a muffin, with a bottle of Fiji water (the best thing in the box) with a Kind Breakfast bar. The box they offer is identical on the outside to the Acela First Class "snack box," just much worse.

My experience at Union Station was positive, though the Acela Lounge there is quite a letdown. I expected cleaner seats (crumbs were all over some of them) and cleaner bathrooms (someone left the men's room a mess in more ways than one).

My Acela return journey after brief business in DC was great. The train was on time every step of the way, and Amtrak's Acela product is obviously fine tuned and very good. I would say business class offers the best value, as first class really is not much different with the exception of food (but during covid times, there's basically no difference). It was especially fun to take advantage of the 20 minute NYP stop and check out the new station.





By far the biggest let down of the sleeper train however, is the full volume diatribes the took place at every single major stop throughout the journey (the worst was NYP; that announcement lasted 2 minutes).
How is anyone in the sleeper car supposed to get consistent sleep. I doubt anyone who books a sleeper car is getting out at any of the intermediate destinations (especially NYP).
Doesn't Amtrak have a moratorium on announcements after 9 p.m.? I know that this train is technically a corridor train, but when I last road the sleeper version in 2001, there were no announcements after New London.

Overall a big disappointment, despite this being a much desired service. Will I take it again? Definitely. Will I recommend it? Maybe not to everyone.
Thoughts on the announcements and food service?


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## me_little_me (Apr 8, 2021)

Just so typically Amtrak. Come out with a new product and just plain screw it up with poor food, dirty rooms and loud announcements for an overnight train on its inaugural run. If it fails, some exec at Amtrak will probably say "See, I knew it wouldn't work. We shouldn't have listened to those whiners on A.U. and the low level employee who proposed the idea. Let's fire him so we have someone to blame".


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## jiml (Apr 8, 2021)

Thank you for the report. As a previous sleeping car patron on this route I've been watching the return of the service with interest. Some of your pics are outstanding. I'm curious about the one - the bed wasn't made up when you boarded? Seems counter-productive on Amtrak's part.


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## Bob Dylan (Apr 8, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> Just wanted to share a few thoughts and pictures from my overnight journey from BOS - WAS on the inaugural return of sleeper cars to the NE Regional 65-67.
> I would put this in the trip reports, but I thought it might spark additional conversation.
> Miles in Transit (who had a roomette next to mine booked only from BOS to BBY) has a video out.
> 
> ...


Not worth the Money till a better Breakfast is served, and Amtrak needs to "walk the walk"when it comes to cleaning the Cars!( Maybe even put a New Viewliner II on since the Is are getting so long in the tooth.

I'd think the Money would better be spent riding AcelaFC, but to each their own.

I too think the announcements should only be audible outside the Sleeper after 10pm, and always thought that the Bright Lights @ the Long NYP Layover were a PITA!


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## Cal (Apr 8, 2021)

I thought you could change the announcement volume in the VI's, that's a shame


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 8, 2021)

jiml said:


> Thank you for the report. As a previous sleeping car patron on this route I've been watching the return of the service with interest. Some of your pics are outstanding. I'm curious about the one - the bed wasn't made up when you boarded? Seems counter-productive on Amtrak's part.



I requested the top bunk. A decision I later regretted, as the upper mattress is too hard, the the PA system was right above my head.
And thank you!


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## niemi24s (Apr 8, 2021)

So checked baggage is offered at BOS for the 9 hour ride on this train to WAS but not for the 22 hour ride on the LSL to CHI.

Wunnerful - simply wunnerful!


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## jiml (Apr 8, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> I requested the top bunk. A decision I later regretted, as the upper mattress is too hard, the the PA system was right above my head.
> And thank you!


I don't do upper bunks anymore.


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## Night Ranger (Apr 8, 2021)

jiml said:


> I don't do upper bunks anymore.


I CAN"T do upper bunks anymore. Both knees, one shoulder and one hip replacement have eliminated that choice for me. I've done several trips back in the day when I could climb semi-gracefully into a top bunk but not any more.


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## Bob Dylan (Apr 8, 2021)

jiml said:


> I don't do upper bunks anymore.


I can still get into the Viewliner Roomette Upper,( which I prefer) but Superliner Roomette Uppers are " Cruel and Inhuman Punishment"!


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## MARC Rider (Apr 8, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> My experience at Union Station was positive, though the Acela Lounge there is quite a letdown. I expected cleaner seats (crumbs were all over some of them) and cleaner bathrooms (someone left the men's room a mess in more ways than one).



That's a real shame, I've used the Club Acela at Union Station for almost 10 years before I retired, and I never had a problem with cleanliness. My last trip was in January, and it was perfectly clean. In fact, I always thought that the bathrooms at the Club Acela at Union Station were one of the reasons I made sure to qualify for Select Plus every year. If you've ever used the public restrooms at Union Station, you'll know what I mean.

Did you let the attendant know there was a problem? They really can't be patrolling the space all the time, and it only takes one pig to mess things up.


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## MARC Rider (Apr 8, 2021)

niemi24s said:


> So checked baggage is offered at BOS for the 9 hour ride on this train to WAS but not for the 22 hour ride on the LSL to CHI.
> 
> Wunnerful - simply wunnerful!


What are you talking about? The Lake Shore Limited offers checked baggage between both Boston and New York to Chicago. Also to Springfield, Albany, Utica, Syracuse, Rochester, Buffalo, Cleveland, Toledo and South Bend.
Lake Shore Limited-New York-Boston-Chicago-October122020 (amtrak.com)
This is the October 2020 timetable, so I guess it's the most current.


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## brianpmcdonnell17 (Apr 8, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> What are you talking about? The Lake Shore Limited offers checked baggage between both Boston and New York to Chicago. Also to Springfield, Albany, Utica, Syracuse, Rochester, Buffalo, Cleveland, Toledo and South Bend.
> Lake Shore Limited-New York-Boston-Chicago-October122020 (amtrak.com)
> This is the October 2020 timetable, so I guess it's the most current.


That timetable is inaccurate; checked baggage service is no longer offered on the Boston section of the LSL.


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## Cal (Apr 8, 2021)

brianpmcdonnell17 said:


> That timetable is inaccurate; checked baggage service is no longer offered on the Boston section of the LSL.


Is it just because they haven't been running with a baggage car?


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## Just-Thinking-51 (Apr 8, 2021)

Cal said:


> Is it just because they haven't been running with a baggage car?


Yes, the lack of a baggage car is one of the reasons.


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## Cal (Apr 8, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> Yes, the lack of a baggage car is one of the reasons.


What are the others?


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## Just-Thinking-51 (Apr 9, 2021)

Mostly money.

Additionally staff on board (one conductor per three cars.), staff at stations, weight of the car (fuel use, extra locomotive). Maintenance of equipment, both train and station. The cost of the equipment to provide the service.

A strong desire to make it harder to use the long distance trains. (Conspiracy theory)


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## bratkinson (Apr 9, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> Mostly money. Additionally staff on board (one conductor per three cars.)



Unless things have changed since Covid, every time I've ridden #448/449 ALB-SPG or BOS-SPG (I live in the Springfield area), there's been both a conductor and an assistant conductor to handle 'all those passengers' in the 2 coaches. Maybe they've cut back due to low passenger counts? I don't know what the union staffing rules are for a 4 car train, but given I regularly ride the 2-car 'shuttle' SPG-NHV, I would surmise that a conductor and A/C are the minimum staffing for any Amtrak train.

I'll be in the sleeper on #67 next week. I'm hoping it's in the rear of the train like it should be and was back in it's previous incarnations (I rode it a couple times). If not, I'll venture they've cut back on expenses and don't turn the train at BOS. Perhaps they stopped turning it at NPN as well as I suspect the sleeper is not switched out at WAS, only vacated, to save switching costs.


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## ehbowen (Apr 9, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> Yes, the lack of a baggage car is one of the reasons.


That's just lack of will. There is always a way to do it if you want to. I remember when the Houston section of the _Texas Eagle_. was still running. They didn't have a baggage car, either...but they offered checked baggage. They used the A/C equipment space at the end of the Superliner Cafe/Coach to hold the checked baggage. I realize that Amfleets and Viewliners don't have this same space, but an analogue could be found if they really wanted to. For example, they could place a VL roomette Out Of Service and use it to hold the checked bags. It's not like they need to offer checked bags to intermediate points; just having Albany and Boston (in that section) would suffice.


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 9, 2021)

bratkinson said:


> Unless things have changed since Covid, every time I've ridden #448/449 ALB-SPG or BOS-SPG (I live in the Springfield area), there's been both a conductor and an assistant conductor to handle 'all those passengers' in the 2 coaches. Maybe they've cut back due to low passenger counts? I don't know what the union staffing rules are for a 4 car train, but given I regularly ride the 2-car 'shuttle' SPG-NHV, I would surmise that a conductor and A/C are the minimum staffing for any Amtrak train.
> 
> I'll be in the sleeper on #67 next week. I'm hoping it's in the rear of the train like it should be and was back in it's previous incarnations (I rode it a couple times). If not, I'll venture they've cut back on expenses and don't turn the train at BOS. Perhaps they stopped turning it at NPN as well as I suspect the sleeper is not switched out at WAS, only vacated, to save switching costs.



Sleeper is at front of train just behind baggage car for 66 as well, so I think it’s a permanent move.


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## Rasputin (Apr 9, 2021)

Cal said:


> What are the others?


All you really need to know is that 448 and 449 are the least respected trains in the Amtrak system. They get no respect. They used to offer good service but that has declined. I wouldn't be surprised if the sleeper will go next, followed by the cafe car. And then 448 and 449 will disappear but no one will notice.


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## Rasputin (Apr 9, 2021)

brianpmcdonnell17 said:


> That timetable is inaccurate; checked baggage service is no longer offered on the Boston section of the LSL.


I believe that technically you can check baggage in Boston for Chicago if you are travelling on the Lake Shore. The problem is that your baggage does not travel on the Boston section of the Lake Shore but goes to New York that night on 67 and then goes out on 49 the next day so there will be a slight delay in picking up your baggage.

The indication in the timetable that Springfield has checked baggage is incorrect as far as I know but corrections would be welcome.


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 9, 2021)

Rasputin said:


> All you really need to know is that 448 and 449 are the least respected trains in the Amtrak system. They get no respect. They used to offer good service but that has declined. I wouldn't be surprised if the sleeper will go next, followed by the cafe car. And then 448 and 449 will disappear but no one will notice.



This is largely because 448/49 (but especially the Boston leg) can't compete with any other form of travel on that route (even intermediate cities), and it doesn't offer a service that would make it worth it. The train is late most of the time and has terrible service. It is already far too long a train ride, so a very small portion of passengers use the train to get from either end to the other.

I went to school in Oberlin close to the Elyria stop and would have gladly taken a train from South Station, but the whole Cleveland area has terrible stop times (in early morning around 3-4am), and it just wasn't worth the 16 hours aboard the train. A ticket in coach might be worth it if buses didn't provide faster and cheaper service to KCLE area.


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## edolan (Apr 9, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> Just wanted to share a few thoughts and pictures from my overnight journey from BOS - WAS on the inaugural return of sleeper cars to the NE Regional 65-67.
> I would put this in the trip reports, but I thought it might spark additional conversation.
> Miles in Transit (who had a roomette next to mine booked only from BOS to BBY) has a video out.
> 
> ...



If you wanted to go past WAS would you just book two tickets: one sleeper to WAS and one coach to NPN — because if you try to book BOS to NPN it says the sleeper is sold out for all dates... certainly would want to get a sleeper for as much of the journey as possible. Also — if the sleeper stays on the train in WAS would they let you just stay in your room?


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## fdaley (Apr 9, 2021)

Very disappointing to read this. The Viewliner rooms used to have a volume control that you could use to turn down the announcements. I always set it to zero to avoid being awakened, figuring the SCA or crew would knock on the door if there was something really important to communicate. But in more recent years I've found the volume control either missing or not working on many trips. 

There is no way I would want to book a sleeper room on this train if I'm going to be awakened by announcements at New York. The whole point is to be able to sleep through NYP. 

And there's really no excuse for not having the room clean at the point of origin.


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## joelkfla (Apr 9, 2021)

Have the volume controls been disabled for safety reasons?

If not, there's also no excuse for not repairing or replacing a simple rheostat.


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## jis (Apr 9, 2021)

fdaley said:


> And there's really no excuse for not having the room clean at the point of origin.


It is Southampton Street! 'nugh said. They tried their level best for a long time to try to avoid having to deal with a Sleeper on the Boston Section of the LSL. And now *shudder* they have to deal with Sleepers on two trains. Probably throwing a passive-aggressive hissy-fit.


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## Cal (Apr 9, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> This is largely because 448/49 (but especially the Boston leg) can't compete with any other form of travel on that route (even intermediate cities), and it doesn't offer a service that would make it worth it. The train is late most of the time and has terrible service. It is already far too long a train ride, so a very small portion of passengers use the train to get from either end to the other.
> 
> I went to school in Oberlin close to the Elyria stop and would have gladly taken a train from South Station, but the whole Cleveland area has terrible stop times (in early morning around 3-4am), and it just wasn't worth the 16 hours aboard the train. A ticket in coach might be worth it if buses didn't provide faster and cheaper service to KCLE area.


I thought it was pretty popular, and I've seen many people on here say there should be a second frequency..


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 9, 2021)

edolan said:


> If you wanted to go past WAS would you just book two tickets: one sleeper to WAS and one coach to NPN — because if you try to book BOS to NPN it says the sleeper is sold out for all dates... certainly would want to get a sleeper for as much of the journey as possible. Also — if the sleeper stays on the train in WAS would they let you just stay in your room?


The sleeper is deadheaded to NPN, but one cant enter. There was a discussion about this not long ago, but I forget what the consensus was.
The sleeper attendant de trains at WAS.


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## west point (Apr 9, 2021)

Thought that the sleeper was removed added at WASH. That is the reason it is at front connected to the ACS-64.


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## Dakota 400 (Apr 9, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> Doesn't Amtrak have a moratorium on announcements after 9 p.m.?



I am remembering that I have heard an announcement that after 10:00 P. M. until 6:00 A. M. was "quiet time" on the train. I know I heard it on the Auto Train, but also on at least one or more of the Western LD trains.


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## MARC Rider (Apr 9, 2021)

ehbowen said:


> That's just lack of will. There is always a way to do it if you want to. I remember when the Houston section of the _Texas Eagle_. was still running. They didn't have a baggage car, either...but they offered checked baggage. They used the A/C equipment space at the end of the Superliner Cafe/Coach to hold the checked baggage. I realize that Amfleets and Viewliners don't have this same space, but an analogue could be found if they really wanted to. For example, they could place a VL roomette Out Of Service and use it to hold the checked bags. It's not like they need to offer checked bags to intermediate points; just having Albany and Boston (in that section) would suffice.


1) The Texas Eagle is a completely different story if it's using Superliner equipment, because they have some coaches with a baggage compartment. Thus, they can offer checked baggage without having a baggage car.
2) I've occasionally been able to look into the baggage cars on the trains (single level service) I've ridden that have them. Being the last car in the train, you can go to the rear sleeper or business class car and look through what used to be the "railfan window." There's a window on the access door the the V2 baggage cars, and so you can see right in. What I've seen is that the amount of checked baggage is miniscule. The vast majority of passengers, even on long-distance trains, just don't feel the need to check their bags. The carry-on allowance is pretty generous, and, although there are exceptions, if you're having trouble with handling your bags, the train staff will help you. The widespread adoption of roller bags has also made schlepping bags around less of a hassle. The only time I've ever checked baggage is when I'm bringing along skis and my winter gear bag, but really, I tend to take too much stuff on those trips. In other words, most passengers don't use checked baggage, so if the management feels they need to do something to save money, that seems like something they can afford to cut in order to keep the rest of the service going.


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## MARC Rider (Apr 9, 2021)

Dakota 400 said:


> I am remembering that I have heard an announcement that after 10:00 P. M. until 6:00 A. M. was "quiet time" on the train. I know I heard it on the Auto Train, but also on at least one or more of the Western LD trains.


Having ridden business class on 67 from Boston to Washington a number of times, I don't remember loud announcements, or any announcements at all, until, maybe Baltimore. The usually turn on the overhead lights somewhere between Baltimore and BWI. The train arrive in Baltimore some time around 6 AM. That's about 40 - 45 minutes before arrival in Washington.


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## me_little_me (Apr 9, 2021)

Rasputin said:


> All you really need to know is that 448 and 449 are the least respected trains in the Amtrak system. They get no respect. They used to offer good service but that has declined. I wouldn't be surprised if the sleeper will go next, followed by the cafe car. And then 448 and 449 will disappear but no one will notice.


So are they changing the name of that portion from LSL to RD (The Rodney Dangerfield)?


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## west point (Apr 9, 2021)

IMO the need for full baggage cars has times of needs.
1. During the Christmas time extra packages to relatives might increase the need ?
2. If Amtrak gets enough equipment and passenger demand for the train lengths to be in the 12 -13 revenue cars there will be enough checked bags to fill a full bag car ?.


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## NEPATrainTraveler (Apr 9, 2021)

Dakota 400 said:


> I am remembering that I have heard an announcement that after 10:00 P. M. until 6:00 A. M. was "quiet time" on the train. I know I heard it on the Auto Train, but also on at least one or more of the Western LD trains.



That's how it was on the LSL too when I rode it in 2018.


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## City of Miami (Apr 9, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> Mostly money.
> 
> Additionally staff on board (one conductor per three cars.), staff at stations, weight of the car (fuel use, extra locomotive). Maintenance of equipment, both train and station. The cost of the equipment to provide the service.
> 
> A strong desire to make it harder to use the long distance trains. (Conspiracy theory)


Beyond the obvious lack of baggage car the rest is pure conjecture imho and may or may not be true.


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## Seaboard92 (Apr 9, 2021)

I believe as a northeast regional No. 65/66/67 are under a different set of rules. Someone else will have to confirm this but I'm pretty certain that is the case. National Network trains have quiet hours.


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## Bob Dylan (Apr 9, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> 1) The Texas Eagle is a completely different story if it's using Superliner equipment, because they have some coaches with a baggage compartment. Thus, they can offer checked baggage without having a baggage car.
> 2) I've occasionally been able to look into the baggage cars on the trains (single level service) I've ridden that have them. Being the last car in the train, you can go to the rear sleeper or business class car and look through what used to be the "railfan window." There's a window on the access door the the V2 baggage cars, and so you can see right in. What I've seen is that the amount of checked baggage is miniscule. The vast majority of passengers, even on long-distance trains, just don't feel the need to check their bags. The carry-on allowance is pretty generous, and, although there are exceptions, if you're having trouble with handling your bags, the train staff will help you. The widespread adoption of roller bags has also made schlepping bags around less of a hassle. The only time I've ever checked baggage is when I'm bringing along skis and my winter gear bag, but really, I tend to take too much stuff on those trips. In other words, most passengers don't use checked baggage, so if the management feels they need to do something to save money, that seems like something they can afford to cut in order to keep the rest of the service going.


Why dont they put one of the New Bag Dorms on the Card and the LSL??


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## Just-Thinking-51 (Apr 9, 2021)

Bob Dylan said:


> Why dont they put one of the New Bag Dorms on the Card and the LSL??



Only 10 Dormitory/Baggage cars available. Two for the Cardinal, Three for the Lake Shore Limited. With the limited staff with these (any single level) trains, it a big empty car with few bags, and one or two crew.


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## ehbowen (Apr 10, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> 1) The Texas Eagle is a completely different story if it's using Superliner equipment, because they have some coaches with a baggage compartment. Thus, they can offer checked baggage without having a baggage car.



The Houston section of the _Texas Eagle_ was two cars...a Superliner coach (with lower level seating for ADA), and a coach/café (with the café on the lower level). No baggage compartment. As I said, they made do; they tucked the checked bags into the A/C equipment space between Dallas and Houston. They could do something similar between Albany and Boston if they really wanted to.


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## Just-Thinking-51 (Apr 10, 2021)

Effort is required. Multiple departments and personnel from different crafts, working at different locations. A lot of effort needed. The video of the guy doing a short hop on the first run, had audio of him having trouble getting into the lounge in South Boston. The guy had to spell it out for the attendant. A new service and a front line employee did not even know when it was to start. Someone failed to educate and train him. Simple 15 min job brief and he would be ready for the new service level.


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## niemi24s (Apr 10, 2021)

ehbowen said:


> The Houston section of the _Texas Eagle_ was two cars...a Superliner coach (with lower level seating for ADA), and a coach/café (with the café on the lower level). . . .They could do something similar between Albany and Boston if they really wanted to.


Could Superliner equipment get between ALB and BOS what with that one tunnel and the catenaries?


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## ehbowen (Apr 10, 2021)

niemi24s said:


> Could Superliner equipment get between ALB and BOS what with that one tunnel and the catenaries?


If you'll read back to where I originally commented, you'll see that I never suggested using Superliner equipment on the Boston section or anywhere on the LSL. I just brought that up to show that, if there's a will, there is a way. For this specific train, my suggestion was that they might put a roomette compartment out of service and use the space to store any checked bags. I still say that if they wanted to provide the service of checked baggage from Boston to Albany they could find a way to do it. But it appears that they don't.


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 10, 2021)

niemi24s said:


> Could Superliner equipment get between ALB and BOS what with that one tunnel and the catenaries?



I’ve always wondered whether superliners would clear the tunnels at BBY. If so, it would be really cool to see it. The equipment would be high unnecessary though.


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## railiner (Apr 10, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> I’ve always wondered weather superliners would clear the tunnels at BBY. If so, it would be really cool to see it. The equipment would be high unnecessary though.


That's a good question...to my knowledge, they haven't run any dome cars east of Albany. They used to deadhead them between Chicago and Albany for the Autumn service from Albany to Montreal on the Adirondack...


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## niemi24s (Apr 10, 2021)

Didn't know there were tunnels at BBY. The tunnel I was thinking of is the short one at CSX MP 164.8, about 1 mile SE of Canaan Center, New York.


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 10, 2021)

niemi24s said:


> Didn't know there were tunnels at BBY. The tunnel I was thinking of is the short one at CSX MP 164.8, about 1 mile SE of Canaan Center, New York.
> View attachment 21570


Good question. I had no idea that tunnel existed. I've never taken 449 out of Boston and the Worcerster Line doesn't get that far.
BBY is technically an underground station, with significant tunnels on the outbound ends of both lines.


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## brianpmcdonnell17 (Apr 10, 2021)

I think I remember reading somewhere on here a few years ago that Superliners could get from Albany to within Boston city limits, but wouldn't be able to get through Back Bay.


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## jiml (Apr 10, 2021)

brianpmcdonnell17 said:


> I think I remember reading somewhere on here a few years ago that Superliners could get from Albany to within Boston city limits, but wouldn't be able to get through Back Bay.


I've seen pics of those "squashed-looking" MBTA double-deckers in Back Bay, but they may be the limit height-wise. Even if not, the catenary might be a factor.


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## crescent-zephyr (Apr 10, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> With the limited staff with these (any single level) trains, it a big empty car with few bags, and one or two crew.



Cardinal has 2 in the “Cafe” plus 1 or 2 coach attendants at least. So minnimum is 4 crew. In theory you could put the sleeper SCA’s in the Dorm as well and free up an extra roomette or 2.


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 10, 2021)

jiml said:


> I've seen pics of those "squashed-looking" MBTA double-deckers in Back Bay, but they may be the limit height-wise. Even if not, the catenary might be a factor.


In my commute today aboard one of them, I checked the height and looked at clearence. They are shorter than Superliners, and they probably have only a half food of clearance in BBY and other tunnels.


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## Cal (Apr 10, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> In my commute today aboard one of them, I checked the height and looked at clearence. They are shorter than Superliners, and they probably have only a half food of clearance in BBY and other tunnels.


They were made so there could be bi-levels on the NEC where taller cars couldn't fit. I believe they were specifically for NYP, and then Marc and MBTA adapted variants too


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## Twinkletoes (Apr 10, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> This is largely because 448/49 (but especially the Boston leg) can't compete with any other form of travel on that route (even intermediate cities), and it doesn't offer a service that would make it worth it. The train is late most of the time and has terrible service. It is already far too long a train ride, so a very small portion of passengers use the train to get from either end to the other.
> 
> I went to school in Oberlin close to the Elyria stop and would have gladly taken a train from South Station, but the whole Cleveland area has terrible stop times (in early morning around 3-4am), and it just wasn't worth the 16 hours aboard the train. A ticket in coach might be worth it if buses didn't provide faster and cheaper service to KCLE area.


Hello fellow Obie.
I arrived at Oberlin by traveling from Chicago to Elyria. At the that the eastbound train got to Elyria in the middle of the afternoon. In later years when I returned for reunions I found the middle of the night business to be quite annoying. I've tried the train a few times in recent years to visit relatives in Cleveland, but hanging out in a minimalist box (nothing like the old Terminal Tower of yesteryear) with relatives who kindly brought you to the station and want to see you off on the journey to Boston (4 hours late the last time I did it) is not encouraging. I've often wondered why they don't shift the "scheduled" time to have Cleveland arrival and departures in the late morning or afternoon.


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## Just-Thinking-51 (Apr 10, 2021)

Yes we could use a better schedule, and more trains between Cleveland, Chicago, and the east coast. But even the low hanging fruit from a few years ago disappeared from Amtrak’s web site. Those route improvements plans order by Congress are not available.


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## IndyLions (Apr 11, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> 2) I've occasionally been able to look into the baggage cars on the trains (single level service) I've ridden that have them. Being the last car in the train, you can go to the rear sleeper or business class car and look through what used to be the "railfan window."



Here's a peek through the "Railfan Window" into the VLII Baggage Car on the Silver Meteor southbound in mid-March. Looks like pretty reasonable usage. As a cyclist - I also love all the bike racks. 

Also - notice the Fed Ex packages. I assume those are going / have gone away with the elimination of the Amtrak Express service.




And no, I didn't open the door illegally. The VLII Sleeper Railfan window was just especially clean. Crazy for Amtrak, I know.


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## jiml (Apr 11, 2021)

IndyLions said:


> Here's a peek through the "Railfan Window" into the VLII Baggage Car on the Silver Meteor southbound in mid-March. Looks like pretty reasonable usage. As a cyclist - I also love all the bike racks.
> 
> Also - notice the Fed Ex packages. I assume those are going / have gone away with the elimination of the Amtrak Express service.
> 
> ...


That certainly is the nicest baggage car I've ever seen. On my last VIA trip pre-Covid the luggage rack in the BC car was broken, so the attendant had us self-store and retrieve our own bags from the baggage car ahead of us. Quite the different interior.


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## PVD (Apr 11, 2021)

online data (not always 100% correct) shows the MBTA cars are around 8" less in height....


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## jis (Apr 11, 2021)

Cal said:


> They were made so there could be bi-levels on the NEC where taller cars couldn't fit. I believe they were specifically for NYP, and then Marc and MBTA adapted variants too


The MBTA and MARC (older) multi-levels are too tall for Penn Station and pre-date the NJT multi-levels specifically designed for Penn Station, which also happen to be the new multi-levels acquired by MARC using options from the original NJT order. Since then NJT has placed additional new orders, including for the Multi-Level Power Cars for converting the current collection of trailers into EMUs.

As a matter of fact, even multi-levels that fit Penn Station like the LIRR C-3s cannot be universally used in Penn Station. They cannot enter or exit through the Hudson Tunnels as there are additional clearance issues when entering or exiting on the diverging tracks at the entry to those from the Penn Station end. Only the NJT ones can fit through the more restrictive clearance.


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## IndyLions (Apr 11, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> Overall a big disappointment, despite this being a much desired service. Will I take it again? Definitely. Will I recommend it? Maybe not to everyone.



Sorry to hear that - but not surprised. The VLI's are pretty tired at this point - and will take extra effort by the staff to be "the best that they can be"...

As an optimist - I'm hopeful the staff morale will get a boost by the return of co-workers from furlough, as well as the talk of expanded Amtrak service. Yes - the plan is more underwhelming than it should be - but if I'm an employee I'm encouraged they are not just talking about route reductions and amenity cutbacks.

If this increased morale can result in increased effort in cleaning, maintenance, etc. - not to mention some incremental improvement in food service even on this route - maybe another report in about 6 months time could be significantly more positive.


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## Larry H. (Apr 12, 2021)

Amtrak has often ignored the cleaning crews work and let substandard work become the norm.. This falls on supervisory workers whom evidently don't pay much attention to the small details which often are where the work shows up as sloppy. I recall taking the Lake Shore out of NY City and the sleeper room I had was full of dirty foot prints on the furniture and generally grimy looking. I used to supervise cleaning in some retail establishments and always stressed looking for dirt and when you see it be sure you have removed it. I recall and old ad by the New York Central showing the extent to which crews cleaned the cars, it was an amazing group of cleaners seeing that the windows were clean, the seats all perfectly vacuumed, the aisles were spotless ect. Those days seem to have disappeared.


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## railiner (Apr 12, 2021)

Larry H. said:


> Amtrak has often ignored the cleaning crews work and let substandard work become the norm.. This falls on supervisory workers whom evidently don't pay much attention to the small details which often are where the work shows up as sloppy. I recall taking the Lake Shore out of NY City and the sleeper room I had was full of dirty foot prints on the furniture and generally grimy looking. I used to supervise cleaning in some retail establishments and always stressed looking for dirt and when you see it be sure you have removed it. I recall and old ad by the New York Central showing the extent to which crews cleaned the cars, it was an amazing group of cleaners seeing that the windows were clean, the seats all perfectly vacuumed, the aisles were spotless ect. Those days seem to have disappeared.


I agree. But, like most other area's of the railroad, including car and locomotive maintenance, track section gangs, station help, "ful crews" on freight trains, etc., they have replaced "armies" of workers, with just a few, aided in many cases by modern technology. It's all related to cost...


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## edolan (Apr 12, 2021)

Okay — this may sound a bit overkill — but I’m planning on a weekend trip on the corridor in the beginning of June to ride the sleeper on the « Night Owl » and to take advantage of the 2-for-1 sleeper deal. 

The plan is to take the southbound Silver Star on Saturday — spend about 6 hours in DC before taking the 66 « Night Owl » to Boston — spend about 5 hours there before taking the 165 Regional back to NY on Sunday.

The fare for my friend and I on the 66 goes from $300 + $138 for the roomette to $150 + $138 for the roomette. I feel like $150 is a pretty great savings for that segment. Thus, I feel slightly inclined to take full advantage of the roomette deal and book a new VLII roomette on the Silver Star for the short hop down to DC. In coach it’s $120 (or $58 if i get on a normal regional) — which goes up to $128 + $129 for the roomette — the splurge feels a bit justified considering the savings of the roomette sale.

My question is this — is the VLII roomette enjoyable enough on such a short trip (3.5 hours) to justify paying ~130 dollars on top of the normal fare for it and ~200 dollars on top of the regional fare? I certainly won’t do any sleeping and I already have access to the Metropolitan Lounge in NYP with my evening sleeper ticket. It would simply be to experience the new cars and maybe eat a meal in the diner (although the current dining is quite abysmal). If you made it through this post please let me know what you think.


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## Bob Dylan (Apr 12, 2021)

edolan said:


> Okay — this may sound a bit overkill — but I’m planning on a weekend trip on the corridor in the beginning of June to ride the sleeper on the « Night Owl » and to take advantage of the 2-for-1 sleeper deal.
> 
> The plan is to take the southbound Silver Star on Saturday — spend about 6 hours in DC before taking the 66 « Night Owl » to Boston — spend about 5 hours there before taking the 165 Regional back to NY on Sunday.
> 
> ...


I dont think it's worth it for the short hop from NYP-DC. 

If you have, or can get an AU Member to get you Upgrade or Companion Coupons, I suggest riding on Acela for this segment.( BC Fares are as Low as $69/FC $184)

I'd wait until theres better Food served in the Diners before riding a LD Train for such a short distance.
YMMV


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 12, 2021)

edolan said:


> Okay — this may sound a bit overkill — but I’m planning on a weekend trip on the corridor in the beginning of June to ride the sleeper on the « Night Owl » and to take advantage of the 2-for-1 sleeper deal.
> 
> The plan is to take the southbound Silver Star on Saturday — spend about 6 hours in DC before taking the 66 « Night Owl » to Boston — spend about 5 hours there before taking the 165 Regional back to NY on Sunday.
> 
> ...



I think it is entirely up to you. If you chose to spend a sizable amount of cash that way, I think it is similar to other pricey leisure activities. There's nothing wrong with it, as long as you know what you are doing.

Patronizing the Night Owl is a good idea. It will ensure that the sleeper service doesn't go anywhere, and it may even make them consider improving their service.

I definitely agree with BD on the silver portion. Wait until the food service improves, which if the rumours are true, it might happen.



Twinkletoes said:


> Hello fellow Obie.
> I arrived at Oberlin by traveling from Chicago to Elyria. At the that the eastbound train got to Elyria in the middle of the afternoon. In later years when I returned for reunions I found the middle of the night business to be quite annoying. I've tried the train a few times in recent years to visit relatives in Cleveland, but hanging out in a minimalist box (nothing like the old Terminal Tower of yesteryear) with relatives who kindly brought you to the station and want to see you off on the journey to Boston (4 hours late the last time I did it) is not encouraging. I've often wondered why they don't shift the "scheduled" time to have Cleveland arrival and departures in the late morning or afternoon.



Glad to see other grads here! I always felt unsafe at the Elyria station during those hours. Its almost as if Ohio doesn't want people to use the train, given the terrible schedule.
An impossible and glorious dream I have is for the old Terminal Tower station to be revamped into an actual intercity rail station. Alas, probably not going to happen.


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## edolan (Apr 12, 2021)

Bob Dylan said:


> I dont think it's worth it for the short hop from NYP-DC.
> 
> If you have, or can get an AU Member to get you Upgrade or Companion Coupons, I suggest riding on Acela for this segment.( BC Fares are as Low as $69/FC $184)





Tlcooper93 said:


> I definitely agree with BD on the silver portion. Wait until the food service improves, which if the rumours are true, it might happen.



Thanks for your input! Erring on the side of ‘not worth it’ as well after some thought — as I simply dont think the VLII alone is worth that price for 3.5 hours, especially when I’m just gonna end up in a VLI later that night. Food and lounge access definitely are not factors to consider as of now either.

In do wonder, though, how would I go about finding companion coupons or upgrades on AU (new member here)?


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## Bob Dylan (Apr 12, 2021)

edolan said:


> Thanks for your input! Erring on the side of ‘not worth it’ as well after some thought — as I simply dont think the VLII alone is worth that price for 3.5 hours, especially when I’m just gonna end up in a VLI later that night. Food and lounge access definitely are not factors to consider as of now either.
> 
> In do wonder, though, how would I go about finding companion coupons or upgrades on AU (new member here)?


Post on the AGR Forum, there usually are Members willing to share Coupons they cant. use or are fixing to expire! No charge, were friendly here!


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## daybeers (Apr 12, 2021)

edolan said:


> Thanks for your input! Erring on the side of ‘not worth it’ as well after some thought — as I simply dont think the VLII alone is worth that price for 3.5 hours, especially when I’m just gonna end up in a VLI later that night. Food and lounge access definitely are not factors to consider as of now either.
> 
> In do wonder, though, how would I go about finding companion coupons or upgrades on AU (new member here)?


Here's the thread. Welcome to AU!


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## JP1822 (Apr 13, 2021)

Amtrak did a pretty descent job advertising the launch of this service (with amenities, private room travel, and the breakfast), has pictures of the Viewliner II sleeper on its website (that the original ad drew people to), and then goes and launches the service with an elder and rundown Viewliner I sleeper, instead of a Viewliner II sleeper that they could have used. If I were just to read the advertisements, I would have expected a Viewliner II not a Viewliner I sleeper. 

But, so typical for Amtrak. Their advertising and branding is one thing, but their execution fails to live up time and time again. And yes, this will provide adequate excuses for the service to be doomed and get cancelled. I personally think they should just run the car through to Newport News and have a cleaning crew come onboard there and take care of things. This would have also shifted the Viewliner sleeper to operate at the rear of the train. 

Linens and sheets can be changed out before arrival into Newport News (or even Washington DC) and Boston. Any supplies or re-supplies could be picked up in Washington DC, NYP, or Boston. Boston already services the Lake Shore. 

Wouldn't be surprised if Boston threw a fit and said since we only service one sleeping car three days a week and its a Viewliner I, we'll only service Viewliner I's for anything else. Regardless, Amtrak needed to debut this service with a Viewliner II Sleeper. They took the wind right out of their advertising launch for this RESTORED service.........


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## Palmetto (Apr 13, 2021)

I've heard that before about the Boston maintenance crowd. It never ceases to amaze me that a maintenance base dictates policy. If that's to be believed, something is terribly wrong with the company.


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## bratkinson (Apr 14, 2021)

As promised, here's the writeup of my trip last night on #67 in roomette #2...

A person on another forum indicated he was planning to ride the restored sleeper on #67 BOS-WAS on the thirteenth, so I figured it would be a good time for me to 'get back into training' since the start of Covid. I sent him a private email and asked if he'd mind company, and he went on to say he's riding WAS-BOS beforehand on #2166.

So we met on the Acela when I boarded at NHV and chatted until after we left BOS on #67 before calling it a night.

Unlike the 'good old days' 15 years ago when the sleeper was still on the Twilight Limited or whatever it was called, it was at the rear adjacent to the cafe/BC car. Our train had the electric motor up front, a full baggage car, then the sleeper (handicap room and vestibule at front, but door closed, attendant was waiting for us at the rear door of the BC/Cafe), followed by I think 4 coaches we had walked past.

The sleeping car attendant had made our beds in advance, with my new friend in #1, and me in #2. The three of us talked for a bit and he said he's on the extra board and got bumped from his normal Capitol Ltd assignment. He also said he'd turn off the speaker system before we left BOS. Good thing. Not a peep out of the speakers in the room or hallway all night. It was only the two of us in the sleeper the entire night. A couple of minutes later, the SCA came back with our 'boxed' breakfast, which I knew what was inside as it was identical to what I had in the Acela First Class a couple hours earlier. I declined due to my medication timing restrictions (1 hr before eating, or 4 hours after) and I had read somewhere that Johnny Rockets '50s diner was still open at WAS. I had a couple of good breakfasts there in the past.

The SCA's accustomed Superliner bedmaking showed up in that the 'head' of the bed in my room was next to the toilet. It only took a couple of seconds for me to take it apart as I normally do anyway and put head away from the toilet. I mentioned it to him this morning while he was making it up and he said he was bumped to #66/67 a couple days ago with zero Viewliner training. He said he knew from experience that most passengers want to sleep feet first, so that's how he made up the beds. I prefer feet first, too, but not with my head next to the toilet.

Three things hit me while rearranging the bed:

#1...the new looking mattress pad is a good 5 inches short! And hard as a rock, too. I've likely spent well over 150 nights in Viewliner roomettes and never seen more than 2” short on the mattress pad.

#2 was 2 NEW blankets! I was expecting the old familiar dark blue ones! The new ones are light blue on one side and white on the other, with black nylon edging all the way around. Hopefully it will minimize fraying as it's heavier than the nylon edging on my blankets at home that has mostly come unstitched after a number of trips through my washing machine and dryer hrough the years.

#3 was new pillows and pillow cases with 2 kittycorner non-parallel black strips on them! Nice!

Also, the Viewliner must have had a mini-refurb in the past year. New curtains and new looking, no stains carpet!

Neither my friend, Larry, nor I got much sleep last night. For me, first night out is always minimal sleep, after that, I sleep like a rock on trains. He and I both noticed the rough ride approaching Providence. Fortunately, with the Viewliner at the front, it rode far better than at the rear of the train, even with a bag dorm following as on the Cardinal. We both fell asleep shortly after Providence, but I awoke while not moving at New Haven. We were there for about 20 minutes, probably 'waiting time'.

Once on Metro North territory, even at a relaxed speed (40ish, I suspect), the ride was a bit rough (as usual) There were multiple areas of trackworkers, as there were 8-10 short 'toots' of the horn at maybe 5 locations with very bright lights between NHV and NRO. I'm also convinced that the engineer NHV-NYP either wasn't familiar with the territory or the PTC was malfunctioning on MN. I didn't count, but from NHV to NRO, we had 'quick stop' applications of the brakes, and as soon as we stopped, two toots and away we went. Sometimes only 50 yards or so and the process repeated. I'm guessing it happened 20 times or more. It even happened twice between NRO and the split to NYP about a mile from NRO. It never happened after that. So maybe it was MN problems. Larry said he looked out the window and saw that we were on track 4 (east/southmost) track and #2 (3-1-2-4 track numbering) was down to the dirt in several extended sections that was being worked on. I managed to fall asleep about 4-5 minutes after NRO but woke up in Penn Station while we killed time there. I fell asleep just after going under the Hudson and didn't wake up until the Baltimore stop.

North (East) of Providence and south of Baltimore were the only really choppy areas of track. And MN trackage was a bit choppy/bouncy the entire time.

We came to a stop in WAS 5 minutes early, at 6:55.

In the WAS station, it appeared that about 1/3 of all the storefronts upstairs are boarded up and only a handful of rush-hour passengers. In the food court, more than half are gone...including Johnny Rockets. There are zero tables and zero chairs down there, and a small number of trash recepticles. Wendys was open. They're next to the former Johnny Rockets, and they had a decent honey/chicken on a croissant for $1.95. I had two. Larry had eaten his boxed breakfeast, so he and I chatted standing up across the way at a front counter from an abandoned restaurant in the food court before proceeding to the Metropolitan lounge to await our trains home...#174 for me at 10:10 and #51 for him at 11:00. Surprisingly, the snacks in the lounge in WAS haven't changed since before Covid. Perhaps the lateness of the hour at BOS is the reason cold water and soda was all that was available.

Would I do this trip again? Definitely a YES. I'm about a third of the way to having enough AGR points to do it again...possibly in fall.


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## Cal (Apr 14, 2021)

Were the new blankets comfortable?


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## bratkinson (Apr 14, 2021)

Cal said:


> Were the new blankets comfortable?


The blanket was not as heavy in weight as the old woven ones, but I think it was somewhat warmer. Perhaps it's a lightweight 'foam' with a slightly fuzzy cotton (or ?) covering on each side.

I'm a 'heavy blanket' person and keep a couple of all wool surplus Army blankets on my bed in winter...and the windows open.


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 14, 2021)

bratkinson said:


> As promised, here's the writeup of my trip last night on #67 in roomette #2...
> 
> A person on another forum indicated he was planning to ride the restored sleeper on #67 BOS-WAS on the thirteenth, so I figured it would be a good time for me to 'get back into training' since the start of Covid. I sent him a private email and asked if he'd mind company, and he went on to say he's riding WAS-BOS beforehand on #2166.
> 
> ...



Glad to hear some things have improved since my inaugural journey.
For me the deal breaker is the loud announcements at night. It seems like the attendant took care of that.

In terms of the snack box, the Acela box provides substantially more food than the sleeper box. Things might have changed, but in taking them back to back, 67 was a far cry from what 2166 provided.


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## MikeM (Apr 14, 2021)

Re the volume issue... time for another plug for gaffer's tape. Gaffers tape plus paper napkins make a great ad hoc volume control.

Gaffer's tape - the tape that keeps Amtrak habitable...


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## zephyr17 (Apr 14, 2021)

Cal said:


> Is it just because they haven't been running with a baggage car?


That'd do it.


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## daybeers (Apr 14, 2021)

Thanks so much for the detailed review! I'm really sad to hear about the food court in WAS. I was at the station in February and saw most stores were closed.


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## jis (Apr 18, 2021)

Seaboard92 said:


> The Palmetto essentially does this on the main North-South core line and does just fine. Yes the end point times are a bit rough and can easily be made worse by delays but it isn't a bad run. I would argue you could get a Palmetto style day train on quite a few routes that make sense.
> 
> New York-Detroit via Cleveland
> New York-Cincinnati via Cleveland
> ...


Atlanta to New York block time is somewhere between 17 and 19 hours. It is hard to do a reasonable daytime train with non-unfriendly end times. However, it is possible to do an Atlanta to Washington DC daytime train, and historically I believe that is what was done, when such existed. Or you could take something like 65/66/67 and extend it all the way to Atlanta. That would be fesible too, and possibly quite lucrative too.

Similarly Miami to Charlotte may be difficult, but Orlando to Charlotte may be possible, depending on how slow or fast Columbia to Charlotte is.

I am also dubious about the time tabling of a Palmetto style train between Atlanta and Chicago. Can Atlanta to Chicago be done in about 15 hours, like the Palmetto?

OTOH Chicago to Memphis would be eminently doable, even with plenty of daylight to spare in the summer.

Speaking of daytime trains, why do I seldom see mention of Chicago - Denver, which is actually doable?


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## MainerTrainer (Apr 18, 2021)

Getting back to the overnight sleepers on the NEC...

Here is what I sent to Amtrak after riding Boston to DC and then back two days later. I wouldn’t do it again.

My wife and I took the 67 train from Boston to Washington DC on Wednesday, April 14th, in a roomette. The roomette was still in day mode, which was fine. Our car attendant was quite pleasant and offered us an alcoholic beverage. He said he’d return with them shortly. Then, he made an announcement that the café car attendant was new and couldn’t get our drinks. Our room was made up and we went to bed. There were station stop announcements along the way that made it hard to sleep. After New London, there was an announcement that no more station stops calls would be made, but they continued anyway. We could not turn them off. This is a sleeper car and announcements prevent sleeping! In the morning, we never got our breakfast box. Our car attendant said we could go to the café car, but then there was an announcement that the café was closed. We never got any breakfast on the trip; we got coffee anyway at least. We arrived in Washington DC on time. This was a very disappointing trip. 

We took the 66 train back on Friday, April 16th, in a bedroom. There was initial confusion before boarding when an Amtrak employee (not a red cap) guided us from the lounge to board, but then the on-board staff said the rooms weren’t ready and we couldn’t go to our room yet. There was some back and forth among the Amtrak staff that clearly demonstrated miscommunication. The room was in day mode, which was fine. Our car attendant was very pleasant again, but said this was his first time doing this run and he had his instructions in his hand. He offered us an alcoholic beverage but it was late so we declined. After we left the station, we called him and he made up our room. He also brought us our breakfast boxes then. Unfortunately, we discovered the next morning that some of the items should be refrigerated, so they should not be brought up the night before. We heard no announcements on this trip, which was an improvement. We arrived in Boston on time. This was a slightly better trip than the trip down, but still disappointing. 

For both trips, the ride was quite rough, which made sleeping difficult. I’m glad we tried these trains, but given the service lapses and difficulty sleeping on rough tracks, we will take the Acela instead. I hope you find ways to improve training of staff on these trains regarding food and beverage service. There probably isn’t much you can do about the tracks.


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## PaTrainFan (Apr 18, 2021)

MainerTrainer said:


> Getting back to the overnight sleepers on the NEC...
> 
> Here is what I sent to Amtrak after riding Boston to DC and then back two days later. I wouldn’t do it again.
> 
> ...



What a fiasco. Can you imagine a major airline having so many snafus and miscommunications early in a new run or upgrade in service? Please report this to Amtrak's "Customer Service." For what it's worth these incidents need to be on the record.


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## bratkinson (Apr 18, 2021)

MainerTrainer - What a difference of experiences from what I had on Tuesday the 13th and you had on the 14th & 16th. It's obvious that Amtrak is literally grabbing any SCAs available and tossing them the BOS-WAS run without adequate (if any) Viewliner training beforehand. I lucked out and the SCA I rode with turned off the trainline announcements before we left BOS! 

Hopefully, Amtrak will send you a survey about your trip like I got on the Acela NHV-BOS segment I rode on Tuesday to take #67. Hopefully, they will get enough negative feedback about the passenger problems happening on #66/67 and actually DO something about it.


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## me_little_me (Apr 19, 2021)

PaTrainFan said:


> What a fiasco. Can you imagine a major airline having so many snafus and miscommunications early in a new run or upgrade in service? Please report this to Amtrak's "Customer Service." For what it's worth these incidents need to be on the record.


Yeah. It is hard to believe (NOT!) how incompetent Amtrak management could be. It's their home territory. It's their first new positive venture in a long while. It's such a short run. It's on their own tracks. Anything that goes wrong is entirely their fault because there is nobody else to blame.

But they still screw it up!

Congress should appoint door nails to the Amtrak Board because they obviously do nothing useful and at least door nails hold doors together. And Amtrak executives should be paid as much as, but no more than, the price of a door nail at Lowes or Home Depot and get the same benefits - being hammered over and over. Soon, they will rust away.


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## Bonser (Apr 19, 2021)

Will Amtrak actually name the overnighter from Boston to DC again? A return to the Night Owl perhaps?


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## jis (Apr 19, 2021)

Tom Booth said:


> Will Amtrak actually name the overnighter from Boston to DC again? A return to the Night Owl perhaps?


Apparently there are no current plans to give that train a special name at this time.


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## pennyk (Apr 19, 2021)

MODERATOR NOTE: there were many posts in this thread regarding daytime corridor routes. Those posts have been split to a new thread:





Daytime Corridor Routes


MODERATOR NOTE: many of the comments in this thread were split off from another thread "First NEC Sleeper Journey - A Huge Letdown" and were off topic. Thank you for keeping comments on topic. On the middle-of-the-night LSL boarding times in Ohio.. I have never understood the 9:30 pm...




www.amtraktrains.com


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## TheVig (Apr 19, 2021)

This bonehead enjoyed his trip.


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 19, 2021)

TheVig said:


> This bonehead enjoyed his trip.




Not a bonehead, but yes, he enjoyed it. I spoke to him in the sleeper car.
Pretty unnecessary comment in more ways than one, considering this video is already talked about in detail here.


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## TheVig (Apr 19, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> Not a bonehead, but yes, he enjoyed it. I spoke to him in the sleeper car.
> Pretty unnecessary comment in more ways than one, considering this video is already talked about in detail here.



Sensitive much?


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## Tlcooper93 (Apr 19, 2021)

TheVig said:


> Sensitive much?



No, I just believe in basic decency.


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## PaTrainFan (Apr 19, 2021)

TheVig said:


> Sensitive much?


 TLCooper met him. You didn't.


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## Seaboard92 (Apr 19, 2021)

At least he isn't like the guy I met once who rigged a coat hanger to his head with a rubber band and live streamed an entire train ride to his friends on Facebook. And then tried to interview the train crew for his "fans". I can respect just about any youtuber as long as they are respectful and let me do my job.


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## TheVig (Apr 19, 2021)

Seaboard92 said:


> At least he isn't like the guy I met once who rigged a coat hanger to his head with a rubber band and live streamed an entire train ride to his friends on Facebook. And then tried to interview the train crew for his "fans". I can respect just about any youtuber as long as they are respectful and let me do my job.



Wow. Honestly, with 25 years under my belt in HR roles, nothing the human race does, really surprises me anymore.


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## Michigan Mom (Apr 20, 2021)

I mean... there's no point in getting mad at the person, if the system allows someone to book a room for a 5 minute ride that is the fault of the system, not the person. I can't criticize someone for purchasing a ticket the system allows one to purchase. There's another consideration, too, from the Amtrak marketing perspective, this is good (and free) advertising for the new NEC sleeper service. Having said that, I wouldn't do it, partly because for my personal finances it would be money wasted, and partly because I've been raised to feel extremely guilty for causing the employees to have to clean a room that was used for 5 minutes.


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## Mailliw (Apr 20, 2021)

It would be even better from a marketing perspective if Amtrak put new equipment on this service, or at least properly cleaned old equipment. Also don't wake passengers up with unnecessary announcements.


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## Just-Thinking-51 (Apr 20, 2021)

It would be even better to have:

A) Clean equipment.
B) Prepare and trained crew.
C) Clear service levels.
D) Properly prepared food service.
E) Prepare and trained station staff.

This train is too much of a rolling “work in progress” to be a “named train.”


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## Cal (Apr 20, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> It would be even better to have:
> 
> A) Clean equipment.
> B) Prepare and trained crew.
> ...


We shouldn't even have to be asking for A, B, and E. Truly any of it..


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## BoulderCO (Apr 20, 2021)

MainerTrainer said:


> Getting back to the overnight sleepers on the NEC...
> 
> Here is what I sent to Amtrak after riding Boston to DC and then back two days later. I wouldn’t do it again.



Thank You, MainerTrainer, for the excellent review. And thanks also for taking one for the team ;>)

It would appear that they are not yet ready for prime time.


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## railiner (Apr 20, 2021)

Michigan Mom said:


> I mean... there's no point in getting mad at the person, if the system allows someone to book a room for a 5 minute ride that is the fault of the system, not the person. I can't criticize someone for purchasing a ticket the system allows one to purchase. There's another consideration, too, from the Amtrak marketing perspective, this is good (and free) advertising for the new NEC sleeper service. Having said that, I wouldn't do it, partly because for my personal finances it would be money wasted, and partly because I've been raised to feel extremely guilty for causing the employees to have to clean a room that was used for 5 minutes.


Got me thinking...how much could Amtrak theoretically earn from a single roomette or bedroom, if it were resold between every station on its route? Should be a fortune....and no...I am not going to 'do the math' to find out...


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## bms (Apr 20, 2021)

Michigan Mom said:


> I mean... there's no point in getting mad at the person, if the system allows someone to book a room for a 5 minute ride that is the fault of the system, not the person. I can't criticize someone for purchasing a ticket the system allows one to purchase. There's another consideration, too, from the Amtrak marketing perspective, this is good (and free) advertising for the new NEC sleeper service. Having said that, I wouldn't do it, partly because for my personal finances it would be money wasted, and partly because I've been raised to feel extremely guilty for causing the employees to have to clean a room that was used for 5 minutes.



I'm surprised the system allowed that, the most recent timetable says that both Back Bay and Route 128 are receive-only going south and discharge-only going north.


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## MainerTrainer (Apr 20, 2021)

BoulderCO said:


> Thank You, MainerTrainer, for the excellent review. And thanks also for taking one for the team ;>)


You're welcome. I’ll let you know when/if I hear back from Amtrak. No survey yet. 

I like Amtrak and want them to do well. This was bad and they need to know.


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## OBS (Apr 21, 2021)

MainerTrainer said:


> You're welcome. I’ll let you know when/if I hear back from Amtrak. No survey yet.
> 
> I like Amtrak and want them to do well. This was bad and they need to know.


Thanks for sending your feedback to Amtrak!


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## MainerTrainer (Apr 21, 2021)

I recieved an email from Amtrak this morning. Apologies for the formatting.


> Thank you for your recent email contact.
> 
> Amtrak welcomes feedback from customers, as it helps us to focus our efforts to improve service. We hope that you will accept our sincere apologies for the lack of adequate service during your recent travel.
> 
> ...


So that’s somewhat reasonable compensation for four breakfasts, two for each of us. I’m glad to know they’ll pass this along. The “Center for Excellence” is on it!

As I stated in my email to them, I really am hoping they fix these issues. We’re actually getting on the Silver Star on Friday, New York to Tampa.


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## MainerTrainer (Apr 21, 2021)

OBS said:


> Thanks for sending your feedback to Amtrak!



You’re welcome!


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## RayFlyer (Apr 30, 2021)

I took 67 BOS-WAS Tues27Apr21 in a Viewliner I roomette using Guest Reward pts. Stopped by the Lounge around 815p-all refreshments were put away but the attendant gladly got them out for my selection. He could not confirm what "meals" service would be available but did confirm there would be a Cafe car. Passengers boarded a little late but departed on time. My roomette was cleaner than I expected with the only a bad spot -- the overhead luggage storage had cookie crumbs and the 2 hangars (cleaners don't look/clean up there). The car attendant explained the roomette features (temp control, fan control, etc) and noted my desired turn-down and wake-up times. He handed me a snack box (same as used in Acela First) and explained how I should go to the Cafe car for my complimentary beverage (wine) and other free soft drinks. Confirmed the Cafe car would be open until shortly before NYC. I relaxed for about an hour, decided to take a shower while the bed was set up. The train makes 25 stops BOS-WAS and no announcements were made. He woke me up as I requested as the train left PHL and I ventured to the Cafe car for my breakfast. Discovered a new Cafe attendant who did not know that sleeper car passengers get a free breakfast item. Again, other beverages were free. Arrived WAS a bit ahead of schedule. Used the WAS lounge to grab some coffee. As this was about the 16th day of this new service, thought it was almost flawless; the sleeper car attendant knew what to do and was helpful by explaining the schedule, features, Cafe car, etc - obviously experienced. I would do this again. FYI... the sleeper car continues to Newport News but empty - no seats are sold (res sys shows Sold Out) - evidently Amtrak will not pay for a sleeper car attendant for the WAS-NPN segment.


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## AmtrakBlue (Apr 30, 2021)

RayFlyer said:


> I took 67 BOS-WAS Tues27Apr21 in a Viewliner I roomette using Guest Reward pts. Stopped by the Lounge around 815p-all refreshments were put away but the attendant gladly got them out for my selection. He could not confirm what "meals" service would be available but did confirm there would be a Cafe car. Passengers boarded a little late but departed on time. My roomette was cleaner than I expected with the only a bad spot -- the overhead luggage storage had cookie crumbs and the 2 hangars (cleaners don't look/clean up there). The car attendant explained the roomette features (temp control, fan control, etc) and noted my desired turn-down and wake-up times. He handed me a snack box (same as used in Acela First) and explained how I should go to the Cafe car for my complimentary beverage (wine) and other free soft drinks. Confirmed the Cafe car would be open until shortly before NYC. I relaxed for about an hour, decided to take a shower while the bed was set up. The train makes 25 stops BOS-WAS and no announcements were made. He woke me up as I requested as the train left PHL and I ventured to the Cafe car for my breakfast. Discovered a new Cafe attendant who did not know that sleeper car passengers get a free breakfast item. Again, other beverages were free. Arrived WAS a bit ahead of schedule. Used the WAS lounge to grab some coffee. As this was about the 16th day of this new service, thought it was almost flawless; the sleeper car attendant knew what to do and was helpful by explaining the schedule, features, Cafe car, etc - obviously experienced. I would do this again. FYI... the sleeper car continues to Newport News but empty - no seats are sold (res sys shows Sold Out) - evidently Amtrak will not pay for a sleeper car attendant for the WAS-NPN segment.


Or VA won't pay...


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## PaTrainFan (Apr 30, 2021)

A new review of the Viewliner service from this always reliable poster at Simply Railway.


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## TC_NYC (Apr 30, 2021)

RayFlyer said:


> FYI... the sleeper car continues to Newport News but empty - no seats are sold (res sys shows Sold Out) - evidently Amtrak will not pay for a sleeper car attendant for the WAS-NPN segment.



This is so crazy. They're really leaving money on the table with this move and could sell so many more tickets from Virginia to Boston. For instance RVR-BOS departing RVR at 6:30 and getting into BOS at 8am. Much better than spending all day on a regional train.


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## Cal (Apr 30, 2021)

PaTrainFan said:


> A new review of the Viewliner service from this always reliable poster at Simply Railway.



I saw it! I always looks forward to watching his videos on Friday mornings.


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## Cal (Apr 30, 2021)

RayFlyer said:


> I took 67 BOS-WAS Tues27Apr21 in a Viewliner I roomette using Guest Reward pts. Stopped by the Lounge around 815p-all refreshments were put away but the attendant gladly got them out for my selection. He could not confirm what "meals" service would be available but did confirm there would be a Cafe car. Passengers boarded a little late but departed on time. My roomette was cleaner than I expected with the only a bad spot -- the overhead luggage storage had cookie crumbs and the 2 hangars (cleaners don't look/clean up there). The car attendant explained the roomette features (temp control, fan control, etc) and noted my desired turn-down and wake-up times. He handed me a snack box (same as used in Acela First) and explained how I should go to the Cafe car for my complimentary beverage (wine) and other free soft drinks. Confirmed the Cafe car would be open until shortly before NYC. I relaxed for about an hour, decided to take a shower while the bed was set up. The train makes 25 stops BOS-WAS and no announcements were made. He woke me up as I requested as the train left PHL and I ventured to the Cafe car for my breakfast. Discovered a new Cafe attendant who did not know that sleeper car passengers get a free breakfast item. Again, other beverages were free. Arrived WAS a bit ahead of schedule. Used the WAS lounge to grab some coffee. As this was about the 16th day of this new service, thought it was almost flawless; the sleeper car attendant knew what to do and was helpful by explaining the schedule, features, Cafe car, etc - obviously experienced. I would do this again. FYI... the sleeper car continues to Newport News but empty - no seats are sold (res sys shows Sold Out) - evidently Amtrak will not pay for a sleeper car attendant for the WAS-NPN segment.


After hearing so many bad and okay experiences, I'm glad yours was so good!


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## Just-Thinking-51 (Apr 30, 2021)

RayFlyer said:


> I ventured to the Cafe car for my breakfast. Discovered a new Cafe attendant who did not know that sleeper car passengers get a free breakfast item. Again, other beverages were free.



Do we/you get a breakfast item? Or was the snack pack supposed to be it?


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## PVD (Apr 30, 2021)

The announcement says "continental breakfast" , there is no dining car, so it's probably a snack box. Remember, Antarctica is a continent.


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## RayFlyer (May 4, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> Do we/you get a breakfast item? Or was the snack pack supposed to be it?


Snack box was given upon arrival in the roommette. Went to Cafe car for the 'free' breakfast item. New attendent (since NY) did not know that sleeper pax get one breakfast item included but sleeper car attendent corrected him. Believe that Busn Cl pax get free beverages (not food) so that may have the reason for confusion.


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## NES28 (May 5, 2021)

I imagine that the reason the sleepers are closed off south of WAS is that segment of the route is treated as a "state-supported service". None of these have sleepers. Certainly Virginia is not going to pay for this; Amtrak probably wouldn't even ask. Amtrak is required to operate the Corridor on a commercial basis. Amtrak probably can't figure out how the accounting would work to have a piece of NEC operation that is, actually off the Corridor whether or not the additional fares for trips to/from NEC stations would pay for the marginal cost of the operation. They may have looked at the old data to see how many riders there were. It does appear that this is another case where these artificial categories work against providing useful service.


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## Tlcooper93 (May 5, 2021)

NES28 said:


> I imagine that the reason the sleepers are closed off south of WAS is that segment of the route is treated as a "state-supported service". None of these have sleepers. Certainly Virginia is not going to pay for this; Amtrak probably wouldn't even ask. Amtrak is required to operate the Corridor on a commercial basis. Amtrak probably can't figure out how the accounting would work to have a piece of NEC operation that is, actually off the Corridor whether or not the additional fares for trips to/from NEC stations would pay for the marginal cost of the operation. They may have looked at the old data to see how many riders there were. It does appear that this is another case where these artificial categories work against providing useful service.



the sleeper ran south of WAS back in 2003. How did they negotiate it back then?


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## RebelRider (May 6, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> the sleeper ran south of WAS back in 2003. How did they negotiate it back then?



Back in 2003 states weren't required to foot the bill for short-haul (less than 750 mile) service. These services are now covered by Section 209 of the Passenger Rail Investment and Improvement Act of 2008.


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## Anderson (May 6, 2021)

AmtrakBlue said:


> Or VA won't pay...


Given recent history (e.g. Amtrak cutting staffing at RVR from 24 hours to 0530-2200 or so without so much as telling DRPT...folks at DRPT found out _when I asked_), I'm fairly certain Amtrak couldn't be arsed to bother...


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## Jack Davis (May 6, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> Just wanted to share a few thoughts and pictures from my overnight journey from BOS - WAS on the inaugural return of sleeper cars to the NE Regional 65-67.
> I would put this in the trip reports, but I thought it might spark additional conversation.
> Miles in Transit (who had a roomette next to mine booked only from BOS to BBY) has a video out.
> 
> ...


Isn't there a way to turn down or 'off' the sound system from inside 'your private' cabin? (I guess not?)


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## Cal (May 6, 2021)

Jack Davis said:


> Isn't there a way to turn down or 'off' the sound system from inside 'your private' cabin? (I guess not?)


Apparently not in the Viewliner's. Only in Superliner II's, correct me if I'm wrong.

Some SCAs, those who are good and are properly trained on the Viewliner, will turn off the announcements so it doesn't disturb anyone


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## Tlcooper93 (May 6, 2021)

Jack Davis said:


> Isn't there a way to turn down or 'off' the sound system from inside 'your private' cabin? (I guess not?)



There was not.
This problem has been rectified, according to subsequent trips taken by other members here. The sleeper attendant has turned off sound in the car.


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## Just-Thinking-51 (May 6, 2021)

Of course it too much work to pull off the sleeper at Washington DC with/while the engines change. So deadheading to Virginia it is.


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## Palmetto (May 7, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> Of course it too much work to pull off the sleeper at Washington DC with/while the engines change. So deadheading to Virginia it is.



If it's right behind the engine, it's not. They add/drop equipment from 79/80 that way, don't they?


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## Just-Thinking-51 (May 7, 2021)

Baggage car is between the motors and the sleeper. You could of course put the baggage car on at the rear, but nope that a bridge too far.


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## William W. (May 8, 2021)

Seems rather silly to put unnecessary mileage on equipment, but that's government for you I suppose.

I'm doing WAS-BOS in a few weeks to see what it's like. Used points on a roomette. I'll let y'all know how it goes.


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## Rasputin (May 8, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> Baggage car is between the motors and the sleeper. You could of course put the baggage car on at the rear, but nope that a bridge too far.


Everything on Amtrak seems to be a bridge too far!


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## neroden (May 9, 2021)

Since the result of selling tickets on a car which is *already travelling to NPN*, even with the extra cost of the attendant, is going to be a profit, PRIIA's "states must pay costs" silliness should not apply and Amtrak should just do it. If someone's giving them guff about this, it's a good reason to go to Congress and demand total revocation of the PRIIA rule.


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## MARC Rider (May 9, 2021)

Does RPA have a position about whether they should sell sleeper space on 65-67 south of Washington? It might help more than our complaining here if Amtrak (and the congresspeople involved) start hearing complaints about this from organized interest groups. After all, why shouldn't Virginians be able to book a through sleeper ride to Boston?


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## Anderson (May 9, 2021)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> Of course it too much work to pull off the sleeper at Washington DC with/while the engines change. So deadheading to Virginia it is.


Which, again, raises the question of "Why not arrange to run the crew through?" Given the furloughs, would it have been _that_ hard to get folks to bid for it out of Boston?


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## OBS (May 9, 2021)

Anderson said:


> Which, again, raises the question of "Why not arrange to run the crew through?" Given the furloughs, would it have been _that_ hard to get folks to bid for it out of Boston?


I'm sure it had to do with the fact there are only LSA jobs working out of BOS. So, not only would you have to find/hire and train people for the position, you would also need 2 extra people to sit on the extra board to cover one position. Not really cost effective the way things are currently arranged....


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## PVD (May 9, 2021)

It is easy for people to not realize the other jobs on the LSL can come from Chicago.


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## west point (May 10, 2021)

If Amtrak can fill the sleeper to WASH then the politics of it might be the reason ? The statement "sorry no space available because some rooms taken to NPN might not go over well "


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## Tlcooper93 (May 15, 2021)

I took another NE Regional Sleeper Journey last night; I thought I'd report the improvement.

Due to a last minute work trip down to Baltimore, I had the opportunity to do the Acela-Sleeper combo that I love.
In the morning, I took Acela 2159 to Baltimore, and at roughly 11pm, I hopped on train 66 back up. So happy I caught a glimpse of Acela Avelia at 30th St. Station on the way down. I didn't know it'd be there. Pardon the low image quality. I didn't bring my nice camera.



Most of all, I'm really pleased to say that there were no station announcements until Providence (around 6:50), which served as a nice wakeup call before Boston to shower/get some coffee from the cafe car. This is consistent with what others have reported, and I guess it has stuck. The bottom bunk is much better to sleep on than the top bunk. Glad I didn't repeat my mistake.

Moreover, the pitiful snack box (which was all they offered last time) now compliments a free breakfast item from the cafe car (albeit extremely limited selection, no vegetarian items).

I'm guessing there was track/catenary work on MetroNorth tracks, as we ditched our Sprinter Loco for a P42 sometime around NYP. Got a glimpse of it at the iconic curve into South Station. When I de-trained, I noticed I was in the same sleeper as last time, 62002. Guess they keep it consistent. So far, I've seen this one, and 62043. This time, the sleeper car was about half full, with most people going to either Providence or Boston.






There's been a lot of discussion on rommette pricing recently. I think 65-67 has a very reasonable price.
For last minute travel from Boston to DC, the sleeper train is by far the most economical, from some mild digging. Please correct me if you find something else.
Lowest fares between BOS and DC 3 days out:
United: $369 direct
JetBlue: $205 direct
NE Regional: $187, $238, $289 (C, B, S)
Acela: $336, $471


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## jis (May 15, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> Does RPA have a position about whether they should sell sleeper space on 65-67 south of Washington? It might help more than our complaining here if Amtrak (and the congresspeople involved) start hearing complaints about this from organized interest groups. After all, why shouldn't Virginians be able to book a through sleeper ride to Boston?


To get RPA's position you will need to ask RPA at Contact Us | Rail Passengers Association | Washington, DC and hope someone answers. Usually Joe Aiello or Madi Butler are pretty good at getting back with an answer.

Just launching off a question in the ether at UA is unlikely to get you any definitive information about any official RPA stance or lack thereof on anything.


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## Just-Thinking-51 (May 15, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> I took another NE Regional Sleeper Journey last night; I thought I'd report the improvement.



Happy to hear that Amtrak is working out the kinks in this service. I do wonder how much is from the hard working employees, and how much is from the management.


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## Bostontoallpoints (May 18, 2021)

I just took the 67 sleeper from Westwood (Route 128) station to BWI on Thursday May 13. I booked a roomette for just myself. When the train pulled into the station the doors to the sleeper did not open when all the coach doors opened. I waited for a couple of minutes but the sleeper door never opened. I hurried down to the coach entrance and boarded the train. I walked through the café and business section to the sleeper car and found my room. It was clean enough but beaten-up and worn. My food box containing water and snacks was waiting next to the chair. Two water bottles were sitting in the holders. I sat in my room for another 10 minutes and the SA never showed up. I headed down to the café car to get a drink and was told by the café attendant to come back in 5 minutes. I met the conductor in business class and got my ticket scanned. After another 5 minutes sitting in my roomette the SCA finally stopped by to introduce herself. She claimed that she opened the door at the station but didn’t see me. Anyway she seemed nice enough and told me to head down to the café for my free drink and asked me if she could make-up the bed. When I came back with my free beer the top bunk was down and ready for sleeping. The next time I saw the SCA was 5:30 am when she knocked on my door to inform me my stop was in one hour and that the café was ready for breakfast. I got up, brushed my teeth and made myself presentable to obtain breakfast. I got a free coffee and sausage, egg and cheese sandwich from the café and ate in my room. The next time I saw the SA was when we were pulling into BWI station. She informed me that the station stop was mine and to head down to the exit door. No five minute warning but I was ready regardless. I gave the SCA a tip and she thanked me. I stood at the door for a minute with a business class passenger. It never opened. The SCA attempted to open the door but seemed unfamiliar with the buttons. After another minute she told us to both head down to the next car. She called to us to hurry up. I got off the train with about 20 seconds to spare. Amtrak needs to properly train their workers. All employees need to know how to open a door at a bare minimum. All in all it was good trip and on time. Was it first class service? Not even close.


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## Bostontoallpoints (May 18, 2021)

Also FYI. I use to take the Nightowl and then the Federal traveling between Boston and Philadelphia 6 times a year for work. I always rode in the sleeper. It's nice to see the sleepers back in service.


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## Dakota 400 (May 18, 2021)

Bostontoallpoints said:


> The SCA attempted to open the door but seemed unfamiliar with the buttons.



What would she have been able to do if there had been a need for an emergency exit? This is quite an illustration of incompetence.


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## Tlcooper93 (May 18, 2021)

Bostontoallpoints said:


> Amtrak needs to properly train their workers. All employees need to know how to open a door at a bare minimum. All in all it was good trip and on time. Was it first class service? Not even close.



Very disappointing to hear. So far all of the sleeper car attendants I've had on the Night Owl (including my trip last night) have been stellar. Many of them are veterans of other LD routes and were recently shifted.


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## Bostontoallpoints (May 18, 2021)

Dakota 400 said:


> What would she have been able to do if there had been a need for an emergency exit? This is quite an illustration of incompetence.


Well she didn't open the door to the sleeper when then train arrived at Route 128 station. I waited for a good 2 minutes and the doors never opened. She claimed she did after I had given up and left for the coach cars. After seeing her in action the next morning at BWI I don't believe the SCA ever opened the doors on her own. If the SCA had trouble at the beginning of the trip why did she never seek help or instruction on the opening of the doors at some point in the night? It's not like there is never an attendant or conducter sitting in the cafe car that she could talk to. Amtrak has a service problem and obviously a management problem. For the prices they are charging the service does not come close to acceptable.


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## Bostontoallpoints (May 18, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> Very disappointing to hear. So far all of the sleeper car attendants I've had on the Night Owl (including my trip last night) have been stellar. Many of them are veterans of other LD routes and were recently shifted.


I hope it was the SCA's first night. I'll ride the sleeper again as I find it conveinent use of my time. Some people may not be as forgiving as I am.


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## Dakota 400 (May 18, 2021)

Bostontoallpoints said:


> Well she didn't open the door to the sleeper when then train arrived at Route 128 station. I waited for a good 2 minutes and the doors never opened. She claimed she did after I had given up and left for the coach cars. After seeing her in action the next morning at BWI I don't believe the SCA ever opened the doors on her own. If the SCA had trouble at the beginning of the trip why did she never seek help or instruction on the opening of the doors at some point in the night? It's not like there is never an attendant or conducter sitting in the cafe car that she could talk to. Amtrak has a service problem and obviously a management problem. For the prices they are charging the service does not come close to acceptable.



I hope that you will let Amtrak Customer Service aware of what you experienced. I recommend a snail mail letter, sent Certified Mail. That's what I did and I received a very satisfactory personal reply in return.


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## TC_NYC (May 18, 2021)

neroden said:


> Since the result of selling tickets on a car which is *already travelling to NPN*, even with the extra cost of the attendant, is going to be a profit, PRIIA's "states must pay costs" silliness should not apply and Amtrak should just do it. If someone's giving them guff about this, it's a good reason to go to Congress and demand total revocation of the PRIIA rule.


Honestly from that perspective the state should be paying the cost of lugging an empty car 374 miles from NPN-WAS round trip unoccupied


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## John Bredin (May 19, 2021)

Does a sleeping car *need* an attendant for the few daytime(ish) hours this train travels south of WAS? Essentially no-one's going to want their bed made up during that time. Signs could be posted warning that there's no attendant until WAS northbound/after WAS southbound.


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## Mailliw (May 19, 2021)

My guess would be there's a union rule requiring an SCA on duty anytime a sleeping car is in service.


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## OBS (May 20, 2021)

Mailliw said:


> My guess would be there's a union rule requiring an SCA on duty anytime a sleeping car is in service.


Good guess, but wrong.


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## MARC Rider (May 20, 2021)

John Bredin said:


> Does a sleeping car *need* an attendant for the few daytime(ish) hours this train travels south of WAS? Essentially no-one's going to want their bed made up during that time. Signs could be posted warning that there's no attendant until WAS northbound/after WAS southbound.


There are people who like to have beds made up for sleeping during the day. If they ran without a sleeping car attendant, how long would it be before we started seeing complaints in Amtrak Unlimited that there was no attendant in the expensive sleeping compartment that someone booked?


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## Rasputin (May 20, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> There are people who like to have beds made up for sleeping during the day. If they ran without a sleeping car attendant, how long would it be before we started seeing complaints in Amtrak Unlimited that there was no attendant in the expensive sleeping compartment that someone booked?


Or that a passenger was injured trying to move the berth up or down.


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## John Bredin (May 20, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> There are people who like to have beds made up for sleeping during the day. If they ran without a sleeping car attendant, how long would it be before we started seeing complaints in Amtrak Unlimited that there was no attendant in the expensive sleeping compartment that someone booked?


Le parfait est l'ennemi du diet bien.  Better to ride in an attendant-less sleeper south of WAS than having no sleeping rooms available south of WAS on these trains, the present situation.

Of course someone would complain. Some people complain if there's a  next to their 🛏 while others complain if there isn't, and some people in each faction think that Amtrak is consciously showing contempt for its sleeper passengers by not configuring small bedrooms  the only logical way.


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## Seaboard92 (May 21, 2021)

I think a lot of these attendants are coming off the Capitol Limited pool which is superliner equipped and I'm not sure how much training they have on the Viewliner and Amfleet doors. Now the Amfleet I doors are relatively easy to operate, they do need a bit of force in the non automatic mode. But the Viewliner doors are the easiest in the entire system to operate from both the outside and inside of the car body. Basically a modified version of the Budd doors from the heritage fleet. If they can't figure that out they shouldn't be working on these trains.


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## Cal (May 21, 2021)

Seaboard92 said:


> But the Viewliner doors are the easiest in the entire system to operate from both the outside and inside of the car body. Basically a modified version of the Budd doors from the heritage fleet. If they can't figure that out they shouldn't be working on these trains.


Easier than the superliner doors? I would think they are the easiest. You turn a handle and open.


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## railiner (May 21, 2021)

Cal said:


> Easier than the superliner doors? I would think they are the easiest. You turn a handle and open.


I agree. And no 'traps' to worry about...


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## 20th Century Rider (May 21, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> Just wanted to share a few thoughts and pictures from my overnight journey from BOS - WAS on the inaugural return of sleeper cars to the NE Regional 65-67.
> I would put this in the trip reports, but I thought it might spark additional conversation.
> Miles in Transit (who had a roomette next to mine booked only from BOS to BBY) has a video out.
> 
> ...


Amtrak will go to the ends of the world to make sure they mess up a good idea... in this case a return to the 'Night Owl.' How much did it cost? Did they pay you to clean up the room you paid for??? Did those midnight announcements help you to sleep better? And was that bottle of Fiji water the best part of the trip?

Sounds like the service... is really 'watered down.'


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## west point (May 22, 2021)

Why can't a SCA assigned elsewhere on the train take care of the few persons left in the sleeper south of WASH ?


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## EchoSierra (May 22, 2021)

niemi24s said:


> Could Superliner equipment get between ALB and BOS what with that one tunnel and the catenaries?



No. I think Worcester is as far east as they can go. Back in 2008, Good Morning America had their Whistle Stop Tour which used a special train with Superliners (the consist was two P42s, an NPCU (90225, specially modified with dome antennas for broadcasting while on the road), three superliners, two sightseer lounges, a transdorm, and two private cars) touring the country. They were unable to go to Boston and had to settle for Worcester instead, because that's as far as the Superliners could go. Some of the bridges east of Worcester are too low for the Superliners.



MikeM said:


> Re the volume issue... time for another plug for gaffer's tape. Gaffers tape plus paper napkins make a great ad hoc volume control.
> 
> Gaffer's tape - the tape that keeps Amtrak habitable...



Gaffer's tape is expensive, but I guarantee that it's worth it. It's strong, removes cleanly, and the adhesive leaves no residue.


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## OBS (May 22, 2021)

west point said:


> Why can't a SCA assigned elsewhere on the train take care of the few persons left in the sleeper south of WASH ?


There are no other attendants on the train other than the cafe attendant.


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## Tlcooper93 (May 23, 2021)

EchoSierra said:


> No. I think Worcester is as far east as they can go. Back in 2008, Good Morning America had their Whistle Stop Tour which used a special train with Superliners (the consist was two P42s, an NPCU (90225, specially modified with dome antennas for broadcasting while on the road), three superliners, two sightseer lounges, a transdorm, and two private cars) touring the country. They were unable to go to Boston and had to settle for Worcester instead, because that's as far as the Superliners could go. Some of the bridges east of Worcester are too low for the Superliners.
> 
> 
> 
> Gaffer's tape is expensive, but I guarantee that it's worth it. It's strong, removes cleanly, and the adhesive leaves no residue.



I read that Superliners can get as far as just outside Back Bay (barely), so theoretically, you could have a superliner train terminate at Landsdowne. This story does sound interesting though. I could be wrong.


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## EchoSierra (May 24, 2021)

Back when that Good Morning America train ran, Lansdowne was named Yawkey, and only had a side platform on track 2.

I think that the superliners might have issues with the bridges over by the Newton stops, but they might also fit just fine, because it's entirely possible that no one has actually measured with a measuring tape, the height of those bridges above the rail head (due to settling, compacting, reballasting, etc, the height can change from what they set it to when the maintenance on the RoW was done). A few years ago, when the AAPRCO had their Pine Tree Limited tour over the MBTA, it was always *assumed* that the full dome cars would not clear the bridges on the Lowell line, but someone insisted that they try it anyway, and sent someone out there with a tape measure. They found that if they proceeded at a reduced speed, the dome cars would clear the bridges on the Lowell line between North Station and West Medford by a couple inches, so as long as the cars didn't rock, they'd clear the bridges just fine, and that's what they did.


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## Tlcooper93 (May 24, 2021)

EchoSierra said:


> Back when that Good Morning America train ran, Lansdowne was named Yawkey, and only had a side platform on track 2.
> 
> I think that the superliners might have issues with the bridges over by the Newton stops, but they might also fit just fine, because it's entirely possible that no one has actually measured with a measuring tape, the height of those bridges above the rail head (due to settling, compacting, reballasting, etc, the height can change from what they set it to when the maintenance on the RoW was done). A few years ago, when the AAPRCO had their Pine Tree Limited tour over the MBTA, it was always *assumed* that the full dome cars would not clear the bridges on the Lowell line, but someone insisted that they try it anyway, and sent someone out there with a tape measure. They found that if they proceeded at a reduced speed, the dome cars would clear the bridges on the Lowell line between North Station and West Medford by a couple inches, so as long as the cars didn't rock, they'd clear the bridges just fine, and that's what they did.



Interesting. I was just on the Worcester Line and I tried to guess the height of the bridges. MBTA duplex cars are 15' 6" if I remember correctly, and Superliners are 16' 2". There was definitely at least of a foot of clearance for the MBTA cars, so maybe the supers would have about 3-4 inches of clearance, which I would guess would not be enough.


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## PVD (May 24, 2021)

It really doesn't matter. They bring nothing to the table. The train goes to Albany and becomes part of the Lake Shore. Unless Mass were somehow convinced to pay for a separate train Superliners have no purpose on this route, as well as adding a bunch of orphan cars at each end, making service a PITA.


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## Tlcooper93 (May 24, 2021)

PVD said:


> It really doesn't matter. They bring nothing to the table. The train goes to Albany and becomes part of the Lake Shore. Unless Mass were somehow convinced to pay for a separate train Superliners have no purpose on this route, as well as adding a bunch of orphan cars at each end, making service a PITA.



Half the stuff we talk about doesn’t really matter. It’s more just for the fun of thinking if Superliners COULD make it.


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## PVD (May 24, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> Half the stuff we talk about doesn’t really matter. It’s more just for the fun of thinking if Superliners COULD make it.


You are right.... true enough...


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## William W. (May 28, 2021)

Consist tonight consists of power, baggage car, Viewliner I sleeper, cafe car w/biz class, and four coaches. I think the sleeper used to be on the rear (?), so that's a nice development.

The SCA seems to know what he's doing, and the snack box looks good.


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## Tlcooper93 (May 28, 2021)

William W. said:


> Consist tonight consists of power, baggage car, Viewliner I sleeper, cafe car w/biz class, and four coaches. I think the sleeper used to be on the rear (?), so that's a nice development.
> 
> The SCA seems to know what he's doing, and the snack box looks good.



The four times I’ve taken it now (including the inaugural) the sleeper has been the first car after baggage.


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## William W. (May 28, 2021)

Zero announcements, and I got my complimentary Woodford on the rocks. Night y'all

Overall it was a good experience. Tracks between Baltimore and NYP can definitely be a bit rough, but otherwise it felt like any other LD Viewliner sleeper train. I would definitely take again, especially on a day like today when flight delays are likely and I want to maximize my time in the city.


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## MARC Rider (May 29, 2021)

William W. said:


> Tracks between Baltimore and NYP can definitely be a bit rough,


 The tracks aren't rough, it's just that the train was probably going 110 mph most of the time. Now the short stretch between the Baltimore station and the mouth of the B&P Tunnel, that's some rough tracks, even at the slow speed the train is doing there.


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## AmtrakBlue (May 29, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> The tracks aren't rough, it's just that the train was probably going 110 mph most of the time. Now the short stretch between the Baltimore station and the mouth of the B&P Tunnel, that's some rough tracks, even at the slow speed the train is doing there.


And arriving at Wilmington northbound.


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## William W. (May 29, 2021)

MARC Rider said:


> The tracks aren't rough, it's just that the train was probably going 110 mph most of the time. Now the short stretch between the Baltimore station and the mouth of the B&P Tunnel, that's some rough tracks, even at the slow speed the train is doing there.



Well whatever it is, the rough spots are amplified when sleeping on a Viewliner vs sitting in a seat on the Acela. Certain points felt similar to the Buckingham Branch section of the Cardinal.

I'm not complaining, just conveying an observation.


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## Tlcooper93 (May 29, 2021)

Viewliners really aren’t meant to be going 110, so it definitely shows its age when the train gets up to speed.

ive taken 67 twice now and didn‘t really get to sleep until after Wilmington anyways, so it never bothered me.


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## Tlcooper93 (May 29, 2021)

William W. said:


> Well whatever it is, the rough spots are amplified when sleeping on a Viewliner vs sitting in a seat on the Acela. Certain points felt similar to the Buckingham Branch section of the Cardinal.
> 
> I'm not complaining, just conveying an observation.



I saw your train this morning when I hopped on the 8:05 southbound Acela. Love seeing sleepers more frequently at SS. Really makes the station feel like it matters again.


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## William W. (May 29, 2021)

Tlcooper93 said:


> I saw your train this morning when I hopped on the 8:05 southbound Acela. Love seeing sleepers more frequently at SS. Really makes the station feel like it matters again.



I also saw your train!
It was cool to be sitting in NYP just as 67 pulled in. Glad I woke up briefly.


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## MARC Rider (May 29, 2021)

William W. said:


> Well whatever it is, the rough spots are amplified when sleeping on a Viewliner vs sitting in a seat on the Acela. Certain points felt similar to the Buckingham Branch section of the Cardinal.



Of course, the Acela ain't the smoothest ride, either.


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## WashingtonFlyer (May 30, 2021)

Any other anecdotal or concrete reports on sleeping car occupancy? The GF has been flying recently so no new Amtrak reports on this end.


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## Tlcooper93 (May 30, 2021)

WashingtonFlyer said:


> Any other anecdotal or concrete reports on sleeping car occupancy? The GF has been flying recently so no new Amtrak reports on this end.


In the four times I’ve taken the sleeper car, it has increased every time to about 2/3 full the final time mid-May.


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## Palmetto (May 30, 2021)

Has anyone seen media advertising on this service?


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## Paul_1 (May 30, 2021)

WashingtonFlyer said:


> Any other anecdotal or concrete reports on sleeping car occupancy? The GF has been flying recently so no new Amtrak reports on this end.


On my WAS-BOS trip on Train 66 leaving WAS on May 25, the sleeping car attendant said we had 11 passengers.


How they were arranged in the bedrooms and roomettes, I don't know. I also don't know where they got on and off. At least one of the 11 passengers rode from NYP-BOS only.


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## Northwestern (Mar 31, 2022)

20th Century Rider said:


> Amtrak will go to the ends of the world to make sure they mess up a good idea... in this case a return to the 'Night Owl.' How much did it cost? Did they pay you to clean up the room you paid for??? Did those midnight announcements help you to sleep better? And was that bottle of Fiji water the best part of the trip?
> 
> Sounds like the service... is really 'watered down.'
> 
> ...





MainerTrainer said:


> Getting back to the overnight sleepers on the NEC...
> 
> Here is what I sent to Amtrak after riding Boston to DC and then back two days later. I wouldn’t do it again.
> 
> ...


********************************
The other night, I was scanning some of the movies offered on my YouTube TV channel. I came across this video, "A Hotel on Rails?":









Amtrak Roomette Overnight on the Northeast Regional Train


In this video, we’ll share our experience taking the Amtrak Commuter train, the Northeast Regional, overnight from Washington, DC to Boston, Massachusetts fo...




is.gd





I've never taken any Amtrak train in the eastern US, so the video on the Acela Night Owl, Washington, DC to Boston, at least for me was interesting. 

I was impressed by the Union Station in DC. Grand old building. I also liked the "big board" showing train departures and arrivals. Also, the many shops, stores (even a Wallgreens) and restaurants around the concourse. I also was impressed by the easy access to the AcelaClub lounge. It looked like the guy just pressed a button to get in, saying that it was easily accessable because he had roomette accommodations. When I last visited the Metropolitan Lounge, at the Amtrak Portland, OR Union station, you had to show your overnight ticket or Bus. Class ticket to a guy sitting at a desk, just to remain in the lounge. The breakfast box that was served to the couple didn't look that appetizing. As they mentioned in the video, wouldn't it be better to skip the box breakfast and journey to the Cafe car for, hopefully, better and warmer breakfast snacks. I think the problems the couple had in sleeping are probably not any different than with any other Amtrak overnight train. Is the DC to Boston track especially bumpy? I like to take along some "Unisom" (over-the-counter) tablets to help me sleep for overnight travel. It seems to work okay for me.


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## Tlcooper93 (Mar 31, 2022)

Anyone have any word as to when 65-67 is starting up again?

still can't book the train as of last night.


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## Amtrak25 (Mar 31, 2022)

I tried to book it to find out for train 67 on June 1, and it shows up. (That is no guarantee that it will come to pass). Coach from $33. Rooms from $318.


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## 20th Century Rider (Mar 31, 2022)

Amtrak25 said:


> I tried to book it to find out for train 67 on June 1, and it shows up. (That is no guarantee that it will come to pass). Coach from $33. Rooms from $318.


So sad is this attempt at a 'failed revival.' Umm! Take the $33 option with a nite cap before boarding. You will do just as well if not better... with lesser expectations and so tired you just fall into yur seat! And sleep! And get to the destination with still remaining big bucks in yer pocket for a grand hotel for a night stay upon arrival!

If only we all understood common sense... and Amtrak understood the definition of premium services that mean something and actually make a difference. Hmmm


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## MARC Rider (Mar 31, 2022)

Amtrak25 said:


> I tried to book it to find out for train 67 on June 1, and it shows up. (That is no guarantee that it will come to pass). Coach from $33. Rooms from $318.


Is that $33 from Boston to Washington? If so, snap it up!!!

Of course, the coaches are Amfleet 1 coaches, which a little skimpy in legroom, don't recline as far as they could, and have no window curtains, so you may or may not have a good night's sleep. You might want to spring a little extra for the business class, which is usually the 2x1 club seating with lots of legroom, leg rests, deep recline, and curtains on the windows. Even if the business class is one of the full Amfleet 1 business class cars with 2x2 seating, it still beats coack, as it has more legroom, a deeper recline of the seats, and curtains on the windows. Son't think curtains on the windows are important? Just wait until you're trying to sleep during the extended stop in New York Penn Station at 3 AM or thereabouts. They keep the platforms brightly lit all night long


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## AmtrakMaineiac (Apr 1, 2022)

I have a trip on 67 planned for September connecting at WAS to the Cardinal, hopefully it will be running sometime before then so that they can get the crews trained and the kinks ironed out by then.


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## TC_NYC (Apr 1, 2022)

AmtrakMaineiac said:


> I have a trip on 67 planned for September connecting at WAS to the Cardinal, hopefully it will be running sometime before then so that they can get the crews trained and the kinks ironed out by then.


You know the crews will show up surprised that the train even has a sleeping car... unfortunately.


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## Amtrak25 (Apr 1, 2022)

I read stories of the sleeper car attendant, off the Capitol Ltd pool, had no clue and no training on how to work Viewliner room functions, whether it was with the bed, shutting off the lights, or the PA system.


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## jis (Apr 1, 2022)

Amtrak25 said:


> I read stories of the sleeper car attendant, off the Capitol Ltd pool, had no clue and no training on how to work Viewliner room functions, whether it was with the bed, shutting off the lights, or the PA system.


Why would someone from the Cap pool know about Viewliners? He should not have been assigned outside his pool without further training.


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## Amtrak25 (Apr 1, 2022)

Of course he should have been trained. Boston has no sleeping car attendant, unless they sent the Chicago-based one off 448 on a another 2 night journey down to DC and back before heading back home on 449.


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## Rambling Robert (Apr 1, 2022)

I am on Train 11 PDX to LAX Car #1130 and Room 13. When I booked the trip I was told this is a west facing/ocean view roomette. Is there anyway to confirm west facing. Thanks much!

This is my first booked sleeper.


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## John Santos (Apr 2, 2022)

Rambling Robert said:


> I am on Train 11 PDX to LAX Car #1130 and Room 13. When I booked the trip I was told this is a west facing/ocean view roomette. Is there anyway to confirm west facing. Thanks much!
> 
> This is my first booked sleeper.


Generally, there is no way to predict which way a car will face and thus no way to know before the train is actually assembled on the day of departure which side the windows will be on. This applies to both sleepers and coaches. Even transdorms, which are usually right behind the baggage car and must have their upper level door facing the rest of the train, are sometimes placed at the back of the train instead of the front.

However, all things being equal, the trains are usually assembled in a particular order from the arriving train the previous day, following whatever procedures at that particular station and yard are used, normally to minimize the amount of switching, uncoupling and recoupling required. So once a particular order is established, it will most likely stay that way for a while. Many things can disrupt this, though, such as adding or removing a car due to seasonal load factors, or replacing a car down for maintenance, or a train getting turned around due to weather or a derailment blocking the tracks, or an accident that damages some of the cars. Maybe even training new yard operations people, they might disassemble and reassemble trains just for practice.

Amtrak often cares about the order of the train (e.g. baggage car followed by transdorm followed by sleepers followed by diner followed by coaches) but it rarely if ever cares about the direction any particular car is facing.

I don't know if anyone keeps any statistics for particular trains; it might turn out that 75% of the time, the 1st sleeper on train X has the odd numbered rooms on the left, but there is no guarantee.


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## Fenway (Apr 2, 2022)

In late February I booked a sleeper from Seattle to San Jose on #11 when work had me working a Boston Bruins road trip out west and everything ran like clockwork. My attendant was excellent and I did show my appreciation. 

He offered a telling comment when he said 'We run smoothly because Chicago is not involved'.

I have fond memories of the 'Night Owl' but never sprung for a sleeper as I could happily pass out in coach. I also learned the trick of taking either PATH or NJ Transit to Newark so I would be settled in before Penn Station.

I had the misfortune of being on this train 











1990 Back Bay, Massachusetts train collision - Wikipedia







en.wikipedia.org





Full disclosure - I can book anything on Amtrak at no charge for the rest of my life but I still wish the accident never happened. My last memory was thinking we were going too fast as we passed Ruggles.


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## AmtrakMaineiac (Apr 2, 2022)

Wikipedia has a pretty good writeup on the 1990 Night Owl crash

1990 Back Bay Rail Crash


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## joelkfla (Apr 2, 2022)

John Santos said:


> Generally, there is no way to predict which way a car will face and thus no way to know before the train is actually assembled on the day of departure which side the windows will be on. This applies to both sleepers and coaches.


True for Superliners. But Viewliner sleepers are oriented with the vestibule nearer the diner, for the benefit of passengers in the Accessible Bedroom, and I believe the position of the diner relative to the sleepers is constant for a particular train. I don't know whether this holds true for single-level trains with just a cafe car and sleepers.


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## Rambling Robert (Apr 2, 2022)

John Santos said:


> Generally, there is no way to predict which way a car will face and thus no way to know before the train is actually assembled on the day of departure which side the windows will be on. This applies to both sleepers and coaches. Even transdorms, which are usually right behind the baggage car and must have their upper level door facing the rest of the train, are sometimes placed at the back of the train instead of the front.
> 
> However, all things being equal, the trains are usually assembled in a particular order from the arriving train the previous day, following whatever procedures at that particular station and yard are used, normally to minimize the amount of switching, uncoupling and recoupling required. So once a particular order is established, it will most likely stay that way for a while. Many things can disrupt this, though, such as adding or removing a car due to seasonal load factors, or replacing a car down for maintenance, or a train getting turned around due to weather or a derailment blocking the tracks, or an accident that damages some of the cars. Maybe even training new yard operations people, they might disassemble and reassemble trains just for practice.
> 
> ...



Thanks John for confirming it a hit or miss of getting a “room with a view” - despite what the booking agent said. I’d rather have a west facing window in Coach ... BOS/CHI/PDX/LAX - I’m used to the good old Amtrak Coach seats.

So the booking agent wasn’t entirely truthful. 

So I guess - based on availability of window seats PDX to LAX in Coach (east or west viewing) - I’ll need to speak with the conductor or window agent in PDX to move from sleeper to Coach.

I don’t want to be disappointed in sleeper class.


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## Fenway (Apr 3, 2022)

AmtrakMaineiac said:


> Wikipedia has a pretty good writeup on the 1990 Night Owl crash
> 
> 1990 Back Bay Rail Crash



To this day I can't fathom how Amtrak hired that engineer given his track record and then be allowed to supervise a trainee. In the final 10 miles between 128 and Back Bay what was the need of being over 100 mph? 

It's a miracle nobody was killed. 

I have no memory of the crash as I remember being surprised at how fast the train was going between Forest Hills and Ruggles and then being at the ER at the then Boston City Hospital. Amtrak offered me a quick settlement of $2500 and a lifetime pass and I signed off on it. I was 40 years old then and I have only found out in the past 10 years that a hip problem I have can be traced back to that accident. 

I have no regrets.


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## Rambling Robert (Apr 3, 2022)

Fenway said:


> To this day I can't fathom how Amtrak hired that engineer given his track record and then be allowed to supervise a trainee. In the final 10 miles between 128 and Back Bay what was the need of being over 100 mph?
> 
> It's a miracle nobody was killed.
> 
> ...


Perhaps there’s a then 40 year old lawyer who still knows the settlement... and how to re-open the claim. What an infrastructure mess - Dartmouth St had a sinkhole?! It’s worth a few hours trying - for your hip.

Getting on the CZ in Emeryville is twisted my left knee and ankle on the Square Stair. An assistant conductor took some of my info then the Conductor came back with a claim number, etc. The pain is so infrequent now - I didn’t pursue the claim. I was very impressed with how concerned the conductor was.

The recent train BOS to NYP was very fast only minutes out of BBY to 128. My iPhone app clocked 113MPH. I was expecting 90!


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## Fenway (Apr 3, 2022)

Rambling Robert said:


> The recent train BOS to NYP was very fast only minutes out of BBY to 128. My iPhone app clocked 113MPH. I was expecting 90!



Heading south it is full throttle after BBY - inbound is a different story. 

If you drive from BBY to RTE you are looking at 25-40 minutes at best. 

When I-95 from Canton to Boston was killed in 1972 it destroyed the master plan of Boston expressways and that remains an issue today. The Orange Line should have been extended to RTE but a young Tom Menino stopped it fearing it would destroy Hyde Park following the playbook of the Red Line expansion not including Arlington and Lexington.


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## AmtrakMaineiac (Apr 3, 2022)

Rambling Robert said:


> The recent train BOS to NYP was very fast only minutes out of BBY to 128. My iPhone app clocked 113MPH. I was expecting 90!


According to a 2009 ETT RTE to Transfer is 130 for Acela, 120 for Regional, Transfer to BBY 120/110 respectively, for both tracks 1 and 2.
Transfer is the interlocking just South of Readville where the Dorchester Branch branches off.
Of course that ETT is 15 years old things may have changed since then.


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## jis (Apr 3, 2022)

AmtrakMaineiac said:


> According to a 2009 ETT RTE to Transfer is 130 for Acela, 120 for Regional, Transfer to BBY 120/110 respectively, for both tracks 1 and 2.
> Transfer is the interlocking just South of Readville where the Dorchester Branch branches off.
> Of course that ETT is 15 years old things may have changed since then.


Ignoring any TSRs, I believe it is the same today.


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