Short-Term Iowa Thruway Service

[fairviewroad]

Here's something new (at least, I think it's new).

http://www.amtrak.com/ccurl/253/857/Amtrak-Iowa-Thruway-ATK-13-149.pdf

You can now buy an Amtrak ticket to Des Moines and Ames, Iowa.

Amtrak is offering Thruway service from those two towns, connecting with both trains 5&6 in Osceola.

The catch: The service is only available 6 days: December 18, 19 and 20 and January 11, 12 and 13.

Clearly aimed at college student traffic. But one assumes it's a (very limited) attempt at testing the waters

for future Thruway service in that state.

 

[jebr]

Glad to see it; it's something that really should be there. Wonder why they haven't been able to negotiate something with Jefferson Lines. They run that same route, albeit currently at times that don't work very well for a train transfer.

Link.

Having a way to ticket the 803/804, though, would allow same-day connections between the EB Zephyr and the WB Builder, and the EB Builder with the WB Zephyr. Not sure how popular that connection would be, but maybe would have some market?

 

[Karl1459]

IMHO, offering a Thruway service would be a responsible prelude to rail service. Not only for "testing the waters" but also for developing a customer base with a "brand" loyalty. This, in the case of Amtrak which does require direct subsidy, would also provide a greater political base to elect representives who would support rail service.

My guess is that it takes at least 5 years for a route to "mature" to a point where there is a "critical mass" of people who are aware of and use the service to a point where it can become a serious contender vs other modes of transportation. A well planned Thruway service could give this process a head start.

 

[coachseats]

Here is an article from the Des Moines Register about it- good to see it is being publicized.

http://blogs.desmoinesregister.com/dmr/index.php/2013/12/03/amtrak-offers-bus-train-connections-to-des-moines-ames-for-holiday-rail-trips-nationwide/article

I too hope it is successful- I think they are aiming at mainly student travel from ISU and Drake, but maybe if it is a good seller we could get it on a permanent basis. I think a 15 passenger van would be plenty on most days and much more cost effective than a whole bus.

 

[calwatch]

It's no worse a route than the Vegas-Kingman shuttle or the Lamy-Santa Fe shuttle. A large van should be sufficient but a bus would be good on Fridays and Sundays.

 

[Peter KG6LSE]

A second use for the buses is for the silly football games !

Ya hit a college town with bus service Ill bet the fans will use it !

I remember its 2-3 H by car fro OTM to cedar falls when I was at UNI

The bus was like 7 hours as you had to go to ames then to DM to OTM .....and it was on the greyhound .

I remember a bar convo with some friends and we had a " napkin plan" to start a mini bus service to all the college towns .

We had the hub near the worlds largest truck stop as the dispatch point ..

 

[railiner]

Sounds like a great idea...I've been advocating for years for Amtrak to run a Thruway bus between Des Moines and Osceola. Now that Greyhound has abandoned service in Iowa and Nebraska (which is incredible to me), all the more reason for Amtrak to make this a permanent daily service....

 

[fairviewroad]

Now that Greyhound has abandoned service in Iowa and Nebraska (which is incredible to me), all the more reason for Amtrak to make this a permanent daily service....

Can you clarify this statement? Because I can go on Greyhound.com and buy a one-seat ride from both Ames and Des Moines right into Chicago.

In fact, on the first day that this Thruway service is offered, I can book a one-seat ticket from Des Moines to Chicago at a fraction of the cost of

the Amtrak bus-to-train shuffle. And with 4 departure options per day.

[And that doesn't even count the Megabus service from Des Moines to Chicago]

Service is also available from those locations to Denver. So while there are certainly arguments for making this a permanent daily service, I don't

think it's the low-hanging fruit that you make it out to be. With many more (and cheaper) bus options, Amtrak will really have to make a strong

case to college students why they should pay more for a longer trip home at the holidays. [Don't think 19-year-olds will be too impressed at the

chance to buy a $25 steak in the diner, either]

 

[jebr]

Now that Greyhound has abandoned service in Iowa and Nebraska (which is incredible to me), all the more reason for Amtrak to make this a permanent daily service....

Can you clarify this statement? Because I can go on Greyhound.com and buy a one-seat ride from both Ames and Des Moines right into Chicago.

In fact, on the first day that this Thruway service is offered, I can book a one-seat ticket from Des Moines to Chicago at a fraction of the cost of

the Amtrak bus-to-train shuffle. And with 4 departure options per day.

[And that doesn't even count the Megabus service from Des Moines to Chicago]

Service is also available from those locations to Denver. So while there are certainly arguments for making this a permanent daily service, I don't

think it's the low-hanging fruit that you make it out to be. With many more (and cheaper) bus options, Amtrak will really have to make a strong

case to college students why they should pay more for a longer trip home at the holidays. [Don't think 19-year-olds will be too impressed at the

chance to buy a $25 steak in the diner, either]

That's offered by either Burlington Trailways or Black Hills Stage Lines; Greyhound just resells their tickets. Technicality, but that's how you're seeing them without Greyhound offering their own service.

Some of it would have to do with comfort, or if their parents are buying, etc. There's also some people who "won't take Greyhound" just out of a perception issue, and so Amtrak can convert them to rail instead. There's also people going to intermediate stations which bus services may or may not serve. I wouldn't be surprised if Amtrak gets a decent turnout for this, though it would have been better if they had this arranged further in advance.

 

[fairviewroad]

That's offered by either Burlington Trailways or Black Hills Stage Lines; Greyhound just resells their tickets. Technicality, but that's how you're seeing them without Greyhound offering their own service.

Some of it would have to do with comfort, or if their parents are buying, etc. There's also some people who "won't take Greyhound" just out of a perception issue, and so Amtrak can convert them to rail instead. There's also people going to intermediate stations which bus services may or may not serve. I wouldn't be surprised if Amtrak gets a decent turnout for this, though it would have been better if they had this arranged further in advance.

I realize those routes aren't operated by Greyhound, but then again, neither is this new "Amtrak" Thruway service. The buses are operated by Arrow Stage Lines. The back-end revenue arrangements may be different, but are largely irrelevant to the traveling public. To say that Greyhound has "abandoned service" in Iowa and Nebraska is kind of over-stating it, if you ask me. Only a bus enthusiast would know or care about the difference. For the traveling public, you can buy a ticket that connects you into the national bus network from many, many places in those two states.

In fact, regardless of who is technically operating the vehicle, Greyhound will sell you a ticket to FAR more locations in Iowa and Nebraska than Amtrak will.

 

[Anderson]

On the one hand, I'm really glad to see this, since the lack of an OSC-DSM bus connection has been a long-standing pet peeve of mine. On the other hand...wrong days for me to actually use it. It's a shame they didn't shoot for a longer window around Christmas and/or try to run this at Thanksgiving as well.

 

[railiner]

Now that Greyhound has abandoned service in Iowa and Nebraska (which is incredible to me), all the more reason for Amtrak to make this a permanent daily service....

Can you clarify this statement? Because I can go on Greyhound.com and buy a one-seat ride from both Ames and Des Moines right into Chicago.

In fact, on the first day that this Thruway service is offered, I can book a one-seat ticket from Des Moines to Chicago at a fraction of the cost of

the Amtrak bus-to-train shuffle. And with 4 departure options per day.

[And that doesn't even count the Megabus service from Des Moines to Chicago]

Service is also available from those locations to Denver. So while there are certainly arguments for making this a permanent daily service, I don't

think it's the low-hanging fruit that you make it out to be. With many more (and cheaper) bus options, Amtrak will really have to make a strong

case to college students why they should pay more for a longer trip home at the holidays. [Don't think 19-year-olds will be too impressed at the

chance to buy a $25 steak in the diner, either]

That's offered by either Burlington Trailways or Black Hills Stage Lines; Greyhound just resells their tickets. Technicality, but that's how you're seeing them without Greyhound offering their own service.

Some of it would have to do with comfort, or if their parents are buying, etc. There's also some people who "won't take Greyhound" just out of a perception issue, and so Amtrak can convert them to rail instead. There's also people going to intermediate stations which bus services may or may not serve. I wouldn't be surprised if Amtrak gets a decent turnout for this, though it would have been better if they had this arranged further in advance.

That's offered by either Burlington Trailways or Black Hills Stage Lines; Greyhound just resells their tickets. Technicality, but that's how you're seeing them without Greyhound offering their own service.

Some of it would have to do with comfort, or if their parents are buying, etc. There's also some people who "won't take Greyhound" just out of a perception issue, and so Amtrak can convert them to rail instead. There's also people going to intermediate stations which bus services may or may not serve. I wouldn't be surprised if Amtrak gets a decent turnout for this, though it would have been better if they had this arranged further in advance.

I realize those routes aren't operated by Greyhound, but then again, neither is this new "Amtrak" Thruway service. The buses are operated by Arrow Stage Lines. The back-end revenue arrangements may be different, but are largely irrelevant to the traveling public. To say that Greyhound has "abandoned service" in Iowa and Nebraska is kind of over-stating it, if you ask me. Only a bus enthusiast would know or care about the difference. For the traveling public, you can buy a ticket that connects you into the national bus network from many, many places in those two states.

In fact, regardless of who is technically operating the vehicle, Greyhound will sell you a ticket to FAR more locations in Iowa and Nebraska than Amtrak will.

jebr has given a very good 'clarification' of what my comment was about....perhaps it should have been posted in the 'Non-rail' category instead of over here.....

I only mentioned it in my post, because Burlington Trailways and Arrow and Black Hills Stages do not have the "national name recognition" by the public that Amtrak and Greyhound do.....

If they do decide to ever run a daily DSM-OSC Thruway connection, and it proves successful, perhaps they should consider one from the Quad Cities to BRL as well, geared toward the West, since the Quad Cities will receive their own CHI train service.....

 

[Anderson]

You indirectly raise the prospect of Cedar Rapids/Iowa City/Waterloo Thruway service as well...

*sighs*
And Sioux City/Sioux Falls service, for that matter...alongside a lot of other cities. I'm not going to lie...Amtrak could probably add a lot of ridership with through-ticketing to more destinations. Where they would put those riders, however...

 

[railiner]

The way Greyhound is abandoning mainline routes, perhaps Amtrak someday will not only be 'America's Railroad', but America's busline as well...... :unsure:

 

[Anderson]

The way Greyhound is abandoning mainline routes, perhaps Amtrak someday will not only be 'America's Railroad', but America's busline as well...... :unsure:

If not for the risk of en masse bustitutions, I wouldn't be opposed to the idea. As it is, I'm hopeful that once ROA gets service, you'll see a bus extended to Bristol, VA...and I'd like to see a push for an integrated bus/rail system to the extent that such is possible.

 

[railiner]

The way Greyhound is abandoning mainline routes, perhaps Amtrak someday will not only be 'America's Railroad', but America's busline as well...... :unsure:

If not for the risk of en masse bustitutions, I wouldn't be opposed to the idea. As it is, I'm hopeful that once ROA gets service, you'll see a bus extended to Bristol, VA...and I'd like to see a push for an integrated bus/rail system to the extent that such is possible.

The slowly expanding network of Thruway buses is a step in that direction....

 

[jebr]

You indirectly raise the prospect of Cedar Rapids/Iowa City/Waterloo Thruway service as well...

*sighs*

And Sioux City/Sioux Falls service, for that matter...alongside a lot of other cities. I'm not going to lie...Amtrak could probably add a lot of ridership with through-ticketing to more destinations. Where they would put those riders, however...

I would've loved to have had some sort of SC/SF Thruway service a few years back when I was in northwest Iowa. There'd have to be a place to park (neither Sioux City nor Sioux Falls have adequate enough transit networks to take transit to their bus stops for intercity transit) but other than that I think it'd be a way to get more riders.

Honestly, I think it'd make sense for Amtrak and Greyhound (or the various Trailways operators) to cross-ticket more often. Greyhound could offer connections to places Amtrak can't go, and Amtrak can offer long-distance service that currently Greyhound doesn't seem to really want, especially in the West.

 

[railiner]

You're right about Greyhound getting away from long-haul services.....it seems like they want to emulate the Megabus business model with various 'hub and spoke' operations...

but only in lucrative markets...

 

[Agent]

This is getting some more publicity with a story this morning from WHO: http://whotv.com/2013/12/19/holiday-travel-amtrak-tries-out-bus-shuttle/.