# Where will the first class car be on my Acela Express journey?



## Andy Oaker

Hello from the UK,

On Sunday May 14, we are travelling from Providence, R.I. to New York, N.Y. on train # 2253 at 11:45am. Where will the first class car be - at the front or at the rear of the train?

Thank you


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## Hal

Andy Oaker said:


> Hello from the UK,
> 
> On Sunday May 14, we are travelling from Providence, R.I. to New York, N.Y. on train # 2253 at 11:45am. Where will the first class car be - at the front or at the rear of the train?
> 
> Thank you


Ask at the Providence station when you get there which end. Either end is possible so no way to know for sure ahead of the train departing Boston on May 14.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## Lonestar648

There is no way to know in advance. Depends which consist is assigned to make that run that day.


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## Tennessee Traveler

There is a Power(Engine) car at each end of the train and the first class car when I rode was the last car before the trailing power car. Since I only rode one time and live in Tennessee, I don't know if that is standard or different for all sets of Acela Equipment. It did appear that each Acela train was a distinctive equipment set with push pull operation meaning that the train was not turned at the end of each trip. In fact, Washington, DC, did not appear to provide a point to turn a train so the equipment would simply operate in the reverse direction when the southbound arrival departed as the northbound train. If that is the case, the first class car will be at either end adjacent to the power engine car.


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## AG1

The station agents can look it up on the computer. At RTE and PVD the location is usually announced over the public address system. For example "Acela arriving Track 1, First class position 2". You would then go and stand by the "Position 2 sign".


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## the_traveler

The First Class car is always at the end, but it may not always be at the same end.

I have been at the Club Acela many times in Washington when they announced "The xx:xx Acela boarding on track ## - First Class in Front". The next Acela may be announced as "The xx:xx Acela boarding on track ## - First Class in the last car". Thus, it is unknown until just before departure where First Class is located. The ticket agents can tell you at the station.


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## Triley

Tennessee Traveler said:


> There is a Power(Engine) car at each end of the train and the first class car when I rode was the last car before the trailing power car. Since I only rode one time and live in Tennessee, I don't know if that is standard or different for all sets of Acela Equipment. It did appear that each Acela train was a distinctive equipment set with push pull operation meaning that the train was not turned at the end of each trip. In fact, Washington, DC, did not appear to provide a point to turn a train so the equipment would simply operate in the reverse direction when the southbound arrival departed as the northbound train. If that is the case, the first class car will be at either end adjacent to the power engine car.


Equipment can be turned using the wye in the yard if needed, though typically yes, the equipment does not get turned around.

To the OP - For an Acela where the consist is starting its day in Boston, the first class car is typically to the rear. But as said, check with an agent in the station, if they don't announce it.


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## amamba

RRRick said:


> The station agents can look it up on the computer. At RTE and PVD the location is usually announced over the public address system. For example "Acela arriving Track 1, First class position 2". You would then go and stand by the "Position 2 sign".


they removed the position signs in PVD. Unclear why - we used to have A, B, C, D, E etc. 
The agents at the ticket window in PVD are very friendly and will tell you.

I hope you enjoy your visit to Rhode Island!!


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## Triley

amamba said:


> RRRick said:
> 
> 
> 
> The station agents can look it up on the computer. At RTE and PVD the location is usually announced over the public address system. For example "Acela arriving Track 1, First class position 2". You would then go and stand by the "Position 2 sign".
> 
> 
> 
> they removed the position signs in PVD. Unclear why - we used to have A, B, C, D, E etc.
> The agents at the ticket window in PVD are very friendly and will tell you.
> 
> I hope you enjoy your visit to Rhode Island!!
Click to expand...

I wasn't thinking when I made my post. I forgot they have the more standardized signs now. Go downstairs and look at the signs (which is the problem since many don't), and provided the engineer spots the train where they should, the signs will tell you were the quiet car or first class car (or business and quiet car on a regional).


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## Palmetto

For those taking an Acela out of Penn Station, knowing which end is the front can be a puzzling situation.


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## Hal

Palmetto said:


> For those taking an Acela out of Penn Station, know which end is the front can be a puzzling situation.


Ask the usher at the boarding gate.


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## the_traveler

If you're boarding at NYP and are in First Class, most likely you'll be in the Club Acela. They provide an escort to the train.

Even if you don't, it is easy to know "which is the front end". If the train is headed towards WAS, the front will be on the west end of the platform. If the train is headed towards BOS, the front will be on the east end. If they board from the east gates (i.e. - 9E, 12E, etc...), the west end will be farthest from the escalator and the east end will be nearest. If they board from the west gates (i.e. - 10W, 13W, etc...), it is opposite.


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## VentureForth

This is where the anal retentive Japanese method is quite nice. Not only do the car numbers line up within centimeters of the line on the platform, but they ALWAYS maintain their consists consistent, IE: Car #1 is always facing Tokyo (or the major city on the route). Car #16 will NEVER be in a different place on a different consist going the same direction at the same station.


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## Devil's Advocate

VentureForth said:


> This is where the anal retentive Japanese method is quite nice. Not only do the car numbers line up within centimeters of the line on the platform, but they ALWAYS maintain their consists consistent, IE: Car #1 is always facing Tokyo (or the major city on the route). Car #16 will NEVER be in a different place on a different consist going the same direction at the same station.


I'm inclined to believe that people who see nothing wrong with Amtrak probably have little or no experience with passenger rail systems in other countries.


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## CCC1007

VentureForth said:


> This is where the anal retentive Japanese method is quite nice. Not only do the car numbers line up within centimeters of the line on the platform, but they ALWAYS maintain their consists consistent, IE: Car #1 is always facing Tokyo (or the major city on the route). Car #16 will NEVER be in a different place on a different consist going the same direction at the same station.


That is made much easier by having a semi permanently coupled set and not worrying about setting up a different cab for each run, which is why Acela tends to be turned on a loop or wye between runs.


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## the_traveler

No, AE doesn't have to be turned. They just use the Power Car on the other end.

That's why First may be the 1st car out of NYP, but the last car out of WAS or BOS. And it's the same consist that arrived.


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## CCC1007

the_traveler said:


> No, AE doesn't have to be turned. They just use the Power Car on the other end.
> 
> That's why First may be the 1st car out of NYP, but the last car out of WAS or BOS. And it's the same consist that arrived.


I never said it *had* to turn, only that it tends to turn, especially if the cleaning and restocking occurs outside the station.


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## Tennessee Traveler

On my only trip on Acela Wilmington, DE, to DC my first class car was the last passenger car just in front of the trailing engine.


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## OBS

There are only two turns a day that are routinely turned on the loop in NY. 2100 for 2117 and 2104 for 2121.


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## CCC1007

OBS said:


> There are only two turns a day that are routinely turned on the loop in NY. 2100 for 2117 and 2104 for 2121.


Ok, so why are they not turning them on the loop that is clearly designed to accommodate a quick turn in sunnyside yard? Do they turn the regionals on that loop?


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## Triley

CCC1007 said:


> OBS said:
> 
> 
> 
> There are only two turns a day that are routinely turned on the loop in NY. 2100 for 2117 and 2104 for 2121.
> 
> 
> 
> Ok, so why are they not turning them on the loop that is clearly designed to accommodate a quick turn in sunnyside yard? Do they turn the regionals on that loop?
Click to expand...

DC does not have a loop, but rather a wye, so they can not make quick loops. Keeping in mind that the equipment turns need to be done in less than an hour and a half of the train arrives on time, if you go and waste 20-30 minutes wyeing the train, now you're left with close to an hour to clean the train, strip the first class stock, and load it with fresh stock. And then the attendants will often be late getting the meals in the oven, and whatever ever other prep the need to do to start service. So now customer satisfaction in first class will suffer.

No thanks. I will deal with the consist's orientation being uncertain. Again, depending on where the equipment originated, as a frequent rider you can make an educated guess as to where the cars will be located. Just install the signs that show car locations on the platform and leave it at that.

There are also reasons that we may operate a consist from the opposite direction of where it would typically be from it's origin, such as something makes one cab car inoperable of leading the train. If there was only one cab, the equipment would then have to be shopped and who knows where the spare equipment would come from? In Boston there isn't any, so we'd have to keep stealing from a later train, until we start forcing the in-station equipment turns to be ready to go out within 30 minutes minutes of its arrival as opposed to 1:30 after it's arrival. This will occasionally happen in DC either if an earlier set goes mechanical, or if it's involved in a service disruption.

There are reasons Amtrak does things the way it does, and there are often consequences to many of the suggestions on these forums to possible changes.


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## PVD

They are double ended, and don't need to be turned, but might be if a service issue meant it could only be run from one end. The regionals and Empire Service (unlike Keystones) only have an engine at one end and no cab car, they must be looped, wyed, or engine run around to the other end, depending on where they are. (SSYD would loop) they don't run push-pull.


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## jis

CCC1007 said:


> the_traveler said:
> 
> 
> 
> No, AE doesn't have to be turned. They just use the Power Car on the other end.
> 
> That's why First may be the 1st car out of NYP, but the last car out of WAS or BOS. And it's the same consist that arrived.
> 
> 
> 
> I never said it *had* to turn, only that it tends to turn, especially if the cleaning and restocking occurs outside the station.
Click to expand...

That is not true anywhere other than in New York. And in New York the track layout is such that it is not easy to get a train from Penn Station into Sunnyside Yard without turning it. In Washington or Boston typically an Acela will not get turned even if it is sent to Ivy City or Southampton St. respectively.


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## Hal

Don't overthink this. If there were enough train sets the first class would always be at the rear. Overnight the train sets go to the shop and unless there is a do not lead issue with a power car they come back from the yard with the first class positioned at the rear no matter how the train set was pointed when it came in. As the train sets come in from the road during the day there is not enough time to send them to the shop or out to the yard to wye or loop. They are turned in the station. So the first class car that arrived in the rear is going to go back out up front.


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## Triley

Hal said:


> Don't overthink this. If there were enough train sets the first class would always be at the rear. Overnight the train sets go to the shop and unless there is a do not lead issue with a power car they come back from the yard with the first class positioned at the rear no matter how the train set was pointed when it came in. As the train sets come in from the road during the day there is not enough time to send them to the shop or out to the yard to wye or loop. They are turned in the station. So the first class car that arrived in the rear is going to go back out up front.


Thank you. Glad to see back up. Lol


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