Seat assignments (Acela pilot Feb 2018)

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In my experience as a private car attendant. One of which was a former LD coach. I think it's better for the TA-C to do the assignments. We get our manifest in the morning and we can best assign our seats that way. Like we had two 8 person groups. Then a two and then two singles. In our dome. And downstairs we had three six groups several fours and almost no singles. And everyone wanted a window seat. But we're able to manage it better
Well, there are situations where I'd raise holy hell about that sort of seat assignment. I often get motion sick if I don't have a window seat, so if you didn't know that and assigned an aisle seat, I might throw up in my neighbor's lap.
I'd rather handle this myself at reservation time without having to mention my motion sickness. Bluntly, self-assignment is better. It's always possible to ask for your needs to be accomodated, but frankly, we shouldn't have to be doing this constantly; it's an actual valuable perk to *not* have to ask.
 
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If I recall, on German and Austrian trains, a seat reservation (which you purchase separately from your travel reservation) is a "sitzplatz." Pretty easy to translate.
I feel like I should comment on this thread simply due to my username. :)

I do agree that it would be nice to be able to select seats ahead of time.

Usually when I get assigned a seat I don't like I'm pretty vocal about asking for a different one.

Of course, The beauty of train travel is that if I'm told "no" there's always the cafe car!
 
No doubt it's possible from a technical standpoint, but then again it might get interesting if Arrow could handle it.
ARROW has to be replaced anyway. The replacement will undoubtedly be able to handle self-assigned seats with diagrams like the airlines (unless idiots are involved in the design).The replacement of ARROW is... taking a while and costing a lot of money. They are doing it the right way, biting off the elephant one piece at a time. But any time you're replacing a non-modular system written in assembly language, and you *can't afford to shut the system down* for a month, it's going to be horribly slow and expensive.ARROW could keep track of assigned seats, but I bet it would risk running up against hardcoded system limitations in the data storage. The sort of thing which new systems don't have.So IMHO Amtrak isn't going to change seat assignment procedure until the associated modules of ARROW are replaced.
I would have thought it was written in COBOL.
 
Arrow runs on TPF, a specialty OS for IBM mainframes and their descendants. Traditionally TPF apps were written only in 370 assembler. Coders were trying to squeeze every ounce of power from the mainframe, and COBOL would have been a disaster from the perspective of performance. Also, TPF has a unique set of OS interfaces. As far as I know there has never been a COBOL compiler (or a PL/I compiler, etc) that generated object code for TPF, nor is there a shim layer that maps OS/MVS calls into TPF calls in a high-volume context. Now TPF apps can be written in C, and that's what I assume the replacement of Arrow is being written in.
 
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Arrow has the capability to assign seats. When Acela was launched in late 2000, First Class seat assignment were available at booking, including an airline-style seat map of the car showing availability. That was nearly 15 years ago. The plan was to expand the system to include Acela Business Class as well. Instead, Amtrak went to Plan B and discontinued all seat assignments within a few months of launch.

There are several reasons given for the discontinuance. One, passengers who were used to boarding and selecting any available seat did not accept the concept of reserved seats and caused crew issues when they were asked to move. A second was that the electronic interface between Arrow and the Acela trainsets that was supposed to illuminate a sign above the seat identifying that the seat was reserved (including, I believe, the name of the passenger) never worked properly requiring the crew to identify the reserved seats. Take your pick, or maybe a bit of both.

The people who think that seat assignments is no bid deal are often from train endpoints where they can board an empty train and grab whichever seat they want. For us poor slobs at a mid-point station, the situation is much different. If my wife and I want to travel from Philadelphia to New York or Boston, getting seats together can be a matter of luck, or worse would involve a beg-a-thon to try to find a kind stranger to swap seats. Given the cost to ride Amtrak, and especially Acela, that is not acceptable. For New York travel, we drive to NJT Hamilton station and board a nearly empty transit train at a fare that is a small fraction of Amtrak's cost. In exchange for saving a hundred dollars or more, we'll "rough it" for an hour or so. For Boston, we fly - with seat assignments - also at a fare much lower than Acela, and often even lower than Regional.
 
Arrow has the capability to assign seats. When Acela was launched in late 2000, First Class seat assignment were available at booking, including an airline-style seat map of the car showing availability. That was nearly 15 years ago. The plan was to expand the system to include Acela Business Class as well. Instead, Amtrak went to Plan B and discontinued all seat assignments within a few months of launch.
Any seat map would have a directional issue. You could think you are picking a forward facing seat and be facing backward. Europeans don't seem to mind riding backwards but Americans think it will make them sick. As it is the trainset could be turned either way. It is noted in Arrow which way but that is not known for sure until the train is near departure.
 
Arrow runs on TPF, a specialty OS for IBM mainframes and their descendants. Traditionally TPF apps were written only in 370 assembler. Coders were trying to squeeze every ounce of power from the mainframe, and COBOL would have been a disaster from the perspective of performance. Also, TPF has a unique set of OS interfaces. As far as I know there has never been a COBOL compiler (or a PL/I compiler, etc) that generated object code for TPF, nor is there a shim layer that maps OS/MVS calls into TPF calls in a high-volume context. Now TPF apps can be written in C, and that's what I assume the replacement of Arrow is being written in.
I seem to remember something in the Inspector General's report which indicated that C++ was being used as well as C. Of course you can use C++ anywhere you can use C.
 
Maybe longterm, something that forces trains to be "made up" predictably, and crews to flip seats if required wouldn't be a bad thing. Obviously, there will be swaps for bad ordered cars, or substitutions for late arriving sets, but that happens in all transportation modes.
 
Maybe longterm, something that forces trains to be "made up" predictably, and crews to flip seats if required wouldn't be a bad thing. Obviously, there will be swaps for bad ordered cars, or substitutions for late arriving sets, but that happens in all transportation modes.
On both Acela and Regional trains there are seats that can't be turned. More on Acela.
 
There are very few seats on Amfleets which cannot be turned.

On the Metroliner cabs, I don't believe ANY can be turned.
 
Arrow has the capability to assign seats. When Acela was launched in late 2000, First Class seat assignment were available at booking, including an airline-style seat map of the car showing availability. That was nearly 15 years ago. The plan was to expand the system to include Acela Business Class as well. Instead, Amtrak went to Plan B and discontinued all seat assignments within a few months of launch.
Any seat map would have a directional issue. You could think you are picking a forward facing seat and be facing backward. Europeans don't seem to mind riding backwards but Americans think it will make them sick. As it is the trainset could be turned either way. It is noted in Arrow which way but that is not known for sure until the train is near departure.
Just the other day at London Euston while making a reservation on a Virgin Pendolino, I asked the nice lady to give me a forward facing window seat that actually has a window next to it and not a blank wall. She pulled out a seat chart and assigned me a seat that met those exact requirements. If she could not find a forward facing seat she would have asked me whether I wanted a forward facing aisle seat or would I rather have a backward facing window seat etc. I can't understand why this should so much more difficult on Amtrak.

Yes, I understand that there would be the Irregular Operations IRROPs) situation, where the assigned seat may not be available or it may be facing the wrong way. But that should be only very occasionally the case since afterall it is IRROPs. OTOH if a railroad claims that all its ops are IRROPs, or a majority are such, and they have no clue what will be on their train facing which way, I start developing a certain level of lack of confidence in the outfit providing that service. May be just me, but that's the way it is.
 
Arrow has the capability to assign seats. When Acela was launched in late 2000, First Class seat assignment were available at booking, including an airline-style seat map of the car showing availability. That was nearly 15 years ago. The plan was to expand the system to include Acela Business Class as well. Instead, Amtrak went to Plan B and discontinued all seat assignments within a few months of launch.
Any seat map would have a directional issue. You could think you are picking a forward facing seat and be facing backward. Europeans don't seem to mind riding backwards but Americans think it will make them sick. As it is the trainset could be turned either way. It is noted in Arrow which way but that is not known for sure until the train is near departure.
Just the other day at London Euston while making a reservation on a Virgin Pendolino, I asked the nice lady to give me a forward facing window seat that actually has a window next to it and not a blank wall. She pulled out a seat chart and assigned me a seat that met those exact requirements. If she could not find a forward facing seat she would have asked me whether I wanted a forward facing aisle seat or would I rather have a backward facing window seat etc. I can't understand why this should so much more difficult on Amtrak.
Yes, I understand that there would be the Irregular Operations IRROPs) situation, where the assigned seat may not be available or it may be facing the wrong way. But that should be only very occasionally the case since afterall it is IRROPs. OTOH if a railroad claims that all its ops are IRROPs, or a majority are such, and they have no clue what will be on their train facing which way, I start developing a certain level of lack of confidence in the outfit providing that service. May be just me, but that's the way it is.
doesn't virgin have all of their pendilinos set up to stay facing a certain way each time, no need to turn the sets at either end?
 
Just the other day at London Euston while making a reservation on a Virgin Pendolino, I asked the nice lady to give me a forward facing window seat that actually has a window next to it and not a blank wall. She pulled out a seat chart and assigned me a seat that met those exact requirements. If she could not find a forward facing seat she would have asked me whether I wanted a forward facing aisle seat or would I rather have a backward facing window seat etc. I can't understand why this should so much more difficult on Amtrak.


Yes, I understand that there would be the Irregular Operations IRROPs) situation, where the assigned seat may not be available or it may be facing the wrong way. But that should be only very occasionally the case since afterall it is IRROPs. OTOH if a railroad claims that all its ops are IRROPs, or a majority are such, and they have no clue what will be on their train facing which way, I start developing a certain level of lack of confidence in the outfit providing that service. May be just me, but that's the way it is.
Sorry to inform you of what you should already know but all Amtrak operations on the NEC are irregular. Equipment substitutions, last minute Acela turns, changing which trainset or consist is used, last minute moves from the shop are the norm. That is what happens when the railroad is cashed starved and equipment starved.
 
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Just the other day at London Euston while making a reservation on a Virgin Pendolino, I asked the nice lady to give me a forward facing window seat that actually has a window next to it and not a blank wall. She pulled out a seat chart and assigned me a seat that met those exact requirements. If she could not find a forward facing seat she would have asked me whether I wanted a forward facing aisle seat or would I rather have a backward facing window seat etc. I can't understand why this should so much more difficult on Amtrak.


Yes, I understand that there would be the Irregular Operations IRROPs) situation, where the assigned seat may not be available or it may be facing the wrong way. But that should be only very occasionally the case since afterall it is IRROPs. OTOH if a railroad claims that all its ops are IRROPs, or a majority are such, and they have no clue what will be on their train facing which way, I start developing a certain level of lack of confidence in the outfit providing that service. May be just me, but that's the way it is.
Sorry to inform you of what you should already know but all Amtrak operations on the NEC are irregular. Equipment substitutions, last minute Acela turns, changing which trainset or consist is used, last minute moves from the shop are the norm. That is what happens when the railroad is cashed starved and equipment starved.
Yes, that is a problem indeed! ;)
 
Arrow has the capability to assign seats. When Acela was launched in late 2000, First Class seat assignment were available at booking, including an airline-style seat map of the car showing availability. That was nearly 15 years ago. The plan was to expand the system to include Acela Business Class as well. Instead, Amtrak went to Plan B and discontinued all seat assignments within a few months of launch.
Any seat map would have a directional issue. You could think you are picking a forward facing seat and be facing backward. Europeans don't seem to mind riding backwards but Americans think it will make them sick. As it is the trainset could be turned either way. It is noted in Arrow which way but that is not known for sure until the train is near departure.
I took the heartland flyer very recently and half the seats are facing backwards and the other forwards. Many people grabbed the rearward facing seats and didn't seem to mind. So it is possible in America....
 
Arrow has the capability to assign seats. When Acela was launched in late 2000, First Class seat assignment were available at booking, including an airline-style seat map of the car showing availability. That was nearly 15 years ago. The plan was to expand the system to include Acela Business Class as well. Instead, Amtrak went to Plan B and discontinued all seat assignments within a few months of launch.
Any seat map would have a directional issue. You could think you are picking a forward facing seat and be facing backward. Europeans don't seem to mind riding backwards but Americans think it will make them sick. As it is the trainset could be turned either way. It is noted in Arrow which way but that is not known for sure until the train is near departure.
I took the heartland flyer very recently and half the seats are facing backwards and the other forwards. Many people grabbed the rearward facing seats and didn't seem to mind. So it is possible in America....
This type of arrangement is common on Amtrak's corridor service trains. Seats are not flipped around after each trip and probably is not very cost effective time and labor wise to do so. Generally, half the seats are facing one direction and half the other with the middle with table seating.
 
Some thoughts from someone who may or may not know what she is talking about:

Assigning seats at the time of reservation could alleviate a lot of other problems too. In stations like WAS you have people lining up an hour before their departure time so they can be the first to board the train and get the best pick of seats. All the long, sprawling lines detract from the usability of the station. If all those people had their seats assigned in advance, they could spend most of that hour in the food court (or elsewhere in the station, or at home), then stroll onto the train 10-15 minutes before departure and take their seats.

On the long-distance trains, I appreciate the efforts taken to segregate passengers who will be disembarking at daytime versus nighttime stops. But surely that can be taken into account when you're offered your pick of seats (i.e., you can't choose from any seat on the train - just from those in the car designated for nighttime destinations, so the passengers in the daytime-destination car don't have to listen to you shuffling around to collect your stuff right before your stop).

If none of this would work for some reason, I wonder if Amtrak could keep separate inventories of window versus aisle seats, and sell them at different prices if necessary? The system is already set up to do that with upper and lower level seats, so it should be possible. That way, people who really want a view out the window don't have to stress out about whether they'll get one, and the people who just want to get where they're going may be able to save a few dollars.
If anyone recalls, they started this service with the Acela and passengers hated it. It also didn't work correctly. Different trains have different loading plans. Some of them are based upon the train size, service requirements, host requirements and station size. Some stations may need certain cars on the platform to accommodate baggage work. There may be a group getting on and they need the seats for late. They may want the person that is getting off first on the aisle because some people sleep like to relax during the day as well.

What works on one train may not work on another train because operating profiles are completely different.

To that end, they were supposedly working on some system that will do exactly what Johanna stated. It would show the consist, the car diagram, the seating chart, the direction of the seats etc. It is part of a massive overhaul of the operations system. Some of it has already been completed. It may help but I'm not in favor of charging people for window seats, forward facing seats (etc.)




Keep your eyes on the website over the next couple of weeks, specifically the NEC.
default_ph34r.png
 
Keep your eyes on the website over the next couple of weeks, specifically the NEC.
default_ph34r.png
Oh boy oh boy! What are your thoughts, Thirdrail?

On the Metroliner cabs, I don't believe ANY can be turned. -R30A
Is this true? Can a Keystone rider confirm this, as all the cab cars are ex-Metroliners. The New Haven–Hartford–Springfield Shuttle usually has one Amfleet I and one cab car, with both cars having half the seats facing forwards and half backwards.
 
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Keep your eyes on the website over the next couple of weeks, specifically the NEC.
default_ph34r.png
Oh boy oh boy! What are your thoughts, Thirdrail?

I
We'll have to see if they corrected the various problems they had last time and if they didn't, we'll have to see if the passengers actually care.

On the Metroliner cabs, I don't believe ANY can be turned. -R30A
Is this true? Can a Keystone rider confirm this, as all the cab cars are ex-Metroliners. The New Haven–Hartford–Springfield Shuttle usually has one Amfleet I and one cab car, with both cars having half the seats facing forwards and half backwards.
They can be turned.

At any rate, if anyone wants to play, the first crash test dummies are locked and loaded on the website:

Acela Express First Class Offers Assigned Seating

There's nothing you need to do. Seats on the following trains will be assigned automatically once you continue with this reservation. You'll be able to view and change your assigned seat(s) once your reservation has been made.

Acela Express 2190

If you don't want an assigned seat, select 'No Thanks' to go back and choose Business Class on this train, or choose a different train.

The Saturday version will feature assigned first class seating as well. The website will allow you to pick your seat from a diagram...after you've completed your purchase.
 
Keep your eyes on the website over the next couple of weeks, specifically the NEC.
default_ph34r.png
Oh boy oh boy! What are your thoughts, Thirdrail?I
We'll have to see if they corrected the various problems they had last time and if they didn't, we'll have to see if the passengers actually care.

On the Metroliner cabs, I don't believe ANY can be turned. -R30A
Is this true? Can a Keystone rider confirm this, as all the cab cars are ex-Metroliners. The New HavenHartfordSpringfield Shuttle usually has one Amfleet I and one cab car, with both cars having half the seats facing forwards and half backwards.
They can be turned.

At any rate, if anyone wants to play, the first crash test dummies are locked and loaded on the website:

Acela Express First Class Offers Assigned Seating

There's nothing you need to do. Seats on the following trains will be assigned automatically once you continue with this reservation. You'll be able to view and change your assigned seat(s) once your reservation has been made.

Acela Express 2190

If you don't want an assigned seat, select 'No Thanks' to go back and choose Business Class on this train, or choose a different train.

The Saturday version will feature assigned first class seating as well. The website will allow you to pick your seat from a diagram...after you've completed your purchase.
Now that we know the website has the functionality, hopefully this will be expanded to more trains in the future. I don't mind choosing my own seat upon boarding, but find it very annoying when the crew assigns me a seat that has no window.
 
It will be easier for SeatGuru to handle fixed regular consists like those found on Brightline trains or Amtrak Acelas, than in randomly variable consists like on non-Acela Amtrak trains.
And THAT was a major issue last time....and depending on how it is set up, may be an issue this time. Hopefully not though. They were wise to ramp down the roll out and test on low impact, easily controlled trains such as the Acela first class. Phase II won't hurt any feelings. Phase III will ramp things up a bit and then they'll evaluate what they see and see how and if this can be expanded.

You've got plenty of time before you have to think about picking coach seating on LD trains as an example.

Maybe someone with guest rewards or something will put in their information as a test.
 
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