Buying 2 coach seats for 1 person?

[Ryan]

Going west, absolutely - if you were assigned to the wrong coach and were headed to PDX, you could end up in Seattle!

Going east, if you board after Spokane, I'm not sure that it matters...

 

[Ispolkom]

East of Spokane, you're boarded by destination, regardless of what train number your ticket has. For instance, if I'm traveling from St. Paul to Minot, I'll usually be assigned to a Portland coach, even if I've bought a ticket on #7. Another example: a ticket on #808 between St. Paul and Milwaukee is often cheaper than on #8 or #28, but I've never been assigned to the extra St. Paul-Chicago coach when I've had a ticket on #808 to Milwaukee.

 

[Guest]

I have heard of "a person of size" on some airline (I forget which) that was required to buy 2 seats. The airline assigned him something like seats 15-C and 23-D!

In the last episode of BBC's new mockumentary "Come Fly With Me" they poke fun at just that situation. I am sure some of the plane haters out there would love this show.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

First you accuse single travelers of being antisocial by trying to avoid being paired up with other strangers. Then you turn around and accuse them of plotting to get closer to children.

You're making stuff up again, I've seen Dave say neither of these things. Stop constructing strawmen.

I'm just trying to understand what Dave's problem is. Apparently nobody knows. Including Dave.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

First you accuse single travelers of being antisocial by trying to avoid being paired up with other strangers. Then you turn around and accuse them of plotting to get closer to children.

You're making stuff up again, I've seen Dave say neither of these things. Stop constructing strawmen.

I'm just trying to understand what Dave's problem is. Apparently nobody knows. Including Dave.

Oh shove off Dave already, pick on someone your own size Dax.

 

[Ryan]

First you accuse single travelers of being antisocial by trying to avoid being paired up with other strangers. Then you turn around and accuse them of plotting to get closer to children.

You're making stuff up again, I've seen Dave say neither of these things. Stop constructing strawmen.

I'm just trying to understand what Dave's problem is. Apparently nobody knows. Including Dave.

Oh shove off Dave already, pick on someone your own size Dax.

Indeed. Looks like Dave's only problem is you trying to pick a fight with him.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I didn't even know internet users had a "size."

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

Only their egos...

 

[PennCentralFan]

If someone buys two seats they are entitled to the space of two seats. Now I don't think there has to be a promise that the seats are together. Since amtrak does not assign specific seats you can't complain if you get two seats that are apart. From what I've seen if you're that anti-social you should get a roomette since it appears the price is cheaper or not that much more expensive when you consider the meals.

What really bothers me are people who buy one seat and then put their bag in the other seat so they can have a seat next to themselves and to discourage people from sitting next to them. That is plain rude.

 

[chandj]

What really bothers me are people who buy one seat and then put their bag in the other seat so they can have a seat next to themselves and to discourage people from sitting next to them. That is plain rude.

Me too--I see this frequently and it is really, really rude.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Now I don't think there has to be a promise that the seats are together. Since amtrak does not assign specific seats you can't complain if you get two seats that are apart.

What nobody has been able to explain to me is how Amtrak benefits from giving the same person two seats in completely different areas. Why would Amtrak do that? Why shouldn't anyone complain about this if they did? It's true that most domestic airlines do allow specific seat reservations and yet there is still no guarantee that you'll get the seat you're ticketed in. Nonetheless I still get that seat 99.9% of the time even without the guarantee. I presume this is because there is no obvious benefit for the airline to intentionally screw with us, just as there would be no obvious benefit for Amtrak to screw with someone willing to pay for multiple seats. Worst case for Amtrak is that they have to take a minute or two of asking people to move around and suddenly the two or more seats are together. Its like this thread is being fielded by people who can't comprehend that Amtrak has nothing to gain from screwing with their best coach customers just because they can.

From what I've seen if you're that anti-social you should get a roomette since it appears the price is cheaper or not that much more expensive when you consider the meals.

What if I buy two seats and then invite someone with good hygiene and an interesting personality to come sit with me, does that still mean I'm being anti-social since I bought two seats just for me? Some of us love to chat with strangers or new found friends, but we also like to weed out the uneducated/smelly/boring types first. We don't expect Amtrak to do that for us; we just want the ability to do it for ourselves with our own money. The very basis of capitalism in action, I would think.

What really bothers me are people who buy one seat and then put their bag in the other seat so they can have a seat next to themselves and to discourage people from sitting next to them. That is plain rude.

If this is what really bothers you then why aren't you thrilled that Amtrak would offer these folks the chance to pay for both seats? It seems as though you're bashing both the root of the problem and the most reasonable solution to said problem. I think we all know that not every roomette will be as cheap as two coach seats, nor will there be a roomette at any price for every single coach customer who doesn't want to sit or sleep hip-to-hip for hours on end with a total stranger.

 

[LA Resident]

What really bothers me are people who buy one seat and then put their bag in the other seat so they can have a seat next to themselves and to discourage people from sitting next to them. That is plain rude.

Me too--I see this frequently and it is really, really rude.

You both would not be surprised to know that this happens on a daily basis on the afternoon Surfliners south from LA to San Diego, as many commuters board two departures in particular (and Metrolink monthly pass holders can take the Amtrak as well).

While it galls me to no end, I always count to 10, then ask politely if the seat is taken. I've gotten a few dismayed looks, but no one has ever said that their briefcase, or Starbucks cup, or whatever, takes precedence. For sure, they don't want someone calling the conductor over. I guess it's just human nature. I don't usually chat with these people; we both just sit there separately and do business, or nap, or eat. Now if Amtrak offered all passengers the chance to buy two seats and put anything they wanted in the second seat, they probably could make some money off of it because there are some incredibly unsocial people around--or people who think they need a five-feet buffer between them and their fellow human beings or believe their "stuff" is better than "people." hboy:

 

[Ispolkom]

Is there any public transportation system where this doesn't happen? As a large and intimidating man, I feel it's my duty to always choose to sit next to some one who has placed his stuff on a seat. I haven't gotten shanked yet.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Is there any public transportation system where this doesn't happen?

Those that have assigned seating? Seems like Amtrak could offer it if they really had a problem with this.

As a large and intimidating man, I feel it's my duty to always choose to sit next to some one who has placed his stuff on a seat. I haven't gotten shanked yet.

That explains so much.

 

[AlanB]

So um... I heard that Amtrak cancels a ticket if the ticketholder does not board the train at their station. Even if two seats are booked in the same name there will only be one person by that name boarding the train. Doesn't that mean the other ticket would/could be cancelled?

I'm not sure where you heard that, but it is most certainly not true. At least at present, things may change when Amtrak finally gets e-tickets, Amtrak has no way of knowing if someone showed up to board the train in coach. In a sleeper, it is easier for them to know, since the attendant keeps track of who boards and informs the conductor that a passenger no-showed. In that case the sleeper can be resold.

But again, in coach, Amtrak has no way of knowing that someone no showed while the train is in transit.

However, in the scenario being talked about here, the passenger with two tickets would have to turn both in to the conductor to have any hope of keeping both seats. Therefore, even though the second ticket is for a non-person, they still didn't no show as far as Amtrak is concerned. Amtrak collected both tickets and got the revenue for them so even if they did know who had showed up, and again they don't, as far as Amtrak is concerned both people did show up.

 

[wyo_nat]

Hi there....FYI - I did try to purchase two tickets last year, and was quickly shot down by Amtrak. Unfortunately, I have stopped taking the train because of this. If they change their policy to allow folks to occupy as many seats as they purchase, I'd come back.

Here's an email thread between me and Amtrak that occurred when I asked customer support why they would not allow this:

WARNING - LONG

---------------

Dear XXXXXX,

Thank you for contacting us.

We will not, book two seats for a passenger simply

because he or she does not want anyone sitting next to him

or her. If the train is full it is very hard to explain to

someone who is standing why that empty seat cannot be used.

Such a passenger has other options which in many cases may

be cheaper: day use of a sleeping car room, first class

seating (and sit in a single seat), travel during a time

when ridership is light, etc.

We hope that this information will assist you.

Sincerely,

Diane

Amtrak Customer Service

Amtrak.com | Stations | Routes | Deals | Plan a Trip | Help

Amtrak is a registered service mark of the National Railroad Passenger Corporation.

--Original Message--

From: XXXXXXX

Date: 6/4/2010 9:54:35 AM

To: [email protected]

Subject: New Reservation Questions

Message:

Hi there, I am planning to take the train from Cary, NC to Fort Myers, FL on 07/16/10 and 07/20/10. I'll be traveling alone on the Silver Star, and wanted to purchase two coach class seats to give me a little more room to stretch out and sleep during the long trip. When I purchased the ticket at the Durham Station, I was told that one person could not purchase/occupy two seats...that it was against policy. I guess I'm curious why Amtrak would refuse the extra revenue offered by a customer that is willing to pay extra for the guarantee to have two seats. If there is no such policy, please let me know, so I can purchase the extra seat for my upcoming trip. Alternatively, if there is indeed a one person/one seat policy please explain why such a policy is in place, because it makes no sense to me, a customer who is willing to pay extra for a little more comfort. I've ridden the train many times before in the past, and have seen folks "pretend" to be sound asleep in order not to be bothered into giving up a second seat, and I'm willing to actually pay extra. I really enjoy taking the train, and often purchase sleeper accommodations. However, it can be cost prohibitive to always take a sleeper (especially when I also have the option of air travel). Please explain the one person/one seat policy to me, or let me know if it's okay to purchase the second seat. Thanks,

 

[Devil's Advocate]

We will not, book two seats for a passenger simply because he or she does not want anyone sitting next to him or her. If the train is full it is very hard to explain to someone who is standing why that empty seat cannot be used.

It's hard to say "he bought two tickets?"

The truly hard part is trying to understand how Diane thinks buying a half-day's worth of a sleeper compartment helps when there are no compartments left. Or how your daytime compartment would help keep a complete stranger from snuggling up to you and slobbering on your shoulder while you sleep with nothing between you all night. Or why she apparently thinks people who want to sit alone are supposed to just know which cars of which trains will eventually fill up and which ones will not at booking time.

Basically Amtrak has substituted a series of barely comprehensible platitudes where a single policy change would be both easy and simple to understand.

AMTRAK FAIL

 

[amamba]

I thought amtrak didn't oversell their trains like planes do? It seriously makes no sense that one is not able to purchase two coach seats if one doesn't want to have a companion next to them. I really do think amtrak should revise this policy so that is it more in line with the airlines. Southwest will let ANYONE - a "customer of size" or just any person - purchase two seats in order to have the seat next to them available. And since southwest doesn't have assigned seating, it sounds just like amtrak in the coaches to me.

 

[dlagrua]

Here is the concern in a nutshell. All seats on the train are taken and there is an individual sitting next to an empty seat. Someone standing wants to sit and asks for the seat. The guy that purchased the two seats then refuses the passenger the seat. The passenger becomes incensed by the refusal and a heated exchange of words ultimately results in a fist fight.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Here is the concern in a nutshell. All seats on the train are taken and there is an individual sitting next to an empty seat. Someone standing wants to sit and asks for the seat. The guy that purchased the two seats then refuses the passenger the seat. The passenger becomes incensed by the refusal and a heated exchange of words ultimately results in a fist fight.

I have no idea about how things work on the NEC, but out here on the LD network I was under the impression that Amtrak does not oversell their tickets to the point that there is standing room only? I don't think most folks would be upset if they continue to refuse to sell/honor multiple tickets on a commuter run but why would they refuse to sell/honor them on a 1:1 ratio LD trip? That's the part I still don't understand and nothing posted in this thread seems to explain their reasoning in that context.

 

[chandj]

I have enjoyed this thread. I do hope the OP gets back on and tells us what happened with his in-law. Did she buy the two seats, take a roomette, stay home?? Inquiring minds want to know. I saw above that Wyo-nat documented an unsuccessful attempt to purchase 2 seats for 1 person--but with Amtrak if I don't like the first answer I call back and try with someone else, so I'm still not sure the 2 tickets for one person can't be done. I should think Amtrak would give a falling fig less if one pax wants to buy 2 seats as long as he/she knows they are not guaranteed to be available side-by-side. Sometimes I would like to keep the seat next to me open by purchasing it, but I'm pretty sure I wouldn't have the nerve to hang on to my empty seat if other passengers looking for seats were giving me the evil eye.

 

[AlanB]

Here is the concern in a nutshell. All seats on the train are taken and there is an individual sitting next to an empty seat. Someone standing wants to sit and asks for the seat. The guy that purchased the two seats then refuses the passenger the seat. The passenger becomes incensed by the refusal and a heated exchange of words ultimately results in a fist fight.

I have no idea about how things work on the NEC, but out here on the LD network I was under the impression that Amtrak does not oversell their tickets to the point that there is standing room only? I don't think most folks would be upset if they continue to refuse to sell/honor multiple tickets on a commuter run but why would they refuse to sell/honor them on a 1:1 ratio LD trip? That's the part I still don't understand and nothing posted in this thread seems to explain their reasoning in that context.

Dax,

I don't understand either. Amtrak isn't supposed to be overselling the LD's, so I agree it really shouldn't matter if someone wants to buy two seats. In fact, Amtrak would even be saving a tiny bit on fuel, with less weight on the train to haul. Probably not measurable, but still.

Now in the case of problems where somehow the train does get overloaded, then the conductor simply says "I'm sorry, but I have to have that seat and I'll arrange a refund for you."

Frankly about the only reason that I can think of for such a rule is that Amtrak doesn't want to have to try to explain to other passengers why so and so still has an empty seat next to them when every other seat on the train is taken; and that's a rather lame excuse IMHO, but I'm throwing it out there anyhow.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Only time Ive seen a LD Train Over Sold as to Coach Seats was on the CONO from CHI-NOL where the Conductor sold Tickets for a few pax to hang out in the Club Car part of the CCC where they proceeded to drink Beer from the Cafe. The Conductor did seem to know these folks, they got on South of Memphis somewhere in the Delta and rode to New Orleans. Of course there was one mix-up where someone was in my Roomette when I boarded the Eagle in San Marcos (they got on in SAS) but all ended well, I was upgraded to Bedroom E for Free with help of a very good SCA and friendly Conductor!, so did I complain, actually Hell No! Good tip for the SCA for sure!

 

[dlagrua]

During the heavy snow storms here this winter the NEC Regionals and Acela trains were vastly oversold. People were standing everywhere. I've even taken the regional from PHL to WAS in good weather on a Saturday when all seats in the cafe car were taken and there were quite a few people standing in the coaches as well. It would seem that Amtrak oversells on the day( several hour) routes but not the the LD routes. I cannot imaging anyone traveling on the EB, CZ, SM, CL or any other long route standing.

 

[sttsxm]

The conductor on 67 at o-dark-thirty this AM said to get up and stop laying across the seats but, if you wanted to he would be willing to sell people another ticket so they could have 2 seats....that train was packed, but 67 a couple days ago from BOS to WAS had MAYBE 6 people in the quiet car the whole way......at least the conductors didn't say the train was full when it wasn't.