# Why Amtrak is not serving Yellowstone?



## Guest (Aug 1, 2007)

I wonder why Amtrak is not serving Yellowstone Park?

It's a great tourist attraction and it's very far from major airports.

The only way to get there - driving VERY long road.

Amtrak could attract many tourists like they did it with Glacier National Park.


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## Penn Central (Aug 1, 2007)

Amtrak has barley enough equipment to run what it has, let alone anything new.


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## EmpireBuilderFan (Aug 1, 2007)

Guest said:


> I wonder why Amtrak is not serving Yellowstone Park?It's a great tourist attraction and it's very far from major airports.
> 
> The only way to get there - driving VERY long road.
> 
> Amtrak could attract many tourists like they did it with Glacier National Park.


Unfortunately, Yellowstone is closer to major Interstates (I-90 and I-15) than it is to any Amtrak service (the Empire Builder or the California Zephyr). The only way that Amtrak could provide any kind of service to Yellowstone at this time is through bus service from the Builder or Zephyr as there are no rail connections near Yellowstone. At one time, both the Union Pacific and the Northern Pacific had tracks that ran to the edge of Yellowstone (UP to West Yellowstone, MT; NP to Gardiner, MT), but both were abandoned and removed many years ago.

The best Amtrak could do, short of rebuilding one of the branches to Yellowstone, is to resurrect the North Coast Hiawatha along the former NP (now BNSF and Montana Rail Link) and provide a bus link at Livingston, MT. Personally, I'd love to see the NP branch rebuilt to Livingston, and Amtrak run through cars from both Seattle and Chicago to Yellowstone, but that's not likely to happen any time soon.


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## Guest (Aug 2, 2007)

EmpireBuilderFan said:


> Guest said:
> 
> 
> > I wonder why Amtrak is not serving Yellowstone Park?
> ...


I saw commercial of Orient Express and they go to Yellowstone. So tracks actually exist?


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## George Harris (Aug 2, 2007)

Guest said:


> EmpireBuilderFan said:
> 
> 
> > Unfortunately, Yellowstone is closer to major Interstates (I-90 and I-15) than it is to any Amtrak service (the Empire Builder or the California Zephyr). The only way that Amtrak could provide any kind of service to Yellowstone at this time is through bus service from the Builder or Zephyr as there are no rail connections near Yellowstone. At one time, both the Union Pacific and the Northern Pacific had tracks that ran to the edge of Yellowstone (UP to West Yellowstone, MT; NP to Gardiner, MT), but both were abandoned and removed many years ago.
> ...


No they don't. You finish your trip to Yellowstone by bus from some point on the currently existing railroad, probably from a point on the Empire Builder route. There is simply no other way. EmpireBuilderFan has the track situation exactly right to the best of my knowledge.

George


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## PRR 60 (Aug 2, 2007)

Guest said:


> I saw commercial of Orient Express and they go to Yellowstone. So tracks actually exist?


The GrandLuxe (formerly the American Orient Express) accesses Yellowstone via bus from the Union Pacific line in Idaho. I believe they use Idaho Falls, ID as the bus pick-up location. It is about 110 miles from Idaho Falls to Jackson, WY.


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## PhilaBurbTom (Aug 2, 2007)

I remember years ago when I worked in Yellowstone right near the West entrance there was a lone rail bumper in a small grassy area. It was described to me at the time as what was left of the end of the line into West Yellowstone. I also remember people that could recall when the passenger train service ran through Livingston above the park. Back in the late 1800's early 1900's artists like Thomas Moran were hired by the railroads to do scenic paintings which were used in railroad advertising to encourage travel to the Crown Jewels of the National Park System. Unfortunatly Congress insists that new routes must make money or at least break even so while it would be a grear rail destination I would not hold my breath.


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## George Harris (Aug 2, 2007)

Trains to the Yellowstone gateway stations died long before Amtrak. Not even sure they made it into the 60's at all. Note that in both cases the railroads only made it to the boundary of the park, not into it. Only the ATSF line that is now the Grand Canyon Railway into Grand Canyon National Park actually gets inside the boundary of any national park anywhere. Only other exception: I believe that the Yosemite Railroad also got in the park at Yosemite, but that line is long gone, I think in the 1930's.


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## MrFSS (Aug 2, 2007)

This is from the 9/25/1960 Union Pacific Table. Direct service from LAX to West Yellowstone (summer only) with sleeper car service.


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## George Harris (Aug 2, 2007)

Wow! coaches and sleepers right to the door. However, it did require a change of trains at Salt Lake City. Looks like you could also make connections to/from the east at Ogden.


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## gswager (Aug 2, 2007)

George Harris said:


> Trains to the Yellowstone gateway stations died long before Amtrak. Not even sure they made it into the 60's at all. Note that in both cases the railroads only made it to the boundary of the park, not into it. Only the ATSF line that is now the Grand Canyon Railway into Grand Canyon National Park actually gets inside the boundary of any national park anywhere. Only other exception: I believe that the Yosemite Railroad also got in the park at Yosemite, but that line is long gone, I think in the 1930's.


What about Glacier National Park?


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## MrFSS (Aug 3, 2007)

gswager said:


> George Harris said:
> 
> 
> > Trains to the Yellowstone gateway stations died long before Amtrak. Not even sure they made it into the 60's at all. Note that in both cases the railroads only made it to the boundary of the park, not into it. Only the ATSF line that is now the Grand Canyon Railway into Grand Canyon National Park actually gets inside the boundary of any national park anywhere. Only other exception: I believe that the Yosemite Railroad also got in the park at Yosemite, but that line is long gone, I think in the 1930's.
> ...


I don't have a table, but an old RR map shows the Great Northern stooped at Glacier, just as the EB does today. Probably was regular service there doe a long time.


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## Bill Haithcoat (Aug 3, 2007)

So often when the question comes up, "Why doesn't Amtrak go to so-and-so?" usually two major points can be made..

1. We don't have the equipment, the funding, the still-operable track, co-operation with the states it would pass through, etc

and 2. The trains often did go to such places in the distant past.

When Amtrak began in 1971 the idea (or, at least what we were told) was something like this: tear down much of the nations rapidly dwindlinig passenger service. Build from the ashes up again with just a few select routes, the most promising. Work and build on them,gradually expand, all with new focus, new marketing, etc.

Well, a lot of water has gone over the dam since then, some really good things have worked out under Amtrak, many have not. There has been quite a bit of experimentation with different routes in its 36 year history.


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## Guest (Aug 3, 2007)

I saw the Orinet Express running into the yard at Idaho Falls in June. Tracks do go past that point, but that is where they discharge the passengers for Yellowstone. I saw the same equipment at Grand Canyon a few days before where I work.


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## EmpireBuilderFan (Aug 3, 2007)

gswager said:


> What about Glacier National Park?


According to Google maps, the BNSF mainline that the Empire Builder runs on is a large chunk of the southern border of Glacier Park, but it doesn't appear that the railroad actually enters the park. Also, none of the EB depots (East Glacier, West Glacier, and Essex) are actually within the park boundaries.


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## Penn Central (Aug 3, 2007)

The Great Northern never built into the park itself. However, they did take advantage of having, until the 1930's and U.S. 2, a virtual monopoly on transport to the park. That's why they advetised the park and not the trains, the they assumed (rightly) that every one would have to take the train to get there.


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## Guest (Aug 4, 2007)

We are on an auto trip around western U.S. Two nights ago had dinner at the Yellowstone Lake hotel and saw the 1935 Yellowstone touring cars that have been restored. Eight of over a hundred have been reclaimed from various owners around the country and had the exterior fully restored with all new mechanical parts. The are used daily to take guests to various activities around the park. The NP owned the Park hotels and used these to transport guests from the train. Be great to see these meeting an Amtrak train.

In today's world, probably the most likely would be connection to the EB if it had a summer only southern connection on the Montana RailLink line. Another possibility might be the Pioneer route if that was reinstated. Not sure the closest city from that to the park.


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## Linus Bowman (Oct 30, 2011)

*Moderator note: this reply is to a topic that has been inactive for four years.* 

I worked for the UP starting in 1953 at Idaho Falls Idaho,yard as a switchman and as a brakeman north of Idaho Falls. Until the late 50's the Yellowstone special ran from about May until late October. It came in at night on the rear of the Butte Special and we set it over on the Yellowstone main line and left for west Yellowstone In the morning. It returned about 11:00 at night and we attached it to the rear end of the Ogden, Utah bound returning Butte Special. The Engines were furnished at Idaho Falls. The Yellowstone Main line split at Ashton, Idaho, 51 miles north if Idaho Falls and continued to both West Yellowstone, Montana and Victor Idaho. The tracks to West Yellowstone from Ashton north were torn up in the early 60's And turned into a hiking and snowmoble trail. A tunnel on that line has also collapsed.

The reason for the seasonal running of the Yellowstone train was the heavy snow fall. The UP would plow out the track in May. Some of the drifts were fifteen feet deep.


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