# Stadiums, sports arenas, and public transit



## DET63 (Dec 30, 2010)

The recent Philadelphia Eagles home game with the Minnesota Vikings was postponed not necessarily because the NFL expected a lot of snow on the field at game time, but because of concerns about fans getting to and from the game safely. If someone got killed in a car wreck _en route_, there could be thousands of dollars in medical and funeral expenses that wouldn't be going into the NFL's coffins—er, coffers.

How much thought goes, from either side, into locating stadiums and sports arenas near public transportation? On the one hand, Madison Square Garden is literally only a few feet (and vertical feet at that) away from Penn Station. On the other hand, Jerry Jones's Cowboys Stadium seems to be about as far as you can get from public transportation in any major metropolitan area in the U.S., if not the world.

It would seem to me that locating outdoor stadiums in cold-weather areas close to public transit would be quite desirable in order to avoid situations like the one in Philadelphia, where the safety of spectators traveling to and from the event could be an issue during a winter storm. This logic would also seem to recommend the existence of rail, rather than bus (including BRT or "quality bus" or whatever they call it), transit, since buses are subject to many of the same issues as other vehicles negotiating icy roads.

However, it is not enough to have stadiums near subway stations: stations must also be located wherever potential spectators live. You're not going to take the subway to the game if it doesn't also go by your house.

In the Bay Area, BART serves Oakland Coliseum and Oracle Arena, both of which are about a 5-minute or less walk away from the Coliseum BART station (and much of the walk is on a pedestrian bridge), while AT&T Park is served by S.F. Muni streetcars (not the cable cars) and buses. I'm not sure what kind of transit serves Candlestick Park or the Cow Palace; I'm sure that at least a few bus lines run to each. I don't know what the transit service will be like if and when the A's and/or 49ers get new stadiums, however.


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## Shawn Ryu (Dec 30, 2010)

I always said Jerry Jones is a greedy piece of **** and thats just one of the many reasons why. he charges at least 40 dollars just to park. He doesnt want public transit because he wants everyone to drive to his stadium.

MSG is RIGHT ABOVE NYP. Literally. Yankee Stadium and Citi Fields are accessible by subways AND commuter rails.

Boston TD Banknorth Garden is also RIGHT ABOVE the Boston North Station.

In Philly, all 4 major sports teams' games can be accessed by using the SEPTA orange line to Pattison (now called AT and T). Because all of their home fields are in one location.


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## Ryan (Dec 30, 2010)

The Redskins really missed the mark with having the WMATA blue line just over a mile from the stadium - the plans were underway for the line to be built where it was and the Redskins had no desire to try and get the line closer to the stadium to protect their parking revenue.

Contrast that with the Nationals, Ravens, Orioles and Capitals, all who have mass transit right at the stadlum/arena.


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## AlanB (Dec 30, 2010)

Shawn Ryu said:


> In Philly, all 4 major sports teams' games can be accessed by using the SEPTA orange line to Pattison (now called AT and T). Because all of their home fields are in one location.


While you are correct, fans could have taken SEPTA to the game and many do just that. there is no way that SEPTA could have handled a full stadium on its own. The line simply doesn't have that much capacity. Emptying that stadium soley with the subway would probably take 2 hours or more.

And of course there are plenty of people who simply don't have easy access to any of SEPTA's rail lines.


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## Shawn Ryu (Dec 30, 2010)

AlanB said:


> Shawn Ryu said:
> 
> 
> > In Philly, all 4 major sports teams' games can be accessed by using the SEPTA orange line to Pattison (now called AT and T). Because all of their home fields are in one location.
> ...


The fans tend to hang out in the downtown area before going to the game. So its no worry. Its easy to access any of the subway lines from downtown area.

Plus the parking lot is huge. There is nothing around the stadium but the parking lots. so most people will still take the car. Orange Line will never be like the subways servicing the Mets or the Yankees fans. But its still an option. A great option. After a baseball football hockey or bball game the trains anywhere are always going to be packed.


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## NS VIA Fan (Dec 30, 2010)

Toronto Union Station (VIA, Amtrak, GO Trains & TTC) has a direct interior connection to the Air Canada Centre (Leafs NHL & Raptors NBA) and the Rogers Centre (SkyDome) is adjacent (Blue Jays, Argonauts CFL and the NFL Buffalo Bills when they play in Toronto)

Montreal’s Bell Centre (Canadiens NHL) is built above the former CPR Windsor Station and has an interior connection to the AMT commuter train station. It’s also connected through underground passages to Central Station (VIA, Amtrak, AMT) the Metro and several large Hotels.



Shawn Ryu said:


> Boston TD Banknorth Garden is also RIGHT ABOVE the Boston North Station


F.Y.I. "TD" stands for the "Toronto Dominion" BankNorth Garden in Boston


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## FrankStar (Dec 30, 2010)

I live within short walking distance of the stadiums, so it's not an issue for me. People were due to pre-game at my house on Sunday before the game and walk the rest of the way.

If Septa (and the political powers that be) had the will, they could probably fill the stadium using only public transit. There are park-and-rides on both sides of the rivers that connect to public transportation.

In fact, a friend of mine suggested that for this past Sunday. Give plenty of warning (the decision was made more than eight hours before game time)and close down the parking lots and vehicular access to the area - and force people to use public transportation. PPA already strictly enforces a non-resident parking ban in my neighborhood during big events in my neighborhood.

They still would have filled the stadium - even in a blizzard.

There are also other Septa bus routes that will get you fairly close to the stadiums.

Another thing to note: Originally, this game was scheduled for 1 p.m. and the NFL only changed it to a night game a few weeks ago. The conditions would have been OK for the 1 p.m. start and the weather only got really bad well after the usual 4 p.m. end time.


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## JayPea (Dec 30, 2010)

Qwest and Safeco Fields in Seattle, home of the Seahawks and Mariners, respectively, are within a few short block of King St. Station and both have easy access to bus and light rail service.


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## Pastor Dave (Dec 30, 2010)

I've taken SEPTA to several sporting events and concerts in South Philadelphia. It works quite well and they usually add service for big events. But I agree that they couldn't possibly handle an entire stadium.


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## Shawn Ryu (Dec 31, 2010)

No public transit can actually handle an entire stadium. Not even in New York. Just enough to ease the car traffic.


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## Bob Dylan (Dec 31, 2010)

The comment about Coach Jerry Jones (aka "The Owner")is spot on! Also the Texas Rangers Stadium is next door as is Fiesta Texas Amusement Park. When the City of Arlington cut their deals with these Greed Merchants, er Sports/Amusement Organizations, it is commonly believed that NOT having Public Transportation to Arlington from neighboring Cities was part of the "Give Away the Store Deals" that Arlington politicians cut with these con artists!

Interestingly, when the upcoming Super Bowl is played there, the NFL has insisted that special trains and busses must be run to transport the 100,000+ that will pay Big Bucks to attend the festivities surrounding this event. Contrast this with DART which runs special trains for events at the American Airlines Arena in Dallas and AMTRAK which runs the Heartland Flyer from OKC to the Fairgorunds in Dallas for the Texas-Oklahoma game each year!


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## Traingeek (Dec 31, 2010)

In smaller Cities like Aberdeen, Baseball stadiums aren't big enough (ours is 6,000) to be practical for Mass transit. Every time I go down to to Ravens or Orioles game in Baltimore, I use Amtrak and MTA Light rail right to the stadium. It really depends on the city.


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## DET63 (Jan 1, 2011)

JayPea said:


> Qwest and Safeco Fields in Seattle, home of the Seahawks and Mariners, respectively, are within a few short block of King St. Station and both have easy access to bus and light rail service.


Isn't KeyArena, former home of the SuperSonics, and originally known as Seattle Center Coliseum, close to one end of the monorail?


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## JayPea (Jan 1, 2011)

True. KeyArena is at the Seattle Center/Space Needle end of the monorail. And the northern terminus of Seattle's light rail service, Central Link Light Rail, is at Westlake, which is at the other end of the monorail system.


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## Tracktwentynine (Jan 3, 2011)

In Atlanta, MARTA directly serves the Georgia Dome (NFL Falcons) and Philips Arena (NHL Thrashers, NBA Hawks) with their Georgia Dome/GWCC/Philips Arena/CNN Center Station on the Blue & Green lines. Georgia Tech's Grant Field (football) is less than 3 blocks from North Avenue Station (Red/Gold lines) and GT's Alexander Memorial Coliseum (basketball) is about 4 blocks from Midtown Station (Red/Gold lines).

Turner Field, which is home to MLB's Braves, is not served by rail. It's about a 10 block walk from Georgia State Station (Blue/Green lines), but it's not particularly feasible for most fans to walk that.

In the 1960s/70s, during MARTA planning, a "future" line to the Model Cities area (southeast Atlanta) was proposed to be built after the Referendum System was completed. The Model Cities Line would have included a stop at the Atlanta-Fulton County Stadium, which was located just north of where Turner Field is today. A provision for that spur was built just north of Garnett Station, and MARTA now uses it for train storage below the platform at Garnett.


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## me_little_me (Jan 3, 2011)

Tracktwentynine said:


> Turner Field, which is home to MLB's Braves, is not served by rail. It's about a 10 block walk from Georgia State Station (Blue/Green lines), but it's not particularly feasible for most fans to walk that.


Isn't it still true that MARTA runs special buses between 5 Points station and Turner Field? The bus was included in the train fare and they ran mostly through streets blocked off for the game.


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## Tracktwentynine (Jan 4, 2011)

me_little_me said:


> Tracktwentynine said:
> 
> 
> > Turner Field, which is home to MLB's Braves, is not served by rail. It's about a 10 block walk from Georgia State Station (Blue/Green lines), but it's not particularly feasible for most fans to walk that.
> ...


Not anymore. MARTA will not run the Braves Shuttle during the 2011 season due to budget cuts.

When it did run, the fare policy was exactly the same as for all other buses: a free transfer to/from rail when using an (RFID) Breeze Ticket or Breeze Card.


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## Ozark Southern (Jan 4, 2011)

All of us who were at the Gathering last year experienced the Metrolink as the Blues (NHL) game let out. The Kiel Centre (NHL), Busch Stadium (MLB), and Transworld Dome (NFL) are all served by both the Red and Blue Lines, both of which connect downtown St. Louis with Missouri and Illinois suburbs. St. Louis also runs Redbird Express (Cardinals MLB) and Rams Express (NFL) buses on game days. Add to this ample parking and good access to all four Interstate highways from the stadium locations, and St. Louis is a very easy town for any sports fan to get around in.


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## DET63 (Jan 6, 2011)

AlanB said:


> Shawn Ryu said:
> 
> 
> > In Philly, all 4 major sports teams' games can be accessed by using the SEPTA orange line to Pattison (now called AT and T). Because all of their home fields are in one location.
> ...


But it wouldn't have to handle _everyone_ to still be useful. Obviously, the more it could handle, the better.


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## Rob Creighton (Jan 12, 2011)

If you ever catch the Cubs on WGN-TV...you'll see the TV commercials where the "Cubs strongly encourage the use of public transportation to Wrigley Field." The spot goes on to outline where the CTA red line stops, and some outlying park and ride options and bus lines from downtown train stations.

Chicago generally has good public transportation to all the local sports stadiums: Wrigley, The Cell, Soldier Field, United Center, McCormick Place. Plus, with Metra, you can get into the city pretty easily from a lot of places. Although, I'm not sure I'd want to use the EL from the Cell or United Center after a night game. If you can get out right after the game heading downtown, it's probably OK. Miss the crowds, it could be a little dicey.


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## Shawn Ryu (Jan 12, 2011)

I wouldnt worry too much. Theres a reason why Red Line runs 24/7.


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## Trogdor (Jan 12, 2011)

Shawn Ryu said:


> Theres a reason why Red Line runs 24/7.


To provide the homeless with a place to sleep.


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## RTOlson (Jan 13, 2011)

DET63 said:


> In the Bay Area, BART serves Oakland Coliseum and Oracle Arena, both of which are about a 5-minute or less walk away from the Coliseum BART station (and much of the walk is on a pedestrian bridge), while AT&T Park is served by S.F. Muni streetcars (not the cable cars) and buses. I'm not sure what kind of transit serves Candlestick Park or the Cow Palace; I'm sure that at least a few bus lines run to each. I don't know what the transit service will be like if and when the A's and/or 49ers get new stadiums, however.


Some Capitol Corridor trains (but not all) also serve Oakland Coliseum and Oracle Arena -- it's an intermodal stop for both Capitol Corridor and BART.

For Candlestick Park, Muni has several options. It runs regular bus service in addition to shuttle bus service from the T Line's Gilman/Paul station and express buses from various points. Cow Palace is also served by Muni bus.

HP Pavilion in San Jose is also close to San José Diridon Station with connections to Capitol Corridor, CalTrain and VTA light-rail, plus buses. It's a couple of blocks away, but it's a nice alternative.


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## Dan O (Jan 16, 2011)

Rob Creighton said:


> If you ever catch the Cubs on WGN-TV...you'll see the TV commercials where the "Cubs strongly encourage the use of public transportation to Wrigley Field." The spot goes on to outline where the CTA red line stops, and some outlying park and ride options and bus lines from downtown train stations.
> 
> Chicago generally has good public transportation to all the local sports stadiums: Wrigley, The Cell, Soldier Field, United Center, McCormick Place. Plus, with Metra, you can get into the city pretty easily from a lot of places. Although, I'm not sure I'd want to use the EL from the Cell or United Center after a night game. If you can get out right after the game heading downtown, it's probably OK. Miss the crowds, it could be a little dicey.


I have only been to Chicago one, but did catch a Cubs game when I was there. (They won!) I can't imagine driving to a game there. The parking lot was smaller than my grocery store parking lot. Appeared to be some street parking nearby but most of the residences looked to be apts/condos so probably street parking already gone.

Have taken train/transit to both UCLA football games and Dodger games in LA. Both required a bit of a walk but not a big deal.

Dan


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## edding (Jan 16, 2011)

Since no one has mentioned it, the Phoenix Metro light rail goes pretty much right past Chase Field for the AZ Diamondbacks and also near whatever they call the arena the Phx Suns play in. Plus it goes literally right past Sun Devil Stadium if you're into college football ( insert the obligatory: Go Devils)


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