St. Paul, Milwaukee, Chicago Corridor service H2 2024 - 2025

[railiner]

Welcome to the world of government funding. There are more worthy projects than there are funds to make them happen. The funding also depends on the political will of the state government involved. Wisconsin has divided government and a lot of people who think that more passenger train service is not a high priority. Thus, in order to convince the paymasters at both the state and the Federal level that a project is worth spending tax dollars, one has to go through a rather long and involved process to show that the project is practicable and is a good value proposition. That's what the paperwork is for. And even if that's so, the project is competing with other projects in other states. And this all has to be done more or less transparently, with plenty of opportunity for opponents of the project to publicly weigh in. This is not like some private-sector operation where some zillionaire or cabal of corporate overlords can meet in semi-secret and make decisions quickly.

I would love to know approximately how much has been spent on “studies” for proposed new services, that never got beyond the studies, since Amtrak’s inception…

To be fair, I suppose I should balance that knowledge, with how much has been spent on studies that eventually reached fruition…

 

[thefirewarde]

The freedom to make fast changes also includes the freedom to make bad changes. The slow process has undoubtedly given advocates time to save some routes that would otherwise have been dropped. This sword cuts both ways.

 

[NES28]

The reality is that Amtrak won't have enough spare cars available to initiate any new routes until Airo trains start getting delivered in 2026. Might as well do some good planning in the meantime!

 

[west point]

The reality is that Amtrak won't have enough spare cars available to initiate any new routes until Airo trains start getting delivered in 2026. Might as well do some good planning in the meantime!

That only if Amtrak does not try to prematurely try to retire some equipment

 

[WWW]

That only if Amtrak does not try to prematurely try to retire some equipment

That Beech Grove (etal) retirement equipment does not have to be run at 80 mph track speed -
the track/rails of which will need to be upgraded anyway.
The best premier equipment does not have to used.
YES it would nice for the start up equipment to be all polish and luster.
Use what is available - gear it up.
This is the USA - "IT CAN BE DONE" !
And get the negative naysayers on a speeder to a dead-end !
TRAIN HORN ### - get out of the way !

 

[diesteldorf]

Just wanted to share a couple things:

Minnesota's Rep. Betty McCollum was instrumental in securing funding to keep the Borealis operational for at least the next 6 years.

https://www.startribune.com/amtraks...o-ensure-service-for-next-six-years/601204293

Last year, around this time of year, the Empire Builder experienced cancelations due to equipment and/or cold weather, causing a personal disruption when I went to Chicago for a weekend away.

This year, at least for 1/17-1/20, the Empire Builder is canceled due to cold weather, but, with the Borealis, at least those living between MSP and Chicago have options.

I completely understand why a long distance train may be canceled in inclement weather, especially if Amtrak doesn't want to risk equipment breakdowns and keep passengers safe, but I am also curious to know if Amtrak has discussed contingency plans when operating the Borealis this winter. Will they run buses or, like the EB, cancel service.

Is the threshhold to cancel the Borealis much higher than the EB, considering it travels a much shorter distance?

 

[NorthShore]

Just wanted to share a couple things:

Minnesota's Rep. Betty McCollum was instrumental in securing funding to keep the Borealis operational for at least the next 6 years.

https://www.startribune.com/amtraks...o-ensure-service-for-next-six-years/601204293

Last year, around this time of year, the Empire Builder experienced cancelations due to equipment and/or cold weather, causing a personal disruption when I went to Chicago for a weekend away.

This year, at least for 1/17-1/20, the Empire Builder is canceled due to cold weather, but, with the Borealis, at least those living between MSP and Chicago have options.

I completely understand why a long distance train may be canceled in inclement weather, especially if Amtrak doesn't want to risk equipment breakdowns and keep passengers safe, but I am also curious to know if Amtrak has discussed contingency plans when operating the Borealis this winter. Will they run buses or, like the EB, cancel service.

Is the threshhold to cancel the Borealis much higher than the EB, considering it travels a much shorter distance?

From what I've been seeing on social media, from another reliable member of this forum, there has been some real back and forth as to what trains in Hiawatha/Borealis service may or may not get cancelled on these dates. Perhaps part of that discussion is what to do without a protect consist, though the Hiawatha has been known to see some serious delays during extreme weather (as I can attest to from personal experience.) Last I've seen, some of the Hiawatha trains will be scratched, but replaced by buses.

 

[Mr.Technician]

I know that it has been a while, but a dash 8 seems to be temporarily on one of the Borealis sets. I don't know how much longer it will be on it, but it's cool to see a dash 8 on it again.
View attachment 38602

I just drove over the highway by SPUD and this trainset still has its dash 8.

 

[prech786]

Is the recent use of superliners on the Borealis one-off exceptions? Is there any discussion out there about permanent superliner equipment on the Borealis?

 

[OmahaRoad]

Is the recent use of superliners on the Borealis one-off exceptions? Is there any discussion out there about permanent superliner equipment on the Borealis?

Everything we know points to it being a one-off exception! Haven't heard anything from MN advocates or state staff about using it more. Plus, there's such a shortage of Superliners for long-distance services as it is that it would be a departure from everything I've ever read about Amtrak's policies/practices around Superliner deployment to put them on a corridor route (that has no need to have them for axle count, etc.).

 

[diesteldorf]

Everything we know points to it being a one-off exception! Haven't heard anything from MN advocates or state staff about using it more. Plus, there's such a shortage of Superliners for long-distance services as it is that it would be a departure from everything I've ever read about Amtrak's policies/practices around Superliner deployment to put them on a corridor route (that has no need to have them for axle count, etc.).

Thanks for sharing. Wasn't aware that they were using Superliners at all on the Borealis.

I normally take Business Class and it seems like it is often sold out. Since tbe Borealis uses 1 car that is half business and half cafe, I know it wouldfn't make sense to add a 2nd cafe/business class consist if they ever wanted to expand business class.

Does Amtrak have any other options if they wanted to expand business class, keeping the 2-1 seating, without adding a car, like on the Pennsylvanian, where Business Class is a standard coach, and not, in my opinion, worth the upgrade charge?

 

[chadamfleetrailfan]

AFAIK, the superliners on the Borealis is just a temporary move. The other Borealis trainset is still comprised of horizons and the cafe car.

From a very reliable source, the one Borealis trainset got freeze damage in St. Paul and was sent to Beech Grove on the Cardinal.

I'm also noticing from the railcam that there wasn't a dining car, so I'm assuming it's only including all coach superliners?

 

[west point]

Freeze damage?? Did the HEP ground not work or is there HEP at MSP??doe

 

[thefirewarde]

It's possible it was cold enough that idle, properly powered cars froze. It's also possible that some insulation got removed and not reinstalled, something was left open, or something was left shut that shouldn't have been - it's very easy to mess up and freeze things at 30 below.

 

[user535733]

I'm also noticing from the railcam that there wasn't a dining car, so I'm assuming it's only including all coach superliners?

Borealis never carried a Dining Car. It has always carried a Cafe.
One of the Superliner coaches is actually a Snack Coach.
The cafe is on the lower level, coach seating on the upper level.