# Guests allowed in bedrooms



## timjimbob (Apr 19, 2016)

Is a passenger, not listed as a bedroom ticket holder, allowed to be escorted back to the bedroom.

We will be travelling on the same train with a couple of coach passengers and I would like to have them visit our room for an hour.


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## the_traveler (Apr 19, 2016)

If the passenger registered in the room escorts those from coach, no problem. However, a passenger from coac can not enter a sleeping car generally.


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## Lonestar648 (Apr 19, 2016)

Just make sure the room isn't over crowded attracting attention (Roomette with 5 or 6). Generally, the SCA sill not care as long as the Sleeping car passengers are escorting, thus insuring that coach guests stay out of other people rooms.


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## jebr (Apr 19, 2016)

Technically (and per the rule book) only sleeper passengers are allowed in a sleeper car. If the SCA sees coach passengers in the sleeper car, even if they're escorted by a sleeper car passenger, they may be asked to leave the sleeper car.

That being said, I've never done it personally, but I'd imagine that more than likely if it's just for an hour or two and they're not noticeably using the extra amenities provided (for example, they're not grabbing cups of coffee to take back) an SCA would be okay with it. They may not even notice if the bedroom door is shut.


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## Ryan (Apr 19, 2016)

Unsurprisingly, I'll provide the contrary opinion.

On the door to the sleeping car should be a sign:




Are your coach guests "Sleeping Car Passengers"? No? Have your reunion elsewhere, like the cafe/lounge car.

Can you get away with it? Perhaps, especially if you are quiet and well behaved. But common courtesy toward your fellow passengers that paid for private accommodations involves not allowing unauthorized passengers into somewhere they don't belong.


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## OBS (Apr 19, 2016)

Oh Ryan....You are such a party pooper...LOL


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## Bob Dylan (Apr 19, 2016)

Ryan is right on the Policy, but if you talk with your SCA ( Always ask!)he MAY OK a visit to your Room. Good ones will, and if so, remember to tip appropriately @ the end of the trip.


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## Mystic River Dragon (Apr 19, 2016)

I agree--a short and polite visit, with the knowledge and approval of your SCA, is great advertising for the sleeper car and may encourage more people to travel in it.


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## Palmetto (Apr 19, 2016)

I had a friend of mine in coach join me in my room for happy hour between Chicago and San Antonio. I asked the attendant if he would mind getting setups for the two of us at the appointed time, prior to our going to the dining car. It would've been better I think to ask first, but OTOH, asking him to bring setups was--in an indirect way--asking for the go ahead. He could've denied the request at that point.

In any case, my friend spent all of about 90 minutes in the sleeping car. And oh yes: we were quite well behaved! :lol:


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## fairviewroad (Apr 19, 2016)

Ryan said:


> Are your coach guests "Sleeping Car Passengers"? No? Have your reunion elsewhere, like the cafe/lounge car.


This.

There is such an obvious alternative location for a mixed-class gathering on board an Amtrak train. With a few narrow exceptions, all trains with sleeping accommodations also have a lounge car.


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## PVD (Apr 19, 2016)

Very often the lounge cars are pretty full, or on single level trains, non existant, they are the cafe car. A short visit by quiet polite folks who don't try to take advantage of the car services (coffee, shower, pillows,blankets) or invade others privacy by being in the halls I generally travel solo, any time someone has walked back to chat (typically a foreign tourist who wants to know more about the US that I met at a meal) the SCA is cool with it, it is way better than a family with kids that run in the hall. No one has ever said anything about it, other than the comment made on the board.


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## WoodyinNYC (Apr 19, 2016)

I recall reading that some oil field workers boarding the _Empire Builder_ in North Dakota often invited friendly unaccompanied ladies back to their rooms, no? Or did the ladies have the rooms and invited the new (and just paid) friends to visit their rooms? Anyway, Amtrak put a stop to it.

I can certainly see that a Rule should be posted prohibiting such excessive camaraderie. An Amtrak sleeping car is not to be used as a hot sheet hotel. I can also see that if you politely ask your attendant first, that the rule can usually be bent. Do expect your guest to get the once-over, like all the others, for good reason.

(For myself, I don't care what goes on in the next room. One of my meds is a date rape drug, and I sleep thru everything. LOL)


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## PVD (Apr 19, 2016)

Polite, quiet and respectful are key. Skip one of those, and you really don't desrve consideration. But that pretty much goes for anything, not just this.


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## seat38a (Apr 19, 2016)

Whats next, are we going to allow visitors to the front of the plane to your lie flat seat to converse as well? Maybe it will help sell more premiums seats on the plane? How about into the PPC as well. 

Reading all the "What if I book a roommete and my kids in coach" or some variation of that question over the past couple of months, I agree with Ryan at some point enough is enough and the the rules should be enforced.


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## pennyk (Apr 19, 2016)

Ryan said:


> Unsurprisingly, I'll provide the contrary opinion.
> 
> On the door to the sleeping car should be a sign:
> 
> ...


I agree with Ryan.


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## HenryK (Apr 19, 2016)

Just make sure the Portland-bound passenger of the opposite sex that you invite to your Seattle-bound sleeping car on the Empire Builder goes back to the coaches before the train gets to Spokane.


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## AmtrakBlue (Apr 19, 2016)

HenryK said:


> Just make sure the Portland-bound passenger of the opposite sex that you invite to your Seattle-bound sleeping car on the Empire Builder goes back to the coaches before the train gets to Spokane.


I was waiting for you to post this, Henry.


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## Bob Dylan (Apr 19, 2016)

HenryK said:


> Just make sure the Portland-bound passenger of the opposite sex that you invite to your Seattle-bound sleeping car on the Empire Builder goes back to the coaches before the train gets to Spokane.


I'm Shocked! Shocked! to find out that Working Girls are on Amtrak Long Distance Trains! Round up the Usual Suspects!


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## SP&S (Apr 19, 2016)

By the book, they should not be allowed back in to the sleeper. But ask. Nicely. A couple of years ago Mrs SP&S and I were traveling from LAX to PDX in a bedroom and our daughter had a coach ticket on the same train for EUG - PDX. Our SCA, after a little thought and after being assured that no meals or parlour car access was involved, let her board directly to our car. She also got a good tip. I mention that she boarded directly into our sleeper because the SCA didn't want to explain this to the conductor when our daughter went from coach thru the diner and parlor. The worst they can do is say no.


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## HenryK (Apr 19, 2016)

I heard that story about the train splitting and the lady getting left behind from at least seven sleeping car attendants who swore it happened on their train. Some told the story with considerably more relish (and eyebrow wagging) than others.


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## Walt (Apr 19, 2016)

pennyk said:


> Ryan said:
> 
> 
> > Unsurprisingly, I'll provide the contrary opinion.
> ...


I agree with Ryan too. And would also go as far as asking the conductor or SCA to enforce the rule.

I've been in too many trains where I have to deal with loud "partying" coach passengers in the sleeper car.

Or tag-team sleeping, where once an hour, someone from coach goes to the door of a sleeper accommodation and knocks, pounding hard enough to wake the sleeping person, aggressively enough to convince the sleeping person to leave (as they apparently agreed). The previously sleeper person slams the door when leaving to express their unhappiness with having to be the one who now has to go to coach.

I'm not going to look the other way, anymore.

If a sleeper passengers wants to socialize with a friend or family member that's in coach, meet them in the lounge.


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## OlympianHiawatha (Apr 19, 2016)

I too _*FIRMLY*_ concur Coach pax stay in Coach-try wandering into First or Biz on an airliner! And I never have been able to figure out these groups that split between Coach and Sleeper, rotating back and forth creating nothing but confusion and mayhem for other pax and crew.


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## jhillm (Apr 19, 2016)

I agree completely with expecting civilized behavior (which goes for Coach, too - I might add.)

But I fail to understand why, within the capacity of the accommodation, I can not invite a new friend to visit, sleep, or eat with me.

A roomette is the same cost whether 1 or 2 people are booked in it. Clearly any Coach passenger has already paid at least low coach fare.

Why is it taking advantage of the system to add a second occupant? (A single second occupant, not a hot bunking rotation of entertainment.)

Yes I see that there is a rule against it - but to what purpose?

What if it is not a new friend, but an old friend? Say I have a roomette from CHI to LAX, and dear friend intends to join me in Kansas City? Would they not purchase a coach seat from Kansas City and just join me in the roomette? We would use no more "service" that the couple across the aisle who paid exactly the same for the roomette, and both occupy it from CHI.


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## seat38a (Apr 19, 2016)

jhillm said:


> I agree completely with expecting civilized behavior (which goes for Coach, too - I might add.)
> 
> But I fail to understand why, within the capacity of the accommodation, I can not invite a new friend to visit, sleep, or eat with me.
> 
> ...


Well if you call Amtrak and then get your real friend on the Roommette reservation problem solved. So unless your willing to put a complete stranger in your roommette reservation and have the conductor upgrade them onto your reservation(if allowed), until that happens your new "friend" is still a "coach passenger." So as the the second part of the sign says, upgrade away, if that means paying extra or you adding them to your reservation, thats fine. Until your "friend" is on the manifest for the sleeper they don't qualify for food inclusion in the dining car or anything else. If your willing to upgrade some random stranger into your room reservation and give them complete access to it, which by definition of putting them on your reservation they get, then whatever happens to you or your belongings is completely on YOU.


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## TiBike (Apr 19, 2016)

On the other hand, when I'm at a hotel or on a cruise ship, I can invite any other paying guests into my room, to enjoy whatever amenities there might be. Visitors just have to observe the same standards of decorum and courtesy as the people assigned the room. I understand the noise/disturbance issue, but that's not unique to visitors -- people properly booked into a sleeper accomodation can be just as much trouble. The difference is you have immediate recourse if it's a visitor who can be sent back to coach. Which seems to me to be the main purpose of the rule: give staff a tool to use to quickly solve problems. If there's no problem, there's no need to employ it. Unless a genuine disturbance results, it's none of my business. It's a matter for the people involved and the SCA. Not my problem.


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## timjimbob (Apr 19, 2016)

Friends have never been on the train and were interested into what the sleeper looked like. No hot swapping or partying.


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## Palmetto (Apr 20, 2016)

Is there a stated policy in the timetable about the situation? I don't recall one.


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## NW cannonball (Apr 20, 2016)

SP&S said:


> By the book, they should not be allowed back in to the sleeper. But ask. Nicely. A couple of years ago Mrs SP&S and I were traveling from LAX to PDX in a bedroom and our daughter had a coach ticket on the same train for EUG - PDX. Our SCA, after a little thought and after being assured that no meals or parlour car access was involved, let her board directly to our car. She also got a good tip. I mention that she boarded directly into our sleeper because the SCA didn't want to explain this to the conductor when our daughter went from coach thru the diner and parlor. The worst they can do is say no.


By the book, no coach passengers in the sleeper.

But, years ago, my wife and infant child in the roomette, me in coach, the SCA allowed me a brief visit to the roomette to consult with family. YMMV


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## Devil's Advocate (Apr 20, 2016)

fairviewroad said:


> There is such an obvious alternative location for a *mixed-class* gathering on board an Amtrak train.



What an odd thing to say about a culture without a caste. So long as they're polite and respectful I honestly don't care what their ticket says. Conversely, if they're acting obnoxious I'm not going to give them a pass just because they have a sleeper ticket.



Bob Dylan said:


> I'm Shocked! Shocked! to find out that Working Girls are on Amtrak Long Distance Trains! Round up the Usual Suspects!



I'm actually kind of surprised. Most passengers on the trains I ride are college kids, families, and retirees. Must be some raunchy seniors looking for a little extra cash.



Walt said:


> I've been in too many trains where I have to deal with loud "partying" coach passengers in the sleeper car. I'm not going to look the other way, anymore.



Never had any problems with obnoxious coach passengers in a sleeper car before. I've only had trouble with actual sleeper passengers making too much noise. I suppose I should have ignored their properly ticketed indiscretions and went on a witch hunt looking for quiet stowaways instead.



OlympianHiawatha said:


> I never have been able to figure out these groups that split between Coach and Sleeper, rotating back and forth creating nothing but confusion and mayhem for other pax and crew.



Mayhem? Really? I don't think that word means what you think it means, but even if it did it that would be reason enough to kick someone off the train and into the hands of the local law enforcement, regardless of whatever their ticket had to say about it.


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## fairviewroad (Apr 20, 2016)

Devil's Advocate said:


> fairviewroad said:
> 
> 
> > There is such an obvious alternative location for a *mixed-class* gathering on board an Amtrak train.
> ...


I'm sure you are aware that transportation companies, including Amtrak, use the word "class" as a way of designating different types of accommodations. To suggest I'm using the word as a way of assigning values to different types of individuals is pretty offensive, actually.


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## Devil's Advocate (Apr 20, 2016)

fairviewroad said:


> Devil's Advocate said:
> 
> 
> > fairviewroad said:
> ...


My view is that such terminology is outdated and jarring to read in 2016. I cannot and do not intend to imply I can read minds. Which is why I remarked that it was an odd thing to _say_ rather than an odd thing to _think_. I've flown a lot of airlines over the years but I can't recall any of them referring to passengers as "coach class" the way Amtrak does. Personally I think Amtrak should probably just call it coach or economy or whatever the train equivalent of "main cabin" would be.


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## Walt (Apr 20, 2016)

Devil's Advocate said:


> Walt said:
> 
> 
> > I've been in too many trains where I have to deal with loud "partying" coach passengers in the sleeper car. I'm not going to look the other way, anymore.
> ...


I can mention the obvious, if the coach passengers in the sleeper were quiet and well behaved, I would never have known they were there.

I can venture a guess that these parties are brought upon because sleeper passengers are free to serve their own alcoholic beverages, whereas such can't be done in coach. So, someone in the traveling group springs for a sleeper accommodation, with the expectation that their group will use it. Basically, turning a sleeper accommodation into their "hospitality suite". It doesn't take all that much alcohol to turn a gathering into a loud party.

There are also the sleeper passengers who invite their coach ticketed friends/family to "enjoy" free coffee, juice, bottled water, and to use the shower(s). I am sure they rationalize this, as being its theirs to share as they will.


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## dart330 (Apr 20, 2016)

I was on the sunset limited in a roomette across from a grandmother whos daughter and 2 grandchildren were travelling in coach. They kept coming back to visit in the room and were very loud. I'm not sure why this was allowed, but they all 4 ate a couple meals in the roomette, constantly asking the SCA to go get them condiments and drink refills. She said she didn't want to have to tip "those people" in the dining car. We even had the train managers on board from LA who perfectly happy to accomadate all of this.

I think things can get out of hand much too quickly allowing coach passengers into sleepers and it should be kept seperated as the airlines do so the rest of the people in the car can enjoy the trip they paid for.


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## Manny T (Apr 20, 2016)

Two factors in my view support the rule about no coach PAX permitted in sleepers: first, there is the security of personal property. Amtrak has decided NOT to make it possible to lock sleeper compartments when a passenger leaves one; hence Amtrak must make other arrangements for the security of personal effects. It makes perfect sense to me to exclude non-sleeper PAX since there is no way to know if their purpose in visiting the sleeper is innocent or nefarious.

Second, it seems to me there is a legitimate interest in reducing traffic between cars as well as traffic in the narrow aisles e.g. in the dining car. By definition visitors from coach will have to pass through the dining car to get to the sleepers. Shall this be permitted while people are eating in the dining car and servers are in the aisle with trays of food? Shall it be permitted when staff are cleaning or setting up the dining car? I don't think so.

The reason for minimizing traffic between cars is obvious--since every passage between cars in a moving train involves an incremental amount of risk.

As others have said, passengers from both sections can meet in the public areas like the lounge or cafe car. There are fringe benefits of keeping non-sleeper PAX out, like reduced noise and so forth, which I think the higher prices paid for sleeping accommodations warrant.

On another point raised, apart from whether the US has classes or castes and whether that terminology should ever used, undeniably the US has people with more money and people with less. People with more money are known to spend it among other on things on exclusivity. Private clubs, exclusive restaurants, dress circle at the opera, sky boxes in ball parks, first class airline accommodations, and yes, sleeping compartments on Amtrak. By definition exclusivity means keeping others out--otherwise, what am I paying my premium for?


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## seat38a (Apr 20, 2016)

dart330 said:


> I was on the sunset limited in a roomette across from a grandmother whos daughter and 2 grandchildren were travelling in coach. They kept coming back to visit in the room and were very loud. I'm not sure why this was allowed, but they all 4 ate a couple meals in the roomette, constantly asking the SCA to go get them condiments and drink refills. She said she didn't want to have to tip "those people" in the dining car. We even had the train managers on board from LA who perfectly happy to accomadate all of this.
> 
> I think things can get out of hand much too quickly allowing coach passengers into sleepers and it should be kept seperated as the airlines do so the rest of the people in the car can enjoy the trip they paid for.


I really don't get this half the family traveling in coach and the others traveling in sleeper thing going on. Say for a moment this grandma's age prevented her from traveling in coach and their's was a special situation. I'm reading questions on this forum regarding putting kids in coach and parents in sleeper, or some combination of splitting people up. Am I the only one who thinks this is F&*$$# Up? Growing up, my parents never put my brother and I in coach or something cheaper while they pampered themselves in the front of the plane, nor did they get themselves a balcony room on a cruise ship while putting everyone else on a different cheaper deck where the sun don't shine. We all traveled together in the same class. We all suffer through coach or we all go premium.


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## PVD (Apr 20, 2016)

If only things were as simple as they should be. I got 2 upgrade coupons for space available upgrades to F/C on an airline. I was bringing my parents back from Florida, and being they were elderly, and never enjoyed much "luxury" in their time, I gave them the upgrades and sat in the back. The flight attendants were aware, and had no problem with me coming up and checking on them from time to time. I didn't try and scam free drinks or a better meal. About 2/3 of the way home, they asked me to stay and sit in an empty seat, they knew I would drag off their carry ons and help them off the plane. Plenty of times flying someone visits someone in another cabin, if they aren't using the bathroom, trying to stay in a seat, or blocking an aisle during cabin service, I've rarely heard a word. I have definetly seen people chased who try and stay, even in premium seats in the same cabin.


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## Palmetto (Apr 21, 2016)

Airlines don't seem to care about coach passengers using the first-class bathroom, though. This after an announcement on some of them.

But we digress.


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## jis (Apr 21, 2016)

Depends on the airline, the route and the aircraft type ....


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## PVD (Apr 21, 2016)

I think JIS is right, I'll go one step further and say it also varies by crew. The same type of plane can have different numbers of bathrooms in different locations also. The airlines control that A 757 200 with 215 economy seats and no recline 2 bathrooms, same plane for a different airline 4 bathrooms 190 seats mixed config (one dedicated to F/C) none are in the traditional far back.


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## me_little_me (Apr 21, 2016)

I just trademarked the name "TrainBnB". Someone reserves a room then on my web site, offers beds or seats for sublease for part or all of the way. :giggle:


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