# Amtrak employees need an attitude adjustment



## spinnaker (Jul 12, 2019)

I don't know about the experience of others but the over all attitude of Amtrak employees has gone from bad to worse. The problem exists both on train and at various stations. 

That is not to say there are not some wonderful helpful and pleasant employees out there but for the most part it is a not so pleasant experience when dealing with Amtrak employees.

One of the areas where they really seem to get upset is when you break one of their rules. Most notably, seating in the dining car.

On my recent trip on the EB, I dutifully waited at the door to be seated. I was waved through with a group. I don't know if she miscounted or what but when I got to the table, there was no room for me. I moved to the far end of the car was meet by attitude by a different attendant and was seated alone (eventually to be joined by others).

I noticed that other passengers were meet with similar poor attitude when seating themselves.

Certainly there are reasons for an attendant to seat you. There are lots of people to seat and serve in a very limited amount of space. Seating needs to be done efficiently. And they do make a number of announcements about the seating but they also make tons of other announcements, it all becomes noise after a while. Here is a simple solution, hang a sign. And if someone sill breaks the rules and seats themselves, politely explain that they wait the next time.

I do understand that dealing with the public can be a difficult job. Some passengers can be simply intolerable. But I think most people at least try to be a good passenger. And I also understand how annoying it must be when you need to explain the same thing for they 20th time to those otherwise good passengers.

Amtrak is currently suffering from many ills. I am sure behavior of their employees is not high on their list but still something should be done. Perhaps it is the union that should address the problem. You want the public on your side not against you. They can be your best advocates with just a little bit of effort.


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## Amtrakfflyer (Jul 12, 2019)

You’d think employees whose jobs are on the line would want to put in a good performance, most do, some obviously do not.


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## Brian Battuello (Jul 12, 2019)

I certainly understand the frustration, especially with the dining car staff. I travel long distance Amtrak several times a year, and in general, the staff, especially the sleeping car attendants, are great. They are given almost nothing to work with, and still make you feel welcome and special. On longer trips, I make a point of connecting with the dining car staff and saying something nice, and usually by the end of the trip they are taking good care of me. Of course they should make everyone feel welcome, but they have an almost impossible job. 

My approach is to let the occasional tired/stressed/frustrated staff comment pass by, and enjoy the meals and views while we can. 

You want attitude, try American Airlines these days. I'd rather take Greyhound.


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## PaTrainFan (Jul 12, 2019)

I recently took a 7,000 mile Amtrak trip out west. In can honestly say that 95 percent of the employees I encountered were at least very good to outstanding. One sleeping car attendant had an attitude I could do without, but she performed adequately.


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## tim49424 (Jul 13, 2019)

I’ve very rarely experienced attitude problems in my 7 years on LD trains, 13 years overall and over 75,000 miles logged on Amtrak. The only time I can recall having a problem with any staff on board is a SCA within the last year never introduced herself, did nothing through the time I rode with her on the overnight trip and when I got off the train a little after 9 PM told me to have a nice day. No tip for her. LOL Otherwise great experiences all around, sometimes in very trying situations.


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## alang (Jul 13, 2019)

I have never experienced anything but a positive attitude from Amtrak employees on many trips over the last 13 years.


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## Asher (Jul 13, 2019)

spinnaker said:


> I don't know about the experience of others but the over all attitude of Amtrak employees has gone from bad to worse. The problem exists both
> That is not to say there are not some wonderful helpful and pleasant employees out there but for the most part it is a not so pleasant experience when dealing with Amtrak employees.
> 
> One of the areas where they really seem to get upset is when you break one of their rules. Most notably, seating in the dining car.
> ...


 "Bad to worse". Come on now.


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## TiBike (Jul 13, 2019)

Luck of the draw. There's been indifferent staff on the Starlight (and the Surfliner to a lesser degree) the past several months, with a relative handful falling into the bad to worse category, and a significant number who try to make the trip a pleasure. I've noticed a tendency at times for low performers to cluster together on a crew (or one bad apple with a strong personality exerts peer pressure on colleagues to perform to his/her low standards). You draw a couple of trips like that in a row, and you might reasonably conclude things are going from bad to worse.

There are good staff out there, who make the trip enjoyable. The Capitol Corridor seems to have a lot of them – no bad apples, not even any who are truly indifferent. Great people who seem to like their jobs. The Surfliner can be as good, but there are exceptions.


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## spinnaker (Jul 13, 2019)

anumberone said:


> "Bad to worse". Come on now.




But you don't comment on alang's comment.


So what was you comment not the same? "never anything but positive"? Really?

Guess I am not surprised of the Amtrak love fest. Or maybe I am just riding the wrong trains and going to the wrong stations?

Part of my problem at the stations might be because of the bicycle. For some reason it really seems to create problems for some of the employee's at the stations. It is like it is a huge problem for them and it is something they need to handle when there is nothing of the sort. 

I can say I was welcome with open arms at the Portland station in the first class lounge. The attendant there could not have been nicer and more helpful. No problem with the bike at all. The woman even jumped up to offer to hold the door for me. 

My experience at the Chicago (First class lounge) and Seattle station not so much. Last year it was mixed at the first class lounge in Chicago. I was given a hassle by first class employee initially, only to be welcome by open arms by a different employee when I returned the next day. I got downgraded from first class to coach because of a late CZ and no first class the day of my departure. But this employee treated me like I was still first class. 

I would also say that my experience with customer service (on the phone) has always been VERY positive. A reason I am so sad of the closure of at least on e of the call centers.

Just this year on the EB, in addition to the less than stellar handling of rule breaking, I got the feeling they did not want to be there. Not exactly negative experience there but no where near positive. As already stated, I do understand they have a very difficult job but so do many other service type workers.


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## spinnaker (Jul 13, 2019)

TiBike said:


> There are good staff out there, who make the trip enjoyable. The Capitol Corridor seems to have a lot of them – no bad apples, not even any who are truly indifferent. Great people who seem to like their jobs. The Surfliner can be as good, but there are exceptions.




Again mixed on that run too. But my experience on that train has been just a few hours to overnight so hard to get a good handle there.. I would say mostly positive with a conductor last year, going above and beyond. I don't want to go into details but the favor he did for me probably broke a number of rules.


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## Devil's Advocate (Jul 13, 2019)

I find it hilarious how many members still pretend they never (or almost never) see any poor performance from Amtrak staff. Really? You've really never seen the staff ignore someone or snap at someone over a minor transgression of an unwritten rule? People who criticize Amtrak staff often give specific examples that explain the nature and manner of the complaint while people who defend Amtrak give little more than vague euphemisms of everything always being great or spend their time deflecting any criticism toward some other company for being worse. I'm not sure how that helps make Amtrak look better but I guess blind faith promotes silly reactions. I've been traveling on Amtrak since I was a little boy, so I already know how things work and there is little reason for the staff to snap at me personally, but that doesn't mean I'm blind and deaf to all the times the staff ignores or snaps at other people who did little or nothing wrong.


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## Seaboard92 (Jul 13, 2019)

I remember back in the 90s on my first trip they snapped at my grandmother and me for wanting to eat in the dining car. From the coaches.


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## drdumont (Jul 13, 2019)

Indeed, YMMV. I commuted weeky from FTW-AUS for two years, and take an LD trip once or twice a year just for the fun of it, thus I have had ample time to observe. In 30 years or so, I have had a bad experience with ONE SCA. The not lamented Pat who worked the Crescent. Thankfully she was sacked the trip after I rode with her. The SCAs seem to be the most accommodating of all.Some are great, some OK, but on the average, always pleasant.
Conductors, trainmen, even the chair car attendants are for the most pretty good. They have a ton of responsibility and a lot on their minds. But there's always a smile, it seems.
Most of the unpleasant experiences I have had have been in the dining car. They seem to have the worst of the lot.
Don't get me wrong, the vast majority are really great. But I've noticed that we run out of the steaks, but the attendants never do. There's not enough seats, but there are at least 4 tables taken up by storage, attendants seated there, a cash register station set up on the table, and so on.
I realize that with X attendants they can serve Y seats in Z time. But I'd rather wait at a table with a glass of water or my beverage and watch the scenery rather than standing in the car or worse - being rushed to clear out so the next standee can be served. I'd like to take my meal and enjoy it. Being able to use all the seats would help.
And even though the service may be pretty good, there seems to be a pervasive attitude that we are intruding on their leisure time.


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## jloewen (Jul 13, 2019)

drdumont said:


> Indeed, YMMV. I commuted weeky from FTW-AUS for two years, and take an LD trip once or twice a year just for the fun of it, thus I have had ample time to observe. In 30 years or so, I have had a bad experience with ONE SCA. The not lamented Pat who worked the Crescent. Thankfully she was sacked the trip after I rode with her. The SCAs seem to be the most accommodating of all.Some are great, some OK, but on the average, always pleasant.
> Conductors, trainmen, even the chair car attendants are for the most pretty good. They have a ton of responsibility and a lot on their minds. But there's always a smile, it seems.
> Most of the unpleasant experiences I have had have been in the dining car. They seem to have the worst of the lot.
> Don't get me wrong, the vast majority are really great. But I've noticed that we run out of the steaks, but the attendants never do. There's not enough seats, but there are at least 4 tables taken up by storage, attendants seated there, a cash register station set up on the table, and so on.
> ...


A pet peeve of mine is staff use of dining car and cafe car seats, especially on the NEC. I understand the need for ONE table for their paperwork, etc., but I have found as many as TWELVE seats taken by (2 or 3 or 4) crew!


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## spinnaker (Jul 13, 2019)

Seaboard92 said:


> I remember back in the 90s on my first trip they snapped at my grandmother and me for wanting to eat in the dining car. From the coaches.



I thought that was allowed as long as all of the first class passengers have been seated? But even if you did break the rules by being seated early, that is no reason to snap at someone. I can see where it would get a bit old if you were the 20th coach passenger they had to tell that night. But grandma? 

I could never do that job. It is really hard to deal with people with a smile on your face. Especially difficult when you are in the confined space of a moving train. It is one of those jobs that is more of a calling than a job. You really need to love what you are doing just to get by.

There are plenty of bad passengers too. But I think most people at least try to be a good passenger. And there is never an excuse for poor behavior but passengers are the ones that are paying to ride. As mentioned they can also be your greatest advocate to keep employees working.


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## spinnaker (Jul 13, 2019)

jloewen said:


> A pet peeve of mine is staff use of dining car and cafe car seats, especially on the NEC. I understand the need for ONE table for their paperwork, etc., but I have found as many as TWELVE seats taken by (2 or 3 or 4) crew!



I am surprised that is allowed. Everyone deserves their break but it should be done outside the pubic view. You would never see this behavior at a restaurant. Easy to imagine that space on a train is at a premium but you would think some can be carved out for a break area.


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## OBS (Jul 13, 2019)

Report, report,report all transgressions, with details, to customer service. This way problems can be tracked, documented, and dealt with. It takes time and documentation, but it does happen!


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## OBS (Jul 13, 2019)

TiBike said:


> Luck of the draw. There's been indifferent staff on the Starlight (and the Surfliner to a lesser degree) the past several months, with a relative handful falling into the bad to worse category, and a significant number who try to make the trip a pleasure. I've noticed a tendency at times for low performers to cluster together on a crew (or one bad apple with a strong personality exerts peer pressure on colleagues to perform to his/her low standards). You draw a couple of trips like that in a row, and you might reasonably conclude things are going from bad to worse.
> 
> There are good staff out there, who make the trip enjoyable. The Capitol Corridor seems to have a lot of them – no bad apples, not even any who are truly indifferent. Great people who seem to like their jobs. The Surfliner can be as good, but there are exceptions.


Quite often, the reason for the clustering has to do with the exercising of seniority. What I mean is, most employees know who the problem people are and do all they can to bid schedules so they are working with other like minded quality people. Thus the rif raf end up all together on a few crews, with the others no one wants to work with....


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## spinnaker (Jul 13, 2019)

OBS said:


> Report, report,report all transgressions, with details, to customer service. This way problems can be tracked, documented, and dealt with. It takes time and documentation, but it does happen!




So what is the best way? Just call the Amtrak number or is there a better way?

I really should have gotten the name of the woman in the first class lounge in Chicago. There is no reason I should be discriminated against just because I have a bicycle. Instead of giving me a hard time she really should have been prepared with reasonable alternatives rather that just "wait at the gate". I should have received the same benefits of any other first class passenger.


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## Amtrakfflyer (Jul 13, 2019)

With yesterday’s announcement expect it to get worse.


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## Asher (Jul 13, 2019)

Darn, I thought Spinnaker was going a tad overboard with the bad to worse, since then it has just got worser.


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## spinnaker (Jul 13, 2019)

anumberone said:


> Darn, I thought Spinnaker was going a tad overboard with the bad to worse, since then it has just got worser.




How so? What was the news from yesterday? Was it the eastern dining car closings in the east? Sorry but I have seen very little news in the past two weeks.

And if it was the closing, more the reason existing employees should be on their guard. It is easy but understandable to lash out over the news but that is the last thing you really want to do. You want passengers to call and complain about the cuts. The last thing that you want is for them to be complaining about you. Why I mentioned the union should address the issue. Management certainly does not care. Complaints on employees are just one more reason for them to make the cuts.


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## NSC1109 (Jul 13, 2019)

I've been working in the customer service world for six years now. Everything from fast food to hospitality to retail to (technically, given my division's "Airport Customer Service" moniker) the airline industry. I understand how frustrating customer-facing jobs can be. Recently we had someone call our Ops office, convinced that we were at war with China because of the "military jets and helicopters overhead" and why we chose her house because she was a "hard-working, God-loving American". Took 15 minutes to get her off the phone. A quick check of FlightRadar showed a single Envoy ERJ (AA's subsidiary, and not someone we work with, making it all the more ridiculous) that caused the whole affair. Their ground crew got quite the kick out of it. 

During my time with retail, it was always someone new, from shoplifting to arguing over policies that I have no control over, etc. We've had more than one employee who had to go into the back and cry or take some time to vent because our customers have a tendency to be rude and condescending. It's not fun, and a person can only take so much. 




Devil's Advocate said:


> I find it hilarious how many members still pretend they never (or almost never) see any poor performance from Amtrak staff. Really? You've really never seen the staff ignore someone or snap at someone over a minor transgression of an unwritten rule? People who criticize Amtrak staff often give specific examples that explain the nature and manner of the complaint while people who defend Amtrak give little more than vague euphemisms of everything always being great or spend their time deflecting any criticism toward some other company for being worse. I'm not sure how that helps make Amtrak look better but I guess blind faith promotes silly reactions. I've been traveling on Amtrak since I was a little boy, so I already know how things work and there is little reason for the staff to snap at me personally, but that doesn't mean I'm blind and deaf to all the times the staff ignores or snaps at other people who did little or nothing wrong.



I have had exactly one bad experience with a Conductor on 364 well over 10 years ago. If I remember correctly, he wouldn't let us go to the cafe car despite being well into Indiana. Said it wasn't available to anyone outside of Business Class until we reached MI. Made zero sense. 

I had two "notable encounters" with other Amtrak staff, one was another Conductor on 364 last year (wasn't a passenger) and the second was in 2017 with a Dining Car Attendant on 8. The DCA was loud, brash, and generally didn't have a tact for customer service, but had no complaints otherwise. The Conductor came off as a bit of a jerk after I tried to inform him that the trailing engine had an open door (the Kalamazoo station is between two homeless shelters and I thought that someone was potentially trying to stow away in the engine for the trip to PTH). I'm not 100% sure if it was just because they needed to go and he would deal with it on the fly, or if he thought I was just some foamer (I had my camera with me at the time). I haven't seen that Conductor since. 

All of the other Amtrak staff I've come across have been amazing, both corridor and LD and I don't recall any specific instances where a person was the victim of a baseless tirade from an employee. The closest I can think of is when a Conductor on 8 called out a guy over the train's PA for smoking pot during the service stop at Havre. Didn't do it by name, but said that they saw him and if the DEA agents boarded the train like they normally did there (unsure if true), they would've ratted him out. Thought it was kind of funny at the time, but being older, I've come to realize it should've been handled differently.


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## NSC1109 (Jul 13, 2019)

spinnaker said:


> How so? What was the news from yesterday? Was it the eastern dining car closings in the east? Sorry but I have seen very little news in the past two weeks.
> 
> And if it was the closing, more the reason existing employees should be on their guard. It is easy but understandable to lash out over the news but that is the last thing you really want to do. You want passengers to call and complain about the cuts. The last thing that you want is for them to be complaining about you. Why I mentioned the union should address the issue. Management certainly does not care. Complaints on employees are just one more reason for them to make the cuts.



Does management not care, or does management not know much about what's going on? 

During my time in retail, I was a supervisor for the floor, meaning I basically managed the cashiers and baggers with one or two other supes. After 5 or 6PM, we basically ran the store until midnight close. But we had almost no power to discipline and had little access to information. It is difficult for both employees and consumers to feel secure, happy, and engaged when it appears that no one knows what's happening and not even direct managers have any clue. That's why open and honest communication is so important in today's workplace. Secrets and compartmentalization are dangerous to a customer-facing organization. From personal experience, nothing is more depressing and demoralizing than knowing that changes are coming but you have no idea what's going to happen and your boss is either unable to unwilling to communicate with their people.


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## seat38a (Jul 14, 2019)

Well, you complain about something too much, history has shown that many corporations, instead of fixing it, will just get rid of it and save money. Now Amtrak is doing the same at least with the Eastern Trains with the dining car. For as long as I've been a member of this forum, one of the biggest complaints was regarding the dining car specifically with the servers. After dealing with couple of a$$&*(#@ dining car staff, on the Coast Starlight and the Southwest Chief, I don't take Amtrak anymore. Over a three year period, I was seeing a downward trajectory.

I wonder how long it will be before Anderson comes out and say, "People have been complaining about the dining car, blah blah blah, so we decided to IMPROVE it." Kind of like the same excuse given before cutting meals in domestic coach class segments.


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## Rasputin (Jul 14, 2019)

seat38a said:


> I wonder how long it will be before Anderson comes out and say, "People have been complaining about the dining car, blah blah blah, so we decided to IMPROVE it." Kind of like the same excuse given before cutting meals in domestic coach class segments.


Sort of like the old "We had to destroy the village in order to save it" explanation.


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## spinnaker (Jul 14, 2019)

seat38a said:


> I wonder how long it will be before Anderson comes out and say, "People have been complaining about the dining car, blah blah blah, so we decided to IMPROVE it." Kind of like the same excuse given before cutting meals in domestic coach class segments.



Why I mentioned the union needs to fix this. Should have been done long ago. At least since the change of management. You are correct stating that complaints are just another excuse for management to cut the employees


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## Michigan Mom (Jul 14, 2019)

The situations are all fact-specific. 
Last time I was in the lounge at CUS (last week actually) despite announcements about not bringing in outside F&B to eat, I saw people who had their McDonald's food and trash on the tables. Sorry but I think that's just plain not appropriate. I'm sure if the employees had dared say anything it would have resulted in a complaint about their attitude.
When you work in customer service, the first thing you learn is that no matter how politely you deny someone's request that you can't fulfill, you are called "rude." No, you can't have a free upgrade. Well you're rude and I'm writing to your CEO.
The vast majority of people working for a living are there to do a good job and protect their paychecks.


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## Winecliff Station (Jul 15, 2019)

Michigan Mom said:


> The situations are all fact-specific.
> Last time I was in the lounge at CUS (last week actually) despite announcements about not bringing in outside F&B to eat, I saw people who had their McDonald's food and trash on the tables. Sorry but I think that's just plain not appropriate. I'm sure if the employees had dared say anything it would have resulted in a complaint about their attitude.
> When you work in customer service, the first thing you learn is that no matter how politely you deny someone's request that you can't fulfill, you are called "rude." No, you can't have a free upgrade. Well you're rude and I'm writing to your CEO.
> The vast majority of people working for a living are there to do a good job and protect their paychecks.



I once overheard a passenger saying “wow, you’re loud” to the attendant calling for tickets as the train was leaving Penn. The attendant said he needs to make sure people hear over their headphones, especially on a sold out train with a lot of people to get through. I’m sure the passenger filed a complaint, based on his continued complaining to his seat mate. He is also one of those head shakers, expressing their disapproval with the head back and forth every time you inadvertently do something that makes them aware you exist.


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## NSC1109 (Jul 15, 2019)

Michigan Mom said:


> The situations are all fact-specific.
> Last time I was in the lounge at CUS (last week actually) despite announcements about not bringing in outside F&B to eat, I saw people who had their McDonald's food and trash on the tables. Sorry but I think that's just plain not appropriate. I'm sure if the employees had dared say anything it would have resulted in a complaint about their attitude.
> When you work in customer service, the first thing you learn is that no matter how politely you deny someone's request that you can't fulfill, you are called "rude." No, you can't have a free upgrade. Well you're rude and I'm writing to your CEO.
> The vast majority of people working for a living are there to do a good job and protect their paychecks.



Exactly right. At my retail job, part of what we do is cash checks (if we have done so before and it is under a certain amount) as well as do Western Union and print money orders. We tell people, booth verbally and by signs, that there are very specific conditions that must be met, all put in place by corporate after unfortunate mishaps: 

Checks: Cashed before and can not exceed $500.
WU: Cannot exceed $1000
Money Orders: $500 increments, cannot be refunded. 

We get people who whine, complain, and sometimes even put on the waterworks when we tell them no. They’ll say it’s for their rent, or a loved one’s medical bills. They’ll say we’ve done it before. Some will even get belligerent. I give all the same line that usually shuts them up: “I’m sorry (sir/ma’am), but I cannot do what you are asking me to do, as it would be a direct violation of our corporate policy and I would be fired”. 

The world of customer service is a wild one...


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## spinnaker (Jul 15, 2019)

Michigan Mom said:


> The situations are all fact-specific.
> Last time I was in the lounge at CUS (last week actually) despite announcements about not bringing in outside F&B to eat, I saw people who had their McDonald's food and trash on the tables. Sorry but I think that's just plain not appropriate. I'm sure if the employees had dared say anything it would have resulted in a complaint about their attitude.
> When you work in customer service, the first thing you learn is that no matter how politely you deny someone's request that you can't fulfill, you are called "rude." No, you can't have a free upgrade. Well you're rude and I'm writing to your CEO.
> The vast majority of people working for a living are there to do a good job and protect their paychecks.




No one ever said anything about employees enforcing the rules. The problem is how they are doing it. They could politely inform offending passengers they are breaking the rule or they can snap at the passenger and berate them for breaking the rules.

It has to be difficult to be civil when it is the 20th person that you have told that day. But as far as you know, that passenger simply does not know the rules. As already mentioned they do make that announcement as they make many other announcements that eventually just become noise. If the person either ignores the first polite explanation or is a returning offender then I would see no problem with the employee getting more stern with the passenger.


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## Rasputin (Jul 15, 2019)

Michigan Mom said:


> The situations are all fact-specific.
> Last time I was in the lounge at CUS (last week actually) despite announcements about not bringing in outside F&B to eat, I saw people who had their McDonald's food and trash on the tables.



I thought the policy at the Metropolitan Lounge had changed a few months ago and that people were now allowed to bring in outside food. Prior to that change people were being kicked out of the lounge for bringing in food from outside. there was a big discussion of this a few months back and a friend who used the lounge in April or May confirmed that outside food was now allowed.

Is the no food policy back on?


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## spinnaker (Jul 15, 2019)

Rasputin said:


> I thought the policy at the Metropolitan Lounge had changed a few months ago and that people were now allowed to bring in outside food. Prior to that change people were being kicked out of the lounge for bringing in food from outside. there was a big discussion of this a few months back and a friend who used the lounge in April or May confirmed that outside food was now allowed.
> 
> Is the no food policy back on?




From my experience, rules in the Metropolitan Lounge seem to be set by the individual employees. I have personally seen the rules change on the same day. The only difference two different employees enforcing the rules.

I see no problem in the Metro Lounge with outside food as long as passengers clean up after themselves. I do see a problem with it in the Cafe car as space is at a premium and should be reserved for those paying the cafe for the food.


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## Thirdrail7 (Jul 15, 2019)

I'm just going to dip my toe into this by saying they have started implementing customer service classes for the front line employees. They also gutted/refined the service standards (someone should file a FOI request and post the results) to streamline a lot of the problematic rules.....which will naturally take time to adjust to and also has the potential to create other areas of chaos.


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## jis (Jul 15, 2019)

One of the ongoing problems that I have had with Amtrak customer facing employees is that many of them seem to dream up random rules of their own which has no basis in any documented policy and then get nasty about it if questioned. I have generally never experienced such blatant random rule making on the fly at any of the airlines I use, nor on any other major national rail systems I use.


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## spinnaker (Jul 15, 2019)

jis said:


> One of the ongoing problems that I have had with Amtrak customer facing employees is that many of them seem to dream up random rules of their own which has no basis in any documented policy and then get nasty about it if questioned. I have generally never experienced such blatant random rule making on the fly at any of the airlines I use, nor on any other major national rail systems I use.




Yep I just mentioned that. Seems to be the worst in the Metro Lounge in Chicago.


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## MARC Rider (Jul 15, 2019)

Having been an Amtrak customer since 1971, and a frequent customer over the past 20 years, I don't think there's an "attitude problem" among Amtrak customer-facing staff that's any worse than in other service industries. I think I can count the number of customer-facing staff with "bad attitude" on the fingers of one hand, well, I might need to use a couple of fingers on the other hand. I mostly ride on the NEC, bust I also ride the other eastern state-supported trains and try to get in at least one long-distance trip a year. Most of the frustrations I've had with customer service appear to have causes outside the customer-facing employees control: decreases in staffing levels, delays, cafe car or diner running out of what I wanted to order, the selection and quality of the food, etc. Of course, I don't expect a waiter or sleeping car attendant to be hovering about me always at my beck and call to satisfy my every personal whim. 

I've had a lot of experience with "gate dragons" at Washington Union Station, especially during the period when they were actually looking at tickets. They were usually friendly about it, but the policy of having everyone line up and wait until someone looks at your ticket is inherently stressful for everyone concerned. I got the idea that some of them were as annoyed at the process as the passengers. They did sure seem happy when the policy was changed to eliminate looking at everybody's ticket and the lines move faster, too. 

In all my years of Amtrak travel, I encountered exactly one conductor who was on what I would consider to be a "power trip," and displayed a "bad attitude" towards customers. I had another conductor throw me off a train because I had an "unreserved" ticket, and the train had switched to being all-reserved. (This was when they were converting all Northeast Regional trains to reserved service only.) I suppose he was justified in kicking me off, but he was a little rude about it. That's all the troubles I've had with conductors.

Compare that with an experience I had flying United Airlines in October 2001. We were lined up in San Francisco Airport with the mother of all long security lines and people were really complaining. I think some people might have been confused about the configuration of the line (which snaked and curved around the airport), or maybe some of the were really trying to butt in front of other people without being too obvious about it. Anyway, there was a certain amount of dissension and a (non-uniformed) United employee came out and threatened to have all of us arrested! Now *that's a "bad attitude!" And then we finally got to the gate, we had a problem with one of our reservations because -- who knows? But my wife was on a different reservation from my daughter and me because she flew out a day later than us. They did take care of that one to our satisfaction, but the whole trip was pretty stressful.*


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## tim49424 (Jul 15, 2019)

Rasputin said:


> I thought the policy at the Metropolitan Lounge had changed a few months ago and that people were now allowed to bring in outside food. Prior to that change people were being kicked out of the lounge for bringing in food from outside. there was a big discussion of this a few months back and a friend who used the lounge in April or May confirmed that outside food was now allowed.
> 
> Is the no food policy back on?



No. The lounge still allows outside food. Michigan Mom’s last time there was when the policy was still to not allow outside food. I’ve been there several times since the change, including Saturday (the 13th) and ate my meal from McDonald’s and a bottle of Coke. I doubt the policy will ever revert back to a no outside food allowed again. Please don’t let anyone tell you anything different....outside food IS allowed and has been since the closing of the Legacy Club.


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## Michigan Mom (Jul 15, 2019)

I was there on July 5th. There's a good possibility that I am remembering what was said incorrectly, especially since I was also there at the end of May.


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## tim49424 (Jul 15, 2019)

Michigan Mom said:


> I was there on July 5th. There's a good possibility that I am remembering what was said incorrectly, especially since I was also there at the end of May.



The policy went into effect, earlier than Feb. 18. I went down to Chicago on a day trip to celebrate my birthday and I started the following thread while in the lounge. This should clear up the timeline, I hope.

https://discuss.amtraktrains.com/th...ge-outside-food-policy-change-feb-2019.74686/


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## Michigan Mom (Jul 15, 2019)

It clears it up, but I'm still pretty sure a different announcement was made, and something about it being based on health department regulations. Maybe it was from when we were there in January, if it changed the following month. I don't want to falsely accuse employees of making incorrect announcements if I've just gotten the timeline confused.


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## tim49424 (Jul 15, 2019)

Michigan Mom said:


> It clears it up, but I'm still pretty sure a different announcement was made, and something about it being based on health department regulations. Maybe it was from when we were there in January, if it changed the following month. I don't want to falsely accuse employees of making incorrect announcements if I've just gotten the timeline confused.



I think it did change between your visit in January and mine in February. When I was there in February, as I stated in the thread I'd started, I asked the desk attendant if the policy had changed and he'd said yes. Also, no Amtrak staff asked anyone who was in there at the time to stop and go eat in the lobby or elsewhere. That's what motivated me to ask. Then I ended up going to McDonald's, getting some lunch and bringing it back and have been doing it since (I've been there again in March, a month ago and Saturday). Nevertheless, we're debating semantics here....the point is, the no food policy has been over for some time now, and it doesn't seem likely that it'll return. My belief is the change in policy, as I've stated before, was in conjunction to the closing of the Legacy Club......thus, the lowering of the fees for the ML to $25 for a day pass, for those who don't qualify for complimentary entry.


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## JayPea (Jul 15, 2019)

My experiences with Amtrak personnel have been by and large good to very good. There have been some isolated incidents that were less than stellar, including encountering a coach car attendant on the EB who as far as I'm concerned should be riding a broom and eating out of a trough, to the occasional disappearing SCA, to another SCA or two who flat out refused to do anything we asked including put the beds down, to the cafe car attendant on the Vermonter who was reluctant to give any service at all, and bitched about "you business class people getting all your free drinks". His worst sin as far as I was concerned was wearing a Yankee hat. I can tolerate most anything but wearing a damYANKEE hat was over the top!!!!!. And then there was the attendant on the EB who refused to sell me a diet Pepsi or bottled water, telling me to go drink out of the tap if I didn't like it, and only with the greatest of reluctance selling me apple juice even though I shouldn't have apple juice because of diabetes. Then when the lead service attendant appeared on scene to give me change, she proceeded to cheerfully sell the person in line behind me a diet Pepsi when I'd been told they were out. That one cost Amtrak a voucher.

Those have been isolated incidents and no where near the normal experience I've had. That said, when one poster said service has gone from bad to worse, I believe them. That's been THEIR experience. And when others say they've never encountered poor service, I believe them too. There again, that's been THEIR experience. Who am I, or anyone else for that matter, to say those experiences are wrong just because we ourselves haven't had those experiences??? We all react to things differently. To go further, my uncle and I have shared many trips together. There have been times when he thought a particular SCA was great and I thought they were worthless. And, like Yogi Berra might say, vice reversa. Our experiences are just that, ours, and I don't see the point of telling people how to react to certain things or telling them how to perceive the service they've gotten.


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## wwchi (Jul 15, 2019)

I take the Michigan trains out of chicago... the conductors on all my trains are great and know me since I am a regular...after 16 years of regular ridership would you believe not ONE person at the gate in Union Station acknowledges or knows me? THEY are the worst...hide from passengers with questions, sit there looking at their phones and even when I am friendly they look at me like who are you? Crazy...love my conductors though!


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## tim49424 (Jul 15, 2019)

wwchi said:


> I take the Michigan trains out of chicago... the conductors on all my trains are great and know me since I am a regular...after 16 years of regular ridership would you believe not ONE person at the gate in Union Station acknowledges or knows me? THEY are the worst...hide from passengers with questions, sit there looking at their phones and even when I am friendly they look at me like who are you? Crazy...love my conductors though!



I agree 1000% (not a typo, I agree 1,000 percent). 

By the way, this was the weekend I was trying to meet up with our mutual conductor friend who got transferred to the Empire Builder (yep, we certainly are fond of our conductors old and new, on the PM). I found out that he had to call off due to family matters, while I was sitting in the Metropolitan Lounge Saturday. Yesterday, I came back from Wisconsin on a 5-hour late EB, missed my connection to Holland and had alternate transportation instead of the train....got back here at 2:30 AM. Additionally, I had to wait the entire time in Wisconsin at the station in the sweltering heat....alone....I was the only one who boarded at Tomah. Crazy weekend...but I'd do it all over again and will since I still need to see him.....I was all prepared to say hi to him for you, so I'll remember next time.


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## NSC1109 (Jul 15, 2019)

wwchi said:


> I take the Michigan trains out of chicago... the conductors on all my trains are great and know me since I am a regular...after 16 years of regular ridership would you believe not ONE person at the gate in Union Station acknowledges or knows me? THEY are the worst...hide from passengers with questions, sit there looking at their phones and even when I am friendly they look at me like who are you? Crazy...love my conductors though!



Agreed. I’ve always found the AML conductors to be personable and a wealth of knowledge and almost always kept us informed. One of them even made the connection between my last name and one of his favorite movies and we had a chat about that for a little while.


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## MARC Rider (Jul 16, 2019)

spinnaker said:


> No one ever said anything about employees enforcing the rules. The problem is how they are doing it. They could politely inform offending passengers they are breaking the rule or they can snap at the passenger and berate them for breaking the rules.
> 
> It has to be difficult to be civil when it is the 20th person that you have told that day. But as far as you know, that passenger simply does not know the rules. As already mentioned they do make that announcement as they make many other announcements that eventually just become noise. If the person either ignores the first polite explanation or is a returning offender then I would see no problem with the employee getting more stern with the passenger.


I think what Michigan Mom is saying is that even if a customer-facing service grunt _*is*_ polite, there are some customers who will complain about "attitude" if they can't get what they want, even if what they want is unreasonable, contrary to company policy, etc. So you have to take some complaints of rude service with a grain of salt. For an extreme example, see the "nut-rage" incident on Korean Air. (In that case the unreasonable "customer" was a high-level executive of the airline, but I'm sure there are a certain number of customers who are never satisfied with anything, and would like to do what Ms. Cho did. *(i.e. publicly berate the service employee and then fire them.)


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## Qapla (Jul 16, 2019)

On a day trip to Tampa earlier in the year my brother and I rode the SM out of PAK. Two guys got on in Orlando. They were obviously a little drunk, wearing paint stained clothes. I had briefly talked to them just before they got on while I was taking pictures of the train - that's how I know they were drunk. They were "fed up" with Orlando and were headed to Tampa to see if they could find work. Whe they first got on they took the seats they were asked to and looked as if they would sleep all the way to Tampa.

Shortly before we got to Kissimmee a shouting match erupted on the car we were in. The language was full of the "F" word with a few of the "N" word thrown in along with threats of physical violence. It was these two guys and a woman who had a couple children with her. She was sitting in the front seats and they decided they wanted to sit on the floor where here kids had been quietly sitting and playing in front of her.

We ended up with three attendants and the conductor before all the shouting and name calling quit. About that time we were coming into Kissimmee. The conductor put the two drunk guys off the train and warned the woman that if she said anymore about those guys she would also have to get off - and she was a regular rider. She kept quiet and so did her kids for the rest of their trip. They actually got off at Lakeland.

As those guys got off the train they blamed Amtrak and the conductor for being "unprofessional" and "taking their money" and not letting them "ride the train in peace".

I'm sure they thought the Amtrak employees had an attitude and would tell all their friends about how unfair they were treated ... the rest of us were glad to see them go - we felt sorry for the people in Kissimmee.


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## spinnaker (Jul 16, 2019)

Qapla said:


> On a day trip to Tampa earlier in the year my brother and I rode the SM out of PAK. Two guys got on in Orlando. They were obviously a little drunk, wearing paint stained clothes. I had briefly talked to them just before they got on while I was taking pictures of the train - that's how I know they were drunk. They were "fed up" with Orlando and were headed to Tampa to see if they could find work. Whe they first got on they took the seats they were asked to and looked as if they would sleep all the way to Tampa.
> 
> Shortly before we got to Kissimmee a shouting match erupted on the car we were in. The language was full of the "F" word with a few of the "N" word thrown in along with threats of physical violence. It was these two guys and a woman who had a couple children with her. She was sitting in the front seats and they decided they wanted to sit on the floor where here kids had been quietly sitting and playing in front of her.
> 
> ...



So how does this apply? A couple of a-hats that were drunk. Totally irrelevant.

There is no denying Amtrak employees have a very difficult job as do anyone that has to deal with the public. It is especially difficult when you are confined with that public for a period of time. Flight attendants, bus drivers etc deal with this garbage everyday.


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## Sauve850 (Jul 16, 2019)

spinnaker said:


> From my experience, rules in the Metropolitan Lounge seem to be set by the individual employees. I have personally seen the rules change on the same day. The only difference two different employees enforcing the rules.
> 
> I see no problem in the Metro Lounge with outside food as long as passengers clean up after themselves. I do see a problem with it in the Cafe car as space is at a premium and should be reserved for those paying the cafe for the food.



I respectfully disagree. I think if you want outside food, eat it outside at that establishment. My observations are that most people do not clean up after themselves. They are simply sloppy and expect the employees to clean up after them.


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## tim49424 (Jul 16, 2019)

Sauve850 said:


> I respectfully disagree. I think if you want outside food, eat it outside at that establishment. My observations are that most people do not clean up after themselves. They are simply sloppy and expect the employees to clean up after them.



Most people are respectful by cleaning up after themselves...a few aren’t and they are the ones who are going to ruin it for everyone.


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## Qapla (Jul 17, 2019)

spinnaker said:


> So how does this apply? A couple of a-hats that were drunk. Totally irrelevant.



How does this apply? 

In the form that, many people who ARE the problem, when they leave a comment or tell others do not accept the blame for the trouble they caused. Instead, they blame it on the attitude of the poor worker that had to deal with them - just like these two guys did.

After all, they had already said that Amtrak and the employees were "unprofessional" instead of acknowledging the issue was of their own making.

I was attempting to illustrate by an actual example that I witnessed how the ones that needed the attitude adjustment were NOT the Amtrak employees - but those two guys who got off the train did not see it that way and blamed Amtrak and the employees for their removal from the train.


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## spinnaker (Jul 17, 2019)

Most passengers at least attempt to be good passengers. But passenger behavior is not the topic of this thread.


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## zephyr17 (Jul 17, 2019)

I've ridden Amtrak extensively since it started in 1971.

YMMV is the best description of customer service.

Generally, in my experience, Amtrak onboard service follows a bell curve, a few really excellent, a few really terrible, most okay somewhete in between, some a bit worse than others, some a bit better. There appear to be regional/crew base variations as well.

I don't blame the unions for any of it. Ensuring consistency in service quality is clearly a management responsibility. Even with union workforce, there are mechanisms to enforce things and contract language can be negotiated. This is a management responsibility that Amtrak has consistently abdicated over the years. Otherwise, service would be more consistent and good, and the bell curve would be shifted higher, so the lower end is more at "okay" than today's awful/absent.


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## dlagrua (Jul 17, 2019)

We have traveled long distance on Amtrak for many years and most of our experiences with the onboard staff have been pleasant. Looking forward at what is happening to the dining crews; it may be that some of the staff is very disappointed at the cuts made and those still coming. This terrible situation may be expressed in their attitudes about work but I can't say that I blame them. This kill the diner plan needs to be addressed with congress but few are speaking up and we have an Amtrak CEO, and an RPA that gives little vocal support.


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## spinnaker (Jul 17, 2019)

zephyr17 said:


> I've ridden Amtrak extensively since it started in 1971.
> 
> YMMV is the best description of customer service.
> 
> ...




No denying whatsoever that employee behavior is a management issue. But IMHO, this management is just looking for a reason to cut staff. I think the employees should not hand them the ammunition for their own demise.


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## PaulM (Jul 19, 2019)

spinnaker said:


> I really should have gotten the name of the woman in the first class lounge in Chicago. There is no reason I should be discriminated against just because I have a bicycle. Instead of giving me a hard time she really should have been prepared with reasonable alternatives rather that just "wait at the gate". I should have received the same benefits of any other first class passenger.


(responding to spinnaker. I can't seem to get the quote thing to work)
The last two times I had a bike and tried to use the ML I was told to take it to the baggage check area where they would hold it for me. But the problem is you never know when to leave the lounge to retrieve it. The baggage people have been very accommodating; but it does take time to get it out of storage. If you wait until the boarding announcement in the lounge, you've lost the advantage over the general boarding population.


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## spinnaker (Jul 19, 2019)

PaulM said:


> (responding to spinnaker. I can't seem to get the quote thing to work)
> The last two times I had a bike and tried to use the ML I was told to take it to the baggage check area where they would hold it for me. But the problem is you never know when to leave the lounge to retrieve it. The baggage people have been very accommodating; but it does take time to get it out of storage. If you wait until the boarding announcement in the lounge, you've lost the advantage over the general boarding population.




Same deal for me last year. For longer term / unattended (by me) it was the baggage area. Once closer to departure time I was permitted to bring the bike into the outer ML vestibule and lean it against the wall. Both the ML and baggage people could not have been nicer on that afternoon.

On that same trip and memory is a bit fuzzy if it happened the day before or that same morning but I was given a difficult time by a different employee over the bike. I was not permitted to have it anywhere near the ML. It was my point that how the rules can change in a day.

Edit:
Now I am thinking about it, it was the same day. As mentioned I had missed my connection do to Amtrak. The lady in the ML told me I could store my bike for free at the baggage overnight. Next morning I picked it up to ride to the lake. Later realizing I needed to use the restroom, I proceeded to the ML where I figured I could use the ML restroom and have my bike somewhat safe for just a few minutes. The ML employee would have none of it. She did not want the bike anywhere in the ML. They were not busy and there was no one there. Instead of arguing (plus I figured I should have thought of it before I picked up the bike), I headed off to the lake and took care of nature's call down there. 

As mentioned got a completely different treatment in the afternoon. I returned from my ride. I wanted to take a shower and grab something to eat for the train ride home. I was told I could not leave my bike in the ML for that time but was once again given the option to use baggage. I was told that I could then later pick it up, leave it against the wall in the ML and wait for boarding time.


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## Sauve850 (Jul 19, 2019)

Ok a week into the mission here. Have you made a detailed list and discussed it with anyone at Amtrak? If you climb high enough up the ladder they will be receptive.


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## The Commissioner (Jul 21, 2019)

The occasional disreputable employee on Amtrak is nothing new. I can remember surly Penn Central employees. My late mother could tell you a story about a power-tripping Pennsylvania Railroad conductor that had her in tears.


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## McMike (Jul 23, 2019)

I am consistently surprised by the cheerfulness and helpfulness of the vast majority of staff. Not at all what I would expect given the conditions and politics. Sure, I have seen a couple dining/snack staff meltdowns, and a few indifferent or overly cynical attendants over the years. But statistically speaking, those are the exception.

That said, I am sensing growing sense of resignation, and a sort of loss of interest in urgency. This is an intended and deliberate part of the program when management is trying to destroy their own company. The deteriorating environment and conditions lead to self-fulfilling cycles of decline in staff attitudes/service and customer experiences. You see this a lot in retail and consumer product companies that are being disassembled by private equity owners: as they slash costs brutally and make it clear to employees that this is a one-way trip into a steep ravine, a cacade of morale failures ensues.


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## Bob Dylan (Jul 24, 2019)

Right out of the 60s " Run 'em Off" Playbook.


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## MikefromCrete (Jul 24, 2019)

Isn't it about time the moderators changed the title of this thread to "Amtrak employees need an attitude adjustment"? The use of the word "and" throws me off every time I view it.


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## pennyk (Jul 24, 2019)

MikefromCrete said:


> Isn't it about time the moderators changed the title of this thread to "Amtrak employees need an attitude adjustment"? The use of the word "and" throws me off every time I view it.


Done. Sorry we missed it for quite a while.


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## daybeers (Aug 19, 2019)

Amtrak does have several bad apples, unfortunately. What we and the rest of the passengers need to do is REPORT those experiences. How can Amtrak be expected to improve when they don't know who or where the problems exist? Call 1-800-USA-RAIL and ask the automated Julie for Customer Relations (not Service). They are the ones authorized to give out vouchers/refunds/deal with complaints or praise.


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## Steve4031 (Aug 19, 2019)

I had to retrain an idiot on 6 last week. I used the employee praise/complaints link from the website. I now have it book marked so I can do it right away. My focus is really on recognizing good employees. But I will report bad ones. 

This incident occurred on the last day of the trip. I went to the lounge car to purchase a snack and beverage. The attendant was not very friendly to begin with because I was apparently interrupting his conversation with the conductor when I entered the lower level of the lounge car. I purchased 2 bags of Doritos and 2 root beers. I sat down at one of the tables and began reading. 

He started playing music in on his phone. I asked him to turn it off. He told me that’s my phone ringing. He never accepted a call. He did turn the music off. A minute later he comes over and says you can read up stairs, not here. I told him the announcements for the duration of my trip stated that those tables were for eating. I explained I was eating and reading. He repeated his statement in an intimidating tone. I told him I would leave when I was done eating. This individual needs to understand where his priorities should be. They should be waiting on passengers rather than conversations about our her passengers with other employees. He should follow Amtrak’s policy of no music without head phones.


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## drdumont (Aug 19, 2019)

This thread seems right on point. The majority of AMTRAK employees are great, helpful, and nice to know.
However, comma, invariably it is the food service people who can be just plain awful. Mostly the dining car people, sometimes the snack bar attendants.
Case in point -
15 August Eagle Northbound DAL-CHI. Great bunch. Pleasant to deal with, they got great tips.
17 August Eagle Southbound CHI-DAL. Dining car - Worst bunch of horse's asses I have encountered in ages. Slow, inattentive, argumentative, no salad, no bread, wrong food/drinks, und so weiter. And the car wasn't even 3/4 full! Oh yeah - no tip, and I went to the snack bar the next morning and paid for nuked breakfast in order to avoid said horse's asses.
The snack bar attendant was a little stuffy at first, but he had just been mobbed as we left Chicago. He warmed up after that, when I joked about trying to herd people is worse than trying to turn stampeding cattle.
Bottom line, Some of the Dining Car people just become bad at their jobs, surly, inattentive, just plain awful. Why them?
ISTR being told at one time they were really employees of the food service contractor - at one time a chain of roadside diners. Don't remember which one, probly changed now.
It's too bad, as the vast majority of the rest of the Long Distance AMTRAKers are just plain great folks.
And that burning odor is coming from the customer Comments page of the website...
Daughter and I already planning our next voyage, this was her first, my umptyleventh. "Gee, Dad, it really IS as much fun as you have told us for years!"
Sigh...


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## Larry H. (Aug 21, 2019)

spinnaker said:


> So what is the best way? Just call the Amtrak number or is there a better way?
> 
> I really should have gotten the name of the woman in the first class lounge in Chicago. There is no reason I should be discriminated against just because I have a bicycle. Instead of giving me a hard time she really should have been prepared with reasonable alternatives rather that just "wait at the gate". I should have received the same benefits of any other first class passenger.



Sounds like the same woman we had last summer when we went to Chicago. She was terrible, barking orders at people who were just trying to find out what they were supposed to do. She sounded like a drill Sargent at best. I did indeed report her to Amtrak. I am surprised they still have her in that position but then it probably has something to do with Unions and seniority.


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## tricia (Aug 21, 2019)

Larry H. said:


> Sounds like the same woman we had last summer when we went to Chicago. She was terrible, barking orders at people who were just trying to find out what they were supposed to do. She sounded like a drill Sargent at best. I did indeed report her to Amtrak. I am surprised they still have her in that position but then it probably has something to do with Unions and seniority.



Or with management not caring enough about quality of customer service.


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## dlagrua (Aug 21, 2019)

If I may be permitted to add another comment. In life there are only two types of people, good people and bad people. Its really that simple. While most of the people that we have met have been good, you are going to come across a "bad apple" once in a while. Amtrak is no exception to the rule. Lately we have come across some angry Amtrak employees but they are angry at Amtrak for the cut's and not at the passengers. When Amtrak people are good lets praise them, if they act bad then lets report them. I would say 95% of Amtrak employees have been nice.


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## fillyjonk (Aug 21, 2019)

In general (maybe one or two exceptions in the 20 years I've ridden), the sleeping car attendants have been good to excellent. The dining car staff tend to be more variable - I've run into people who were short or even bordering on rude with people. I try very hard to be polite even if I'm getting rudeness back and that *usually* softens the reaction I get from the dining car attendants. (It's also possible that a greater proportion of people tip the sleeping car attendants than the dining car staff? I don't know. I tip both unless service is really abysmal)

I write it off as "dining car attendants have to deal with more people, and probably have a more tiring job than sleeping car attendants" but I will admit it's a little off-putting to be "barked" at or - as happened once - I came in, indicated I was a solo traveler (so, expected to sit with strangers), was seated, and then was abruptly told to MOVE to a different place because that seat was needed for someone else. Oh, I got up and moved but....yeah. (I guess the case was, two people came down to be seated, and then the third traveler, who had been asleep, sloped in, and they didn't want to not-sit with the rest of their party). Maybe I let myself be pushed around, I don't know, but it seemed easier to just pick up and move than protest.

I have seen conductors who seemed a little powertrippy. Many of them tend to be a bit "short" with people but I figure that's because they have a lot to do and a lot they have to pay attention to.


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## drdumont (Aug 22, 2019)

drdumont said:


> This thread seems right on point. The majority of AMTRAK employees are great, helpful, and nice to know.
> However, comma, invariably it is the food service people who can be just plain awful. Mostly the dining car people, sometimes the snack bar attendants.
> Case in point -
> 
> ...



Well, here it is, 4 days later and no response from AMTRAK after I left comments on the website in the space provided. If I have a light day today I may call and ask for Customer Relations. I'm not really looking for a rebate or anything, I just want to ensure management is aware of the behavior of these rectus equu.i


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## Michigan Mom (Aug 22, 2019)

dlagrua said:


> If I may be permitted to add another comment. In life there are only two types of people, good people and bad people. Its really that simple. While most of the people that we have met have been good, you are going to come across a "bad apple" once in a while. Amtrak is no exception to the rule. Lately we have come across some angry Amtrak employees but they are angry at Amtrak for the cut's and not at the passengers. When Amtrak people are good lets praise them, if they act bad then lets report them. I would say 95% of Amtrak employees have been nice.



I have a different outlook. I think very few people are actually all good, or all bad. Most people are some type of mix on the scale from good to bad. I do agree that the vast majority of Amtrak employees are pleasant people, and depending on their job function may be more or less willing to engage in conversation. Conductors typically, in my experience anyway, seem to have their minds focused elsewhere and rarely are willing to stop and chat, and I would never characterize that as rudeness. In fact I appreciate it. if that makes sense.


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## Devil's Advocate (Aug 22, 2019)

Michigan Mom said:


> I have a different outlook. I think very few people are actually all good, or all bad. Most people are some type of mix on the scale from good to bad.


Agreed. I've always felt the idea of most people being "good" or "bad" was a silly concept based on lazy reasoning and binary logic.




Michigan Mom said:


> Conductors typically, in my experience anyway, seem to have their minds focused elsewhere and rarely are willing to stop and chat, and I would never characterize that as rudeness. In fact I appreciate it. if that makes sense.


I complain as much as anyone but I've never had anything bad to say about Amtrak conductors. I've also had good experiences with the vast majority of lounge car attendants. It's mainly sleeper attendants and dining car staff that cause most of my dissatisfaction. In theory the conductor is above everyone else, but they're usually too busy to spend a lot of time discussing staff failures. As a result Amtrak OBS operate more like a fast food restaurant where the highest ranking employee is an assistant manager with minimal training in conflict resolution and little incentive or authority to actually fix anything.


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## TiBike (Aug 22, 2019)

Are conductors really "above everyone else"? Maybe they have ultimate authority of a sort, but I haven't seen them exercise any supervisory responsibility for service staff. I have seen examples to the contrary, e.g. stopping to chat with the three (sometimes four) coach attendants who were hanging out in the business class car on the Starlight for most of a trip south from Salinas. Or holding an already late train for an extra ten minutes to load a bike herself, instead of asking one of the several service staff members standing around doing nothing to do it. I know there's an artificial union issue involved with that, but that's my point: service staff don't functionally report to conductors. There's no effective supervision out in the field.


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## Qapla (Aug 22, 2019)

One thing I have noticed it that most of the attendants helping you to board are helpful and willing - they even have a somewhat pleasant demeanor. However, many do not like when they have to repeat themselves when they give you your seating instructions when riding in coach. I have had this happen more than once.

It is not really their fault, per se ... it could be classified as "lack of foresight" in their training. When someone is on crutches or in a wheelchair these attendants go the extra mile to accommodate them - as they should. However, when a person as a "disability" that is not so apparent, they are not so quick to help. Case in point: When boarding, it is quite noisy outside the train and there are often many boarding at a given stop. The attendant asks you your destination and then gives you a seating assignment. They often do this while looking around to "keep order" and make sure no one trips or needs additional assistance. I am hard of hearing. When a person looks away, especially in a noisy environment, I cannot hear what they say ... well, technically, I sometimes can "hear" them - but I cannot understand them ... their words just become part of the "background noise". Then, when I do not respond to them immediately they seem to be "perturbed" that I am still standing there. If I get the chance to tell them I cannot hear them, they get the point ... sometimes.

It's not really their fault. Most people who can hear just fine never give a second thought that the person they are talking to may not be able to hear and/or understand them. I deal with this often when I eat somewhere and deal with waitstaff or counter help. Even when you tell them you can't hear them unless they look at you and speak a little louder ... most say "OK" and go right back to the way they were talking. I have had to tell some of the counter help in fast food places several times I cannot hear the before they get the point.

Recently I was approved for a handicapped placard due to a bad hip. I don't always need it, but, sometimes, I need to walk with a cane. I have learned to take the cane with me when I ride the train. I have noticed that I get better attention paid to me when boarding because the attendant can "see" that I have a need. Even though the cane has nothing to do with my hearing, it has helped the attendants to quit looking away while talking with me.

I have never reported any Amtrak employee because I had trouble hearing them. But, I do wish more businesses would give attention to people with hearing problems.

On another note:

We have taken a couple day trips to Tampa on the Star recently. There is one female attendant who looks a little "gruff". When boarding, she is all business. We have been on more than one trip with her. Due to her facial looks and her business manner when directing people to their seats one could easily assume she is "disgruntled" and "short" with people. That couldn't be further from the truth! We sat in the lounge car most of the way home the last trip we took. We had a chance to talk with her. She is an "absolute Sweetie". During the hustle and bustle of the boarding process, her cheeks become quite flushed (reddish more than pinkish - and quite blotched) ... but, as the train gets under way, her cheeks return to normal. This condition is known as Rosacea - and there is not much a person can do about it. She even came and got us when we were nearing our destination and told us which car we would need to move to to get off the train.


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## Sauve850 (Aug 22, 2019)

drdumont said:


> Well, here it is, 4 days later and no response from AMTRAK after I left comments on the website in the space provided. If I have a light day today I may call and ask for Customer Relations. I'm not really looking for a rebate or anything, I just want to ensure management is aware of the behavior of these rectus equu.i


A few days on the website could and usually takes a lot longer for response I believe. I would call but I wouldnt just leave it there. Just making sure mgmt is aware isnt enough in my opinion. Over the last 30 years thankfully Ive had very few instances that warranted a call. When I did I asked for and received followup on steps taken with the employee in question. The last time however was about 4-5 years ago. I was not in search of a voucher. Good luck.


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## SarahZ (Aug 22, 2019)

drdumont said:


> Well, here it is, 4 days later and no response from AMTRAK after I left comments on the website in the space provided. If I have a light day today I may call and ask for Customer Relations.


I would make a phone call. 

In the world of customer service, phone calls are the highest priority, then email, then website feedback. In the case of website feedback, issues are sometimes further triaged to the appropriate departments, who then further assign them by priority. 

So, while your comment may have been received Monday, it may not be seen by the appropriate department until Thursday, and you may not receive a response until Wednesday (because they're dealing with explosive phone issues first).

If you call, your complaint will be noted and addressed much quicker. I always recommend customers call when they have an urgent issue. Always.

Source: I've been a Customer Service Manager (in call centers) for 15 years.


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## Seaboard92 (Aug 22, 2019)

To add to something earlier the conductor is the main person. The conductor is above the engineer, and all service staff.


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## Qapla (Aug 23, 2019)

Just curious ... do the Conductors know how to drive the trains?


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## OBS (Aug 23, 2019)

Qapla said:


> Just curious ... do the Conductors know how to drive the trains?


Not officially....


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## Asher (Aug 23, 2019)

I think maybe, just maybe, if Amtrak dining car personal we’re made to work in a fast food establishment, they would learn what pressure is. Dining car servers work in a pretty orderly situation.


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## Seaboard92 (Aug 23, 2019)

anumberone said:


> I think maybe, just maybe, if Amtrak dining car personal we’re made to work in a fast food establishment, they would learn what pressure is. Dining car servers work in a pretty orderly situation.



Have you worked in a dining car? I have and I can tell you it’s pretty stressful.


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## Asher (Aug 23, 2019)

Seaboard92 said:


> Have you worked in a dining car? I have and I can tell you it’s pretty stressful.


No I never have. I didn't mean to imply it wasn't stressful. Bu it seems like diners are seated in a orderly fashion and I see no reason for a server to be impolite, it's not like they are waiting on a table of eight longshoreman.


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## Devil's Advocate (Aug 23, 2019)

Seaboard92 said:


> Have you worked in a dining car? I have and I can tell you it’s pretty stressful.


Have you ever chastised or berated your customers due to the stress? Have you ever broadcast your admonishment over the public address system for added effect? I don't think stress alone can explain the way some Amtrak dining car staff bark orders and snap at customers who make mistakes.


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