California Zephyr discussion 2024 H2 - 2025

[pennyk]

I'm ok with the roomette, but if you are solo, you can have the SCA take the upper mattress to double up.

I believe she may be traveling with a friend, so doubling the mattress may not be an option. Thanks.

 

[Bob Dylan]

For fear of heights, closing the curtains might help. I think that’s what @Mystic River Dragon did when she took the Empire Builder to a Gathering.

I don’t recall having any altitude issues on any trains.

The only Altitude Issues on Superliner Trains is the Toliets usually stop working!

 

[Cal]

1. Since she is somewhat afraid of heights, how can she make the best of this trip. Have others, who are afraid of heights, had issues with the CZ westbound?

The Zephyr, as someone said earlier, is rarely "on the edge". However if she feels too anxious I would just tell her to close her curtains and take a nap, or read a book. Anything that is not looking out.

4. Can the roomette be made more comfortable (YouTube videos show very flat mattresses)?

If she is travelling solo I would say use both mattresses, which apparently helps (I haven't tried this, but a friend of mine has and said it was better).

 

[Trainiac]

They don't want pedestrians crossing the Powell bridge with the street, they do have a separate walkway for pedestrians. I was there over the summer, stayed at the Hyatt, and used the elevator and bridge across, Zephyr is there during morning and afternoon hours, I thought it was ok. Uber wanted a rip off price.

Stayed there last night, wasn't any problems with anyone or anything. My CZ was 3 hours late getting in so around 8pm, walked right from the train to the elevator to go up to the foot bridge. Yes there is an elevator, a smelly one. The only person I encountered crossing was a guy with a bike, walked past and didn't have any problem.

In the morning getting back, a bunch of joggers were using the stairs and stuff and jogging around no problems. It's very convenient and I'm not much of a walker myself, but YMMV.

 

[Cal]

Stayed there last night, wasn't any problems with anyone or anything. My CZ was 3 hours late getting in so around 8pm, walked right from the train to the elevator to go up to the foot bridge. Yes there is an elevator, a smelly one. The only person I encountered crossing was a guy with a bike, walked past and didn't have any problem.

In the morning getting back, a bunch of joggers were using the stairs and stuff and jogging around no problems. It's very convenient and I'm not much of a walker myself, but YMMV.

Pretty much matches my experience. Wasn't the cleanest bridge, but I didn't feel unsafe. I walked over after my #5 got in at around 7, and later at like 9 when #14 was there.

 

[west point]

Tell her to not look out the window when she hears the car go over a bridge. Also when locking out windows a little practice will indicate when most bridges are about to be crossed. Anyone remember what and where major bridge crossing occur I don't?

 

[MccfamschoolMom]

If she is travelling solo I would say use both mattresses, which apparently helps (I haven't tried this, but a friend of mine has and said it was better).

I've heard of some Amtrak travelers using a backpacker's sleeping mat on top of the mattress (I had one in my Amazon wishlist, so I must have heard it mentioned in a YouTube video). One has to consider whether or not it would be worthwhile adding that to one's luggage, though. I've also heard of people bringing along a neck pillow or a small travel pillow to supplement what Amtrak provides, and that seems to be a more common practice.

 

[Barb Stout]

2. Is it likely she will get "mountain sickness" since she has always lived at or below sea level in a coastal area? Are there any tips to mitigate or prevent this?

Before a trip to Peru, I looked into altitude sickness and this is some of what I found out.
1) It is unpredictable who will fall prey to it and when. Some people have been at altitude many times and then the 8th time (for example), they are hit with mountain sickness and vice versa.
2) There are medications one can take to prevent it, but they are prescription. I couldn't get into my cardiologist (I have certain conditions that I thought might change the calculus) in time to get a prescription. It turned out fine, but I couldn't walk very far at 14,000 feet. See point 5.
3) Everyone at altitude should drink plenty of water.
4) Avoid alcohol. It will affect you negatively much sooner than the same amount at lower altitudes.
5) Most people wouldn't get altitude sickness at the altitude of the California Zephyr, but many people will feel more tired, sleepier, and weaker at such altitudes. Gravity may be stronger ; )

 

[Willbridge]

Before a trip to Peru, I looked into altitude sickness and this is some of what I found out.
1) It is unpredictable who will fall prey to it and when. Some people have been at altitude many times and then the 8th time (for example), they are hit with mountain sickness and vice versa.
2) There are medications one can take to prevent it, but they are prescription. I couldn't get into my cardiologist (I have certain conditions that I thought might change the calculus) in time to get a prescription. It turned out fine, but I couldn't walk very far at 14,000 feet. See point 5.
3) Everyone at altitude should drink plenty of water.
4) Avoid alcohol. It will affect you negatively much sooner than the same amount at lower altitudes.
5) Most people wouldn't get altitude sickness at the altitude of the California Zephyr, but many people will feel more tired, sleepier, and weaker at such altitudes. Gravity may be stronger ; )

Because the train makes a steady climb, passengers have a chance to adjust for the altitude. It's more of a problem on the highways and as noted in #1 above actual altitude sickness is hard to predict.

 

[GariYaMoshi]

The Zephyr, as someone said earlier, is rarely "on the edge". However if she feels too anxious I would just tell her to close her curtains and take a nap, or read a book. Anything that is not looking out.


If she is travelling solo I would say use both mattresses, which apparently helps (I haven't tried this, but a friend of mine has and said it was better).

We doubled up the mattresses and slept on the bottom bunk only of the bedroom. It helped a bit. I would consider taking an inflatable sleeping pad next time.

 

[MARC Rider]

Because the train makes a steady climb, passengers have a chance to adjust for the altitude. It's more of a problem on the highways and as noted in #1 above actual altitude sickness is hard to predict.

The high point on the whole run is the Moffatt Tunnel at 9 thousand and something feet. The high point on the Donner pass is 7 thousand something feet. As was mentioned before, most cabin pressure in airliners is the equivalent of about 8,000 feet. I don't know how much of the Zephyr route is above 8,000 feet, but it can't be a very long distance or duration.

 

[George Harris]

Here is some information thanks to formula and data in a web site called Engineer’s Tool Box plus elevations from a Union Pacific Map of high and low elevations per division and Google for the various city elevations. I threw in the boiling temperature of water for my own curiosity. I am not throwing in mileposts because I do not have that information handy.

Elevation / Air Pressure / % of sea level / water boil temp / place name
Feet ........./ .........psi .........../....... %............... /......... Deg F ............/
......-0-...... / ......14.70 ........./ ....100% .........../ .........212 .............../ Sea Level
.......26...... / ......14.68......... / ......99.9% ......../ .........211.9 .........../ Sacramento CA
..6,887 ...../ ......11.39......... / ......77.5% ......./ ..........198.9 .........../ Donner Pass Tunnel
..5,936 ...../ ......11.81......... / .......80.3% ....../ ..........200.7 .........../ Donner Lake
..4,265 ...../ ......12.57 ........./ .......85.5% ....../ ..........203.8 .........../ Salt Lake City UT
..9,239 ...../ ......10.41 ........./ .......70.8% ......./ .........194.6 ............/ Moffet Tunnel
..5,280 ...../ ......12.10 ......../ ........82.3% ....../ ..........201.9 ............/ Denver CO
......680 ..../ .......14.34 ......../ ........97.6% ....../ ..........210.6 .........../ Chicago IL

You could very well feel your ears popping on the major climbs. I used to have that experience from time to time going over Racoon Mountain which is just east of Chattanooga on the Tennessean, and the elevation difference is way less than you have here. Incidentally the grade on that route was 1.4% and the train speed around 35 mph. over it. Don't recall the elevation difference.

 

[west point]

Mr. Harris. Find the different boiling temperatures interesting. Any idea just how that affects steam engines performance. Any difference. Would think that a slightly larger firebox needed to support same sea level combustion since oxygen partial pressure is also slightly less.

 

[UserNameRequired]

A generic item private pilots are taught is to try to use 500 feet per minute for climb/descent, with one of the several reasons being passenger comfort. Small children are known to be more sensitive to that number and it may be a good idea to reduce that rate for their comfort if you can. There are probably several techniques to help with ear pain, the only one I remember at the moment is chew some gum.

 

[AniAni]

Here is some information thanks to formula and data in a web site called Engineer’s Tool Box plus elevations from a Union Pacific Map of high and low elevations per division and Google for the various city elevations. I threw in the boiling temperature of water for my own curiosity. I am not throwing in mileposts because I do not have that information handy.

Elevation / Air Pressure / % of sea level / water boil temp / place name
Feet ........./ .........psi .........../....... %............... /......... Deg F ............/
......-0-...... / ......14.70 ........./ ....100% .........../ .........212 .............../ Sea Level
.......26...... / ......14.68......... / ......99.9% ......../ .........211.9 .........../ Sacramento CA
..6,887 ...../ ......11.39......... / ......77.5% ......./ ..........198.9 .........../ Donner Pass Tunnel
..5,936 ...../ ......11.81......... / .......80.3% ....../ ..........200.7 .........../ Donner Lake
..4,265 ...../ ......12.57 ........./ .......85.5% ....../ ..........203.8 .........../ Salt Lake City UT
..9,239 ...../ ......10.41 ........./ .......70.8% ......./ .........194.6 ............/ Moffet Tunnel
..5,280 ...../ ......12.10 ......../ ........82.3% ....../ ..........201.9 ............/ Denver CO
......680 ..../ .......14.34 ......../ ........97.6% ....../ ..........210.6 .........../ Chicago IL

You could very well feel your ears popping on the major climbs. I used to have that experience from time to time going over Racoon Mountain which is just east of Chattanooga on the Tennessean, and the elevation difference is way less than you have here. Incidentally the grade on that route was 1.4% and the train speed around 35 mph. over it. Don't recall the elevation difference.

That's the next trip we have planned. All good info. Thank you!

 

[Siegmund]

I don't know how much of the Zephyr route is above 8,000 feet, but it can't be a very long distance or duration.

From just east of Granby to just west of Pinecliffe (more or less the top of the a short-tunnel-every-minute section of the climb), about 39 rail miles, probably just shy of 2 hours.

The climb is slow enough -- less than 100 feet per minute -- that ear popping should not be frequent. But "acclimating" takes several days, so someone who has trouble at 8,000 feet won't enjoy those 2 hours.

 

[Stevenz]

(Ear popping and altitude sickness are unrelated phenomena. And climbing at a rate of 100’/min gives a rate of 6000’/hour. I like to see that.)

The climb to the Moffat Tunnel actually does take a couple of days and is very gradual. What is the max grade, 2%, 3%? After all, if you start in Chicago at +/- 600 feet you are climbing all the way across the plains to whichever high point, with stops along the way. There should be no problem with altitude sickness. And I would think that if there was, lots of people on this forum would know of cases from the century or so of transcontinental rail travel but no one has mentioned any.

I don’t think the person who wants to take this trip has to worry about it at all. It should be a relaxing, memorable experience which I will bet she will want to do again.

 

[Willbridge]

Here is some information thanks to formula and data in a web site called Engineer’s Tool Box plus elevations from a Union Pacific Map of high and low elevations per division and Google for the various city elevations. I threw in the boiling temperature of water for my own curiosity. I am not throwing in mileposts because I do not have that information handy.

Elevation / Air Pressure / % of sea level / water boil temp / place name
Feet ........./ .........psi .........../....... %............... /......... Deg F ............/
......-0-...... / ......14.70 ........./ ....100% .........../ .........212 .............../ Sea Level
.......26...... / ......14.68......... / ......99.9% ......../ .........211.9 .........../ Sacramento CA
..6,887 ...../ ......11.39......... / ......77.5% ......./ ..........198.9 .........../ Donner Pass Tunnel
..5,936 ...../ ......11.81......... / .......80.3% ....../ ..........200.7 .........../ Donner Lake
..4,265 ...../ ......12.57 ........./ .......85.5% ....../ ..........203.8 .........../ Salt Lake City UT
..9,239 ...../ ......10.41 ........./ .......70.8% ......./ .........194.6 ............/ Moffet Tunnel
..5,280 ...../ ......12.10 ......../ ........82.3% ....../ ..........201.9 ............/ Denver CO
......680 ..../ .......14.34 ......../ ........97.6% ....../ ..........210.6 .........../ Chicago IL

You could very well feel your ears popping on the major climbs. I used to have that experience from time to time going over Racoon Mountain which is just east of Chattanooga on the Tennessean, and the elevation difference is way less than you have here. Incidentally the grade on that route was 1.4% and the train speed around 35 mph. over it. Don't recall the elevation difference.

A piece pf UP trivia: Denver Union Station elevation was 5,188 ft in UP public timetables until the mid-1960's and then it suddenly jumped to 5,280. A government survey marker on the building confirms that. Actually, all of downtown Denver is below 5,280. A marker on the steps of the state capitol building, above downtown, grabs the "Mile High" title.

 

[George Harris]

(Ear popping and altitude sickness are unrelated phenomena. And climbing at a rate of 100’/min gives a rate of 6000’/hour. I like to see that.)

The climb to the Moffat Tunnel actually does take a couple of days and is very gradual. What is the max grade, 2%, 3%? After all, if you start in Chicago at +/- 600 feet you are climbing all the way across the plains to whichever high point, with stops along the way. There should be no problem with altitude sickness. And I would think that if there was, lots of people on this forum would know of cases from the century or so of transcontinental rail travel but no one has mentioned any.

I don’t think the person who wants to take this trip has to worry about it at all. It should be a relaxing, memorable experience which I will bet she will want to do again.

Of course ear popping and altitude sickness are quite different things.

The climb from Chicago to Denver is gradual, but the climb from Denver to the Moffett Tunnel is anything but gradual. Same thing in the other direction. The climb out of Emeryville to Sacramento is near zero, but once you start up the hill to Donner Pass the rest of that climb is anything but gradual. In fact, the change of elevation bottom to top of grade Sacramento to Donner is significantly larger than that between Denver and Moffett, 6,861 feet versus 3,959 feet.

There are plenty of people walking around with portable oxygen concentrators because they have lung related medical issues. A person concerned about breathing difficulties due to elevation should look into that. I know a person who was fine living in a 200 feet to 400 feet elevation location, but when visiting relatives that lived at around a 7,000 feet elevation had to get one of these things and use it while there. I plan to write something with an explanation of what these things do for you but not now in the middle of the night.

 

[MARC Rider]

There are plenty of people walking around with portable oxygen concentrators because they have lung related medical issues. A person concerned about breathing difficulties due to elevation should look into that. I know a person who was fine living in a 200 feet to 400 feet elevation location, but when visiting relatives that lived at around a 7,000 feet elevation had to get one of these things and use it while there. I plan to write something with an explanation of what these things do for you but not now in the middle of the night.

I had an oxygen concentrator issued to me by a doctor in Breckinridge when I developed acute mountain sickness (headache, loss of appetite and fainting in the bathroom). It wasn't so portable, but I didn't have to use it when I was out skiing and snowshoeing, only when I was in the apartment. It even hooked right into my CPAP hose so I could sleep with extra oxygen at night. Everyone is different, but I think for most, sitting in the train is not going to be much different from sitting in a long distance flight.