# Service Disruption on Empire Builder



## CLEARFORK (Aug 2, 2018)

Just received phone call: "due to a service disruption your reservation on train 27 is cancelled. We're sorry, no more information is available at this time." Been waiting to speak to an agent for 40 minutes. $3000 in non-refundable reservations for this trip. Anyone have any idea?


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## keelhauled (Aug 2, 2018)

Is that for the very immediate future? BNSF derailed a freight train in Montana and shut down the track with no estimated reopening time.


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## Guest (Aug 2, 2018)

train 27 for this Saturday.


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## Acela150 (Aug 3, 2018)

CLEARFORK said:


> $3000 in non-refundable reservations for this trip.


In this case the trip is 100% refundable. You have nothing to worry about.


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## calwatch (Aug 3, 2018)

Unless you had other plans in your destination in which case you should try to get them to spring for a flight to your destination.


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## zephyr17 (Aug 3, 2018)

Doubt they would have done that even before Anderson.


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## cpotisch (Aug 3, 2018)

CLEARFORK said:


> Just received phone call: "due to a service disruption your reservation on train 27 is cancelled. We're sorry, no more information is available at this time." Been waiting to speak to an agent for 40 minutes. $3000 in non-refundable reservations for this trip. Anyone have any idea?


As Acela150 said, if they cancel on you, it is at least 100% refundable. It's even possible that if you call customer relations and explain how badly this screws things up, they may be willing to give you further compensation. My point is, I'm sure you will not have lost money on your ticket.


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## CLEARFORK (Aug 3, 2018)

No lost money on AMTRAK ticket. Lost money on non-refundable lodging reservations. Customer relations will not compensate even a portion of the rental car to drive out to East Glacier.


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## cpotisch (Aug 3, 2018)

CLEARFORK said:


> No lost money on AMTRAK ticket. Lost money on non-refundable lodging reservations. Customer relations will not compensate even a portion of the rental car to drive out to East Glacier.


Did you talk to customer relations or customer service? Customer service just means the regular agents at USA-RAIL. Customer relations is a specific branch that deals with compensating passengers, and you have to specifically ask to talk to them.


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## jis (Aug 3, 2018)

Here is what I can gather so far on this.

The derailment happened near Cut Bank adjacent to the famous trestle on 8/2. Good thing the derailment did not happen on the trestle.

Tracks should clear by around 9am MDT today (Friday 8/3). 7(1) and 8(1) were disrupted at Shelby MT and Essex MT respectively. A bus bridge was established between the two.

Trains 7 (04), 8 (03), 27 (04) and 28 (03) are canceled with no substitute transportation due to equipment out of position caused by the derailment.

BTW, am I the only one that is getting this sinking feeling that BNSF is having some difficulty keeping their train on the rails this summer?


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## Ryan (Aug 4, 2018)

CLEARFORK said:


> No lost money on AMTRAK ticket. Lost money on non-refundable lodging reservations. Customer relations will not compensate even a portion of the rental car to drive out to East Glacier.


Which exactly aligns with their published policy. Expecting otherwise was unrealistic.


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## cpotisch (Aug 4, 2018)

Ryan said:


> CLEARFORK said:
> 
> 
> > No lost money on AMTRAK ticket. Lost money on non-refundable lodging reservations. Customer relations will not compensate even a portion of the rental car to drive out to East Glacier.
> ...


Yeah, Amtrak is not really obligated in the slightest to comp non-Amtrak travel bookings. Sometimes CR may be willing to give you extra cash or a voucher, but that's really only if they're treating you especially well, and it's not technically Amtrak comping lost bookings, if that makes sense.


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## the_traveler (Aug 4, 2018)

It would be the same thing if you were driving, and the road was closed due to a pile-up or a bridge collapse or if you were flying and they closed the airport because of snow. You would not expect Ford, Dodge, United or American to compensate you for your hotel or rental. So why do you expect Amtrak to do so?





It was not even their fault. It was BNSF that derailed. You would not expect U-Haul to compensate you if driving - just because a U-Haul got into an accident on the road?


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## ehbowen (Aug 4, 2018)

Yeah, that's why they sell travel insurance. If it's important or if you stand to lose a lot of money if a single domino falls, you buy it.


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## cpotisch (Aug 5, 2018)

the_traveler said:


> It would be the same thing if you were driving, and the road was closed due to a pile-up or a bridge collapse or if you were flying and they closed the airport because of snow. You would not expect Ford, Dodge, United or American to compensate you for your hotel or rental. So why do you expect Amtrak to do so?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


In my opinion, asking a car manufacturer to comp you if a road was closed is not really analogous to asking for compensation from Amtrak. If anything, that's basically the equivalent of asking Bombardier or Morrison-Knudsen for compensation, but I don't think anyone is doing that.


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## the_traveler (Aug 5, 2018)

Why is it different?





The train that derailed was not Amtrak. The tracks that it ran on is not owned or maintained by Amtrak. The locomotive and cars that derailed were not manufactured by Amtrak.

So why is Amtrak liable for a train that is not their own, operating on tracks not their own, maintained by another railroad and with cars not manufactured by Amtrak.

Using the same reasoning, if you got into a car accident in Texas, should you say New York State DOT is liable because the road was not maintained correctly?


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## Ryan (Aug 5, 2018)

Hint: He's not saying that Amtrak is liable.


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## jebr (Aug 5, 2018)

the_traveler said:


> Using the same reasoning, if you got into a car accident in Texas, should you say New York State DOT is liable because the road was not maintained correctly?


How is that even close to the same reasoning? No one's saying Amtrak is liable for the train crashing. The only thing that was suggested is that Amtrak should pay for the hotel/rental car. Which I don't necessarily agree with, but if Amtrak isn't providing alternate transportation and the refund isn't enough to cover alternate transportation purchased separately, I don't think it's unreasonable to ask Amtrak to cover the difference.

Amtrak may have been able to provide bus transportation, even if the bus had to come from a ways away. As far as I'm aware, there weren't a lot of nearby roads closed, so it seems feasible for them to do so. Otherwise, Amtrak should at least provide enough for someone to arrange alternate transportation.


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## bms (Aug 5, 2018)

Every time you buy an Amtrak ticket, there is trip cancellation insurance offered. If Amtrak were to cover hotels, rental cars etc. for all passengers, basically everyone would be buying that insurance with their ticket and they'd likely have to raise the price of every ticket.


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## shelzp (Aug 5, 2018)

Your credit card company may provide you with some travel insurance


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## Bob Dylan (Aug 5, 2018)

Trip Insurance for Expensive Trips and your Credit Card coverage are excellent tips.

I'm with those who think Amtrak should refund the difference for Alternate Transportation ( Flying or Rent Car)But NOT the Non-refundable part of the trip for Hotels,Rent Cars etc..

You should be careful when booking or buying anything Expensive that is Non-refundable, Buyer Beware!


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## MKE Rail (Aug 5, 2018)

My family was on the CZ in 2015 that ended up being 36 hours late. We took it all the way CHI to EMY (around 87 hours on). It was pretty rough but Amtrak gave us a credit for the entire trip (the customer relations rep was shocked we were that late). When he heard my daughter (4) in the background the agent felt so bad they add a $500 credit.

In my experience Amtrak does seem to take better care of you than airlines if something goes wrong.


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## cpotisch (Aug 5, 2018)

MKE Rail said:


> My family was on the CZ in 2015 that ended up being 36 hours late. We took it all the way CHI to EMY (around 87 hours on). It was pretty rough but Amtrak gave us a credit for the entire trip (the customer relations rep was shocked we were that late). When he heard my daughter (4) in the background the agent felt so bad they add a $500 credit.
> 
> In my experience Amtrak does seem to take better care of you than airlines if something goes wrong.


Couldn’t agree more. When we called customer relations about a 20 hour late Silver Meteor that had derailed and run out of food, their very first offer was two $300 e-vouchers I’m a $520 ticket. They didn’t argue at all or anything like that - they just understood immediately and gave us $600 in vouchers. Try calling the airlines about that kind of stuff - you’re probably not going to end up top satisfied.


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## Dakota 400 (Aug 5, 2018)

Travel insurance is my friend. As a senior citizen, it's not inexpensive. But, when one needs it, it more than pays for itself.


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## Guest (Sep 10, 2018)

I haven't gone to the Amtrak site yet so I am asking here. Does anyone know what the price of their travel insurance is for their trips? Does it depend on how much your ticket cost?? I have always gotten travel insurance for my cruises but never given a thought to getting it for my train trips. This thread has positively made me think I should be getting it. Thanks for any replies.


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## Guest (Sep 10, 2018)

I found this on the Amtrak site. I hope this helps with some information on this thread.

Disclaimer of Liability


Amtrak's fares, time schedules, equipment, routing, services and information (hereinafter "Amtrak services") are not guaranteed and are provided "as is" without any warranties of any kind, either express or implied, and Amtrak disclaims all warranties, express or implied.

Amtrak reserves the right to change its policies without notice.

Amtrak further specifically disclaims liability for any inconvenience, expense, or damages, incidental, consequential, punitive, lost profits, loss business or otherwise, resulting from errors in its timetable, shortages of equipment, or due to delayed trains, except when such delay causes a passenger to miss an Amtrak train guaranteed connection. When a guaranteed Amtrak train connection is missed, Amtrak will provide passenger with alternate transportation on Amtrak, another carrier, or provide overnight hotel accommodations, at Amtrak's sole discretion, but only when such circumstances resulted from the actions of Amtrak and this shall constitute Amtrak's sole liability and passenger's sole and exclusive remedy.

Amtrak also disclaims any liability for the products and/or services of Amtrak's advertisers, business partners, sponsors, suppliers, licensors and agents to the extent permissible under the law and Amtrak shall only be responsible for the rail transportation services that it provides.

See also Web Notices and Site Terms of Use.

I looked up the travel insurance Amtrak offered and it only covered me if ''' I ''' was unable to make it to the train. It was a good price, but nothing was covered if Amtrak cancelled.


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## cpotisch (Sep 10, 2018)

Guest said:


> I haven't gone to the Amtrak site yet so I am asking here. Does anyone know what the price of their travel insurance is for their trips? Does it depend on how much your ticket cost?? I have always gotten travel insurance for my cruises but never given a thought to getting it for my train trips. This thread has positively made me think I should be getting it. Thanks for any replies.


Looks like it's $17.00 per person no matter what. I do not think it's worth it, considering the constraints.


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## the_traveler (Sep 10, 2018)

Personally neither do I. If there was a problem with say a connecting train, Amtrak will take care of it anyway. If you really want travel insurance for a high expense item, like a 2 week hotel stay or the flights get to reach the train, I would go with another company myself.


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## Bob Dylan (Sep 10, 2018)

You're Credit Card or Insurance you already have may provide coverage during Travel, but for what Amtrak offers, as was said, I don't think it's worth it.

As,also was said, if you're doing an Expensive Trip ( in the Thousands,Non Cancelable Reservations etc) I'd look into Private Insurance with your Agent or Broker!


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