new cars

[busboy]

Didn't I hear Amtrak had bought a bunch of new sleeper and other type cars? When will they start going into service???

 

[the_traveler]

They put an order in, but it will be a few years before the first one gets built!

 

[jis]

They start arriving in 2013, and at least some should be in service by the latter half of the year. Most of them arrive in 2014.

 

[Tracktwentynine]

They put an order in, but it will be a few years before the first one gets built!

They're already being built. I've seen pictures around the web of carframes well along and that was months ago.

If they're to go into service in late 2013, they'll be out on the road being tested starting in mid-2013, I would estimate.

 

[afigg]

They're already being built. I've seen pictures around the web of carframes well along and that was months ago.

If they're to go into service in late 2013, they'll be out on the road being tested starting in mid-2013, I would estimate.

The FY2012 - FY2016 5 year plan has a Rolling Stock count table which shows 25 of the new cars projected to be in active service by the end of FY2013. The document was published early this year after Congress finally passed the FY12 budget. The schedule has likely slipped since then, but by this time next year, there will probably be numerous sightings of the new cars undergoing test runs on the NEC, if not starting to enter revenue service.

 

[the_traveler]

1343054064[/url]' post='382111']

1342889211[/url]' post='381787']They put an order in, but it will be a few years before the first one gets built!

If they're to go into service in late 2013, they'll be out on the road being tested starting in mid-2013, I would estimate.

I hope they test them on rails, not on the road!

Highways are in bad enough shape without more ruts in them!

 

[Aaron]

This was in the railpac.org newletter I got today. I don't know what their source is on this, though.

News not reported by the Media

As of mid-July the stop work order by Amtrak has been lifted against CAF for the $298 million order of 130 Viewliner II low level long distance passenger cars. This stop order has put production back by about 4 months. Original plans called for delivery of the first car by October of this year which CAF claims they will still meet. NB

 

[jis]

Yes. At least I knew of the lifting. In the first place all the noise made about the "stop work order" was mostly URPA trying to make noise about stuff. There were some design issues that needed to be corrected and the way one does it is by issuing an order to stop work while the fix is agreed upon. Nothing really out of the normal process for dealing with glitches.

 

[George Harris]

Yes. At least I knew of the lifting. In the first place all the noise made about the "stop work order" was mostly URPA trying to make noise about stuff. There were some design issues that needed to be corrected and the way one does it is by issuing an order to stop work while the fix is agreed upon. Nothing really out of the normal process for dealing with glitches.

It used to amaze me the things that cause an uproar because people know nothing about normal contracting procedures, and appeared to have no iterest in finding out. By now I am just resigned to it. Likewise, there are now many people in California that seem to think that what the legislature just passed and the gov has signed means that construction starts tomorrow. Nope. Get educated about what was really passend and what it happen next. It is not exactly a done deal yet.

 

[PRR 60]

Back in April, the story from an Amtrak source was:

Amtrak and CAF mutually discovered a concern with the design of the car underframe. The process for dealing with such a situation is to issue a stop work order until the issue is resolved to mutual satisfaction, so indeed a stop work order was issued. The issue is a relatively minor design issue and a fix is more or less in hand. Work resumes shortly with the agreed upon resolution.

Three months seems to be a very long time to resolve a "relatively minor design issue" and implement a fix that was "more or less in hand." This is production of a railcar, not the 787 Dreamliner. It really takes three months correct a minor design issue?

 

[jis]

Did it take three months?

 

[leemell]

Yes. At least I knew of the lifting. In the first place all the noise made about the "stop work order" was mostly URPA trying to make noise about stuff. There were some design issues that needed to be corrected and the way one does it is by issuing an order to stop work while the fix is agreed upon. Nothing really out of the normal process for dealing with glitches.

It used to amaze me the things that cause an uproar because people know nothing about normal contracting procedures, and appeared to have no iterest in finding out. By now I am just resigned to it. Likewise, there are now many people in California that seem to think that what the legislature just passed and the gov has signed means that construction starts tomorrow. Nope. Get educated about what was really passend and what it happen next. It is not exactly a done deal yet.

Last schedule for the CAHSR Project that I saw said this:

RFP was sent out about March this year

Responses due back by October 1st.

Contract issued on December 1st.

Work commences before the 31st of December.

 

[afigg]

Did it take three months?

Yea, URPA and railpac.org are not exactly reliable news sources from my impressions of reading the web sites. They both have a lot of axes to grind.

I would expect that there will be a formal status update from Amtrak in the next few months on the delivery schedule for the CAF cars and a projected entry of the first units into revenue service. If CAF has a completed first unit by this fall either ready or close to being ready to turn over to Amtrak, would not surprise me if there was some sort of car roll-out ceremony at the Elmira facility in October with NY politicians on hand making sure they get on TV and their names in the paper. It is election season after all.

 

[PRR 60]

Did it take three months?

Didn't it?

 

[Swadian Hardcore]

As of mid-July the stop work order by Amtrak has been lifted against CAF for the $298 million order of 130 Viewliner II low level long distance passenger cars. This stop order has put production back by about 4 months. Original plans called for delivery of the first car by October of this year which CAF claims they will still meet. NB

If they were delayed four monthes then I think they would get delivered initially in February 2013 at the latest.

 

[Nathanael]

Back in April, the story from an Amtrak source was:

Amtrak and CAF mutually discovered a concern with the design of the car underframe. The process for dealing with such a situation is to issue a stop work order until the issue is resolved to mutual satisfaction, so indeed a stop work order was issued. The issue is a relatively minor design issue and a fix is more or less in hand. Work resumes shortly with the agreed upon resolution.

Three months seems to be a very long time to resolve a "relatively minor design issue" and implement a fix that was "more or less in hand." This is production of a railcar, not the 787 Dreamliner. It really takes three months correct a minor design issue?

If it's a body or frame issue, it easily could; there are all kinds of cascading effects from changes to those and they can require retooling.

I noticed that CAF is advertisting for some new employees at its plant.

http://www.careerbuilder.com/Jobs/Company/C8B7JT676994N1KHRVK/CAF-USA-Jobs/

Two tool operators (fabrication/welders) and one jigs/fixtures specialist -- and they really want all of them to have experience with stainless steel, but aren't making it a hard requirement -- and one robotics programmer/technician.

I had read speculations that CAF USA might be having some trouble working with stainless steel correctly, due to lack of US worker experience with stainless steel welding. This tells me that those speculations... were probably correct. (The robotics programmer is probably just a coincidence.)

If these speculations were correct, it would mean that the "design issue" isn't what we'd usually think of as a design issue (the architectural blueprints for the car are fine), but something closer to a mismatch between the manufacturing techniques being used and the specified tolerances and thicknesses.

If CAF can't find suitable people to fill those jobs, they'll probably have to bring people over from Spain; the process of proving that they need H1-B employees could cause additional delays. But the trains would get built and would work either way.

 

[jis]

I wonder what, other than additional cost, prevents reclaiming the two prototype Viewliner Sleepers shells and refitting them with new modules and trucks, so that two more Viewliner Sleepers become available in relatively short order. Specially if they plan to convert the CONO to single level to release Superliners for other LD trains, they will get very tight on Sleeper availability all over again.

 

[Trogdor]

One of the two is being converted to a business car. The other is probably so far gone that it would practically be building a new car.

 

[printman2000]

I wonder what, other than additional cost, prevents reclaiming the two prototype Viewliner Sleepers shells and refitting them with new modules and trucks, so that two more Viewliner Sleepers become available in relatively short order. Specially if they plan to convert the CONO to single level to release Superliners for other LD trains, they will get very tight on Sleeper availability all over again.

Did I miss something? I have not read anything about a City of New Orleans conversion to single level.

 

[jis]

I wonder what, other than additional cost, prevents reclaiming the two prototype Viewliner Sleepers shells and refitting them with new modules and trucks, so that two more Viewliner Sleepers become available in relatively short order. Specially if they plan to convert the CONO to single level to release Superliners for other LD trains, they will get very tight on Sleeper availability all over again.

Did I miss something? I have not read anything about a City of New Orleans conversion to single level.

Nothing specific. It is one of about a dozen different scenarios that have been considered. Does not mean it will necessarily happen or not.

 

[Trogdor]

Problem with converting 58/59 to single level is there aren't any single-level coaches available. Would also tie up three sets while only freeing up two sets of Superliners unless something was changed with the Eagle's rotation.

 

[AutoTrDvr]

I wonder what, other than additional cost, prevents reclaiming the two prototype Viewliner Sleepers shells and refitting them with new modules and trucks, so that two more Viewliner Sleepers become available in relatively short order. Specially if they plan to convert the CONO to single level to release Superliners for other LD trains, they will get very tight on Sleeper availability all over again.

Did I miss something? I have not read anything about a City of New Orleans conversion to single level.

Nothing specific. It is one of about a dozen different scenarios that have been considered. Does not mean it will necessarily happen or not.

I take it then, that there is no present plan to add/replace Superliners (as there seems to be for Viewliners)?

 

[jis]

I wonder what, other than additional cost, prevents reclaiming the two prototype Viewliner Sleepers shells and refitting them with new modules and trucks, so that two more Viewliner Sleepers become available in relatively short order. Specially if they plan to convert the CONO to single level to release Superliners for other LD trains, they will get very tight on Sleeper availability all over again.

Did I miss something? I have not read anything about a City of New Orleans conversion to single level.

Nothing specific. It is one of about a dozen different scenarios that have been considered. Does not mean it will necessarily happen or not.

I take it then, that there is no present plan to add/replace Superliners (as there seems to be for Viewliners)?

There is a plan starting replacement after 2018 I believe. But afigg is the resident expert of such things and maybe he will chime in. It is all spelled out in the Fleet Plan re-published recently.

 

[trainviews]

I wonder what, other than additional cost, prevents reclaiming the two prototype Viewliner Sleepers shells and refitting them with new modules and trucks, so that two more Viewliner Sleepers become available in relatively short order. Specially if they plan to convert the CONO to single level to release Superliners for other LD trains, they will get very tight on Sleeper availability all over again.

Did I miss something? I have not read anything about a City of New Orleans conversion to single level.

Nothing specific. It is one of about a dozen different scenarios that have been considered. Does not mean it will necessarily happen or not.

I take it then, that there is no present plan to add/replace Superliners (as there seems to be for Viewliners)?

There is a plan starting replacement after 2018 I believe. But afigg is the resident expert of such things and maybe he will chime in. It is all spelled out in the Fleet Plan re-published recently.

As I understand it the new bilevel corridor cars for California and the Midwest will free up a few Superliner coach cars (and a whole lot of Horizons, but that is a nother matter). But aside from that there are only plans, that are not financed yet and nothing is on order or close to being ordered.

 

[AutoTrDvr]

I wonder what, other than additional cost, prevents reclaiming the two prototype Viewliner Sleepers shells and refitting them with new modules and trucks, so that two more Viewliner Sleepers become available in relatively short order. Specially if they plan to convert the CONO to single level to release Superliners for other LD trains, they will get very tight on Sleeper availability all over again.

Did I miss something? I have not read anything about a City of New Orleans conversion to single level.

Nothing specific. It is one of about a dozen different scenarios that have been considered. Does not mean it will necessarily happen or not.

I take it then, that there is no present plan to add/replace Superliners (as there seems to be for Viewliners)?

There is a plan starting replacement after 2018 I believe. But afigg is the resident expert of such things and maybe he will chime in. It is all spelled out in the Fleet Plan re-published recently.

As I understand it the new bilevel corridor cars for California and the Midwest will free up a few Superliner coach cars (and a whole lot of Horizons, but that is a nother matter). But aside from that there are only plans, that are not financed yet and nothing is on order or close to being ordered.

Many thanks! The only issue there being what happens when the existing Superliner Fleet starts to wear out... :unsure:

Again, just trying to keep what we have....