Status of Surfliner Service between Oceanside and Irvine

[zephyr17]

We called Guest Rewards this morning and were told that Pacific Surfliner Train 777 will have direct service from San Diego to Los Angeles during the last week of June on the date we plan to travel. When I mentioned the temporary Pacific Surfliner Timetable that went into effect last Monday, and which shows train 777 as departing San Diego as 1777 at 11:03 a.m. instead of the 12:01 p.m. shown in our ticket, this came as a surprise to the woman I talked with! She checked with her “support desk” and was told that direct service would be available on the date we plan to travel. All she could advise us to do was to keep checking our e-mails to see if Amtrak has contacted us with an update (and, hopefully, a new e-ticket.) She also said it would be OK for us to call back again (not that it would do much good if the system hasn’t been updated.) So, there you have it. Less than two weeks before we are to depart, there is still a major disconnect within the system that won’t allow us to update our tickets. (We’re assuming that all of the other people who plan to travel on the Pacific Surfliner on the same date we do are in the same position.) If and when we learn anything new, we’ll post an update.

All any of them know is what ARROW tells them. If it isn't in ARROW, it doesn't exist. They don't have access to any more information than you do, looking at ARROW as filtered through the website.

They also cannot change a ticket to something that isn't in ARROW. There is no physical means to ticket you on a train/bus combination that is not in it.

However, ARROW does not always represent ground truth and that is likely the case here. The stuff on the Pacific Surfliner website is posted by the agency closest to the action and almost certainly the more accurate. LOSSAN, the Joint Powers Board that funds the service and operates the website, has reduced service and closed agencies, a move that would seem to reflect it expects a long closure. Probably, since they haven't given Amtrak a restart date which they themselves do not have (and they control restart, not Amtrak), Amtrak just put a date in ARROW a few weeks out and called it good. That's what you're seeing. They'll put in another, farther out phantom date as we get a bit closer, my guess is they'll probably do that sometime early next week.

As I said before, your best and quickest method of finding out is to keep checking online. Preferably through the app, which I know from experience reflects changes quickly. Not saying the website doesn't, only that I know the app does. An email will not be as timely, it'll likely be a day or two after the ARROW update if history is a guide, and there remains a possibility that they might not send one at all.

I would say the chances of you having the earlier departure that includes a bus bridge is upwards of 85%.

The only scenario that puts your trip in danger is if they do not revise your itinerary and cancel the SAN-LAX segment for some reason. That'll appear in the app as not having a QR code (it also seems to be the scenario when not sending an email is most likely). If the QR code disappears, call immediately.

Finally, as long as they revise your itinerary once ARROW is updated, your revised itinerary will be the one attached to your e-ticket. It really doesn't matter if the old itinerary shown on the PDF is remains accurate or not, that PDF will still validly scan. Just be at the station for the earlier departure.

 

[zephyr17]

It's also quite possible that Amtrak hasn't fully determined what their medium-to-long-term plans will be during the closure, and they don't want to confuse people with multiple changes if at all possible. I wouldn't be surprised if the current temporary schedule shifts a bit as they figure out timing, demand needs, staffing availability, etc. Doesn't explain why the rep claims that direct service will be available, but I wouldn't be surprised if that's just typical bad Amtrak communication..

Their only source of information is the system. If the system says there will be direct service, that is what they will say. They have no other source of information.

Also, Amtrak doesn't control that service, LOSSAN does. It is up to LOSSAN to figure it out what's going to happen and coordinate with Amtrak. All indications are that LOSSAN thinks the service won't be available for quite awhile and they don't know how long yet.

 

[zephyr17]

Just for the record, there are at least three agencies involved, SCRRA which owns the track and is responsible for maintainence (which they sometimes seem to call in BNSF to do in emergencies), LOSSAN which sponsors, funds, and controls Pacific Surfliner service, and Amtrak which operates it for LOSSAN.

Amtrak is the tail, not the dog.

 

[Eric in East County]

We have no problem doing the bus transfer if it comes to that. The only issue that concerns us is that, if the bus bridge is still in place on the day we leave, there are only three (3) trains departing from San Diego. The third train arrives in LA too late for us to catch our Southwest Chief. The first train leaves at around 7:31 a.m. (If necessary, we can take this 7:31 a.m. train, although this will require us to leave home very early in the morning and make our way to San Diego through the morning commute.) The train we’d prefer to take leaves at 11:03 a.m. In a perfect world, our tickets for Train 777 (departing at 12:01 p.m.) would automatically be reissued for the 11:03 a.m. train. (We’re not expecting this to happen.) Most everyone will probably want seats on that 11:03 a.m. train so it is sure to sell out right away. Working to our advantage is that, right now, no one can buy a ticket for the 11:03 a.m. train since it doesn’t show up in the Amtrak system. Also, the average person probably doesn’t know enough to keep visiting the Amtrak app to gain an advantage if and when the system updates to “no direct service” for the date we plan to travel. (We are now doing this once or twice daily.) The average person probably doesn’t know about AU, either and won’t be visiting this thread to learn if any new developments have taken place that aren’t being talked about elsewhere.

The last week in June is traditionally a heavy travel time what with the 4th of July fast approaching. Perhaps a best effort is being made to have direct service back in place by then. If not, I pity the poor Amtrak agents who will have to deal with those irate customers who, in good faith, bought direct service tickets and then got skunked.

Choosing to travel via Amtrak is not for the faint-hearted!

 

[zephyr17]

Well, I agree with that. It certainly confers an advantage on those who the ins, outs and peculiarities of Amtrak. And I do feel for the customer service reps who so often get blindsided by Amtrak, especially the last couple years.

I am reasonably sure that if you are ticketed on 777, you'll be reticketed on the 1777/3977/777 train/bus/train service. In any case, since you are checking regularly you'll stand a good chance of being close to the first in line for it.

I don't think those bluffs are going to be cooperative in getting the service safely restarted on a short timeline, though .

 

[MIrailfan]

why they letting freights through? Things that make you go hmmm.

 

[zephyr17]

why they letting freights through? Things that make you go hmmm.

One a day each way very slowly. And not a trainload of passengers at risk. Just a bunch of inanimate objects and just two operating crew. The risk/liability calculation is wholly different.

Also, that line is San Diego's only rail freight connection to the outside world.

If SCRRA has any brains, they probably demanded a very thorough hold harmless agreement with BNSF to allow them to operate under these conditions, making BNSF responsible for all damage and losses and indemnifying SCRRA.

 

[GDRRiley]

why they letting freights through? Things that make you go hmmm.

because freight has minor risk and they can happily run it along at 5-10mph

the bus bridge is really expensive to run thats why they've tried to cut it back as much as possible. its also caused some major delays thought the system when a bus gets badly delayed. which given its on I-5 between LA and SD it will be, just never know for how long

OCTA doesn't care but its clear some legislators do, we may see some changes coming on the state side so closures like this are limited and get fixed fast. That bypass can't come soon enough

 

[Eric in East County]

I am reasonably sure that if you are ticketed on 777, you'll be reticketed on the 1777/3977/777 train/bus/train service. In any case, since you are checking regularly you'll stand a good chance of being close to the first in line for it.

As a result of Amtrak not being to honor our made-and-paid-for bedroom reservation last year, we were under the perhaps mistaken impression that if the bus bridge is still in place on the day we are to depart, our made-and-paid-for “train only” reservation on Pacific Surfliner 777 would somehow become invalid unless and until Amtrak reissues us a new 1777/3977/777 train/bus/train service ticket before 1777 sells out completely.

As a result of your clarification, we feel much better about our situation, although we won’t feel easy until we have that reissued 1777/3977/777 ticket in hand. Even then, we won’t begin to totally relax until we’re in Los Angeles and situated inside our Southwest Chief bedroom.

Since our original 777 reservation was made using travel points, it appears under a different reservation number than our Southwest Chief reservation. Last March, we called Amtrak Customer Relations and had them manually link the two reservations together so that we’d have a guaranteed connection. Will we have to do this again for the reissued 1777/3977/777 reservation?

 

[Trogdor]

Since our original 777 reservation was made using travel points, it appears under a different reservation number than our Southwest Chief reservation. Last March, we called Amtrak Customer Relations and had them manually link the two reservations together so that we’d have a guaranteed connection. Will we have to do this again for the reissued 1777/3977/777 reservation?

There’s no such thing as “manually linking” reservations in a way that is going to be meaningful from an automated process perspective. All it really does is add a footnote to the reservations that someone will see if they happen to be looking at your specific reservation. And there is rarely a reason (unless you are on the phone with them at that moment) for an employee to manually look up your reservation.

 

[Eric in East County]

We’re aware that our names won’t be showing up on any automatically generated list of passengers who missed their connection due to a late arrival. But having a footnote on our reservation that some agent will have look up is preferable to being written off as a “no show.”

 

[zephyr17]

As a result of Amtrak not being to honor our made-and-paid-for bedroom reservation last year, we were under the perhaps mistaken impression that if the bus bridge is still in place on the day we are to depart, our made-and-paid-for “train only” reservation on Pacific Surfliner 777 would somehow become invalid unless and until Amtrak reissues us a new 1777/3977/777 train/bus/train service ticket before 1777 sells out completely.

As a result of your clarification, we feel much better about our situation, although we won’t feel easy until we have that reissued 1777/3977/777 ticket in hand. Even then, we won’t begin to totally relax until we’re in Los Angeles and situated inside our Southwest Chief bedroom.

Since our original 777 reservation was made using travel points, it appears under a different reservation number than our Southwest Chief reservation. Last March, we called Amtrak Customer Relations and had them manually link the two reservations together so that we’d have a guaranteed connection. Will we have to do this again for the reissued 1777/3977/777 reservation?

Make sure and keep checking daily. While I do think you'll be reticketed automatically by Amtrak, as you know, Amtrak can be very much hit or miss. Missing QR code on the app will be the clue that you need to take action. If they rebook you automatically, the QR will remain on the app.

As to the manual note in your reservation, my guess is it is attached to the PNR ("Passenger Name Record", the reservation number) not the itinerary under it. I think as long as they don't cancel entirely and rebook, it'll still be there. In all cases where my reservations have been involuntarily modified, mostly misses between LD and corridor trains in Chicago, the same PNR was retained for the reissued tickets.

I did have a case where a modification got so tangled up that the AGR agent and I agreed it would be better to just cancel it and start over. That was a unusual situation and also was on a modification I requested, not one forced by something Amtrak did.

 

[MIrailfan]

How about elevating the tracks on an overpass or rebuilding? Costly but effective.

 

[ParanoidAndroid]

Many effective things are costly...

But I think an overpass on the beach would be rather unsightly, and the foundations would suffer the same issues with unstable ground.

 

[GDRRiley]

How about elevating the tracks on an overpass or rebuilding? Costly but effective.

Not an option with coastal commision nor the sight lines that would impact. Bypass inland under I-5 is the best choice

 

[Eric in East County]

This morning, (Monday, June 19th) I got up early to check the Amtrak website to see if there has been an update made to the Pacific Surfliner schedule for next week. It still shows direct train service between San Diego and Los Angeles (including the popular Anaheim/Disneyland station) during the last week in June.

I’m assuming that a person booking Pacific Surfliner tickets on-line for next week will be sold a “train only” ticket. I’m also assuming that those who call Amtrak’s 800 number and get through to an agent to inquire if there is still a bus bridge between Oceanside and Irvine will be told that it doesn’t appear on the schedule so therefore it is not in effect.

The Pacific Surfliner Travel Advisories page still shows the bus bridge in effect, with no indication that direct service will be available next week.

I also checked our SAN-LAX reservation for train 777 for next week and it, too, shows direct train service with a departure time of 12:01 p.m. (If we end up having to take train 1777, we’ll have to be at the station in enough time for an 11:03 a.m. departure.)

The agents at San Diego’s downtown Santa Fe Depot might be able to “unofficially” provide a better idea of what to expect next week if one could just get through to them.

Given that today is a Federal holiday, I’m willing to cut Amtrak a break about being slow to update its system. If it hasn’t been updated by tomorrow, then there is something seriously wrong. The number of people whose travel plans could be seriously impacted by this SNAFU remains to be seen.

 

[GDRRiley]

Given that today is a Federal holiday, I’m willing to cut Amtrak a break about being slow to update its system. If it hasn’t been updated by tomorrow, then there is something seriously wrong. The number of people whose travel plans could be seriously impacted by this SNAFU remains to be seen.

the date that was proposed near the start to get the track reopened was late this week or early next. The city gives 0 updates until metrolink and surfliner start service.

 

[Eric in East County]

the date that was proposed near the start to get the track reopened was late this week or early next. The city gives 0 updates until metrolink and surfliner start service.

This is indeed encouraging news. In an earlier post to this thread, I speculated that a best effort might be made to restore direct Pacific Surfliner service in time for the peak travel week proceeding the 4th of July. (The potential loss of tourist dollars to all concerned if the bus bridge remains in effect is certainly a powerful incentive to cut through the red tape and dispense with the foot dragging.) If this is the case, then Amtrak is apparently more on top of the situation than we’ve been giving them credit for, which might explain why the Pacific Surfliner schedule posted on the website hasn’t been updated. We’ll have to wait and see. In the meantime, we plan to keeping checking the Amtrak website and the Pacific Surfliner Travel Advisories page for updates.

 

[zephyr17]

I’m assuming that a person booking Pacific Surfliner tickets on-line for next week will be sold a “train only” ticket. I’m also assuming that those who call Amtrak’s 800 number and get through to an agent to inquire if there is still a bus bridge between Oceanside and Irvine will be told that it doesn’t appear on the schedule so therefore it is not in effect.

Yep, until and unless ARROW is updated, that's all that can be done regardless of method, website, app, phone agent, station agent.

 

[GDRRiley]

This is indeed encouraging news. In an earlier post to this thread, I speculated that a best effort might be made to restore direct Pacific Surfliner service in time for the peak travel week proceeding the 4th of July. (The potential loss of tourist dollars to all concerned if the bus bridge remains in effect is certainly a powerful incentive to cut through the red tape and dispense with the foot dragging.) If this is the case, then Amtrak is apparently more on top of the situation than we’ve been giving them credit for, which might explain why the Pacific Surfliner schedule posted on the website hasn’t been updated. We’ll have to wait and see. In the meantime, we plan to keeping checking the Amtrak website and the Pacific Surfliner Travel Advisories page for updates.

None of this is amtrak. its all OCTA and San Clemente. LOSSAN and SCRRA (metrolink) are mostly just sitting on the sidelines waiting to inspect the track and restart service.

 

[Eric in East County]

Those who stand the most to lose if the bus bridge is kept in place might very well be putting pressure on OCTA and San Clemente to allow direct service to resume. Apparently, something must be in the works if Amtrak is not updating the Pacific Surfliner schedule shown on its website and is continuing to sell tickets based on direct service between SAN and LAX. Of course, Amtrak has been known to sell accommodations that it might not be able to provide. But to continue to do so less than a week before people will be expecting to travel is a bit brazen. Then too, if these bought and paid for direct service accommodations can’t be provided, the blowback will be significant. Again, those of us who will be traveling on the Pacific Surfliner next week must hope for the best but plan for the worst.

 

[Eric in East County]

I was up again early this morning to check on the status of our SAN to LAX Pacific Surfliner 777 train scheduled for next week. The Amtrak website still shows all 10 northbound Pacific Surfliners departing on that day at their regular times, with direct service to LA and all of their usual station stops. The Pacific Surfliner Travel Advisories page is still showing the temporary timetable which went into effect on June 12th, with only three northbound trains and the bus bridge. There were no updates about direct service being restored later this week or early next week.

Our ticket, which was issued to us almost a year ago, is “train only” and there is no way that Amtrak will issue us a new one while their computer still shows direct service.

Ideally, there will soon be an official announcement stating whether or not direct service has been restored. If not, we plan to be at the downtown Santa Fe Depot in time for the 11:03 a.m. departure of 1777 (if that’s what will be running that day), trusting to luck that our 777 “train only” ticket will be sufficient to get us onto the bus and eventually to LA.

 

[MIrailfan]

any updates

 

[Eric in East County]

The Amtrak website shows the bus bridge in effect on Friday, June 23, and direct service to LAX beginning on Saturday June 24th. The Pacific Surfliner Travel Advisories page has not been updated since June 12th. We plan to check back on Saturday to see if the Pacific Surfliner stopped in Anaheim, a sure indication that direct service has been restored.

 

[thully]

The Amtrak website shows the bus bridge in effect on Friday, June 23, and direct service to LAX beginning on Saturday June 24th. The Pacific Surfliner Travel Advisories page has not been updated since June 12th. We plan to check back on Saturday to see if the Pacific Surfliner stopped in Anaheim, a sure indication that direct service has been restored.

That’s not what I’m seeing on the Amtrak app now - it seems to show the bus bridge through July 16th. I’d call to get your ticket changed to 1777 and the bus bridge if it hasn’t updated already.