BREAKING NEWS: Wisconsin Purchises Two Talgo Sets

[cpamtfan]

Wisconsin is reportadly purchesing two Talgo sets at $47 million a piece with ARRA money. I believe it has been announced on Jim Doyle's website. Never saw that coming in a million light years!

cpamtfan-Peter

 

[transit54]

See here:

http://news.google.com/news/more?um=1&...MqZFS-jvY_4s_uM

I wonder if they will be built to FRA Tier III standards or whether a waiver will be sought.

 

[jphjaxfl]

You will likely see more of these types of deals as the demand for rail passenger equipment increases. This is a win/win situation for WI, new trains and new jobs.

 

[oldtimer]

Does anyone know if the old Milwaukee Road Shops still exist? If so would they be available to use by Talgo.

 

[MrFSS]

Says they will run on the CHI - MKE route. I had hoped for a CHI - Madison train. Or, a Madison - MKE train. Maybe later.

 

[wayman]

You will likely see more of these types of deals as the demand for rail passenger equipment increases. This is a win/win situation for WI, new trains and new jobs.

It's also a win for Amtrak, since they'll presumably get to use the Horizon cars (?) currently on the Hiawatha elsewhere in the system. It wouldn't look pretty, and it wouldn't ride nearly as nicely as an Amfleet, but at times of capacity-crunch (holidays, whatever) they could toss an extra coach on the Silvers or the Crescent or the Lake Shore or the Cardinal...

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

You will likely see more of these types of deals as the demand for rail passenger equipment increases. This is a win/win situation for WI, new trains and new jobs.

It's also a win for Amtrak, since they'll presumably get to use the Horizon cars (?) currently on the Hiawatha elsewhere in the system. It wouldn't look pretty, and it wouldn't ride nearly as nicely as an Amfleet, but at times of capacity-crunch (holidays, whatever) they could toss an extra coach on the Silvers or the Crescent or the Lake Shore or the Cardinal...

The Horizons aren't designed for long distance service-- they're very tight and would need refurbished to go on those LD trains. I would never pay any amount of money to ride from WAS to MIA in a Horizon!

As for the Talgos... eh, whatever get's Wisconsin what it wants. I just don't understand why they want Talgos as opposed to more traditional coaches that are lying around... Is Amtrak going to run these sets in lieu of the Horizons on Hiawatha service? Same route, Wisconsin bought consists?

 

[transit54]

You will likely see more of these types of deals as the demand for rail passenger equipment increases. This is a win/win situation for WI, new trains and new jobs.

It's also a win for Amtrak, since they'll presumably get to use the Horizon cars (?) currently on the Hiawatha elsewhere in the system. It wouldn't look pretty, and it wouldn't ride nearly as nicely as an Amfleet, but at times of capacity-crunch (holidays, whatever) they could toss an extra coach on the Silvers or the Crescent or the Lake Shore or the Cardinal...

The Horizons aren't designed for long distance service-- they're very tight and would need refurbished to go on those LD trains. I would never pay any amount of money to ride from WAS to MIA in a Horizon!

As for the Talgos... eh, whatever get's Wisconsin what it wants. I just don't understand why they want Talgos as opposed to more traditional coaches that are lying around... Is Amtrak going to run these sets in lieu of the Horizons on Hiawatha service? Same route, Wisconsin bought consists?

I'm betting it will reduce their operating costs substantially as Amtrak won't be charging them to use its equipment. It's very difficult to get federal money for operating costs, but it isn't hard to obtain federal money for capital projects. WI saw an opportunity - grab some stimulus funds (i.e. free money) to build itself new trainsets will which 1) provide additional WI jobs and 2) reduce yearly operating costs of Amtrak service, an expense paid fully by the state. It's a smart move as far as I can see.

 

[frj1983]

The key is, I also think, the 80 jobs it will produce...even if it's only for a short time

I wonder where they will be assembled?

Yeahh for my home State!

 

[MrFSS]

The key is, I also think, the 80 jobs it will produce...even if it's only for a short time
I wonder where they will be assembled?

Yeahh for my home State!

See THIS story.

Looks like Janesville may get the business and they are talking about Madison to Milwaukee service, too.

 

[MattW]

Ok, so they're establishing this assembly plant to produce more than just a few trainsets so they can be delivered around the country. What are the chance of perhaps a rail startup like maybe...Georgia wanting to buy some sets to use on a system of some kind? (yes, read my sig)

 

[jphjaxfl]

Wisconsin has also discussed extending some of the Hiawathas to Green Bay which would make a lot of sense.

 

[MikefromCrete]

Wisconsin has also discussed extending some of the Hiawathas to Green Bay which would make a lot of sense.

The news reports indicate that the Talgos would be used Chicago-Milwaukee-Madison if that route is approved for high speed funding (which will probably happen, as part of the Midwest High Speed Initiative). Two train sets could handle the existing Chicago-Milwaukee service, with perhaps a stand by Horizon set for maintenance times. The Horizons could be used on the existing Illinois service until new equipment is acquired for that purpose and then the cars could be used for the proposed Chicago-Rockford-Dubuque and Chicago-Quad Cities (on to Iowa) routes under consideration. Illinois Gov. Pat Quinn just signed a capital improvements bill that provides money for high speed rail and for CREATE projects in the Chicago area which would expedite freight and passenger trains through the nation's rail capital. Most of the funding for this bill comes from legalizing video poker machines in bars.

Although bi-level California-type cars have long been the favored equipment for Illinois high speed service, this might put Talgo in a better position to build trainsets for the entire Midwest system.

The Talgos purchase just came out of nowhere. I'm really surprised to see Wisconsin act on this. They've been taking about commuter rail from Kenosha to Milwaukee and Milwaukee light rail for years without any progress.

I can hardly wait for their arrival.

 

[DET63]

A fly in the ointment?

GOP lawmaker critical of trains purchase
Saturday, July 18, 2009, 4:00 AM

By Bob Hague

Not everyone is ready to climb aboard Governor Jim Doyle's new $47 million dollar Spanish train sets. "This is the out of control spending that has our country in this financial mess in the first place. We are all going wind up spending the rest of our lives repaying our debt to the Chinese," says State Senator Glenn Grothman, a Republican who serves on the Senate transportation committee.

 

"Everywhere we go, we hear that we have too high taxes here, and sometimes we have complaints that some services have already been cut. There is already Hiawatha service, as well as Greyhound bus service, between Milwaukee and Chicago," says Grothman. The trains, built by the Spanish firm Talgo, will replace Amtrak's existing Hiawatha trains when high speed service begins on that route in 2011.

Link

Grothman prefers buses.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

A fly in the ointment?

If that's what you care to call a toothless whiner.

Betcha NC will buy a buncha these.

 

[Long Train Runnin']

This is GREAT NEWS! I want to ride on a Talgo set its just getting out to the west coast I can easily make it Chicago though! A good day for all!

 

[MikefromCrete]

A fly in the ointment?

GOP lawmaker critical of trains purchase
Saturday, July 18, 2009, 4:00 AM

By Bob Hague

Not everyone is ready to climb aboard Governor Jim Doyle's new $47 million dollar Spanish train sets. "This is the out of control spending that has our country in this financial mess in the first place. We are all going wind up spending the rest of our lives repaying our debt to the Chinese," says State Senator Glenn Grothman, a Republican who serves on the Senate transportation committee.

 

"Everywhere we go, we hear that we have too high taxes here, and sometimes we have complaints that some services have already been cut. There is already Hiawatha service, as well as Greyhound bus service, between Milwaukee and Chicago," says Grothman. The trains, built by the Spanish firm Talgo, will replace Amtrak's existing Hiawatha trains when high speed service begins on that route in 2011.

Link

Grothman prefers buses.

What an *****.

 

[sechs]

I wonder if they will be built to FRA Tier III standards or whether a waiver will be sought.

The Talgo America website states that their Series VIII cars "will be fully FRA compliant."
What are they going to be using to pull these things around?

 

[battalion51]

IIRC the Horizon fleet is cleared to operate at 110 MPH. So even if the Talgos aren't online or are in need of servicing you can still operate a Horizon set in its place. I do have to think though that these trains will work just like their Cascades counterparts and have a diesel on one end (P-42 for these guys) and a Cabbage on the other. In all likelihood though you'll probably see a special paint scheme on these trains, so you'll likely see a few motors and Cabbages painted to match the set. Possibly a use for the rehabbed P-40's? Still awesome news regardless.

 

[Green Maned Lion]

IIRC the Horizon fleet is cleared to operate at 110 MPH. So even if the Talgos aren't online or are in need of servicing you can still operate a Horizon set in its place. I do have to think though that these trains will work just like their Cascades counterparts and have a diesel on one end (P-42 for these guys) and a Cabbage on the other. In all likelihood though you'll probably see a special paint scheme on these trains, so you'll likely see a few motors and Cabbages painted to match the set. Possibly a use for the rehabbed P-40's? Still awesome news regardless.

They are supposedly cleared for 125- they were intended to supplement the Amfleets - but Amtrak has internal restrictions to 90 mph (E60s were the fastest engines to haul them) due to stability problems at speed.

 

[cpamtfan]

This is GREAT NEWS! I want to ride on a Talgo set its just getting out to the west coast I can easily make it Chicago though! A good day for all!

Same for me!

 

[VT Hokie]

What about the arguments about a unique small fleet, the need for dedicated spare parts and additional training, the fixed consist nature of the train, etc.? Those are always used as arguments against the Turboliners, Acela, etc.

But I think this is definitely good news, as long as Amtrak doesn't steal the trains and haul 'em off to Delaware!

 

[BigBlueBuddha]

But I think this is definitely good news, as long as Amtrak doesn't steal the trains and haul 'em off to Delaware!

The trains will be owned by the state of Wisconsin, not Amtrak:

"They would replace aging trains on Amtrak’s Hiawatha line between Milwaukee and Chicago, which Wisconsin and Illinois pay for Amtrak to operate, about $7 million last year. Klein said the state’s costs would go down because it would own the trains rather than use Amtrak’s."

See full article here: Wisconsin State Journal

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

But I think this is definitely good news, as long as Amtrak doesn't steal the trains and haul 'em off to Delaware!

The trains will be owned by the state of Wisconsin, not Amtrak:

"They would replace aging trains on Amtrak’s Hiawatha line between Milwaukee and Chicago, which Wisconsin and Illinois pay for Amtrak to operate, about $7 million last year. Klein said the state’s costs would go down because it would own the trains rather than use Amtrak’s."

See full article here: Wisconsin State Journal

The Turboliners were owned by NYS.

 

[bretton88]

Woohoo! Go Wisconsin! The addition of TALGOs will definitely upgrade the level of service on the Hiawathas. Question though, will the Talgos have a cafe car? I believe the ones in WA do.