Why the Lack of Communication?

[Everydaymatters]

I would like to know if there is a reason why, when a train is going to be very late the TA's don't give an honest answer. Why are pax told the train will be on time, when they know it will not. Why do they say "No Problems", when they know there are problems and that's why the train has been sitting in the same place for hours?

From comments I have read, we would all like honest answers.

This has come up often on this forum and I wonder why the pax aren't given the facts??? Do the facts usually cause ire and it's easier to just pacify them? Does it make the passengers calmer if they don't know? Is there a psychology behind these responses to pax questions?

I'm not asking this question to stir up an angry controversy or to initiate criticism. Just wondering what the reasons are.

 

[N.T.]

First of all, since I'm new to this board, what doe 'TA' stand for? On most boards it's 'Travel Agent' but that may not be the case here. I too am concerned about getting information as I'm suppose to be traveling on the EB next week. However, I think the case with Amtrak, as with the airlines, the reservation or gate agent doesn't have access to the complete information. We may think they do because they're in front of a computer which has access to everything. That's where I think we get the idea that 'they know the reason for the delay' (but aren't telling us). Unless you are in direct communication with an operations manager, you really can't get the complete and up-to-date information about a delay.

 

[Ispolkom]

I would like to know if there is a reason why, when a train is going to be very late the TA's don't give an honest answer. Why are pax told the train will be on time, when they know it will not. Why do they say "No Problems", when they know there are problems and that's why the train has been sitting in the same place for hours?

I think that usually when car attendants don't give an honest answer, it's because they simply don't know what's going on, any more than the passengers. They might dissimulate because some passengers don't like an honest "I don't know."

A bigger question for me is why conductors, who probably do have a better idea of what's going on, don't offer more information. That I can't answer. On the Empire Builder last Monday I was surprised that the conductor did get on the intercom and explain why we were late (1st, because we waited for passengers from the Cardinal, 2nd because we were stuck behind a freight that set off a drag detector). Later we learned about the Empire Builder annulments in time for me to cancel my trip to Minot. I thought that was excellent public service, and wrote a letter to Amtrak customer service. I can't see why all conductors don't keep the customers clued in that way.

 

[gregoryla]

I am not sure that the premise is correct, at least as far as the pax on the train are concerned. The one time that my train was very late -- on the EB 8 last fall when we arrived in Chicago 8 hours late -- the conductor made regular announcements about the causes of the delay, our ETA, etc. Amtrak CSRs boarded the train in Milwaukee (or maybe it was La Crosse, I don't recall) to help pax rebook connections, etc. I thought we were treated right.

I also do not know what is meant by "TA."

 

[The Davy Crockett]

TA = Train Attendant

 

[printman2000]

Truthfully, a passenger with a scanner is usually more informed than the on board staff.

 

[Mackensen]

The last couple trips I've been on the conductors have made frequent announcements explaining that (a) we're late and (b) why it is that we're late. The only exceptions have been in the middle of the night when no announcements of any kind are made. Maybe I'm just lucky.

 

[pennyk]

I was on the Acela a few weeks ago and we were stopped/delayed for several hours due to police activity at the New London, CT station. The conductor regularly made announcements that we were going to be delayed and assured us that we were all safe. At first, the details were not relayed to the passengers, likely because the conductor was not informed. I had my netbook with me and I received information from an AU member as to the source of the activity prior to the conductor informing the passengers. I was extremely impressed with the abundance of communication that we as passengers received from the train crew. Despite being 3+ hours late, there were no irate passengers in the FC car.

 

[transit54]

Generally, I've had good luck with conductors making announcements, though sometimes its after the fact, "We were delayed due to some signal problems near White River, we will now be about twenty minutes late." That being said, I'm mostly on corridor trains (and the Vermonter in particular) where I think there's less that's likely to go wrong. Back when I worked for JetBlue, we had a policy that whenever a delay occurred, we would immediately announce it and explain the cause. Then, we would continue to make announcements at least every 15 minutes, even if the announcement was that we didn't have any update on the situation. I really think Amtrak should adopt something along these lines - i.e. when a train is anticipated to be delayed 5 minutes or more, make an announcement about the cause of the delay. Then make additional announcements at X interval until the situation is resolved.

 

[the_traveler]

That's part of the reason many of us travel with scanners. With it, I sometimes know more about the reason for the delay(s) than the OBS (On Board Staff)! I've even had some OBS ask me what's happening, when they see my scanner.

And TA may mean "Ticket Agent (at the stations)" in this case. They can only relay on the information provided to them. If they are told that the train is on time, they can only relay to those waiting that information.

 

[Everydaymatters]

A couple of years ago on the EB we were rerouted due to bridge work. The bridge work had been going on for a more than a week and the TA's knew about the delays. After the detour announcement was made, only one of them gave an honest answer, including the fact that we would be a few hours late arriving at CUS. The others, when asked, said we would be on time. I can't buy that only one of them knew it would be late.

I had thought (hoped) things had changed since then and reading the above replies it would seem it had.

However, the reason I brought this up now is because of a May 31 travelogue I just read.

 

[The Davy Crockett]

I was on the Acela a few weeks ago and we were stopped/delayed for several hours due to police activity at the New London, CT station. The conductor regularly made announcements that we were going to be delayed and assured us that we were all safe. At first, the details were not relayed to the passengers, likely because the conductor was not informed. I had my netbook with me and I received information from an AU member as to the source of the activity prior to the conductor informing the passengers. I was extremely impressed with the abundance of communication that we as passengers received from the train crew. Despite being 3+ hours late, there were no irate passengers in the FC car.

That is because, IIRC from your posts on the trip, the edgy ones drowned their sorrows in the free booze one gets in FC... hboy: :giggle:

 

[Devil's Advocate]

I've had pretty good luck with announcements on more recent trips. The staff are sometimes clear and sometimes unclear as to the cause but you get the feeling that they really are trying to at least acknowledge the situation and to provide some sort of estimate as to the length of delay if not give a new ETA.

 

[amamba]

I was on a SB acela two weeks ago and we were delayed for about 30 minutes right outside PVD because there was a problem with the pantographs. I was very impressed that immediately after we stopped, the conductor made an announcement. he also gave two updates during the 30 minutes that let us know what was going on. It was pretty funny because he said "There is a problem with the pantographs, and it is very technical so I won't bore you with the details." Then all the pax in my car kept asking "What is a pantograph?"

We were then stuck for about 15-20 minutes outside of New York - I think waiting for a bridge because we had missed our original slot. Again, the conductor came on and said we would be about 25 minutes late into NYP (we appeared to have made up some of our earlier time lost by zipping through RI/CT). I was very, very impressed by the information given to us by the conductor who kept us well informed through both stops. I am not sure if this is more typical on an acela train, though, than the LD trains.

 

[the_traveler]

It was pretty funny because he said "There is a problem with the pantographs, and it is very technical so I won't bore you with the details." Then all the pax in my car kept asking "What is a pantograph?"

I KNOW! I KNOW! (Raises hand)

That what makes the train move!

But why don't they just call them "wheels"?

 

[Trogdor]

The pantograph is the electric engine's fuel pump.

 

[pennyk]

It was pretty funny because he said "There is a problem with the pantographs, and it is very technical so I won't bore you with the details." Then all the pax in my car kept asking "What is a pantograph?"

I KNOW! I KNOW! (Raises hand)

That what makes the train move!

But why don't they just call them "wheels"?

Dave, is there ANYTHING about trains that you do not know???

 

[jdcnosse]

On my second trip back from FLG to GRR, while on the Pere Marquette we had a very nice conductor. We got delayed around the Indiana border because (I forgot who owns the tracks in Indiana/Michigan on the Pere Marquette route) but they were doing track work and then had to let freight through, so we were late by about an hour, hour and a half...but the conductor got on at least two, maybe three times to explain what was going on. (He simply said for those that didn't know, Amtrak contracts the rights to use the tracks from the freight company, and this particular freight company was doing that work and once we got the all clear then we could continue on).

 

[Mackensen]

On my second trip back from FLG to GRR, while on the Pere Marquette we had a very nice conductor. We got delayed around the Indiana border because (I forgot who owns the tracks in Indiana/Michigan on the Pere Marquette route) but they were doing track work and then had to let freight through, so we were late by about an hour, hour and a half...but the conductor got on at least two, maybe three times to explain what was going on. (He simply said for those that didn't know, Amtrak contracts the rights to use the tracks from the freight company, and this particular freight company was doing that work and once we got the all clear then we could continue on).

Depending on where exactly you were, that was probably our good friends (and I use that term advisedly) at CSX.

 

[GG-1]

It was pretty funny because he said "There is a problem with the pantographs, and it is very technical so I won't bore you with the details." Then all the pax in my car kept asking "What is a pantograph?"

I KNOW! I KNOW! (Raises hand)

That what makes the train move!

But why don't they just call them "wheels"?

Dave, is there ANYTHING about trains that you do not know???

Aloha

GEE I thought they were the Spark Maker for the night time show/entertainment. ROTFLOL.

 

[the_traveler]

Aloha

GEE I thought they were the Spark Maker for the night time show/entertainment. ROTFLOL.

... which is only seen from the penthouse suite dome!

 

[railiner]

A related communications problem is that of waiting at a station such as Denver for Train No. 6. It is oftentimes delayed on its transcontinental journey, and it is the job of the station agent to set the mark for the expected arrival and departure time. The agent gets an initial 'guestimate' based on the reporting time from previous stations. The last manned station is Glenwood Springs. That is a long way away, and on a mountain railroad, a lot of stuff can happen to further delay the train.

On the other hand, there is padding prior to Denver's arrival time, and in the best cases, the train can sometimes make up a lot of time. So they have to be cautious once they post the ETD, as they can be 'burned' if they set it too late, and the train makes up time. Now it can't leave until the posted time, or risk stranding some passengers.

The agent will also receive information from the train dispatcher if the train is further delayed, enroute. So what happens is the agent will be conservative in his 'guesstimate'. So passengers are waiting, and now they are subjected to being 'nickled and dimed', with the ETD getting pushed back periodically. Each time this happens, there will be a chorus of groans from the waiting throng, who are trapped waiting or else leave for a while and risk coming back too late.

Sometimes you just can't win either way...

 

[Spokker]

On a recent Coast Starlight trip we were running late and the conductor kept us abreast of all relevant developments. When we were stopped for more than ten minutes, she would make an announcement that it was a red signal and/or freight traffic or whatever. She also announced when smoke breaks would be shortened and gave us a ton of updates about when we would arrive in Los Angeles.

 

[user 683]

Truthfully, a passenger with a scanner is usually more informed than the on board staff.

I'll second that! We experienced significant delays on the LSL 49(May 17) due to a bridge problem and as a result were parked at ALB for many hours. I thought the staff did an Ok job at keeping us informed and I also think they did not have all of the facts. We were initially told to expect 1 to 1.5 hour delay due to a "faulty indicator on a bridge". After 2 hours, it was obvious something more significant was going on. I turned on my scanner and heard several revised estimates on when service would be restored, but even this interaction did not include all of the details about problems being worked - to include broken rail issue (as I would learn about the following day). I don't recall all of the exact details, but the this type of interaction continued for several hours.

 

[jis]

It was pretty funny because he said "There is a problem with the pantographs, and it is very technical so I won't bore you with the details." Then all the pax in my car kept asking "What is a pantograph?"

I KNOW! I KNOW! (Raises hand)

That what makes the train move!

But why don't they just call them "wheels"?

Dave, is there ANYTHING about trains that you do not know???

Aloha

GEE I thought they were the Spark Maker for the night time show/entertainment. ROTFLOL.

Yeah right GG! The trains do need those "Spark plugs" to make them move