Does Amtrak still ship mail?

[Andy]

Has anyone used Amtrak's express shipping? They handle small packages up to 50 lbs and even pallets up to 500 lbs (even human remains). Where are such packages stowed? And what are the rates like compared to shipping USPS? I would hope that since it's station to station it would be cheaper.

 

[AAARGH!]

... (even human remains).

Ewwwwww. I may be on a train with a dead body? :blink:

Gives new meaning to the term 'dead head' I guess.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

... (even human remains).

Ewwwwww. I may be on a train with a dead body? :blink:

Gives new meaning to the term 'dead head' I guess.

Hahaha-- actually I would think a dead body would be stored in a boxcar.. maybe an ExpressTrak?

Which, would be pretty close to dead-heading! :unsure:

I am so writing that in my will now.

"And my remains shall be carried by Amtrak across the Empire Builder route, then put on the Capitol Limited to be dropped off in Alliance. If I should be cremated, may my ashes be thrown into the vents of a P42 so that I may ride Amtrak forever!"

 

[AlanB]

Has anyone used Amtrak's express shipping? They handle small packages up to 50 lbs and even pallets up to 500 lbs (even human remains). Where are such packages stowed? And what are the rates like compared to shipping USPS? I would hope that since it's station to station it would be cheaper.

It all goes into the baggage car. Not sure about the rates though.

The Empire Builder frequently sees caskets in the baggage car. Not sure how much the other trains see human remains, but the EB serves many places where flying isn't an option, so again it's not unusual at all to see a casket being loaded/off loaded at many of the more rural stations.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

Has anyone used Amtrak's express shipping? They handle small packages up to 50 lbs and even pallets up to 500 lbs (even human remains). Where are such packages stowed? And what are the rates like compared to shipping USPS? I would hope that since it's station to station it would be cheaper.

It all goes into the baggage car. Not sure about the rates though.

The Empire Builder frequently sees caskets in the baggage car. Not sure how much the other trains see human remains, but the EB serves many places where flying isn't an option, so again it's not unusual at all to see a casket being loaded/off loaded at many of the more rural stations.

Wow...

Next time I think twice before I get off at a service stop and take a peek into the bag.

 

[jackal]

Parcel post and Media Mail are trucked, and I don't much about that, but I know most of it is contracted out to various trucking companies. If Amtrak was to ever get back into carrying mail, it would undoubtedly be FCM, just like the airlines handle. FCM is easily handled with all other baggage on passenger airliners and I see no reason why this couldn't be the same for trains. It's basically used as filler in the baggage compartments. I don't think Amtrak should ever get into hauling parcel post or anything very cargo related, but I can see an opportunity for short to medium distance (i.e. NY to Chicago, Boston to DC, NYC to FL, etc) hauls if there is routinely excess space in baggage cars.

Right on all counts.

And I'm surprised that teh Airlines, which have become so preoccupied with weight/fuel costs haven't differed to Amtrak yet.

When I worked for JetBlue, I was told that the airline was bringing in a sizable amount of money on mail and cargo contracts, which includes their new cargo program. I don't know what percentage of that was mail, and we didn't handle any mail/cargo where I worked. I believe one quarter I heard that mail and cargo revenue helped push the company into profitability for that quarter. So I don't think airlines are anxious to give up that revenue at all.

Two years ago, when I was still in college, I took an economics of transportation course. We looked at, among many other things, the start of the airline industry in the US, and mail contracts were offered to airlines almost as an explicit subsidy to assist the growth of such carriers. Of course now that's no longer the case, but mail contracts do represent a nice, reliable stream of income for many air carriers.

Mail contracts up here are big money and still hit the news occasionally, since they are often the lifeblood of some of the smaller airlines serving some of the remote villages that can't even be reached by any other means of transportation (some can be reached by a week-long boat journey--in the summer--and others are completely isolated). Without the mail contracts, these airlines couldn't afford to fly to these villages, since regardless of how much it needs air service, a village of 200 or even 2,000 can't profitably sustain an airline operation. Even Alaska Airlines relies on the mail contracts to help pay for flights to places like Nome, Kotzebue, and Adak, which are otherwise not profitable even at $300-$500 each way (and these are 500-1000 mile flights, so compare that to your 4,000-mile transcon which you can get for $100!).

It hit the news recently, too, because of changes in the "bypass mail" program, which allows people to basically load cargo directly on an airline but only pay USPS federally-mandated rates (in effect, "bypassing" the USPS's sorting and distribution centers). The USPS coughs up the difference, in effect subsidizing an airline's cargo operation. It's always a bone of contention on the part of the USPS because it's a monetary black hole, but it's federal law and in the USPS charter that the USPS must serve every community in the U.S. (no matter how remote). So thank you all for helping to pay for somebody's pallet of refried beans from Costco to be shipped to Pepe's North of the Border in Barrow! :lol:

Has anyone used Amtrak's express shipping? They handle small packages up to 50 lbs and even pallets up to 500 lbs (even human remains). Where are such packages stowed? And what are the rates like compared to shipping USPS? I would hope that since it's station to station it would be cheaper.

A few of us did an analysis of shipping costs awhile back in an older thread. You may be able to find it if you search (if the built-in search doesn't do it for you, try going to Google and typing "site:discuss.amtraktrains.com amtrak shipping usps" or something like that.

Memory's a bit fuzzy, but for a cross-country shipment, I think the cheapest was USPS Media Mail (since, IIRC, it's a flat rate regardless of the distance equivalent to a one-zone USPS Parcel Post shipment), followed by USPS Parcel Post, then Amtrak Express, then FedEx Ground, UPS Ground, USPS Priority Mail, and then the more expensive options (Express Mail, FedEx 2-day/1-day, UPS, etc.).

Basically, it wasn't the cheapest--Parcel Post was--but it was cheaper than the faster options, so it may strike a good balance between speed and cost.

 

[Ispolkom]

Has anyone used Amtrak's express shipping? They handle small packages up to 50 lbs and even pallets up to 500 lbs (even human remains). Where are such packages stowed? And what are the rates like compared to shipping USPS? I would hope that since it's station to station it would be cheaper.

It all goes into the baggage car. Not sure about the rates though.

The Empire Builder frequently sees caskets in the baggage car. Not sure how much the other trains see human remains, but the EB serves many places where flying isn't an option, so again it's not unusual at all to see a casket being loaded/off loaded at many of the more rural stations.

I remember idly looking out the window at Rugby on an eastbound Empire Builder and seeing a large container marked HUMAN REMAINS being loaded on, quite respectfully, as I recall. I must have been in the Portland baggage coach.

With regard to carrying first-class mail (it took me a while to figure out what FCM meant) on the Empire Builder, I'm not sure how much a savings the Postal Service would get from using the railroad. Just carrying the mail to those cities served by route seems a duplication. Sure you deliver the mail to Devils Lake and Stanley, but you still need a truck route to deliver to Carpio, Velva, and Westhope. How much are you saving? It would make more sense, perhaps, for major city pairs: Chicago-Twin Cities, or New York-Miami.

In St. Paul, as well, the USPS is moving from their building next to Union Depot to a suburb with better road connections near the airport.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

As well as I can remember the first cost of a stamp was three cents. Most mail was moved by passenger train or by truck.If you wanted it to go air mail you had to write "air mail" at the lower left hand side of the envelope.

Later the price for air mail went up to five cents while regular remained at thee. I think most people still wrote air mail on it even with the postage, just to be sure.

Caskets did move in the baggage car, I have seen that all my life,nothing unusual. As Alan pointed out I guess it happens today more in areas not served much by other means,as the some of the EB's stops.

There were cars called ROP (Railway Post Office) where letters were sorted en route.There is or was one in the post office museum near Washington DC Union Station. Check it out, NTD weekend if nothing else. It is downstairs somewhere, you can walk through it as I recall.

Guys standing in the mail room sorting mail at 80 rocking and rolling miles per hour developed their own way of standing, etc, Just as dining car crew had to develop their own style of working on a moving train.

I recall a story about a guy who left the trains and worked in a "still" post office, he still rocked and rolled in his own way after years of doing that. It was in his blood, he could not easily stop.

Remember how the mail man would be late nearly every day at your home before Christmas? Maybe that does not happen so much today since many gifts are on line or computerized. But anyway, trains which carried a lot of mail sometimes ran late before Christmas, just like your neighborhood postman.

Do you have any really old envelopes from your mail at home? Legal papers, letters, holiday cards,etc--my point is: look at the stamp. You might see the ROP stamp there and the train number and the abbreviated name of the railroad. Check it out. Old letters, etc. Before the mid 60's.

Almost all pre-Amtrak passenger trains carried some mail cars. There was various heavy and bulk kind of mail, even reefers,i.e. refrigerator cars on passenger trains. I am not completely clear what might be carried in a passenger train and what was freight. But you would be surprised how much was on the passenger trains.Some trains might have just one, two or three headend cars.Others might have 10 or 15 or so,

The mail was a source of income for the trains. When the rails lost the mail contract in the mid 60's almost as many trains were dropped overnight as were to be dropped a few years later when Amtrak came into

being. But the mail could delay the trains, cause the train to make double stops because of its length etc.

There is a whole culture built around the trains going through towns it did not stop, flinging the mail off onto the platform and picking the mail up on the thing-a-ma-jig to receive the mail. And not throwing oneself off the train while perfoming such duties. I suppose trains like the 20th Century and the Broadway probably just carried the long distance terminus to terminus mail, I guess. I cannot see those trains being bogged down at Xmas, for example.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Has anyone used Amtrak's express shipping? They handle small packages up to 50 lbs and even pallets up to 500 lbs (even human remains). Where are such packages stowed? And what are the rates like compared to shipping USPS? I would hope that since it's station to station it would be cheaper.

It all goes into the baggage car. Not sure about the rates though.

The Empire Builder frequently sees caskets in the baggage car. Not sure how much the other trains see human remains, but the EB serves many places where flying isn't an option, so again it's not unusual at all to see a casket being loaded/off loaded at many of the more rural stations.

On page 126 of the retiring timetable, and page 109 of the new one, are some regulations about caskets. It does not seem to provide pricing info unless I am looking right over it.

I remember boarding a pre-Amtrak train years ago and noticing that a casket was being put aboard as well. I was in coach. When the conductor came through collecting tickets the lady across from me had two tickets yet she was traveling alone. The conducter inquired about this and she was put into the upsetting position of telling him she was traveling with the casket--you could tell she did not want to talk about it.

Surely there must have been some way for the conductor to notice on the ticket that the party was deceased without upsetting the lady. Guess he was just being careless.

But the idea of the remains having a ticket (when accomanied by a survivor) kind of suggests to me that maybe the cost was that of one way coach??? No idea, just a thought. Guess a lot of times somebody is traveling with the deceased.

 

[sunchaser]

Has anyone used Amtrak's express shipping? They handle small packages up to 50 lbs and even pallets up to 500 lbs (even human remains). Where are such packages stowed? And what are the rates like compared to shipping USPS? I would hope that since it's station to station it would be cheaper.

It all goes into the baggage car. Not sure about the rates though.

The Empire Builder frequently sees caskets in the baggage car. Not sure how much the other trains see human remains, but the EB serves many places where flying isn't an option, so again it's not unusual at all to see a casket being loaded/off loaded at many of the more rural stations.

On page 126 of the retiring timetable, and page 109 of the new one, are some regulations about caskets. It does not seem to provide pricing info unless I am looking right over it.

I remember boarding a pre-Amtrak train years ago and noticing that a casket was being put aboard as well. I was in coach. When the conductor came through collecting tickets the lady across from me had two tickets yet she was traveling alone. The conducter inquired about this and she was put into the upsetting position of telling him she was traveling with the casket--you could tell she did not want to talk about it.

Surely there must have been some way for the conductor to notice on the ticket that the party was deceased without upsetting the lady. Guess he was just being careless.

But the idea of the remains having a ticket (when accomanied by a survivor) kind of suggests to me that maybe the cost was that of one way coach??? No idea, just a thought. Guess a lot of times somebody is traveling with the deceased.

Years ago on planes they would give you bereavement fare, which was a little less. I don't know if Amtrak ever did that. I don't remember if there was anything on the plane ticket(s) that mentioned it. That was 1985 & 1995 ish.

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

And once you "create" the jobs at Amtrak to haul the mail what are those people who currently haul the mail going to do. Moving the contract back to Amtrak is just moving jobs, not creating them. The folks who are moving the mail now (FedEx?) are using American workers to do the job so its not like they are taking anything away from the job situation.

But is Fedex using American energy?

 

[Joel N. Weber II]

But the idea of the remains having a ticket (when accomanied by a survivor) kind of suggests to me that maybe the cost was that of one way coach??? No idea, just a thought. Guess a lot of times somebody is traveling with the deceased.

Are we sure this traveler correctly understood how the system was supposed to work?

 

[RRrich]

There were cars called ROP (Railway Post Office) where letters were sorted en route.There is or was one in the post office museum near Washington DC Union Station. Check it out, NTD weekend if nothing else. It is downstairs somewhere, you can walk through it as I recall.
Guys standing in the mail room sorting mail at 80 rocking and rolling miles per hour developed their own way of standing, etc, Just as dining car crew had to develop their own style of working on a moving train.

I recall a story about a guy who left the trains and worked in a "still" post office, he still rocked and rolled in his own way after years of doing that. It was in his blood, he could not easily stop.

Wifey's Dad was a Railway Mail Clerk.

She tells me that as part of his job he carried a gun - Thoughts of Jesse James et. al? He did go through Kansas.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

But the idea of the remains having a ticket (when accomanied by a survivor) kind of suggests to me that maybe the cost was that of one way coach??? No idea, just a thought. Guess a lot of times somebody is traveling with the deceased.

Are we sure this traveler correctly understood how the system was supposed to work?

I have no idea. This was about 1964. I am just relaying my thoughts on the matter.If you know how it works, let us know.........and of course how it works today on Amtrak might not be how it worked then.