Trip planning Olympia, WA circle trip

[willieweed]

I'm planning a trip from Olympia, Wa. to Sacramento, then to Galesburg, Illinois, then to LAX and home to Olympia. The intent is to avoid any overnight stays. Looking at schedules it appears there should be no problems. Departure Dec. 31 +\-.
Comments please.

 

[caravanman]

I'm planning a trip from Olympia, Wa. to Sacramento, then to Galesburg, Illinois, then to LAX and home to Olympia. The intent is to avoid any overnight stays. Looking at schedules it appears there should be no problems. Departure Dec. 31 +\-.
Comments please.

Is your intent to just change from one train onto the next as one "continual" journey? If so, then please be aware that Amtrak long distance trains can experience eye- watering delays! While it should be an interesting thing to attempt, the published schedules cannot be relied on too heavily. I don't know which of your trains are reliable or otherwise, but delays of many hours are more to be expected, than on time performance, in my experience.

 

[Peter_Travels]

I'm planning a trip from Olympia, Wa. to Sacramento, then to Galesburg, Illinois, then to LAX and home to Olympia. The intent is to avoid any overnight stays. Looking at schedules it appears there should be no problems. Departure Dec. 31 +\-.
Comments please.

Sounds like fun! All of those are beautiful train routes (especially this time of year) and you should have a great time!

What was said about trains being late is true, there can be delays of several hours, but all of your connections (except for the last one, in LA, which might be tight) are easily doable.

That said, if you are on a train that is very late, you will typically be accommodated by Amtrak, either by being put up in a hotel or put on another train (or sometimes bus).

I would highly recommend it. Have fun!

 

[Bob Dylan]

I'm planning a trip from Olympia, Wa. to Sacramento, then to Galesburg, Illinois, then to LAX and home to Olympia. The intent is to avoid any overnight stays. Looking at schedules it appears there should be no problems. Departure Dec. 31 +\-.
Comments please.

Looks like you'll be spending some time in Sacramemto, Galesburg and LA between connections.

Depending on the time keeping of your Trains ( I'm assuming your riding the Starlight,Zephyr,Southwest Chief and Starlight again)you MAY be spending the night in any of these Cities, since delays can occur @ any time that makes you miss your connections.

You didn't indicate if you're riding in Coach or a Sleeper, but even with guaranteed connections, there's a chance you won't be occupying a room if you miss your connection and have to take the next days train!

What is your Plan B if delays occur????

 

[Asher]

Never know about snow around Tahoe In the Sierra’s

 

[Peter_Travels]

Looking at both current and historical data combined @ juckins. com.

The chance of missing your connection in Sacramento is between 0% and 3.3%.

The chance of missing your connection in Galesburg is between 1.6% and 6.7%.

The chance of missing your connection in Los Angeles is between 20% and 34%.

The chance you are going to miss your connection in Sacramento or Galesburg is small, but possible.

The chance you will miss your connection in Los Angeles is higher, but the most manageable - If you miss your connection, they will probably put you on a bus to Bakersfield, and then a San Joaquins train to Martinez, where you will meet the Coast Starlight that you missed in LA.

Just keep the possibility in your head that you MIGHT have to spend a night in a city you are connecting in. Amtrak runs the train every day on the routes you plan to take and they will almost certainly compensate you for your tardiness if you miss your connection.

Delays happen and they can be large, so you should keep it in your mind on the backbunner, but it isn’t something to actively think about. I’ve had trains cancelled, connections missed. Things usually have a way of working out.

 

[willieweed]

Plan B is go with the flow and hope for the best. I will be in a Roomette on the Starlight both directions, Roomette on the Zephyr and Bedroom on the Chief, assuming those choices will be available. Making reservations today.

 

[danasgoodstuff]

And for Amtrak to take care of you for missed connections, it needs to be booked as one continuous trip - I think they should call and make sure on this one, right?

 

[zephyr17]

And for Amtrak to take care of you for missed connections, it needs to be booked as one continuous trip - I think they should call and make sure on this one, right?

Yep, guarantee only applies to connections on the same reservation number.

 

[willieweed]

Depart 01/01/2025.
Train 11; Train 6 ; Train 3 ; Train 14. Had this trip reserved in Sept. 2022 to see the land of NOWHERE and had to cancel on short notice for medical reasons. 2022 trip had the same cars.
Thanks to all for the input.

 

[Cal]

The chance of missing your connection in Galesburg is between 1.6% and 6.7%.

I'm extremely surprised it's so low, considering what #6 has to go through before getting to Galesburg.

 

[Peter_Travels]

I'm extremely surprised it's so low, considering what #6 has to go through before getting to Galesburg.

Yeah, it’s been pretty good.

They started a slightly different schedule in April 2024 and it is working pretty well at keeping them on time (not the same story for the Chief, however). Average delay to Galesburg is only 35 minutes.

 

[BCL]

Yep, guarantee only applies to connections on the same reservation number.

Not necessarily that I would think, since it’s possible to use multi-city to force connections that aren't guaranteed.

I don’t think there’s any way to do a loop like this on one reservation with all guaranteed connections. Maybe a round trip would be guaranteed, but this kind of oddball route isn’t likely to fit into the choices that Amtrak would give.

The loop to LA also creates issues creating a booking with guaranteed connections. Just riding the rails without an overnight stay is going to mean taking a risk if there are delays. But it should be possible to cancel and rebook, or maybe just put oneself at the mercy of station agents to help out.

And granted the penalties for cancellation are pretty bad now, but certainly better than just eating the whole fare for a no-show.

 

[zephyr17]

Not necessarily that I would think, since it’s possible to use multi-city to force connections that aren't guaranteed.

I don’t think there’s any way to do a loop like this on one reservation with all guaranteed connections. Maybe a round trip would be guaranteed, but this kind of oddball route isn’t likely to fit into the choices that Amtrak would give.

The loop to LA also creates issues creating a booking with guaranteed connections. Just riding the rails without an overnight stay is going to mean taking a risk if there are delays. But it should be possible to cancel and rebook, or maybe just put oneself at the mercy of station agents to help out.

And granted the penalties for cancellation are pretty bad now, but certainly better than just eating the whole fare for a no-show.

Truly forced connections are indeed not guaranteed. I did not want to get into all the ins and outs checking if a connection is guaranteed or not, even if the city pair doesn't yield a result. That is not an infrequent occurrence due to the kludgy individual city pair by city pair by routing method connections have to be set up in ARROW.

In any case, the easiest way to ensure connections are guaranteed is to book with an agent, preferably an AGR agent. No matter how "oddball" the full itinerary is, they won't normally book connections that aren't guaranteed.

 

[BCL]

And for Amtrak to take care of you for missed connections, it needs to be booked as one continuous trip - I think they should call and make sure on this one, right?

I don’t think that’s necessarily the case. I believe Amtrak chooses what it will allow as guaranteed connections by limiting them to routings that can be booked as one-way trips. As far as I can tell, the connection that would be guaranteed with the OP's trip would be Olympia to Galesburg via Sacramento. That can be booked as a one-way trip.

 

[willieweed]

The trip was booked with an agent.

 

[BCL]

Truly forced connections are indeed not guaranteed. I did not want to get into all the ins and outs checking if a connection is guaranteed or not which has a lot of nuance due to the kludgy individual city pair by city pair by routing method connections have to be set up in ARROW.

In any case, the easiest way to ensure connections are guaranteed is to book with an agent, preferably an AGR agent. They won't book a connection that isn't guaranteed.

Don't they have access to multi-city bookings that are forced? If we can do it, a reservation agent can surely do that.

But yeah - as far as I can tell it's only specified city pairs with specific routings that are guaranteed. Olympia to Galesburg would be guaranteed if it's on the Coast Starlight and California Zephyr. The other connections would have to be forced and I'm not sure they would be guaranteed even with more than two hours scheduled between arrival and departure.

I'm not sure how to do this. I get the idea - to just ride the rails for fun. I suppose it might be possible to cancel and rebook if it's pretty obvious that a delay is going to put a serious crimp in the plans. Not sure if it would be worth paying Flex fares for that. And of course the possibility of being stuck in an area with spotty cellular service.

I've booked one round-trip from Emeryville that was just about 4 hours in Santa Barbara to get back on the Coast Starlight and back on a bus (with this weird train segment at the end that I didn't take). I'm not sure what would have happened if the train was way late. I don't believe that round trips are guaranteed. We were late about an hour, but it was something like 5 hours, I'm not sure what we could have done other than cancel and get another ticket for the next day.

 

[BCL]

The trip was booked with an agent.

Sure. Did you ask if all the connections would be guaranteed?

 

[zephyr17]

Don't they have access to multi-city bookings that are forced? If we can do it, a reservation agent can surely do that.

But yeah - as far as I can tell it's only specified city pairs with specific routings that are guaranteed. Olympia to Galesburg would be guaranteed if it's on the Coast Starlight and California Zephyr. The other connections would have to be forced and I'm not sure they would be guaranteed even with more than two hours scheduled between arrival and departure.

I'm not sure how to do this. I get the idea - to just ride the rails for fun. I suppose it might be possible to cancel and rebook if it's pretty obvious that a delay is going to put a serious crimp in the plans. Not sure if it would be worth paying Flex fares for that. And of course the possibility of being stuck in an area with spotty cellular service.

I've booked one round-trip from Emeryville that was just about 4 hours in Santa Barbara to get back on the Coast Starlight and back on a bus (with this weird train segment at the end that I didn't take). I'm not sure what would have happened if the train was way late. I don't believe that round trips are guaranteed. We were late about an hour, but it was something like 5 hours, I'm not sure what we could have done other than cancel and get another ticket for the next day.

I just checked, 11-6-3-14 connecting at SAC, GBB, and LAX consists entirely of guaranteed connections. If booked on a single reservation using Multi-City or an agent the entire trip would be guaranteed. Whether or not it is a good idea is a different issue, but there are no connections lacking the guarantee on that itinerary.

While agents have the capability of booking connections that are not guaranteed, they normally will not. They might do it if pressed and warning that a given connection isn't guaranteed, but they won't do it on their own initiative.

PS, I verified the 6-3 connection at GBB with a phantom OMA-KCY booking. That routing comes up, so that connection is guaranteed.

 

[willieweed]

Yup. Don't see anything on the ticket or boarding pass that indicates a guarantee but the ticket say Round Trip.

 

[BCL]

I just checked, 11-6-3-14 connecting at SAC, GBB, and LAX consists entirely of guaranteed connections. If booked on a single reservation using Multi-City or an agent the entire trip would be guaranteed. Whether or not it is a good idea is a different issue, but there are no connections lacking the guarantee on that itinerary.

While agents have the capability of booking connections that are not guaranteed, they normally will not. They might do it if pressed and warning that a given connection isn't guaranteed, but they won't do it on their own initiative.

PS, I verified the 6-3 connection at GBB with a phantom OMA-KCY booking. That routing comes up, so that connection is guaranteed.

I'm still wondering if it's really guaranteed. I was under the impression that a specific connection point isn't guaranteed (i.e. in Galesburg between #6 and #3), but that endpoints routed through a connecting city can be guaranteed. I was thinking it would matter whether or not Sacramento to Galesburg to Los Angeles could be booked as a one-way trip as to whether the connection in Galesburg was guaranteed.

I did a little checking, and certainly Olympia to Sacramento to Galesburg can be booked one way. Galesburg to Los Angeles to Olympia can also be booked one way.

 

[zephyr17]

I'm still wondering if it's really guaranteed. I was under the impression that a specific connection point isn't guaranteed (i.e. in Galesburg between #6 and #3), but that endpoints routed through a connecting city can be guaranteed. I was thinking it would matter whether or not Sacramento to Galesburg to Los Angeles could be booked as a one-way trip as to whether the connection in Galesburg was guaranteed.

I did a little checking, and certainly Olympia to Sacramento to Galesburg can be booked one way. Galesburg to Los Angeles to Olympia can also be booked one way.

When a guaranteed connection, which all on this itinerary are, is going to miss, Amtrak generates a list of reservations connecting between the two trains. They proceed to work the list setting up revised itineraries and accommodations. It makes no difference how the reservation was made, whether agent, Multi-City, or simple one-way/round trip, the only thing that matters is both trains are on the same reservation. Nor does it matter how complicated the rest of the reservation itinerary is as far getting on the guarantee list to be worked is concerned. The only criteria is a miss on a guaranteed connection with both trains on one reservation.

You appear to think it is more complicated than it is.

The fly in the ointment on a continuous circle trip is the destination is the origin. The default protection method in case of a miss is the quickest and most direct route to the "destination" which might be just retracing the outbound trip back to the origin in this case. However, Amtrak is usually good at honoring the intent of a trip when it is pointed out to them. While it is always a good idea to be proactive with Amtrak whenever there is a prospective miss, it is more critical here. I am reasonably confident that Amtrak would work with the passenger to get a fairly close facsimile of the original itinerary in place. Getting that would almost certainly require calling and working with them, though.

In any case, the connections at SAC, GBB, and LAX on this itinerary are guaranteed and @willieweed's trip will be protected. He has nothing to worry about there. Getting that itinerary back in place in case of miss may take some work on his part, but the underlying protection is in place and he need not be concerned about that.

 

[zephyr17]

Yup. Don't see anything on the ticket or boarding pass that indicates a guarantee but the ticket say Round Trip.

That isn't something they display.

Rest easy, though. Every one of those connections are guaranteed.

 

[willieweed]

zThat isn't something they display.

Rest easy, though. Every one of those connections are guaranteed.

It'll be interesting to see how this works out with all the different climate zones in January. Thanks, Zephyr.