# September AGR Changes???



## Rail Freak (Jul 2, 2010)

Do any of you Pros anticipate any AGR changes once Amtrak takes the reins in Sept?

Thanx

RF


----------



## the_traveler (Jul 2, 2010)

Nobody knows! It could be better (like maybe 24/7 availability) or worse (like maybe increased point levels)!

I hope it's the first one!


----------



## Bob Dylan (Jul 2, 2010)

Speaking strictly as a footman to HRH the_traveler, it might be better since the agents will be regular amtak employees and not contract associates in Canada! (They might even know what state WAS,DC is in! :lol: )Awhile back I read somewhere that Amtrak was hiring 50 agents just to deal with AGR, not sure who the Manager?Admin will be but hope it's one of the hard chargers not stuck in the 70s! The only question I have is what about the points charged/routes traveled, theyve already killed all the loophole trips ,(RIP  )hope they dont tinker with the zone borders or create even tighter guidelines!BTW- Remembere to book AGR trips before July 31 to get the 10% rebate on award trips!


----------



## the_traveler (Jul 2, 2010)

jimhudson said:


> BTW- Remembere to book AGR trips before July 31 to get the 10% rebate on award trips!


You can still book them after July 31 and get a rebate - only the rebate will be *just 5%*!


----------



## jim55 (Jul 2, 2010)

I am not a pro just lived a few years.It't not going to be good. Amtrak is booming in these troubled times. When Bordman says the tax-payers expect something, and the prices of sleeper accomadations go up 3x (don't give me crap about this, been watching and doing for the last 7 years) the norm. Something is changeing. Why would Amtrak move to take over the AGR program now? I think to change policy without negotiateing with any kind of contract, cuting out any good deals we enjoy and probably uping the points required for a nice trip. I wonder, if there are interests on this forumn that have lead to the loss of the so called "loopholes", diverting topics elsewhere, and some of the neat things, we shared? Jim


----------



## AlanB (Jul 2, 2010)

Jim,

I believe that Amtrak is bringing things in house because of all the issues and problems that they've been having thanks to having a 3rd party administering the program.

As for changes, even now Amtrak still runs the program. While it's a small staff at present, there is still a department at 60 Mass for AGR. They set the rules, points needed for an award, and they come up with all the partners and promos that we see. They don't need the program to come in house to change the rules. They do that right now, and rather frequently too.

All that said, it wouldn't surprise me if they do eventually decide to raise the redemption rates for sleepers, as they've remained the same for 10 years now. As everyone knows, costs have not remained the same during that same 10 year period.


----------



## Exiled in Express (Jul 2, 2010)

jim55 said:


> I am not a pro just lived a few years.It't not going to be good. Amtrak is booming in these troubled times. When Bordman says the tax-payers expect something, and the prices of sleeper accomadations go up 3x (don't give me crap about this, been watching and doing for the last 7 years) the norm. Something is changeing. Why would Amtrak move to take over the AGR program now? I think to change policy without negotiateing with any kind of contract, cuting out any good deals we enjoy and probably uping the points required for a nice trip. I wonder, if there are interests on this forumn that have lead to the loss of the so called "loopholes", diverting topics elsewhere, and some of the neat things, we shared? Jim


I don't think the change to in house support is necessarily nefarious. I work for another quasi-federal agency and to tighten the budget we cut a lot of contracted services and brought them in house. The Carlson deal could also have been planned this way all along, let the Amtrak folks shadow an experienced loyalty management company and when ready let them take over. In the grand scheme of things the AGR pool of riders is not that big, how many times in your travels do you run into first time riders? For me it is multiple instances on every trip. I play points better than most and it took 2 or 3 trips before I saw the value Amtrak and AGR could be, if they sour the program that is one less tool to turn first time riders into repeat riders.


----------



## the_traveler (Jul 2, 2010)

I agree with Exiled, but it's not just "first time riders" that are not in AGR!





Last year, I took a trip in Acela First from BOS to NYP, and was seated at a 2 person table. In PVD, a guy got on, and when he left, he had left his ticket stub. It did not have an AGR number on it!



And he was the type (well dressed businessman) who appeared to take First quite often!

BTW - The meal he chose was .......... *NO MEAL* and his drinks were .......... *1** CAN OF PEPSI* (which he left half)!


----------



## jmbgeg (Jul 3, 2010)

AlanB said:


> Jim,
> 
> I believe that Amtrak is bringing things in house because of all the issues and problems that they've been having thanks to having a 3rd party administering the program.
> 
> ...


Costs have risen but so have fares. Is that not the equalizer?


----------



## AlanB (Jul 3, 2010)

jmbgeg said:


> AlanB said:
> 
> 
> > Jim,
> ...


Yes, regular fares have risen, but not the AGR fares. Those points represent dollars to Amtrak; dollars that Amtrak collects for the room occupied by an AGR member on a reward trip. If those paying have seen price increases over the years, why shouldn't those using AGR points? Amtrak can sell that room for far more money than its collecting from AGR.

And please understand, I'm not advocating for increasing the point levels and I certainly won't be happy to see them from a personal perspective. But I can understand why sooner or later it will become necessary.


----------



## Shanghai (Jul 3, 2010)

*By increasing fares, Amtrak is funding AGR, therefore there should not*

*be an increase in point requirements. There have been several studies on the airlines*

*and hotel loyalty programs that says these programs increase ridership and*

*thus revenues. In recent years, the loyalty programs actually make money for*

*the airlines with their partner contributions. I once heard that United Airlines*

*makes more money on Mileage Plus than on flying airplanes!!!*


----------



## Ispolkom (Jul 3, 2010)

Shanghai said:


> *By increasing fares, Amtrak is funding AGR, therefore there should not*
> 
> *be an increase in point requirements. There have been several studies on the airlines*
> 
> ...


But doesn't United Airlines make money on Mileage Plus by flooding the market with Frequent Flyer Miles, leading to either higher redemption costs or shortages of seats available for redemption?

Every frequent traveler program I know of has repeatedly devalued their points. This can be done by straight-forward increases in the number of points needed (Hilton at the beginning of the year, for example), or by tightening capacity controls (United is a well-known offender here).

The fact that AGR hasn't changed redemption rates for sleeper tickets in ten years doesn't mean that they won't. It probably means that they haven't paid attention to sleeper redemptions, either because the rate of redemptions is so low, or they are just focused on the NEC.

Like AlanB, I'm grateful that AGR redemption rates remain what they are, and especially that there are no capacity controls, but I won't be surprised when one or both of those changes.


----------



## Bigval109 (Jul 4, 2010)

Well I hope they don't change the point rates anytime soon :mellow: or reduce the space available for rewards. I'm getting close to my reward trip and a change would put be further back :angry2: . And pretty much ruin my trip plans for May 2011. :angry2: Maybe we should not speak changes into being.


----------



## Choo Choo (Jul 7, 2010)

Raising the AGR redemption rates might have unforeseen consequences. For example, in my case, I just earn enough points (20,000) to qualify for a two zone redemption reward every year. Since I have friends on the west coast and since I am coming in from the east coast, I usually just buy a sleeper for the portion of the trip not covered by the redemption. It's a lot of money, but I avoid the hassle of switiching over to the airlines or switching back into coach for that other portion of the trip that isn't covered. I don't know how common this is, but the presence of the AGR redemption program is encouraging me to spend regular money on an Amtrak sleeper which I wouldn't ordinarily spend it on.


----------



## jis (Jul 7, 2010)

Shanghai said:


> By increasing fares, Amtrak is funding AGR, therefore there should not
> 
> be an increase in point requirements. There have been several studies on the airlines
> 
> ...


But all that has not prevented United from raising redemption costs every couple of years.

Redemption cost now is almost double of what it was 15 years back, specially for upper class

redemptions.


----------

