# Definition of one two and three zone trip



## dlagrua (May 18, 2013)

I've booked several AGR points trips before and they have always been one train point to point trips. My question is that if you want to book a one zone trip and it takes two or more trains to get to your final destination, is that still considered a single zone trip? Say you wanted to travel from Miami to Boston. That would require a trip on one of the Silvers plus a leg on the NEC train or LSL. How does this work?


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## PRR 60 (May 18, 2013)

dlagrua said:


> I've booked several AGR points trips before and they have always been one train point to point trips. My question is that if you want to book a one zone trip and it takes two or more trains to get to your final destination, is that still considered a single zone trip? Say you wanted to travel from Miami to Boston. That would require a trip on one of the Silvers plus a leg on the NEC train or LSL. How does this work?


No matter how many trains or buses are involved, if the trip stays within one zone, it is still a one zone trip. Even Miami to Portland ME, which uses three trains, would be a one-zone trip.


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## dlagrua (May 19, 2013)

PRR 60 said:


> dlagrua said:
> 
> 
> > I've booked several AGR points trips before and they have always been one train point to point trips. My question is that if you want to book a one zone trip and it takes two or more trains to get to your final destination, is that still considered a single zone trip? Say you wanted to travel from Miami to Boston. That would require a trip on one of the Silvers plus a leg on the NEC train or LSL. How does this work?
> ...


Didn't realize that. Not that it comes up all that often but it is nice to have that benefit.


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## oregon pioneer (May 19, 2013)

This was brought up in a thread last winter. Ryan, I hope it's OK to re-post this map that you posted then. Here is the map with the zone boundary city names on it. Any travel wholly within one of these zones, no matter how far apart the origin and destination cities, is a single zone. Any travel that crosses a zone line, no matter how close the origin and destination, is more than one zone. Kind of arbitrary, but you do always have the option of paying for a trip if it's really not worth spending your points on!


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## the_traveler (May 19, 2013)

Also, unless *BOTH* the origin and destination are within the Northeast Zone, do not count that as a zone. Consider it part of the Eastern Zone instead!

Examples:


Boston and Washington are both in the Northeast Zone. This is a Northeast Zone award.
Providence and Miami. Only Providence is in the Northeast Zone. This is an Eastern Zone award.
Denver to Charlotte. You do connect in Washington, but since both the origin and destination are not in the Northeast Zone, this would be a 2 zone award (Midwest and Eastern Zones).


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## Linda T (May 19, 2013)

the_traveler said:


> Also, unless *BOTH* the origin and destination are within the Northeast Zone, do not count that as a zone. Consider it part of the Eastern Zone instead!
> 
> Examples:
> 
> ...


Thank you for explaining that. I never really understood it. So it looks like if you stay in the NE region then it's cheaper travel in coach, though everything else appears to be the same point value as a normal one zone trip?


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## Ryan (May 19, 2013)

Correct!

Oregon Pioneer, no problems at all - glad the picture is useful to folks.


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## crescent2 (May 20, 2013)

This may be slightly OT, but it's related and important. Alhough the number of trains doesn't matter as long as they are in the same zone, an overnight layover does matter. It will (usually, unless it's in NOL, or you're yarrow!) require a second, separate AGR redemption (or a paid ticket), even if you are within the same zone.

The examples discussed above might not include an overnight layover, but there are other trips within one zone which do.

From what I've learned here, only trips that amtrak.com shows without using the multi-city option can be done on a single AGR redemption--unless you get very lucky and get an agent who decides to let you!


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## Devil's Advocate (May 20, 2013)

I've been told that San Antonio to Seattle was a three zone award, that El Paso to Chicago was a four zone award, and that New Orleans to Seattle was a five zone award. If you think it's as simple as looking at what Amtrak.com gives you, looking at the zone map, and handing over 1, 2, or 3 zones worth of points you could be in for a nasty surprise. What are you going to do when your friendly AGR agent decides you're asking for the wrong routing or that you're getting too much travel out of too few points? I realize that there are a handful of folks who claim they can still get AGR to book whatever they want for a minimum of points just by calling back, but my experience has been the exact opposite those claims.


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## AlanB (May 20, 2013)

crescent2 said:


> From what I've learned here, only trips that amtrak.com shows without using the multi-city option can be done on a single AGR redemption--unless you get very lucky and get an agent who decides to let you!


You can only be sure that trips found without using the multi-city option are bookable by AGR. But many trips that can be found using the multi-city option are still bookable. You just won't know without calling and as noted by others, depending on the agent you may or may not get the correct answer from said agent.

But many multi-city options are bookable and many are not.


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## kal-tex (Jun 4, 2013)

If I wanted a trip from Detroit to Miami (assuming no hotel over-nights), would that be a one- zone, or a two zone? I'd probably have to go back to Chicago, and then head east. That's traveling in a different zone than both Detroit and Miami. Does that time count as a second zone?


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## Ryan (Jun 4, 2013)

Isn't Detroit in the Eastern zone? That *should* make it a 1 zone.


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## AlanB (Jun 4, 2013)

It will be a one zone provided that you ride the bus from Detroit to Toledo.

If you wish to route via Chicago by train, then it may or may not be considered a 1 zone trip.


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## chakk (Jun 4, 2013)

Devil's Advocate said:


> I've been told that San Antonio to Seattle was a three zone award, that El Paso to Chicago was a four zone award, and that New Orleans to Seattle was a five zone award. If you think it's as simple as looking at what Amtrak.com gives you, looking at the zone map, and handing over 1, 2, or 3 zones worth of points you could be in for a nasty surprise. What are you going to do when your friendly AGR agent decides you're asking for the wrong routing or that you're getting too much travel out of too few points? I realize that there are a handful of folks who claim they can still get AGR to book whatever they want for a minimum of points just by calling back, but my experience has been the exact opposite those claims.


Since there are only 3 zones in the USA, I don't see how ANY Amtrak agent could tell you that a trip required 4 or 5 zones.


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## Ryan (Jun 4, 2013)

If it's based on the number of zones you pass through, a PDX-CHI-WAS-SDL trip is 4 (west, central, east, central).


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## VentureForth (Jun 5, 2013)

You see, I was under the impression that zone trips were based on 1) what's bookable directly in Arrow and 2) zones based on departure and arrival station.

There really is no such thing as a 4 or 5 zone trip. You can't redeem that. There may be a 2+2 or a 2+3 zone trip, depending on the stations that are passed through that can't be booked on the same itinerary. To be told that El Paso to Chicago is a 4 zone trip is ludicrous and that agent should be retrained. Of course, unless you spend the night in San Antonio, Fort Worth and St. Louis. But that would be 4 itineraries.

I wouldn't take a bad agent's fodder as an "example".

Sometimes I think AGR is the "Business Class" of point systems - no consistent rules...


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## Ryan (Jun 5, 2013)

That's the way things used to be.

After too many people took advantage of this to build ridiculously circuitous itineraries (the most famous of which was the "Slidell Loophole"), AGR cracked down and started charging on "zones traveled through", not "Start and endpoints".

Now that policy seems to have moderated some, and it'd really the luck of the draw what you get.

With no currently published rules, there's no way to say if either or both are correct. Hopefully, agents have some latitude in interpreting things. If I live in the northeast and attempt to book a circuitous trip between two cities in the central zone with a long detour out west, the agent (probably rightly) should refuse to give me the trip for the 1 zone price.

However, someone like the guy in Detroit that just wants to get to Miami without riding the but should have the latitude to do that with just burning a one zoner.

Allowing agents to think and make those kind of determinations is a good thing, IMO.


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## crescent2 (Jun 18, 2013)

Just want to add especially for any AU newbies, rules have changed somewhat with the recent publication of AGR guidelines. Re my post above, for example, many overnight layovers are now allowed. The zones are still in effect, of course.


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