# Coast to Coast Round Trip



## HP_Lovecraft (Dec 13, 2008)

Work is very slow. Free time is a dangerous thing!

One quirk about the Slidell loophole is that if you want to get back where you started, you need to use 2, 2-zone rewards for a coast-to-coast round trip. (ie Slidell-LAX, then LAX-Slidell)

However, I just noticed a similar situation with Albuqueque to New Orleans. They are both within the same zone, but offer 2 seperate loophole routes. One eastcoast, and one west coast.

It would work like this:

1st 1 Zone reward: ABQ-CHI-CVS-NOL (68 hours)

2nd 1 Zone 1 reward: NOL-LAX-ABQ (64 hours)

A fantastic deal if you lived near Albuqueque! Thats a $8.75/10000 rate


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## the_traveler (Dec 13, 2008)

How about buying a $9 ticket NOL-SDL, going 1 zone SDL-WAS-CHI-ABQ, then going 1 zone ABQ-LAX-NOL? :lol:


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## Long Train Runnin' (Dec 14, 2008)

the_traveler said:


> How about buying a $9 ticket NOL-SDL, going 1 zone SDL-WAS-CHI-ABQ, then going 1 zone ABQ-LAX-NOL? :lol:



There is know way you can do that? I mean wow lol how does AGR not notice something like that. Thats an amazing steal though lol


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## AlanB (Dec 14, 2008)

I can't speak to the idea of going to ABQ, but a few FT members have reported being questioned by AGR reps as to why they were starting their trips in places where they didn't live. So AGR is at least aware of these issues and perhaps looking for ways to close the gap.


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## Trogdor (Dec 14, 2008)

I figured they'd catch on. I mean, Slidell probably has, what, maybe a grand total of one AGR member, yet it's an awfully popular for folks redeeming award tickets.


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## Neil_M (Dec 14, 2008)

AlanB said:


> I can't speak to the idea of going to ABQ, but a few FT members have reported being questioned by AGR reps as to why they were starting their trips in places where they didn't live. So AGR is at least aware of these issues and perhaps looking for ways to close the gap.


Something like that could be hard to implement. If you could only book trips from where you lived then what about if you had flown from say, New York to LA and wanted to get the train back or if you were away for a few weeks and wanted to book a one way trip between two points you had used other transport to get to. All perfectly reasonable and liable to cause a lot of friction if forbidden. I s there anything in the AGR 'rules' that requires the rep to poke their noses into your business?


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## JayPea (Dec 14, 2008)

When I booked my Slidell loophole trip, I must have gotten a good AGR agent. He openly encouraged me to book the trip the way I did.


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## GG-1 (Dec 14, 2008)

AlanB said:


> I can't speak to the idea of going to ABQ, but a few FT members have reported being questioned by AGR reps as to why they were starting their trips in places where they didn't live. So AGR is at least aware of these issues and perhaps looking for ways to close the gap.


And how do the think I get on the train?


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## the_traveler (Dec 14, 2008)

JayPea said:


> When I booked my Slidell loophole trip, I must have gotten a good AGR agent. He openly encouraged me to book the trip the way I did.


And when I made my BHM-LAX award res, the AGR agent 1st suggested the PDX routing!  (As if I would say "*NO!*" :lol: )


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## HP_Lovecraft (Dec 14, 2008)

AlanB said:


> So AGR is at least aware of these issues and perhaps looking for ways to close the gap.


I think if you talked to the AGR lead manager, he would say "Yes, there is a very simple solution to the various "loopholes". MORE TRAINS, MORE ROUTES, MORE TRIPS"! So, if there was a direct train between, say, ALB, and New Orleans, there would be no need to route through DC or LAX.


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## sechs (Dec 15, 2008)

rmadisonwi said:


> I figured they'd catch on. I mean, Slidell probably has, what, maybe a grand total of one AGR member, yet it's an awfully popular for folks redeeming award tickets.


Maybe we should move on to the Picayune loophole?


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## Long Train Runnin' (Dec 15, 2008)

sechs said:


> rmadisonwi said:
> 
> 
> > I figured they'd catch on. I mean, Slidell probably has, what, maybe a grand total of one AGR member, yet it's an awfully popular for folks redeeming award tickets.
> ...


I guess it begs to be asked but whats that one? another border city that can let you take a few days of travel for no reason to get to the same place?


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## HP_Lovecraft (Dec 15, 2008)

Its the stop next to Slidell, meaning, if they make some rule like "stops to pick up passengers going to atlanta only", you could just go to Picayune instead.

Honestly, I don't think they really care. Its kinda interesting in itself just to figure out what the longest reward is for each zone.

For Zone-3, looks like Port Huron to Miami.


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## the_traveler (Dec 15, 2008)

Long Train Runnin said:


> sechs said:
> 
> 
> > rmadisonwi said:
> ...


Picayune is one of the other towns on the Crescent route in the Midwest zone. Any town between ATL and SDL is in the "loophole", and you are routed via WAS or CVS!


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## sechs (Dec 16, 2008)

Long Train Runnin said:


> another border city that can let you take a few days of travel for no reason to get to the same place?


And, if you haven't figured it out, Slidell isn't a border city. It's the first stop after New Orleans.

I'm still confused as to why Arrow will sometimes give you the routing via Washington going to New Orleans, but never going back.


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## the_traveler (Dec 16, 2008)

sechs said:


> I'm still confused as to why Arrow will sometimes give you the routing via Washington going to New Orleans, but never going back.


The system only lists a certain number of trains (maybe 8 total) and if it is maxed out before it can list the WAS connection, it will not list it. Also, I don't think it lists it to NOL because the CONO is a direct train to NOL from CHI. A way around that is to book to SDL and pay the extra $9 yourself - and you will be routed via WAS!


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## Ispolkom (Dec 16, 2008)

the_traveler said:


> sechs said:
> 
> 
> > I'm still confused as to why Arrow will sometimes give you the routing via Washington going to New Orleans, but never going back.
> ...


No, for some reason the system will give you MSP-CHI-CVS-NOL (on trains 8, 50 and 19) as a route, along with MSP-CHI-NOL. (On 11/7, for instance.) It doesn't give you MSP-CHI-WAS-NOL, though.

On the other hand, on that same day it routes a NYP-MSP passenger either through Washington or Philadelphia, not on the Lake Shore Limited. Go figure.


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## the_traveler (Dec 16, 2008)

Ispolkom said:


> the_traveler said:
> 
> 
> > sechs said:
> ...


As I said, it only shows a limited number of choices, and it ran out of space (or will run out of space) before it could list additional choices. And that goes for your NYP-MSP example too. It ran out of space before it could list the LSL option. The default time is "Anytime". I bet if you change that to something like "2 PM" or "3 PM", you will see the LSL listed.

Case in point, If I put in KIN-NYP, it will list the 7(ish) AM, 9(ish) AM, etc... trains - up to like 3 PM, but it will not show the 6:30 PM or 7:30 trains. But if I change the time from "Anytime" to something like "4 PM", I will see the 6:30 PM, 7:30 PM and 10:46 PM trains listed too.


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## Ispolkom (Dec 16, 2008)

the_traveler said:


> Ispolkom said:
> 
> 
> > the_traveler said:
> ...


Oh, I see my mistake with the New York booking. I guess that I'm not used to booking routes that have so many choices.

I still don't see, though, why the system allows Sech's original point. It lets me go from St. Paul to New Orleans via Charlottesville, even though the City of New Orleans gives a direct route.


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## the_traveler (Dec 16, 2008)

Ispolkom said:


> I still don't see, though, why the system allows Sech's original point. It lets me go from St. Paul to New Orleans via Charlottesville, even though the City of New Orleans gives a direct route.


It's called choices! Some people (like me  ) would rather go from CHI-NOL via WAS or CVS than to go directly on the CONO. And sometimes, it may in fact be less. The CONO may be high bucket, but the Cardinal/CL-Crescent may be low bucket!

It's the same with airlines. Some people may chose to fly from JFK to LAX nonstop, while others may want to go via ATL, ORD or DTW. And some crazy people would chose to fly from BOS to ALB (about 150 miles) via SAN and LAX! (I did that in the 1980's! :lol: )


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## Ispolkom (Dec 16, 2008)

the_traveler said:


> Ispolkom said:
> 
> 
> > I still don't see, though, why the system allows Sech's original point. It lets me go from St. Paul to New Orleans via Charlottesville, even though the City of New Orleans gives a direct route.
> ...


You're right, you're right. Why not offer the alternative? I was thinking that it didn't make sense to offer a longer routing to AGR redeemers, but that probably isn't too important to Amtrak. An example of your case is that yesterday I noticed that if I wanted to attend the inauguration next month I could still buy tickets to Washingtonl via the City of New Orleans and the Crescent and arrive, God willing at 10 a.m. on the 20th.

In any case, I have convinced Mrs. Ispolkom that on our return from our trip to Savannah next year we have to go to Atlanta and travel from there to Minot on AGR points. From Savannah it's 20k points for a roomette, while from Atlanta it's the same amount for a bedroom. Now to find a better route between Savannah and Atlanta than riding the Dog.


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## sechs (Dec 17, 2008)

the_traveler said:


> sechs said:
> 
> 
> > I'm still confused as to why Arrow will sometimes give you the routing via Washington going to New Orleans, but never going back.
> ...


I misstated the connecting city, but, the comment otherwise stands.

For example, if you look for KCY-NOL on Dec. 18, you'll get the Mule to St. Louis and connecting bus to the City, the Chief to Chicago and then the City, and a route via CVS on the Cardinal. If you reverse the trip, you will never get that routing with the Cardinal.

The number of trains isn't a limitation. Since the Crescent leaves in the morning, it would sort before the City of New Orleans. And you can't force it by choosing a time, anyway.

The connection between the Crescent and Cardinal is valid, as, if you choose two cities exclusively on their routes (ATL and CIN, for example), it will connect them at Charlottesville going either direction.


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## PRR 60 (Dec 17, 2008)

the_traveler said:


> ...And some crazy people would chose to fly from BOS to ALB (about 150 miles) via SAN and LAX! (I did that in the 1980's! :lol: )


And some fly from Orange County (CA) to PHL via SFO just for the fun of it. I did that in the 2008's! :lol:


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## the_traveler (Dec 17, 2008)

But I went to CA specifically to ride the (1980's Amfleet-equipped) Surfliner between SAN and LAX!  With buses thrown in between SAN and SAN and also between LAX and LAX! (Does that get me extra credit? :lol: )

And it only took me 36 hours for what should be a 3 hour drive!


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## Long Train Runnin' (Dec 18, 2008)

the_traveler said:


> But I went to CA specifically to ride the (1980's Amfleet-equipped) Surfliner between SAN and LAX!  With buses thrown in between SAN and SAN and also between LAX and LAX! (Does that get me extra credit? :lol: )
> And it only took me 36 hours for what should be a 3 hour drive!


Dare I ask how many AGR points you racked up for pulling that stunt?


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## the_traveler (Dec 18, 2008)

Back in thee 80's, AGR was not yet set up, and I was too dumb that I didn't yet sign up for the Eastern Airlines frequent flyer program (if in fact they even had one then). So I got -0- miles and/or points!  But because I was a student at the time, and Eastern Airlines offered a special student fare package of something like $25 per segment, the whole trip was (IIRC) under $125! :lol: (There were 4 flight segments - BOS-KC, KC-SAN, LAX-ATL and ATL-ALB, plus of course the Surfliner!)


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