# AGR/voucher manipulation



## Slasharoo (Jul 3, 2013)

We are planning a September trip from Milwaukee to San Diego. I have enough points for two, two-zone roomette redemptions. I was hoping to go out on EB to CS to Pacific Surfliner. Then after a few days in San Diego, take the CS back to Sacramento as paid coach. After a couple days in Sacramento, board the CZ roomette redemption back to Milwaukee.

I am worried about missing the EB/CS connection and I was thinking about reserving a roomette on the next day's CS as insurance. If the train is on time, I can cancel that extra reservation and use the voucher to pay for the trip from SD to Sacramento.

What problems do you all see with this plan?


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## Rail Freak (Jul 3, 2013)

_I've been told that Amtrak will catch that before your travel date & will cancel at least one reservation! I'm sure others will chime in on this!!!_


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## Ryan (Jul 3, 2013)

Yep, that would be a "duplicate booking or impossible reservation" and get cancelled.


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## the_traveler (Jul 3, 2013)

If you're talking about the EB>CS connection in PDX, I old not worry about it. That connection is over 4 hours long and is a guaranteed connection. There is very small chance of missing it. And if for some reason you do, Amtrak will pay for the hotel and food overnight! If you yourself made the stop, you would have to redeem a 2 zone award to PDX, pay for the hotel yourself and then redeem another 1 zone award south. (No stopovers over 23:30 allowed on an award trip.)


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## Slasharoo (Jul 3, 2013)

Rail Freak said:


> _I've been told that Amtrak will catch that before your travel date & will cancel at least one reservation! I'm sure others will chime in on this!!!_


My wife would then have to make that reservation???(different last name)


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## the_traveler (Jul 3, 2013)

That might work. But as I stated above, if you do that you would either have to pay cash or redeem another 1 zone award. Plus you would have to pay for the hotel, not Amtrak.


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## amamba (Jul 3, 2013)

Don't reserve a roomette on two dates. That is kind of not nice for two reasons. The first is that the trains often sell out, so you are now keeping that room from being booked in advance by someone who wants it. The second is that if you do cancel just prior to departure, amtrak might not sell that room, thereby depriving them of revenue that they so desperately need.


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## Ryan (Jul 3, 2013)

the_traveler said:


> That might work. But as I stated above, if you do that you would either have to pay cash or redeem another 1 zone award. Plus you would have to pay for the hotel, not Amtrak.


Let me see if I can explain this better.
Plan A is to not make the stop and book one trip all the way through.

What he's asking about is the wisdom of booking a room on the CS for the day after as "insurance". In the event that the train is delayed and the connection is missed, when Amtrak puts him up in a hotel for the night and tries to put him in coach the next day (because sleepers are sold out), he can just use the paid room and all will be well.

In the likely event that the connection is made, he can just cancel the "insurance room" and use the voucher to pay for other travel.


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## the_traveler (Jul 3, 2013)

And as amamba stated, if it is cancelled by the OP because the connection is made, there is a very good chance that the room will go unsold in the 24 hours prior to departure. Thus depriving Amtrak of revenue.

Remember, onboard upgrades are now sold at the current bucket, not low bucket. So if someone decided not to pay $300 for a Roomette before getting on the train, they most likely will not pay $300 or $350 (if the bucket rose) once on the train!


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## Slasharoo (Jul 3, 2013)

the_traveler said:


> And as amamba stated, if it is cancelled by the OP because the connection is made, there is a very good chance that the room will go unsold in the 24 hours prior to departure. Thus depriving Amtrak of revenue.
> Remember, onboard upgrades are now sold at the current bucket, not low bucket. So if someone decided not to pay $300 for a Roomette before getting on the train, they most likely will not pay $300 or $350 (if the bucket rose) once on the train!


Right. I do not like doing this at all, but my wife's health at that time will be such that if we cannot get a roomette for overnights, we will have to fly back from Portland. The four hour layover is helpful, so maybe we will roll the dice.


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## Ryan (Jul 3, 2013)

It's a pretty safe connection:


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## Slasharoo (Jul 3, 2013)

Thanks Ryan, that makes us feel a little more confidant. Do you have a graph showing the connection going the other way? I have read that that is the best direction to travel on the EB, but I don't know if a 73 minute layover from the CS is better or worse than a 4 hour layover on the EB? The EB is a longer route with a more sketchy OTR, at least anecdotally but your east bound chart shows the fall is pretty consistently good. Is the northbound CS the same?


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## Ryan (Jul 3, 2013)

That's the _west_bound EB into PDX.

Here's the CS into PDX, and these are DEPARTURE times, so arrival times are even better:


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## Slasharoo (Jul 3, 2013)

ok, is there a consensus of any kind here? Is the connection more likely to happen going CS to EB (73 minutes) or EB to CS (255 minutes)? I know one layover is considerably longer, but one route is considerably longer as well which could lead to more delays.


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## the_traveler (Jul 3, 2013)

I can only speak for myself. I have done both connections many times over the past many years, and I've never missed either connection in PDX.


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## Acela150 (Jul 4, 2013)

The one thing the CS schedule has is, Padding! You'll be fine both ways!


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## Jason McHuff (Jul 4, 2013)

At least in the past, the Coast Starlight has been noted for its tardiness, with Empire Builder connecting passengers getting bussed from Klamath Falls up to Washington, and the Empire Builder can get delayed by weather (though September may not be the most likely for that) and maybe oil trains.

And they will hold the other train if it's worth it--either a short time or a lot of connecting passengers. In addition, it's always possible that someone with a sleeper reservation might not make it or show up the next day.

But if you did get stuck in coach, would you at least get a refund on the sleeper cost (and hopefully still access to the parlour car)?


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## AlanB (Jul 4, 2013)

You would get a voucher for the missing sleeper, not a points refund. In theory one is still supposed to get all the rest of the perks that you would have received as a sleeper pax, including meals. In practice, I'm not so sure if things would go smoothly enough that you'd get into the PPC.


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## crescent2 (Jul 4, 2013)

I've not made the trip, but an AGR agent suggested that I overnight in PDX, from the nb CS to the eb EB. He seemed to think a bustitution would be likely or the connection missed. Take that for what you think it's worth.


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## Slasharoo (Jul 4, 2013)

crescent2 said:


> I've not made the trip, but an AGR agent suggested that I overnight in PDX, from the nb CS to the eb EB. He seemed to think a bustitution would be likely or the connection missed. Take that for what you think it's worth.


can I offer to overnight in PDX on my own dime and still keep it part of a two zone reward?


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## Ryan (Jul 5, 2013)

No.

I also wouldn't worry about the connection, the data above suggests that it is rarely missed.


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## Slasharoo (Jul 5, 2013)

Thanks everyone for your help. I am going to start looking at dates soon.


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## crescent2 (Jul 5, 2013)

As Ryan said, the agent said that would necessitate using an additional award. If my trip pans out, I doubt I'll do the overnight. I could tolerate a bustitution if I had to on that part of my route, and my trip is already too long in days as is.

Please let us know how yours goes.


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## Slasharoo (Jul 15, 2013)

Well, I finally got to make my reservations for my first AGR reward trip. I did change it up a little from my original idea, thanks to all the help I received here. We are going out on the CZ to Sacramento for a couple days, CS to Santa Barbara for three days, then back to MKE on CS-EB. The middle CSs leg will be paid for, but the other two are covered. Two and a half months is a long time to wait, though...


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## the_traveler (Jul 15, 2013)

Sounds great! 

One suggestion is that if the fare is not that much more, you may want to consider getting a room for the SAC-SBA segment. Yes, I know it is a daytime trip, but it includes 3 meals per person (maybe worth $40+ per person) plus access to the PPC (priceless)!


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## Slasharoo (Jul 15, 2013)

Traveler,

I was anticipating you suggesting that...I checked and noticed that it was definitely low bucket...done. 

The Parlour car was probably the kicker on that deal, though.


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