SWC loses 9 hours between Raton and Las Vegas???

[Dave Van]

#3 (9/23?) lost 9 hours and is now 10+ late. I have been on the SWC when it was 11 hours late but it was a late start that just grew. This seems like a major issue to loose 9 hours in the short distance between two stations. Info???

that late trip.....@ Raton

 

[Bob Dylan]

Engine damaged by debris ( Boulder) on tracks. BNSF Rescue engine had to take it to ABQ where a protect P-42 took over the lead.

New scenery in Daylight in New Mexico and Arizona!

 

[starlight11]

I'm on this train right now (been on since CHI). Right outside of Raton we hit some kind of rock or boulder. The rock was evidently crushed but the brake hoses on the lead engine broke and locked up the braking system.

We sat for probably 6 hours as the conductor attempted to release the braking system so we could ditch the engine on a siding. The power had to be cut for most of that time, so it got fairly warm inside the cars and local law enforcement walked through several times to check up on everybody. Eventually they let everyone step off the train for a little while to get fresh air. Luckily it was a nice day outside with interesting clouds.

They moved the train to a siding where we sat for another couple hours to await instructions from the "top brass" regarding leaving the engine there. Evidently there's very strict guidelines that must be followed.

Meanwhile they had to get ready for a crew shift change. The new crew had been driven out (from ABQ?) and their vehicle had gotten stuck in the mud, so the train had to back up to pick them up, adding another 30+ minutes of delay.

After that, the train had to go very slow for a while due to signal problems.

When things finally settled down, the engineer took a turn above the prescribed rate of speed and the counter balancing breaking system evidently failed. So the engineer had to manually break hard, which gave everyone a feeling of possible pending derailment, as passengers were pushed against the right hand side of the train. Soon after, the conductor traveled the train to file incident reports from any possible injuries. This incident didn't cause any extra delays, but it did rattle nerves after an already long day. I'm only glad I wasn't in the dining car as I imagine dinner items were thrown around pretty radically.

It's certainly a ride to remember! The upside is that the rarely seen portions of AZ will be visible today. I only hope this train arrives soon enough in LAX for me to catch the last northbound Surfliner of the day!

 

[fredmcain]

When things finally settled down, the engineer took a turn above the prescribed rate of speed and the counter balancing breaking system evidently failed. So the engineer had to manually break hard, which gave everyone a feeling of possible pending derailment, as passengers were pushed against the right hand side of the train.

What exactly does this mean? I've had some pretty crazy train riding experiences myself but I never encounter this. What is a "Counter balance breaking system"?

 

[starlight11]

My understanding is that we were going too fast around a curve and the train was leaning very far into one direction.

The conductor later said that it was caused by failure of the counter breaking system. I may be using the wrong terminology, but that was the announcement.

My service car attendant said he'd never experienced anything like it before.

 

[fredmcain]

be

My understanding is that we were going too fast around a curve and the train was leaning very far into one direction.

The conductor later said that it was caused by failure of the counter breaking system. I may be using the wrong terminology, but that was the announcement.

My service car attendant said he'd never experienced anything like it before.

I've never heard of a "counter breaking system". Does anyone know what that is?

As for terminology, I wonder if maybe the dynamic breaks failed. The conductor assumed (probably erroneously) that you wouldn't know what that was so he called it a "counter breaking system". Then maybe the engineer discovered too late that they weren't working properly and with a bad curve rapidly approaching, made a big air brake reduction but it was too little too late and you hit the curve too fast. If that was the case, you should be glad that you were ONLY 11 hours late 'cause if you'd hit the ground it woulda been much, much worse.

I can relate a little bit from my very first cross-country Amtrak trip back in 1980. When I permanently left the Phoenix area, I took what was then called the Southwest Limited from Flagstaff to Chicago then on to Connecticut from there. The speed limit east of La Junta was 90 MPH and believe me they went 90. Even way back then the Santa Fe's track was beginning to deteriorate. It was a very, very rough ride to say the least which was made worse by the older equipment. (Still had the old steam heated "heritage" stuff.) Don't know if it was just the rough track or the fact that the air conditioner in our sleeper had failed but I got VERY little if any sleep that night!

Somewhere east of Hutchinson, KS, we rejoined the main line and encountered good track and a smooth ride. I quickly dozed off to sleep. My sleep was short lived as the best was yet to come!

After we left the main line again and onto the secondary main line through Topeka, there was more 90MPH stuff on rough, jointed track and lots and lots of 80 and even 85 MPH curves. I held onto my bed for dear life as the flanges bit violently into the rails on the curves. The car lurched violently. There were a couple of times that I was convinced that we wouldn't make it and end up in the ditch. We did not. Somehow we stayed on the rails. After we were back on the mainline again east of Kansas City, the ride was smooth and uneventful. But it stayed hot. Amtrak maintenance crews tried to fix our A/C again at KC but to no avail. That, indeed, was a trip to remember.

 

[starlight11]

I think your description is spot on! I think that's exactly what happened. I think the conductor did in fact say dynamic braking, not counter braking.

Currently we look to be about 12.5 hours late. The food supply is running low. Only continental breakfast available, which they stocked up on in Flagstaff.

 

[KmH]

Dynamic braking is provided by using the locomotives electric traction motors as generators to slow the train.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_braking

"During dynamic braking, the traction motors, which are now acting as generators, are connected to the braking grids (large resistors), which put a large load on the electrical circuit. When a generator circuit is loaded down with resistance, it causes the generators to slow their rotation. By varying the amount of excitation in the traction motor fields and the amount of resistance imposed on the circuit by the resistor grids, the traction motors can be slowed down to a virtual stop (approximately 3-5 MPH)."

 

[fredmcain]

KmH,

Thanks for your description. That was a good explanation as to how this works.

As an aside, back in the old steam days, steam locomotives didn't have dynamic braking which was one reason (among many) that railroads don't use them anymore.

Earlier in the summer we took a ride on the Cumbres & Toltec Scenic RR in southern Colorado (highly recommended). After we crossed Cumbres Pass, there was a 4% downgrade to Chama that lasted several miles. The brake shoes really produced some very serious smoke! I had to wonder how it went in the old days when they had to move a really heavy freight train over the mountains as on Donner Pass or somewhere like that. Must've been quite a challenge!

 

[Bob Dylan]

Helper engines were very common in the Mountains, in fact Helper,Utah was a major Railroad town and got it's name from serving as a depot for helper engines through the Mountains.

 

[Dave Van]

Thanks all....good info. Sorry you sailed by my record late into LAX time but someone had to do it!!

 

[Eric in East County]

For the last few weeks, we’ve been tracking the arrival times of Trains 3 & 4. We’ll be riding on both of them next month and want to stay current on whether they are still being impacted by the track work that caused them to be (consistently) very late last summer. That’s how we found out that #3 was running 11+ hours late today. From experience, we’ve learned that AU is the best place to find out what’s happening with Amtrak trains. That’s how we happen to find this thread. What really amazed us, though, was the posting from someone actually on #3 who was able to provide a first-hand account of why it was running so late. Thank you, AU for making possible postings like that one.

Eric & Pat

 

[TheOldMan]

Can't help but worry did you get any dinner? You have not made up anytime so hope you can make your connection.

 

[Dave Van]

SWC #3 over the last month had a on time record of 28%......sad stat....but I was 11 hours late in Sept on my ride from Chicago to LA Union so that ride didn't help. Be great if they could just get to 50% on time but that will be a struggle.

 

[ChuckL]

I've been watching the arrivals for #3 for the past several days and they were looking pretty decent until yesterday's "boulder incident." I'm traveling from DER to SAN at the beginning of November and booked the Surfliner leaving at 11:20 am which is after the one that should connect with the SWC's arrival in Los Angeles (just in case #3 was running a bit late.)

Now I'm wondering if I should plan and book an even later train since I'm booked in BC. Today's #3 arrived just shy of 4 hours late. How late do trains have to be to not be included in last month's on time statistics?

Sent from my iPhone using Amtrak Forum

 

[starlight11]

They ended up serving Subway sandwiches (picked up in Kingman) for lunch and beef stew (which I decided to skip) for dinner.

There were more delays as we got into California as we lost our priority to many BNSF and Metrolink trains.

Between Riverside and Fullerton the train got within probably half a mile of the wildfire in Orange County. I was able to see some stunning and dramatic views of HUGE and widespread flames. Here was a partial view from the sightseer lounge:

Truly a train ride to remember! And I would not have witnessed it had the train not been so late!

The train pulled into Union Station a little after 8:30 PM, well after the last northbound Surfliner had left. They put me on the 9:50 PM northbound AmBus and I didn't get home until after midnight. Thus concluded my two week trip to the east coast (taking the full runs of the SWC, Capitol Limited, and Cardinal trains).

Needless to say I was happy to be done traveling!

 

[Dave Van]

Thanks for that info!!! The Cardinal is my primary train......have to use it to get anywhere. Nice ride....but like many a 'on time' bear!!!

 

[Bob Dylan]

Always an adventure on Amtrak! Nice pic too, thanks for sharing!

 

[Hotblack Desiato]

How late do trains have to be to not be included in last month's on time statistics?

The cutoff for long-distance trains is 30 minutes (under 30 minutes is on time, over 30 is late...I forget if exactly 30 is on time or late, but you get the idea).

 

[Dave Van]

Slow going for all SWC of late.....

#4 (26) 4 hours late at Kingman AZ

not good

 

[Dave Van]

#4(26) 9 hours + late at Lamar......just seem the SWC can't get a break. I know track work seemed complete on my ride on #4(10) but we did sit in the Raton tunnel for 30 minutes due to signal work. Is fixing this a priority??? Or late just SOP now.