Non-existent trackage on NARP/RPA's Vision Map?

[TML]

When I looked at the Vision map from NARP/RPA containing their proposed expansion routes and compared them to existing trackage from Google Maps and/or state track maps, it seems to me that one particular segment in the map - the route from Tampa south to Naples via St. Petersburg, Sarasota, Punta Gorda, and Ft. Myers - apparently no longer exists in its entirety (in other words, some of this trackage appears to have been pulled at certain points). Is it really true that any hypothetical restoration of passenger rail service from Tampa south to Ft. Myers would require re-laying some tracks previously pulled?

 

[John Santos]

When I looked at the Vision map from NARP/RPA containing their proposed expansion routes and compared them to existing trackage from Google Maps and/or state track maps, it seems to me that one particular segment in the map - the route from Tampa south to Naples via St. Petersburg, Sarasota, Punta Gorda, and Ft. Myers - apparently no longer exists in its entirety (in other words, some of this trackage appears to have been pulled at certain points). Is it really true that any hypothetical restoration of passenger rail service from Tampa south to Ft. Myers would require re-laying some tracks previously pulled?

I think a lot of the proposed routes would require many miles of track to be replaced or upgraded to permit reasonable passenger speeds. 25 mph just won't cut it, even if non-perishable freight doesn't mind. As long as the ROW is intact and bridges, causeways, cuts and tunnels haven't been destroyed, replacing the track is the "easy" part. If the ROW has been sold or encroached on, then lawyers get involved and the cost goes way up!

I have no idea what the particular conditions are in Florida. I did see a You-Tube video a few months ago about a couple of guys with a go-cart mounted on train wheels who were following the abandoned line west from Phoenix. Some of it looked completely intact, but there were places where it was partially washed out and a long collapsed trestle across a dry sandy area that passes for a river in that region. They stopped the lawnmower engine that was driving it, hopped off, and carried it to the next good section of track. Finally, they reached a place where one rail seemed okay, but the other was arching about 5 feet into the air and pointing in a crazy direction. Then it got worse. I think this is the track they would need to restore to get the Sunset Limited back into Phoenix.

I expect this sort of thing is or should be accounted for in the NARP/RPA proposals

 

[cirdan]

I am not familiar with the location. But if this is the type of trackage used to serve maybe a local industrial spur or two with rickety track and and crazy low speed restrictions, they would probably be looking into relaying new track anyway before passenger service can commence. So it wouldn't really make much of a difference is some bits are missing, as long as no land has been disposed off or given to other uses.

 

[BlackDiamond]

From looking at the OpenRailwayMap it looks like much of the route has been built upon south of Bonita Springs including housing developments and an airport. They may have to find a new route into Naples.

Also, I don't see how a route from Tampa to Naples could go through St. Petersburg given that it is on a peninsula on the other side of the bay.

 

[west point]

When I looked at the Vision map from NARP/RPA containing their proposed expansion routes and compared them to existing trackage from Google Maps and/or state track maps, it seems to me that one particular segment in the map - the route from Tampa south to Naples via St. Petersburg, Sarasota, Punta Gorda, and Ft. Myers - apparently no longer exists in its entirety (in other words, some of this trackage appears to have been pulled at certain points). Is it really true that any hypothetical restoration of passenger rail service from Tampa south to Ft. Myers would require re-laying some tracks previously pulled?

You are correct. The SAL line from Bradenton to Arcadia was abandoned as well as the ACL from East Sarasota to south fork was also abandoned. Fort Meyers to Naples by SAL was abandoned with ACL still to somewhere north of Naples. Now only present intact rail is CSX from just west of Lakeland south thru the Bone valley mines to Arcadia. Then Seminole Gulf RR from Arcadia on south to Ft. Meyers. Not sure if SGRR toward Naples,

Source SPV southeast 2006 edition. So, these might not all be correct.
With the upcoming hurricane Milton nothing may be left?

 

[George Harris]

This is far from the only imaginary line on these maps. One in my neck of the woods that comes to mind is a Nashville to Memphis line. The currently available track is significantly longer than the I-40 route and misses the only intermediate city of any size, Jackson TN. There was a direct route in the past, but it was so slow that the last "fast" train was down to one coach and disappeared before any of the Interstate highway was opened. Then, the Jackson to Memphis segment of that route was abandoned in 1967, and much of it has been built over since. I suspect there are others. A good bit of this map is called thinking with the wishbone, not the headbone.