Fort Worth to Los Angeles bad service

[drdumont]

I agree about the negative changes that have happened in society, but surely, carrying a sidearm to brandish at rude customer service providers is not going to end well. I live in Baltimore, the murder capital of America, yet I have seen no need to carry a weapon (and get the training needed to use it effectively.)

Come now. Resorting to it in such a scenario as in the Diner would be incredibly stupid and simply out of the question. Weapons are prohibited except when checked in baggage. Just like the airlines.
I carry it ready to go when driving, on my day to day routine, but. not where prohibited. I regularly practice, attend clinics, and am vetted and permitted.

I don't normally carry my weapon on AMTRAK. If I do, it is in an approved locked container, checked as baggage and all regulations are complied with and met.

I have never fired a weapon at a living being. I have brandished it in defense at a filling station (in the old days) and at a Supercharger in a sketchy area. A weapon is like a parachute. You never need one until you need one, and then you generally need it urgently.

I will, however, not hesitate to use it in the face of threat to myself or my family.

 

[Devil's Advocate]

This problem is not just a US problem. it is repeated in most countries I have visited in the last 3 years, the world is not as content as it used to be.

Amtrak has had this problem a lot longer than three years.

I am sure those in the service industry face less than pleasant members of the public on a daily basis, but of course it is part of their job description. Maybe us polite and reasonable people ought to cut them a little slack, or try humour to ease a situation.

I try to support whoever is being treated unfairly. On Amtrak the power imbalance favors the staff by a wide margin and they know it.

I wrote it off as "day after Thanksgiving and too many people are traveling" but if my December trip on the 18th is similarly unpleasant, I may rethink Amtrak in the future.

My Thanksgiving involved four flights, four airports, two airlines, and two lounge visits and the staff where busy but pleasant the entire time.

 

[Traveller]

I try to support whoever is being treated unfairly. On Amtrak the power imbalance favors the staff by a wide margin and they know it.

Agree

 

[Asher]

I agree about the negative changes that have happened in society, but surely, carrying a sidearm to brandish at rude customer service providers is not going to end well. I live in Baltimore, the murder capital of America, yet I have seen no need to carry a weapon (and get the training needed to use it effectively.)

Yeah, packing a firearm is a good way to multiply the issue.

 

[west point]

I would suggest that Amtrak start an OBS chief being on trains that are booked for more than 200 riders at any point.

 

[Cal]

It’s not unusual for the consist numbers to be wrong on trains. This member is not a newbie so I’m sure they were referring to the consist number next to the door and not the car number at the middle of the car.

Oh yeah I've seen car numbers for different routes being displayed, but some don't notice the painted car numbers.

I would suggest that Amtrak start an OBS chief being on trains that are booked for more than 200 riders at any point.

Excellent idea, hard implementation. And of course it's Amtrak and I doubt they will do that...

 

[Bob Dylan]

I would suggest that Amtrak start an OBS chief being on trains that are booked for more than 200 riders at any point.

ALL Long Distance Trains need an OBS Chief aboard, and one that is part of Management, not buddy/buddy with the OBS Crew.

It works very well on Canadian LD Trains where the Conductor rides in the Engine with the Engineer.

Back when Amtrak had such a position, some of the Chiefs did a very good job, but most were just part of the Crew since they were not part of Management.

I remember lots of Ld Trips where I only saw the Chief a few times, mostly when boarding and @ the end of the trip, and in the Diner!

 

[railiner]

ALL Long Distance Trains need an OBS Chief aboard, and one that is part of Management, not buddy/buddy with the OBS Crew.

Not always "buddy/buddy"...there could be cases where there was animosity and unfair treatment toward a former coworker who didn't get along for whatever reason. This was rare, but whenever someone is promoted from the ranks, and now supervises former contemporaries, they could carry past relations with them. Probably they should be required to work out of a different crew base, to minimalize this possibility.
As for making them part of management, they tried that originally, but the union objected and negotiated that they be a "partially exempted" union position.
As a result, the Chief's could not be hired "off the street", unless there weren't sufficient application's from the OBS ranks, and the Chief's had to be covered under ARASA (American Railway and Airway Supervisor's).

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

Not always "buddy/buddy"...there could be cases where there was animosity and unfair treatment toward a former coworker who didn't get along for whatever reason. This was rare, but whenever someone is promoted from the ranks, and now supervises former contemporaries, they could carry past relations with them. Probably they should be required to work out of a different crew base, to minimalize this possibility.
As for making them part of management, they tried that originally, but the union objected and negotiated that they be a "partially exempted" union position.
As a result, the Chief's could not be hired "off the street", unless there weren't sufficient application's from the OBS ranks, and the Chief's had to be covered under ARASA (American Railway and Airway Supervisor's).

Actually the OBS manager when Amtrak first started were management, at some point they were given desk jobs at terminals. The second time Amtrak try the Chief of OBS there were from the union ranks and it’s was peer or buddy/buddy system. It could work but not always.

Not sure why Amtrak has forgotten its history of supervising of OBS members. The lawsuit that prevents them from using any other management than the union ranks should be able to be overturned.

That said anyone in management riding the train could deal with well known problems. Just got to get them on a train.

 

[railiner]

Actually the OBS manager when Amtrak first started were management, at some point they were given desk jobs at terminals. The second time Amtrak try the Chief of OBS there were from the union ranks and it’s was peer or buddy/buddy system. It could work but not always.

Not sure why Amtrak has forgotten its history of supervising of OBS members. The lawsuit that prevents them from using any other management than the union ranks should be able to be overturned.

That said anyone in management riding the train could deal with well known problems. Just got to get them on a train.

IIRC, the On Board Chief's were assigned to all the long distance trains. They reported to a Train Manager, one for each route, who spent about half their time working at the crew base, and the other half riding their trains, to check up on the Chief's performance.

 

[zephyr17]

It works very well on Canadian LD Trains where the Conductor rides in the Engine with the Engineer

Actually, all VIA trains have Service Managers, not just long distance trains.

 

[Cal]

IIRC, the On Board Chief's were assigned to all the long distance trains. They reported to a Train Manager, one for each route, who spent about half their time working at the crew base, and the other half riding their trains, to check up on the Chief's performance.

Now being a train manager like that is a job I would LOVE to have.

 

[fillyjonk]

Just curious, what numbers were you looking at on the car?

Sorry to hear that the crew weren't great.

the numbers in the little window, where PRESUMABLY they can change the car numbers with each run so they match the car number printed on your ticket

 

[fillyjonk]

It’s not unusual for the consist numbers to be wrong on trains. This member is not a newbie so I’m sure they were referring to the consist number next to the door and not the car number at the middle of the car.

yes, it was the consist number, I forgot the term for it. The numbers next to the door which are supposedly changed out for each run of the train, but none of these were 21-specific

 

[fillyjonk]

Agree

yes, I've never had it happen to me, but I've seen people who were not being very disruptive but were asking things or pushing back on a non-rule being enforced being told they'd be put off at the next stop.

Some of the Amtrak employees are like some petty bureaucrats in every bureaucracy* - they LOVE the power they have and wield it to an extreme degree, makes them feel like a Big Person.

(*I work on a college campus and I see instances of this every semester)

 

[Stevenz]

“Not knowing the facts” almost dismisses the rude, unprofessional behaviour. As if it’s OK to be rude in some circumstances. It’s not. Public facing jobs have their challenges because the public, meaning certain individuals, can be very trying. Customer service training is all about dealing with those people.

I have recently taken the Floridian and City of New Orleans, the first U.S. overnight train trips I have done. Looking at Amtrak through the eyes of a non-geek it is evident that Amtrak needs to work on details. Its overall lack of polish will be noticed. Amtrak can’t just count on rail fans who are a bit more tolerant because they enjoy the overall experience. But the lack of polish and myriad small maintenance lapses create an ambiance of neglect.

While I’m no fan of U.S. airlines, they do a good job of presenting a professional facade. Amtrak is a little more rough-and-ready. It isn't charming. Amtrak seems to operate as though it isn’t in a competitive environment. They are. Everybody is. They can look to the airlines for lessons, and remember that its own passengers have choices and are voters.

Amtrak is extremely vulnerable at the moment. I’m sure the freight railroads would be glad to see them go, and they have more influence in congress than Amtrak has. Amtrak’s political base is very small with the possible exception of the NEC. Advocacy has to start now.

 

[zephyr17]

yes, it was the consist number, I forgot the term for it. The numbers next to the door which are supposedly changed out for each run of the train, but none of these were 21-specific

Car line number.

 

[Harmon Shay]

Actually, all VIA trains have Service Managers, not just long distance trains.

I believe also that VIA trains don't have conductors. That position was eliminated years ago in favor of having two engineers, with one in charge, in the cab, at least on the non-corridor trains. I believe those are the only two operating people on board. The rest are on-board service.