# Buying Pts. @ 30% Bonus?



## Rail Freak (May 17, 2017)

From vowing never to ride Amtrak again (because of AGR II) to Jonesing for another train trip, I'm thinking of buying 15k pts. to get the 4,500 Bonus Pts. Any thoughts out there?

Thanx


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## the_traveler (May 17, 2017)

Under AGR 2.0, unless you need some points for a ticket "tomorrow", it is not advantageous to purchase points "to save up for a future trip"! A trip is no longer just 15K or 30K, it's based on the current bucket. Plus, if you only need a few points, you can always buy them at that time.

If it were me, unless you need the points right now, I would not buy them.


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## Rail Freak (May 17, 2017)

I'm not going to travel LD Trips like I use to (1 or 4 a year) I want to save for a truly last ride. ex. STP-WAS-CHI-LAX-PDX-SAC-CHI-NOL-WAS-STP. Hopefully with my only hotel in PDX. But, I probably would be planning another trip after that! LOL!!! So I guess this would be like buying a trip on Lay Away! (Any youngsters know what that is?)

HAVE FUN


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## oregon pioneer (May 17, 2017)

I did some calculations, and it looked to me like the points *_at 30% bonus_* cost almost exactly what they are worth in exchange for a ticket. I'd just buy the ticket, especially if it's one where you can take advantage of a Senior or other discount.

On the other hand, if you have to use two payment methods, it can cause you to break the trip at a transfer point on what would otherwise be a through-trip. In that case, there can be a substantial cost penalty, and it might make better sense to buy the points to keep it one one res.

I will be paying for part of my trip next winter, and I will probably do the ticket purchase for a short portion after an overnight layover with a friend! That portion will be Business Class, so nice Senior discount there.


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## City of Miami (May 17, 2017)

oregon pioneer said:


> I did some calculations, and it looked to me like the points *_at 30% bonus_* cost almost exactly what they are worth in exchange for a ticket


But 'what they are worth' varies from a max of $0.028 downward to much less at times! I only found it advantageous to buy pts at 50% bonus, and now......not yet!!


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## jebr (May 17, 2017)

Unless you already have a bunch of points and are looking to top it off for a redemption that you're looking at booking now, just put the cash in a savings account until you're ready/have enough money to buy the trip you want. If nothing else, the refund penalties are less for a paid ticket vs. a points ticket, and you don't have to worry about the points devaluing further down the line.

There's no sweet spot where you're getting a significantly better redemption buying points than by just paying cash, and without that incentive I would say it's not worth buying points unless you're already flush with points and are just needing to top off for a specific trip.


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## Rail Freak (May 21, 2017)

I know AGR II only started last year but have they offered this "Up To 30% Bonus" before?


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## the_traveler (May 21, 2017)

Many times.

It used to be a straight 50% bonus, then a straight 30% bonus, but lately it's been a staggering bonus.


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## Rail Freak (May 21, 2017)

Thanx Dave, do you remember when the last 50% Bonus was?


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## the_traveler (May 21, 2017)

It was at least 2-3 years ago.


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## RSG (May 21, 2017)

the_traveler said:


> It was at least 2-3 years ago.


Closer to 3.5 or 4, IIRC. I passed on it, thinking "Pfft...maybe next time."


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## dlagrua (May 25, 2017)

With the introduction of AGR 2.0 the price of points went through the roof and more were required for LD tickets. It was a double whammy. If that's the way the game was going to go, I just stopped buying points all-together. You pay more for the points than what they are worth when redeemed. At a 50% bonus costs are on par with the value of the ticket. *If you want to lose money buy the points.*

Unless folks just need a few points to bring things to the required level to get a ticket, I doubt if many are buying points anymore. Its a lousy system and IMO Amtrak needs to revisit it. If they want our money in advance, there must be some incentive for people to buy.


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## Devil's Advocate (May 25, 2017)

Buying points with AGR2 starts at a disadvantage on day one and continuously underperforms standard inflation. Although there may be very specific cases where it helps, such as topping off a few points to cross the finish line, in most cases it's a fools errand.


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## Carolina Special (May 25, 2017)

If they're still pushing it, there must be someone out there buying the points. No matter how foolish we may think it is for the buyer.

So why shouldn't Amtrak keep pushing the points? It helps them meet that operating cost target.


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## the_traveler (May 25, 2017)

dlagrua said:


> With the introduction of AGR 2.0 ... more were required for LD tickets.


If your going end to end or "the long way" (like WAS-SEA via NYP, CHI and LAX), that is true. But how about CLE-CHI (which is also a LD route)? :huh: It used to be 2 zones (8,000 or 20,000 or 30,000)! I bet it costs much less now.
So you can't just say that more points are required for LD routes.


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## Railroad Bill (May 25, 2017)

the_traveler said:


> dlagrua said:
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> > With the introduction of AGR 2.0 ... more were required for LD tickets.
> ...


But I really miss doing "The Toledo Shuffle" NOT


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## AmtrakBlue (May 25, 2017)

Railroad Bill said:


> the_traveler said:
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My one time trying to do that shuffle I got bused to Chicago instead.


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## Devil's Advocate (May 25, 2017)

the_traveler said:


> dlagrua said:
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> > With the introduction of AGR 2.0 ... more were required for LD tickets.
> ...


All those people who were buying and saving points for years so they could finally make a six hour trip from Cleveland to Chicago are much better off now.


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## the_traveler (May 25, 2017)

Railroad Bill said:


> But I really miss doing "The Toledo Shuffle" NOT


You could always "Shuffle off to Buffalo" instead! :giggle:


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## the_traveler (May 25, 2017)

Devil's Advocate said:


> the_traveler said:
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> > dlagrua said:
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It cost me less points now to go from upstate NY to Florida!


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## dlagrua (Jun 2, 2017)

the_traveler said:


> dlagrua said:
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> > With the introduction of AGR 2.0 ... more were required for LD tickets.
> ...


I stand corrected on this point. Points are worth more on shorter trips but still not on par with cash. Right?


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## Ryan (Jun 2, 2017)

It's less a matter of the worth of points (since they now have a semi-fixed cash value), and more that the points cost are more proportional to voyage length. That's good for short trips (they cost fewer points) and bad for long trips (they cost more)...


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## oregon pioneer (Jun 2, 2017)

dlagrua said:


> the_traveler said:
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If you book low-bucket, on the shortest coast-to-coast route, points trips are cheaper now than in the past. I just booked BOS-WIH (barely short of PDX) for 27,497 points for next February. It used to be three zones, or 35,000. Of course, I checked Amsnag, then booked early and got the low-bucket roomette ("only one available at this price"  ).


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## ehbowen (Jun 7, 2017)

oregon pioneer said:


> If you book low-bucket, on the shortest coast-to-coast route, points trips are cheaper now than in the past. I just booked BOS-WIH (barely short of PDX) for 27,497 points for next February. It used to be three zones, or 35,000. Of course, I checked Amsnag, then booked early and got the low-bucket roomette ("only one available at this price"  ).


But for the 35,000 points you could have brought a traveling companion along at no additional cost. How does that change the calculus of your coast-to-coast trip?


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## oregon pioneer (Jun 8, 2017)

ehbowen said:


> oregon pioneer said:
> 
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> > If you book low-bucket, on the shortest coast-to-coast route, points trips are cheaper now than in the past. I just booked BOS-WIH (barely short of PDX) for 27,497 points for next February. It used to be three zones, or 35,000. Of course, I checked Amsnag, then booked early and got the low-bucket roomette ("only one available at this price"  ).
> ...


My last trip coast-to-coast was on the old AGR1 system. 35,000 points each way. I first asked Hubby if he wanted to come with me, and he said no, if he did not come, then I could visit my sister as long as I liked without worrying about him being bored. Then I asked my best friend if she would like to come, at least one way, and she said no -- it didn't fit her schedule. I decided that the "me" time was worth more than sharing a roomette with anyone further down my list, so I went alone. Of course, I took the scenic route because it cost no more in points. I got to take the Cardinal, which I could never take if Hub was along, because he won't take a long distance train without a full diner.

Adding a second person to my trip this winter would kick the direct-route points price up to ~35,500 points so yest, it would be slightly more expensive. But a different two-zone trip we want to take some year in December (at low bucket) would come in at 19,113 points (used to be 20,000), for the two of us. For my purposes, AGR 2.0 still works -- but I stick by my original contention that it is not worth buying points, even at a 30% bonus, unless you only need a few for your trip and cannot figure out any way to break the trip out between cash and points.


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## Devil's Advocate (Jun 8, 2017)

In my view AGR2 is great at funding short forgettable hops that are easily paid with cash from between sofa cushions rather than funding the bigger more extravagant trips that average people actually fantasize about. Which seems kind of silly and self-defeating in my view, but what do I know? Maybe it's totally worth it to spend far more and earn far less in exchange for lower prices on shorter trips.


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## Rail Freak (Jun 8, 2017)

oregon pioneer said:


> ehbowen said:
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_ I never heard from ya!!!_


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