New Routes and Services

[Viewliner]

I'd like to know what routes would you add if you could. After Amfleet came up with cutting routes, I figured lets be a little optomistic.

My Proposals:

Priorities: Return Silver Palm, Make Cardinal Daily, Make Sunset Limited Daily (Split up if needed), Three Rivers added Diner.

Ketucky Cardinal (Chicago-Miami) [Rename to Floridian?]

New Train to run via FEC and leave Silver Service as is.

New York-Los Angeles Direct Service

Desert Wind Revived (Chigago-Las Vegas-Los Angeles)

To do this we'd need additional Superliners and new Viewliner Fleets, possibly built by Temoinsa or Beech Grove.

Any Thoughts, or Ideas?

 

[AlanB]

Viewliner,

I’d like to see the train that was proposed in Amtrak’s Market Analysis Plan, which was supposed to run overnight from NY to Chicago via Canada and Detroit Michigan. I can’t remember the name that they had for it at the moment.

The Pioneer, which if memory serves ran from either Salt Lake or Denver to Portland.

I’d also like to see the Heartland Flyer renamed and extended to either Portland or Seattle via Denver. Perhaps this could be combined with a Pioneer, but I think that having both would be better.

Finally we need a train that runs from Chicago, thru St Paul-Minneapolis, then leaves the Builder route and heads due west from St Paul. This train would serve both South Dakota and Wyoming, two states that currently have no Amtrak service at all.

This is of course in addition to the fine choices that you’ve already listed.

 

[tp49]

I'd love to see a NY-Emeryville/Oakland direct train.

Right now most of the improvments I would make are either frequency increases or things that were already considered.

-Begin the service from LA to Las Vegas.

-Increase frequency between San Jose and Sacramento (1 or 2 aditional round trips per day).

-Allow one of the Sacramento/Bakersfield round trips to extend into Los Angeles.

-A seasonal service between Oakland and Reno.

-An additional train on the Starlight route to begin in Oakland (to serve Northern California during daylight hours).

-Revive the SLC-Las Vegas train (I think there was one).

-An extra frequency on the Cascades extended to Vancouver, BC

Some HSR I'd love to see:

-California Los Angeles to Bay Area (probably via central valley).

-Chicago-St. Louis

-Houston-Dallas (with possible extension to Austin and San Antonio)

 

[tp49]

Alan,

Was that proposed NY-Chicago via Canada and Detroit train make any stops in Canada? Curious because of Customs delays.

 

[AlanB]

Alan,
Was that proposed NY-Chicago via Canada and Detroit train make any stops in Canada? Curious because of Customs delays.

Tp49,

No that train would have made no stops while in Canada, thereby avoiding any customs issues. The two main reasons for this proposal were to avoid the busy CSX line from Buffalo to Chicago and to provide direct service from NY to Detroit.

 

[AlanB]

Ps. That route through Canada was to have been called the Twilight Limited.

I'd also like to see Amtrak add the proposed Crescent Star, which was to have split off the current Crescent at Meridian Miss and continued onto Dallas Texas.

 

[-Late Shore-]

BRING BACK THE DESERT WIND! BRING BACK THE DESERT WIND! PLEASE! LOL! :lol: This train was the perfect way that people whom did not want to fly, could take the train into Vegas.

As you can see, I'm only 23, and very much into Amtrak and have never been to Vegas, so the train trip should be a "book unto itself".

 

[Allen Dee]

-Begin the service from LA to Las Vegas.

Let the new Los Angeles to Las Vegas train service begin as a corridor service, like the new Nor'easter between Boston and Maine.

I'm all for it, and so are a lot of my friends who are tired of driving and flying this route.

Bring this route on!!!

 

[Allen Dee]

Ps. That route through Canada was to have been called the Twilight Limited.
I'd also like to see Amtrak add the proposed Crescent Star, which was to have split off the current Crescent at Meridian Miss and continued onto Dallas Texas.

Make the Sunset Limited a DAILY train.

From El Paso route it through Abilene, Dallas, and Houston, instead of San Antonio.

Connect with the Crescent Star and Texas Eagle for service south and east.

This would make a lot more sense than cessation.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Make all long distance trains daily, such as the Sunset and the Cardinal, any others.

Extend the Crescent from Meridian to Fort Worth

Revive the FLoridian, (say, as Viewliner said, as an extension of the Kentuckian), Hope it can go through Chattanooga|(my birth city) and Atlanta(my present city).Hhave to remember that tracks have not handled passenger trains for years, however.(but we are dreaming!)

Revive Broadway lLimited, both in name and in quality of service.

Restore Desert Wind

Extend Sunset(a daily train, of course)back to Miami.

Revive a train like the former "Lark" of many years ago...it ran straight out of San Francisco(no bus connection)to San Jose overnight to LA.

Definately bring back the Florida East Coast line with passenger service.

 

[GWR]

I thought I add web address link which shows all the passenger routes which use to run before Amtrak took over most of the passenger routes in 1971.

Some of them sounds good and may make money.

http://www.trains.com/Content/Dynamic/Arti...01/138fddcg.asp

Guy

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Thanks GWR...That is a world which I remember well....actually I remember a world a bit older than that. Back that up 10-15 years and there were even more trains going even more places than is here listed. Keep in mind that the time frame shown was at the lowest ebb of passenger train service. AMtrak represented an attempt to tear it all down and then re-make it , get it going again...by concentrating on select routes, growing them, and then expanding. In some ways that has happened but never to the full potential hoped for. But for the younger members of our forum, that is a very good sketch of former passenger train routes. I had no idea such a list was available on the internet....live and learn.

 

[AmtrakerBx]

I'd revive a truly first class "Limited". a premier service...overnite from NYC to Chicago...making limited stops// utilizing refurbished heritage cars...sleepers..diner..lounge...maybe add a dome in Albany..and of course

an observation car...maybe do it in 18 hrs..hmmmmm. I lov to dream too.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

Yes, that is what I meant by a revived Broadway Limited, both as to name and as to class of service. The Pennsylvania Railroad's "Broadway Limited" was in heavy competition with the New York Central R.R.'s "20th Century Limited".....Guess we could have something called the" 21st Century Limited"...just a thought.

 

[Amtrak Watcher]

Lots of good suggestion here -- makes me feel better. I don't recall the exact circumstances, but remember being annoyed with the service between the U.S. and Canada, where I had to get off a train in one country, take a bus or cab (or something) a short distance to get on another train in the other country. Is there some technical problem that keeps VIA trains off of U.S. tracks and Amtrak trains off of Canadian tracks? Or is all of this political/customs oriented?

 

[AlanB]

I don't recall the exact circumstances, but remember being annoyed with the service between the U.S. and Canada, where I had to get off a train in one country, take a bus or cab (or something) a short distance to get on another train in the other country. Is there some technical problem that keeps VIA trains off of U.S. tracks and Amtrak trains off of Canadian tracks? Or is all of this political/customs oriented?

Amtrak Watcher,

In recent memory, the only time that I've heard of what you are describing happened during this past year on the International, which runs between Chicago and Toronto. In this instance, it was due to the increased boarder security after 9/11. All passengers were forced off the train and onto a bus to go through customs. Then they were put right back on the same train on the other side of the boarder.

This was done because customs was stretched to thin and couldn't or didn't want to spare any agents to go to the train. This condition lasted for several months, but has now been resolved and the passengers’ once again clear customs while still on the train.

I also think that for a brief period of time, maybe a month, this happened on the Cascades train to Vancover.

Other than that I'm not aware of any other cases where this happens. All trains currently clear customs with the passengers on board.

Now the Vermonter is sort of an exception to this rule, but that's because the train ends in Vermont. So passengers have no other option except the bus if they wish to reach Montreal.

 

[AlanB]

Yes, that is what I meant by a revived Broadway Limited, both as to name and as to class of service. The Pennsylvania Railroad's "Broadway Limited" was in heavy competition with the New York Central R.R.'s "20th Century Limited".....Guess we could have something called the" 21st Century Limited"...just a thought.

Bill,

Incidentally, this past Sunday I was at a transportation/train festival in Hoboken New Jersey. While there I had the pleasure of taking a tour and sitting in the now fully restored Hickory Creek observation/sleeping car. This car had the distinction of being one of the two cars used at the rear of the 20th Century Limited.

What a pleasure to sit in this car with its luxury accommodations.

Maybe when Amtrak drops it's freight cars, we could get a few sister cars to the Hickory Creek to once again grace the ends of Amtrak trains.

 

[GWR]

Well I was just interested to see if I could find a list of old passenger route and I was so please I did find a web site it was very interesting. I liked some of the old names better.

Guy

 

[Coach34135]

All I wish for is a route that goes from LAX to ATL....

I go to TLH and drive up to ATL instead of waiting in NOL for the Crescent.

 

[Bill Haithcoat]

AlanB---regarding Hicikory Creek.....on another post.... a long, long time ago ...and under the old format , I asked you, specifically,if you were familiar with the literal red carpet used for the 20th Century Limited? This was back when "give the red carpet treament" meant something and was not just an expression. A literal red carpet was rolled out for passengers just for that one train at Grand Central Station NYC and,I think, also at Grand CentraliChicago(Yes, there was a Grand Central in CHI). ANyway, connect the two in your mind and you will see the significance of the 20th Century Limited, the Broadway's rival..

 

[AlanB]

Bill,

Sadly no read carpet over in Hoboken, however the NJHS did a great job with the restoration and are currently seeking Amtrak certification so they can once again use the car for private/public excursions.

While we were in the car though, they had a gentleman all dressed up in the traditional porter's uniform, complete with the dinner chimes and all. He gave a very nice talk about the car's history and he will actually serve as a volunteer porter when the car starts running on Amtrak.

 

[GWR]

Would thses destingation be good for new routes

82 Ex-Georgian 5-3, 4-10 Atlanta-St. Louis

92 Wabash Cannonball 301, 304 St. Louis-Detroit

93 Pan-American 8, 9 Cincinnati-New Orleans

103 Cincinnati Limited 77, 78 Cincinnati-New York

102 Ex-Redbird 65 Cincinnati to Chicago

rename the cresent to the southern cresent and maybe have something about the southern railroad on the train like some old back and white picture on the wall of the cresent it is past.

Guy

 

[Amtrak Watcher]

Some Amtrak routes come very close to big cities without actually going there. The Coast Starlight avoiding San Francisco comes to mind.

Wichita is another. The Southwest Chief stops in Newton (about 20 miles north of Wichita) at 2:00 or 3:00 in the morning (depending in which direction you are going), which would not be a big deal during the day, but presents a real problem for those in Wichita in the middle of the night.

SOLUTION:

Send the Southwest Chief through Wichita instead of Newton.

Extend the Heartland Flyer from Oaklahoma City to Wichita.

These two steps would close a small hole in what would otherwise be a big network.

I've wondered why the Empire Builder doesn't go through the larger cities in North Dakota and Montana as it hugs the Canadian border. Someone told me this is because for the cities the Empire Builder presently serves, Amtrak is the only transportation option for hundreds of miles.

 

[Viewliner]

I like these responses. I'd like to see the "Broadway Limited" as I said earlier, except maybe do that when a diner is added to the Three Rivers. Also as someone in the NY Metro Area is aware of the Access to the Regions Core which would add tunnels at the Hudson River and possibly link NYP to NYG. Imagine taking the Acela there.

As for the "Red Carpet" I have a book which shows the article. Picture getting off the Lake Shore/"21st Century Limited" or the "Broadway Limited" and getting that treatment.

I don't want ORL-MIA service lost if/when the FEC reroute happens, but as I said earlier a separate train running on the FEC, maybe leaving NY around 3 p.m.

Also why not extend the Silver Star to Boston?

Also I'm interested on what you think about the equipment proposals?

P.S. if anyone is interested I can send pics of Hickory Creek once I get them developed.

 

[tp49]

Here's one, a summer only service from Seattle to Juneau (possibly Anchorage) Alaska. Have the connection timed with the Coast Starlight. This could be marketed towards the cruise ship crowd as a land cruise and it would put Alaska a state that never had Amtrak service into the fray.

I would also love to see a Los Angeles/San Francisco train that actually goes into San Francisco up the peninsula. Realistically to have the Starlight go into SF would add almost 3 hours to the trip so this would be a better alternative.