# Miami TRI-RAIL. (SFRTA)



## Just-Thinking-51 (Oct 4, 2010)

First time in 12 years or so since I been down in southern Florida. Got to see some of the TRI-RAIL from I 95. Two trains one south, one north bound.

The south bound was an Double Decker DMU that was start off from an station in an cloud of black smoke, but did pass me an few miles down the road. Question how are the DMU working out. Saving fuel, breakdowns? Also why is nobody washing these things. Sure I could see the FRA DMU stickers but the black stains from the exhust pipes cover everthing.

The north bound train was only two coaches and an engine. Wow small train. Sure there are some small one on this planet, but an two car communter train?

Next question: Nice stations but the ones I could see were in out of the way locations, and no acess to the east side of I 95. Sure the highway is like 8 to 10 lanes in that area, but a foot bridge cross to the east side of I 95 would be do-able and help bring in more riders. It seem most house units were on the east side of the highway. With the west side having more commerical type buildings.

Last question how are they doing. Yes most transit system are have issue these days, but how is the Tri Rail doing overall with there ridership?


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## jis (Oct 4, 2010)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> The north bound train was only two coaches and an engine. Wow small train. Sure there are some small one on this planet, but an two car communter train?


Not been to Philly lately? Scads of SEPTA EMUs are two car trains. NJT also occasionally runs two car trains specially on the Hoboken - Montclair scoot on weekends sometimes.


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## acelafan (Oct 4, 2010)

Just-Thinking-51 said:


> First time in 12 years or so since I been down in southern Florida. Got to see some of the TRI-RAIL from I 95. Two trains one south, one north bound.
> 
> The south bound was an Double Decker DMU that was start off from an station in an cloud of black smoke, but did pass me an few miles down the road. Question how are the DMU working out. Saving fuel, breakdowns? Also why is nobody washing these things. Sure I could see the FRA DMU stickers but the black stains from the exhust pipes cover everthing.
> 
> ...


Tri-Rail seems to be holding its own. One item I wish they could fix is the online realtime train tracking tool. It was supposed to be a GPS solution that would give you up to the minute updates of train delays; the feature on the web has been disabled for more than a year now and you have to call the customer service number or rely on station PA announcements which can be hard to hear.

Tri-Rail had to fight for funding last year...under threat of severe service cutbacks I believe the state legislature stepped in and provided monies or allowed TriRail to use its capital reserve fund...which causes a host of other issues. I think fares were raised a buck or two...which is about a 20% raise since the fares are low to begin with...but the service has been running and people do use it, that's for sure.

I'm not a proponent to build walkways over I-95....it's just not an inviting environment for passengers to be in. Parts of south florida aren't exactly the safest and one could feel trapped on a walkover over the highway that would undoubtedly be fenced in to prevent debris from being thrown onto the highway below.


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## AlanB (Oct 4, 2010)

The legislature at the last minute stepped in and approved legislation that imposes an extra tax on car rentals within the Tri-Rail service area, with the revenue being generated by that going to Tri-Rail. I think it's something like $2 or so. No capital funds were transfered to my knowledge. Had they failed to pass that tax, it was the third try IIRC, Tri-Rail would have slashed service for lack of funding. That in turn would have trigged the Fed to ask for its money back, since the Fed helped to double track the entire line and with that came an obligation to run some 40 trains per weekeday for at least 20 years IIRC.

Turning to Tri-Rail stations, many are close to a highway underpass/overpass, so walking is still an option at many of the stations.

Finally in the second quarter of this year they were averaging around 12,000 daily riders. Looking quickly ridership through June was down about 9%, due largely to the economy but perhaps a small part is because of the fare increase.


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## battalion51 (Oct 4, 2010)

All I can say is the DMUs were a friggin mistake. I'm out of the loop as to how they're doing mechanically, but I think they probably would've been good unpowered trailers. The service is definitely used, and I think they've been so afraid to do rate hikes, but they never kept up with cost of living adjustments or increases in fuel prices. The other thing with this system is that it was thought out to be used to connect to bus services to get you to your ultimate destination, not have everything be in walking distance. There certainly are some places where you could walk if your job was nearby, but it's in no way the Subway. But even if you look at systems like Metro North or MBTA the commuter rail system brings you to a destination where you likely connect to a bus or subway line to get to your final destination.


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## Green Maned Lion (Oct 4, 2010)

jis said:


> Just-Thinking-51 said:
> 
> 
> > The north bound train was only two coaches and an engine. Wow small train. Sure there are some small one on this planet, but an two car communter train?
> ...


Not to mention the likely soon-to-be-discontinued Great Princeton Junction & Princeton Rail Road's (GPJ&PRR) amazingly long Dinky. It consists of a single Arrow III EMU.


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## Nexis4Jersey (Oct 4, 2010)

DMU's aren't a mistake , there the future unless you want to pay higher fares passed down form fuel costs. DMU's save alot of fuel , but should only be used on long lines with ridership less then 15,000. EMU's should be used on busy lines were the need for long trains is there. Double Decker DMU's are a mistake they don't really save fuel.


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## Eric S (Oct 5, 2010)

Nexis4Jersey said:


> DMU's aren't a mistake , there the future unless you want to pay higher fares passed down form fuel costs. DMU's save alot of fuel , but should only be used on long lines with ridership less then 15,000. EMU's should be used on busy lines were the need for long trains is there. Double Decker DMU's are a mistake they don't really save fuel.


I don't think people are necessarily suggesting that DMUs in concept are a mistake, but rather that the particular DMUs that Tri-Rail has (from Colorado Railcar) were a mistake.


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## Nexis4Jersey (Oct 5, 2010)

I was talking about these DMU's , no Colorado Railcar made fuel sucker ugly DMU's DMU's are becoming popular in Texas , Colorado , California , Northwest and Northeast either as Light Rail or Regional Rail. It depends on the type of the service.







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## MattW (Oct 5, 2010)

Actually, this (these?) is (are?) Tri-rail's DMU(s).

http://www.nationalcorridors.org/df/df05172004c.jpg

The Alaska Railroad also has one, they're ridiculously tall with the high-level deck at the 48" standard height and a full second-level above that!

When I look at them, I'm always afraid that if a pax on the top deck sneezed just right, it'd flip over


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## George Harris (Oct 5, 2010)

In general, teh Colorado Railcar DMU appears to be a bad implementation of a really good idea. Given the ridership in soth Florida - and the potential for hurricane winds, there is no need for double deckers and some real safety issues with using them.


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## MattW (Oct 5, 2010)

George Harris said:


> In general, teh Colorado Railcar DMU appears to be a bad implementation of a really good idea. Given the ridership in soth Florida - and the potential for hurricane winds, there is no need for double deckers and some real safety issues with using them.


Well is it just double deckers? Don't the Superliners have a lower center of gravity compared to the Amfleets? Granted, they're like a sail, but the lower CoG has to count for something.


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## AlanB (Oct 5, 2010)

Tri-Rail shuts down operations long before hurricane strength winds approach the area. They do that in large part because they pull all the gates off the crossings, lest they become flying missles.


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## battalion51 (Oct 8, 2010)

As Alan said, rail operations go on curfew well before any storm arrives, so the wind issue is negligible. Tri-Rail has had a fleet of double deckers (in the Bombardier Coaches) for its entire existence, and they survived Andrew. I think they can handle pretty much anything. My beef isn't with DMUs as a concept, but rather with the particular DMUs bought. I personally think the success of MU cars lies in their low weight, but the issue with the Colorado Railcar model is that they relied on a transmission to turn the wheels. Any other MU out there that's been successful has used electric motors to turn the wheels. If they would've had a diesel electric model where you're not going to burn out the transmission by going from the 4th notch straight to the 8th, then you'd be fine. But that's not what happened with these cars/


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## George Harris (Oct 8, 2010)

battalion51 said:


> My beef isn't with DMUs as a concept, but rather with the particular DMUs bought. . . . . Any other MU out there that's been successful has used electric motors to turn the wheels. If they would've had a diesel electric model where you're not going to burn out the transmission by going from the 4th notch straight to the 8th, then you'd be fine.


The Budd RDC cars have mechanical transmissions. Even though the design is about 60 years old, I can use the present tense because there are quite a few of these things still running. The problem is not the use of a mechanical transmission, but the mechanical transmission that was used was not up to the job. Colorado Railcar seemed to have a knack for taking a good idea and impementing it badly.


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