Heartland Flyer Scuppered

[fairviewroad]

What's the policy for Amtrak/railroads anyway regarding a tornado sighting? A train doesn't really have the option to try and drive somewhere else...

Interesting question. I mean, I would guess it's exceedingly rare for an Amtrak engineer or other crew member to actually spot a tornado

up ahead. But what about cases where a tornado warning is issued for the area the train is passing through or is about to pass through?

Does dispatch notify the engineer/conductor? If so, what to do? It would seem counterproductive to simply come to a stop if there's no

tornado actually on the ground in the vicinity, and arguably you'd want to keep moving to clear the area...but what if the warning zone

is up ahead? Does Amtrak have its duck in a row well enough to keep a train from entering harm's way?

 

[Devil's Advocate]

Trains could probably benefit from having additional weather monitoring equipment.

We know that trains can't really dodge storms the same way aircraft can and aren't impacted as greatly regardless. That being said, being able to sense early warning signs around them could allow them to lower the speed or stop completely in order to avoid heading into a developing storm. Visual indications with a human eye are unlikely to provide enough warning for a train but on-board weather sensing equipment might be able to save a train or two here and there. It might not make sense for equipping every train this way, but I would want hazardous waste trains to have this kind of technology. Just imagine the train below hauling a long series of hazardous materials.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azV5bC2br-Q

 

[jis]

If anyone is sitting on the fence about climate change then i don't think any amount of graphs and evidence will change their mind...

The climate is changing, that is an irrefutable fact.

The debate needs to be centered on how much it's going to change and if there's anything we can do about it.

I agree the climate is changing. But what most people don't (or do not want to) understand is that the earth goes thru cycles of "global warming" and "global cooling" every 100,000 years or so. The last period of "global warming" was about 100,000 years ago. So the current cycle is completely normal.

Maybe, maybe not. We will only know after the fact if that is the case.

 

[OlympianHiawatha]

A couple of years ago I was riding the Heartland Flyer back to Norman and about the time we arrived Pauls Valley Dispatch came on with news of a Tornado Warning just north of OKC and was working to get all trains stopped or slowed before they reached the Warning Box. The Conductor explained they take these very seriously and when a Warning goes out, all traffic in the Box or approaching the Box stops.

 

[fairviewroad]

A couple of years ago I was riding the Heartland Flyer back to Norman and about the time we arrived Pauls Valley Dispatch came on with news of a Tornado Warning just north of OKC and was working to get all trains stopped or slowed before they reached the Warning Box. The Conductor explained they take these very seriously and when a Warning goes out, all traffic in the Box or approaching the Box stops.

Ah, a real-life example! Thanks.

 

[henryj]

If anyone is sitting on the fence about climate change then i don't think any amount of graphs and evidence will change their mind...
The climate is changing, that is an irrefutable fact.

The debate needs to be centered on how much it's going to change and if there's anything we can do about it.

I agree the climate is changing. But what most people don't (or do not want to) understand is that the earth goes thru cycles of "global warming" and "global cooling" every 100,000 years or so. The last period of "global warming" was about 100,000 years ago. So the current cycle is completely normal.

Thanks for that traveler. And when the next ice age comes, and it's just around the corner in geological time' New York will be under 1000' of ice. Hoorah. And Ryan, I could not agree more with you on that statement. lol. " Remind me again what any of this has to do with the Heartland Flyer?"

 

[sitzplatz17]

Trains could probably benefit from having additional weather monitoring equipment.
We know that trains can't really dodge storms the same way aircraft can and aren't impacted as greatly regardless. That being said, being able to sense early warning signs around them could allow them to lower the speed or stop completely in order to avoid heading into a developing storm. Visual indications with a human eye are unlikely to provide enough warning for a train but on-board weather sensing equipment might be able to save a train or two here and there. It might not make sense for equipping every train this way, but I would want hazardous waste trains to have this kind of technology. Just imagine the train below hauling a long series of hazardous materials.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azV5bC2br-Q

That video was exactly what I was thinking of. I guess it'd really be a freak chance it that were to happen to a passenger train, but it's still a possibility.

A couple of years ago I was riding the Heartland Flyer back to Norman and about the time we arrived Pauls Valley Dispatch came on with news of a Tornado Warning just north of OKC and was working to get all trains stopped or slowed before they reached the Warning Box. The Conductor explained they take these very seriously and when a Warning goes out, all traffic in the Box or approaching the Box stops.

Thanks for the example!

 

[NE933]

Well, the nature of the beast is at play here, because although the signature feature of tornadoes, their funnel cloud vortexes, are not apparent when the massive storm is setting itself up. It seems from what I read that ten minutes is the approximate normal amount of warning time, and often it's even less then that. Rotation in the upper storm and a radar signature of bow shaped areas of hail and severe rain are the best criteria meteorologists seem to have at the moment.

If a train, or anything else, were already under a part of the storm system that is giving off the classic rotation and black, sometimes green tinged ominous clouds, then the railroad's people have some fast decisions to make. The engineer can't turn back, and depending where the train is, staying the course might be the safest course, or not. Trains magazine recently had an article about split second decisions (like seeing a truck stop directly ahead), but tornadoes were not part of the treatment.

While some of the postings here kind of got 'sticky', the topic of the Heartland Flyer, or any other train, in tornado prone areas is deserved and interesting. Clearly an F4 or F5 has the power to knock over rolling stock and cause loss of life. And these phenomena are a part of life. A reliable warning system that has rail routes wired into it is the only defense. And if a train crew is unfortunate to be caught where little warning was possible, then it's wartime: clear and insightful decisions and communication is what shall mean the difference between riding it out, or not.