# SEPTA facing $63M capital budget shortfall over motorists' lawsuit



## Thirdrail7 (Jan 16, 2019)

I have to admit, I've never like the use of toll road money funding other transportation initiatives. 



> The lawsuit imperils funding set aside by Act 44, 2007 legislation that diverts some $450 million in toll revenues from the debt-ridden Pa. Turnpike Authority to the Pa. Department of Transportation to support multimodal projects. A 2014 earmark began diverting most of this funding to mass transit providers, like SEPTA.
> 
> The suit, filed by a truckers lobby and a driver’s association, asserts these transfers are illegal and seeks to refund nearly $6 billion in Act 44 payments to transit agencies since the bill took effect.
> 
> ...


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## MARC Rider (Jan 16, 2019)

What's their legal argument? 

I don't have any kids in school, why should my taxes go to education?

I don't farm, why should my taxes pay for agricultural subsidies?


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## Anderson (Jan 16, 2019)

I know there was a lawsuit in New York over the use of Thruway tolls once the Thruway bonds were paid off.


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## cirdan (Jan 17, 2019)

MARC Rider said:


> What's their legal argument?
> 
> I don't have any kids in school, why should my taxes go to education?
> 
> I don't farm, why should my taxes pay for agricultural subsidies?


I also think the taxes and duties levied on tobacco and alcohol for example needs tgo be spent on subsidies for tobacco and alcohol.

How dare other departments think they have any right to that money.


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## Thirdrail7 (Jan 17, 2019)

MARC Rider said:


> What's their legal argument?


It would have probably helped you if I posted the link and the rest of the article!

https://whyy.org/articles/septa-facing-63-million-capital-budget-shortfall-over-motorists-lawsuit/

A brief fair use quote will air their beef:



> Two organizations, the Owner Operator Independent Drivers Association Inc. — a truckers lobby — and the National Motorists Association, sued the state in March,* holding that it was illegal for Turnpike revenues to be spent on anything other than highway maintenance.*
> 
> Automotive groups across the U.S. have tied similar funding diversions to rising tolls. The legal battle in Pa. mimics a similar suit filed in 2013 by truckers’ groups in New York state over toll revenues diverted to fund improvements along the Erie Canal. That legal effort was initially successful but was thrown out on appeal last year.
> 
> SEPTA is just one of many transit providers across the state that could be impacted by this suit. The Port Authority of Allegheny County, which provides transit service in the Pittsburgh metro area, announced in November that it would idle 44 capital projects because the Turnpike had begun withholding quarterly payments to transit providers over the suit.


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## fairviewroad (Jan 19, 2019)

I am definitely not a lawyer, but it seems as though that should be a fairly easy question to sort out. Either diverting those funds to non-highway maintenance is specifically prohibited by PA law, or it's not. The plaintiffs must surely have a reason to think they are correct, otherwise they would not spend the legal fees on the case. The fact that SEPTA is "taking it seriously" is another key indicator here.

That said, it would also seem to be a relatively simple fix, legally speaking. PA lawmakers could simply change the law, right? Whether the political will is there is a different question, of course.


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## neroden (Mar 1, 2019)

Lawsuit looks DOA to me under binding precedents.  That said, you never know what a corrupt hack federal judge will do.. Remember Bush v Gore.


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## Metra Electric Rider (Mar 2, 2019)

Hasn't PA had, lets say issues, with Turnpike funding before? Something about where the money went as well as returning highways to tolls after eliminating them?


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## Thirdrail7 (Mar 3, 2019)

Almost 40 SEPTA projects stalled over Pa. Turnpike lawsuit

https://www.philly.com/transportation/septa-projects-halted-pennsylvania-turnpike-suit-truckers-penndot-20190225.html



> SEPTA officials put almost 40 improvement projects on hold this month as it awaits the outcome of a lawsuit that could slash a third of its capital budget by this summer.
> 
> 
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> Construction that is underway is continuing, but design work on 21 projects has stopped. Those stalled include high-profile work such as the $1 billion plan to modernize the trolley network with new vehicles, a $59 million renovation of the transit hub beneath City Hall, and work on stations at Secane, Noble, Tasker-Morris, and Villanova. Purchasing for 16 other projects has also stopped.


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## Bob Dylan (Mar 3, 2019)

Ironic that the 60 Minute Story today used SEPTA as a Model for how PTC works for Trains! <_<


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## PRR 60 (Mar 4, 2019)

This toll diversion plan started with a proposal floated by then Pennsylvania Governor Ed Rendell to toll I-80 across PA. The tolls collected off I-80 would have gone to the PA Turnpike Commission (PTC). The law then called for the PTC to transfer $450 million a year to PennDOT for general transportation needs, one of which is SEPTA.  The PTC would be made whole since the existing turnpike tolls would have used for the turnpike and the $450 million diversion would have come from I-80.  The hitch: adding tolls to I-80 required US DOT approval since the road was originally built with 90% federal interstate highway funding.

US DOT turned down the I-80 tolling and fund diversion plan as a violation of federal law.  Basically, tolls placed on federally-funded Interstate Highways (which is legal) can only be used for expenditures for that highway.  Diverting the I-80 tolls to other uses was not allowed.  However, despite the fact that the PTC was blocked from collecting I-80 tolls, the state law requiring the $450 million per year funding transfer from the PTC to PennDOT was not changed.  Thus, the PTC had to scrape up that $450 million out of turnpike tolls, which are about $1 billion per year - with $600 million dedicated to debt service.  The result: turnpike tolls have soared (increases every year for the last 10 years or so), more bonds have been issued to pay bills and payroll and the PTC hovers near insolvency.


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## Thirdrail7 (Mar 4, 2019)

Thank you for the information, Prr60. It would seem the PTC would have an interest in having the law overturned. This would enable them to remain solvent and fund their own programs.

New York is floating similar "tolls to fund mass transportation" needs, although it involves free bridges and a watch of the city. I've always felt that tolls collected from those bridges should be used specifically for those bridges. Then, you can use the money that was previously allocated for those bridges to fund your mass transportation needs.

However, I suspect the tolls will become a slush fund.


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## Acela150 (Mar 4, 2019)

Bob Dylan said:


> Ironic that the 60 Minute Story today used SEPTA as a Model for how PTC works for Trains! <_<


Septa all but brags that they have PTC. And the best part is, their PTC is horrible. I lost count of how many times I was on a train at Septa the train would dump cause the PTC was set up wrong. 

Side note. The engineer in that segment is a good guy. He's in their rules department and was one of my instructors. He's a guy that I miss.


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## neroden (Mar 5, 2019)

PRR 60 said:


> This toll diversion plan started with a proposal floated by then Pennsylvania Governor Ed Rendell to toll I-80 across PA. The tolls collected off I-80 would have gone to the PA Turnpike Commission (PTC). The law then called for the PTC to transfer $450 million a year to PennDOT for general transportation needs, one of which is SEPTA.  The PTC would be made whole since the existing turnpike tolls would have used for the turnpike and the $450 million diversion would have come from I-80.  The hitch: adding tolls to I-80 required US DOT approval since the road was originally built with 90% federal interstate highway funding.
> 
> US DOT turned down the I-80 tolling and fund diversion plan as a violation of federal law.  Basically, tolls placed on federally-funded Interstate Highways (which is legal) can only be used for expenditures for that highway.  Diverting the I-80 tolls to other uses was not allowed.  However, despite the fact that the PTC was blocked from collecting I-80 tolls, the state law requiring the $450 million per year funding transfer from the PTC to PennDOT was not changed.  Thus, the PTC had to scrape up that $450 million out of turnpike tolls, which are about $1 billion per year - with $600 million dedicated to debt service.  The result: turnpike tolls have soared (increases every year for the last 10 years or so), more bonds have been issued to pay bills and payroll and the PTC hovers near insolvency.


The thing is that the Turnpike wasn't federally funded, so it was legal to divert the money from it.  (Although I believe they have to repair the turnpike first... but it's in good repair.)   So the truckers don't have a legal case.  The Turnpike Commission might be unhappy, but as a "creature of the state" they don't appear to have a legal case either; they do what the state legislature tells 'em to.


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## Thirdrail7 (May 12, 2019)

The lawsuit was dismissed. However, an appeal was immediately filed. A such, the funds are on hold.. PA is looking to borrow money tp pay their bills.

https://www.post-gazette.com/news/t...ion-Port-Authority-SEPTA/stories/201904170122



> The agency has been unable to make quarterly payments of $112.5 million to the state Department of Transportation since July because of a federal lawsuit filed by a trucking group known as Owner Operator Independent Drivers Association Inc., and others. State law requires the payments, which PennDOT uses to help pay public transit subsidies to agencies such as the Port Authority and the Southeastern Pennsylvania Transportation Authority in Philadelphia.
> 
> Although a federal judge in Harrisburg dismissed the truckers’ claim it should be illegal for the turnpike to use toll money to pay for anything other that turnpike projects, the truckers immediately filed a notice of appeal. The truckers sought as much as $6 billion in damages from past tolls it claims were increased to pay for transit.



The lack of money may also impact Amtrak.



> Without the money, Port Authority and SEPTA have postponed more than $120 million of capital projects so far in the past 10 months. Both agencies have said the funding cuts haven’t caused service reductions yet.
> 
> But PennDOT has said if the funding shortfall continues into the new fiscal year that begins in July, those agencies and others such as Amtrak could face dire consequences. SEPTA would see its state funding drop from $351 million to $107 million, limiting the agency to maintenance-only projects.
> 
> Amtrak could lose the $8.13 million operating subsidy it receives from the state to help carry 1 million passengers a year.


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## neroden (May 13, 2019)

There is something odd here. Normally the truckers would not be able to get a temporary in junction, so the money would be transferred while the case was pending and refunded if the truckers won. What is preventing the funding transfer? The truckers as not likely to win on the merits and will not suffer irreparable damage from the fund transfer, so no injunction should issue and the funds should transfer. What am I missing?


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