# Lancaster (CA) Wants to Close Train Station to Keep Homeless Out



## CHamilton (Aug 28, 2014)

Lancaster Wants to Close Train Station to Keep Homeless Out



> Lancaster officials say there's been a huge influx of homeless people to their Antelope Valley city lately, so what do they think is the best response? Closing the Metrolink commuter rail station, which they believe "Downtown Los Angeles" is using to ferry homeless people into Lancaster, according to the Antelope Valley Times.


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## Bob Dylan (Aug 29, 2014)

NIMBYs are Everywhere! The less than welcoming people of Antelope Valley even lost the Roy Rogers and Dale Evans Museum because Tourists didn't want to go out there to see the stuffed Roy and Dale on the stuffed Trigger and Buttermilk!


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## Swadian Hardcore (Aug 29, 2014)

Reno is being swarmed by homeless everywhere, including the train station but there's really homeless everywhere, it's like we are being internally besieged by homeless.


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## neroden (Aug 29, 2014)

Honelessness in the US is largely the consequences of three policies:

- Reagan throwing the mentally ill out of the state mental hospitals

- the dismantling of most of our welfare systems (including massive underfunding of Section 8, the housing program)

- the mismanagement of the economy, so that median income hasn't gone up since 2000, and unemployment is persistently high -- in short, people are not getting ahead

Utah decided that it was actually cheapest to just pay for apartments for the homeless. Which basically works for everyone except the ones who belong in the mental institutions. However, for some reason we have been unable to convince other states to do the bloody obvious, so far.

http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2013/12/20/republican_state_gives_free_houses_to_moochers_cuts_homelessness_by_74_percent.html


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## DesertRat (Aug 29, 2014)

jimhudson said:


> NIMBYs are Everywhere! The less than welcoming people of Antelope Valley even lost the Roy Rogers and Dale Evans Museum because Tourists didn't want to go out there to see the stuffed Roy and Dale on the stuffed Trigger and Buttermilk!


 (nitpicking) Actually...that museum was located in Victorville (end nitpicking)


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## DesertRat (Aug 29, 2014)

Lancaster actually might have a point....but that would only move the problem down one stop, not solve it. Can't be THAT simple.


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## Dan O (Aug 29, 2014)

jimhudson said:


> NIMBYs are Everywhere! The less than welcoming people of Antelope Valley even lost the Roy Rogers and Dale Evans Museum because Tourists didn't want to go out there to see the stuffed Roy and Dale on the stuffed Trigger and Buttermilk!


I went to the museum when it was still in Victorville. It's not a big enough city to support a museum like that. I-15 was close to the museum but most folks from LA take it to get to Las Vegas so were not that keen on stopping.

Might not be a bad idea to pay for apts for the homeless. But then again my daughter has a Master's degree, teaches at a community college and has another job and has to rent a small bedroom in a house because she can't afford that apartment she'd like to have.


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## Bob Dylan (Aug 29, 2014)

Sorry about misplacing the Roy Rogers Museum, I know it was hard to get too and tourists didnt want to to go there! The Ghost known as X Train from Victorville to Vegas would have faced the same problem right?

The posts about the homeless are excellent and here in Austin the crazy real estate market and lack of affordable rentals are causing working people to either share or move out of the city!

Plenty of homeless here also due to the weather, the no hassle city policies and the reasons neroden cited! Sounds like conservative Utah has some politicians with common sense! We are our brothers keeper!

As retired person on a fixed income I sure can relate to the school teacher who can't afford her own apartment! Greed is not good!


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## TinCan782 (Aug 29, 2014)

So close Lancaster, they'll just use nearby Palmdale. From Metrolink, In FY14 Q4, Lancaster averaged 382 boardings per day. So subtract, (from the article), "over 67 individual that were coming here [via Metrolink] for transitory services." and that leaves 315 people who lose a station. Metrolink uses the term "boardings" but for commuters, which is the bulk of the passengers, its highly likely they are also disembarking at the same station so the numbers are probably still applicable.

They seem to have a pretty accurate count on how many and are sure adamant that LA is buying the homeless tickets!

http://www.metrolinktrains.com/pdfs/Facts&Numbers/Performance_Data/Station_Boardings/FY14_BOARDINGS_Q4.pdf


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## fairviewroad (Aug 29, 2014)

DesertRat said:


> Lancaster actually might have a point....but that would only move the problem down one stop, not solve it. Can't be THAT simple.


It "solves" the "problem" if you are a city official in Lancaster. They couldn't care less what happens in Palmdale or at any other

stop along the line.


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## SubwayNut (Aug 29, 2014)

Here's an interior photo of the targeted waiting room.


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## SubwayNut (Aug 29, 2014)

I guess I misread the article thinking it was about closing the waiting room that was seen as a haven for the homeless. Their proposal is push Metrolink out of town completely, for this tiny problem. Totally ridiculous!


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## John Bredin (Aug 30, 2014)

FrensicPic said:


> So close Lancaster, they'll just use nearby Palmdale. From Metrolink, In FY14 Q4, Lancaster averaged 382 boardings per day. So subtract, (from the article), "over 67 individual that were coming here [via Metrolink] for transitory services." and that leaves 315 people who lose a station. Metrolink uses the term "boardings" but for commuters, which is the bulk of the passengers, its highly likely they are also disembarking at the same station so the numbers are probably still applicable.
> 
> They seem to have a pretty accurate count on how many and are sure adamant that LA is buying the homeless tickets!
> 
> http://www.metrolinktrains.com/pdfs/Facts&Numbers/Performance_Data/Station_Boardings/FY14_BOARDINGS_Q4.pdf


Or the mayor of Lancaster is pulling a number from his, umm, hat. Like Sen. Iselin said, there are 57 [strikeout]Heinz varieties[/strikeout] Communists in the State Department.


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## Swadian Hardcore (Aug 31, 2014)

Maybe he's just trying to stir up a ruckus against the homeless.


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## Green Maned Lion (Aug 31, 2014)

People don't like the homeless. They hate thinking about the following fact: but for the grace of God go I.


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## Swadian Hardcore (Aug 31, 2014)

Then is someone going to do something about the Homeless Hordes in Reno? They're everywhere I tell you, they even line the Truckee Riverwalk. They prowl by the Walmart. They're everywhere.


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## AmtrakBlue (Aug 31, 2014)

Swadian Hardcore said:


> Then is someone going to do something about the Homeless Hordes in Reno? They're everywhere I tell you, they even line the Truckee Riverwalk. They prowl by the Walmart. They're everywhere.


Where do you suggest they be? I'm not homeless and I hang out at our local river walk and train station.


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## Green Maned Lion (Aug 31, 2014)

But for the grace of God go you, Swadian. Advocate for more finding for the homeless.


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## rickycourtney (Sep 2, 2014)

Lancaster is a town in crisis at the moment.

There was a huge housing boom in the town about 10 years ago as people looked to get out of the "rougher" parts of LA. They flocked to Lancaster because they could get a big house, with an equally big backyard on a cul-de-sac. It was the perfect hunting ground for the subprime mortgage lenders. The city had a massive collapse when the housing market fell out.

The city has never really recovered because it's too far from the job centers of the LA basin. A 1.5 - 2 hour commute each way, every day is a tough sell.

That's forced the city to setup some (limited) assistance programs to help the struggling citizens that remain. Those places may indeed be more appealing than the services provided in Downtown LA.

But I don't buy this crap that Los Angeles is using Metrolink to ferry homeless people into Lancaster. Tickets on the line are very pricey ($15 one way LA-Lancaster) and I just don't see LA picking up the tab for that.


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## SarahZ (Sep 2, 2014)

Swadian Hardcore said:


> Then is someone going to do something about the Homeless Hordes in Reno? They're everywhere I tell you, they even line the Truckee Riverwalk. They prowl by the Walmart. They're everywhere.


Please try to remember these are people, not bedbugs. I get that panhandlers can get annoying, but they still deserve sympathy. These are people who don't have shelter, a bed, food, or health care. Honestly, any of us could be in that position some day. Have some pity.


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## calwatch (Sep 2, 2014)

The mayor of Lancaster is, to charitably put it, nuts. This is a guy who wanted to have drones over the city conducting surveillance, wanted to keep his city a "Christian community", and in his private capacity as an attorney is suing the neighboring city of Palmdale because they don't have any Hispanics on their city council, never mind that there are none in Lancaster either. Palmdale and Lancaster have a huge grudge match that has only escalated because of the antics of the elected officials running both towns - Palmdale defended the former executive director of the local transit agency, despite documented favoritism, questionable expenditures, and child pornography found on his computer, while Lancaster and LA County wanted to dismiss him immediately. And to his credit (or in spite or it) Rex Parris has shored up the downtown, been a huge advocate for solar, and brought the BYD bus plant to his community.

Overall this will never happen because they would have to repay Federal funds that paid for the station in the first place, as part of the 1994 Northridge Earthquake emergency actions. But it's nice bluster that seems to play well with the locals, even though for outsiders it confirms how crazy the mayor is.


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## Shawn Ryu (Sep 2, 2014)

Lancaster is a town of cold hearted racists, if the mayor represents the town residents.


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## leemell (Sep 2, 2014)

In the mid-San Fernando Valley middle and upper class suburbs, I regularly see homeless. I have some training in evaluating people and I would estimate that more that 50% of the homeless I see have some mental problems. It is not just economic. In addition the "mainstreaming" of mental patients pre-dates the Reagan administration. I remember a 60 Minutes segment in the middle of the Carter administration that was basically calling into question the practice of "mainstreaming" mental patients. It was, in fact, the first time I had heard of that term. This excerpt from a study written by The Kaiser Foundation illustrates some of this history.

kaiser commission Medcaid and the uninsured
Learning From History:
Deinstitutionalization of People with Mental Illness As Precursor to Long-Term Care Reform

"These issues led to plans for major change. President Carter established the President’s Commission on Mental Health, which called for a new national priority for adults and children with serious mental disorders and recommended an orderly phase-down of state hospitals through performance contracts that would integrate federal and state funding. Congress responded by enacting the Mental Health Systems Act, with numerous changes to the federal CMHC program, including, importantly, a shift in emphasis to increase the priority of this population and to expand services beyond clinical care alone. In addition to the Commission report, the Department of Health, Education and Welfare produced a blueprint for further policy change in the most significant federal human services programs (Medicaid, Medicare and SSI) to better support individuals with mental illness in the community. With the CSP program reorienting state planning, and plans to make changes to the major federal programs to reinforce those efforts,_* deinstitutionalization policy entered a new stage, focused on successful integration of people with mental illnesses into their communities*_."

President Reagan then accelerated it by cutting Federal mental health spending by upwards of 25%.


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## BCL (Sep 2, 2014)

neroden said:


> - the dismantling of most of our welfare systems (including massive underfunding of Section 8, the housing program)


There's been quite a bit of NIMBYism about Section 8 in Antelope Valley. That has some of the cheaper housing options in Los Angeles County outside of the the hood, and a lot of long-time residents have tried to link an increase in crime with so many Section 8 tenants. It's also been alleged that the county is deliberately encouraging people to move to the area with their Section 8 subsidies The other end of spectrum is public housing complexes, which then have issues since they concentrate poverty.

http://theavtimes.com/2012/07/25/mayor-commends-terminated-section-8-fraud-investigators/

http://citywatchla.com/in-case-you-missed-it-hidden/5603-big-trouble-in-little-antelope-valley


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## Swadian Hardcore (Sep 2, 2014)

SarahZ said:


> Swadian Hardcore said:
> 
> 
> > Then is someone going to do something about the Homeless Hordes in Reno? They're everywhere I tell you, they even line the Truckee Riverwalk. They prowl by the Walmart. They're everywhere.
> ...


Well I did give them money when they asked for it and if I had some spare cash with me, but someone needs to help them out. Giving them money constantly isn't going to do anything in the long term.


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## Bob Dylan (Sep 2, 2014)

SarahZ said:


> Swadian Hardcore said:
> 
> 
> > Then is someone going to do something about the Homeless Hordes in Reno? They're everywhere I tell you, they even line the Truckee Riverwalk. They prowl by the Walmart. They're everywhere.
> ...


True this! Outstanding Sarah!


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## The Davy Crockett (Sep 3, 2014)

Get out of town :excl:

Homeless along Reno's Riverwalk? 

Might not they just be trolls who emerge from under the bridges along the Riverwalk to try and make an honest (for trolls) living? :blink:

Don't look down on them  just because they live so close to Hell that they can see Sparks :excl: :unsure:

:unsure:

:unsure:

:unsure:

:unsure:

:unsure:

Sparks, Nevada, that is.


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## NW cannonball (Sep 4, 2014)

The Davy Crockett said:


> Get out of town :excl:
> 
> Homeless along Reno's Riverwalk?
> 
> ...


Thanks.

Live long and prosper.

I love the rational approach , you nailed it.


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## Shawn Ryu (Sep 7, 2014)

BCL said:


> neroden said:
> 
> 
> > - the dismantling of most of our welfare systems (including massive underfunding of Section 8, the housing program)
> ...



All in the name of property values.

I am pro-free market kind of guy but I hope nuke accidentally drops on these people.


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## NW cannonball (Sep 8, 2014)

SarahZ said:


> Swadian Hardcore said:
> 
> 
> > Then is someone going to do something about the Homeless Hordes in Reno? They're everywhere I tell you, they even line the Truckee Riverwalk. They prowl by the Walmart. They're everywhere.
> ...


Naah - they annoy me. And there's some famous quote about sympathy -- what is it? about where in the dictionary?

But when they get serious and ask for reasonable help -- OK. When my son(9 years old) stole $40 from me and gave the money to the travellers sleeping under the bridge nearby-- good for the kid.

Good for the travellers (used to be called what? hoboes or such?)

There's still people about this time of year that ride the rails and dodge the heat. And I don't mind them sleeping only a few blocks away under the bridge, in my otherwise upscale inner-city neighborhood. When I see them, I smile and wave. And they do likewise. And if they ask -- I point them to the nearest free showers, and best cheap food.

Hell, they ask me for nothing but tolerance. I can do that.

As for "mental problems" well - I worked at a big health-care company for a while. The bosses were far far crazier than any homeless street people.


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## BCL (Sep 8, 2014)

NW cannonball said:


> SarahZ said:
> 
> 
> > Swadian Hardcore said:
> ...


The other day I was approached by a woman claiming that she had no money to get back home and needed to take a bus. I was heading to the bank and on the way out she approached me again. I was thinking of her request and at that point I was fairly sympathetic but didn't want to give her money if she was going to simply use it to for a fix or whatnot.

Now I have AGR points (lots of them) and was thinking maybe I could get her a ticket with those points. She said she was in a hurry to catch the bus and she was claiming that she had to catch a VTA bus to Diridon Station in San Jose to catch another bus. I offered to take her there directly and buy her a ticket. It would at the very least make me feel less uncomfortable that I'd be just giving money to someone who was lying to me. I know you can get a cash refund on a ticket, but that comes with a penalty and also has to be mailed in. Using my AGR points would have been ideal from my standpoint, but I just gave in and handed over $20.

I don't know if I did the right thing. I looked over the schedule again and there was actually plenty of time for me to take her there and buy a ticket if that's what she really was looking to do.


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## Bob Dylan (Sep 8, 2014)

Sounds like your first hunch was right, you were played by a pro!

I'll buy a person a meal if theyre hanging around a fast food place and they tell me they're hungry, but no Cash for cigarettes, booze, a fix or a ticket "home"!


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## Swadian Hardcore (Sep 8, 2014)

A lot of the guys out on the Riverwalk seem like real homeless and I do give 'em a dollar if they really look like they need it and ask for it, but if you are just sitting or walking around doing nothing and asking people for money while occasionally mumbling to yourself and yelling curses at no one, how am I supposed to help you at all? How am I am supposed to help you if you are saying "f##king blah blah blah" to yourself while wandering the Riverwalk?


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## The Davy Crockett (Sep 8, 2014)

Trolls do that.


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## Green Maned Lion (Sep 9, 2014)

Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's "The Man With The Twisted Lip" always comes to mind when somebody wants only food.


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## JayPea (Sep 9, 2014)

Green Maned Lion said:


> Sir Arthur Conan Doyle's "The Man With The Twisted Lip" always comes to mind when somebody wants only food.


Oddly, I thought of that very story too. When I see people panhandling I wonder if there are any Neville St. Clairs amongst them.


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## NW cannonball (Sep 11, 2014)

I hope I never supported the idea that anybody who has even a dime -- gives a dime to some damn beggar.

I gave up doing that 30 years back.

Last evening another panhandler asked for "25. 40,"

Never give a cent to a panhandler, because , first, "don't support totally lying to live".

And second, every cent will support a heroin habit.

Be polite, but broke.

Homeless deserve be homeless, never hassle them for that.

But give money? Never. That's as stupid as contributing to some liars campaign fund.


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## sechs (Sep 12, 2014)

Lancaster just wants Palmdale to be the end of the line.

Both cities are pretty ridiculous. They're literally out in the desert, and the furthest exurbs of LA, on the other side of the mountains. Someone has already mentioned the housing situation.


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## beautifulplanet (Nov 25, 2014)

Having friends currently living in the Antelope Valley, I try to follow the developments there.

Here is the update regarding the Lancaster Metrolink train station - turns out, Mr. Perris and other officials do not want to close the station after all (full quote following):



> *Lancaster Metrolink Station To See Security Improvements*
> 
> Homeless Service Enhancements also coming to the Antelope Valley
> _Posted Date: 11/18/2014_
> ...



source:

http://www.cityoflancasterca.org/index.aspx?page=20&recordid=4504


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