Californian Zephyr - are winter delays usual?

[user 6862]

Sorry to ask so many questions, but is there a relatively accurate rail map of the Amtrak routes online? The only ones I've found are general or road maps that show rail lines when in close up only.

I am assuming that you mean more accurate than the map in the Amtrak national schedule book.

I do not think all do, but most of the railroad companies over which Amtrak operates have their own system maps on-line. For these you would then have to figure over which line or lines the Amtrak trains run, but that can usually be done by matching up towns between the Amtrak schedule or map and the railroad company's map. BNSF has or had very detailed division by division maps on line. If they are not still there, send me your email address and I can email them to you. Warning: the files are large. These maps do not show roads. Union Pacific has a system map that gives low and high elevations on their system, which means for the CZ route you gett the top of the grade elevation for both the Moffet tunnel and Donner Pass.

As to delays in the mountains: Yes, the west side of the Sierras get a lot more snow than the Rockies. There was a case of an Amtrak train getting stalled for a day or so on the west side of Donner a few years back, but note that these events were over 50 years apart. The railroad has had over 140 years of practice in dealing with the snow falls on that section of line. I would rather use it across the mountains in the winter than try to cross these mountains on the parallel Interstate highway. In the summer the highway is quite a bit faster, but in the winter maybe not, and maybe even closed at times. It is far better to be looking out the window at the snow when riding on rails than when riding on pavement. It is entirely likely that the train through here could be on time or not severely late when a but would not be able to get through at all.

Coming east out of California to Jacksonville. I would go for the Sunset Limited across the southwest to New Orleans, then bus. The train only runs three days per week, and it is not the fastest on the system, but thanks to a lot of work by UP over the last few years, the days of it frequenty running hours late are gone. As someone else said, in New Orleans Amtrak and Greyhound use the same station. I think you would find some of the scenery from the train more interesting. In California you will at one point be going along the shore of the Salton Sea, which is the lowest elevation on rails in the US. It is below sea level. In the last couple hundred miles before New Orleans you go through the swamps of south Louisiana, This area is known as the Cajun country which is where the Brits exiled the French out of Acadia to on the basic theory that those not killed by Malaria would be eaten by the alligators. Entirely different group of Frenchmen in ancestry than those in New Orleans.

Where do you get all this information from, I'll follow as much as I can and will come back to you if I get stuck, thanks for the offer. Think it's a shame that that much of the deserts to the east of LA are passed at night, although can see as you mention other places where the view will just what we want.

I think that the Brits were pretty mean way back then (yes I am one), but whoever polices the world has to do the dirty work along with the taking the spoils. By the way, we live in France now and can understand why they exiled them (only joking, about the exile).

Thanks George for taking the time, we'll have a better trip for having joined this forum.

 

[George Harris]

Just checked. The division by division maps are no longer on line. If interested, give me an email address.

 

[zephyr17]

" you may want to look up what happened to the Donner Party, after which it was named. http://en.wikipedia....ki/Donner_Party "

Thanks zephyr17, feel a whole lot better after reading that. Hope it hasn't become an American custom if you are delayed on the pass.

Well there is a monument to the Donner Party in Donner Pass. . . at a picnic area.

Now tell me you're kidding

Nope. It's a state park...with picnic tables.

 

[user 6862]

Just checked. The division by division maps are no longer on line. If interested, give me an email address.

Have just done that George, thank you.

 

[alanh]

Here's the BNSF division maps:

http://www.bnsf.com/customers/where-can-i-ship/maps/

 

[user 6862]

That's very kind of you Alan, thank you very much.

 

[George Harris]

Alan found a way into the information that I missed. Everything I could have sent is there, and what is there is of more recent vintage.

 

[v v]

The important thing is that it's there for all to see, and thank you for your intentions in ant case.

 

[BigRedEO]

Took the CZ from Chicago to Emeryville three years back. TONS of snow coming over the Sierra Nevada compared to the Rockies and at points you are MUCH higher in elevation looking down at the Interstate. Dining Car attendant told me that the CZ had a 16 hour delay the week before when all that snow had come down, but they had heat, water and plenty of food to cover in such an event. And I would most certainly rather be on the train for that. On the Southwest Chief two years back, we got delayed on a siding for two hours somewhere outside of Santa Fe. The view was amazing, the snow was falling down, I was lucky enough to be in a bedroom and fell asleep with my feet up on the chair while sitting on the sofa. Woke up when the train started moving again. I hadn't been that relaxed in a long time.

But the bus can be miserable. I've had to take Greyhound from LA to Seattle - that was in the worst heat wave in the Pacific Northwest ever and the Portland Greyhound station had no air conditioning and one of our buses for a portion of the trip had no air conditioning (it was 106 degrees that day!). I've also had to take Greyhound from Cleveland to Chicago and the people on that bus were... yikes! My favorite was the couple in front of me snorting things up their nose and then proceeding to... shall we say... get a little too intimate and act like nobody could tell what they were doing. The rest of the people on the bus weren't that much more above them in their attitudes and LOUDNESS. Miserable trip!

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

But the bus can be miserable. I've had to take Greyhound from LA to Seattle - that was in the worst heat wave in the Pacific Northwest ever and the Portland Greyhound station had no air conditioning and one of our buses for a portion of the trip had no air conditioning (it was 106 degrees that day!). I've also had to take Greyhound from Cleveland to Chicago and the people on that bus were... yikes! My favorite was the couple in front of me snorting things up their nose and then proceeding to... shall we say... get a little too intimate and act like nobody could tell what they were doing. The rest of the people on the bus weren't that much more above them in their attitudes and LOUDNESS. Miserable trip!

Yep, that's a G4500. Among the worst buses around. Thank goodness GLI is getting rid of them.

 

[NAVYBLUE]

I can't speak about winter delays, but I can speak about "dead cows" delays in the winter season. Left Reno, NV Monday 12/10 @4:06 PM. Left Grand Junction, CO at the scheduled time Tuesday but prior to entering Ruby Canyon we came to a stop for 15-20 minutes for repairs to an air pressure hose.

It seems we hit (2) cows at 80 MPH which dislodged some hoses. Those had to be reinstalled as well as much of the carcasses of the (2) cows had to be removed from the engine front.

I didn't find out until Wednesday morning at "breakfast" that we had hit the (2) cows. When we arrived in Chicago people were stopping in front of the engine to take pictures of a partial carcass and some parts of the head still attached to the front of the engine. I didn't take pictures but glanced at the front of the engine and it was not a pretty sight.

NAVYBLUE

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

I can't speak about winter delays, but I can speak about "dead cows" delays in the winter season. Left Reno, NV Monday 12/10 @4:06 PM. Left Grand Junction, CO at the scheduled time Tuesday but prior to entering Ruby Canyon we came to a stop for 15-20 minutes for repairs to an air pressure hose.

It seems we hit (2) cows at 80 MPH which dislodged some hoses. Those had to be reinstalled as well as much of the carcasses of the (2) cows had to be removed from the engine front.

I didn't find out until Wednesday morning at "breakfast" that we had hit the (2) cows. When we arrived in Chicago people were stopping in front of the engine to take pictures of a partial carcass and some parts of the head still attached to the front of the engine. I didn't take pictures but glanced at the front of the engine and it was not a pretty sight.

NAVYBLUE

Why did people want to take pics of that? Sometimes I just can't understand.....

 

[crescent2]

I hesitate to post this, but I must agree with those who've questioned traveling such a great distance by bus. You said you wanted to "do stuff as everyday people do," but honestly, no one I know would even consider traveling that far (or really, anywhere) by bus if any alternative were available. Please understand that Greyhound ridership may not necessarily be the average American. Perhaps bus ridership varies by location, but around here, most people do not want to travel on Greyhound or other long distance bus lines, and bus stations have a reputation or connotation (deserved or undeserved?) of being in less than desirable areas, not places one desires to be. The "everyday" person probably travels by car (car is king!) or plane, but would much prefer Amtrak over Greyhound imho. Just something to consider. I admire your sense of adventure, but I'm just not sure what you will experience will be representative of that which you seek. Especially as an older couple, long distance bus would not be the most desirable mode of transportation in many people's opinions.

We've been to the New Orleans train station many times, which is also a bus station, but I don't recall the bus side having many travelers. But I really wasn't paying attention to it.

I will admit I've never traveled by long distance bus, nor have any of my friends as far as I know, but that sort of reinforces my point. I am in no way wealthy, just average working socioeconomic status, now retired.

Regardless, best wishes for a wonderful trip!

 

[zephyr17]

Crescent, that is a great reply I completely concur.

Vv, for long distance travel the average American flies or drives. Most people avoid long distance (a day or more) bus travel like the plague. The folks that do generally have absolutely no choice. And bus stations are mostly really skeevy (the Seattle Greyhound station, which I have been in recently, is awful).

BTW, in my younger and broker days i have traveled long distance by bus. Not something i would do again if i had any alternative, including the alternative of not going at all.

 

[Ted Bell]

I have been watching delays on the California Zephyr since friday. It has been running late all weekend (and today). Primarily the Eastbound 6. I don't know if there are resources to determine the causes of delays, does anyone know?

 

[Agent]

I have been watching delays on the California Zephyr since friday. It has been running late all weekend (and today). Primarily the Eastbound 6. I don't know if there are resources to determine the causes of delays, does anyone know?

Here's what I know:

#6/12 had a short detour in Utah on account of a stalled Union Pacfic train: http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,2941544.

#6/14 had to put its baggage car on the end while at Salt Lake City: http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?4,2943214.

And the Zephyr hasn't been running late all weekend. #6/13 was never more than sixteen minutes late.

 

[Ted Bell]

Here's what I know:

#6/12 had a short detour in Utah on account of a stalled Union Pacfic train: http://www.trainorde...d.php?4,2941544.

#6/14 had to put its baggage car on the end while at Salt Lake City: http://www.trainorde...d.php?4,2943214.

And the Zephyr hasn't been running late all weekend. #6/13 was never more than sixteen minutes late.

Thank you for the information, I wasn't familiar with the trainorders website.

You are correct, the train that left Emeryville on Thursday was on time. However the trains leaving on Friday, Saturday and Sunday have all been significantly late to SLC and beyond. Looks like something is happening between Elko and SLC.

 

[user 6862]

Thanks again everybody, all opinions and details are very welcome.

Have to say I blame the Greyhound thing on Irma Kurtz, here's a link to reviews of her book of her travels on Greyhound in the 1990's. It's the first line in the publishers write-up, it rings a bell with me. http://www.booklore.co.uk/PastReviews/KurtzIrma/TheGreatAmericanBusRide/TheGreatAmericanBusRideReview.htm By the way, it's a good read.

Rosie and I have decided to use the Sunset Limited to New Orleans, people on here have swayed me as I was fence sitting on this one. If I were on my own I would travel that trip Greyhound, but my sweet wife who insisted if I could do it she could would have 2 1/2 days without hardly any facilities, that's not fair to ask. We have agreed at her suggestion that we fly back to London from NY not Jacksonville, that will mean an extra bus ride from Jacksonville, Fla to NY, that's our big compromise.

So the outline is ~ NY to Chicago by Greyhound Chicago to San Francisco by California Zephyr SF to Santa Barbara by bus and train, transfer at San Luis Obisbo SB to NOL by Sunset Limited NOL to Jacksonville Fla by Greyhound Jacksonville, Fla to NY by Greyhound

The delay thing looks good, there's always a day between travel in our plans except from Santa Barbara to New Orleans where the Pacific Surfliner terminates in LA and we transfer to the Sunset Limited to NOL, there we have 2 hours 50 minutes. And again from NOL onto Jacksonville, FL where there will only be 3 hours. Hoping the 4:12 pm Surfliner from SB in particular is usually good for time as there are only 3 Sunsets each week and we would then have to fall back on Greyhound or rent a car.

The previous Greyhound trip was in 2002, 5 months after 9.11. Some people who would normally fly were scared to, didn't / couldn't want to drive and the train didn't go where they wanted to go, so Greyhound was the option of first and last? choice.

Maybe 10 years on the real Greyhound clientel has re-appeared, that's for us to find out now. The first Greyhound was just under 6000 miles in 7 1/2 days, met a lot of people and yes a few were anti-social, but that's life and no good trying pretend otherwise. The really, really interesting people met on that journey was a cafe owner in Duluth where there were a couple of hours layover. Wandered down Main Street to take a look at where Bob Dylan grew up. As it was mid February I now know what minus a zillion below feels like and dived into the cafe which was like a social club. In the mid west met a couple of ladies in their mid 50's who were obviously wealthy, an American Indian who had so much stature and presence it was scary, a man of few words, and a couple of second generation Mexicans who were travelling to the man's brother's funeral and I couldn't understand why he repeatedly mentioned he had such a good job as it came with health insurance. I then learnt almost at my destination that his brother hadn't any health insurance... And of course there were many more including drivers with attitude and those you may want as your best friend.

Have another different question re refunds and booking details, will post on a new thread, hope that's not too many questions?

 

[Ted Bell]

You are correct, the train that left Emeryville on Thursday was on time. However the trains leaving on Friday, Saturday and Sunday have all been significantly late to SLC and beyond. Looks like something is happening between Elko and SLC.

Looks like things are getting a little better. #6/17 was only an hour late to SLC today.

 

[crescent2]

I hope the Sunset Limited trip goes well. That still leaves a LOT of Greyhound, though.

Happy travels!

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

I hope the Sunset Limited trip goes well. That still leaves a LOT of Greyhound, though.

Happy travels!

At least upgraded coaches have been spotted on the Gulf Coaat runs. Somebody even did a trip report including that run with a D4505, my avatar and favourite.

Here's some interesting stuff: http://www.airliners.net/aviation-forums/trip_reports/read.main/226793

http://transitzac.wordpress.com/2012/09/05/85-hours-on-the-bus/

http://transitzac.wordpress.com/2012/09/13/85-hours-on-the-bus-part-2/

 

[YourFoodSherpa]

I am sure that weather has most to do with this - absent the occasional car/truck/bus versus train incident, but I rode the Zephyr last January from Chicago to Emeryville and we were almost a half-hour early. I cut myself particularly close, as I flew from SFO to San Diego that evening. If there had been a delay, it would have gummed up my connecting travel plans, but it all worked out finer than fine.

 

[user 6862]

I hope the Sunset Limited trip goes well. That still leaves a LOT of Greyhound, though.

Happy travels!

At least upgraded coaches have been spotted on the Gulf Coaat runs. Somebody even did a trip report including that run with a D4505, my avatar and favourite.

Here's some interesting stuff: http://www.airliners...ead.main/226793

http://transitzac.wo...urs-on-the-bus/

http://transitzac.wo...the-bus-part-2/

Both these blogs are great reads, exactly what I was trying to put over about Greyhound and it's customers, still I guess that's why you posted them.

Thanks pal

 

[PaulM]

http://transitzac.wo...urs-on-the-bus/

http://transitzac.wo...the-bus-part-2/

Are all cross country bus trips that lacking in drama? I kept waiting for something to happen.

Maybe I need to get out more often, but I had no idea bus foamers existed. I can picture riding a long distance bus, but being an expert on equipment, stations, routes, personnel, history, corporate arrangements, and other trivia?

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

http://transitzac.wo...urs-on-the-bus/

http://transitzac.wo...the-bus-part-2/

Are all cross country bus trips that lacking in drama? I kept waiting for something to happen.

Maybe I need to get out more often, but I had no idea bus foamers existed. I can picture riding a long distance bus, but being an expert on equipment, stations, routes, personnel, history, corporate arrangements, and other trivia?

What is "bus foamer" supposed to mean?