Large plane discussion

[Old MM]

If the flight is an RJ not mainline, it might be operated by PSA as an American Eagle carrier, which I think does maintenance at Dayton, whereas MIA would be AA mainline.

There might be specialized mechanics in Dayton, but most anything can get done in Miami unless something has changed and they've moved people around or out sourced etc.

 

[PVD]

If it's PSA as Eagle, AA would rather have the subsidiary do it, I believe they make less money...

 

[Trogdor]

Regarding the new nonstop DAY-MIA, I have doubts it's for scheduled maintenance in DAY. AA has a major hub and maintenance base in MIA. The flight times make me wonder if it's to connect cruise traffic in and out of south Florida. Many of AA's early morning departures to MIA are for that purpose. So it might be that the cruise industry is preparing to get going again in November, and the market research showed there are enough customers out of the Dayton OH area to justify service. Also the entire airline industry is depressed and capacity has been reduced to the point where some other smaller cities may lose service. Part of the coping strategy might be to identify markets where they can recoup some losses. The other reason for early MIA arrivals and late departures are connecting traffic from South America, but this seems less likely than potential cruising resurgence, because of ongoing restrictions. Maybe they're anticipating (or hoping) that situation will improve.

EDIT: I removed the word "daily" since OP had said it was Saturday only. That was the big cruising day for flights out of DTW to MIA early in the morning, so I'm still thinking that has something to do with it.

I can assure you that virtually nobody is doing anything to connect to cruise traffic right now, or in the near future.

There might be specialized mechanics in Dayton, but most anything can get done in Miami unless something has changed and they've moved people around or out sourced etc.

Scheduled maintenance is often done at designated facilities where the airline has facilities dedicated specifically to such (or where a contractor has such facilities).

It's not a question of whether or not Miami can do "most anything." Unplanned breakdowns, sure, they can fix it. Routine stuff that has to be done every few days, definitely makes sense to have that capability at certain stations. But for stuff that has to be done less often, and needs to be scheduled in advance, they're going to route the plane to a specific facility. And the regional carrier, in this place, has its maintenance base in Dayton, and needs to send planes there regularly enough that they can schedule it through a regular revenue routing.

It's not really that different from Amtrak sending heavier maintenance to Beech Grove or Bear, DE, when Chicago, Sunnyside, Ivy City (DC), etc. can handle regular line maintenance.

 

[Dakota 400]

There is a maintenance facility in Dayton. This flight has everything to do with shuttling airplanes from the MIA hub to DAY for maintenance and not much to do with a convenient flight for residents of Dayton. If they can sell some seats, so be it.

Air Canada has a similar flight between Montreal and Nashville. It's a pure maintenance run.

There is a PSA maintenance facility at DAY. As of October 1st, there will be some staff reductions at that facility.

The flight times make me wonder if it's to connect cruise traffic in and out of south Florida. Many of AA's early morning departures to MIA are for that purpose. So it might be that the cruise industry is preparing to get going again in November, and the market research showed there are enough customers out of the Dayton OH area to justify service.

The flight time leaving DAY does make sense for making a same day cruise connection. The flight time leaving MIA does not make sense for returning cruise passengers. One's off the ship by no later than 10:00-10:30 A. M. A 9:30 P. M. departure from MIA would not be desirable. I have no doubt that AA's market research does show sufficient demand during the Fall and Winter for such a flight to MIA if cruising does return late 2020 or early 2021.

But, to justify such a schedule for a "part of a one day getaway", the fares would have to be dirt cheap to make such a schedule attractive, I think.

That's a long flight in an RJ!

That's what I thought!

 

[Dakota 400]

My company pays for me to fly in first class, and I really like the 1-2 seating because I can snag one seat that is both a window and aisle seat.

Last August, I flew on a Delta regional jet from MSP-DAY in First Class with the 1-2 seating. Like you, I reserved the "A" seat. Decent leg room, wider and more comfortable seat, with better than expected First Class service on a regional jet experienced.

 

[Dakota 400]

I’m not sure if this belongs in the Small or Large Plane forum. Bizarre!
A man flying a jetpack was reported by pilots above Los Angeles - CNN
1 day ago · An American Airlines flight was the first to report a "guy in a jetpack" at the plane's' altitude of 3,000 feet above Los ...

I am really becoming quite concerned about individuals who seem not to understand the danger they are posing by flying drones near airports and now this report of a human flying idiot. What is it going to take for the FAA and law enforcement to stop such actions? (And, I am afraid I think I know the answer.)

 

[railiner]

Yes, Denver was the exemption at LGA, it is slightly longer than the limit but was grandfathered. For some reasons, Saturdays are also exempt, but I don't think anyone bothered with a one day a week service....

AA did....ran nonstop to Eagle/Vail during the ski season....

 

[PVD]

interesting I knew they went there, I never realized from LGA

 

[trainman74]

Just as long as people in Dayton realize the flight is to Miami, Florida, and not Miami University in Oxford, Ohio.

And just as long as people in Miami realize the flight is to Dayton and not Daytona.

 

[Asher]

I am really becoming quite concerned about individuals who seem not to understand the danger they are posing by flying drones near airports and now this report of a human flying idiot. What is it going to take for the FAA and law enforcement to stop such actions? (And, I am afraid I think I know the answer.)

The FAA has already put big restrictions on drones, and most drones are programmed so they won't fly in certain airspaces. They are really a interesting piece of equipment and serve a lot of purposes. Lots of enemies though and I don't blame you for you're concerns.

 

[jis]

Maybe it is time to merge this thread back into the small jet thread except the first few articles in the thread perhaps. I came looking for large jets and did not find many

 

[MARC Rider]

Well, here's something about large jets:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/travel/ne...liners-over-manufacturing-problem/ar-BB18t9sU
I hope none of them were the planes that I flew on when I went to Beijing in 2017.

 

[jiml]

Well, here's something about large jets:

https://www.msn.com/en-us/travel/ne...liners-over-manufacturing-problem/ar-BB18t9sU
I hope none of them were the planes that I flew on when I went to Beijing in 2017.

There's been some "insider" stories about how 787's made in Renton have fewer problems than those having final assembly done in South Carolina. No idea if this is a factor with this latest issue, but I've enjoyed my limited flights on them. Nice airplane.

 

[jis]

There's been some "insider" stories about how 787's made in Renton have fewer problems than those having final assembly done in South Carolina. No idea if this is a factor with this latest issue, but I've enjoyed my limited flights on them. Nice airplane.

No 787s are made in Renton. If you have ever seen that factory, you'd know why. Renton is where 737MAXs are assembled these days. AFAIK no widebody has ever been manufactured at Renton.

787s are assembled in Everett.

The 8 787 frames with problems alluded to were all assembled in Charleston SC as per articles in industry publications like AvWeek. There is a (understandably) long thread on this subject at airliners.net.

 

[PVD]

It has always been a narrowbody plant, all the way back.... They did refurb a few of the first Everett built 747s, guessing the ones from flight testing, but not sure. Wouldn't be surprised if they worked outside, can't imagine they would fit. Certainly no new builds......

 

[jis]

It has always been a narrowbody plant, all the way back.... They did refurb a few of the first Everett built 747s, guessing the ones from flight testing, but not sure. Wouldn't be surprised if they worked outside, can't imagine they would fit. Certainly no new builds......

Even if the somehow manage to get the front of a 747 into one of those buildings, there is no way they could get the tail in AFAIR.

Couple of years back we had a software standards meeting hosted by Boeing Research in a hotel next door to that plant. It was interesting to watch 737s coming out of the building at regular intervals. Also interesting to see the 737 fuselages come in on rail flats into the plant to be assembled into planes.

We tried to get a tour of that plant, but Boeing does not do that. No visitors to that plant. They instead organized a VIP tour for a small group to the Everett plant, where we had access to the manufacturing floor and were taken around on golf carts to various points of interest. That was a few days after the first 777X had been joined together. Got to see those folding wing tips at close range. Also go to see the manufacturing process for the CF wings for the 777X. Specifically they were working that day on the main spars for line number 7 as I seem to recall.

 

[Dakota 400]

They instead organized a VIP tour for a small group to the Everett plant, where we had access to the manufacturing floor

Must have been at the Everett plant, but one of the most interesting industrial tours that I have taken was at the Boeing factory. So much to see and learn that it was difficult to absorb it all.

 

[jiml]

No 787s are made in Renton. If you have ever seen that factory, you'd know why. Renton is where 737MAXs are assembled these days. AFAIK no widebody has ever been manufactured at Renton.

787s are assembled in Everett.

The 8 787 frames with problems alluded to were all assembled in Charleston SC as per articles in industry publications like AvWeek. There is a (understandably) long thread on this subject at airliners.net.

Yeah thanks, brain cramp - 737MAX focus had me thinking of Renton. I've been to the Everett plant, but not Renton.

 

[Old MM]

I actually used to work somewhere, that gave me first person experience with how flights are scheduled. That's why I'm skeptical of this notion of a city pair being created for maintenance. Does not make sense. It could be correct, it could be things have changed. And planes are definitely routed according to where they want the metal, and the crews, to end up that night. But the idea of a once a week scheduled maintenance run to Dayton, especially now, seems weird.

 

[PVD]

Depends on the plane, and the way the airlines does maintenance. Years ago, Continental inherited a group of 737-100 from People Express. Unlike the -200 which was pretty popular, there weren't very many anywhere (only 30 were built), and they used to do there best to get them back to Newark as often as possible.

 

[railiner]

I actually used to work somewhere, that gave me first person experience with how flights are scheduled. That's why I'm skeptical of this notion of a city pair being created for maintenance. Does not make sense. It could be correct, it could be things have changed. And planes are definitely routed according to where they want the metal, and the crews, to end up that night. But the idea of a once a week scheduled maintenance run to Dayton, especially now, seems weird.

I believe we discussed this on an old thread about short flights...at one time United had flights from Oakland to San Francisco, to reach that maintenance base, and they would even sell you a ticket just for that flight. There are probably other examples. American Eagle used to have flights to Marquette, Michigan, where they had a maintenance base. It was formerly Sawyer AFB.

 

[jis]

Must have been at the Everett plant, but one of the most interesting industrial tours that I have taken was at the Boeing factory. So much to see and learn that it was difficult to absorb it all.

Yes, even the non-VIP tour of the Everett Plant is amazing. I have taken it three or four times over a period of 40 years. The first time was when almost all the bays were used for 747s with only one or two ramping up for the 767.

It was kind of amazing to realize this last time that in the declining days of 747s, over a period of over 40 years I have seen at least some number of 747s being manufactured there. The last time was of course the 747-8 which is a pretty impressive plane. But the place was dominated by 777s and 787s with a bit of 747 and 767 (Air Force contract),

Of course much has changed in the facilities too, the enormous new addition being the CF parts manufacturing facility which have these gian autoclaves that are big enough to bake and entire 777 wing, and if needed at some point, almost an entire 737 sized fuselage. And all this in a semiconductor clean room like environment with most of the work being done by robots.

 

[20th Century Rider]

If money is no object our you just won the lottery... why not spend $32000 for a flight from Abu Dhabi to NYC! I've always been amazed by the elevated service of first class! The downside is that you can only eat so much because your stomach is the size of a human fist... and if you get tired and go to sleep you will literally be dreaming at the cost of thousands per hour!

 

[MARC Rider]

If money is no object our you just won the lottery... why not spend $32000 for a flight from Abu Dhabi to NYC! I've always been amazed by the elevated service of first class! The downside is that you can only eat so much because your stomach is the size of a human fist... and if you get tired and go to sleep you will literally be dreaming at the cost of thousands per hour!

For all that money, I don't see any straps on the bed to keep you from rolling on to the floor if the pilot banks a little too steeply.

 

[PVD]

I saw straps on one of the beds in the video. Compliance might be another issue...