# L.A.'s Transit TAP Dance



## WhoozOn1st (Sep 24, 2009)

MTA fare system runs into roadblocks

"A new audit done for the agency by KPMG reveals that the cost of the Transit Access Pass program has risen from $78.5 million to $154 million since 1998 and that the deadline for completing the system has been extended from an initial estimate of three years to more than 10."

I've heard at least one railfan characterize the MTA's TAP implementation as "brain-dead;" haven't ever used it myself.


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## p&sr (Sep 24, 2009)

WhoozOn1st said:


> I've heard at least one railfan characterize the MTA's TAP implementation as "brain-dead;" haven't ever used it myself.


I was down there myself a couple of weeks ago. At the Red Line in Union Station they have Turn-styles now so you can't just get on the Train like before. This was to increase revenue and decrease the number of people riding free.

The brain-dead part? The Turn-styles run on the Honour System. If you have a Tap card, you're supposed to Tap it so you get charged for your ride. If you just bought an ordinary Ticket, you're supposed to ignore the "Tap here!" notices and just walk freely through the Turn-style as if it weren't there.

And if you DON'T have any Ticket? Goodness knows...

The other clever thing is that on the way OUT of the Station you have to walk through the Turn-styles again. Each Turn-style has a sign facing the out-bound Traffic reminding you to be sure and Tap again (so you get double-billed for your Ride). Then up above (hard to see) is a Notice saying to just ignore those signs because you really do NOT have to Tap on your way out... only when entering... and even then, only if you want to.

I might have devised that a bit differently, if I'd been in charge...


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## gswager (Sep 25, 2009)

The turnstyles are set up in some stations, but its security is not on yet. Anybody can walk in. Supposedly next year or so, the security will be activated.


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## WhoozOn1st (Sep 25, 2009)

The article link doesn't work anymore, but there's a thread about the advent of turnstiles for L.A. *here*.


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## WhoozOn1st (Aug 27, 2010)

This L.A. Times editorial addresses the LACMTA's "brain-dead" TAP system. The online headline is "MTA and its beleaguered Transit Access Pass system," but the print edition is more to the point:

Paperless, and clueless

"While it tries to get its ticketing system in order, the MTA has proposed a worrisome solution to the [turnstile] problem. Within 60 days, the agency plans to set lights on the gates to flash whenever someone passes through without using a TAP card. This alerts fare inspectors to check that the rider has a valid paper ticket or pass (that is, when a fare inspector is present). Tourists and occasional rail users are likely to be confused and embarrassed by the flashing lights; taking a subway ride without a TAP card will be a little like walking out of a store after a salesclerk has forgotten to take the security tag off one's purchase. At rush hour, the gates will probably be a disco of flashing lights, rendering the warning system next to useless."


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## Shawn Ryu (Aug 27, 2010)

WhoozOn1st said:


> This L.A. Times editorial addresses the LACMTA's "brain-dead" TAP system. The online headline is "MTA and its beleaguered Transit Access Pass system," but the print edition is more to the point:
> 
> Paperless, and clueless
> 
> "While it tries to get its ticketing system in order, the MTA has proposed a worrisome solution to the [turnstile] problem. Within 60 days, the agency plans to set lights on the gates to flash whenever someone passes through without using a TAP card. This alerts fare inspectors to check that the rider has a valid paper ticket or pass (that is, when a fare inspector is present). Tourists and occasional rail users are likely to be confused and embarrassed by the flashing lights; taking a subway ride without a TAP card will be a little like walking out of a store after a salesclerk has forgotten to take the security tag off one's purchase. At rush hour, the gates will probably be a disco of flashing lights, rendering the warning system next to useless."


I know none of the light rail stations aside from underground have turnstiles. Is it reakistic to have turnstiles installed there as well?


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## WhoozOn1st (Aug 27, 2010)

Shawn Ryu said:


> I know none of the light rail stations aside from underground have turnstiles. Is it reakistic to have turnstiles installed there as well?


Apparently not, and it's mentioned in the editorial:

"This month, the MTA finished installing turnstile gates at all of L.A.'s subway stations and half of its light-rail stations; the other half are designed in such a way that gates will never be practical."


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## Dan O (Aug 29, 2010)

WhoozOn1st said:


> Shawn Ryu said:
> 
> 
> > I know none of the light rail stations aside from underground have turnstiles. Is it reakistic to have turnstiles installed there as well?
> ...


Just there a week ago and there are turnstiles. I bought tickets and wondered where I insert them to get through. Oops..don't have to do that. Just walk through. I have been on the subway maybe 10 times and never seen anyone that looks like they work there. I have seen Sheriff's deputies checking for tickets once in a car but not the one I was in. Seems like there would be a lot of folks not paying and just avoiding the deputies.

Dano

PS Same thing for Metrolink too. We buy tickets but no one usually asks to see them. I have had them ask once or twice. Even at that, it seems like one could just move to the next car or downstairs to avoid being caught in the ticket sweep if one didn't have a ticket.


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