# Metrolink Using BNSF Locos For Cab Cars



## CSXfoamer1997 (Feb 10, 2016)

I know that Metrolink is currently using BNSF AC4400's in place of the Hyundai Rotem cab cars while the Oxnard crash is under investigation, but does anyone know when this is supposed to end? The AC4400's are not going to be suitable for the high speed rail when it comes into effect.


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## TinCan782 (Feb 10, 2016)

End? They haven't even fully implemented the practice.

My daily commute on the Ventura County line is mostly without the BNSF locos, sometimes with.

BTW, this past week, they installed temporary ramps (for wheel chairs, etc.) on the platforms at LAUS to accommodate the trains with the BNSF loco that can't line up properly with the permanent ramps.


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## keelhauled (Feb 10, 2016)

What high speed rail?


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## CSXfoamer1997 (Feb 10, 2016)

keelhauled said:


> What high speed rail?


California High Speed Rail, aka CHSR


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## TinCan782 (Feb 10, 2016)

CSXfoamer1997 said:


> keelhauled said:
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> > What high speed rail?
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That is NOT Metrolink (or Amtrak that matter).


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## CCC1007 (Feb 10, 2016)

FrensicPic said:


> CSXfoamer1997 said:
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> > keelhauled said:
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no, but they will share some track


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## CSXfoamer1997 (Feb 10, 2016)

CCC1007 said:


> FrensicPic said:
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> > CSXfoamer1997 said:
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Well, if Amtrak and Metrolink and Coaster are going to share the tracks with CHSR, why would they not go at 125 MPH? It'd be a marvelous idea!


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## TinCan782 (Feb 10, 2016)

CAHSR is still a ways away...by the time HSR is here in So Cal the BNSF locos will be gone and probably Metrolink's current power as well.

From Metrolink's website this addresses the OP's initial question...

_*"When will the locomotives be added to the Metrolink System? How long will they remain on the system?*_

_Metrolink started deploying these BNSF locomotives across its system on Dec. 18, 2015 and will continue adding them until all 40 are in service. The initial lease is a year. The BNSF locomotives will likely be replaced when the new Tier 4 clean locomotives are ready to be put into service."_

http://www.metrolinktrains.com/agency/page/title/our_trains


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## jis (Feb 10, 2016)

Seems to me that if they do what All Aboard Florida is doing (Engine at each end) it would solve all their problems once and for all and even provide enough power to the trains to accelerate out of stops decently. Also provide a certain level of redundancy should one engine fail enroute. This mindless focus on trying to run all rains with precisely one engine is somewhat mind boggling. Yeah it does seem to save some money, but at some cost of reliability and safety.


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## Peter KG6LSE (Feb 11, 2016)

I was in LA a few weeks ago and used the riverside line every day to get to LA from claremont area.

I never saw a BNSF loco on my trains . just that funky cab car and the normal consist.


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## leemell (Feb 11, 2016)

CCC1007 said:


> FrensicPic said:
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> > CSXfoamer1997 said:
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No, CHSR is building it's own tracks from Bakersfield to Burbank and eventually to LAUS. CHSR will not be sharing any of this track with Metrolink.


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## CCC1007 (Feb 11, 2016)

What about Los Angeles to Anaheim?


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## leemell (Feb 11, 2016)

LA to Anaheim is in Phase II. Not currently scheduled and will be sometime after 2029 completion of Phase I.


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## gswager (Feb 12, 2016)

Peter KG6LSE said:


> I was in LA a few weeks ago and used the riverside line every day to get to LA from claremont area.


That is a long way to go to CA 60 corridor (Pomona Freeway) to catch Metrolink Riverside train. Could it be a San Bernardino train?


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## Fan Railer (Mar 14, 2016)

http://www.goventura.org/sites/default/files/Item%2011_ATT-A_REVISED2%20-%20Item%20No.%208%20-%20Authorize%20Expenditure%20of%20Funds%20for%20a%20Non-Competitive,%20Locomotive%20Lease%20with%20BNSF.pdf

Trackside:


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## Acela150 (Mar 14, 2016)

Inward facing cameras. Providing a false sense of security to America since May 13, 2015.


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## sechs (Mar 20, 2016)

If I'm understanding correctly, trains with these BNSF locomotives are only using the Metrolink engines for HEP. Is there a theory behind this?



Acela150 said:


> Inward facing cameras. Providing a false sense of security to America since May 13, 2015.


Huh?


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## MikefromCrete (Mar 20, 2016)

sechs said:


> If I'm understanding correctly, trains with these BNSF locomotives are only using the Metrolink engines for HEP. Is there a theory behind this?
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BNSF locomotives are freight units. They don't have the ability to provide head end power.

The inward facing cameras focus on crew actions during a run. They had been appearing since the Metrolink crash that killed a bunch of poeople. Some crew members feel they are invasion of their privacy and are of no practical use in preventing accidents.


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## MikefromCrete (Mar 20, 2016)

Sorry, the May, 2015 date is the crash of Amtrak 188 in Philadelphia, where the actions of the engineer before the crash are unknown. So some think inward facing cameras would provide answers for this type of crash.


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## sechs (Mar 31, 2016)

MikefromCrete said:


> sechs said:
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> > If I'm understanding correctly, trains with these BNSF locomotives are only using the Metrolink engines for HEP. Is there a theory behind this?
> ...


Of course the freight units don't provide head-end power. On the other hand, the Metrolink units do provide motive power. Why aren't they?

To be honest, your workplace is your employer's business. So, unless they're sticking cameras in the restrooms, it's hardly an invasion of your privacy.


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## Fan Railer (Apr 12, 2016)

Who says the metrolink locomotives AREN'T providing motive power in addition to the HEP? On paper, it says that they are just there for HEP, and all motive power is coming from the BNSF loco only, but in real life, the engineer rarely takes the time and effort to isolate the metrolink loco, so it is providing motive power along with the BNSF loco.


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## CSXfoamer1997 (Apr 12, 2016)

Fan Railer said:


> Who says the metrolink locomotives AREN'T providing motive power in addition to the HEP? On paper, it says that they are just there for HEP, and all motive power is coming from the BNSF loco only, but in real life, the engineer rarely takes the time and effort to isolate the metrolink loco, so it is providing motive power along with the BNSF loco.


Right. And in theory, it could help save fuel on the Metrolink loco, am I correct?


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## TinCan782 (Apr 12, 2016)

CSXfoamer1997 said:


> Fan Railer said:
> 
> 
> > Who says the metrolink locomotives AREN'T providing motive power in addition to the HEP? On paper, it says that they are just there for HEP, and all motive power is coming from the BNSF loco only, but in real life, the engineer rarely takes the time and effort to isolate the metrolink loco, so it is providing motive power along with the BNSF loco.
> ...


I spoke to one of their engineers recently and asked him regarding this subject: BOTH locos are providing motive power.

I ride the Ventura Line daily for my commute.

Edit/Add: Both locos in use was also made evident by engine noise and exhaust emissions observed as the train departed the station.


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## Acela150 (Apr 13, 2016)

sechs said:


> MikefromCrete said:
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To which I say come work for the railroad and have to deal with the BS we deal with. I don't want to have some train master who doesn't know a thing about running a train or being a conductor telling me what I could have done differently when my train hits a trespasser. Railroads constantly hire Train Masters who have jack experience on any train. They're the morons telling us how to do our jobs and they don't know a thing about what we do.


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## sechs (Apr 15, 2016)

Acela150 said:


> To which I say come work for the railroad and have to deal with the BS we deal with. I don't want to have some train master who doesn't know a thing about running a train or being a conductor telling me what I could have done differently when my train hits a trespasser. Railroads constantly hire Train Masters who have jack experience on any train. They're the morons telling us how to do our jobs and they don't know a thing about what we do.


Seems like this is more a reflection on your management than on cameras in the workplace....


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## seat38a (Apr 25, 2016)

I've noticed that the BNSF engine's are not being used on the OC line. Just a guess but could it be all the work OCTA did grade separating so no need? Anyone else have relaible news?


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## Acela150 (Apr 25, 2016)

sechs said:


> Acela150 said:
> 
> 
> > To which I say come work for the railroad and have to deal with the BS we deal with. I don't want to have some train master who doesn't know a thing about running a train or being a conductor telling me what I could have done differently when my train hits a trespasser. Railroads constantly hire Train Masters who have jack experience on any train. They're the morons telling us how to do our jobs and they don't know a thing about what we do.
> ...


Come do our job. You'll quickly change your statement.


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## Ryan (Apr 26, 2016)

That doesn't really refute his point.


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## jis (Apr 26, 2016)

Inward facing cameras, like many other monitoring devices do not necessarily prevent accidents, but they may help in investigating what happened after the fact. Just like Cockpit Voice Recorders and Flight Data Recorders do not prevent accidents but help enormously in investigating them.

There is a reasonable discussion ot be had about whether inward facing cameras help investigations sufficiently to trump the perceived need for privacy. Additionally, whether the data can be used for day to day operation monitoring or not should be part of the Union contract. CVRs for example are not generally used for day to day operation monitoring AFAIK. Maybe saxman can tell us more.

Merely the fact that there is bad management and bad Union contracts is not an argument either for or against using a tool to help accident investigations.

Just my partially informed opinion I might add and I am open to corrections as usual.


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## Fan Railer (Apr 26, 2016)

seat38a said:


> I've noticed that the BNSF engine's are not being used on the OC line. Just a guess but could it be all the work OCTA did grade separating so no need? Anyone else have relaible news?


They have been used on the OC line, but only on trains that turn at Laguna. NCTD doesn't want them in Oceanside because they don't meet yard clearances apparently.


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## TinCan782 (Apr 26, 2016)

Fan Railer said:


> seat38a said:
> 
> 
> > I've noticed that the BNSF engine's are not being used on the OC line. Just a guess but could it be all the work OCTA did grade separating so no need? Anyone else have relaible news?
> ...


They have been 50/50 on the Ventura line. I heard that the overnight layover yard at Moorpark has a problem with the additional length!


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## leemell (Apr 26, 2016)

I was for a time I was a Mission Controller on a major unmanned spacecraft. When on duty (the time on shift could last 12-14 hours) there was no right to privacy. You are in charge of a multi-billion dollar machine. When you are in charge of a machine transporting people, there, in my opinion, is no right to privacy. You are doing a job with life threatening consequences if you make a mistake.


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## TinCan782 (May 1, 2016)

From the LA times regarding BNSF locos on Metrolink trains ...

http://www.latimes.com/local/california/la-me-adv-metrolink-engines-20160501-story.html


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## Acela150 (May 1, 2016)

One look at several Septa Silverliner V cars shows the welds look like a joke. So the fact they are blaming poor welds is not a shock.


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