MNRR Dual Mode Chargers discussion

[Touchdowntom9]

Time to restart the discussion.

Man those are quiet. Assume that’s the benefit of using 3rd rail whenever available. Fantastic stuff

 

[Dutchrailnut]

Keep in mind currently only 302 has third rail gear installed on its trucks. for 301 it is not available yet.

 

[daybeers]

 

[west point]

Noticed that the loco is slightly narrower than the passenger cars.

 

[MARC Rider]

Are these dual mode locomotives engineered to allow operation at full speed when third rail is available?

 

[PVD]

If I recall correctly, 80 mph operation on 3rd rail power is possible, which would be consistent with the M-7 EMU operation.

 

[west point]

If I recall correctly, 80 mph operation on 3rd rail power is possible, which would be consistent with the M-7 EMU operation.

IMO there are 2 separate factors for max speed.
1. the actual mechanical limit when shoe is contacting the third rail. Have no idea but over running and under running might have different values. the design of the shoe will be determined by the current draw.
2. Electrical draw is the other. The number of amps each of 2 shoes can draw. EMU shoes draw much less amps since each car is drawing only power for its car. So, MNRR locos current draw is much greater per shoe. The max current draw may depend probably on amount of surface contact that the shoe places on the rail. the post that says the shoe design is different and only 4 are on 301 (2 each side) since more have not been delivered. It may be that they are just prototypes subject to change.

What could really complicate the use of 3rd rail is if one shoe fails out of the 4

 

[PVD]

IMO there are 2 separate factors for max speed.
1. the actual mechanical limit when shoe is contacting the third rail. Have no idea but over running and under running might have different values. the design of the shoe will be determined by the current draw.
2. Electrical draw is the other. The number of amps each of 2 shoes can draw. EMU shoes draw much less amps since each car is drawing only power for its car. So, MNRR locos current draw is much greater per shoe. The max current draw may depend probably on amount of surface contact that the shoe places on the rail. the post that says the shoe design is different and only 4 are on 301 (2 each side) since more have not been delivered. It may be that they are just prototypes subject to change.

What could really complicate the use of 3rd rail is if one shoe fails out of the 4

I'm basing my numbers on the published specs

 

[Dutchrailnut]

The SC42-dm has 8 third rail shoes, 4 on each side

 

[west point]

The SC42-dm has 8 third rail shoes, 4 on each side

That certainly changes the dynamic. I stand corrected. Any specs on Max current rating of each shoe? Unfortunately, too late to edit my post. Did try.

 

[Amtrak25]

Can those shoes move to flip out of the way or operate on over-sliding 3rd rail ?

 

[Dutchrailnut]

No the shores are not flippable but a dual sided shoe same as on M-8's can be used not ordered at this time.
Each shoe has a 700 amp fuse.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

Little update, so far all test runs are for Siemens to dial in and set the electronics. No Metro North accepance runs yet.
one unit had a truck change to put an instrumented truck in for testing but that was switched to its own truck.
No MDBF testing or Crew training yet on them. may start in April if nothing changes.
303 and 304 are believed to be ready for shipment but on hold as not to plug up Harmon.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

Frebr minutes from NGEC committee : Metro North Dual Mode Locomotive Procurement as of 2-27-25 : Locomotive 301 and 302 are undergoing dynamic testing in Croton. Locomotive 303 has completed its Q40 inspection. Locomotive 304 – production is complete with testing to begin Locomotive 305 is in final assembly.
Metro-North announced this week that it has engaged Siemens for an electric battery locomotive which will take power from overhead catenary or an on-board battery.

 

[Amtrak25]

Frebr minutes from NGEC committee : Metro North Dual Mode Locomotive Procurement as of 2-27-25 : Locomotive 301 and 302 are undergoing dynamic testing in Croton. Locomotive 303 has completed its Q40 inspection. Locomotive 304 – production is complete with testing to begin Locomotive 305 is in final assembly.
Metro-North announced this week that it has engaged Siemens for an electric battery locomotive which will take power from overhead catenary or an on-board battery.

If the PSA ones are to be 60-MHz + battery, I assume no diesel (?), why are they called Chargers as opposed to Sprinters ?

 

[jis]

If the PSA ones are to be 60-MHz + battery, I assume no diesel (?), why are they called Chargers as opposed to Sprinters ?

Are they called Chargers? And hopefully they are 60Hz and not 60MHz

 

[Dutchrailnut]

yes Model is Charger transformer is a 25/60 hz transformer, the battery is to move train from platform to LIRR yard and back out to platform, as it has no overhead catenary. No they can't go up branch lines and that would be a CDOT locomotive not a MN unit. unless a pool is established. the max current the dm units are allowed to pull is 4000 amps

 

[Amtrak25]

yes Model is Charger transformer is a 25/60 hz transformer, the battery is to move train from platform to LIRR yard and back out to platform, as it has no overhead catenary. No they can't go up branch lines and that would be a CDOT locomotive not a MN unit. unless a pool is established. the max current the dm units are allowed to pull is 4000 amps

So these will be able to run under Pennsy catenary and cut over to 25Hz at Gate ?

I had thought Sprinter meant electric and Charger meant diesel. So I am confused why these are called Chargers.

Does NYPS 20 & 21 have catenary now ? For some reason I thought it was either de-energized or removed.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

Sprinter is a vectron model, the Charger is a model. not a function.