Greyhound seats and fleet questions

[Swadian Hardcore]

What's a staycation?

 

[rickycourtney]

What's a staycation?

A vacation where you stay at home or close to home.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

What's a staycation?

A vacation where you stay at home or close to home.

Thanks.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

I had the good fotune to spot a Greyhound running on the highway today. I had to run a quick errand after lunch and I was in another building. At about 1:09 PM, I noticed Interstate-80 out a window and then saw a MCI D4505 running westbound towards San Francisco. That must've been Schedule 8311, the 1:00 PM departure. That thing kept good pace with the other vehicles.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Since most Greyhound buses are rotated from thier home garage, I was wondering if the garage assignments are based on fleet number. For example, a lot of 6900-series 102DL3's have been seen in Dallas.

 

[railiner]

Does Greyhound in fact have "home garages" for particular buses? I thought that system ended years ago, when IFTA stickers replaced multi-license plated buses, that were plated for particular pools.... I was under the impression (perhaps in error, I will have to find out when I get back to work), that buses received their PMI and DOT inspections and services at whichever garage they happened to be near when it came due....

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

I'm looking through Greyhound's News Room and they have quite a few interesting releases on there. They've started a new Little Rock-Memphis locqal route via Bald Knob that will use small cutaway buses instead of full-sized intercity coaches. News Release here: http://www.greyhound.com/en/newsroom/viewrelease.aspx?id=533&year=2013.

They also announced flexible service plans for the Thanksgiving holiday season, estimating to carry over 500,000 passengers and touting their impressive nationwide OTP of 90%. News Release here: http://www.greyhound.com/en/newsroom/viewrelease.aspx?id=533&year=2013.

They've also relocated their stations in Oklahoma City, Nanaimo, and Madison, plus introducing an airport shuttle from Pittsburgh.

 

[metrolinecoach111]

Does Greyhound in fact have "home garages" for particular buses? I thought that system ended years ago, when IFTA stickers replaced multi-license plated buses, that were plated for particular pools.... I was under the impression (perhaps in error, I will have to find out when I get back to work), that buses received their PMI and DOT inspections and services at whichever garage they happened to be near when it came due....

The simplest answer is that they do, but it really doesn't mean much. It's really just for accounting.

You may remember a few years back from the company newsletters that they revamped the fleet and maintenance programs. The idea was if they could section off buses to "home bases," they could have better control of mileage, service and maintenance. The program started in Seattle, found its way to LA and went East from there. They do have the general 48-states pool, but try to "plan" buses to be in their home base after x amount of miles. Fleet plans this out with feedback from the regional garages. Of course, OSC and the field dictate everything, so it hardly ever ends up the way they plan it.

 

[rickycourtney]

According to METRO Magazine 55 more Prevost X3-45 coaches are on the way in 2014.

As an outsider, what I find interesting is that Greyhound appeared to be very loyal to MCI for several decades... but since being purchased by FirstGroup in 2007, they have made a huge investment in Prevost.

By my count, 395 Prevost X3-45 coaches have been added to Greyhounds fleet between 2009-2014. In that time 218 MCI D4505 coaches were added.

It also appears that Greyhound is also being courted by Van Hool and Setra with both companies sending Greyhound some demonstrator coaches.

In my opinion, competition between motorcoach builders is great for Greyhound (lower prices, better products).

I'd be interested in hearing thoughts from those of you with more knowledge of Greyhound

 

[railiner]

What you may not be aware of, is that for a long period of time, Greyhound owned MCI.....that ended in 1987 when the busline was sold off from the parent corporation...

 

[MrFSS]

What is the average price tag for one of these new buses, if you know?

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

I don't have Greyhound most recent fleet roster anymore but by my own count, Greyhound has ordered 365 Prevost X3-45's and 275 MCI D4505's. I'm not sure exactly how many of the D4505's but I know they start at unit 86300 and 86574 has been spotted so it's at least 275. However, Greyhound many yet order more since they obviously have the money to do it.

Each new MCI and Prevost runs about $500,000-$600,000, depending on the options and the discounts that the carrier receives. Greyhound must receive huge discount because they're buying a new bus almost every day.

OTOH, a new Van Hool C2045 costs about $400,000 list price. Since this imported coach is significantly cheaper then a US-made MCI, it most definitely uses cheaper construction, which may contribute to more accidents and more fatalities. That's why I won't ride Megabus again and that's why I'm glad Greyhound hasn't ordered any Van Hools.

Oh yeah, about that "equipment box" at the back of the MCI passenger cabin, I found out it's actually got two big air intake fans in them, not just an equipment box. So the coaches that have a rear window (and thus lack the simple air intake) must use a more complicated system that results in poor reliability and safety. This basically means any Van Hool, Setra, and most other foreign buses. Go Greyhound, No Rear Window for the Win!

 

[railiner]

According to METRO Magazine 55 more Prevost X3-45 coaches are on the way in 2014.

As an outsider, what I find interesting is that Greyhound appeared to be very loyal to MCI for several decades... but since being purchased by FirstGroup in 2007, they have made a huge investment in Prevost.

By my count, 395 Prevost X3-45 coaches have been added to Greyhounds fleet between 2009-2014. In that time 218 MCI D4505 coaches were added.

It also appears that Greyhound is also being courted by Van Hool and Setra with both companies sending Greyhound some demonstrator coaches.

In my opinion, competition between motorcoach builders is great for Greyhound (lower prices, better products).

I'd be interested in hearing thoughts from those of you with more knowledge of Greyhound

What you may not be aware of, is that for a long period of time, Greyhound owned MCI.....that ended in 1987 when the busline was sold off from the parent corporation...

It is my humble opinion, that MCI, which has had a checkered record of coach quality since its divestiture from the old Greyhound Corporation, under several different owners and a period of bankruptcy, is no longer building the great coach that they used to under Greyhound ownership. Indeed, their "Challenger's", knocked out of the business, the former "standard of the world", General Motors...albeit with some government interference aimed at their cozy relationship with Greyhound.

That said, I would agree that it is a good thing to have a choice of different manufacturer's and price ranges to select new vehicles from in general, as in any product...

 

[rickycourtney]

So going through the articles on the METRO Magazine website (which seem to be mostly regurgitated press releases, but I digress) it seems like there are 395 Prevost X3-45 coaches in Greyhound's fleet.

Here's the breakdown:

Spring 08: 50 coaches (33 to launch BoltBus, 17 for the line-haul fleet) (reference)

09/08: 140 coaches (reference)

04/12: 60 coaches (reference)

04/13: 90 coaches (reference)

11/13: 55 coaches (reference)

----------------------

Total: 395 coaches

The press release from Prevost seems to support these numbers (except they say there were 3 orders in 2013):

Prevost announced that it has received an order for 55 more X3-45 coaches from Greyhound in addition to the two orders it received earlier in the year, for a total of 145 vehicles.

[snip]

Out of the 145 vehicles ordered, 50 were delivered between April and September 2013. The 95 remaining coaches will be delivered in April and May 2014. Prevost supplied Greyhound and First Canada (both part of FirstGroup) with a total of 350 vehicles between 2008 and 2012, inclusively.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Yeah, that's 395 units. I had forgotten about the BoltBus because I was going by the Greyhound fleet numbers and BoltBus dosen't match with those numbers. But then again, Greyhound must have more than 275 D4505's because BoltBus has some too. Overall I'd say if Greyhound does another order for D4505's then they'll be matched equally with X3-45's.

I was wondering what type of engine those rebuilt 102DL3's have. The rebuilds started in 2011 so the new engines must be EPA 2010 compliant. The Detroit 60 ain't compliant so it must be something else, but I have no idea what. The options are basically Detroit 13, Cummins ISX, or Volvo D13.

 

[rickycourtney]

I was wondering what type of engine those rebuilt 102DL3's have. The rebuilds started in 2011 so the new engines must be EPA 2010 compliant. The Detroit 60 ain't compliant so it must be something else, but I have no idea what. The options are basically Detroit 13, Cummins ISX, or Volvo D13.

Here's a video from last year (Aug. 2012) on the refurb program.According to that... they're getting rebuilt Detroit Diesel Series 60 engines.

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

I was wondering what type of engine those rebuilt 102DL3's have. The rebuilds started in 2011 so the new engines must be EPA 2010 compliant. The Detroit 60 ain't compliant so it must be something else, but I have no idea what. The options are basically Detroit 13, Cummins ISX, or Volvo D13.

Here's a video from last year (Aug. 2012) on the refurb program.According to that... they're getting rebuilt Detroit Diesel Series 60 engines.

LOL, the seats and interior that they showed in the vid was from a D4505, not an 102DL3. And not all of the rebuilds are ADA-compliant, which is why so many got transferred to Canada.

But yes, it does answer the question about the engine. I think they rebuilt the engine to reduce emissions. The G4500 rebuilds will have a totally new Volvo D13 engine.

Thanks.

 

[Scott]

Hi I used to be able to take the greyhound bus from Palmdale ca, straight thru to Las Vegas for about a 4 hr busride.now I have to goto San Fernando then north Hollywood then LA and wait almost 2 hrs to transfer to another bus that stops at 2 other stations until I finnaly arrive in Vegas 9 hrs later.Why would they take out the service straight thru to Vegas from palmdale?

Thanks.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Hi I used to be able to take the greyhound bus from Palmdale ca, straight thru to Las Vegas for about a 4 hr busride.now I have to goto San Fernando then north Hollywood then LA and wait almost 2 hrs to transfer to another bus that stops at 2 other stations until I finnaly arrive in Vegas 9 hrs later.Why would they take out the service straight thru to Vegas from palmdale?

Thanks.

Not enough Ridership? Greyhound has really cut down on Lots of its Routes that Dont run through Major Terminals!

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Hi I used to be able to take the greyhound bus from Palmdale ca, straight thru to Las Vegas for about a 4 hr busride.now I have to goto San Fernando then north Hollywood then LA and wait almost 2 hrs to transfer to another bus that stops at 2 other stations until I finnaly arrive in Vegas 9 hrs later.Why would they take out the service straight thru to Vegas from palmdale?

Thanks.

That service was Table 554 in the System Timetable. It operated Los Angeles-Mojave-Los Vegas, using G4500's based from Los Angeles Garage. It was cut back to Palmdale on 1 July 2013. Possibly the unreliable G4500's drove away passengers, causing Greyhound to lose money. Thus, they had to cut the route.

Prior to October 2012, the route was operated with smaller and more reliable MC-12 coaches, which did not meet the latest ADA standards, forcing their retirement.

If you wish to ride from Palmdale to Las Vegas, you can still ride to Los Angeles and transfer to Las Vegas. This is probably better for you anyway because the Los Angeles-Las Vegas route is operated with superb D4505 equipment.

Think about it this way, Greyhound saved money with the route cuts and used that money to buy more D4505 coaches, allowing the rebuild of the old G4500's.

 

[NW cannonball]

I don't have Greyhound most recent fleet roster anymore but by my own count, Greyhound has ordered 365 Prevost X3-45's and 275 MCI D4505's. I'm not sure exactly how many of the D4505's but I know they start at unit 86300 and 86574 has been spotted so it's at least 275. However, Greyhound many yet order more since they obviously have the money to do it.

Each new MCI and Prevost runs about $500,000-$600,000, depending on the options and the discounts that the carrier receives. Greyhound must receive huge discount because they're buying a new bus almost every day.

OTOH, a new Van Hool C2045 costs about $400,000 list price. Since this imported coach is significantly cheaper then a US-made MCI, it most definitely uses cheaper construction, which may contribute to more accidents and more fatalities. That's why I won't ride Megabus again and that's why I'm glad Greyhound hasn't ordered any Van Hools.

Oh yeah, about that "equipment box" at the back of the MCI passenger cabin, I found out it's actually got two big air intake fans in them, not just an equipment box. So the coaches that have a rear window (and thus lack the simple air intake) must use a more complicated system that results in poor reliability and safety. This basically means any Van Hool, Setra, and most other foreign buses. Go Greyhound, No Rear Window for the Win!

Hey, Swadian -- 3 things

A lot of us here value your encyclopaediac contributions on all things bus (motorcoach)

Not inviting comments about Van Hools, you've made your (probably well-considered) opinion clear the last few years. I rode Megabus once 6 years back, will try to avoid, but won't rule out if the price is right.

What you posted about motorcoach prices seems in line with railcar costs, more or less, allowing for maintenance intervals and passenger capacity.

Have you ever considered changing your screen name to "Busmaster" (that would get a few of more tech-savvy computer geeks giggling (never mind, never mind, off-topic)

And, number 4, I ride trains, cause I like to, but a good bus is better than a train that can't get you there, or fails connection. Thanks for your ongoing contributions. Your advice has helped me.

Thanks, man

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

Thanks, you don't sound sarcastic to me. I won't change to "Busmaster" because I'm not Busmaster, I don't even have the newest Greyhound roster. A lot of my info comes from Railiner, the rest comes from research, talking to drivers, etc. I watched a video about the MCI 102DL3 and it showed the engine compartment, so I could see that there's two big air intake fans on top of the engine, whereas a Van Hool has them behind the engine.

I don't know too much about engine but I'm getting a better grasp on the basics. Very interesting pieces of machinery. Even if you don't know anything about buses, an imported bus being much cheaper than US-made just screams for suspicions.

I like to ride trains too, it's just that Amtrak's too expensive right now and their schedules don't fit my needs. But I do grab a quick rail ride whenever I can. In the meantime, I'll just stay off the rail discussions for fear of addidently threadjacking.

Besides, if I can save up enough money, I'll visit China next year and do loads of train rides at much lower cost than Amtrak. I obviously won't save enough money if I ride Amtrak everywhere.

 

[NW cannonball]

Hey, you visit China next year - get near Shangai - years back I found on the web that Shanghai was going to introduce "double bendy buses" local transit, piqued my interest. Probably that project failed, more or or less.

 

[NW cannonball]

Thanks, you don't sound sarcastic to me. I won't change to "Busmaster" because I'm not Busmaster, I don't even have the newest Greyhound roster. A lot of my info comes from Railiner, the rest comes from research, talking to drivers, etc. I watched a video about the MCI 102DL3 and it showed the engine compartment, so I could see that there's two big air intake fans on top of the engine, whereas a Van Hool has them behind the engine.

I don't know too much about engine but I'm getting a better grasp on the basics. Very interesting pieces of machinery. Even if you don't know anything about buses, an imported bus being much cheaper than US-made just screams for suspicions.

I like to ride trains too, it's just that Amtrak's too expensive right now and their schedules don't fit my needs. But I do grab a quick rail ride whenever I can. In the meantime, I'll just stay off the rail discussions for fear of addidently threadjacking.

Besides, if I can save up enough money, I'll visit China next year and do loads of train rides at much lower cost than Amtrak. I obviously won't save enough money if I ride Amtrak everywhere.

No, seriously, your posts on bus alternatives -- way way helpful. Amtrak riders and all us public transit users value your knowledge and bus expertise. Thanks for myself, and, i bet, a few thou people whom your posts here have helped.

Keep on posting. Very good info. Thanks again. Please don't minimize your valuable contributions. Lots of us readers thank you. Yeah, sometimes you be off-topic, who ain't :unsure: - but thanks again.

Yeah sometimes you wander off-topic -- you know - that happens - we all do - that happens a lot, - "{noli perspirare)"

 

[railiner]

NW cannonball, I agree with your sentiment....obviously Swadian is very enthusiastic about Greyhound, and enjoys helping educate others from his extensive knowledge where it can be of benefit to them.

Greyhound should be appreciative of his avid support as well, if they were aware of it....