When is Sleeping Car returning to WAS-BOS overnight train?

[jiml]

If the reservation system programmed to say that there is no Sleeper service south of WAS it will of course not issue a Sleeper ticket south of WAS. It has no idea about whether there is a deadhead Sleeping car in the consist or not. It will in all likelihood issue two tickets.

OTOH, if it is programmed to say that there is Sleeper service south of WAS, but no boarding is allowed southbound from WAS and south, then one could get a single ticket. It is all upto what policy is programmed into the rez system.

I guess we'll find out soon. It would be poor planning if someone tried to ticket from BOS to any point south of WAS and the system returned "No rooms available" when there was as far as WAS. I suspect there will be a fair number of trial bookings once this is online.

 

[John Santos]

This is a good question, and I am very curious as well about this. I know for sure a market for BOS-NPN overnight does exist (I myself even have reason to take it), but I suppose that anyone going south can just transfer to buisness class for the remainder of the journey (and northwards people can just transfer at WAS).

My question for all of this is why now? There are obvious possible answers, but I'm curious what everyone else thinks about why they chose to bring back the sleeper during these times, especially when sleeper/LD trains are not doing so hot.

I used to travel Boston to Richmond several times a year, but never thought of taking the train. My customer's building was on Staple Mills Road, about a mile from RVR, so it would have been extremely convenient. (They moved their computer center to Philadelphia in 2012 and I took the Acela there a bunch of times.) So a roomette on the 67/66 BOS->RVR->BOS would have been great!

As to "Why now?" The new VII sleepers are coming online, so they currently have a surplus. Plus the COVID service reductions might make more VI's available. Maybe they were planning to retire some of the VI's and replace them with VII's and decided to keep them in service instead and use the opportunity to increase service? That would definitely be a GOOD THING (TM).*

[*] there used to be a smiley for registered trademarks, but it seems to have vanished. There was both a circled "R" and a "TM", but both appear to be gone now. I suspect the Organization of Smiley Exporting Countries is creating artificial shortages to drive up prices.

 

[Tlcooper44]

I used to travel Boston to Richmond several times a year, but never thought of taking the train. My customer's building was on Staple Mills Road, about a mile from RVR, so it would have been extremely convenient. (They moved their computer center to Philadelphia in 2012 and I took the Acela there a bunch of times.) So a roomette on the 67/66 BOS->RVR->BOS would have been great!

As to "Why now?" The new VII sleepers are coming online, so they currently have a surplus. Plus the COVID service reductions might make more VI's available. Maybe they were planning to retire some of the VI's and replace them with VII's and decided to keep them in service instead and use the opportunity to increase service? That would definitely be a GOOD THING (TM).*

[*] there used to be a smiley for registered trademarks, but it seems to have vanished. There was both a circled "R" and a "TM", but both appear to be gone now. I suspect the Organization of Smiley Exporting Countries is creating artificial shortages to drive up prices.

This was my thought as well.
The 50 new VII's definitely help, and probably make the original excuse for discontinuing the Night Owl, "equipment shortages," no longer viable.

It seems that Amtrak is more sleeper car friendly now than it has been for the past 15 years.

 

[jis]

I guess we'll find out soon. It would be poor planning if someone tried to ticket from BOS to any point south of WAS and the system returned "No rooms available" when there was as far as WAS. I suspect there will be a fair number of trial bookings once this is online.

The way the rez system seems to work these days, if they populate it correctly it should show the Sleeper/BC or Sleeper/Coach combo properly. But they have to set it up to do so.

 

[fdaley]

It seems that Amtrak is more sleeper car friendly now than it has been for the past 15 years.

As long as the people riding them don't need to eat.

But in this case, because of the schedule and the comparatively short overall trip duration, meal service isn't needed. So it might be the one Amtrak sleeper route I'll ride this year.

 

[Maglev]

The 50 new VII's...

There are only 25 VII sleepers.

Another example of AMtrak promoting sleepers is the seasonal addition of a second sleeper on the Portland section of the Empire Builder.

 

[NS VIA Fan]

Not sure if I would like that method of 'killing time'...
I would prefer if they would simply open the train for early occupancy, and depart later......

The 1130pm departure worked well for someone attending a ball game, hockey or theatre and still offered a reasonable after midnight arrival home in Port Hope, Cobourg or Belleville out of Toronto.....or Cornwall and Brockville on the Montreal end. The first train from Kingston to Toronto in the morning and right up 'till Covide had a schedule almost identical to the Enterprise and there was still an evening train to Kingston although it has operated earlier the last few years.

The Kingston lay-over didn't matter much to through passengers......but it allowed VIA to capture the late evening/early morning market. The original plan had been to operate via Ottawa which would have accounted for a lot of the lay-over time in Kingston.

But all a moot point now. The Sleepers just never caught on and the overnight Toronto<>Montreal Coaches were only busy on Friday and Sunday night.....but VIA has still been able to keep that late night/early morning Kingston market roughly on the Enterprise schedule.

 

[Exvalley]

Isn’t the issue making sleepers available south of WAS that there is no crew base in NPN for sleeper attendants?

 

[Big Iron]

Isn’t the issue making sleepers available south of WAS that there is no crew base in NPN for sleeper attendants?

If I recall correctly, when I rode 65 back in the sleeping car days the SCA was based in BOS and overnighted in NPN.

 

[Palmland]

If I recall correctly, when I rode 65 back in the sleeping car days the SCA was based in BOS and overnighted in NPN

Would they even need to overnight? Make the same day turn like the equipment does and stay on duty for the round trip. No different than a two night west coast train except the SCA could have a few hours of down time in NPN.

The Richmond-Williamsburg area is growing fast and will soon become an extension of the NEC. With a bit of marketing Amtrak should at least try selling sleeper space. It’s a lot different than in the days of the Twilight Shoreliner.

 

[neroden]

Good news. The mystifying absence of service into Virginia remains mystifying; I do wonder if it would be more effective to reroute 66/67 to Norfolk an provide sleeper cars along that route (not an option back in 2001).

 

[Acela150]

If I recall correctly, when I rode 65 back in the sleeping car days the SCA was based in BOS and overnighted in NPN.

Bingo!

Would they even need to overnight?

Yes. The union agreement calls for it.

 

[jiml]

Nope, not sleeping with a toilet at my feet.

Oh, to be young again.

 

[OBS]

Isn’t the issue making sleepers available south of WAS that there is no crew base in NPN for sleeper attendants?

No, they would go to the hotel just like the Cafe LSA does.

 

[railiner]

Did you notice that 65/66/67 has a significantly faster schedule between NYP and WAS than the Silvers or the Crescent?

Well, I haven't really perused the timetables intensely ever since they stopped issuing paper ones a few years ago, but since they no longer have to switch in or out the Executive Sleeper, or the bulk mail cars at NYP, as well as not loading package express at other stations, it is not at all surprising. Besides that, the long distance trains need time to load a higher proportion of elderly passenger's or other's needing red cap assistance at intermediate station stops...

 

[Seaboard92]

It wouldn't surprise me if they are trying to crew this out of Washington which does have a sleeper base for the Capitol Limited.

The worst part of this will be the arrival into DC and NYC where the attendant will probably wake everyone up at four AM to refreshen the room so that they themselves can get off on time. If there was ever a pet peeve of mine that is it. Every time I'm on the train into Chicago they kick you out of the room for five to ten minutes once you get past South Bend. Personally I think we should just have the coach cleaners handle that work. It would be better from a customer comfort standpoint.

 

[bms]

I've never taken the Acela Express or the Night Owl. With this new service, I definitely am thinking about a trip to the East Coast to take the Acela Express and the Night Owl Sleeper between Boston and Washington. I doubt I'd sleep much but it'd be nice to look out on the Northeast Corridor from a sleeper bed.

 

[jamess]

I would love for the 2nd Roanoke train to be a sleeper.

Current trains depart at~6am and arrive at ~11pm.

So a morning arrival and late departure would be very nice, and they could simply turn the same train

 

[west point]

It may be if the night owl takes off with ridership that Amtrak could run it with a Bag - Sleeper BOS <> NPN and regular V-1 Bos <>-WASH ?

 

[Kimo]

At that speed, you would arrive in Washington at something like 4:00 a.m. Then what?? Even at what were conventional speeds at the time (60s and 70s), the Night Owl got o DC at about 5:30. The railroad let sleeping passengers lie until 7:30, I believe.

 

[neroden]

f there was ever a pet peeve of mine that is it. Every time I'm on the train into Chicago they kick you out of the room for five to ten minutes once you get past South Bend. Personally I think we should just have the coach cleaners handle that work. It would be better from a customer comfort standpoint.

It remains utterly bizarre that they don't. This was a short-term cost-cutting decision made decades ago, a change from pre-Amtrak practice.

There are enough sleeper trains handled out of Chicago that they should reverse this and have permanent staff stationed at Chicago do the cleaning and restocking after everyone is off the train; it's madness to have the OBS doing it while annoying the customers.

It's perhaps more understandable at a terminus which doesn't have enough sleepers coming in to provide continuous work for a station-based staff (perhaps Miami, with its two trains per day?) but at Chicago it's just crazy not to have station-based staff doing this.

 

[jis]

At that speed, you would arrive in Washington at something like 4:00 a.m. Then what?? Even at what were conventional speeds at the time (60s and 70s), the Night Owl got o DC at about 5:30. The railroad let sleeping passengers lie until 7:30, I believe.

Between New York and Washington DC 65/66/67 have more or less the same block time as any other NE Regional. I don't understand why people are all hung up and bent out of shape about speed. They pretty much travel at the same speed as most of the NE Regionals.

They also have similar block times between NYP and NHV. They have slightly longer block time between NHV and BOS. Most of the additional time is spent sitting at the platform at NHV and NYP.

Because there is that more or less two hours of dwell time in the schedule, it is easy to run it at a slower speed if needed, like with diesel substitution or through OHE work areas without impacting the OTP much at the end points.

This has been the way the Night Owl and the Federal operated too, since forever.

 

[PVD]

It may be if the night owl takes off with ridership that Amtrak could run it with a Bag - Sleeper BOS <> NPN and regular V-1 Bos <>-WASH ?

Unless something changes in a major way, I don't believe you can legally sell space in a VL Bag Dorm, it has no ADA space.

 

[Seaboard92]

I would love for the 2nd Roanoke train to be a sleeper.

Current trains depart at~6am and arrive at ~11pm.

So a morning arrival and late departure would be very nice, and they could simply turn the same train

What they could do is just run a section from Roanoke-Washington and combine it into the Night Owl at DC. Then it could service both destinations. Of course it would add more work on the DC switching crews which I'm sure they would absolutely love.

 

[AG1]

Nope, not sleeping with a toilet at my feet.

The Viewliner 1 toilets are seaed with a heavy gasketed cover and are dry when not in use. The water flows only when flushed and the contents is forcefully sucked away by the vacuum system. The toilets are not open like the public toilets or the ones in your home.