# Driving vs the Amtrak Autotrain Costs



## dlagrua (Mar 2, 2010)

I know that this post may create quite a bit of controversy so I will make my point and compare it to a first class trip on the AutoTrain.

Such a trip w a bedroom currently costs approximately $550 one way from Lorton VA to Sanford Fl (just outside Orlando). If I am not mistaken it is a 650 mile trip so lets make a comparison:

*Driving*

Assuming a $25,000 automobile and a 100,000 mile depreciation cycle

By these assumptions it costs you 25 cents per mile in wear and tear.

I add another 5 cents per mile for maintenance (tires, oil changes, and repairs)

I believe that a 30 cent per mile figure is LOW for what it cost for the above but for comparisons sake lets go with it.

30 cents x 650 mile = $195 in depreciation and maintenance.

Now add in the gasoline. At 25 MPG which is good mileage you will use 26 gallons of gas x 2.75 =$71.50

If you drive ,not many will drive continuously through (we don't) so lets assume $100 for a room

Even an average dinner for two that Amtak provides is worth $40.00 (yot also get free wine)

Add in $10 for the continental breakfast and total food cost is $50

So now lets add up everything

Car Cost $195.00

Gasoline 71.50

Lodging 100.00

Food 50.00

Tolls 10.00

Cost to drive $426.50

*Cost of AutoTrain trip *for TWO in a Bedroom is $550 (includes wine/snack hour, dinner, light breakfast)

So assuming that my driving cost numbers are correct ( I believe them to be low) you will save $123.00 if you drive, but for us the driving fatigue is just not worth the hassle. We will also say that train travel reminds us of a time when it was part of the fun of getting there .

Now if you fly you can save more money but depending on the length of your trip rental car and long term parking at the airports can run the bill up pretty quickly. We we might save some money, but we have completely eliminated air travel for many other reasons. We refuse to be subjected to the filthy, crowded, unhealthy, and dehumanizing conditions that go with it. On the train you can travel as a lady or a gentleman, not like an animal in a cage.

Bottom line is that most people will realize that train trips in a sleeper are not the cheapest way to travel but first class air travel is even more expensive and coach fares can be extremely competitive.

Later on I will do a driving vs train trip cost analysis on our June trip to Chicago.


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## DivMiler (Mar 2, 2010)

Interesting analysis. When I try to determine whether or not to use my car for work (such as to drive to a meeting) or to take the train or rent a car, I tend to use the IRS's reimbursement mileage rate (which my employer uses to reimburse me). Currently it is 50 cents per mile. Yours comes up with 41 cents per mile ($71.50 divided by 650 miles is 11 cents per mile, plus the 30 cents you calculated earlier).

With the 50 cents per mile, I calculate that it would cost $485 to travel the 650 miles, including your other assumptions, still cheaper than to take Auto Train.


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## Guest (Mar 2, 2010)

Your numbers are funny. I am getting $619 as the minimum price of a bedroom and a regular vehicle.

Second, you should get more than 100,000 miles from a $25K car. If you don't then you bought a crappy car and deserve to have your money taken from you. Also looking at cars from a investment standpoint is just bad money management. My car pretty much depreciated all of its value a long time ago, but it still works fine and gets me from A to B every time.


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## rrdude (Mar 2, 2010)

DivMiler said:


> Interesting analysis. When I try to determine whether or not to use my car for work (such as to drive to a meeting) or to take the train or rent a car, I tend to use the IRS's reimbursement mileage rate (which my employer uses to reimburse me). Currently it is 50 cents per mile. Yours comes up with 41 cents per mile ($71.50 divided by 650 miles is 11 cents per mile, plus the 30 cents you calculated earlier).
> With the 50 cents per mile, I calculate that it would cost $485 to travel the 650 miles, including your other assumptions, still cheaper than to take Auto Train.


But doesn't the IRS rate of .50 per mile INCLUDE the cost of fuel? I've been told it did. Example is that if driving your personal car, on company business, you can't turn in an expense sheet for .50 and mile AND fuel. I really don't know, that's why I'm askin'...........


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## DivMiler (Mar 2, 2010)

> But doesn't the IRS rate of .50 per mile INCLUDE the cost of fuel? I've been told it did. Example is that if driving your personal car, on company business, you can't turn in an expense sheet for .50 and mile AND fuel. I really don't know, that's why I'm askin'...........


No, I didn't include the cost of gas:

650 *$0.50 = $325

Lodging 100.00

Food 50.00

Tolls 10.00

Total: $485.


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## rrdude (Mar 2, 2010)

I also did this type of comparison a few years back, and had a family of 7 going down. The cost of renting a mini-van, WITH two car seats (yes the rental companies charge for car seats) and all the EXTRAS that kids want and/or "need" when tooling down the highway, made it a virtual WASH when compared to getting GREAT RATES on S/W airlines.

Unless the Train Price is a real KILLER, (like ANY time I have tried to book a room on the Cardinal), I'll choose the train, and can usually get my employer to go along, if I am within 10%-20% of what it would cost to fly.

The deal breaker is the time. I had to CANX my RT from BWI-Toronto, cause rail both ways was just eating my time. Hey OW this Friday is better than nuttin'!


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## dlagrua (Mar 2, 2010)

Guest said:


> Your numbers are funny. I am getting $619 as the minimum price of a bedroom and a regular vehicle.
> Second, you should get more than 100,000 miles from a $25K car. If you don't then you bought a crappy car and deserve to have your money taken from you. Also looking at cars from a investment standpoint is just bad money management. My car pretty much depreciated all of its value a long time ago, but it still works fine and gets me from A to B every time.



My point is that at 100k miles a car value has been depreicated to almost nothing. You've pretty much spent the cost of the car to get to that point. Now the point that a fully depreciated automobile can still get you around is true but I have found that the reliability and major and very expensive repair work will make driving a high mileage car costly. If you want to do a "barebones" comparison and have cost as the only deciding factor in your travel then the Autotrain coach fare wins every time. I've seen AAA promotions where the AutoTrain coach fare to Florida w car is like $169.00 and dinner is still included.


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## Bootman4U (Mar 2, 2010)

Well, have you ever opened a bag of worms and I am glad you did!!!!

I see this sort of thread on lots of other "travel" boards I pay attention to. often it comes in under the title of "The Best Way To Get From.......To..."

My general comments about the automobile....most folks are going to have a certain amount of "expense" for an auto whether it is rolling or not....e.g., every day/month you are paying insurance on the vehicle whether you drive it or not; in VIRGINIA, every day we are paying a certain amount of personal property tax on it whether it rolls or not! If your car is not paid off then every day you are paying a certain amount on the note, etc., etc.

And I have to laugh about the comment of having a so-called "crappy" auto because it doesn't get a certain degree of MPG or it only goes so far with servicing..hey, get over that...my big bad Vette gets 25 on the highway and even if it didn't, I LIKE IT and can afford it.

Bottom line, there are a number of intangible things which are hard to measure....such as actually being some sort of "nut case" (depending on who you ask) who is willing to spendf their time and MONEY to ride that what some feel is a rather antiquated conveyance called a RAILROAD...what is with that, anyway???

Then there's the not-so-easy thing to do..putting some sort of monetary value on your TIME...is yours worth more or less than mine? And sure there are crazy drivers on 95 but when you are on the Auto Train and it breaks down and those I-95 jerks are whizzing BY you on the way to Florida....

OP, I salute you for your hard work and I honestly hope it is helpful to some...but I hope you aren't looking for a consensus (and I bet you aren't) 'cause it isn't going to happen...hey, let's have a drink together sometime <G>


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## alanh (Mar 2, 2010)

According to Google Maps, it's 811 miles from Lorton to Sanford via I-95 and I-4. (The Auto Train mileage is 855.)

The standard mileage rate is 50c/mile for 2010. This includes everything except tolls and parking fees. So one-way would be $405.50. Add to that food and lodging and tolls.


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## Ryan (Mar 2, 2010)

It's minor in the grand scheme, but where are the tolls on the Auto Train route? I'm not aware of any from Virginia all the way to JAX, is there one past that?


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## haolerider (Mar 2, 2010)

Ryan said:


> It's minor in the grand scheme, but where are the tolls on the Auto Train route? I'm not aware of any from Virginia all the way to JAX, is there one past that?


There are tolls prior to Lorton - in Delaware.

One factor that has not been discussed or considered is that most of the Auto Train passengers come from far north of Lorton - PA, NJ, NY, MA, RI, etc and they consider the Auto Train as their break from having to drive I-95. By the time many get to Lorton, it is a welcome sight to see the train, get their cars loaded, sit down and relax with the food and drinks - and not have to deal with the I-95 mess. Also, the demographics of the AT passengesr skew to an older passenger who does not want to drive the entire distance - and many times cannot deal with the distance and they have the money to pay for the relaxation. To many of the snowbirds, cost is not the object, it is the avoidance of the highway.


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## Ryan (Mar 2, 2010)

haolerider said:


> Ryan said:
> 
> 
> > It's minor in the grand scheme, but where are the tolls on the Auto Train route? I'm not aware of any from Virginia all the way to JAX, is there one past that?
> ...


Well yes, but they don't count - they will either be incurred or not (depending on where you live) regardless of taking the train or not.


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## jphjaxfl (Mar 2, 2010)

As another poster pointed out, you really have decide the value of your time behind the wheel driving 811 miles on I-95 and I-4 vs your time relaxing, eating and sleeping on Auto Train. Most people are coming to Florida for a vacation. Sometimes when you have a stressful driving trip, it may take a day or two to recover. When you disembark from Auto Train, you are ready to enjoy your vacation. The same is true of the comparison of driving vs taking a regular train and renting a car or using public transportation at your destination. In my opinion the train wins everytime over a more than 4 hour drive.


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## dlagrua (Mar 2, 2010)

alanh said:


> According to Google Maps, it's 811 miles from Lorton to Sanford via I-95 and I-4. (The Auto Train mileage is 855.)
> The standard mileage rate is 50c/mile for 2010. This includes everything except tolls and parking fees. So one-way would be $405.50. Add to that food and lodging and tolls.



Ok I stand corrected at the mileage but when I do a comparison I tend to be on the conservative side. I'll go with your numbers and add $100 for the hotel on the RT and $50 for meals. Thats puts us within $50- $100 of the sleeper Autotrain fare. We can debate the point on cost all day but the svaving of the driving fantigue is what is most important to us.


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## alanh (Mar 2, 2010)

For a 1-2 day drive and for 2 or more persons, driving will usually be cheaper. For example, I frequently go from Phoenix to LA which is about 350 miles. That's $350 driving round trip, or a minimum $120 airfare + local transportation in LA. If I have two people in the car, it's cheaper to drive. However, I frequently fly because I don't want to spend 6-7 hours each way on the road.

Unfortunately, the timing of the Sunset Limited doesn't usually work for me.

[Edit: sorry, gave car one-way but airfare roundtrip]


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## Tony (Mar 2, 2010)

haolerider said:


> One factor that has not been discussed or considered is that most of the Auto Train passengers come from far north of Lorton - PA, NJ, NY, MA, RI, etc and they consider the Auto Train as their break from having to drive I-95.


Which is why I take a Silver. Pick up a rental right in the Orlando station for between $100 and $200, and I just keep relaxing; which for me, is the entire purpose of vacationing.


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## AlanB (Mar 2, 2010)

jphjaxfl said:


> As another poster pointed out, you really have decide the value of your time behind the wheel driving 811 miles on I-95 and I-4 vs your time relaxing, eating and sleeping on Auto Train. Most people are coming to Florida for a vacation. Sometimes when you have a stressful driving trip, it may take a day or two to recover. When you disembark from Auto Train, you are ready to enjoy your vacation. The same is true of the comparison of driving vs taking a regular train and renting a car or using public transportation at your destination. In my opinion the train wins everytime over a more than 4 hour drive.


This is my big reason for either taking the AT or a Silver, especially when headed for Disney. At Disney all you do is run around trying to see everything and often end up exhausted by the end of the vacation. By taking the AT to/fro one has time to relax prior to attacking Disney and then time to recuperate after Disney.


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## Chatter163 (Mar 2, 2010)

I found the expectation of a car's life at 100,000 miles to be interesting. Where I live, some distance from the city, the expectation is more like 200,000-300,000.


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## OTownDog (Mar 2, 2010)

Ryan said:


> It's minor in the grand scheme, but where are the tolls on the Auto Train route? I'm not aware of any from Virginia all the way to JAX, is there one past that?



No tolls between JAX - ORL on 95 or 4

I think the AT costs are very conservative. Since I travel up north with 2 yellow Labs, these trip will always be in my private vehicle,.... until Amtrak has a "pet" car.


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## dlagrua (Mar 2, 2010)

Chatter163 said:


> I found the expectation of a car's life at 100,000 miles to be interesting. Where I live, some distance from the city, the expectation is more like 200,000-300,000.


At 100K miles the value of your car is fully depreciated but even after that driving still is not free. Maintainace, repairs, gas, oil, batteries and tires wear out. I live out in the country and have not had any car last more than 150K miles and even the ones that did stranded me on the road several times and needed loads of expensive mechanical work.

If cost is the ONLY consideration then the coach fare on the AutoTrain especially when they run the AAA specials at $169.00 wins every time unless you wish to drive a jalopy nonstop to Florida. However, if you did that, expect to wiped out for a day or two as you'll need to sleep sometime. That would cut into your vacation by at least a day so still add a day of lodging. You may disagree but all things considered I still say that the AT is the better deal.


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## volkris (Mar 2, 2010)

dlagrua said:


> You may disagree but all things considered I still say that the AT is the better deal.


And that's what it really comes down to: personal opinion.

Clearly there are at on of factors, a ton of different options, and a ton of different situations, all with different subjective values to the particular person involved. It's pretty much impossible to make a general statement about whether Auto Train, air, or road is best... so what's the point in arguing seriously about it?

Best say "here are my calculations for my particular situation, and they make it the right decision for me," and leave it at that. Trying to say that rail is always or even usually the winner is a futile task.


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## dlagrua (Mar 3, 2010)

volkris said:


> dlagrua said:
> 
> 
> > You may disagree but all things considered I still say that the AT is the better deal.
> ...



The open exchange of ideas and opinions are what a forum is all about

I hope that we are not arguing anything. I simply present a bit of infomation (that is hopefully correct) for discussion. Will will never all agree but we can choose to participate and enjoy the discussion, present differing views or at our option ignore the post. I'm here to simply express a point of view "shoot the breeze" and certainly no one has to agree with it. I see nothing wrong with that,


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## Ryan (Mar 3, 2010)

volkris said:


> Trying to say that rail is always or even usually the winner is a futile task.


It's a good thing that nobody is espousing that view around here.


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## dlagrua (Mar 3, 2010)

Ryan said:


> volkris said:
> 
> 
> > Trying to say that rail is always or even usually the winner is a futile task.
> ...



I believe all views are welcome and if you present numbers to go with your point they can be appreciated. The debate to be made about car vs train travel costs can be different in every situation.

Tomorrow we will go into Philadelphia for the Flower Show. The fare is $12.00 round trip via SEPTA. Parking at the station is a buck. Now if we drove to Philadelphia, parking would be a minimum of $25.00, plus we would have to pay gas and account for some wear and tear. The train is less costly for this trip and BTW there is virtually no street parking in that area of the city. You must use the lots. .

Point is that in some cases the train is more cost effective and in and it other cases it isn't. Overall train travel is not cheaper than driving but if you follow the coach fare specials, they do give you some really low fares.


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## Hanno (Mar 3, 2010)

I love the Auto Train and the good Lord willing will never drive I-95 to and fro again. The cost difference is minimal when taking the all factors into consideration including the risk of having an accident while driving. Years ago when we were driving I-95 we saw accidents almost every trip and sometimes several. I'll say it again...I love the AT and will pay a premium to use it!


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## VentureForth (Mar 3, 2010)

Totally off topic... but I'm curious.

I see a LOT of Ontario tags every day on I-95 here in Savannah. How many Canuks ride the AT to Skip I-95 if even for just about half of their drive?

Hmmm... Never mind about Ontarians...they wouldn't benefit. How about Quebecians?


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## dlagrua (Mar 3, 2010)

Hanno said:


> I love the Auto Train and the good Lord willing will never drive I-95 to and fro again. The cost difference is minimal when taking the all factors into consideration including the risk of having an accident while driving. Years ago when we were driving I-95 we saw accidents almost every trip and sometimes several. I'll say it again...I love the AT and will pay a premium to use it!



I presented my cost figures when I started this post and some will agree with them and others won't. It is also my opinion that the cost factor of driving vs AutoTrain is minimal but there will always be a difference of opinion on that point. The convenience of traveling while enjoying wine/cheese, dinner, watching a movie (or DVD) reading, sleeping, showering and arriving in Florida with no driving fatigue is the real reason that we take it. The food is actually very good. Its a nice trip and we enjoy it. We've taken it four times before ( always in a bedroom) and we expect to take it again. Occasionally we will take the train going and drive home but when we do this we stop to see the sights many times along the way. Last year we stopped in Savannah, Ashville NC Gatlingbrug TN and Staunton VA before arriving home

Still say that for folks on a budget and/or for those that can sleep in their reclining coach chair; those special $169.00 A/T AAA fares that they run from time to time are a heck of a deal.


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