Acela 21 (Avelia Liberty) development, testing and deployment (2018 - 1Q 2024)

[jis]

Tier II has been modified to allow more European designs with CEM systems like Acela II, that is what "Tier II Alternative" refers to. It is not the same thing as Tier III, which is was created to allow future high speed rail using stock European or Japanese/Chinese trainsets, but only on track not shared by any conventional equipment.

Tier II Alternative did not change the top speed which remains 150 mph. As I said, Amtrak's waiver request four years ago was the only movement on this, and there has been nothing since. Acela II will top out at 150 mph on the corridor even though the track is rated for 160 mph, and will continue to do so until Tier II is ever possibly changed to match the track class speed of 160.

Can you provide a citation to the section of the relevant CFR where your claimed modification appears?

 

[Amtrak706]

Can you provide a citation to the section of the relevant CFR where your claimed modification appears?

https://www.federalregister.gov/doc...tive-compliance-and-high-speed-trainsets#h-81

I guess I missed this one. They did, in fact, up Tier II to 160 a few months ago. I am very happy to be wrong about that!

And further down, alternative crashworthiness requirements are established for Tier I and II. Only Tier I is mentioned specifically, but I am pretty sure that Tier II by definition includes all criteria of I and adds on more, since Acela II is being designed with a CEM system to comply with this rule as well:
https://www.federalregister.gov/doc...gth-of-cab-cars-and-multiple-unit-locomotives

 

[west point]

Frankly, I think there would be a lot more benefit if they could get Metro North to upgrade the maximum speed between New Rochelle and New Haven to 80 mph rather than worrying about 160 mph vs. 150 mph. On my recent Acela trip, we were mostly going ~40-50 mph through that section, occasionally speeding up to 70 mph on short stretches. The cars on the paralleling I-95 were definitely going faster, even when they were jammed up. I'll bet if you could upgrade that section, you might shave 30 minutes off the NYP-BOS times.

Good point. However the upgrade of MNRR would come from an entirely different money pool. Transfer the 150 MPH money to MNRR slim and a negative none. On your trip do you know if your train had clear signals or was following another train? Also did it have to slow for the Walk bridge work? The new interlocking east of Walk is still not in service so that makes for a long 2 track running segment, Was your trip during rush hours?

 

[Acela150]

Frankly, I think there would be a lot more benefit if they could get Metro North to upgrade the maximum speed between New Rochelle and New Haven to 80 mph rather than worrying about 160 mph vs. 150 mph. On my recent Acela trip, we were mostly going ~40-50 mph through that section, occasionally speeding up to 70 mph on short stretches. The cars on the paralleling I-95 were definitely going faster, even when they were jammed up. I'll bet if you could upgrade that section, you might shave 30 minutes off the NYP-BOS times.

Metro North has always been that way. Keep in mind that the New Haven Line is a very busy Line and is always undergoing some type of work. I’ve seen their DTOBO which stands for Daily Train Operations Bulletin Order. Which is their version of a TSRB or Temporary Speed Restriction Bulletin. So basically slow orders. While I haven’t seen one in a while. The DTOBO on the New Haven Line was longer than both the Harlem and Hudson lines combined. Metro North doesn’t have an obligation to upgrade the speed to 80mph track cause they run Amtrak. Just like Amtrak doesn’t have an obligation to upgrade track for Freight or commuter service.

 

[MARC Rider]

Metro North has always been that way. Keep in mind that the New Haven Line is a very busy Line and is always undergoing some type of work. I’ve seen their DTOBO which stands for Daily Train Operations Bulletin Order. Which is their version of a TSRB or Temporary Speed Restriction Bulletin. So basically slow orders. While I haven’t seen one in a while. The DTOBO on the New Haven Line was longer than both the Harlem and Hudson lines combined. Metro North doesn’t have an obligation to upgrade the speed to 80mph track cause they run Amtrak. Just like Amtrak doesn’t have an obligation to upgrade track for Freight or commuter service.

Your points are well taken. I've been riding that route once or twice a year for almost 20 years, and there's always been work. Do they ever plan to finish the work?

While Metro North might not have an obligation to accommodate Amtrak high speed rail, if the political leaders at the Federal and state level have any interest in even "higher speed" intercity rail between New York and Boston, it might be worth it for them to both change Metro North's mandate regarding its responsibility to Amtrak and to provide them with enough funding to upgrade the infrastructure to allow consistent running at 70-80 mph. Maybe even some maximum speed of 90 mph, if its technically feasible.

 

[daybeers]

The New Haven Line has always been unbearably slow. The 72.7 miles from NHV to GCT takes ~104-125 minutes on MNRR, including expresses. It's utterly ridiculous.

 

[west point]

MNRR in a few years could get their express tracks to about 90 MPH for at least short distances. East of Bridgeport or where many trains short turn then maybe some speed up. The only other solution which is impossible would be a 5th track for super expresses NYG - New Haven.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

Its fun to see the unknowing with no experience or knowledge discus what Metro North should do. the New Haven line before Metro North never was a higher speed than 70 mph.
Metro North got some sections to higher speed including a token 90 mph section. It was the FRA that reduced the speeds due to concerns MN was pushing the limits.
The token 90 mph from New Rochelle till just short of Harrison saved a whopping 27 seconds of running time .
a educated calculation a few years ago showed if entire line were made 100 mph minus the temporary restrictions would be a gain of 3 minutes and 20 seconds at a cost of many Billions of US peso's
the biggest thing hindering Amtrak is simple facts they do not show up on time at wherever they enter Metro North, even a minute can put you behind a Metro North train simple as that.

 

[jis]

Dutch, I was thinking exactly that. Glad you stated it so eloquently ...

 

[Acela150]

the biggest thing hindering Amtrak is simple facts they do not show up on time at wherever they enter Metro North, even a minute can put you behind a Metro North train simple as that.

They'll show up on time or early and Metro North will put them behind, it happens every day.... Don't blame Amtrak for being 1 minute late. I was once on an Acela that arrived into New Haven 10 minutes early. By the time we got to Stamford we were 20 minutes late. So unless Amtrak magically took over the dispatching on the New Haven line, this goes on Metro North.

 

[OBS]

They'll show up on time or early and Metro North will put them behind, it happens every day.... Don't blame Amtrak for being 1 minute late. I was once on an Acela that arrived into New Haven 10 minutes early. By the time we got to Stamford we were 20 minutes late. So unless Amtrak magically took over the dispatching on the New Haven line, this goes on Metro North.

Very true. Happens waayyy too often.

 

[DSS&A]

Very true. Happens waayyy too often.

Amtrak may still have an opportunity to address the MN dispatching delay problems if the agreement language to allow MN on Amtrak's route into Penn Station not finalized. On-Time performance language can be added into the agreement before it is signed. Basic language such as "I will let me use my tracks for additional service as long as you run my trains X percent on your tracks between locarion A and location B".

 

[jis]

They'll show up on time or early and Metro North will put them behind, it happens every day.... Don't blame Amtrak for being 1 minute late. I was once on an Acela that arrived into New Haven 10 minutes early. By the time we got to Stamford we were 20 minutes late. So unless Amtrak magically took over the dispatching on the New Haven line, this goes on Metro North.

Then again Amtrak distressingly often has difficulty keeping its own trains on its own dispatched railroad on time, and of course, we shall not even discuss what happens to NJT ( when they can find a crew to run their train that is [emoji51])

 

[Thirdrail7]

Your points are well taken. I've been riding that route once or twice a year for almost 20 years, and there's always been work. Do they ever plan to finish the work?

They will never finish the work. Do you know why? It is one of the busiest commuter lines in the country. It is also one of the oldest. It takes a constant pounding. So even if they finish one project, it is time to do another one. By the time they finish everything, the first thing they completed will need an overhaul.

Remember, they are working to literally rebuild ever component of their railroad. Bridges, catenary, underpasses, overpasses, track beds...everything. It started in the late 90s.

 

[Acela150]

The Wall Street Journal has posted a story on Alstom's building of the Acela II trainsets.

Credit to Jis for the find and posting the article to Facebook.

It should be noted that there are only 2 photos. One is of what I'll guess will be a cafe and the other is of the interior of a shell that is undergoing work.

Article is behind a paywall but may show up for some who don't pay. It oddly enough showed up on my phone.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/next-g...oBQpfxbFe5tV2Te8h8Q6zriLqlmuuwMbmpWKAFSlIBdlc

 

[PaTrainFan]

Same story on MarketWatch.com, no paywall.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/amtraks-next-generation-acela-cars-taking-shape-2019-05-12

 

[jis]

Same story on MarketWatch.com, no paywall.

https://www.marketwatch.com/story/amtraks-next-generation-acela-cars-taking-shape-2019-05-12

Yup. It has the words, but it is missing the photos that Acela150 mentions.

 

[Acela150]

Photos

 

[districtRich]

CBS This Morning had a nice segment this morning on the new trainsets. There were some shots of the new interiors.

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/amtrak-new-acela-trains-first-look/

 

[jis]

Looks very TGV-like inside and out, not surprisingly.

 

[Acela150]

Railway Age article about the building of the new HST's.

https://www.railwayage.com/passenge...ela-cars-are-made-inside-the-alstom-facility/

 

[Acela150]

Looks very TGV-like inside and out, not surprisingly.

Agreed, I had a feeling the new trainsets would be more European like.

Side note, it appears that they are doing away with the "airline style" luggage compartments. GOOD! Those things drive me up a wall. People always leave them open and it ticks me off. You didn't find it open, so close it. Anytime I have to close one I always politely say to the person who opened it, leave it as you found it! Closed!

 

[Blackwolf]

Totally a railfan thing, but it would appear a K5LA isn't the horn being installed? Looks like only two tones, located below the windscreen and behind plastic streamlining panels once in service.

 

[jis]

Are those four battering ram type things, CEM Collision Posts?

 

[Acela150]

Are those four battering ram type things, CEM Collision Posts?

So from the looks of it, yes. I can't wait for Engineers to complain about being centered instead of on the right hand side of the control stand.