Disillusionment with Amtrak sleeper perks

[crescent-zephyr]

IP Does have plenty of experience with overnight trains though. The city of New Orleans services, the Ocassional run to Florida, Denver, Albuquerque, and of course the various private charters.

I'm not saying they have everything figured out, but they seem fully capable of operating overnight services.

 

[jis]

There is a difference though between operating an occasional overnight service and a daily overnight service. I am almost certain that if they do move into it, they will ease into it.

I would be very surprised if they bid on anything unless FRA makes significant changes addressing the issues raised by Ed. Currently it is almost impossible to get the necessary operating cost projections out of Amtrak in any meaningful form, for example.

 

[crescent-zephyr]

What are the differences? IP ran a regular service that required a regular paid staff (not volunteeers like on a one time excursion). They had to regularly stock and service the train in Chicago. They had to provide regular housing for staff in New Orleans.

And all of that cutrenty applies to the Hoosier State as well. The staff still has to overnight outside of their home.

They would need more staff and more equipment, but I don't see any major changes. Care to point them out?

 

[jis]

OK you win. There is no difference Iowa pacific should be able to start serving tomorrow. Why aren't they?

 

[Ziv]

Railiner, you and Jis are right of course. I don't know why I thought the EB was still a Great Northern operation at that time. It just seemed so luxurious then compared to now.

 

[Philly Amtrak Fan]

Suffice it to say that Iowa Pacific is no universal panacea that some people think it is. I suspect that initially it will not venture into any of the western transcons, and will probably try to start with less than 24 hour runs as a starter.

So that narrows it down to the CL, LSL, CONO, Auto train. and Palmetto?

 

[jis]

I don;t think either Auto Train or Palmetto will be on offer. I think the most likely will be CONO. I am dubious about the LSL too. Too complicated requires a lot of yard work at Albany and involves Sunnyside.

 

[OBS]

Might actually be a welcome improvement over the status of the current CONO...

 

[railiner]

Railiner, you and Jis are right of course. I don't know why I thought the EB was still a Great Northern operation at that time. It just seemed so luxurious then compared to now.

Lets see....IIRC, back then, they had crisp linen tablecloths and napkins...stainless steel flatware....real glassware for drinks...Amtrak "National" pattern (blue and white) china settings....fresh flowers....extensive menus of food freshly prepared on board....a full level of service with 3 or 4 chefs and assistants, at least 4 waiters, and a steward in charge, serving 48 patrons....

Yeah...I could see why you found it luxurious...

 

[crescent-zephyr]

Might actually be a welcome improvement over the status of the current CONO...

I've ridden the IP version of the City, and the current Amtrak version... Trust me. It would be a HUGE improvement. I got lucky though... I had a great Waitress in the diner, who was working super hard to get everyone served by herself, even though she was the only one in the entire diner.

 

[Steve4031]

Iowa pacific could make a serious go at this because of the cruise traffic out of New Orleans. The train could be part of a pre or post cruise package.

There is a solid basis of ridership for many college towns much like the Hoosier state: champaign, Carbondale, Memphis, Jackson, and New Orleans.

 

[peconicstation]

The big question with Iowa Pacific, and the upgraded services offered on it's version of The Hoosier State is how long can they sustain this for ?

This is a state funded route, and as such is subject to political whims.

Food and Beverage services have always been money losers, but back in the day, were a source of pride, and bragging rights by the private railroads.

If we look back to the early 1970's, the then Auto Train Corporation hit a grand slam with it's Lorton to Sanford Florida train, and it turned a profit, (before it launched

it's money loosing Louisville run).

That said, one thing the original Auto Train was not known for was it's food, it kept costs down by serving dinner buffet style and using Marriot as it's caterer.

Ken

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

That said, one thing the original Auto Train was not known for was it's food, it kept costs down by serving dinner buffet style and using Marriot as it's caterer.

Ken

I would venture to guess Marriott could sling much better chow that what's being heaved out today!

 

[Devil's Advocate]

That said, one thing the original Auto Train was not known for was it's food, it kept costs down by serving dinner buffet style and using Marriot as it's caterer.

Ken

I would venture to guess Marriott could sling much better chow that what's being heaved out today!

I would strongly agree. In fact some of the best food and service I've ever experienced was provided by their JW Marriott and Ritz-Carlton brands.

Source: Numerous stays at nearly every level and type of Marriott brand (Marriott Hotels & Resorts, TownePlace, Fairfield Inn, Springhill Suites, Residence Inn, Courtyard, Courtyard City Center, Renaissance, Autograph Collection, JW Marriott, Gaylord Hotels, and Ritz-Carlton) across the US and several other countries.

 

[Eric S]

I believe that Marriott catering merged into Sodexo in the 1990s.

 

[PVD]

Contract food service business was indeed spun off and merged with Sodexo in the late 90's. Like any other contract caterer the client sets the parameters. Marriott split into 2 parts, lodging is seperate from the food service and contract catering entity. Different way of running than hospitality, where you are the standard setter. Unless meeting and banquet business is very strong, food and beverage are not great profit centers in the hospitality trade. Many hotels lose money providing good restaurants because it drives occupancy, in good food cities, they don't do that well because guests have so much to choose from

.

 

[john small berries]

That said, one thing the original Auto Train was not known for was it's food, it kept costs down by serving dinner buffet style and using Marriot as it's caterer.

Ken

I would venture to guess Marriott could sling much better chow that what's being heaved out today!

Easy to say if you never rode the old Auto Train. The food was nothing to write home about - kind of like eating in a truck stop buffet.

 

[PVD]

Which is actually very close to one of the original core businesses that morphed into Marriott. They were the "Hot Shoppes" chain which ran highway rest area restaurants. The merger with host creating Host-Marriott made them a major player in the highway rest area trade.

 

[MARC Rider]

Many hotels lose money providing good restaurants because it drives occupancy, in good food cities, they don't do that well because guests have so much to choose from

.

Oho, so it isn't just railroad dining cars that have this problem! Though at least with hotels, if you don't like the food, you just go down the street for alternatives.

 

[PVD]

That's a huge part of their problem. Most cities have lots of great choices for meals. Lots of sports and entertainment venues have partnered with popular local food establishments to keep a higher percentage of the patrons buying inside. They were already killing a captive audience on price, but started to see a shift of patrons eating more before/after entering. Food options seem to be way better than they used to be. (quality and selection, not price)

 

[Metra Electric Rider]

Interestingly, in Asia many of the best restaurants are in hotels. Whether they are funded/subsidized by the hotel, I couldn't answer. I know that there has been a push in Chicago for better hotel restaurants, perhaps driven by the Asian experience and tourists. Now the restaurants in railway hotels, who knows (see, staying on topic).

Back on the Marriott topic, they ran Great America well...

 

[PVD]

I've been in some pretty good hotel restaurants, they just have a hard time competing in some cities. Some of the hotels I've gone to meetings at where rather than do a separate meeting room service, they give us part of the restaurant, and a shortened menu. I thought that was good, it moved food in the restaurant which usually keeps quality up.

 

[trainman74]

That said, one thing the original Auto Train was not known for was it's food, it kept costs down by serving dinner buffet style and using Marriot as it's caterer.

I would venture to guess Marriott could sling much better chow that what's being heaved out today!

The Marriott foodservice division is now Sodexo, which has already been mentioned both favorably and unfavorably in this thread -- as has also been mentioned in this thread, it really depends on how much the institution for which they're providing the food service is willing to pay.

 

[PVD]

What I really think would satisfy most people is some sense of consistency, both of food presentation/quality, and service. With the exception of the Auto Train, and Acela F/C, where things are generally (not always) pretty good, comments are all over the map. Same route different day can be 180 degree difference, forget about route to route. And that is certainly not restricted to food. Ice, water, blankets, boarding procedures, and so much else just don't seem to be delivered in the same way. I understand that sometimes equipment types or unique situations dictate adjustment, but it seems to be the rule not the exception. Like the bottled water thread, it seems that pretty much every SCA had a way to make sure their passengers got water if they wanted it. But in a number of different ways. Staff should not have to find ways to help passengers (they usually do pretty well) it should be the standard procedure.

 

[me_little_me]

As someone who spent 5 nights in BRs in the last 2 weeks including 3 in th last 3 days, my biggest complaint is the lack of variety. I'd be happy if the trains had different menus - or at least some differences. At least we encountered only one waiter who should be working another job!

Hey, the waitress on the Crescent topped the chocolate mousse with a fresh strawberry.