Amtrak is finally coming to Scranton!

[jis]

I think once the Scranton to NYP service is running, it would make sense to talk about BOS. That just seems easy(ish). Then I think Scranton to HAR would be the next relatively low hanging fruit. There is relative little NS traffic on the line (I think 6-8 per day) but infrastructure may be an issue. That Corridor would never support more than two or three round trips per day. Binghamton is pretty much the same story, but the lure of the NYC market will make it more appealing. Scranton to PHL is an ugly proposition. Travel times were historically fairly ugly. There is significant ROW disruption in Bucks and Montgomery Counties. SEPTA will repay AMTRAK‘s (sometimes very unfair) dispatching practices as AMTRAK tries to operate express over the congested with local service ex-Reading trunk from Jenkintown-Wyncote to Center City, although this could be mitigated by restoring the branch from Lansdale to Norristown and using infrastructure necessary for the Reading service to reach the NEC. Problems aside PHL-Scranton could be a very busy corridor, especially Allentown to PHL. It’s a question of dollars and cents.

The height of the fruit will depend on what the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania is willing to fund come the end of the initial Federal funding period. None of these routes will be funded in perpetuity by the Feds. They all become state funded PRIIA 209 routes after the initial establishment period.

Consequently if SEPTA chooses to clobber these trains it would not be Amtrak they would be clobbering. It would be PennDOT, and guess where SEPTA gets its funding from

That is of course not to say that bureaucracies do not look for opportunities to cause damage to themselves purely out of spite. The New York Tri-State area is replete with examples of such. Of course the taxpayers get to fund all that nonsense as time goes on.

 

[Mailliw]

There's one slight hiccup with running trains to Boston (or DC) out of Scranton. Presumably these would just be NER trainsets. We have the facilities to store them overnight, but I'm not sure about the commissary. Who's the vendor for the Northeast Regionals? Could tlcafe cars be resupplied in Scranton?

 

[Septa9739]

@jis I think bureaucracies harming each other out of spite isn’t beyond SEPTA and AMTRAK, neither really likes to play nice in the sandbox, especially with the other. I think the more serious clobbering of AMTRAK service would be from the fact that SEPTA already pads its ex-Reading side peak expresses “generously” because mediocre dispatching plus congestion equals no guarantee that expresses don’t get stuck behind locals. I think it would be very hard to reliably run reverse peak express service at any decent speed through the area.

 

[jis]

@jis I think bureaucracies harming each other out of spite isn’t beyond SEPTA and AMTRAK, neither really likes to play nice in the sandbox, especially with the other. I think the more serious clobbering of AMTRAK service would be from the fact that SEPTA already pads its ex-Reading side peak expresses “generously” because mediocre dispatching plus congestion equals no guarantee that expresses don’t get stuck behind locals. I think it would be very hard to reliably run reverse peak express service at any decent speed through the area.

Fortunately since all the ones involving a SEPTA Amtrak interface are just what if fantasies right now, we don’t really need to spend much time worrying about it

 

[Amtrak25]

I would imagine most people going Scranton to CT or Boston are on 84 than they are trying to grind the horror show above.

What about Mt Pocono and East Stroudsburg, which are larger passenger generators than Scranton ?

 

[MARC Rider]

What about Mt Pocono and East Stroudsburg, which are larger passenger generators than Scranton ?

That's the situation right now. Perhaps once there's reliable train service connecting Scranton to New York, more businesses and people will move to Scranton and will use the train to travel to New York. The Scranton downtown is surprisingly intact and I could see it as a great location to move back-office operations of New York businesses. It's a combination of a nice urban environment, but lower real estate costs and less congestion than the big city. And with a train, you can get into New York ealiy when you need to, without having to fight traffic jams.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

The trackage between the water gap and Moscow are not in great shape and have lots of slow speed curves, from Moscow to Scranton it's in better shape but still not Passenger worthy unless you run a Steam town excursion. not only has the track to be totally redone but reliable signal system/PTC installed , this in turn would send Steam town packing.

 

[jis]

The trackage between the water gap and Moscow are not in great shape and have lots of slow speed curves, from Moscow to Scranton it's in better shape but still not Passenger worthy unless you run a Steam town excursion. not only has the track to be totally redone but reliable signal system/PTC installed , this in turn would send Steam town packing.

It is quite possible to equip Steam Engines with PTC as UP has done with the Big Boy.

 

[Amtrak25]

Bob Levin decided to not install PTC equipment in his E8's, but Steamtown with NPS's pockets might be able to do something.

 

[Dutchrailnut]

UP is a railroad with deep pockets and support shops all over.
PTC requires daily testing and specialists to maintain it. chances of a park service maintaining PTC equipment is near zero.

 

[jis]

UP is a railroad with deep pockets and support shops all over.
PTC requires daily testing and specialists to maintain it. chances of a park service maintaining PTC equipment is near zero.

Different branches of the Feds or their agents at loggerheads with each other. not unusual I am afraid

 

[JoeBas]

What about Mt Pocono and East Stroudsburg, which are larger passenger generators than Scranton ?

I would still go up to 84 and over if I were them, rather than having to chew through the city. If you're from the area, 209 ain't that bad.

 

[railiner]

N

Fortunately since all the ones involving a SEPTA Amtrak interface are just what if fantasies right now, we don’t really need to spend much time worrying about it

Not sure I understand the meaning of this…doesn’t Amtrak and SEPTA “interface” now between Trenton and Newark, DE?
And won’t that soon extend to connect with MARC in Delaware?

 

[jis]

N

Not sure I understand the meaning of this…doesn’t Amtrak and SEPTA “interface” now between Trenton and Newark, DE?
And won’t that soon extend to connect with MARC in Delaware?

My post was in the context of a comment about what may happen if a service between Philly and Allentown operated by Amtrak was started on a SEPTA operated line. It was not about what is already operating. One needs to read the entire chain of posts. A single post taken out of context may indeed read like nonsense all by itself.