Red Cap cart falls on track and passengers at Union Station in Chicago

[Stevenz]

That's it huh?

Yup, that’s all that should be required of sensible people. Show them the video and say, don’t do this.

Perhaps a solution is to not use motorised vehicles. They’re heavy and go faster than is safe for that environment. I have also seen them transporting people who were perfectly mobile.

Then there are the electric carts used in airports. They careen around through crowds with no margin for error. I wonder how many mishaps happen in airports.

 

[Stevenz]

It won't get that heated. It is as clear a case of dead bang liability as a rear end car accident. Documented on video. Amtrak knows it, Amtrak's lawyers know it, the plaintiff's lawyer knows it. A settlement will be negotiated, Amtrak is inescapably on the hook for this and everyone involved is well aware of that, the only real question is the amount.

As to overreacting, I do not think outrage over an inattentive driver dumping a passenger four feet onto the tracks then having several hundred pounds of cart and luggage land on them is overreacting.

There is the amount and then there’s the pound of flesh. This is a made-for-TV-news event.

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

Are the mail platforms used for servicing vehicles?

Not much on the platform or the tracks next to them.

 

[PVD]

Would the arbitration agreement for ticketed passengers cover this type of incident? (i don't actually care whether people think it should or shouldn't, just whether it does)

 

[zephyr17]

Would the arbitration agreement for ticketed passengers cover this type of incident? (i don't actually care whether people think it should or shouldn't, just whether it does)

Good point. It's likely it does, IMHO. They were ticketed passengers (and so agreed to arbitration as a condition of buying the ticket) on the way to Amtrak train, on Amtrak property using an Amtrak service provided by an Amtrak employee.

 

[Cal]

Not much on the platform or the tracks next to them.

I'm sorry I don't quite understand. I know at LAX after LD trains come in servicing vehicles will handle the Diner and SSL (and on the Surfliners they do this too), so I am talking about those and checked baggage cartas.

 

[Barb Stout]

The platforms are extremely narrow. The station was built with narrow platforms on each side of the train; one side for passengers, the other for mail and express. The mail platforms have a ramp going directly into the basement of the station, so they’re not usable for passengers. Union Station was built for long distance trains, but today, most trains are commuter trains or corridor trains, although it has the most long distance trains of any station, none of which carry mail and express. The narrow passenger platforms were made much worse by the construction of buildings on air rights over the tracks leading to massive pillars in the middle of the passenger platforms. This accident occurred as the red cap was navigating around one of this pillars. Boarding and deboarding trains at Union is a circus. Mobs of passengers and carts zig zagging along narrow platforms. I’ve come close to being hit by carts. It’s not a good situation. Perhaps the carts could use the baggage platforms with the doors open on both sides until there is a more permanent fix. Changing the track layout will be a massive endeavor, but has to happen, at least on the South Side. The North Side tracks aren’t as busy yet, and there is only one really long distance train that uses that side; the Empire Builder. Chicago Union is an amazing place. It’s just sad they demolished the concourse in the late ‘60’s and replaced it with a cramped basement.

Would it be easier and/or less expensive to make the basement into a passenger-friendly place and use those baggage cart platforms for boarding and de-boarding? I guess it could be confusing to have 2 platforms for boarding and de-boarding.

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

I'm sorry I don't quite understand. I know at LAX after LD trains come in servicing vehicles will handle the Diner and SSL (and on the Surfliners they do this too), so I am talking about those and checked baggage cartas.

The old mail platforms are not in use, the tracks are in place, and are not in use. These are the high platforms that are on the east side of the south portion of the station. There was plans to rebuild or refurbish them for services.

So in recap in Chicago, one passenger platform low level with post support the building overhead. One platform that is used for baggage and no post that connects with the basement. Another complete separate area with high platforms for mail that see no other use, but was planned to be rebuilt as high platforms for single level trains.

I am confusing myself now. Need pictures.

 

[Cal]

The old mail platforms are not in use, the tracks are in place, and are not in use. These are the high platforms that are on the east side of the south portion of the station. There was plans to rebuild or refurbish them for services.

So in recap in Chicago, one passenger platform low level with post support the building overhead. One platform that is used for baggage and no post that connects with the basement. Another complete separate area with high platforms for mail that see no other use, but was planned to be rebuilt as high platforms for single level trains.

I am confusing myself now. Need pictures.

Oh shoot, in my original question I meant the baggage/service platform that isn't used by passengers, the one that leads to thebasement.

Are THOSE platforms used by servicing vehicles other than baggage?

 

[OBS]

Oh shoot, in my original question I meant the baggage/service platform that isn't used by passengers, the one that leads to thebasement.

Are THOSE platforms used by servicing vehicles other than baggage?

Yes, commissary trucks and limited mechanical vehicles.

 

[Amtrak25]

Yes, commissary trucks and limited mechanical vehicles.

Then why not the baggage wagons ? Is it because they also haul passengers ?

 

[Asher]

“fercrissake”

I’m thinking if the warning placard on the vehicle contains this term we may have some confusion

 

[drdumont]

That's it huh?

It is a start, but going to a full width front axle would improve staability. Likely the front steering knuckle would have grounded and halted the vehicle. This would have a deleterious effect on maneuverability, they would not be able to UTurn on the platform as easily.
There could be an edge detector designed and installed which would halt the cart when too close to the edge.
There ARE ways to make it safer.
We ride these things every trip, and it is a little nerve wracking.

 

[drdumont]

Those pillars in the middle of the CUS platforms pose another potential danger which hasn’t yet been touched upon in this thread. While there last May, we were sharing a Red Cap cart with another couple who were facing us and away from the direction of travel. The man extended one of his arms outboard of the cart and, if Pat hadn’t reached over and pulled it in, it would have collided with one of the pillars which were quite close as we went passed them. (Since the man was not facing the direction of travel, he was unaware of his danger.) Surprisingly, the Red Cap driver didn’t caution him to keep his arm inside the cart.

Every time we have ridden them, we are warned to keep hands and arms inside the vehicle. One presumes this pertains to feet an dother bodily appendages.

 

[OBS]

Then why not the baggage wagons ? Is it because they also haul passengers ?

It’s been a long time since I was down there, but I don’t think there is an easy access from the lower level to the station level for any type of machinery.