Talgo Trainsets to California

[seat38a]

Here is a more detailed article on just the LOSSAN portion of the money and how it is going to be used. http://www.oc-breeze.com/2016/08/17/89581_state-awards-82-million-grant-enhance-pacific-surfliner-commuter-rail-service/

"Talgo Rail Equipment: Provides a five-year capital lease, including maintenance, for 31 rail cars to replace aging trainsets."

So I'm guessing the Horizon consist will be going bye bye when the Talgo's arrive. This will make it much easier for seniors and the disabled to get on and off the train vs the precarious situation I've seen with seniors getting on and off the Horizon consists. The boarding height should be about the same as the Surfliner, and the Talgo's come with built in ramps for people in wheelchairs.

DSC00783 by B H, on Flickr

DSC00786 by B H, on Flickr

 

[jis]

The amount of money and state of relationship between CalDOT and UP. UP has been unusually cooperative in California such as not been seen anywhere else.

Well said. And it is a bit strange how cooperative UP is with the California service.

It's not strange. California just pays UP more money for trackage rights than Amtrak does.

It is a deal that was struck by none other than Gene Skorpowski, who is now at All Aboard Florida, in charge of introducing the Birghtline Service.

 

[bretton88]

For anyone who is interested in more details about these cars:

http://web.talgoamerica.com/images/Amrak/Series_8_Brochure_sized_opt.pdf

 

[seat38a]

For anyone who is interested in more details about these cars:

http://web.talgoamerica.com/images/Amrak/Series_8_Brochure_sized_opt.pdf

I really hope they repaint the train from the Wisconsin Badger Red, to California Blue before being put into service.

 

[bretton88]

Looks like 36.2 inch seat pitches in coach class, which isn't horrible, but not spectacular either (bummer for anyone coming from a superliner). Hopefully California can make adjustments to these seats. The inclusion of 2x1 business class is nice.

 

[jis]

I was wondering, are the seats mounted on tracks like they are on airliners, making it easy to adjust pitch? Or are they bolted in place?

 

[bretton88]

http://web.talgoamerica.com/series8passengercars-images-vidmenu

They certainly appear to be bolted down to the floor.

 

[battalion51]

I have to wonder if in order achieve the time savings there will be a couple of sets that are captive in service to SLO. I know sets currently rotate up there, but it seems like time savings being touted will only be achieved with Talgo sets.

 

[bretton88]

I have to wonder if in order achieve the time savings there will be a couple of sets that are captive in service to SLO. I know sets currently rotate up there, but it seems like time savings being touted will only be achieved with Talgo sets.

From CalSta (the state agency administering the grant) on the Talgos: Two new Talgo trainsets will be leased for five years and utilized to deliver service between Los Angeles and San Luis Obispo that is about 25 minutes faster as well as more fuel efficient.

 

[jis]

I have to wonder if in order achieve the time savings there will be a couple of sets that are captive in service to SLO. I know sets currently rotate up there, but it seems like time savings being touted will only be achieved with Talgo sets.

From CalSta (the state agency administering the grant) on the Talgos: Two new Talgo trainsets will be leased for five years and utilized to deliver service between Los Angeles and San Luis Obispo that is about 25 minutes faster as well as more fuel efficient.

So clearly, no rotation to any other route. It will be completely dedicated to this route on a special accelerated schedule.

 

[battalion51]

Let me clarify, I meant I wonder if one seat rides to San Diego from SLO will be forced to be cut. Right now 761 originates in LA, then turns for 790 but it continues through to San Diego.

 

[bretton88]

Let me clarify, I meant I wonder if one seat rides to San Diego from SLO will be forced to be cut. Right now 761 originates in LA, then turns for 790 but it continues through to San Diego.

The answer from all indications is yes. The talgos are to be dedicated LAX to SLO.

 

[jis]

First of all, this does not mean that the only service north of LAX will be Talgo service to SLO. I am sure there will continue to be more than one service to Santa Barbara/Goletta that will provide one seat ride to San Diego.

Theoretically a single consist can do one RT turn between SLO and San Diego in a day, but it is tight.

I am assuming that this will be an additional frequency to SLO and not a replacement for an existing one. So those existing frequencies will continue to provide the one seat ride.

 

[bretton88]

First of all, this does not mean that the only service north of LAX will be Talgo service to SLO. I am sure there will continue to be more than one service to Santa Barbara/Goletta that will provide one seat ride to San Diego.

Theoretically a single consist can do one RT turn between SLO and San Diego in a day, but it is tight.

I am assuming that this will be an additional frequency to SLO and not a replacement for an existing one. So those existing frequencies will continue to provide the one seat ride.

I wouldn't make that assumption. The goal is to replace the leased amtrak single level set and split up the other California set to provide greater capacity to the other surfliner routes. This is a route where the passenger counts can fit into the Talgo sets. While there is some inconvenience in breaking up the one seat ride to SD, very few people where riding it all the way through, so the one seat ride was considered to be expendable for the sake of improvements elsewhere.

 

[jis]

This train can make at most one round trip a day. So unless they are planning to reduce service to SLO there will be other consists involved for SLO service.

 

[bretton88]

This train can make at most one round trip a day. So unless they are planning to reduce service to SLO there will be other consists involved for SLO service.

I thought there where 2 Talgo trainsets involved. So 2 round trips.

 

[jis]

Ah OK So just maintain current service but faster, and no through running for SLO trains to San Diego. makes sense

 

[bretton88]

The complete text on the Talgo grant from CalSTA:

Provides $15 million to the LOSSAN Rail Corridor Agency over 5 years, coupled with existing resources available through the LOSSAN annual operating budget, to deploy 31 Talgo rail cars on the Los Angeles-San Luis Obispo services. This equipment enables faster acceleration, lower fuel consumption, faster journey times (about 25 minutes faster) and 10 easier customer loading and unloading than the current Amfleet and Horizon fleet that it will replace (single-level, high boarding height equipment). The equipment will lead to at least one additional train consist in addition to the nine consists used today in daily operation, and ensure that all equipment in the corridor has low-level boarding. It also will improve the customer experience with fully automated doors, improved passenger communications, and easier to maneuver configurations, particularly for passengers with disabilities. The additional equipment will also provide equipment deployment flexibility that will allow for increased capacity on crowded Los Angeles-San Diego trains, and more schedule flexibility to enable better peak hour service to LOSSAN North stations, including Santa Barbara.

http://calsta.ca.gov/~/media/CalSTA/docs/pdfs/2016/Detailed%20Project%20Award%20Summary%20-%20Final.pdf?la=en

 

[west point]

Expect 2 round trips but there may be times when one train set is out of service and there will be a scramble to find enough replacement cars ?

 

[Blackwolf]

While California will always remain committed to the bi-level fleet for 90% or more of traditional heavy-rail services, I can see a serious and convincing argument being made to keep the two Talgo sets in California after the 5 year lease is up. It all depends on how well they are received by both LOSSAN and by the traveling public. And the high-level platforms in San Francisco will not be a deterrent at all to using them on a re-launced Spirit of California. If they have all high-level platforms at Transbay, just run the train to San Jose and service it in Oakland.

 

[seat38a]

Expect 2 round trips but there may be times when one train set is out of service and there will be a scramble to find enough replacement cars ?

I don't think the Horizon consists are going anywhere. They will probably be sitting around the LA yard and pulled into service when needed. There seems to be plenty of extra cars sitting around the LA Yard and probably explain how they are able to add surge capacity to the trains so quickly. During 3 day holiday weekends, its not uncommon for busy trains to have 2 business class cars and a extra coach car in the consist. During TG weekends, Amtrak has been running a second San Diego to SLO train on top of the daily train 777.

 

[seat38a]

The complete text on the Talgo grant from CalSTA:

Provides $15 million to the LOSSAN Rail Corridor Agency over 5 years, coupled with existing resources available through the LOSSAN annual operating budget, to deploy 31 Talgo rail cars on the Los Angeles-San Luis Obispo services. This equipment enables faster acceleration, lower fuel consumption, faster journey times (about 25 minutes faster) and 10 easier customer loading and unloading than the current Amfleet and Horizon fleet that it will replace (single-level, high boarding height equipment). The equipment will lead to at least one additional train consist in addition to the nine consists used today in daily operation, and ensure that all equipment in the corridor has low-level boarding. It also will improve the customer experience with fully automated doors, improved passenger communications, and easier to maneuver configurations, particularly for passengers with disabilities. The additional equipment will also provide equipment deployment flexibility that will allow for increased capacity on crowded Los Angeles-San Diego trains, and more schedule flexibility to enable better peak hour service to LOSSAN North stations, including Santa Barbara.

http://calsta.ca.gov/~/media/CalSTA/docs/pdfs/2016/Detailed%20Project%20Award%20Summary%20-%20Final.pdf?la=en

Having been on the Horizon consist, makes perfect sense. Boarding and offloading with only 3 doors, sometime 4 doors if the BC attendant is opening the BC/Cafe door, really slows things down big time. Also, the conductor having to go unlock and bring out the hand cranked lift for wheelchairs, and your talking the train lingering around for good 15 min in some cases vs the 5 min on the Surfliner.

 

[bretton88]

Expect 2 round trips but there may be times when one train set is out of service and there will be a scramble to find enough replacement cars ?

I don't think the Horizon consists are going anywhere. They will probably be sitting around the LA yard and pulled into service when needed. There seems to be plenty of extra cars sitting around the LA Yard and probably explain how they are able to add surge capacity to the trains so quickly. During 3 day holiday weekends, its not uncommon for busy trains to have 2 business class cars and a extra coach car in the consist. During TG weekends, Amtrak has been running a second San Diego to SLO train on top of the daily train 777.

They will go somewhere. Just not back to this service. One of the unstated reasons for getting the Talgo sets is to finally get out from Amtrak's high lease charges on the horizon/amfleet set.

 

[RPC]

Interesting...the brochure shows the baggage compartment between the conductor's station and coach seating and the rest of the train. I wonder if an illustrator got the ends reversed?

 

[Scuba_Steve]

Maybe I missed this somewhere, but does anyone know when these will be delivered to CA?