Saluki 8/7/22 Superliner sleepers as Axle counts

[Amtrakfflyer]

Two sleepers reported on other board with photos. What a waste of equipment during peak summer. Unless it’s for a shakedown ride prior to return to service I don’t know how it’s justified. Let’s hope it’s equipment soon to be in revenue service.

 

[TransitTyrant]

Two sleepers reported on other board with photos. What a waste of equipment during peak summer. Unless it’s for a shakedown ride prior to return to service I don’t know how it’s justified. Let’s hope it’s equipment soon to be in revenue service.

The cars were bad ordered, not really a big deal

 

[lrh442]

Bad ordered or not, this puts additional wear and tear on aging cars that are in extremely high demand and are literally irreplaceable over the span of the next half-decade (at least). Not to mention the potential for damage or destruction from accidents. Why are they not running unused bags for axle count? Oh wait, I forgot: they just don't care.

 

[TransitTyrant]

Bad ordered or not, this puts additional wear and tear on aging cars that are in extremely high demand and are literally irreplaceable over the span of the next half-decade (at least). Not to mention the potential for damage or destruction from accidents. Why are they not running unused bags for axle count? Oh wait, I forgot: they just don't care.

No, it’s because the baggage cars were no longer setting off the crossing gates. For the time being there’s no single level cars on that route until they come up with a solution.

 

[Amtrak25]

CN is demanding all Superliners, so no baggage cars.

 

[MikefromCrete]

How in the world could single level cars not set off crossing gates? I mean, CN hauls thousands of single level fright cars! And, of course, locomotives lead all passenger trains on former Main Line of Mid-America. This has just become ridiculous. CN just needs to fix its faculty grade crossing equipment. If CN can't run its railroad in a safe manner, the routes need to be turned over to someone else.

 

[Bob Dylan]

CN is demanding all Superliners, so no baggage cars.

Why on earth ??? They're Axle Count Cars, not Height Measuring Cars!

 

[Amtrak25]

It is a weight issue.

Perhaps the Venture cars should have been equipped with Pullman 2410 6-wheel trucks with drop equalizer bars, and use a retired GGI as a cab car.

 

[zephyr17]

Sandbags.

 

[Just-Thinking-51]

Yes, this is getting a bit weird. Maybe it’s time for the FRA to do there jobs.

 

[west point]

Why not use Heritage bg cars with sand bags if necessary? Or did Amtrak get rid of all. Or maybe Heritage diners?
BTW it may be the signal problem comes from the different profile of Amtrak passenger car wheels than freight cars?

 

[TransitTyrant]

How in the world could single level cars not set off crossing gates? I mean, CN hauls thousands of single level fright cars! And, of course, locomotives lead all passenger trains on former Main Line of Mid-America. This has just become ridiculous. CN just needs to fix its faculty grade crossing equipment. If CN can't run its railroad in a safe manner, the routes need to be turned over to someone else.

The wheel profile on Amfleets and Horizons wasn’t setting off crossing gates. Only the heavier weight of the Superliners was. Do you really think IDOT wants to pay to use Superliners for the Illini/Saluki?

 

[jis]

The wheel profile on Amfleets and Horizons wasn’t setting off crossing gates. Only the heavier weight of the Superliners was. Do you really think IDOT wants to pay to use Superliners for the Illini/Saluki?

All the result of some American railroads using antiquated systems that have been replaced by more sensitive systems in countries (and indeed several other American railroads) that are not trying as hard as the few laggards to proceed downward in the advancement scale.

 

[MikefromCrete]

The wheel profile on Amfleets and Horizons wasn’t setting off crossing gates. Only the heavier weight of the Superliners was. Do you really think IDOT wants to pay to use Superliners for the Illini/Saluki?

Amtrak has been using Horizons and Amfleets for decades on the CN. How come all of sudden, they don't work. I have to believe that CN's maintenance of its crossing gates is at fault. They're probably doing something that saves 50 cents per gate on maintenance. Of course this could be retaliation for Amtrak's legal actions against CN.

 

[jis]

Best way to avoid the need for track circuit trigger requiring certain number of axles is to simply stop using track circuits for this purpose.

An example of advanced systems being installed by FECR which does not depend on track circuits.:

When it comes to protecting crossings, officials at Florida East Coast Railway (FEC) have their hands full. The 351-mile regional has 577 mainline crossings, about 300 of which are located in a 90-mile segment between West Palm Beach and Miami. All crossings are equipped with active warning lights and gates. As crossings are upgraded, FEC equips them with LED lights. The railroad also is installing constant warning devices, which trigger gates based on calculated train speed. The devices replace motion detectors or track circuits, says Andy Fowler, general manager of signals and communications.

"When track circuits see the train, no matter what the speed, the gates go down, which means there could potentially be a long period of time during which the crossing is activated if the train is traveling slowly," he says. "Constant warning devices give you 30 seconds of warning time, whether the train is moving fast or slow."

Full article at:

https://www.progressiverailroading....tinue-quest-to-improve-crossing-safety--39013

 

[lrh442]

No, it’s because the baggage cars were no longer setting off the crossing gates. For the time being there’s no single level cars on that route until they come up with a solution.

Good to know. But, using Superliners is still a lazy and short-sighted "solution." It doesn't appear that CN is going to fix this anytime soon, so Amtrak is going to be living with it for a while. Why don't they load some unused bags with weight? Heck, reacquire a few Hi-Levels and run 'em empty. Something. Anything. Just stop running Superliner sleepers into the ground in non-rev operation! Gaaah!
(no need to tell me why my ideas are impractical - I'm just ranting)

 

[Amtrak25]

Are there any privately owned or tourist railway Gallery commuter cars they could lease for the purpose ? I thought there was a bunch in Michigan and Iowa.

But I really don't think Amtrak is interested in efficient or creative solutions.

 

[jis]

Are there any privately owned or tourist railway Gallery commuter cars they could lease for the purpose ? I thought there was a bunch in Michigan and Iowa.

But I really don't think Amtrak is interested in efficient or creative solutions.

There are all those ex-SantaFe Hi-Level cars that Bruce has been trying to peddle for decades

 

[TransitTyrant]

Amtrak has been using Horizons and Amfleets for decades on the CN. How come all of sudden, they don't work. I have to believe that CN's maintenance of its crossing gates is at fault. They're probably doing something that saves 50 cents per gate on maintenance. Of course this could be retaliation for Amtrak's legal actions against CN.

It’s been an issue for years. It started out as simply dragging a few baggage cars for axle counts, then speed was dropped over crossings to 59 for single level consists. Now we are here. They’ll need a fix if the state owned Venture cars are ever to be out in service over this route.

 

[Willbridge]

Sandbags.

Model Railroader in the 1950's ran a hilarious satire about being a miniature scale passenger on a model railroad. Passenger asks car attendant what those fishing tackle weights in the aisle are for and is told that they're extra weight to reduce derailments on trailing point spring switches.

It seems as though anything dreamed up in satire is eventually implemented.

 

[RebelRider]

Best way to avoid the need for track circuit trigger requiring certain number of axles is to simply stop using track circuits for this purpose.

An example of advanced systems being installed by FECR which does not depend on track circuits.:



Full article at:

https://www.progressiverailroading....tinue-quest-to-improve-crossing-safety--39013

I believe "track circuits" here is being used as a generic term. There are basically two types of grade crossing signals. Fixed warning and constant warning. Each uses a track circuit to detect a train.

The fixed warning crossings are a fixed length from the crossing. Whenever a train enters that circuit, regardless of speed, the crossing will activate. Therefore, the circuit must be long enough to provide the minimum warning at maximum track speed. This means slow trains will activate the crossing long before they should, holding up road traffic and frustrating drivers. This can encourage impatient people to drive around gates.

Constant warning systems still have a track circuit that also extends as far as necessary to provide the minimum required warning for the track's maximum speed. However, constant systems are much smarter. Through fancy electronic means (measuring resistance I assume), they know how fast the train is moving and will activate the crossing accordingly. It will always provide a constant, or fixed, warning time at the crossing regardless of train speed. This minimizes disruption at crossings and provides a predictable, constant time from activation to train crossing.

I'm fairly certain this is the "advanced" systems being installed by FEC. Still track circuit based, just a lot smarter.

 

[west point]

Some constant time systems use doppler effects. In wide use? Have no idea. Might be intersting to see what Brightline is usingonthe 110 MPHsection.