Greyhound Canada to cease operations
- Thread starter jiml
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I received an e-mail on the CP article and was (bitterly) amused to see it saying "Greyhound Canada is permanently cutting all bus routes across the country..."
in reference to its residual lines in Ontario and Quebec. I understand what they meant but it reflects a certain point of view.
I've developed a theory that started with discoveries made in the Oregon Intercity Bus Study (1975). It states that traditional intercity bus service of the type run by Greyhound has one generation to live after the discontinuance of paralleled rail service*. It's a generalization that can be negatively affected by major external events such as the 55 mph speed limit, WWII, a pandemic, and positively affected by regional growth, undocumented immigrants, WWII, etc. After that generation, the service either must be completely restructured or subsidized or both. Or, abandoned.
It's harder to pin down when the rail service is drastically cut but continues as an irrelevant tourist attraction (not that tourist attractions don't have their own place in regional economies). But testing the theory, what happened with VIA Rail service in 1991 -- 1999? Or did economic growth in Central Canada delay the inevitable?
* A generation = 22 to 30 years.
In honor of Greyhound history, I'm attaching a photo from when they were expanding by buying up smaller lines. The second-hand bus was on the hourly Edmonton<>Calgary express run.
That's a really fascinating analysis.
Mailliw
OBS Chief
Greyhound Canada is ending all of it's domestic routes this summer. Is there any possible chance VIA might be able to step in and expand service outside the Corridor?
Your question has several layers to consider so there's no easy solution, but the article you've linked has an interesting omission - the Amtrak Thruway bus replacement that has travelled between Chicago and Toronto since the cancellation of the International, operated by Greyhound. I am hoping it's an oversight.
At the risk of attracting the usual apologists, I wouldn't bet my next paycheck on VIA stepping into the void.
At the risk of attracting the usual apologists, I wouldn't bet my next paycheck on VIA stepping into the void.
Looking more and more like the only way for me to get to/from Ontario is going to be by Airplane directly to Pearson,, Automobile or Go Train from Niagara Falls to Oakville!
Just let me know when you're heading this way.Looking more and more like the only way for me to get to/from Ontario is going to be by Airplane directly to Pearson,, Automobile or Go Train from Niagara Falls to Oakville!
Looks like itll be 2022 before I can come back to the Great White North!Just let me know when you're heading this way.
Coachways was not so small...its routes extended all the way from Calgary to Fairbanks, at one time. I rode them from Edmonton to Fairbanks in 1970.
I think that's run by Greyhound USA - so that and the few other cross-border services may still operate when the border reopens.
I used to wonder who rode Coachways Ltd and Alaskan Coachways between Edmonton and Fairbanks! If I recall correctly the travel time was about the same as Edmonton to New York City. Most of their other routes were replications of CPR and CNR branch lines.
What often happens in cases like the demise of GLC is that someone steps in and claims to take it off the government's hands but only restores the most productive service or the parts that fit with their existing system. Ironically, that's what GL did when it took over Continental Trailways and Pacific Trailways.
This carrier, originally set up to replace Saskatchewan Transportation Company, is promising to replace GLC in Ontario and Quebec.
Rider Express
This carrier, originally set up to replace Saskatchewan Transportation Company, is promising to replace GLC in Ontario and Quebec.
Rider Express
I wish someone would prove that it's wrong. In the 1975 study we looked back to the beginning of intercity bus service in Oregon, even a bit into the stagecoaches that preceded them. A lot of the bus routes were set up by the railways to replace money-losing branch and local main line trains.
We hypothesized as to what caused the one-generation phenomenon but never formalized it because of a change in administration. When I lived in Alberta I began to see the same thing. Then I moved to Colorado and it was like going to a movie that I had seen before. (The reason for the timing is that Oregon was ahead on its paved highway program and then its interstate highway construction, so it developed the consequent problems sooner.)
There is an urban transit parallel, although colored by more intense politics. It was rarer in Canada due to so many streetcar systems already being owned by governments or electric utilities. In the U.S., however, the interval between the end of streetcar service and the collapse of the replacement privately-owned bus company was about a generation.
There are long-term ironies in this story. Trudeau pere was in charge for the 1977-1981 rail cutback. Trudeau fils is in charge now. And I can't recall a train-off case where the availability of competing bus service wasn't cited as a justification.
Chicago<>Detroit is Greyhound Lines, Inc. (USA). Detroit<>Toronto was GLC. They pooled for through service. At one time, they also ran thru service all the way from Chicago to Montreal, Toronto<>Montreal link operated by Voyageur Colonial, which GLC later acquired...
NS VIA Fan
Conductor
What was left of Greyhound Canada was already closely paralleled by VIA in the corridor including Toronto-London-Windsor in southwestern Ontario along with Toronto-Ottawa and Ottawa-Montreal...but the main Toronto-Montreal route through Kingston is Mega-Bus.
Greyhound does not run east of Montreal.....that's Orleans Express and Maritime Bus in NB, NS and PEI.
Greyhound's Transcontinental routes were discontinued a couple of years ago and Ontario Northland can get you to Winnipeg now.
NS VIA Fan
Conductor
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That's what I thought too, but it was not mentioned in the list of only five trans-border routes in the article linked in Post #4 - hence my comment.
Ontario Northland still maintains some really diverse bus routes, including a connection with VIA in Ottawa and alternating north and south routes between Thunder Bay and Winnipeg, with the latter reaching Fort Frances, ON/International Falls, MN. They're obviously heavily subsidized, but generally well-regarded. I have a friend who has done some consulting work for them, although mostly on the rail side.
Megabus has introduced service between Toronto and Ottawa, partially filling the void:
https://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/megabus-coming-to-ottawa-following-greyhound-shutdown-1.5428439
https://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/megabus-coming-to-ottawa-following-greyhound-shutdown-1.5428439
NS VIA Fan
Conductor
I took Megabus overnight between Montreal and Toronto a couple of years ago (I certainly would have been on VIA's Enterprise if it had still been running) It was a double-decker bus and not to busy. I had a double seat to myself and overall...not a bad ride!
I miss the Enterprise too, it was my favorite Corridor Train!
I've only been on Mega Bus once, Austin to the DFW Metroplex, I had one of the $5 Tickets, and the ride was as good as Greyhound or any of the Mexican Buses that use I35 on this route.
When I rode the overnight Corridor train, I believe it was called The Cavalier...
As for Megabus, I strongly dislike their Van Hool double deckers. They have low headroom (5' 9") on both levels, and they ride rather hard, as compared to Prevost and MCI coaches....
As for Megabus, I strongly dislike their Van Hool double deckers. They have low headroom (5' 9") on both levels, and they ride rather hard, as compared to Prevost and MCI coaches....
Both names were used and I believe it ran with only a number for awhile.
NS VIA Fan
Conductor
The overnight Cavalier between Toronto and Montreal was launched by CN at the end of the CN/CP Pool Train agreement in October 1965.
https://www.amtraktrains.com/threads/the-end-of-the-pool-agreement.66087/
The overnight Toronto-Ottawa train was the Capital and it was eventually combined with the Cavalier (cars were dropped at Brockville to run to Ottawa)
The Cavalier was discontinued with the big VIA cuts in January 1990.....then restarted again 10 years later in January 2000 as the new 'Enterprise' and lasted until 2005.
