Little incursion into Ukraine Summer '24

cirdan · Aug 29, 2024

Barciur said:
Without change, since 2014, the large map shows all of the connections to Ukrainian territories, including those occupied by Russia since 2014.

That map is also interesting in that the names of Russia and Belarus have been painted out, and by the looks of it some places within Ukraine have been renamed or had their bilingual names removed.

If the experiences of countries like Spain, Romania, Italy, Croatia, Wales, Ireland etc are anything to go by, bilingual place names will remain points of contention for decades to come, persisting long after other differences between linguistic minorities and majorities have been settled and bridges repaired.

jis · Aug 29, 2024

cirdan said:
That map is also interesting in that the names of Russia and Belarus have been painted out, and by the looks of it some places within Ukraine have been renamed or had their bilingual names removed.

If the experiences of countries like Spain, Romania, Italy, Croatia, Wales, Ireland etc are anything to go by, bilingual place names will remain points of contention for decades to come, persisting long after other differences between linguistic minorities and majorities have been settled and bridges repaired.

Then again there is the counterexample of Switzerland where multilingualism is firmly institutionalized. Same is the case in India.

cirdan · Aug 29, 2024

jis said:
Then again there is the counterexample of Switzerland where multilingualism is firmly institutionalized. Same is the case in India.

Switzerland saw a minor spat as recently as the 1970s when the French speaking minority in the majority German speaking Canton of Berne protested and engaged in acts of civil disobedience. All very restrained and civilized and Swiss style of course. This did lead to the French speaking part breaking away and forming a new canton, the Canton of Jura in 1979. Even so some people found themselves on the wrong side of the border and continued to campaign. As of 2026 the little town of Moutier (7000 inhabitants) will switch from the Canton of Berne to the Canton of Jura. So it's not as if these disputes are ancient history yet.

Bob Dylan · Aug 29, 2024

jis said:
Then again there is the counterexample of Switzerland where multilingualism is firmly institutionalized. Same is the case in India.

And Canada where the 2 official Languages are English and French.

Lots of jobs require applicants to be Bi-Lingual including Federal Civil Service Jobs and VIA.( although I'm not certain about the T&E Crew members)

The Separatist Movememt in Quebec was an ongoing problem for many years, but things have settled down greatly in recent years.

cirdan · Aug 30, 2024

I understand that in Ireland too, many government positions require applicants to be bilingual. Some people consider this unfair and unnecessary as it shrinks the pool of applicants without adding any value, as in most areas of the country, nobody actually uses Irish.

OTOH I guess the rule probably motivates people to learn Irish, which can only be a good thing as it slows down the decline of the language.

railiner · Aug 30, 2024

cirdan said:
OTOH I guess the rule probably motivates people to learn Irish, which can only be a good thing as it slows down the decline of the language.

I feel the opposite…it would greatly reduce division of different people if we could all understand each other, and speaking a common language would be a good start…