# High Speed Rail may be finished



## wildcat (Nov 17, 2011)

Per various news outlets, Congress has pretty much put the kabosh on high speed rail -- at least the Obama version of it --on a national basis. Some programs might get through if they are differently/separately funded but a true, national high speed system may be dead. You know what's coming next: the end of Amtrak LD service and the entire thing will be nothing but corridors with mid-speed equipment.


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## jis (Nov 17, 2011)

wildcat said:


> Per various news outlets, Congress has pretty much put the kabosh on high speed rail -- at least the Obama version of it --on a national basis. Some programs might get through if they are differently/separately funded but a true, national high speed system may be dead. You know what's coming next: the end of Amtrak LD service and the entire thing will be nothing but corridors with mid-speed equipment.


Haven't we heard the story of end of Amtrak LD service at least a dozen times over the last 40 or so years? I will believe it when it actually happens. I am almost certain that it won't.

Also HSR will get built where it makes sense. The acts of one misguided Congress has never been what ultimately determined what happened to the country, most fortunately.


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## Green Maned Lion (Nov 17, 2011)

Don't be so cavalier, Dr Mukerji. I don't think it will happen. But neither did the Mexicans.


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## Bob Dylan (Nov 17, 2011)

Green Maned Lion said:


> Don't be so cavalier, Dr Mukerji. I don't think it will happen. But neither did the Mexicans.


Good point GML, but think jis is right, we might see a couple of LD Trains go away, and some of the more "far out" HSR schemes will not get funded, but generally as long as the Obama Administration (read Amtrak Joe) is in the White House, and the Senate retains a few common sense members ,(sadly lacking in the House of Corporations, er Representatives)at the Least the busy corridors , ie NEC,Virginia/Carolina/ Wisconson/Illinois/Missouri and the Cascades and California Routes should be OK! Still gotta say ride em while you can, lots of us missed out on the Broadway Ltd/20th Century/National/Pioneer/Dessert Wind/Three Rivers/Lone Star etc. etc.Id like a see a True Bullet Train on the NEC someday, maybe in my Grandaughters lifetime! 

Id rather see the so called HSR money be put into improving/maintaing what we have now including these corridors, but that's just luddite me! (I wish Steamers still pulled the Trains! :lol: :lol: :lol: )


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## Devil's Advocate (Nov 17, 2011)

jis said:


> Haven't we heard the story of end of Amtrak LD service at least a dozen times over the last 40 or so years? I will believe it when it actually happens.


A thousand paper cuts can be just as deadly as a sword slash if left untended.



jis said:


> I am almost certain that it won't.


Fair enough, but can you explain to me how you foresee Amtrak replacing the Superliner fleet that forms the bulk of the LD network? At some point won't the remaining cars pass beyond all reasonable expectations of functional longevity. If Amtrak wasn't able to save up enough (any?) money to replace them over the last four decades of service how will they do it with the time that still remains?



jis said:


> Also HSR will get built where it makes sense. The acts of one misguided Congress has never been what ultimately determined what happened to the country, most fortunately.


I'm pretty cynical but even I saw the "Texas Triangle" as an objectively legitimate use of HSR. However, I don't know anyone, anywhere who still thinks that it will be built. At least not in the form of HSR or not in our lifetimes.


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## saxman (Nov 19, 2011)

Well HSR is probably dead for now, but there is next year and the year after that, and one after that. In two years we'll have many different members of Congress again, and I'm hopeful that all this political bickering will stop, and maybe get some guys that actually work together. I think many people agree, we're going to need to build HSR in one form or another. It's just that right now, no one can agree on how it should be built, or funded. I think as long as some just want to throw money at it, it won't work until we come up with a long term funding solution, such as the Highway Trust Fund for highways and the Aviation Trust Fund for runways and such. (Albeit the fact the HTF doesn't pay for all of the highways)

Didn't FDR propose some sort of interstate highway system back in the 30's? I guess it got killed, and didn't come about again until the 50's. It might take 5, 10, or 20 years, but HSR is coming. More and more people are attracted to train travel every year, and one day our politicians will have no choice but to listen.


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## jis (Nov 19, 2011)

Texas Sunset said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > I am almost certain that it won't.
> ...


Amtrak has seldom saved enough money to do anything. The business about using RRIF loans to buy equipment is relatively recent and in and of itself does not involve any past savings, but involves guaranteeing loans based on future earnings. It is entirely possible that such a loan could be crafted for even acquiring Superliners. OTOH historically it has always eventually gotten funded by other sources. A particular alignment in Congress today means nothing about what will happen in five years.

Think about it. Just two years back over $10 billion got allocated by Congress to passenger railroad. We'll have to wait and see what happens in the next six. There will be two Presidents and 3 Congresses involved, not counting the current term. The Superliners are fine for at least another 10 years. There is time. During the depth of Bush II administration who'd have thunk that we'd have any hope of continuing full Diner service on LD trains past right about now? And who'd have thunk it would be Bush's FRA boss and other Bush appointees that would pull it off?

Of course if your favorite pastime is to panic and fold, be my guest. But panicking and throwing in the towel never helped in moving steadily towards a goal. And that is what we collectively need to do now. Personally I have always liked to work towards goals that appear to be difficult to achieve than those that are just a breeze. They are boring. So for now I am a happy camper to have something to get my teeth into and chew for a while  Cavalier? maybe. But so far it has served me well in my various ventures.



> jis said:
> 
> 
> > Also HSR will get built where it makes sense. The acts of one misguided Congress has never been what ultimately determined what happened to the country, most fortunately.
> ...


Who said that every project that I, or we, think is worthwhile will be successfully be built? Many will fail to be built, and many that are built will in our opinion be suboptimal. That is the nature of the beast.


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