Auto Train Mysterious Death

[GaSteve]

I feel badly for that poor old lady. that's not a pleasant way to go.

I think the woman was 63 - and that hardly makes her an "old lady." :wacko: At least I hope not.

I saw an Orlando tv news report this evening in which the woman's son was interviewed. He stated that the family is upset that the Georgia Bureau of Investigation is not keeping them posted as to how the investigation is going.

The GBI still considers this a criminal investigation until proved otherwise. Such things are always kept close to the vest to avoid compromising the investigation. This is not to say by any means that any of the family are suspects, but it would be standard procedure.

 

[BigRedEO]

The CNN article says the husband got up around 3 - 3:15am and then noticed her missing around 5:45am. That's a short time period for that to happen. Plus, sleeping in coach is NOT easy so someone would have had to have noticed her get up. But I'm still not understanding the $1,000 cash - especially since it says they were on their way HOME. If they were just beginning their vacation, maybe, but who would need to take that much cash when you're on a non-stop train going home?

 

[passenger]

I agree with the speculations by Railroad Bill. I wonder when the woman went missing (guess I can find that in the news articles). The autotrain runs on a pretty tight schedule, and would pass each town including Jesup, Ga at approximately the same time each day. The train crew probably has record of when they passed each particular town or landmark. The authorities should know what time the body left the train. They need to do a full investigation and bring justice for the deceased woman.

They say between 3:00 and 3:30 a.m. The train arrived in Sanford an hour early that morning. I was in one of the Coach cars and awake most of the night. I can't imagine a window being removed and not hearing noise or wind. There have to be other passengers who know something.

 

[pennyk]

I agree with the speculations by Railroad Bill. I wonder when the woman went missing (guess I can find that in the news articles). The autotrain runs on a pretty tight schedule, and would pass each town including Jesup, Ga at approximately the same time each day. The train crew probably has record of when they passed each particular town or landmark. The authorities should know what time the body left the train. They need to do a full investigation and bring justice for the deceased woman.

They say between 3:00 and 3:30 a.m. The train arrived in Sanford an hour early that morning. I was in one of the Coach cars and awake most of the night. I can't imagine a window being removed and not hearing noise or wind. There have to be other passengers who know something.

Were you in one of the coach cars where the passengers are being interviewed by the GBI?

 

[Dovecote]

Doesn't the door require two latches to open? Maybe not... But it does take a bit of extra strength than opening a bathroom door. The speculation about an emergency exit being removed is plausible, - and much easier. But how could it not have been noticed - especially in Coach? I suppose with no stops, it's possible that all coach pax were asleep at the same time. Perhaps a sleeping gas was introduced into the cabin and all the passengers were in a deep sleep when the culprit came aboard.

It was a dark and stormy night. Suddenly, a window popped out.

"IF" it was in coach, there is no possible way an emergency window could have been popped out, and no one noticed, unless the coach car was virtually empty, and the only pax were at the extreme other end of the car. The wind noise alone, let alone the wind itself, and the sound of the horn....?

Papa took her down to the lower level, said "let's open the dutch door like we used to honey, smell that fresh Georgia air.......Step a little closer"....PUSH...... close door and dog the latches,.............."Good nite hon......"

Actually it is possible for one of the coach cars to be completely empty especially if the passenger load is very light. I witnessed such an occurence on Thanksgiving Day last year. My location on the train was in the sleeper car adjacent to coach car 5310. Due to the light load this car did not have any passengers. Our SCA mentioned that this is done when the passenger load is very light to have a buffer zone between the coach and sleeping cars. If this situation existed for this trip than it is possible for this dastardly deed to take place either in an empty or near empty car without anyone hearing the door open.

 

[user 1215]

GBI's involvement is interesting particularly because GBI really doesn't have the skill set. Even though the crime literally happened in Georgia, the passengers were on a closed vessel between Virginia and Florida. GBI should handle the autopsy and crime scene, but the investigation needs to be be Florida and Virginia's.

Or the FBI.

Special Agent Lynch, I know a great deal of folk have made fun of you on this board, but if you still lurk out there, what do you think?

 

[Dale]

My friend was on this train and had dinner with this couple. It would seem to me that an assisted suicide pact would be better performed at home with a surplus of pills. Getting thrown from a train is a pretty painful and gruesome way to exit life and one could not be certain that death would result from the fall, no?

If she did have help leaving that train, isn't it strange that no one saw or heard anything even in the early morning? They weren't in the sleeper section-they were upstairs in the coach recliner seats trying to sleep. Train was probably half full of people nodding in and out of sleep in their chairs. The train apparently stops 5 times during the 17 hours from Maryland to Florida.

Advanced Parkinson's can really contort a living person's body into some wild uncontrollable movements. She might have gotten up to go to the bathroom (hence taking her purse with her) and hit the wrong button. Would be interesting to know if those doors close automatically after opening or with the movement of the train.

 

[GaSteve]

My friend was on this train and had dinner with this couple. It would seem to me that an assisted suicide pact would be better performed at home with a surplus of pills. Getting thrown from a train is a pretty painful and gruesome way to exit life and one could not be certain that death would result from the fall, no?

If she did have help leaving that train, isn't it strange that no one saw or heard anything even in the early morning? They weren't in the sleeper section-they were upstairs in the coach recliner seats trying to sleep. Train was probably half full of people nodding in and out of sleep in their chairs. The train apparently stops 5 times during the 17 hours from Maryland to Florida.

Advanced Parkinson's can really contort a living person's body into some wild uncontrollable movements. She might have gotten up to go to the bathroom (hence taking her purse with her) and hit the wrong button. Would be interesting to know if those doors close automatically after opening or with the movement of the train.

I would assume that you friend has volunteered his/her information to the GBI.

 

[GaSteve]

GBI's involvement is interesting particularly because GBI really doesn't have the skill set. Even though the crime literally happened in Georgia, the passengers were on a closed vessel between Virginia and Florida. GBI should handle the autopsy and crime scene, but the investigation needs to be be Florida and Virginia's.

Or the FBI.

Special Agent Lynch, I know a great deal of folk have made fun of you on this board, but if you still lurk out there, what do you think?

I don't understand why the Florida or Virginia authorities would have any more expertise than the GBI. The incident, whatever it was, occurred in Georgia, hence it is the GBI's case unless and until they ask the FBI for assistance.

 

[MikefromCrete]

My friend was on this train and had dinner with this couple. It would seem to me that an assisted suicide pact would be better performed at home with a surplus of pills. Getting thrown from a train is a pretty painful and gruesome way to exit life and one could not be certain that death would result from the fall, no?

If she did have help leaving that train, isn't it strange that no one saw or heard anything even in the early morning? They weren't in the sleeper section-they were upstairs in the coach recliner seats trying to sleep. Train was probably half full of people nodding in and out of sleep in their chairs. The train apparently stops 5 times during the 17 hours from Maryland to Florida.

Advanced Parkinson's can really contort a living person's body into some wild uncontrollable movements. She might have gotten up to go to the bathroom (hence taking her purse with her) and hit the wrong button. Would be interesting to know if those doors close automatically after opening or with the movement of the train.

I would think her exit from the train was on the lower level of the Superliner coach. Opening an emergency window on the top level of the coach would certainly be noticed by the other passengers. She could have gone downstairs to use the washroom, became confused and opened the exit door. I supposed she could have opened the top of the dutch door and fell out (or the bottom half, for that matter). The missing money, of course, leads to the suspicion of foul play. It could have been anybody on the train. You would think the incident would have been witnessed by people riding in the lower level coach section, but everyone could have been asleep.

Very mysterious, the stuff of novels and movies. As far as the incident being investigated by Georgia, the crime (if it was one) happened in Georgia, so it falls under that state's jurisdiction. Virginia and Florida would have no reason to be involved. Of course, the FBI could be called in on the investigation since it happened on an interstate train.

As far as pushing buttons, that would be for doors between the cars. The exit doors on the Superliners are opened by hand.

 

[NE933]

Many older folks, like my grandparents, are from an older generation in which large sums of money would be stashed throughout the house so that it can be immediately available should there be a financial collapse, or simply just to avoid reporting it to IRS or the housing development which would mean certain tax and/or rent hikes. Also, there is some security in knowing the presence of a 'little pot of extra money' on hand, ready in a second, if you need it.

That being said, when a senior citizen decided to take a few hundred for vacation or other trip, they carry the object holding the money everywhere. A woman with a 'loaded' handbag will feel uncomfortable just leaving it on the chair while they go to the bathroom, especially in coach. This poor woman had her thousand dollars next to her because she was the only security, not because she tried to get out of the moving train in the middle of the night to start a new life, and not to commit suicide. If suicide by jumping from a train was the plan she would have left the bag, and money, in her seat.

This is a tragic story of a passenger getting up to go to the bathroom, and either some random cruel ******* gets his or her kicks, or more likely, someone who knows her well had premeditated the plan and the inevitable moment came to answer nature's call. The latches of the door are unopened, a wind is generated, who cares, if there was a struggle well she had Parkison's and sometimes the patients can can make incomprehensible sounds.

Any elderly passenger, Parkisons or not, while walking through a moving train of 70mph: the only thing they are interested in is where's something to hold on to. They are not going to walk over to a door and play with the latches. The only one who used the latches is the murderer.

 

[boxcar479]

You know I was thinking that maybe someone who sat near or even with her at one of her meals, could have seen her wad of cash when she payed for her meal. What do you think GUEST_ Dale? hhmmmm

 

[AlanB]

The train apparently stops 5 times during the 17 hours from Maryland to Florida.

The Auto Train makes 1 stop between Virginia and Florida to refuel in the middle of the night. Any other stops would have been because of opposing train traffic and most likely brief. But except for the scheduled refueling stop, no doors would be opened. At any other stops for meets with other trains, the doors would remain closed as no one would be boarding or disembarking.

And the Auto Train doesn't go to Maryland. It ends/starts in Lorton, Virginia about 20 or 30 miles south of DC.

 

[dlagrua]

You know I was thinking that maybe someone who sat near or even with her at one of her meals, could have seen her wad of cash when she payed for her meal. What do you think GUEST_ Dale? hhmmmm

Meals are included on all tickets on the AutoTrain.

What is also sad about this is that the edlerly lady murdered who was riding in coach was suffering with advanced parkinsons disease. If the woman had $1000 in cash with her they could have probably afforded the upgrade. If that was my wife at 67 and in ill health she would be traveling in a bedroom.

 

[Ryan]

It's still possible that someone saw the money when she was leaving with a tip.

And having $1000 in cash is not an indicator of someone's ability to pay for a bedroom, so lose your attitude about coach. Are you ever going to get around to substantiating your acquisition of a crew member, or are you just hoping that it'll quietly be forgotten?

 

[rrdude]

The CONDUCTOR did it!

I have no proof, I have no motive, I have no idea. It just sounds good, like "The Butler did it!"

I'm putting $5.00 in the AU kitty, that the husband did it.

 

[user 1215]

And having $1000 in cash is not an indicator of someone's ability to pay for a bedroom, so lose your attitude about coach. Are you ever going to get around to substantiating your acquisition of a crew member, or are you just hoping that it'll quietly be forgotten?

If she was in a bedroom, Amtrak would have the $1000 and it wouldn't be in her purse. (Oh, and I think you meant "accusation" of a crew member. The GBI had an aquisition of of a corpse.

What I want to know - and this seems to be the most troubling to me - is that there was a report that an emergency window was missing. Don't know if this was extrainformational reporting or what, but I want to know where that missing emergency window was.

Another botched opportunity is when they all detrained. Cops should have been on the scene, and they should have sequestered the passengers when they arrived in Sanford.

 

[Greg]

Doesn't the door require two latches to open? Maybe not... But it does take a bit of extra strength than opening a bathroom door. The speculation about an emergency exit being removed is plausible, - and much easier. But how could it not have been noticed - especially in Coach? I suppose with no stops, it's possible that all coach pax were asleep at the same time. Perhaps a sleeping gas was introduced into the cabin and all the passengers were in a deep sleep when the culprit came aboard.

It was a dark and stormy night. Suddenly, a window popped out.

"IF" it was in coach, there is no possible way an emergency window could have been popped out, and no one noticed, unless the coach car was virtually empty, and the only pax were at the extreme other end of the car. The wind noise alone, let alone the wind itself, and the sound of the horn....?

Papa took her down to the lower level, said "let's open the dutch door like we used to honey, smell that fresh Georgia air.......Step a little closer"....PUSH...... close door and dog the latches,.............."Good nite hon......"

Don't some of the older Superliner sleepers have an upstairs bathroom with a frosted window in it? It is possible that the perp and the woman could make it to the sleeper in the middle of the night to one of those restrooms, pop out the emergency window (if they're so equipped, and I think I remember that they are) shove her out, exit the restroom, close the door and people might not notice for a while.

 

[Big Iron]

It's still possible that someone saw the money when she was leaving with a tip.

And having $1000 in cash is not an indicator of someone's ability to pay for a bedroom, so lose your attitude about coach. Are you ever going to get around to substantiating your acquisition of a crew member, or are you just hoping that it'll quietly be forgotten?

Having $1,000.00 CLEARLY demonstrates the ability to buy a bedroom but does not demonstrate the willingness to buy a bedroom so drop the attitude with the other poster. You must still be sore from the whuppin the JMU Dukes put on the Hokies last Saturday.

 

[haolerider]

Doesn't the door require two latches to open? Maybe not... But it does take a bit of extra strength than opening a bathroom door. The speculation about an emergency exit being removed is plausible, - and much easier. But how could it not have been noticed - especially in Coach? I suppose with no stops, it's possible that all coach pax were asleep at the same time. Perhaps a sleeping gas was introduced into the cabin and all the passengers were in a deep sleep when the culprit came aboard.

It was a dark and stormy night. Suddenly, a window popped out.

"IF" it was in coach, there is no possible way an emergency window could have been popped out, and no one noticed, unless the coach car was virtually empty, and the only pax were at the extreme other end of the car. The wind noise alone, let alone the wind itself, and the sound of the horn....?

Papa took her down to the lower level, said "let's open the dutch door like we used to honey, smell that fresh Georgia air.......Step a little closer"....PUSH...... close door and dog the latches,.............."Good nite hon......"

Don't some of the older Superliner sleepers have an upstairs bathroom with a frosted window in it? It is possible that the perp and the woman could make it to the sleeper in the middle of the night to one of those restrooms, pop out the emergency window (if they're so equipped, and I think I remember that they are) shove her out, exit the restroom, close the door and people might not notice for a while.

It is really quite amazing to me to read all of the hypothetical analysis of what could have happened, what might have happened, who did it, who didn't do it, etc., etc. I am also amazed that all this discussion has taken place based on a reporters story of the event. I think we all know that most reporters don't know the difference between the front of the train and the back of the train - let alone a term like "emergency window". So far as the guilty party,we have the husband, a thief on the train, someone who saw the victim with the alleged $1,000 in her purse and even someone who foolishly thinks a new employee on the train was the guilty party. Someone even suggested that because of the victim's Parkinson tremors, she mistakenly touched a door handle and while her hands were shaking, she somehow opened the door and fell out - somehow managing to close the door on her way out!!

At some point the police or GBI will determine what happened and then we can all sit back and see who was correct and who was not. Until then, continue to speculate. It is entertaining as hell!!

 

[Ryan]

It's still possible that someone saw the money when she was leaving with a tip.

And having $1000 in cash is not an indicator of someone's ability to pay for a bedroom, so lose your attitude about coach. Are you ever going to get around to substantiating your acquisition of a crew member, or are you just hoping that it'll quietly be forgotten?

Having $1,000.00 CLEARLY demonstrates the ability to buy a bedroom but does not demonstrate the willingness to buy a bedroom so drop the attitude with the other poster.

No, it doesn't. Doesn't even come close. You've got no idea what she was carrying that money for and the insistence that this is some kind of an indicator that they could have afforded a bedroom is rediculous. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on being ignorant of dlagura's attitude wrt to the kind of people that ride in coach on the rest.

You must still be sore from the whuppin the JMU Dukes put on the Hokies last Saturday.

I fail to see the relevance of the results of a football game to just about anything, other than trying to get a rise out of me. Reported.

 

[rrdude]

It's still possible that someone saw the money when she was leaving with a tip.

And having $1000 in cash is not an indicator of someone's ability to pay for a bedroom, so lose your attitude about coach. Are you ever going to get around to substantiating your acquisition of a crew member, or are you just hoping that it'll quietly be forgotten?

Having $1,000.00 CLEARLY demonstrates the ability to buy a bedroom but does not demonstrate the willingness to buy a bedroom so drop the attitude with the other poster.

No, it doesn't. Doesn't even come close. You've got no idea what she was carrying that money for and the insistence that this is some kind of an indicator that they could have afforded a bedroom is rediculous. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on being ignorant of dlagura's attitude wrt to the kind of people that ride in coach on the rest.

You must still be sore from the whuppin the JMU Dukes put on the Hokies last Saturday.

I fail to see the relevance of the results of a football game to just about anything, other than trying to get a rise out of me. Reported.

"Reported"? To who, and why? I got the joke Ryan. R U serious?

 

[haolerider]

It's still possible that someone saw the money when she was leaving with a tip.

And having $1000 in cash is not an indicator of someone's ability to pay for a bedroom, so lose your attitude about coach. Are you ever going to get around to substantiating your acquisition of a crew member, or are you just hoping that it'll quietly be forgotten?

Having $1,000.00 CLEARLY demonstrates the ability to buy a bedroom but does not demonstrate the willingness to buy a bedroom so drop the attitude with the other poster.

No, it doesn't. Doesn't even come close. You've got no idea what she was carrying that money for and the insistence that this is some kind of an indicator that they could have afforded a bedroom is rediculous. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on being ignorant of dlagura's attitude wrt to the kind of people that ride in coach on the rest.

You must still be sore from the whuppin the JMU Dukes put on the Hokies last Saturday.

I fail to see the relevance of the results of a football game to just about anything, other than trying to get a rise out of me. Reported.

"Reported"? To who, and why? I got the joke Ryan. R U serious?

"Wait until Dad gets home - you all will be sorry!"

 

[Big Iron]

In its simplest form a bedroom on the Auto Train does not cost $1,000.00 so having that amount in her possession is indicative of her being able to afford a bedroom should she have desired. You, as I, have no idea what her intentions were for the money so we'll never know if she desired a bedroom or not. Since she was travelling in coach, if its safe to assume, she decided her money was best spent elsewhere. Simply stating, with the facts known to us, that she did have the "ability" to purchase a bedroom.

I'll graciously accept your benefit of the doubt regarding coach passengers since, in my prior post, I made no mention of coach passengers, or coach travel in general.

 

[Big Iron]

It's still possible that someone saw the money when she was leaving with a tip.

And having $1000 in cash is not an indicator of someone's ability to pay for a bedroom, so lose your attitude about coach. Are you ever going to get around to substantiating your acquisition of a crew member, or are you just hoping that it'll quietly be forgotten?

Having $1,000.00 CLEARLY demonstrates the ability to buy a bedroom but does not demonstrate the willingness to buy a bedroom so drop the attitude with the other poster.

No, it doesn't. Doesn't even come close. You've got no idea what she was carrying that money for and the insistence that this is some kind of an indicator that they could have afforded a bedroom is rediculous. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt on being ignorant of dlagura's attitude wrt to the kind of people that ride in coach on the rest.

You must still be sore from the whuppin the JMU Dukes put on the Hokies last Saturday.

I fail to see the relevance of the results of a football game to just about anything, other than trying to get a rise out of me. Reported.

"Reported"? To who, and why? I got the joke Ryan. R U serious?

"Wait until Dad gets home - you all will be sorry!"

IM SORRY IM SORRRY. My poor Dad, put in a hard days work, coming home to be with his loving wife and kids only to be met at the door with a Mom that is mad as a hornet and three kids huddled in the corner waiting for the inevitible. Fond memories, thanks for the laugh!!!!!!!