# SEPTA during the Papal Visit: A Transit Map Like You've Never Seen



## fairviewroad (Jun 24, 2015)

I'm trying to wrap my mind around this. During the Pope's visit to Philly on September 26 and 27, SEPTA will _severely_ curtail its service. For example:



> SEPTA will reduce the number of stations that will be used from the usual 282 to 31 on its Regional Rail, Market-Frankford Line subway/elevated, Broad Street Line subway, trolley lines and Norristown High Speed Line.


Those 31 stations include just one or two stops on each line. [see map below.] Tickets will be reserved and sold only in advance. [Among other things, you won't be able to do the NJT-SEPTA connection in Trenton, since SEPTA won't even be serving Trenton that weekend.]

The idea seems to be to funnel Papal fans to specific stations so that trains can simply load and go into Center City. But what about parking at those stations? They're not designed to handle an entire trainload of passengers.

The Broad Street and Market-Frankford Lines will operate under similar restrictions, even though those routes must surely be used by transit-dependent people who will still need to get to work, etc, that weekend. Basically, the only SEPTA rail service that will operate largely unchanged will be the Subway Surface lines, except Route 10 which will not operate at all.

Basically SEPTA and Philadelphia's plan seems to be "If you aren't here to see the Pope, you're not welcome this weekend."

You can get a detailed overview here.


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## C855B (Jun 24, 2015)

Wow. A Pope's visit. Granted, Pope Francis is far, far more popular than his predecessors with both the faithful and non-Catholics, so maybe it's wise to rejigger the city for massive crowd control.

"A Pope's visit" is local (St. Louis area) slang for a huge, expensive preparation process for an event that amounts to nothing. His Eminence' (John Paul II) arrival was on a cold day, and despite weeks of high-level preparations for crowd control and security precautions in the expectations of hundreds of thousands descending on the city, the motorcade route was lined by... hundreds. Barely.


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## Ryan (Jun 24, 2015)

The ridiculous uptick in business (and therefore tax revenue) will bring in quite a bit more money than is actually spent.


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## MikefromCrete (Jun 24, 2015)

Getting back to the topic at hand, this plan is hard to comprehend. Restricting the number of stations in use (and I under stand that SEPTA's regional rail has a lot of stations) seems counterproductive. SEPTA seems to expect that everyone will flock to the few stations in use. I would imagine parking lots would fill very quickly. Why not spread out the crowds? I'm shaking my head at this. SEPTA will probably make it so hard to get to the festivities that people will give up and stay home. It reminds of the time when Pope John Paul II visited Chicago and said mass at Grant Park. The city kept saying that two million people were in attendance. Later aerial photography show that the crowd, while big, was far short of even a million, much less two million. The city also claimed that two million people attended the Blackhawks Stanley Cup rally in Grant Park in 2013. I have my doubts about that figure, too.

Getting back to SEPTA, I'm shaking my head. How about more transit service instead of less? I just don't understand this plan.


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## Swadian Hardcore (Jun 25, 2015)

So, no trains are stopping at 30th Street, Suburban, and Market East?


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## Acela150 (Jun 25, 2015)

Cant wait for this hell.. Sorry Pope. Train service to and from Center City has yet to be determined.


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## Mystic River Dragon (Jun 25, 2015)

There was an article in the local paper about this--one young woman was interviewed and said she works at a coffee shop and SEPTA is her only mode of transportation, and she doesn't know how she will get to work. (She can't be the only one, either.)

I had higher hopes of SEPTA than this--they've had forever to work out a sensible plan, and I imagine the Pope is about the last person who would want to disrupt everyone else's routine--he seems like a very nice person.

I was going down to 30th Street to see the exhibit train on September 19, but I'm cancelling--I will have to see it somewhere else at a later time. Yes, I know it's a week earlier, but who knows what mess SEPTA might have already caused by then. It must be catching--NJT is just up the river. (Sorry, I had to get my daily NJT dig in, and this seems just as good a place as any  .)


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## AmtrakBlue (Jun 25, 2015)

Mystic, I would hope things are ok on the 19th. I may be going for Train Day too. Haven't decided if I'll do SEPTA or Amtrak, though.


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## Bob Dylan (Jun 25, 2015)

AmtrakBlue said:


> Mystic, I would hope things are ok on the 19th. I may be going for Train Day too. Haven't decided if I'll do SEPTA or Amtrak, though.


Berry: there's a post today on trainorders that says MARC wants to expand service from Perryville, MD. to Newark, DE to close the gap that is now served only by expensive/roundabout Amtrak and SEPTA service!

Supposedly they have a Fed grant that has to be spent by 2018 or lose it! Be convenient and less expensive to get to Baltimore, BWI and WAS if it happens!


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## AmtrakBlue (Jun 25, 2015)

jimhudson said:


> AmtrakBlue said:
> 
> 
> > Mystic, I would hope things are ok on the 19th. I may be going for Train Day too.  Haven't decided if I'll do SEPTA or Amtrak, though.
> ...


Yes, I know. DelDOT is supposed to be talking with MD about it this week I think. They're even considering expanding it to WIL.I think MD would be crazy not to do it since DE would be paying the majority of it, I'm guessing.


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## Mystic River Dragon (Jun 25, 2015)

AmtrakBlue said:


> Mystic, I would hope things are ok on the 19th. I may be going for Train Day too. Haven't decided if I'll do SEPTA or Amtrak, though.


In that case, I can change my mind--would you like to meet at PHL on Train Day? (Or, if you want to wait for the Gathering, that would be fine with me, too--either way.) Send me a PM when you get a chance, and we can talk about it further.

(I've asked pennyk to look into why I'm not getting email notifications, but I will check there anyway regularly to see if there are any messages.)


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## MrFSS (Jun 25, 2015)

Mystic River Dragon said:


> AmtrakBlue said:
> 
> 
> > Mystic, I would hope things are ok on the 19th. I may be going for Train Day too. Haven't decided if I'll do SEPTA or Amtrak, though.
> ...


I have checked your notification settings and they are set for you to receive an email when you get a PM. Also, the PM should pop-up on the screen the next time you come to the forum and/or log into the forum. If that is not happening, let me know.


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## Mystic River Dragon (Jun 25, 2015)

Thank you, MrFSS. Everything is working again now.


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## fairviewroad (Jun 25, 2015)

Swadian Hardcore said:


> So, no trains are stopping at 30th Street, Suburban, and Market East?


That's in the category of "Still to be determined."

The material says something to the effect that officials are still figuring out which of the Center City stations will be used. Obviously 30th Street will be used

for Amtrak. So perhaps SEPTA will want to minimize crowding at 30th Street (I know, they use separate platforms from Amtrak, but still) and instead require

everyone to ride over to Suburban Station, which will be roughly the same walking distance from the festivities (as I understand it).

OTOH, Suburban Station is such an underground maze that arguably you don't want tens of thousands of people detraining/boarding at once. The best

plan may be to divvy it up. Some lines are assigned 30th Street, some lines are assigned Suburban Station.


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## Acela150 (Jun 25, 2015)

Mystic, the weekend before will be nothing but normal really. I think Starting Tuesday or Wednesday is when things will start going down hill.


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## Mystic River Dragon (Jun 25, 2015)

fairviewroad said:


> Swadian Hardcore said:
> 
> 
> > So, no trains are stopping at 30th Street, Suburban, and Market East?
> ...


What a shame this whole situation is. They could have made Philadelphia easy to get around and a showplace for visitors. But Suburban is a horrible station. And even the amount of times I have been in 30th Street, I still can't figure out how to walk across the river and go over to the Parkway--imagine first-time visitors trying it.



Acela150 said:


> Mystic, the weekend before will be nothing but normal really. I think Starting Tuesday or Wednesday is when things will start going down hill.


I am sure that you are right. I like to start panicking early to get in practice.


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## Anderson (Jun 25, 2015)

Honestly, I could see running a lot of express service (a la the above map), but pulling lots of stations from use would seem to screw over commuters more than anything. If they really feel the need to do this, why not simply offer resident commuters a "period pass" for the week (purchasable with a DE/PA/NJ ID) if they don't already have one and then hike fares at the un-preferred stations?


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## fairviewroad (Jun 25, 2015)

Anderson said:


> Honestly, I could see running a lot of express service (a la the above map), but pulling lots of stations from use would seem to screw over commuters more than anything. If they really feel the need to do this, why not simply offer resident commuters a "period pass" for the week (purchasable with a DE/PA/NJ ID) if they don't already have one and then hike fares at the un-preferred stations?


Well, most regional rail "commuters" won't be affected since the revised service map is only in affect for a Saturday or Sunday. I'd guess a relatively high % of Regional Rail travel on weekends is discretionary travel. Weekday service will not change. The pope will only be in Philly on Saturday and Sunday. Prior to the pope's arrival, this will be no different than any other large convention in town.

I'm guessing they really are trying to discourage folks from using the system unless they are attending the event. [The Phillies are out of town that weekend, FWIW]

Downtown residents can still go about their normal routines, with perhaps an extra amount of walking. In my mind the real losers are the people along the Orange and Blue Lines who work on weekends and still need to get to their jobs.

As far as walking from 30th Street to the Parkway area, I'm guessing there will be no shortage of signage/guides that weekend. Or, just follow the crowd.


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## NorthShore (Jun 26, 2015)

How much of this is being determined not by the transit agency, but security planners?


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## PRR 60 (Jun 26, 2015)

PATCO (southern NJ to Philadelphia) has also announced limited stop service during the papal visit. PATCO trains will only stop at Lindenwold, Woodcrest, Ferry Avenue and Broadway (Camden) in NJ. The only Philadelphia stop will be 9th-10th and Locust. No individual tickets will be sold. Only Freedom Smartcards will be accepted for fares. The fare will be a flat $5 for all day travel.

Many of these SEPTA and PATCO changes are based on lessons learned from the Phillies 2008 World Series parade. Philly-area mass transit was overwhelmed that day and ended in a total operational meltdown. Those using PATCO had two-hour waits to buy tickets. SEPTA had to suspend subway service to and from the stadium area due to dangerous crowding. SEPTA regional rail also shut down for a while. People waited hours to get on trains heading home. Some walked miles instead.

This event is projected to be even larger. I guess it is nice world-wide PR for the city and the city fought hard to get it, but for Philly-area residents it sure seems like a weekend when it would be nice to get out of town.


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## MikefromCrete (Jun 26, 2015)

I predict that actual attendance at the Papal events will be much smaller than predictions. People will look at the problems involved in getting to the site as well as the huge numbers predicted to be there and decide to stay home and watch it on TV.


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## Swadian Hardcore (Jun 26, 2015)

It's actually not that hard to get there from 30th Street. Just cross the river and then walk along the river.

Edit: Maybe they ought to close Suburban Station and open 30th Street and Market East.


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## PRR 60 (Jul 14, 2015)

The sale of special SEPTA one-day passes for the September 26 & 27 Papal visit will start July 20. The $10 per day passes will be sold on-line only, with a limit of 10 per order and a maximum of 175,000 to be sold for each day. The pre-purchased passes will be the only tickets valid for travel September 26 and 27. Other tickets, including regular monthly passes, will not be accepted.

In addition, the operation of the Regional Rail system will be radically altered that weekend. Each line will have limited outer stations (some just one), and each will serve only one center city station (University City, 30th Street or Jefferson Station). Suburban Station will not be used for any Regional Rail operations that weekend. Prior to the day's events, service will be inbound only (5:30am to noon). No passengers will be permitted to board in center city to go to an outer station during the inbound slots. After the events, service will be outbound only, with no passengers permitted inbound.

The NJ Transit/SEPTA Trenton connection will be broken since SEPTA will not be operating to Trenton. The Airport Line will operate as two lines with trains from two airport stops to Jefferson Station, and other trains from Eastwick to University City.

Here is a listing of the outer station(s) and center city station for each rail line. I've never seen anything like this. This will be a good weekend for locals to stay home or head to the shore. Pity the poor traveler who stumbles into this mess by accident.

*Saturday, September 26 & Sunday September 27*​ *Airport Line (1)*: *Terminal C-D* and *Terminal A-B* to and from *Jefferson Station* (Market East) only

*Airport Line (2)*: *Eastwick* to and from *University City* only

*Chestnut Hill East Line*: will not operate

*Chestnut Hill West Line*: *Chestnut Hill West* to and from *30th Street Station* only

*Fox Chase Line*: *Fox Chase* to and from *Jefferson Station* only

*Lansdale/Doylestown Line*: *Pennbrook* and *Fort Washington* to and from *Jefferson Station* only

*Media/Elwyn Line*: *Media* and *Primos* to and from *University City* only.

*Norristown Line*: *Norristown Transportation Center* to and from *Jefferson Station* only

*Paoli/Thorndale Line*: *Paoli* and *Radnor* to and from *30th Street Station* only

*Trenton Line:* *Levittown*, *Croydon** and *Cornwells Heights*** to and from *30th Street Station* only

*boardings 5:30am to 8:30am only

**boardings 8:30am to noon only

*Warminster Line*: *Warminster* to and from *Jefferson Station* only

*West Trenton Line*: *Woodbourne* to and from *Jefferson Station* only

*Wilmington/Newark Line*: *Wilmington* and *Marcus Hook* to and from *30th Street Station* only

SEPTA News Release


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## Mystic River Dragon (Jul 14, 2015)

PRR 60 said:


> The sale of special SEPTA one-day passes for the September 26 & 27 Papal visit will start July 20. The $10 per day passes will be sold on-line only, with a limit of 10 per order and a maximum of 175,000 to be sold for each day. The pre-purchased passes will be the only tickets valid for travel September 26 and 27. Other tickets, including regular monthly passes, will not be accepted.
> 
> In addition, the operation of the Regional Rail system will be radically altered that weekend. Each line will have limited outer stations (some just one), and each will serve only one center city station (University City, 30th Street or Jefferson Station). Suburban Station will not be used for any Regional Rail operations that weekend. Prior to the day's events, service will be inbound only (5:30am to noon). No passengers will be permitted to board in center city to go to an outer station during the inbound slots. After the events, service will be outbound only, with no passengers permitted inbound.
> 
> ...


Also, on the New Jersey side, the RiverLine (light rail between Trenton and Camden along the Delaware River and its small towns) will not be running at all either day (I imagine to stop people from trying to connect to Philly on PATCO or the Atlantic City line). For months, towns on the Jersey side of the river have been asked to host people coming to see the Pope, and now if anyone had planned to get there from South Jersey, it won't be possible by public transit that I can see. Even worse, NJ Transit, in it's usual muddle-headed way, hasn't even put a news item about it on its website (I only found out because the stationmaster at TRE told me because he knows I often work on the weekend).


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