# Are the sleeper rooms always on the same side of the train?



## Gregory (Aug 16, 2015)

Hi, I have found that the roomettes are numbered with even numbered rooms on one side and odd number rooms on the other. I am wondering if the odd/even numbered are always on the same side of the train no matter what direction it is running, or is it just left however it works out?

I guess what I'm asking in other words is, do they turn the whole train around on a loop at the end of the run, or do they just reconnect the cars in the correct order without changing they direction they face?

I'm just trying to see if I can predict which side of the train my roomette window will be on during my upcoming trip. I hope my question makes sence.

Thanks.


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## Ispolkom (Aug 16, 2015)

Gregory said:


> I'm just trying to see if I can predict which side of the train my roomette window will be on during my upcoming trip. I hope my question makes sence.
> 
> Thanks.


Generally speaking, no you can't predict which side of the train your roomette will face. There are exceptions, though. Aren't the bedrooms on westbound Lake Shore Limited always on the right side of the train, so the vestibule is next to the dining car?


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## Ryan (Aug 16, 2015)

Viewliner - yes

Superliner - no


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## George K (Aug 16, 2015)

Ryan said:


> Viewliner - yes
> 
> Superliner - no


That's interesting, Ryan. On my trip on #27 last year, the guy in the roomette across the hall said that he specifically requested being on the north side of the train. Reading this forum proved that his request was, um, either not true or ignored.

But, on the Viewliners, is there a way that I can tell which side (north, south, east west) I'll be on a specific train (taking 49 next month in a bedroom)?


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## Devil's Advocate (Aug 16, 2015)

Gregory said:


> I guess what I'm asking in other words is, do they turn the whole train around on a loop at the end of the run, or do they just reconnect the cars in the correct order without changing they direction they face? I'm just trying to see if I can predict which side of the train my roomette window will be on during my upcoming trip. I hope my question makes sence.


Your question makes plenty of sense and many modern passenger railroads will allow you to specify the side of the train and the specific seat or compartment you want as part of the ticketing process. Unfortunately with the exception of a few very specific Viewliners the Amtrak operations staff makes no attempt to keep cars in any particular orientation regardless of the circumstance.


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## jis (Aug 16, 2015)

Even for Viewliners you can only be certain about the car adjacent to the Diner. The other cars I have seen in non-standard orientation on occasions, so you can't depend on it.


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## rrdude (Aug 17, 2015)

jis said:


> Even for Viewliners you can only be certain about the car adjacent to the Diner. The other cars I have seen in non-standard orientation on occasions, so you can't depend on it.


And you know what? That_* pretty much sums up Amtrak*_ as a Railroad, and their Operations Department, and their Marketing Department's, ability-willingness to provide a quality experience. (you can add your own other deficiencies here too.......)

Imagine you are starting a new, Intercity passenger train today. (Think FEC) what do you think one of the FIRST attributes your website-ticketing engine would allow? Yep, seat selection. I _know_ even with those foreign RR passenger lines, and high volume tourist lines that offer seat selection, there are SNAFU's and FUBAR's, but please folks, this isn't rocket science.

Would it increase Amtrak's cost per train? I think it would, as many, many, more cars or train-sets would need to be either turned, or more semi-permanently assigned to certain routes.

IMHO, the "biggest bang, for the smallest buck" would be


Better Amtrak-to-passenger communication
Vastly improved OBS, and to a smaller extent T & E crew service. (A matter of training and monitoring)
Empowering line employees to make decisions regarding issues when later/missed trains cause very upset customers
Re-Installing Train Chiefs or Train Managers on every LD run
Allowing LD Route Managers more discretion on marketing, staffing, and amenities. (hold them accountable for profit/loss of said amenities)


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## zephyr17 (Aug 17, 2015)

Gregory said:


> Hi, I have found that the roomettes are numbered with even numbered rooms on one side and odd number rooms on the other. I am wondering if the odd/even numbered are always on the same side of the train no matter what direction it is running, or is it just left however it works out?
> 
> I guess what I'm asking in other words is, do they turn the whole train around on a loop at the end of the run, or do they just reconnect the cars in the correct order without changing they direction they face?
> 
> ...


They typically wye the train, but particularly at the train's service base they will swap the cars in and out for any number of reasons. Car gets bad ordered, time for a major inspection, car on another train going out earlier gets bad ordered and they swap in a car from another train's consist. When they do that, they don't pay any attention to the orientation of the car, since Superliners can run either direction forward. For coaches, they just flip the seats around.

You really can't predict. Sleepers even in the same consist can and frequently are oriented differently.


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## Manny T (Aug 17, 2015)

This is something I've been trying to figure out for years. Maybe it's just me.

I take the LSL a lot to NYC. I ALWAYS want a roomette on the Hudson River side. I almost never get it.

What I have concluded so far (this is LSL specific) is this:

The CHI-NYC sleepers are always in the back of the train.

The dining car is always in front of the sleepers.

The bedrooms are always closest to the dining car.

The train runs EW between CHI-Albany, then NS between NYC & Albany.

The Hudson River is west of the tracks.

Therefore going North (i.e. heading to Chicago) the even numbered roomettes are on the Hudson.

Going South (to NYC) the odd numbered roomettes are on the Hudson.

If I am wrong, I would welcome any corrections.

If this information can translate to any other Viewliner trips, I would be happy.


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## chakk (Aug 17, 2015)

I've been told by a big fan of the New York Central (who models it in his home) that the railroad always oriented sleeping cars so that the bedrooms faced the Hudson River.


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## the_traveler (Aug 17, 2015)

Normally, the CHI-NYP sleepers and Dining Car are on the rear of the LSL and the CHI-BOS sleeper is on the front of the train. However, with the track construction at ALB the BOS sleeper is also going to NYP. During this time, all sleepers are on the front followed by the Dining Car, and then coaches.

Thus during this period, it is the *ODD* roomettes and the bedrooms that will be on the Hudson River side.


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## Devil's Advocate (Aug 17, 2015)

rrdude said:


> Imagine you are starting a new, Intercity passenger train today. (Think FEC) what do you think one of the FIRST attributes your website-ticketing engine would allow? Yep, seat selection. I _know_ even with those foreign RR passenger lines, and high volume tourist lines that offer seat selection, there are SNAFU's and FUBAR's, but please folks, this isn't rocket science.


It must be the freight railroads' fault or congress or the FRA or some other big bad bogeyman. There is no way Amtrak have shot themselves in the foot on this.


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## Manny T (Aug 17, 2015)

Sorry, I don't think the bedrooms (H, A, B) can always be on the Hudson River side. There is an aisle alongside the bedrooms. So if the bedrooms are always in the front of the Sleeper car, closest to the dining room, in one direction the bedrooms will be on the Hudson River side, and in the other direction the aisle will be on the Hudson River side.


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## FormerOBS (Aug 17, 2015)

I don't know the servicing practices in NYC. If the train is turned intact on a wye or loop (as I suspect), then the rooms will be on one side eastbound and on the other side westbound. If the train is disassembled and reoriented without turning, then they will be on the same side. The latter process is more troublesome and time consuming, but is sometimes necessary if a turning wye or loop isn't available.

Tom


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## GG-1 (Aug 17, 2015)

Aloha

When I rode the PRR the cars were always at a platform with the doors together so the personel could service 2 cars for boarding. In those days I was not in sleepers so cannot say they were the same.


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## zephyr17 (Aug 17, 2015)

FormerOBS said:


> I don't know the servicing practices in NYC. If the train is turned intact on a wye or loop (as I suspect), then the rooms will be on one side eastbound and on the other side westbound. If the train is disassembled and reoriented without turning, then they will be on the same side. The latter process is more troublesome and time consuming, but is sometimes necessary if a turning wye or loop isn't available.
> 
> Tom


I am pretty sure Sunnyside has a loop track.


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## rrdude (Aug 17, 2015)

zephyr17 said:


> FormerOBS said:
> 
> 
> > I don't know the servicing practices in NYC. If the train is turned intact on a wye or loop (as I suspect), then the rooms will be on one side eastbound and on the other side westbound. If the train is disassembled and reoriented without turning, then they will be on the same side. The latter process is more troublesome and time consuming, but is sometimes necessary if a turning wye or loop isn't available.
> ...


Yep.


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## jis (Aug 17, 2015)

But that does not mean the consists always remain the same. They do change from time to time for various reasons, and sometimes things get switched in oriented backwards or abnormal-wards.


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## zephyr17 (Aug 17, 2015)

I honestly can't think of a terminal where they do not wye (more common) or loop the train and have to shuffle it to keep in the right order. Unlike Sunnyside, most Amtrak yards don't have the capability to turn the train right on the property, but they run down and wye it somewhere else. In Seattle they use the Coach Yard Wye to turn the Builder and Starlight (Cascades are push-pull), which despite its name isn't in the coach yard. It is a bit south of the Amtrak maintenance yard.

But as jis pointed out, it isn't turning the train that causes the issue of equipment orientation, it is substitution of cars for any number of reasons. The yards just put the equipment in the consist however it is easiest, they don't try to turn individual cars around. Unlike the equipment inherited from the railroads, Superliner sleepers don't have a firm orientation. The the older RR equipment did and were built to run facing one way and one way only. Note that in Superliner roomettes, the rooms on either side of the aisle are oriented in opposite directions. In the sleepers Amtrak inherited from the RRs, the roomettes all faced the same way.


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## TinCan782 (Aug 17, 2015)

With my two Coast Starlight round trips the northbound #14 bedrooms were on the ocean (west) side. The same consistency was noted on the southbound #11...the bedrooms were on the inland side! 

Using the "wye" in Seattle as mentioned by zephyr17 is the reason.


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## zephyr17 (Aug 18, 2015)

Last time I was on the Starlight, the 1130 was bedrooms forward (bedrooms on the inland side), 1131 was roomettes forward (bedrooms the ocean side), and 1132 was roomettes forward. Just depends.


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## willem (Aug 18, 2015)

FrensicPic said:


> With my two Coast Starlight round trips the northbound #14 bedrooms were on the ocean (west) side. The same consistency was noted on the southbound #11...the bedrooms were on the inland side!


Ditto for one recent Coast Starlight round trip.


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## west point (Aug 23, 2015)

The single level rains are generally turned on a loop at Sunnyside ( NYP ), Miami, New Orleans. Chicago has to wye trains. CHI is where single level cars get messed up because they will not take time to wye a train consist if the equipment has arrived too late to make scheduled departure time. As posted elsewhere Seattle, Portland, Oregon, Emeryville ( San Francisco ) , and Los Angeles all have to wye trains If the LAX pass thru tracks ever get built then it will have a natural loop that will save 30 - 45 minutes for maintenance..


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## TinCan782 (Aug 23, 2015)

Can't imaging the run-through tracks being used for long distance trains that originate/terminate in LA. The idea for the run-through tracks is to benefit commuter/regional trains like Metrolink and Pacific Surfliner which may "run through" LAUS after making a stop. I believe the run-through tracks will be the 4 (or so) closest to the station (west) with the outer tracks remaining as is.


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