New train (40-41 Floridian) between Miami and Chicago via Washington DC

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west point said:
Back in legacy RR days there was a big demand for west coast Florida service from the Midwest. IMO switching Meteor to serve Tampa would be a mistake.
What might be better is terminating the Palmetto at Tampa. Of course what would be even better is a connection at Lakeland for service to Ft. Myers and later south. ACL & SAL both had connections to those locations and the west coast tourist attractions + populations have just boomed since then.
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I'm still of the crowd that believes they should just bring back separate east and west coast sections. If you aren't gonna bring back the pre-94 routing on the S-Line, split the Meteor in Auburndale, otherwise split it at Jacksonville. With Brightline now serving Orlando-Miami, I would think that leg on the Meteor would be less traveled now. Ocala-Lakeland-Miami EC section, Orlando-Lakeland-Miami WC section. Of course the logistics would have to be worked out with trackage rights, but splitting this train isn't a new idea. After all, this train was split up daily for 50 years. Even so, you could just bring back the Auburndale split to make it easier, but you serve less areas and performing that maneuver on the mainline instead of in the confines of the station is probably less desirable for dispatchers and crew alike. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 
The first article in this RPA Hotline Issue contains a very good explanation of the equipment situation that motivated the creation of the Floridian:

https://mailchi.mp/narprail/hotline1369

The second article contains good info about the Floridian itself.
 
jis said:
The first article in this RPA Hotline Issue contains a very good explanation of the equipment situation that motivated the creation of the Floridian:

https://mailchi.mp/narprail/hotline1369

The second article contains good info about the Floridian itself.
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Solid read - particularly the detail on which Superliners are out-of-service. I think most knew it was bad, but not that bad. A VIA-style refurb on the Santa Fe Hi-levels may have been money well spent in hindsight.
 
This is an interesting train - even though it is temporary.

Personally, I like the fact they are trying it. Yes - I totally understand the timekeeping implications and all the other reasons why it might be a bad idea - but in my mind they are dealing with a couple of real issues (Superliner shortages and tunnel construction) in a creative way that also allows them to kick the tires on Midwest-FL service years (or decades) before it is practical to start it up from scratch.

So this year for our winter IN-FL trip we're going to try the Floridian. It means a 2:15 minute drive to/from South Bend, but a one-seat ride with no layover and better food throughout (vs Cardinal to Star via DC w/an overnight).

Looking forward to it.
 
zephyr17 said:
Passengers don't get reimbursed specifically for missed meals. You can get compensation for really late trains from Customer Relations, though you usually have to ask for it these days. It can involve partial refund of the accommodation charge, which could be interpreted as compensation for the missed meals.
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Well, yes they do, at least on occasion. About five years ago, I was boarding the northbound Crescent at Atlanta. Back then, it was scheduled to leave Atlanta at about 8 pm, and it served dinner to Atlanta passengers shortly after departure. When it became clear that the Crescent was running very late, the station agent came out and gave sleeping car passengers cash -- $35-$40 each, as I recall -- and told them to go out and get dinner on their own. Of course, this only works in staffed stations that are near restaurants.

zephyr17 said:
My understanding is supporting dining car revenue was a big part of the decision to include meals in the sleeper fares. Prior to that, many if not most sleeper passengers did not eat three meals a day in the diner, I know I didn't.
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I've heard that too. It's kind of sad that the only way Amtrak can justify dining car service is by charging passengers for meals they don't want to eat.
 
jimdex said:
I've heard that too. It's kind of sad that the only way Amtrak can justify dining car service is by charging passengers for meals they don't want to eat.
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Or can't. As a solo traveler I am pretty much paying for two meals and getting one. Not that I want another, but still...

I do not normally eat three meals a day. I do on Amtrak, though, on principle.

jimdex said:
Well, yes they do, at least on occasion. About five years ago, I was boarding the northbound Crescent at Atlanta. Back then, it was scheduled to leave Atlanta at about 8 pm, and it served dinner to Atlanta passengers shortly after departure. When it became clear that the Crescent was running very late, the station agent came out and gave sleeping car passengers cash -- $35-$40 each, as I recall -- and told them to go out and get dinner on their own. Of course, this only works in staffed stations that are near restaurants.
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On a really late eastbound Empire Builder at Everett (mudslide issues between Seattle and there), with dinner missed, the agents just got Subway turkey sandwiches for everyone. That, too, was five or six years ago. Like most things Amtrak, YMMV.

However, what I had in mind with my comment really was Customer Relations compensation after the fact, not real time response by station agents. That's highly variable like most things in the field at Amtrak.
 
zephyr17 said:
On a really late eastbound Empire Builder at Everett (mudslide issues between Seattle and there), with dinner missed, the agents just got Subway turkey sandwiches for everyone. That, too, was five or six years ago. Like most things Amtrak, YMMV.

However, what I had in mind with my comment really was Customer Relations compensation after the fact, not real time response by station agents. That's highly variable like most things in the field at Amtrak.
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Not just Amtrak. Field response in face of IRROPS is highly variable at airlines too. I have experienced everything from a simple 3-4 hour delay to a 24 hour delay in departure with very significant rerouting, essentially going westwards from New York to get to India instead of eastwards as originally planned. An at some points the handling was superb and at others not so much. On the 24 hour delay the handling at Newark was surprisingly good. They offered me a hotel and meals for the delay period even though my home was just ten miles away! Must have something to do with 1K Status and Business Class ticket or something.
 
Whether or not it's intentional, the tire kicking aspect of the Floridian could be critical. Getting many states involved in "keeping" their Chicago to Florida connection, assuming ridership is decent, could be invaluable in adding more equipment onto the LD order. I can see a world where the next new Long Distance route is the Floridian running alongside the Star and Capitol Limited, simply because it's easy to argue "Yeah, when we ran that service we had segments selling out. We can sell out a morning and evening train on this route."

Edit: And to get the Floridian Take Three past Congress, you might have to have a quid pro quo Western LD improvement as well.
 
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jis said:
The first article in this RPA Hotline Issue contains a very good explanation of the equipment situation that motivated the creation of the Floridian:

https://mailchi.mp/narprail/hotline1369

The second article contains good info about the Floridian itself.
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Mr. Matthews really gets it right on Amtrak's equipment move with the Floridian, and also provides a welcome count of Superliners that still need to be returned to service. I just hope Amtrak can rescue some of the Superliners that went on their sides in those wrecks, but I rather doubt that it can.
 
I hope they either get a new crew for this or send the existing crew to ride the western LD trains for some training.
The wife & I just completed a rail pass that took us on the SWC, CS, CZ, CL & Crescent (and others).
The Cap Limited was the absolute worst of the trip. No observation car, very unfriendly/unhelpful onboard staff - it was way worse than just flying cheap-o air. A distant second worse was the Crescent.
All of the western trains (and the CONO) were so very much better, particularly the OBS.

Back over the summer we took a 7 hour Flix bus from Columbus, OH to CHI. That was hands down a better ride than the CL we had.

Good luck to the Floridian, I hope to ride it one day - but I won’t be the guinea pig 😆
 
Cal H said:
I hope they either get a new crew for this or send the existing crew to ride the western LD trains for some training.
The wife & I just completed a rail pass that took us on the SWC, CS, CZ, CL & Crescent (and others).
The Cap Limited was the absolute worst of the trip. No observation car, very unfriendly/unhelpful onboard staff - it was way worse than just flying cheap-o air. A distant second worse was the Crescent.
All of the western trains (and the CONO) were so very much better, particularly the OBS.

Back over the summer we took a 7 hour Flix bus from Columbus, OH to CHI. That was hands down a better ride than the CL we had.

Good luck to the Floridian, I hope to ride it one day - but I won’t be the guinea pig 😆
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Maybe the CL OBS will be assigned to other trains as the SS OBS takes over the Floridian (if that's how it turns out). Maybe that's why they were grumpy.
 
AmtrakBlue said:
Maybe the CL OBS will be assigned to other trains as the SS OBS takes over the Floridian (if that's how it turns out). Maybe that's why they were grumpy.
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In all the years I rode the Cap Ltd I usually found the OBS Crews to be ruder and less helpful,than most of the other LD Trains!
 
Palmland said:
Thought I heard the same OBS crews as now for the SS and CL but they change in Washington for the run thru Floridian??
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That is correct. There will be an OBS crew change at Washington DC.

They trying to avoid making as few changes as possible since they have every intention of reverting back to two separate train in a couple of years or three.
 
jis said:
That is correct. There will be an OBS crew change at Washington DC.

They trying to avoid making as few changes as possible since they have every intention of reverting back to two separate train in a couple of years or three.
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That IMO is very wasteful of OBS persons. Having to layover at WAS for almost 24 hours makes no sense.
 
west point said:
That IMO is very wasteful of OBS persons. Having to layover at WAS for almost 24 hours makes no sense.
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It is exactly the same number of crew as is used now and the expense is slightly less because the fewer billable hours that the crew puts in. So except in a theoretical sense it is not really wasteful, and I am sure the crew appreciates being on duty continuously for just one overnight instead of two too.
 
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On my last trip on the Capitol Limited, I had a good crew. The LSA in the diner comped me a sandwich when she discovered I did not like my flex meal. I tried it but did not like it, and I was still hungry. I approached the snack counter with my credit card out and ordered the ham and cheese sandwich. She asked why I was still hungry and I explained. She comped the sandwich.
 
Steve4031 said:
On my last trip on the Capitol Limited, I had a good crew. The LSA in the diner comped me a sandwich when she discovered I did not like my flex meal. I tried it but did not like it, and I was still hungry. I approached the snack counter with my credit card out and ordered the ham and cheese sandwich. She asked why I was still hungry and I explained. She comped the sandwich.
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I LOVE employees like this, they make everything just feel so much nicer. Today I took the Surfliner for a very short trip and the conductor had the same vibes, she was very warm and friendly.
 
Cal said:
I LOVE employees like this, they make everything just feel so much nicer. Today I took the Surfliner for a very short trip and the conductor had the same vibes, she was very warm and friendly.
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I agree. Employees like this will usually have a much more rewarding workday experience, and their job will most likely be much "easier" than those authoritarian ones, that are unhappy in their job, and will most likely run into a lot more stress dealing with more frequent passenger conflicts...
 

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