Its no longer Flat Iron Steak

[Ryan]

So when Amtrak serves a Different "cut of meat" that is NOT a Steak, it CANNOT become a Steak just by cooking it in one of the (less-usual) styles in which a True Steak could have been cooked!

Except for the fact that it is the same cut of meat, cooked differently.

What you are saying is that they take a Steak and mistreat it beyond all recognition, such that even Amtrak themselves no longer sees fit to call it a "Steak".

Regardless of how it's cooked, a steak is a steak is a stake. No matter what you or Amtrak see fit to call it.

But this is NOT what I was talking about. I was talking about "when Amtrak serves a Different cut of meat that is NOT a steak". A different matter entirely.
http://discuss.amtraktrains.com/index.php?...&hl=braised

According to jim55, quoted on 5-21-09,

"one bite and something was wrong. The guy across from me said 'did you see the asterisk (*) by the flat iron steak on the menu? ...beef shanks will be substituted... when flat iron steaks are no longer available.'"

This is part of the "recent reduction of quality" that I was referring to.

Perhaps you should have alluded to that, since the topic of THIS THREAD is the braised version of the Flat Iron STEAK. You're really reaching here to try to justify yourself, rather than admit that you're wrong.

 

[p&sr]

This is part of the "recent reduction of quality" that I was referring to.

Perhaps you should have alluded to that...

Yeah, I should have said something about when it's a different cut of meat that's not a Steak, then it doesn't become a Steak however you cook it. I can't see how I could have missed that.

the topic of THIS THREAD is the braised version of the Flat Iron STEAK.

The Title of THIS THREAD is, "It's No Longer Flat Iron Steak".

Well, maybe it is and maybe it isn't. But assuming it isn't, then it must be a different cut of meat. Or don't you think so?

 

[Ryan]

Well, maybe it is and maybe it isn't. But assuming it isn't, then it must be a different cut of meat. Or don't you think so?

Try reading the article that I linked. Or the portion that I quoted if you can't be bothered to click on the link. I'll state it as clearly as I can. They. Are. The. Same. Cut. Of. Meat.

Reaching into a different thread about a different topic completely is the height of lameness. The shank substitution due to availability and the different prep method for the summer are two completely different topics.

 

[p&sr]

Reaching into a different thread about a different topic completely is the height of lameness. The shank substitution due to availability and the different prep method for the summer are two completely different topics.

Absolutely right. I should only quote from THIS CURRENT THREAD. OK, here goes with Post #30:

Steak is a staple of just about every American restaurant. This substitution thing is really a disapointment...

"Substitution Thing" indeed. Sounds fishy to me. Almost like substituting a DIFFERENT CUT OF MEAT THAT IS NOT A STEAK.

Not that they do it every time, to be sure. But when they DO, it is both disappointing and a clear "reduction in quality".

IMHO.

 

[Ryan]

Reaching into a different thread about a different topic completely is the height of lameness. The shank substitution due to availability and the different prep method for the summer are two completely different topics.

Absolutely right. I should only quote from THIS CURRENT THREAD. OK, here goes with Post #30:

I never claimed that. But if you're going to try to say that substituting a lesser cut of meat is a vile atrocity that should be avoided in a topic that is about serving the same cut of meat prepared differently, then perhaps at some point you should indicate such.

Steak is a staple of just about every American restaurant. This substitution thing is really a disapointment...

"Substitution Thing" indeed. Sounds fishy to me. Almost like substituting a DIFFERENT CUT OF MEAT THAT IS NOT A STEAK.

Not that they do it every time, to be sure. But when they DO, it is both disappointing and a clear "reduction in quality".

IMHO.

You still don't get it. You're confusing the substitute beef shank that happens occasionally with a planned, temporary change to the menu. Once you get that clear in your head, all of this will make sense to you.

 

[p&sr]

If you're going to try to say that substituting a lesser cut of meat is a vile atrocity that should be avoided... then perhaps at some point you should indicate such.

Yeah, I should have said something like, "if they serve a DIFFERENT CUT OF MEAT that is not a steak, it cannot become a steak no matter how you cook it, and this is a lamentable reduction in quality." I can't see how I neglected to make that clear.

You still don't get it.

Obviously not.

You're confusing the substitute beef shank that happens occasionally with a planned, temporary change to the menu. Once you get that clear in your head, all of this will make sense to you.

Not likely at all. You underestimate the Power of an Obtuse Mind!

 

[Ryan]

If you're going to try to say that substituting a lesser cut of meat is a vile atrocity that should be avoided... then perhaps at some point you should indicate such.

Yeah, I should have said something like, "if they serve a DIFFERENT CUT OF MEAT that is not a steak, it cannot become a steak no matter how you cook it, and this is a lamentable reduction in quality." I can't see how I neglected to make that clear.

Unfortunately, in the context of the discussion, nobody (but you) was talking about serving a different cut of meat.

In hindsight, it should have been obvious that you were on a different page (of a different menu, even) when you said:

I said that "Beef is NOT ALWAYS the BEST". One reason it is NOT ALWAYS the BEST is the recent reduction in Beef Quality on Amtrak. There is NO substitute for Steak. Pot Roast is just fine for those who like it (Which I most certainly DO), but it is NOT STEAK and can NEVER replace Steak on a Menu. And the fact that some poor souls who overlook the Fine Print actually THINK they're ordering Steak, only to be Heartbroken at finding some Braised Whatever on their Plates... well, that's just a crying shame.

since there is no "fine print" to lead people to think that they are ordering steak:

http://www.amtrak.com/pdf/menus/Menu_diningcar-0609.pdf

If you want to mope about the substitution of a lesser quality of meat being substituted during times of high demand, you've linked to the proper thread for that.

 

[p&sr]

There is no "fine print" to lead people to think that they are ordering steak:

Does this mean that they are NOT ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat? Wouldn't that be a Reduction of Quality?

In hindsight, it should have been obvious that you were on a different page...

So what else is new?

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

There is no "fine print" to lead people to think that they are ordering steak:

Does this mean that they are NOT ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat? Wouldn't that be a Reduction of Quality?

You aren't ordering a different cut of meat! Braised flat iron steak is the same cut of meat as grilled flat iron steak. There may be a reduction of enjoyment because the customer had preferred grilling versus braising-- however this does not equate to a reduction of quality. A reduction of quality would be either a lesser cut of beef, or a bad attempt at braising. The prior is simply not true and the latter is just confused with people who think that braising makes the steak "of a lesser quality" and is thus misconstrued mistruth.

 

[p&sr]

There is no "fine print" to lead people to think that they are ordering steak:

Does this mean that they are NOT ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat? Wouldn't that be a Reduction of Quality?

You aren't ordering a different cut of meat!

Well, thank goodness for that. (As long as they don't substitute it as in Post#30 of This Thread.)

I guess HokieNav got it wrong about the fine print, where he said people were NOT being led to believe they were ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat that is NOT a Steak.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

There is no "fine print" to lead people to think that they are ordering steak:

Does this mean that they are NOT ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat? Wouldn't that be a Reduction of Quality?

You aren't ordering a different cut of meat!

Well, thank goodness for that. (As long as they don't substitute it as in Post#30 of This Thread.)

I guess HokieNav got it wrong about the fine print, where he said people were NOT being led to believe they were ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat that is NOT a Steak.

Now you are confusing two different issues.

First there is a long-dead issue of the "shank-steak" (no such thing as a steak from beef shank). Amtrak would sometimes put a braised beef shank in place of the grilled flat iron. This had some "fine print" involved and was a different cut of meat.

This braised shank is similar to the current menu selection but different on a number of factors: the main one being the use of flat iron steak instead of cheaper shank. This is a HUGE increase of quality, actually, and while it may have somehow confused you-- most people recognize that braised steak is steak nonetheless.

 

[p&sr]

First there is a long-dead issue of the "shank-steak" (no such thing as a steak from beef shank).

Yeah, like I said. It's a Different Cut of Meat that is NOT a Steak. I should have made that more clear.

Amtrak would sometimes put a braised beef shank in place of the grilled flat iron. This had some "fine print" involved and was a different cut of meat.

Interesting. I should have mentioned that.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

First there is a long-dead issue of the "shank-steak" (no such thing as a steak from beef shank).

Yeah, like I said. It's a Different Cut of Meat that is NOT a Steak. I should have made that more clear.

Amtrak would sometimes put a braised beef shank in place of the grilled flat iron. This had some "fine print" involved and was a different cut of meat.

Interesting. I should have mentioned that.

And it is an entirely separate issue... the braised beef on the menu for all trains but the EB is flat iron steak, NOT shank meat. It is a high quality cut cooked in a method that works well for the ability of the cut.

You completely do not understand the issues and have taken to the very annoying, and immature, tactic as to taking my words out of their contexts. What a shame, up until now I had at least considered you honorable. Now you're just being silly.

 

[Ryan]

I guess HokieNav got it wrong about the fine print, where he said people were NOT being led to believe they were ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat that is NOT a Steak.

Wrong again. You quite obviously didn't bother to look at the menu that I linked that has no fine print on it. I should have said "there is no "fine print" to lead people to think that they are ordering grilledsteak", since you can't seem to separate the cut of meat and the method of preparation in your head.

People were not being led to believe that they had ordered a grilled steak. They were being served EXACTLY WHAT WAS ON THE MENU, hence no disappointment is possible.

 

[p&sr]

I guess HokieNav got it wrong about the fine print, where he said people were NOT being led to believe they were ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat that is NOT a Steak.

Wrong again. You quite obviously didn't bother to look at the menu that I linked that has no fine print on it.

Different menu, once again. ALC just said about there being fine print on the menu. He wouldn't get that WRONG, would he?

 

[p&sr]

Now you're just being silly.

Yeah, me and who else?

This whole Tread just stabs a STEAK into my heart. Such a bitter disappointment.

Looks like I'll have to get back to "Mopping" again

(sees blood from heart-stab running across the Kitchen Floor...)

It's been fun. TTYL, and enjoy the meals on Amtrak.

PS -- Take a Tip from me, and just order the Chicken. It's a LOT less controversial!

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

I guess HokieNav got it wrong about the fine print, where he said people were NOT being led to believe they were ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat that is NOT a Steak.

Wrong again. You quite obviously didn't bother to look at the menu that I linked that has no fine print on it.

Different menu, once again. ALC just said about there being fine print on the menu. He wouldn't get that WRONG, would he?

Umm.. no. You're wrong. Again. There is no fine print on this new menu. HokieNav is 100% correct. You're wrong.

Though by the time you quote this, I wouldn't be surprised if you started deleting my words to work my words. Obviously fact has no meaning with you.

 

[Ryan]

I guess HokieNav got it wrong about the fine print, where he said people were NOT being led to believe they were ordering Steak, but some Different Cut of Meat that is NOT a Steak.

Wrong again. You quite obviously didn't bother to look at the menu that I linked that has no fine print on it.

Different menu, once again. ALC just said about there being fine print on the menu. He wouldn't get that WRONG, would he?

No he wouldn't. Since we're talking about two different menus, it's quite possible for both of us to be right. You continue to demonstrate a fundamental misunderstanding that there are two completely different topics at hand here, and you're the only one that keeps mistakenly bringing the substitution of a lesser quality of meat in a thread talking about a different meal, served off of a different menu.

 

[p&sr]

Though by the time you quote this, I wouldn't be surprised if you...

Whatever. Just order the Chicken.

 

[p&sr]

You continue to demonstrate a fundamental misunderstanding that there are two completely different topics at hand here...

No, you continue to DENY that both topics are being discussed. Or were. (To the Point of disgust, no doubt.)

TTYL and enjoy the Trains, and ALL of their Menus, WITH or WITHOUT fine print! Either way, there's plenty to go around.

And like I said to ALC... Keep life simple and just order the Chicken.

 

[Ryan]

You continue to demonstrate a fundamental misunderstanding that there are two completely different topics at hand here...

No, you continue to DENY that both topics are being discussed. Or were. (To the Point of disgust, no doubt.)

You are the only person in the thread that kept coming back to the matter of substitution of a different cut of meat. ALC and I trying to convince you that it's a different issue don't count.

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

Seems simple to me.

On all trains, order the steak and you get braised flat iron steak. On the EB, order the grilled flat iron and it will be cooked to order. Nothing confusing there. Just steak.

 

[p&sr]

You are the only person in the thread that kept coming back to the matter of substitution of a different cut of meat.

Right again. Funny how hard it is to get a point across sometimes, isn't it?

I think we understand one another at last. We're talking about DIFFERENT issues, DIFFERENT menus... (and, dare i say it, a DIFFERENT cut of meat? Nah, couldn't be.)

 

[ALC Rail Writer]

You are the only person in the thread that kept coming back to the matter of substitution of a different cut of meat.

Right again. Funny how hard it is to get a point across sometimes, isn't it?

I think we understand one another at last. We're talking about DIFFERENT issues, DIFFERENT menus... (and, dare i say it, a DIFFERENT cut of meat? Nah, couldn't be.)

Nope. The braised beef currently on all Amtrak menus out West is a braised flat iron steak.

 

[Neil_M]

I have heard the chicken is actually turkey............ :lol: