# It's cheaper to fly than it is to take express train to airport



## TinCan782 (Feb 7, 2016)

*It's cheaper to fly out of some airports than it is to take the express train TO the airport*

I haven't spent any time analyzing such things but, any experiences here in the US?

http://roadwarriorvoices.com/2016/02/06/its-cheaper-to-fly-out-of-some-airports-than-it-is-to-take-the-express-train-to-the-airport/


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 7, 2016)

FrensicPic said:


> *It's cheaper to fly out of some airports than it is to take the express train TO the airport*
> 
> I haven't spent any time analyzing such things but, any experiences here in the US?
> 
> http://roadwarriorvoices.com/2016/02/06/its-cheaper-to-fly-out-of-some-airports-than-it-is-to-take-the-express-train-to-the-airport/


I wouldn't know what to compare it to since I've never seen any express trains here in the US. In other countries the express trains to the airport are often fairly expensive but I've never found one that cost more than my airfare. I don't typically fly airlines like Ryanair so maybe that's the difference.


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## Train2104 (Feb 7, 2016)

Using cost-per-mile/km for flights is not a very effective measure, since flights are often extremely long.


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## cirdan (Feb 8, 2016)

Many airport express trains in Europe and Asia were built relatively recently and at high cost and are branded as a premium service, typically commanding higher fares than a regular domestic train over a comparable distance.

Similarly, many taxi companies also charge premium fares for airports.

I gues the logic is that people who are flying can afford it.

I have indeed seen cases were the combined price of airport expresses at both ends exceeded the cost of flying.


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## caravanman (Feb 8, 2016)

This is a good example of the plane being cheaper than the train...

Jordan Cox said the 1,017 mile round trip to Germany was £7.72 cheaper than a direct train home...

http://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/teenager-flies-from-sheffield-to-essex-via-berlin-because-it-is-cheaper-than-getting-the-train-a6837836.html

Ed.


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 8, 2016)

It's easy to get excited about these stories until you bother to research the halfhearted "airline" that makes them all possible. Read any investigative article or watch any documentary on Ryanair and you'll see that in reality they're little more than a specialized tax avoiding shell company that just happens to look like a conventional airline because they own a lot of aircraft and employ a lot of pilots as private contractors.


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## jis (Feb 8, 2016)

Most airports in Asia and Europe have multiple modes of public transport available to get to/from the airport at various price points. If one insists on only taking the highest price point means then of course you pay for it at that price point.

The tendency in these articles, which seem to serve the primary purpose of filling column space on slow news days, is to take the lowest fare possible on an airline and the highest price point everything else, and then crow about it.


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## cirdan (Feb 8, 2016)

caravanman said:


> This is a good example of the plane being cheaper than the train...
> 
> Jordan Cox said the 1,017 mile round trip to Germany was £7.72 cheaper than a direct train home...
> 
> ...


This has been discussed on other forums and the concensus is that it isn't true. He's comparing a "walk up" rail fare to a "buy a long time in advance" air fare.


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## caravanman (Feb 8, 2016)

Not sure if it was true or not... I read it as he got a cheap deal to get to Sheffield by rail, and then found it expensive to get home, so ended up on the day flying via Berlin. Yet, if he was "so savvy" I guess he would know to buy his train return in advance?

As a senior railcard and senior coach card owner, I enjoy the advance booking discounts myself.

All the same, quite a nice mini adventure to take the long way home, via Berlin, even at £70 odd quid!

Ed.

P.S. Not sure about the "tax avoidance" Irish airlines, probably following the same business models as US companies Google, Starbucks, etc, etc.

The cheap airlines are just that, cheap... They do fly modern planes, and people fly in them. Business folk with expense accounts can afford the cost of airline lounges and first class frills, not all of us can...


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## fairviewroad (Feb 8, 2016)

Someone pointed out to me last week while JetBlue was offering some $29 cross-country fares that it was possible to buy a LIRR ticket from far eastern Long Island to JFK Airport (that is, Jamaica station) for $35, which is more than the subsequent flight to LAX.

However, it was acknowledged that a couple of things made this less of a good story. First, the $35 fare is the Peak Buy on Board price, so most people would pay less than that. (Note: $35 = $30 peak buy on board fare plus $5 JFK Airtrain ticket)

Second, the $29 fare was before taxes/fees.

And third, the $29 fare was a very limited time, limited quantity offer.

(Also, in terms of comparing it to this article, you wouldn't really call a LIRR train from eastern Long Island to JFK via Jamaica an 'express' service.)

But it's kind of, sort of a neat story.


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## Long Train Runnin' (Feb 16, 2016)

I feel like I pay way too much every time I take the train from my home station to JFK.

$16.00 on NJT to Penn Station

$10.00 or $7.25 on LIRR to Jamaica depending on peak/off peak

$5.00 for the Airtrain (Maybe a $1 surcharge if I didn't already have a metrocard)

Worst case I'm out $64 dollars for a round trip in the worst case. To me it seems like a lot. A car service from door to door is just about $500 all in. There is honestly no good way to get to JFK from where I live in Central Jersey.

Of course best case off peak non weekends there are $24.73 worth of tolls each way just for me to drive to JFK. $34.15 for anyone without an Ez-Pass reader for tolls. You just can't win.


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## jis (Feb 16, 2016)

Moral of the story ... Don't fly out of JFK  . OTOH if you are flying out of there for lower fare, well some of the higher cost of getting there is amortized


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## Devil's Advocate (Feb 16, 2016)

Long Train Runnin' said:


> I feel like I pay way too much every time I take the train from my home station to JFK...You just can't win.


What about carpooling or taking a bus? Where I live reaching the airport involves zero tolls and some of the cheapest gasoline in the country. Unfortunately in order to enjoy these benefits you'd have to live where people like Ted Cruz are seen as mentally gifted spiritual superheroes.


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## jebr (Feb 16, 2016)

Devil's Advocate said:


> Long Train Runnin' said:
> 
> 
> > I feel like I pay way too much every time I take the train from my home station to JFK...You just can't win.
> ...


Honestly, this is the case for most areas outside the Northeast (and California on the gas front.) Getting to MSP requires no tolls, and gas is generally about average here.

Luckily, here transit is at least relatively easy and inexpensive, at least from the two main downtown cores. Non-rush hour fares are $1.75 for a 2.5 hour pass (includes local buses as well,) $2.25 during rush hour.


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## Long Train Runnin' (Feb 16, 2016)

jis said:


> Moral of the story ... Don't fly out of JFK  . OTOH if you are flying out of there for lower fare, well some of the higher cost of getting there is amortized



Yeah that is the true moral of the story lol. I do my best to avoid it, but sometimes you just can't avoid it. Especially if you want to fly some foreign carriers. I have done pretty good since I stopped flying Untied out of EWR it's meant getting to know Dallas well lol. I have yet to attempt to fly out of LGA.



Devil's Advocate said:


> Long Train Runnin' said:
> 
> 
> > I feel like I pay way too much every time I take the train from my home station to JFK...You just can't win.
> ...


There aren't really that many great bus options from here. I could catch a bus to the Port Authority Bus terminal from a rest stop about 10 minutes from my house, but I've never really looked into it. Bus from there to Port Authority is 19 bucks. With a very limited schedule.



jebr said:


> Devil's Advocate said:
> 
> 
> > Long Train Runnin' said:
> ...


Yeah I think the problem for me is either by road or rail I am crossing through different agencies that all need to ensure they are getting a small piece of me on the way through :wacko:


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## cirdan (Feb 17, 2016)

caravanman said:


> Not sure if it was true or not... I read it as he got a cheap deal to get to Sheffield by rail, and then found it expensive to get home, so ended up on the day flying via Berlin. Yet, if he was "so savvy" I guess he would know to buy his train return in advance?
> 
> As a senior railcard and senior coach card owner, I enjoy the advance booking discounts myself.
> 
> ...


I agree. I don't think Ryanair is just a loss-leader front to a bigger tax avoidance or money laundering scheme. I do believe they cover costs and return a profit for the owners. The planes are modern and just as well maintained as those of other airlines and I'm not sure about the pilots but there isn't exactly an unemployment problem among pilots that I'm aware of so if the conditions and pay was really rotten, they wouldn't get people to do that work. The criticism from what I've heard is more that they don't train their own pilots but poach them from other airlines (which you could argue is unfair, but then that's capitalism). It's a bit difficult to entice a pilot to change airlines if you're offfering lower pay and lousier conditions so i doubt that is actually the case.

Ryanair is more about showing what you can do if you cut down on the frills and non essentials, which do eat a big part of the costs of other airlines. Add to that that they have an eccentric and maverick CEO who likes to show off about how good he is at cutting costs (not all rumors he puts out are true by the way, it's all part of his scheme - more the pyschology of appearing to be a frugal housekeeper than actually pinching real pennies - for example the seat fabrics were designed to look ultra cheap but were actually more expensive than some of the stuff other airlines use). But then there are things such as at the shareholder meeting the only drink offered was tap water. That is of course as much about sticking a finger up at other airlines as it is about the money really saved.


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## BCL (Feb 18, 2016)

cirdan said:


> caravanman said:
> 
> 
> > Not sure if it was true or not... I read it as he got a cheap deal to get to Sheffield by rail, and then found it expensive to get home, so ended up on the day flying via Berlin. Yet, if he was "so savvy" I guess he would know to buy his train return in advance?
> ...


They become profitable based on their fees.


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