# Express with Longest run in India introduced



## jis (Nov 20, 2011)

_Vivek Express_ was introduced connecting _Dibrugarh Town_ in the Northeast corner of India with _Kanyakumari _at the southernmost tip. It covers 4286km (2679 miles) in a shade over 82 hours. This makes its run longer than all Amtrak train's except the Texas Eagle Los Angeles runs. Allegedly it is the 8th longest run in the world, so there must be a bunch of Russian and Chinese ones around that are longer. In all 6 railway zones (equivalent to railroads in the US) will have to handle this train through its journey.

You can read about it here.


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## Oldsmoboi (Nov 20, 2011)

Do they run sleepers or is it all coach?


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## jis (Nov 20, 2011)

Oldsmoboi said:


> Do they run sleepers or is it all coach?


A typical Indian LD train has three or four varieties of Sleepers and it also has some amount of sitting only accommodation for short turn passengers.

I suspect this train probably has Non-AC 3 Tier Sleeper (SL), and AC 3 Tier Sleeper (3A). It may also have AC 2 Tier Sleeper (2A), and most likely it does not have AC First Class Sleeper (1A). Usually about 75% to 90% of the accommodation on overnight LD expresses is sleeper, except in special overnight trains like the Rajdhani and Duronto Expresses, which are 100% Sleeper. You can get some more information about the various types of Sleeper on IR at http://goindia.about.com/od/rail/tp/Indian-Train-Accommodations.htm


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## Bob Dylan (Nov 20, 2011)

jis said:


> _Vivek Express_ was introduced connecting _Dibrugarh Town_ in the Northeast corner of India with _Kanyakumari _at the southernmost tip. It covers 4286km (2679 miles) in a shade over 82 hours. This makes its run longer than all Amtrak train's except the Texas Eagle Los Angeles runs. Allegedly it is the 8th longest run in the world, so there must be a bunch of Russian and Chinese ones around that are longer. In all 6 railway zones (equivalent to railroads in the US) will have to handle this train through its journey.
> 
> You can read about it here.


Do they take AGR Points? ^_^ What about the Diner jis? Do they restock at stops or do vendors sell food @ the stops and on the Trains like in Latin America?? And is there any overnight layovers like in SAS with the TE/SSL or is it a True cross country like the "suspended" Sunset East??

This wouldnt be long enough of a trip for the_traveler, hed have to work out a criss cross,double loop trip in order to have more Train time! :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## jis (Nov 20, 2011)

jimhudson said:


> Do they take AGR Points? ^_^


Well, not yet 



> What about the Diner jis? Do they restock at stops or do vendors sell food @ the stops and on the Trains like in Latin America??


Depends on the train. Some trains carry Pantry Cars which are stocked en route and food is delivered at the seat. This is generally the case on more prestigious trains. On other LD trains the age old technique of taking orders en route and telegraphing them forward to a station for pickup and delivery is still used quite effectively all over the system. There are no Dining Cars on any LD train in India because it is impractical to try to serve a thousand passengers from a Dining Car or two or three or....



> And is there any overnight layovers like in SAS with the TE/SSL or is it a True cross country like the "suspended" Sunset East??


No overnight layovers. It is a true trans sub-con in this case 



> This wouldnt be long enough of a trip for the_traveler, hed have to work out a criss cross,double loop trip in order to have more Train time! :lol: :lol: :lol:


Yeah he could possibly use the routing _Dibrugarh _to _Kanyakumari _on _Vivek _and then _Kanyakumari _to _Jammu _on _Himsagar Express_ the second longest run in India, to spend more than a week on trains.  And I bet the entire thing in 2A will be cheaper than a Roomette from Chicago to LA


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## Devil's Advocate (Nov 20, 2011)

jis said:


> On other LD trains the age old technique of taking orders en route and telegraphing them forward to a station for pickup and delivery is still used quite effectively all over the system. There are no Dining Cars on any LD train in India because it is impractical to try to serve a thousand passengers from a Dining Car or two or three or.


I wonder if it would be a huge improvement if Amtrak was able to do the same. While on-board dining can still be a rewarding experience in a social sense the freshness and quality of the food still leaves a lot to be desired after decades of financial starvation. I understand that a some cooks are able to cobble together improved results through their own unorthodox methods and that Amtrak's food today is not as bad as the worst years ever, but I don't see how that as a compelling reason to leave it alone. Contracting with stationary restaurants could allow for so much more variety and much improved quality using fresh locally sourced ingredients. Even in the dead of winter a real restaurant should be able to beat what we currently eat. Although Amtrak trains keep such loose schedules that most restaurants may simply refuse to do business with them.



jis said:


> Yeah he could possibly use the routing _Dibrugarh _to _Kanyakumari _on _Vivek _and then _Kanyakumari _to _Jammu _on _Himsagar Express_ the second longest run in India, to spend more than a week on trains.  And I bet the entire thing in 2A will be cheaper than a Roomette from Chicago to LA.


I won't deny that this suggestion sounds rather appealing, but I've seen enough raw footage of Indian trains and related events to still be more than a little hesitant. Are there any trains that ply long and interesting routes in a service level similar to that portrayed in _The Darjeeling Limited_?


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## jis (Nov 20, 2011)

Texas Sunset said:


> I won't deny that this suggestion sounds rather appealing, but I've seen enough raw footage of Indian trains and related events to still be more than a little hesitant. Are there any trains that ply long and interesting routes in a service level similar to that portrayed in _The Darjeeling Limited_?


_Darjeeling Limited_ is of course a completely mythical train. There are special tourist trains like the _Palace on Wheels_ that are operated in various parts of the country by IR under the auspices of IRCTC, that would be similar luxury. But they are not transportation. They are purely for tourism and cost so much that only the proverbial 1% of India that can afford it. It is targeted entirely towards foreigners.

If considerable unpredictability and unfamiliar things upsets one, they should avoid Indian Railways and India.  OTOH, in general Indian Railways is not known to completely cancel a train in the middle of nowhere without providing some means to the passengers to get to a station where they can get alternative transportation, usually on a train.


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## Texan Eagle (Dec 12, 2011)

jis said:


> > This wouldnt be long enough of a trip for the_traveler, hed have to work out a criss cross,double loop trip in order to have more Train time! :lol: :lol: :lol:
> 
> 
> Yeah he could possibly use the routing _Dibrugarh _to _Kanyakumari _on _Vivek _and then _Kanyakumari _to _Jammu _on _Himsagar Express_ the second longest run in India, to spend more than a week on trains.  And I bet the entire thing in 2A will be cheaper than a Roomette from Chicago to LA


The entire journey that Jis mentioned would take eight days including a 2 day layover in Kanyakumari sicne both trains run once a week only, and total ticket cost in highest available Sleeper class would come to, hold your breath, *$86 only! *


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## rrdude (Dec 13, 2011)

Texas Sunset said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > On other LD trains the age old technique of taking orders en route and telegraphing them forward to a station for pickup and delivery is still used quite effectively all over the system. There are no Dining Cars on any LD train in India because it is impractical to try to serve a thousand passengers from a Dining Car or two or three or.
> ...


I really doubt it Newt/Perry, as Amtrak would find a way to screw that up too, either on their own, or because of the host railroads.

While _some Dinner Trains_ operate this way, very successfully, (I've operated both types in the past), the ability to correct or "Do-Over", or come up with some other alternative options with a diner in the consist far outweigh the negatives. You are really "self-contained" when there is a diner in the consist. When you must depend upon others to cook your food, hold it in an Alto-Sham or some other warmer, provide you with all of the options that a dining patron may request........Diner in the consist is the way to go, notwithstanding JIS's comments about feeding thousands..........


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## Texan Eagle (Dec 13, 2011)

Texas Sunset said:


> jis said:
> 
> 
> > Yeah he could possibly use the routing _Dibrugarh _to _Kanyakumari _on _Vivek _and then _Kanyakumari _to _Jammu _on _Himsagar Express_ the second longest run in India, to spend more than a week on trains.  And I bet the entire thing in 2A will be cheaper than a Roomette from Chicago to LA.
> ...


Texas Sunset- agreed there is a lot of media out there that shows the dirty side of Indian trains, but that's not the complete picture. Agreed _The Darjeeling Limited _is completely fictional and you may not find that kind of service in real life, but Indian Railways runs several categories of trains with multiple classes of service and you can choose the level of comfort you desire. The AC First Class on the important _Rajdhani Express _class of trains offers more comfort and luxuries than Amtrak's Sleeper class, and I'd say, it could match, or surpass, the comfort you'd get on an airline's First Class. You can get private cabins which are more roomy than Amtrak's Superliner bedrooms, bedsheets, pillows, blankets and towels are provided, an attendant will make your bed, and all meals are included, freshly prepared onboard and served in your cabin in real bone china dishes, not plastic. These trains are usually overnight expresses and the ticket fare includes Welcome drinks, evening snacks, 3 course dinner, bed tea and morning breakfast, and you can ask for repeat orders as much as you can eat. The ticket cost for a 1000 mile 16 hour journey in this class is something around $80 per person.

Here is a detailed video showing the AC First Class journey experience on a _Rajdhani Express _train-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2_zene3_l54

Here is one more video showing the said class of train from the outside. Compare it with the other cheaper class of train standing on the adjacent track.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o785rrxc0Sc


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## Bob Dylan (Dec 13, 2011)

Wow! $80!!! Imagine how much subsidy Indian Trains must receive, our Bean Counters, er Republican Members of Congress, would beShocked! Shocked! to know that Trains are subsidized so heavily! :hi: Thanks for Posting the Videos, a couple of our members are, or will be, in India for the Holidays, wish I could afford to go!


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## jis (Dec 13, 2011)

jimhudson said:


> Wow! $80!!! Imagine how much subsidy Indian Trains must receive, our Bean Counters, er Republican Members of Congress, would beShocked! Shocked! to know that Trains are subsidized so heavily! :hi: Thanks for Posting the Videos, a couple of our members are, or will be, in India for the Holidays, wish I could afford to go!


Actually passenger service is cross subsidized by freight. If the lower class passengers and suburban passengers were charged anything close to what would business wise reasonable, IR passenger service would make a very healthy profit. The premium trains are all quite profitable. Additionally it gets saddled with running a whole host of "social" services which run uo serious losses. Overall Indian Railways does not get any operating subsidies. It pays dividend to the government. Remember IR's labor costs are quite low and that is a huge part of the expense of running trains. OTOH its diesel fuel costs are high, but over 50% of the traffic is electric hauled AFAIR.

I suspect that our bean counters won't be terribly unhappy with IR finances. They would probably moan a bit about why they do not make more revenue on the "social" services, but everyone knows that those are politically sacrosanct and no one will touch them. IR also has tremendous potential for carrying more freight, but the general political tendency is to favor passenger service since that provides more opportunities for politicians to claim they are doing something for their constituents as they cut ribbons to introduce new trains every so often.

BTW, there are two IRs in English: Indian Railways and Irish Railways, but the native name of Irish Railways is Iranrod Eireann, and Indian Railways is Bhratiya Rail.


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## Texan Eagle (Dec 13, 2011)

jimhudson said:


> Wow! $80!!! Imagine how much subsidy Indian Trains must receive, our Bean Counters, er Republican Members of Congress, would beShocked! Shocked! to know that Trains are subsidized so heavily!
> 
> 
> 
> Thanks for Posting the Videos, a couple of our members are, or will be, in India for the Holidays, wish I could afford to go!


While Indian passenger trains are indeed heavily cross-subsidized by freight as jis mentioned, and the $80 seems like a subsidized fare when looking at it in US Dollars, ironically the fact is that among passenger services, this class (AC First Class) is the only class on Indian Railways that actually yields a profit when full, and the excess revenue is used to subsidize other cheaper classes of travel for the poorer sections of the society. To put things in perspective, while the most luxurious class described above will cost you $80, you can travel the same 1000 mile distance in another train along the same route taking a few more hours for a little under $6 (yes, six dollars!) in the cheapest class Indian Railways offers, called Unreserved Second Class Sitting (more often than not it is Standing or Squeezing-Your-Way-In Class and that's what is shown in all the negative media reports). A little more humane way to travel would be Non AC Sleeper class which would cost you $10 for a sleeping berth (each berth sold individually, not rooms) and no bedsheets or food. Next up, for $26 you could opt for an AC Sleeper 3 Tier accommodation which is same as the previous class, but in an air-conditioned car and bedsheets, blankets and hand towels are given. A person opting for more comfort can go for AC 2 Tier Sleeper which has only 2 berths (bunks) instead of three one above the other and then finally you have the AC First Class whose fares are comparable, sometimes even higher, than air fares for the same city pairs (yes, $80 can be higher than corresponding airfare for a 1000 mile journey in India!). Long story short- there is far more variety to choose from in Indian trains besides the usual dirty-filthy-overcrowded trains that a lot of media and foreign tourists seem to focus on.


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